It was my faulty memory that STO had multiplayer ships (perhaps it did in some previous incarnation) that brought me to the game in the first place. I will never stop pointing out that games with multiplayer ships can and do work and I will keep pointing out examples. I agree Cryptic will miss the essence of Star Trek without crewed ships. The ship, what happens inside amongst crew that are interacting, is the very heart of the show. What makes combat in Star Trek unique? The bridge scenes. Captains calling out orders, bridge crew confirming and relaying information, explosions, panels and screens blowing out, bodies getting knocked around. Now, Saturday Night Live might make fun of how goofy they can be but that only makes the point how iconic they are to the experience. It's not some some weird fetish it's a basic touchstone of identity.
All that said, I'm in STO regardless. What they're doing with procedurally generated worlds/missions and competative PvE is fundamentally exciting, should be exciting, to anyone that plays MMOs. These are ideas that will make PvE replayable. Could well turn it from the grind we all know and hate into a game we actually enjoy playing. Doing something for the experience, enjoyment, of it rather than for the bribe of a reward at the end is a wonderful idea. Dynamic gameplay without being dependant on PvP could be a big tipping point in how MMOs are designed. If it works.
There are crews in the game. They're bridge crews/away teams. It sounds like they'll be every bit as important and customizable as the player-character captain himself. I like this. The fact is that even with multiplayer ships in the game most of us, most of the time, even if we're on a big ship will be flying solo when our friends aren't around. Having a functional ship player crew is a task that does require some organization (no more than getting a party together for dungeons) and practice as a team. This means organized guilds, small or large. When your buddies, the 'regular cast', isn't around you're probably not going to want to just sit around or join a pick-up group. Instead you can take your own ship, and your own NPC crew, out for adventures. And...I like pet classes. If beastmaster or mastermind is cool how much cooler will having a whole party of customizable characters under your control?
Yeah, I'm in. Cryptic has promised that they aren't shutting the doors on multiplayer crews just focusing on what needs to work to get the game out first. And they're right. If there aren't functional dynamic missions and strategic PvE then nobody will be warping around either in solo ships or multiplayer ones.
Keep on fighting the good fight, never let Cryptic forget they need the multiplayer starship to truely create a "Star Trek" experience, but try to be realistic in your expectations in the short term.
We do know bridges will be in at some point, possibly at or shortly after launch, and we've been told that when they figure out how to make ship interiors functional rather than decorative they'll be in as well for regular use. Once that happens how long before the obvious? More people will want to play on their friends ships if only "just for fun." I think they must know how this is likely to play out themselves and they should damn well be planning for it.
It was my faulty memory that STO had multiplayer ships (perhaps it did in some previous incarnation) that brought me to the game in the first place. I will never stop pointing out that games with multiplayer ships can and do work and I will keep pointing out examples. I agree Cryptic will miss the essence of Star Trek without crewed ships. The ship, what happens inside amongst crew that are interacting, is the very heart of the show. What makes combat in Star Trek unique? The bridge scenes. Captains calling out orders, bridge crew confirming and relaying information, explosions, panels and screens blowing out, bodies getting knocked around. Now, Saturday Night Live might make fun of how goofy they can be but that only makes the point how iconic they are to the experience. It's not some some weird fetish it's a basic touchstone of identity. All that said, I'm in STO regardless. What they're doing with procedurally generated worlds/missions and competative PvE is fundamentally exciting, should be exciting, to anyone that plays MMOs. These are ideas that will make PvE replayable. Could well turn it from the grind we all know and hate into a game we actually enjoy playing. Doing something for the experience, enjoyment, of it rather than for the bribe of a reward at the end is a wonderful idea. Dynamic gameplay without being dependant on PvP could be a big tipping point in how MMOs are designed. If it works. There are crews in the game. They're bridge crews/away teams. It sounds like they'll be every bit as important and customizable as the player-character captain himself. I like this. The fact is that even with multiplayer ships in the game most of us, most of the time, even if we're on a big ship will be flying solo when our friends aren't around. Having a functional ship player crew is a task that does require some organization (no more than getting a party together for dungeons) and practice as a team. This means organized guilds, small or large. When your buddies, the 'regular cast', isn't around you're probably not going to want to just sit around or join a pick-up group. Instead you can take your own ship, and your own NPC crew, out for adventures. And...I like pet classes. If beastmaster or mastermind is cool how much cooler will having a whole party of customizable characters under your control? Yeah, I'm in. Cryptic has promised that they aren't shutting the doors on multiplayer crews just focusing on what needs to work to get the game out first. And they're right. If there aren't functional dynamic missions and strategic PvE then nobody will be warping around either in solo ships or multiplayer ones. Keep on fighting the good fight, never let Cryptic forget they need the multiplayer starship to truely create a "Star Trek" experience, but try to be realistic in your expectations in the short term. We do know bridges will be in at some point, possibly at or shortly after launch, and we've been told that when they figure out how to make ship interiors functional rather than decorative they'll be in as well for regular use. Once that happens how long before the obvious? More people will want to play on their friends ships if only "just for fun." I think they must know how this is likely to play out themselves and they should damn well be planning for it.
Great Post! I feel pretty much the same way about this game. I think it still sounds like it could be a fun/interesting game, but I really think they need multi-player crewed ships with interiors to create an immersive Star Trek experience.
It was my faulty memory that STO had multiplayer ships (perhaps it did in some previous incarnation) that brought me to the game in the first place. I will never stop pointing out that games with multiplayer ships can and do work and I will keep pointing out examples. I agree Cryptic will miss the essence of Star Trek without crewed ships. The ship, what happens inside amongst crew that are interacting, is the very heart of the show. What makes combat in Star Trek unique? The bridge scenes. Captains calling out orders, bridge crew confirming and relaying information, explosions, panels and screens blowing out, bodies getting knocked around. Now, Saturday Night Live might make fun of how goofy they can be but that only makes the point how iconic they are to the experience. It's not some some weird fetish it's a basic touchstone of identity. All that said, I'm in STO regardless. What they're doing with procedurally generated worlds/missions and competative PvE is fundamentally exciting, should be exciting, to anyone that plays MMOs. These are ideas that will make PvE replayable. Could well turn it from the grind we all know and hate into a game we actually enjoy playing. Doing something for the experience, enjoyment, of it rather than for the bribe of a reward at the end is a wonderful idea. Dynamic gameplay without being dependant on PvP could be a big tipping point in how MMOs are designed. If it works. There are crews in the game. They're bridge crews/away teams. It sounds like they'll be every bit as important and customizable as the player-character captain himself. I like this. The fact is that even with multiplayer ships in the game most of us, most of the time, even if we're on a big ship will be flying solo when our friends aren't around. Having a functional ship player crew is a task that does require some organization (no more than getting a party together for dungeons) and practice as a team. This means organized guilds, small or large. When your buddies, the 'regular cast', isn't around you're probably not going to want to just sit around or join a pick-up group. Instead you can take your own ship, and your own NPC crew, out for adventures. And...I like pet classes. If beastmaster or mastermind is cool how much cooler will having a whole party of customizable characters under your control? Yeah, I'm in. Cryptic has promised that they aren't shutting the doors on multiplayer crews just focusing on what needs to work to get the game out first. And they're right. If there aren't functional dynamic missions and strategic PvE then nobody will be warping around either in solo ships or multiplayer ones. Keep on fighting the good fight, never let Cryptic forget they need the multiplayer starship to truely create a "Star Trek" experience, but try to be realistic in your expectations in the short term. We do know bridges will be in at some point, possibly at or shortly after launch, and we've been told that when they figure out how to make ship interiors functional rather than decorative they'll be in as well for regular use. Once that happens how long before the obvious? More people will want to play on their friends ships if only "just for fun." I think they must know how this is likely to play out themselves and they should damn well be planning for it.
Great Post! I feel pretty much the same way about this game. I think it still sounds like it could be a fun/interesting game, but I really think they need multi-player crewed ships with interiors to create an immersive Star Trek experience.
I agree, it was a good post. I still cannot get excited about PVE even though thats probably the closest I've come to it but I can easily see why others would be anticapating the game. That said, the consensus seems to be that it won't really feel like a true star trek game and I'm just wondering if it was a waste for them to buy the Star Trek IP for a mmorpg?
No or limited interiors maybe a game breaker for me. I am a huge Star Trek fan but STO with no interiors, bad idea. Since I am a huge fan I will probably try it but I am very disappointed with this direction. Multiplayer ships I feel are a must. I want to live on a ship that is the heart of Star Trek.
No or limited interiors maybe a game breaker for me. I am a huge Star Trek fan but STO with no interiors, bad idea. Since I am a huge fan I will probably try it but I am very disappointed with this direction. Multiplayer ships I feel are a must. I want to live on a ship that is the heart of Star Trek.
I'm not sure if that shoots my theory down or not. Your saying what most star trek fans are, that interiors should be a huge part of the experience and it maybe a game breaker which at first glance leads me to believe that they are shooting at the wrong target audience but than you'd play it anyway because your a star trek fan? I'm not sure if I understand that. I suppose you are saying the setting and stories of star trek is enough because your a huge fan?
No or limited interiors maybe a game breaker for me. I am a huge Star Trek fan but STO with no interiors, bad idea. Since I am a huge fan I will probably try it but I am very disappointed with this direction. Multiplayer ships I feel are a must. I want to live on a ship that is the heart of Star Trek.
I'm not sure if that shoots my theory down or not. Your saying what most star trek fans are, that interiors should be a huge part of the experience and it maybe a game breaker which at first glance leads me to believe that they are shooting at the wrong target audience but than you'd play it anyway because your a star trek fan? I'm not sure if I understand that. I suppose you are saying the setting and stories of star trek is enough because your a huge fan?
In my opinion, if your Star Trek fan of any type, you owe it to yourself to at least try the game out.
My friends and I have discussed this for a long time now, and we agree that having Player crews would be awesome. However we also love the other aspects of what Star Trek was, and that is exploring, seeking out new life forms and to go boldly where no one else has gone before. We plan on making our own little mini game out of it. We will meet somewhere like Deep Space 9, each set our own course and take off, who ever finds a new world first will contact the rest of us, and we will head to that planet, then group up to explore the world meet the life forms on that planet and if sentient, Begin negotiations to join the federation, or protect ourselves from there attacks.
We look forward to heading into the neutral zone for some pvp action in little squadrons. This is where not being a player crew would be most beneficial in my opinion. Setting up ambushes with one of us playing decoy to lure ships into our net.
So in my opinion, not having interiors to start out is not game breaking nor is not having player crews. I would hope though that some time in the near future they would have both.
I am filled with the deja-vouse of the PE explosion when they anounced they were not including interiors. I would think Cryptic would do their home work and make this a priority feature. I can understand the technical problems associated with player crews but free roaming interiors are very doable and are a key element of the Star Trek feel.
After all the debating and argueing back in the PE interior war days I am simply too fed up to debate this too much. I simply will watch and wait in the hope Cryptic wakes up to the mistake they are making. Because for me personaly they will not see a dime of my money until that happens.
No or limited interiors maybe a game breaker for me. I am a huge Star Trek fan but STO with no interiors, bad idea. Since I am a huge fan I will probably try it but I am very disappointed with this direction. Multiplayer ships I feel are a must. I want to live on a ship that is the heart of Star Trek.
I'm not sure if that shoots my theory down or not. Your saying what most star trek fans are, that interiors should be a huge part of the experience and it maybe a game breaker which at first glance leads me to believe that they are shooting at the wrong target audience but than you'd play it anyway because your a star trek fan? I'm not sure if I understand that. I suppose you are saying the setting and stories of star trek is enough because your a huge fan?
Yes this maybe a game breaker for me. I will make a decision close to released based on a number of issues. Will the game at release offset what I feel is important to my ST experience. However like Lord of the Rings Online I think Star Trek has so many fans and appeal that many including myself may try it even if the game is not exactly what we hope for. So the stories and the setting the developers offer may be enough to get many to try but will it be enough to keep them? LOTRO got me to try it because of my love of Tolkien but ultimately I left because I did not feel I was really in Middle Earth. For me the feeling of a living persistent world is what I enjoy most in a good mmo. Can STO make me feel I am in a persistent world without the multiplayer ship and interior to move around in? We will see.
I am a huge ST fan, I grew up watching Kirk and co and am almost finished TNG box set yet I have never bought a single Star Trek game and thats simply because no game has ever been made that would allow me to feel part of the Enterprise crew.
STO sounds like another game for that pile of dross. If they are planning to incorporate interiors and multiplayer crews then I will wait until that happens before I subscripe, as I am not spending 1 penny on a gloryfied version of Eve.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.
That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle. That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
Its destroyed my interest in the game for the moment, IF the game gets good reviews and I can sift thru the hate posts v fanboy muck I might still do a month but its doesnt sound like something im going to like.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle. That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
Good point. I threw some pretty bitchin yacht parties back in the day before I quit SWG.
Originally posted by eccoton Originally posted by nolf One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle. That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.
That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
While the smaller ships didn't allow you to walk around(which makes sense), they did offer a pretty good cockpit view. In fact, I rarely ever used the exterior view.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.
That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
The yacht is not the only ship in SWG you can walk around in and decorate. The YT-1300 ( the "Millenium Falcon" model ) is another example, with the additionof the ability to have others join you in fighting by manning the turrets while you fly the ship.
Originally posted by WisebutCruel Originally posted by nolf
Originally posted by eccoton
Originally posted by nolf
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle. That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
The yacht is not the only ship in SWG you can walk around in and decorate. The YT-1300 ( the "Millenium Falcon" model ) is another example, with the additionof the ability to have others join you in fighting by manning the turrets while you fly the ship.
As you yourself quoted me as saying "That is an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however......" and "This isn't even the point of my post."
I've yet to see why this negates the point of my post, which is, I DON'T WANT TO BE A VEHICLE.
Not here saying that STO will be a failure due to this, just that I don't personally want to play it based on that. Not ripping SWG's JTL (I got some fun out of that expansion), just merely expressing my thoughts on being a vehicle, as asked by the OP of this thread. If you want to make me a pilot, make me a pilot. Give me a control panel and readouts and such, just as the pilots in ST have. I don't want to hold my right mouse button down and drag to turn my ship. That's all I'm saying.
So however you choose to nitpick my thoughts and railroad this thread off the intended topic, that doesn't change the fact that some of us don't want to be a ship. Not saying they should change their game plans or anything, just that I'm among those who probably won't be playing due to this feature.
If they make a consorted effort to balance this out by giving your character places to be a character, I will consider it. But really Star Trek is about life aboard a ship, not life as one, in my eyes. A bunch of random planets and stations to play around on for a few levels aren't really going to make up for that, for me.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
Originally posted by kingfelix Originally posted by nolf
Originally posted by eccoton
Originally posted by nolf
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle. That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
While the smaller ships didn't allow you to walk around(which makes sense), they did offer a pretty good cockpit view. In fact, I rarely ever used the exterior view.
/agree that the cockpit was definitely the was the only way to go in JTL. I also felt more like a "pilot" with the joystick as opposed to the keyboard and mouse, but there was WAY more to SWG than being in your ship which is why the feeling of being a vehicle was so much less intense for me in SWG.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.
That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
The yacht is not the only ship in SWG you can walk around in and decorate. The YT-1300 ( the "Millenium Falcon" model ) is another example, with the additionof the ability to have others join you in fighting by manning the turrets while you fly the ship.
As you yourself quoted me as saying "That is an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however......" and "This isn't even the point of my post."
I've yet to see why this negates the point of my post, which is, I DON'T WANT TO BE A VEHICLE.
Not here saying that STO will be a failure due to this, just that I don't personally want to play it based on that. Not ripping SWG's JTL (I got some fun out of that expansion), just merely expressing my thoughts on being a vehicle, as asked by the OP of this thread. If you want to make me a pilot, make me a pilot. Give me a control panel and readouts and such, just as the pilots in ST have. I don't want to hold my right mouse button down and drag to turn my ship. That's all I'm saying.
So however you choose to nitpick my thoughts and railroad this thread off the intended topic, that doesn't change the fact that some of us don't want to be a ship. Not saying they should change their game plans or anything, just that I'm among those who probably won't be playing due to this feature.
If they make a consorted effort to balance this out by giving your character places to be a character, I will consider it. But really Star Trek is about life aboard a ship, not life as one, in my eyes. A bunch of random planets and stations to play around on for a few levels aren't really going to make up for that, for me.
I have played PotBS and while it would have been nice to walk around on the ship and decorate the captains room it was not a must have.
Also think about it this way, implementing ship interiors for every shiptype or playercrews take a shitload of time and money.
The question for such features is now, is it worth it to implement it for the start? They have to ask themselfs, does the implementation of those features attract enough people to warrant the cost?
My opinion for all this is simple. Make a basic game that is enough fun and should you get enough people to play add the other features afterwards.
The only company out there, willing to sink huge amounts of money in an untested MMO might be Blizzard. All the others will make a MMO with the basics and add afterwards if it is successfull.
Nice to have? Yes. Gamebreaking? No. I have played PotBS and while it would have been nice to walk around on the ship and decorate the captains room it was not a must have.
Also think about it this way, implementing ship interiors for every shiptype or playercrews take a shitload of time and money. The question for such features is now, is it worth it to implement it for the start? They have to ask themselfs, does the implementation of those features attract enough people to warrant the cost?
My opinion for all this is simple. Make a basic game that is enough fun and should you get enough people to play add the other features afterwards.
The only company out there, willing to sink huge amounts of money in an untested MMO might be Blizzard. All the others will make a MMO with the basics and add afterwards if it is successfull.
Good points, though it seems(at least from the poll) that this game may not be very successful until it has said feature. I think there are just a lot of ST fans that associate ST with the what goes on onboard the ships. Also, I don't think PotBS is a very good example of a sucessful game.
I wouldnt read to much into that poll. It has only 106 votes, more than half would still try it even without interiors.
And, lets face it, most posts on the mmorpg.com forums are usually negative. Regardless of what mmo it is.
Oh and, i didnt say that PotBS was a successfull game. I simply wanted to point out that it was similar to STO and that the lack of ship interiors wasnt gamebreaking there.
Comments
It was my faulty memory that STO had multiplayer ships (perhaps it did in some previous incarnation) that brought me to the game in the first place. I will never stop pointing out that games with multiplayer ships can and do work and I will keep pointing out examples. I agree Cryptic will miss the essence of Star Trek without crewed ships. The ship, what happens inside amongst crew that are interacting, is the very heart of the show. What makes combat in Star Trek unique? The bridge scenes. Captains calling out orders, bridge crew confirming and relaying information, explosions, panels and screens blowing out, bodies getting knocked around. Now, Saturday Night Live might make fun of how goofy they can be but that only makes the point how iconic they are to the experience. It's not some some weird fetish it's a basic touchstone of identity.
All that said, I'm in STO regardless. What they're doing with procedurally generated worlds/missions and competative PvE is fundamentally exciting, should be exciting, to anyone that plays MMOs. These are ideas that will make PvE replayable. Could well turn it from the grind we all know and hate into a game we actually enjoy playing. Doing something for the experience, enjoyment, of it rather than for the bribe of a reward at the end is a wonderful idea. Dynamic gameplay without being dependant on PvP could be a big tipping point in how MMOs are designed. If it works.
There are crews in the game. They're bridge crews/away teams. It sounds like they'll be every bit as important and customizable as the player-character captain himself. I like this. The fact is that even with multiplayer ships in the game most of us, most of the time, even if we're on a big ship will be flying solo when our friends aren't around. Having a functional ship player crew is a task that does require some organization (no more than getting a party together for dungeons) and practice as a team. This means organized guilds, small or large. When your buddies, the 'regular cast', isn't around you're probably not going to want to just sit around or join a pick-up group. Instead you can take your own ship, and your own NPC crew, out for adventures. And...I like pet classes. If beastmaster or mastermind is cool how much cooler will having a whole party of customizable characters under your control?
Yeah, I'm in. Cryptic has promised that they aren't shutting the doors on multiplayer crews just focusing on what needs to work to get the game out first. And they're right. If there aren't functional dynamic missions and strategic PvE then nobody will be warping around either in solo ships or multiplayer ones.
Keep on fighting the good fight, never let Cryptic forget they need the multiplayer starship to truely create a "Star Trek" experience, but try to be realistic in your expectations in the short term.
We do know bridges will be in at some point, possibly at or shortly after launch, and we've been told that when they figure out how to make ship interiors functional rather than decorative they'll be in as well for regular use. Once that happens how long before the obvious? More people will want to play on their friends ships if only "just for fun." I think they must know how this is likely to play out themselves and they should damn well be planning for it.
Always notice what you notice.
Great Post! I feel pretty much the same way about this game. I think it still sounds like it could be a fun/interesting game, but I really think they need multi-player crewed ships with interiors to create an immersive Star Trek experience.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
Great Post! I feel pretty much the same way about this game. I think it still sounds like it could be a fun/interesting game, but I really think they need multi-player crewed ships with interiors to create an immersive Star Trek experience.
I agree, it was a good post. I still cannot get excited about PVE even though thats probably the closest I've come to it but I can easily see why others would be anticapating the game. That said, the consensus seems to be that it won't really feel like a true star trek game and I'm just wondering if it was a waste for them to buy the Star Trek IP for a mmorpg?
No or limited interiors maybe a game breaker for me. I am a huge Star Trek fan but STO with no interiors, bad idea. Since I am a huge fan I will probably try it but I am very disappointed with this direction. Multiplayer ships I feel are a must. I want to live on a ship that is the heart of Star Trek.
I'm not sure if that shoots my theory down or not. Your saying what most star trek fans are, that interiors should be a huge part of the experience and it maybe a game breaker which at first glance leads me to believe that they are shooting at the wrong target audience but than you'd play it anyway because your a star trek fan? I'm not sure if I understand that. I suppose you are saying the setting and stories of star trek is enough because your a huge fan?
Boom! 50% potential customers GONE! just like the interiors.
Bye Bye STO - you could of been great.
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
I'm not sure if that shoots my theory down or not. Your saying what most star trek fans are, that interiors should be a huge part of the experience and it maybe a game breaker which at first glance leads me to believe that they are shooting at the wrong target audience but than you'd play it anyway because your a star trek fan? I'm not sure if I understand that. I suppose you are saying the setting and stories of star trek is enough because your a huge fan?
In my opinion, if your Star Trek fan of any type, you owe it to yourself to at least try the game out.
My friends and I have discussed this for a long time now, and we agree that having Player crews would be awesome. However we also love the other aspects of what Star Trek was, and that is exploring, seeking out new life forms and to go boldly where no one else has gone before. We plan on making our own little mini game out of it. We will meet somewhere like Deep Space 9, each set our own course and take off, who ever finds a new world first will contact the rest of us, and we will head to that planet, then group up to explore the world meet the life forms on that planet and if sentient, Begin negotiations to join the federation, or protect ourselves from there attacks.
We look forward to heading into the neutral zone for some pvp action in little squadrons. This is where not being a player crew would be most beneficial in my opinion. Setting up ambushes with one of us playing decoy to lure ships into our net.
So in my opinion, not having interiors to start out is not game breaking nor is not having player crews. I would hope though that some time in the near future they would have both.
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
I am filled with the deja-vouse of the PE explosion when they anounced they were not including interiors. I would think Cryptic would do their home work and make this a priority feature. I can understand the technical problems associated with player crews but free roaming interiors are very doable and are a key element of the Star Trek feel.
After all the debating and argueing back in the PE interior war days I am simply too fed up to debate this too much. I simply will watch and wait in the hope Cryptic wakes up to the mistake they are making. Because for me personaly they will not see a dime of my money until that happens.
I'm not sure if that shoots my theory down or not. Your saying what most star trek fans are, that interiors should be a huge part of the experience and it maybe a game breaker which at first glance leads me to believe that they are shooting at the wrong target audience but than you'd play it anyway because your a star trek fan? I'm not sure if I understand that. I suppose you are saying the setting and stories of star trek is enough because your a huge fan?
Yes this maybe a game breaker for me. I will make a decision close to released based on a number of issues. Will the game at release offset what I feel is important to my ST experience. However like Lord of the Rings Online I think Star Trek has so many fans and appeal that many including myself may try it even if the game is not exactly what we hope for. So the stories and the setting the developers offer may be enough to get many to try but will it be enough to keep them? LOTRO got me to try it because of my love of Tolkien but ultimately I left because I did not feel I was really in Middle Earth. For me the feeling of a living persistent world is what I enjoy most in a good mmo. Can STO make me feel I am in a persistent world without the multiplayer ship and interior to move around in? We will see.
They losted me, it's just EvE with Startrek Wrecked Ship's now.
I am a huge ST fan, I grew up watching Kirk and co and am almost finished TNG box set yet I have never bought a single Star Trek game and thats simply because no game has ever been made that would allow me to feel part of the Enterprise crew.
STO sounds like another game for that pile of dross. If they are planning to incorporate interiors and multiplayer crews then I will wait until that happens before I subscripe, as I am not spending 1 penny on a gloryfied version of Eve.
One thing I know, I do NOT want to be a vehicle in any way shape or form in my MMOs. I didn't enjoy it in EVE, or in JTL for SWG. There is nothing that detracts more from immersion or any sense of RPG than pretending to be a vehicle.
That doesn't mean I believe this game is or will be a failure, but the likelihood of me playing it is very low for that reason. The one thing I would play STO for would be immersion; living in the Star Trek universe. Being a ship flying through space just doesn't cut it for me, I'm afraid, despite the fact that I am a life-long star trek fan of the shows, movies, and novels.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
Its destroyed my interest in the game for the moment, IF the game gets good reviews and I can sift thru the hate posts v fanboy muck I might still do a month but its doesnt sound like something im going to like.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
Good point. I threw some pretty bitchin yacht parties back in the day before I quit SWG.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
While the smaller ships didn't allow you to walk around(which makes sense), they did offer a pretty good cockpit view. In fact, I rarely ever used the exterior view.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
The yacht is not the only ship in SWG you can walk around in and decorate. The YT-1300 ( the "Millenium Falcon" model ) is another example, with the additionof the ability to have others join you in fighting by manning the turrets while you fly the ship.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
The yacht is not the only ship in SWG you can walk around in and decorate. The YT-1300 ( the "Millenium Falcon" model ) is another example, with the additionof the ability to have others join you in fighting by manning the turrets while you fly the ship.
As you yourself quoted me as saying "That is an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however......" and "This isn't even the point of my post."
I've yet to see why this negates the point of my post, which is, I DON'T WANT TO BE A VEHICLE.
Not here saying that STO will be a failure due to this, just that I don't personally want to play it based on that. Not ripping SWG's JTL (I got some fun out of that expansion), just merely expressing my thoughts on being a vehicle, as asked by the OP of this thread. If you want to make me a pilot, make me a pilot. Give me a control panel and readouts and such, just as the pilots in ST have. I don't want to hold my right mouse button down and drag to turn my ship. That's all I'm saying.
So however you choose to nitpick my thoughts and railroad this thread off the intended topic, that doesn't change the fact that some of us don't want to be a ship. Not saying they should change their game plans or anything, just that I'm among those who probably won't be playing due to this feature.
If they make a consorted effort to balance this out by giving your character places to be a character, I will consider it. But really Star Trek is about life aboard a ship, not life as one, in my eyes. A bunch of random planets and stations to play around on for a few levels aren't really going to make up for that, for me.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
While the smaller ships didn't allow you to walk around(which makes sense), they did offer a pretty good cockpit view. In fact, I rarely ever used the exterior view.
/agree that the cockpit was definitely the was the only way to go in JTL. I also felt more like a "pilot" with the joystick as opposed to the keyboard and mouse, but there was WAY more to SWG than being in your ship which is why the feeling of being a vehicle was so much less intense for me in SWG.
I really hope that *insert game name here* will be the first game to ever live up to all of its pre-release promises, maintain a manageable hype level and have a clean release. Just don't expect me to hold my breath.
You were not a vehicle in SWG you were the pilot. I loved my luxury yaht in SWG. You could walk around it decorate the different rooms. I had a bar area like 10 forward. You could even have other players come on board. I would hold parties and have a dozen people hanging out and dancing on my ship. The ships in SWG added tons of immersion. I had hoped STO would have that type of thing in the game. I do not think anyone here wants to be the ship, they seem to want to be one of the crew members on the ship.
That's an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however, followed the EVE way of you are the ship. Yes, you were "piloting" it, but as I said, looking at myself as a ship doesn't cut it for me. That isn't even the point of my post, but you are correct, SWG did allow you to walk around your yacht. How that invalidates how I feel about the rest of the ships in SWG and all of them in EVE, I don't know.
The yacht is not the only ship in SWG you can walk around in and decorate. The YT-1300 ( the "Millenium Falcon" model ) is another example, with the additionof the ability to have others join you in fighting by manning the turrets while you fly the ship.
As you yourself quoted me as saying "That is an example of ONE kind of ship featured in SWG that allowed that. Most of them, however......" and "This isn't even the point of my post."
I've yet to see why this negates the point of my post, which is, I DON'T WANT TO BE A VEHICLE.
Not here saying that STO will be a failure due to this, just that I don't personally want to play it based on that. Not ripping SWG's JTL (I got some fun out of that expansion), just merely expressing my thoughts on being a vehicle, as asked by the OP of this thread. If you want to make me a pilot, make me a pilot. Give me a control panel and readouts and such, just as the pilots in ST have. I don't want to hold my right mouse button down and drag to turn my ship. That's all I'm saying.
So however you choose to nitpick my thoughts and railroad this thread off the intended topic, that doesn't change the fact that some of us don't want to be a ship. Not saying they should change their game plans or anything, just that I'm among those who probably won't be playing due to this feature.
If they make a consorted effort to balance this out by giving your character places to be a character, I will consider it. But really Star Trek is about life aboard a ship, not life as one, in my eyes. A bunch of random planets and stations to play around on for a few levels aren't really going to make up for that, for me.
I agree nolf.
Personally I have no interest in a game mainly being a space pew pew game. Much less so with a Star Trek game. I sense a huge lack of vision here.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Nice to have? Yes.
Gamebreaking? No.
I have played PotBS and while it would have been nice to walk around on the ship and decorate the captains room it was not a must have.
Also think about it this way, implementing ship interiors for every shiptype or playercrews take a shitload of time and money.
The question for such features is now, is it worth it to implement it for the start? They have to ask themselfs, does the implementation of those features attract enough people to warrant the cost?
My opinion for all this is simple. Make a basic game that is enough fun and should you get enough people to play add the other features afterwards.
The only company out there, willing to sink huge amounts of money in an untested MMO might be Blizzard. All the others will make a MMO with the basics and add afterwards if it is successfull.
Good points, though it seems(at least from the poll) that this game may not be very successful until it has said feature. I think there are just a lot of ST fans that associate ST with the what goes on onboard the ships. Also, I don't think PotBS is a very good example of a sucessful game.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
I wouldnt read to much into that poll. It has only 106 votes, more than half would still try it even without interiors.
And, lets face it, most posts on the mmorpg.com forums are usually negative. Regardless of what mmo it is.
Oh and, i didnt say that PotBS was a successfull game. I simply wanted to point out that it was similar to STO and that the lack of ship interiors wasnt gamebreaking there.