So can any one recommend me a mmorpg or am I going to go back to single player rpgs and wait for the next best thing?
If you are looking for something a tad different, you could take a look at Saga of Ryzom. There is a trial, so you can take a free look. I'm unsure if it's sandbox, but if it isn't, it is close
I don't know about end-game in Ryzom, but I started recently and like it. It is very free, because it is skill based and you can build your character how you please.
I see the OP's complaint everywhere... I don't understand why you guys burn yourselves out of games by constantly doing the same content over and over again with a zerg mentality of trying to get "the best of the best" gear. What happens after you get that gear? Do you even know how to have fun in the game when you aren't trying to get your Epic Hat of Win? WoW, as well as most other successful MMORPGs, has a ton of stuff to do. You don't need to rush through to level 80 a day after the expansion comes out, and you don't need to rush through Naxx the day after. I can't possibly see how any of this would be fun. There are other things to do, other FUN things, that do NOT rely solely on grinding levels, only to begin grinding for gear. When you guys ("you guys", meaning the ones who are saying they are burnt out on the repetition of "end game")start to realize that, you'll begin having more fun with your MMOs. End game is a state of mind, not an inevitiability of most successful MMOs.
I've done all the Northrend Content (all quests in every zone) and I agree with the OP. Yeah, I could go back to BC or Old World stuff, but that provides zero challenge and gets very boring very quickly. I've tried playing alts, but the gameplay honestly isn't that interesting on any class (though DK's have the most interesting class mechanics, it basically boils down to watching a bunch of cooldowns for 3 rune types and abilities). I like doing stuff with my brother, but I can't do anything challenging with him unless we do an instance, which requires getting 3 other people, and as you gear up becomes less and less challenging (doing well in the game punishes you if you like a challenge). Furthermore, there really just isn't a lot of group content when you get down to it, and I've done it all. The bosses always act the same way, and they all act like morons, so that gets boring after a few weeks easily. The only reason I still play is because I'm a good raid leader and so people count on me. As it is, I am trying to avoid playing as much as possible. It's not because I haven't tried to get myself interested in other parts of the game, but because I have tried and it's all become the same mindless, challengeless drivel (and again, even if I find a challenge somewhere, I am either not rewarded for it or punished by getting gear that makes challenges more trivial).
I see the OP's complaint everywhere... I don't understand why you guys burn yourselves out of games by constantly doing the same content over and over again with a zerg mentality of trying to get "the best of the best" gear. What happens after you get that gear? Do you even know how to have fun in the game when you aren't trying to get your Epic Hat of Win? WoW, as well as most other successful MMORPGs, has a ton of stuff to do. You don't need to rush through to level 80 a day after the expansion comes out, and you don't need to rush through Naxx the day after. I can't possibly see how any of this would be fun. There are other things to do, other FUN things, that do NOT rely solely on grinding levels, only to begin grinding for gear. When you guys ("you guys", meaning the ones who are saying they are burnt out on the repetition of "end game")start to realize that, you'll begin having more fun with your MMOs. End game is a state of mind, not an inevitiability of most successful MMOs.
The problem is there isn't a lot to do in WoW. And all guilds are interested in right now are raids. Leveling from 1-80 is where all the content is.
Thanks guys, EVE was okay, I could not really get into FFXI, it seemed really much more complicated than a mmorpg should be. How is LOTRO by any chance? I like mmos with good stories as well
I was going to offer advice until I read this. FFXI too complicated? Maybe you belong in WoW after all.
Thanks guys, EVE was okay, I could not really get into FFXI, it seemed really much more complicated than a mmorpg should be. How is LOTRO by any chance? I like mmos with good stories as well
I was going to offer advice until I read this. FFXI too complicated? Maybe you belong in WoW after all.
NO doubt. When I started playing EVE I didn't even have a second to think of FFXI. I didn't even know it's existence. By the way, get LOTRO, it's 100% worth. Just ask long term players because I'm just not qualified for that.
The biggest problem with FFXI isn't solo friendly. You have to GRIND as a GROUP to level. I didn't find that fun at all.
And the crafting system in it was stupid. Having to have a buff on you to get those Crystals... then only to have it fail and lose most of you mats. oh and that 10% XP lost on Death was killer.... All these things is why I only played it for 3 month and never looked back. That was well before WoW was even released.
Tho that level sync they added sounds kinda cool, and sounds like finding a group is easier, but still sounds like it has the group grind nonsense I quit the game because of is still there.
After getting my level 80 elemental shaman in a raid guild, after doing the same 3-4 heroic instances to get the gear i needed to raid, I joined a raid guild, constantly we did the same raid naxxramas, eye of eternity and malygos those three same raids, the same thing over and over and over again. Just hoping for loot. When I was leveling my alt to 80, something just came accross my mind that this is what I will be doing with this character, the same few instances, to the same few raids just to to keep grinding for loot and waiting months after months for a different raid. There was no different exploration, there was no different content, it was rushing to 80 to do the same grind that i did on my shaman.
Is it worth it? The 15 dollars a month to constantly do this same repetition? Then I quit WoW. but is this problem just in WOW? Are there any mmorpgs with a different end game where there are different goals? If there is can any one recommend me one? I am extremely bored and its not that I am burned out there is a big difference between being burned out and just plain bored.
So can any one recommend me a mmorpg or am I going to go back to single player rpgs and wait for the next best thing?
People pay a lot of money to roll a big 16 pound ball down a lane and knock over the same 10 pins over and over and over again.
I don't see them complaining.
But seriously, name one game where you don't basically don the same thing over and over again?
____________________________________________ im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
So can any one recommend me a mmorpg or am I going to go back to single player rpgs and wait for the next best thing?
First of all there are some great single player games out there. And if all of your time is in WoW than you are missing out big time.
If you like RPG's check out Mass Effect, (and Jade Empire if you haven't yet) Fallout 3, (and Oblivion if you haven't yet).
For action there's always Orange box and Left4dead and GTA4.
As for MMOs I've been playing City of Heroes/Villains for 5 years. You don't work towards anything in that game, you play to play and that's it. It's best for altaholics. You can do endgame grinding if you really want, but I don't see the point.
MMO games are what you make of them. Nobody said that rushing to end game and partcipating in the loot treadmill is what you have to, or even are supposed to do. I've been playing (mostly) since launch and I've never been to Karazhan, or any instances after it. I still have fun by taking my time leveling, exploring, farming and trading in the auction hall. I even occasionally read the quest text! I roleplay by gaining reputation with the places that fit my character. I cook, I fish, I clean my house... just kidding. But you get the picture. If end game was all I was interested in, I would have quit when Burning Crusade came out. Luckily for me, I am easily amused, and I don't care if I'm not doing the "in" thing, or doing what everyone else is doing. I have more fun going against the grain, to be honest. If you measure your character by the loot that everyone else has, then yes, i could see being frustrated and unsatisfied. But nobody said you have to play that way.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
After getting my level 80 elemental shaman in a raid guild, after doing the same 3-4 heroic instances to get the gear i needed to raid, I joined a raid guild, constantly we did the same raid naxxramas, eye of eternity and malygos those three same raids, the same thing over and over and over again. Just hoping for loot. When I was leveling my alt to 80, something just came accross my mind that this is what I will be doing with this character, the same few instances, to the same few raids just to to keep grinding for loot and waiting months after months for a different raid. There was no different exploration, there was no different content, it was rushing to 80 to do the same grind that i did on my shaman.
Is it worth it? The 15 dollars a month to constantly do this same repetition? Then I quit WoW. but is this problem just in WOW? Are there any mmorpgs with a different end game where there are different goals? If there is can any one recommend me one? I am extremely bored and its not that I am burned out there is a big difference between being burned out and just plain bored.
So can any one recommend me a mmorpg or am I going to go back to single player rpgs and wait for the next best thing?
People pay a lot of money to roll a big 16 pound ball down a lane and knock over the same 10 pins over and over and over again.
I don't see them complaining.
But seriously, name one game where you don't basically don the same thing over and over again?
Had to laugh at this, good one!
Out of every 100 men, 10 should not be there, 80 are nothing but targets, 9 are the real fighters. Ah, but one, ONE of them is a warrior, and he will bring the others home. -Heraclitus 500BC
So can any one recommend me a mmorpg or am I going to go back to single player rpgs and wait for the next best thing?
First of all there are some great single player games out there. And if all of your time is in WoW than you are missing out big time.
If you like RPG's check out Mass Effect, (and Jade Empire if you haven't yet) Fallout 3, (and Oblivion if you haven't yet).
For action there's always Orange box and Left4dead and GTA4.
As for MMOs I've been playing City of Heroes/Villains for 5 years. You don't work towards anything in that game, you play to play and that's it. It's best for altaholics. You can do endgame grinding if you really want, but I don't see the point.
sounds to me like you limited YOURSELF. why were those 3 or 4 raids the ONLY ones you did? stop treating the game like a 2nd job. try forgetting about DKP's and stats and getting the "right" gear.. try HAVING FUN. why does it have to be so serious?
people these days are so focused on being uber or being "geared" that they forget to have fun
You made me laugh, I give you that. Naxx 25, Sartharion 25 and Malygos 25 is the ONLY thing you have for end game right now, which can be done in 4-5 hours AND you NEED gear if you want to progress. Those easy mode instances are not fun by all means. Blizzard screwed up, let's hope they pick it up with Ulduar.
This is why Asherons Call was my favorite MMO. It was almost impossible to hit cap level the first year the game was out. I never got bored and I always felt like my character was progressing.
I see the OP's complaint everywhere... I don't understand why you guys burn yourselves out of games by constantly doing the same content over and over again with a zerg mentality of trying to get "the best of the best" gear. What happens after you get that gear? Do you even know how to have fun in the game when you aren't trying to get your Epic Hat of Win? WoW, as well as most other successful MMORPGs, has a ton of stuff to do. You don't need to rush through to level 80 a day after the expansion comes out, and you don't need to rush through Naxx the day after. I can't possibly see how any of this would be fun. There are other things to do, other FUN things, that do NOT rely solely on grinding levels, only to begin grinding for gear. When you guys ("you guys", meaning the ones who are saying they are burnt out on the repetition of "end game")start to realize that, you'll begin having more fun with your MMOs. End game is a state of mind, not an inevitiability of most successful MMOs.
The problem is there isn't a lot to do in WoW. And all guilds are interested in right now are raids. Leveling from 1-80 is where all the content is.
Like I said in the post you replied to, I completely disagree with this line of thinking. Leveling from 1-80 is the beginning, not the immediate path to the end. All of the RAID guilds are interested in doing raids right now, but that's to be expected. I'd suggest, if raiding isn't your thing, joining a guild that isn't focused solely on the gear grind... you may find you have more fun that way.
Grinding for gear isn't the only thing to do, just like doing instances isn't the only "challenging" thing to do, as someone mentioned above. If you cannot find other things to do, I just don't think you've looked hard enough!
Originally posted by ParkCarsHere Like I said in the post you replied to, I completely disagree with this line of thinking. Leveling from 1-80 is the beginning, not the immediate path to the end. All of the RAID guilds are interested in doing raids right now, but that's to be expected. I'd suggest, if raiding isn't your thing, joining a guild that isn't focused solely on the gear grind... you may find you have more fun that way. Grinding for gear isn't the only thing to do, just like doing instances isn't the only "challenging" thing to do, as someone mentioned above. If you cannot find other things to do, I just don't think you've looked hard enough! To be entirely objective; there's really not that much PvE to do in WoW at end-game other than: 1. Raid.
2. Rep grinds.
3. Achievement grinds.
4. Crafting grinds.
5. Alts. If you're not into grinds, there's not a lot to do outside raid times. As a casual, this doesn't impact me .. but I have no idea how people who play 40 hours a week manage to occupy themselves for all that time.
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
Welcome to my world where banging your head against a wall seems more enjoyable than anything out there.
I've been there for years bro, and thus i just devoted my gaming time to just beta and alpha testing games out on the web. Seems to be working but I've yet to find a game that is worth my time, energy and actually worth playing and sticking with... Right now LotRO is looking promising but slowly its starting to turn me off, I'm thinking about trying AoC to see what its like, movies on youtube seems like its worth while to play.
Originally posted by Jerid13 So you didn't enjoy making your character get stronger? Scalable enemies does not negate my argument, rather it reinforces it, if enemies didn't get harder you couldn't get stronger to over come them... The point is that you said you spent 100's of hours playing an RPG, thats grinding, thats level building.
Making your character stronger isn't bad, per se. The problem is that an end game built around making your character stronger means an extremely repetitive and grindy endgame. The grinding and repetition are what's bad.
Spending hundreds of hours on a game isn't intrinsically grinding. Or do you want to argue that all that time I spent playing Tecmo Super Bowl, I was really just grinding levels in, err, what, exactly?
Wrong, read my post on page 3 at the top about FFXI and have a great day.
{ Mod Edit }.
Being an FFXI fanboy doesn't make you perfect. Maybe grouping is easier, but I bet travel times still stink and that grouping can still be a major pain if you can't find a healer or tank. I also can tell that it is still mega-grindy. Sure, the combat system is nice, but I don't really care for the "go to location X and kill guys for hours over and over again to gain a level." That DOES get old. The complete lack of single-player content, so if you want to explore you HAVE to get a full group, is not a lot of fun either. As for the crafting system, I can't believe you are advocating a system where you have a random chance to skill up and a random chance to fail and lose all of your mats. The crafting system in FFXI is TERRIBLE, the "hard" thing is just that it is a MASSIVE time and money sink. That's it. I'm not saying FFXI doesn't have it's good points -- I love the elemental combos, but it is far from a perfect game.
Sorry bro.
Level sync fixed all that. Any tank online or healer being level 75 can party and level sync with a level 10, drop their level down and exp for however long they want.
And there's ALWAYS over 2.2k people on pretty much every server always, japanese chinese americans just like WoW lmao
I play end game and also level new jobs and never had problems finding anything, you can ask any tank of the 600 tanks online to participate in any level party LOL every idiot WoW fanboy always has that argument how the heck would you know, I play FFXI you don't.
I played it years ago. Maybe that one thing has changed, but you failed to address all of my other points. Apparently I'm an "idiot WoW Fanboy" to you because I don't like WoW or FFXI.
You maybe used to not like it, I used to not be fond of it, but it's evolved like I said and will not repeat in a hundred posts for idiots like you who don't read everything to miss, EVOLVED into a magical beautiful game
You know, I get the fact it is easier to group now. I'll believe you on that. Too bad you are too busy calling people idiots to actually address the rest of the reasons I didn't like FFXI (staying in one spot for hours grinding mobs, the crafting system, total inability to solo any content of that matters, etc, etc). While I like the group combat system, that doesn't mean I like how they make you use it. As far as I can tell, many of the things I didn't like are still in force. I find it ironic that you accuse me of not reading what you've wrote, when it is actually you who isn't reading what other people right.
Actually I've only called 2 people idiots which still holds true for the reasoning they posted what they did.
Reason I called them an idiot:
They said they played FFXI when Rise of Zilart released and guess what, IF YOU DID READ ANYTHING LIKE YOU JUST STATED you would already know this, I said it was released in 2003, yeah, telling me you played Rise of Zilart in 2003 is like basing World of Warcraft off of Pre-BC level 60 cap when the level cap is 80, GET IT smarty pants since I had to break it down for you, god you are the most impossible person I have ever met.
Oh I did call you one because the only excuse for playing FFXI anyone that plays WoW has is, the repitituous grinding of mobs,when in fact you don't grind the exact same mobs, you have about 3-4 different in the area to choose from, and you tell me, which even proves even further you didn't read, that I didn't explain FFXI when if you go to the top of page 3 in this thread I went haywire and typed a whole page for tards like you to not read and accuse me of not explaining anything, actually I posted about 3 pages about it, from page 3 all the way through page 6 there Doc.
And all you post is redundant crap that doesn't make sense, when in the last 5 pages I have explained my point of view way more than you even thought about, maybe because since you're too lazy to read, you definately are too lazy to move your fingers.
I agree with most of the design choices made in wow. I do think their end game suffers from overly repetitive game play issues. I expect they know this but cannot change it given the architecture of the game, but will in their next mmo. *fingers crossed*..
Well I am playing the game for 3.5 years now and 75% of my time I am doing PvP.
Can't even see it in your list...
BG's, Lake Wintergrasp, open world PvP, City Raid are pure fun and were never better organised in WotLK.
And since Wow has the best fluid controls in the avatars fights, why should I even think of stopping the fun I have ?
To play unresponsive, clunky avatars with a stick in their asses and have an uncontrolled autofacing puppet ???
Just trying to be Justicar or Conqueror or having a title like Challenger is pure fun to get.
-------
Also: every class in Wow is rather worth a good play and is a complete different experience: Try a Holy Paladin and a rogue to get the feeling of HOW different they play both in PvP and in PvE.
Tactics change according to your class.
Which idiot thinks a Rogue plays like a warlock or a paladin or a mage ???????
Nice try, but your ALT is NEVER the same kind of play in Wow (both PvE and PvP) and you know that very well.
I'd like to play this game that you are, because it sure isn't the WoW that I played for 4 years.
Justicar? Conqueror? Talk about the ultimate grind, you kind of just proved his point there. PvP is a grind as well, if not more so.
This is why endgame should be exactly that, endgame. It is also why there should be more focus on providing more content before endgame. Eventually everything has an end except space and time.
That happens to me sometimes. I'll be playing WoW, and I'll have a thought. It usually ends in me quitting, at least for a while. Just wait until the thoughts go away, and you can enjoy the game again. WoW and thinking do not mix.
After getting my level 80 elemental shaman in a raid guild, after doing the same 3-4 heroic instances to get the gear i needed to raid, I joined a raid guild, constantly we did the same raid naxxramas, eye of eternity and malygos those three same raids, the same thing over and over and over again. Just hoping for loot. When I was leveling my alt to 80, something just came accross my mind that this is what I will be doing with this character, the same few instances, to the same few raids just to to keep grinding for loot and waiting months after months for a different raid. There was no different exploration, there was no different content, it was rushing to 80 to do the same grind that i did on my shaman.
Is it worth it? The 15 dollars a month to constantly do this same repetition? Then I quit WoW. but is this problem just in WOW? Are there any mmorpgs with a different end game where there are different goals? If there is can any one recommend me one? I am extremely bored and its not that I am burned out there is a big difference between being burned out and just plain bored.
So can any one recommend me a mmorpg or am I going to go back to single player rpgs and wait for the next best thing?
Excellent point. Unfortunately, this can be said about any PvE game. I think what you're doing wrong is this:
Instead of joining a raid guild, that sees you as an elemental shaman, try joining a GUILD. Not a company looking for some nice loot. I feel as if you're playing the game to DO the content instead of relaxing, taking it slow, laugh, socialize, and enjoy the content.
Try moving to a different server and join a small guild of people you could talk to all day (because that is what you'll be doing), and have a good time. Play the game, don't let the game play you!
This is why endgame should be exactly that, endgame. It is also why there should be more focus on providing more content before endgame. Eventually everything has an end except space and time.
..... and football matches of course.
And that's why I never get bored with the fluid responsive fights in Wow.
How can anyone be bored with things like these ? Give me an mmorpg with the same fluid animations and controls of Wow and I would be hooked immediatly.
No ... they ALWAYS come up with the clunky awkward "stick a button in their asses" mechanics in those other mmorpg's.
Dreadful.
The few animations that WoW does have it does very well. That's the one thing I wish other developers would pay more attention to, combat and avatar animations. With that said, I think Guild Wars and AoC are just as fluid and responsive. Now you may not like their combat mechanics (personally I love both) but they are both well done imo.
Comments
If you are looking for something a tad different, you could take a look at Saga of Ryzom. There is a trial, so you can take a free look. I'm unsure if it's sandbox, but if it isn't, it is close
I don't know about end-game in Ryzom, but I started recently and like it. It is very free, because it is skill based and you can build your character how you please.
I've done all the Northrend Content (all quests in every zone) and I agree with the OP. Yeah, I could go back to BC or Old World stuff, but that provides zero challenge and gets very boring very quickly. I've tried playing alts, but the gameplay honestly isn't that interesting on any class (though DK's have the most interesting class mechanics, it basically boils down to watching a bunch of cooldowns for 3 rune types and abilities). I like doing stuff with my brother, but I can't do anything challenging with him unless we do an instance, which requires getting 3 other people, and as you gear up becomes less and less challenging (doing well in the game punishes you if you like a challenge). Furthermore, there really just isn't a lot of group content when you get down to it, and I've done it all. The bosses always act the same way, and they all act like morons, so that gets boring after a few weeks easily. The only reason I still play is because I'm a good raid leader and so people count on me. As it is, I am trying to avoid playing as much as possible. It's not because I haven't tried to get myself interested in other parts of the game, but because I have tried and it's all become the same mindless, challengeless drivel (and again, even if I find a challenge somewhere, I am either not rewarded for it or punished by getting gear that makes challenges more trivial).
The problem is there isn't a lot to do in WoW. And all guilds are interested in right now are raids. Leveling from 1-80 is where all the content is.
I was going to offer advice until I read this. FFXI too complicated? Maybe you belong in WoW after all.
I was going to offer advice until I read this. FFXI too complicated? Maybe you belong in WoW after all.
NO doubt. When I started playing EVE I didn't even have a second to think of FFXI. I didn't even know it's existence. By the way, get LOTRO, it's 100% worth. Just ask long term players because I'm just not qualified for that.
The biggest problem with FFXI isn't solo friendly. You have to GRIND as a GROUP to level. I didn't find that fun at all.
And the crafting system in it was stupid. Having to have a buff on you to get those Crystals... then only to have it fail and lose most of you mats. oh and that 10% XP lost on Death was killer.... All these things is why I only played it for 3 month and never looked back. That was well before WoW was even released.
Tho that level sync they added sounds kinda cool, and sounds like finding a group is easier, but still sounds like it has the group grind nonsense I quit the game because of is still there.
People pay a lot of money to roll a big 16 pound ball down a lane and knock over the same 10 pins over and over and over again.
I don't see them complaining.
But seriously, name one game where you don't basically don the same thing over and over again?
____________________________________________
im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
First of all there are some great single player games out there. And if all of your time is in WoW than you are missing out big time.
If you like RPG's check out Mass Effect, (and Jade Empire if you haven't yet) Fallout 3, (and Oblivion if you haven't yet).
For action there's always Orange box and Left4dead and GTA4.
As for MMOs I've been playing City of Heroes/Villains for 5 years. You don't work towards anything in that game, you play to play and that's it. It's best for altaholics. You can do endgame grinding if you really want, but I don't see the point.
MMO games are what you make of them. Nobody said that rushing to end game and partcipating in the loot treadmill is what you have to, or even are supposed to do. I've been playing (mostly) since launch and I've never been to Karazhan, or any instances after it. I still have fun by taking my time leveling, exploring, farming and trading in the auction hall. I even occasionally read the quest text! I roleplay by gaining reputation with the places that fit my character. I cook, I fish, I clean my house... just kidding. But you get the picture. If end game was all I was interested in, I would have quit when Burning Crusade came out. Luckily for me, I am easily amused, and I don't care if I'm not doing the "in" thing, or doing what everyone else is doing. I have more fun going against the grain, to be honest. If you measure your character by the loot that everyone else has, then yes, i could see being frustrated and unsatisfied. But nobody said you have to play that way.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
People pay a lot of money to roll a big 16 pound ball down a lane and knock over the same 10 pins over and over and over again.
I don't see them complaining.
But seriously, name one game where you don't basically don the same thing over and over again?
Had to laugh at this, good one!
Out of every 100 men, 10 should not be there,
80 are nothing but targets, 9 are the real fighters.
Ah, but one, ONE of them is a warrior,
and he will bring the others home.
-Heraclitus 500BC
First of all there are some great single player games out there. And if all of your time is in WoW than you are missing out big time.
If you like RPG's check out Mass Effect, (and Jade Empire if you haven't yet) Fallout 3, (and Oblivion if you haven't yet).
For action there's always Orange box and Left4dead and GTA4.
As for MMOs I've been playing City of Heroes/Villains for 5 years. You don't work towards anything in that game, you play to play and that's it. It's best for altaholics. You can do endgame grinding if you really want, but I don't see the point.
I like Srpgs but i also like playing with others
http://helpourfuture.blogspot.com/
save our future.
You made me laugh, I give you that. Naxx 25, Sartharion 25 and Malygos 25 is the ONLY thing you have for end game right now, which can be done in 4-5 hours AND you NEED gear if you want to progress. Those easy mode instances are not fun by all means. Blizzard screwed up, let's hope they pick it up with Ulduar.
be careful of them thoughts. If we're not careful everyone will have thoughts and quit WoW.
This is why Asherons Call was my favorite MMO. It was almost impossible to hit cap level the first year the game was out. I never got bored and I always felt like my character was progressing.
The problem is there isn't a lot to do in WoW. And all guilds are interested in right now are raids. Leveling from 1-80 is where all the content is.
Like I said in the post you replied to, I completely disagree with this line of thinking. Leveling from 1-80 is the beginning, not the immediate path to the end. All of the RAID guilds are interested in doing raids right now, but that's to be expected. I'd suggest, if raiding isn't your thing, joining a guild that isn't focused solely on the gear grind... you may find you have more fun that way.
Grinding for gear isn't the only thing to do, just like doing instances isn't the only "challenging" thing to do, as someone mentioned above. If you cannot find other things to do, I just don't think you've looked hard enough!
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
I've been there for years bro, and thus i just devoted my gaming time to just beta and alpha testing games out on the web. Seems to be working but I've yet to find a game that is worth my time, energy and actually worth playing and sticking with... Right now LotRO is looking promising but slowly its starting to turn me off, I'm thinking about trying AoC to see what its like, movies on youtube seems like its worth while to play.
Making your character stronger isn't bad, per se. The problem is that an end game built around making your character stronger means an extremely repetitive and grindy endgame. The grinding and repetition are what's bad.
Spending hundreds of hours on a game isn't intrinsically grinding. Or do you want to argue that all that time I spent playing Tecmo Super Bowl, I was really just grinding levels in, err, what, exactly?
Wrong, read my post on page 3 at the top about FFXI and have a great day.
{ Mod Edit }.
Being an FFXI fanboy doesn't make you perfect. Maybe grouping is easier, but I bet travel times still stink and that grouping can still be a major pain if you can't find a healer or tank. I also can tell that it is still mega-grindy. Sure, the combat system is nice, but I don't really care for the "go to location X and kill guys for hours over and over again to gain a level." That DOES get old. The complete lack of single-player content, so if you want to explore you HAVE to get a full group, is not a lot of fun either. As for the crafting system, I can't believe you are advocating a system where you have a random chance to skill up and a random chance to fail and lose all of your mats. The crafting system in FFXI is TERRIBLE, the "hard" thing is just that it is a MASSIVE time and money sink. That's it. I'm not saying FFXI doesn't have it's good points -- I love the elemental combos, but it is far from a perfect game.
Sorry bro.
Level sync fixed all that. Any tank online or healer being level 75 can party and level sync with a level 10, drop their level down and exp for however long they want.
And there's ALWAYS over 2.2k people on pretty much every server always, japanese chinese americans just like WoW lmao
I play end game and also level new jobs and never had problems finding anything, you can ask any tank of the 600 tanks online to participate in any level party LOL every idiot WoW fanboy always has that argument how the heck would you know, I play FFXI you don't.
I played it years ago. Maybe that one thing has changed, but you failed to address all of my other points. Apparently I'm an "idiot WoW Fanboy" to you because I don't like WoW or FFXI.
You maybe used to not like it, I used to not be fond of it, but it's evolved like I said and will not repeat in a hundred posts for idiots like you who don't read everything to miss, EVOLVED into a magical beautiful game
You know, I get the fact it is easier to group now. I'll believe you on that. Too bad you are too busy calling people idiots to actually address the rest of the reasons I didn't like FFXI (staying in one spot for hours grinding mobs, the crafting system, total inability to solo any content of that matters, etc, etc). While I like the group combat system, that doesn't mean I like how they make you use it. As far as I can tell, many of the things I didn't like are still in force. I find it ironic that you accuse me of not reading what you've wrote, when it is actually you who isn't reading what other people right.
Actually I've only called 2 people idiots which still holds true for the reasoning they posted what they did.
Reason I called them an idiot:
They said they played FFXI when Rise of Zilart released and guess what, IF YOU DID READ ANYTHING LIKE YOU JUST STATED you would already know this, I said it was released in 2003, yeah, telling me you played Rise of Zilart in 2003 is like basing World of Warcraft off of Pre-BC level 60 cap when the level cap is 80, GET IT smarty pants since I had to break it down for you, god you are the most impossible person I have ever met.
Oh I did call you one because the only excuse for playing FFXI anyone that plays WoW has is, the repitituous grinding of mobs,when in fact you don't grind the exact same mobs, you have about 3-4 different in the area to choose from, and you tell me, which even proves even further you didn't read, that I didn't explain FFXI when if you go to the top of page 3 in this thread I went haywire and typed a whole page for tards like you to not read and accuse me of not explaining anything, actually I posted about 3 pages about it, from page 3 all the way through page 6 there Doc.
And all you post is redundant crap that doesn't make sense, when in the last 5 pages I have explained my point of view way more than you even thought about, maybe because since you're too lazy to read, you definately are too lazy to move your fingers.
That piece of your post is your Real issue.
How bout just playing the game, whatever one it may be, and immerse yourself in the game play to have fun and learn the lore and dynamics?
I agree with most of the design choices made in wow. I do think their end game suffers from overly repetitive game play issues. I expect they know this but cannot change it given the architecture of the game, but will in their next mmo. *fingers crossed*..
Can't even see it in your list...
BG's, Lake Wintergrasp, open world PvP, City Raid are pure fun and were never better organised in WotLK.
And since Wow has the best fluid controls in the avatars fights, why should I even think of stopping the fun I have ?
To play unresponsive, clunky avatars with a stick in their asses and have an uncontrolled autofacing puppet ???
Just trying to be Justicar or Conqueror or having a title like Challenger is pure fun to get.
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Also: every class in Wow is rather worth a good play and is a complete different experience: Try a Holy Paladin and a rogue to get the feeling of HOW different they play both in PvP and in PvE.
Tactics change according to your class.
Which idiot thinks a Rogue plays like a warlock or a paladin or a mage ???????
Nice try, but your ALT is NEVER the same kind of play in Wow (both PvE and PvP) and you know that very well.
I'd like to play this game that you are, because it sure isn't the WoW that I played for 4 years.
Justicar? Conqueror? Talk about the ultimate grind, you kind of just proved his point there. PvP is a grind as well, if not more so.
This is why endgame should be exactly that, endgame. It is also why there should be more focus on providing more content before endgame. Eventually everything has an end except space and time.
That happens to me sometimes. I'll be playing WoW, and I'll have a thought. It usually ends in me quitting, at least for a while. Just wait until the thoughts go away, and you can enjoy the game again. WoW and thinking do not mix.
Excellent point. Unfortunately, this can be said about any PvE game. I think what you're doing wrong is this:
Instead of joining a raid guild, that sees you as an elemental shaman, try joining a GUILD. Not a company looking for some nice loot. I feel as if you're playing the game to DO the content instead of relaxing, taking it slow, laugh, socialize, and enjoy the content.
Try moving to a different server and join a small guild of people you could talk to all day (because that is what you'll be doing), and have a good time. Play the game, don't let the game play you!
..... and football matches of course.
And that's why I never get bored with the fluid responsive fights in Wow.
How can anyone be bored with things like these ? Give me an mmorpg with the same fluid animations and controls of Wow and I would be hooked immediatly.
No ... they ALWAYS come up with the clunky awkward "stick a button in their asses" mechanics in those other mmorpg's.
Dreadful.
The few animations that WoW does have it does very well. That's the one thing I wish other developers would pay more attention to, combat and avatar animations. With that said, I think Guild Wars and AoC are just as fluid and responsive. Now you may not like their combat mechanics (personally I love both) but they are both well done imo.