My problem with the F2P games is that too often they are misleading and manipulative. They claim you can play them without using the item shop, but then they consciously make the game too frustrating and unenjoyable to play without using it.
As an example, I just introduced my son to a free-to-play game. A few days later he likes the game but is already hitting me up to pay for things because it's too frustrating without it.
This feels to me like the Ally Bank bike commercial where the girl finds out if she rides her bike more than 2 feet there is a fee.
So I'm pretty down on F2P games at the moment. I won't say that I will never play one, but it's unlikely.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
I don't know if its snobbery or more an 'back-lash' effect from the new micro-transaction models being 'added' to formerly 'pure' P2P subscription-based games. I've yet to play a F2P game, not because I believe I am 'above' anything or even 'against' item-shops. However, I do see what happens to the games core quality when the 'extra' items are introduces as an 'extra' fee. The extra's get the big development bucks.. the core game gets the shaft in order to protect the 'value' of the extra's. SWG Trading Card game.. great example... undermines the crafter (non-combat) system as well as the regular subscriber (grind-to-get) players by adding a 'lottery-based' random item if you buy a 'pack' of cards. In order to support the value of the 'extra' packs... the quality between extra and grind-based items has become dramatically apparent. So... perhaps its not just because players are 'against' F2P systems.. it just might be that F2P tend to be based on a system that is frustrating a lof of players in the traditional P2P systems that are getting converted into sub+item shops. Its frustration by association.
i dont think its so much that though I agree with the aspect of your arguement regarding F2p and charges for extra items. But i think personally, my issue is, why am I going to pay more money per month for extra items to help me in a F2p game when i can get the same if not more content and items if i only pay $15 a month. every F2p I ever played ive done the math on, you end up exceeding the amount youd ever pay for a sub based MMO by a long shot to get to the same goal. its a money sink for alot of F2P MMO's and while I am not against them making a profit I am against them nickel and diming players, and that what alot of them do, they nickel and dime you to death. I will continue to play P2P MMO's because the amount of content, items, fun I get out of them far exceed whatever I can get out of a F2P game. You end up spending a small fortune....for what? when i can spend $15 a month and more for my money. Only thing I would agree with is, F2P MMO's have stepped up their game with quality such as graphics, core gameplay, but in the end the Item malls turn it to crap in favor of people who spend their money for that extra boost or edge. your essentially buying your way through the game. I will never advocate that.
3.4ghz Phenom II X4 965, 8GB PC12800 DDR3 GSKILL, EVGA 560GTX 2GB OC, 640GB HD SATA II, BFG 1000WATT PSU. MSI NF980-G65 TRI-SLI MOBO.
I will never play a f2p MMO, I've said it before and I will continue to say it.
It has nothing to do with being snobbish, it has everything to do with not liking the business model. I want to pay my monthly sub and get the same as everyone else. I don't want to have to keep buying little things here and there and I don't want someone who cares less about money to get much more then me just because s/he opened their wallet.
I also won't ever lease a car. I don't like that business model. I will obviously continue to buy cars and drive them but I will never lease a car. Is that snobbish too?
I get that he is the voice of f2p MMOs on this site. But to say that people who don't agree with him are snobbish is a bit ridiculous and sounds like a defense mechanism.
Some business models work for some people, some work for others. Some people get unlimited calling but pay more a month, some people get x number of free minutes only but then pay less a month. Some people lease vehicles, some buy. Some people buy movies, some rent.
So to say that someone who prefers one business model over another is a snob, is to say that you don't understand the world or the human mind.
In most cases, subscription games are simply a better value. This may change as more and more devs/suits are hopping on the greed bandwagon, but right now it's really a no-brainer in terms of value and convenience. For $15 a month, I get unlimited amounts of entertainment, and I don't have to enter multiple line items in my entertainment budget.
I've played RoM, and I spent between $20-$30 a month for the two months I played, mostly trying out accessories and things that I thought made my character look cool.
It really has nothing to do with being a snob. Flat-rate services are generally a better value over time.
but not toward playing free to play or not...but rather whether the game is good or not for my own tastes.
I think everyone should get off there high horses...and become true Gamer Snobs like me.....
Isnt it time for we the players to tell the developers of the real bad games to get a clue......
I for one dont think there are many excuses anymore for bad games....I mean just how stupid do the developers on some of these games think we as players are?
Anywise this article got me thinking......
Lets be realistic....
Why the heck isnt everyone true gammer snobs....
i bet the people who say they dont like free to play games.....isnt becasue they are free to play but becasue the ones they looked at...have some serious issues.....
(a few games come to mind with issues...i could name them here...and the issues...but that would derail this thread)
Why exactly is it snobbish to dislike being ripped off by a gaming company? Sometimes I wonder about you people who will defend shady business practices, makes me feel you have an invested interest in that type of business and aren't worried at all about ethics.
You have already made up your mind that F2P games all are designed to rip off customers and can be nothing other than that.
You have already made up your mind that F2P is a shady business practice and can be nothing other than that.
You have already made up your mind that if someone says anything positive about F2P that they have monetary interests in it and are unethical people.
It's entirely possible that you feel the only preople who play F2P are people who just want to buy their way past others or people who don't know they are being fleeced.
I'm almost certain that you feel you are speaking from a position of solid knowledge of the business model.
Some say that could possibly be, in some circles, a slight bit towards what one might consider to be sort of close to what the dictionary - and I'm not saying the dictionary is infallible here - may define as Snobbish .
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Also, I would like to add that if being a "Snob" means more MMO players will refuse to play mediocre/half finished titles, both F2P and P2P, then more people should become one.
If my refusing to play/pay for half finshed, mediocre, rushed out crap, as we have been seeing far too much of lately makes me a snob, then So Be It.
I think people are often at a loss for words so just generalize their statements.When they say NEVER,it probably means as of right NOW,or they could never SUPPORT a f2p model as of RIGHT now,they don't really mean NEVER,because things can and will change.Sp people just need to be able to read and understand outside the bubble.
As of right NOW,the F2P model is a money soaking leeching model that should not be supported, it is of LOW quality and not worthy of being supported.However a simple change could make it a good model.that change would be sponsorship,sponsors that contribute to the development of the game and sustaining the servers.This would mean a TRUE F2P game,not the lying words that developers are feeding us right now.If you D/L 30 MB of game play,then if they are CLAIMING it is Free to play,you better well get 30 mb of game play for free,witch of course is FAR from the truth.
I actually got really into online gaming though a FREE network run in early days by SEGA,called Heat.net.They operated the servers free to players,this means you could use their bandwidth to run and operate your own game servers,setup who joins and who can't.on top of that ,they offered daily prizes,giving away such things as PC hardware donated by sponsors.It really felt like a free gaming experience,with the central hub for chatting and setting up games.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
In one fell swoop you've killed all interest I've had in what you're saying about F2Ps. And I now have an additional 20 or so minutes to play my P2Ps on Mondays .
Mostly, I'm not so much as a snob, but I'm incredibly shallow. I collect pieces of gear or armor that is useless for me just because it looks cute. I can spend more real life money on cash shops for pretty items or surgery tickets than I ever would in a year with a Pay to play MMORPG. That's one of my favorite things about Free to play MMORPGs. They always include really cute costumes.
Mostly, I'm not so much as a snob, but I'm incredibly shallow. I collect pieces of gear or armor that is useless for me just because it looks cute. I can spend more real life money on cash shops for pretty items or surgery tickets than I ever would in a year with a Pay to play MMORPG. That's one of my favorite things about Free to play MMORPGs. They always include really cute costumes.
I honestly thought you were kidding, until I re-read it and realized you weren't.
Just a viewpoint about items in an MMO that never crossed my mind before, and caused a double take.
I'd put a bed sheet on my Avatar if it gave better stats......
But you are correct, F2P games do have better fluff items (in general) so I can see where that would be a draw.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Mostly, I'm not so much as a snob, but I'm incredibly shallow. I collect pieces of gear or armor that is useless for me just because it looks cute. I can spend more real life money on cash shops for pretty items or surgery tickets than I ever would in a year with a Pay to play MMORPG. That's one of my favorite things about Free to play MMORPGs. They always include really cute costumes.
I honestly thought you were kidding, until I re-read it and realized you weren't.
Just a viewpoint about items in an MMO that never crossed my mind before, and caused a double take.
I'd put a bed sheet on my Avatar if it gave better stats......
But you are correct, F2P games do have better fluff items (in general) so I can see where that would be a draw.
Who knew?
Lol, in WoW, I'm always complaining how ""ugly" my DK tier is on vent. I will come to raid in my playboy bunny outfit and everyone will be like "Giggle, put on your gear".
I wouldn't say never, but I find it very unlikely that I'd play a F2P game, or more specifically a game funded mostly through a cash shop, for a significant period of time. I strongly dislike the business practice of charging money for virtual goods. I am fine with paying a subscription fee, since that's paying for a service (running servers, maintaining the game, and developing new content). I am not fine with putting a price tag on in game items and services that have nothing to do with the quality of the product, just artificial rarity and power levels created by the developers. I am of course aware that people buy gold in P2P games, which is essentially the same. I would, however, rather play a game that discourages such behavior rather than one that relies on it to make a profit.
So, yes, I guess I am a snob. If a F2P game and a P2P game were exactly the same except for a cash shop, I might play the F2P game as a trial, but I'd rather pay the subscription for the P2P game if I decided to stick with it. Similarly, I'd consider playing a F2P game if it was better than all P2P MMOs on the market. I find it highly unlikely that someone would make such a high quality game and not charge a subscribtion fee for it, though.
Since I started to work with the UT III UDK on my free time I am no longer a MMORPG snob in terms of releases, expansions, fixes, and new game play. But I am not a consumer for mini micro transactions that are there for online games. I do support the business model where it works but I “choose” not to take part. I think it is a rip off. If you don’t, then that’s cool. I won’t flame you because that would be “snobbish”.
Yet where it works it works. I think Turbine made a good decision with DDO. They made a better decision not to make LOTRO free to play and the game is good. I could never see Eve Online doing micro transactions. I think a business has to be fair to the consumer and examine what will work with their community. I prefer the subscription business model of Eve Online and LOTRO. I detest SOE's business model since they have such a bad track record with not following through or lying to their respectable communities. And I am disappointed with Cryptic Studio’s take on MMORPG's and online store since the release of CO. Cryptic has a lot of talent there but I hate their business model. I think as a consumer we need to speak out constructively.
On a side note PC games are going to make a comeback over console games. See...it is all buzz words for the month within marketing. Before the progressives it was called propaganda which is well practiced across the globe in all markets and regions for all scenarios.
I believe many members missed the points of Richard's post and some members ought to re-read the whole text again, especially the last paragraph.
That said, I noticed many members here all write something similar to this: "I've played X F2P MMORPG and it sucks because you had to buy cash so I'll never play F2P MMOs because they are all the same".
It's like saying: "That is stupid, all of those must be stupid". We all know this is entirely false and yes those who dares to say stupid things like this are Snobs. They deem themselves superior and also believe they are the best in what they do, the top 1 specialist and that regardless of what you say, proof and facts that you bring, you will NEVER be right.
Quite frankly, I've quickly learned to stop defending F2Ps against those naysayers. As we all know, the F2P market is growing and one day or another, as Richard mentionned, they will try a F2P at least once and may, possibly, like it. But until then, I do not believe we should bother pointing the truth to them as these sheeps feel safer in their little enclosure and refuse to eat the grass on the other side of the fence, even though that grass is growing in quality with every passing day.
One day they'll run out of grass and will have no choice but to leave their enclosure and look for a better field of grass.
I believe many members missed the points of Richard's post and some members ought to re-read the whole text again, especially the last paragraph. That said, I noticed many members here all write something similar to this: "I've played X F2P MMORPG and it sucks because you had to buy cash so I'll never play F2P MMOs because they are all the same". It's like saying: "That is stupid, all of those must be stupid". We all know this is entirely false and yes those who dares to say stupid things like this are Snobs. They deem themselves superior and also believe they are the best in what they do, the top 1 specialist and that regardless of what you say, proof and facts that you bring, you will NEVER be right. Quite frankly, I've quickly learned to stop defending F2Ps against those naysayers. As we all know, the F2P market is growing and one day or another, as Richard mentionned, they will try a F2P at least once and may, possibly, like it. But until then, I do not believe we should bother pointing the truth to them as these sheeps feel safer in their little enclosure and refuse to eat the grass on the other side of the fence, even though that grass is growing in quality with every passing day. One day they'll run out of grass and will have no choice but to leave their enclosure and look for a better field of grass.
[Mod Edit]
Woah, woah. That is totally uncalled for. Seriously, could we get a mod to edit this? That's pretty racist.
Terrible column. Please consider not posting if you aren't going to be posting things of value- however marginal they might be.
We get you love F2P. We get you want others to like said style. But making a weekly posting about how, in a roundabout way, if you don't like F2P or aren't willing to try, you're a snob.
Hey, check it out Richie: since you posted what was in effect personal ramble and bias, I'll treat you with the same...
I don't like F2P. I never did, and never will. The idea alone is enough to push me away. What I love is equal opportunity. And that can only, *TRULY* be achieved when there's a buy-in. Be up-front (pun!) about the business of the game, get it dealt with, and now the only thing you have inside of your game is equal opportunity.
I don't like F2P, because I enjoy balanced gaming. And while the mechanics of a game might not end up being balanced, it's better than knowing going in that there will be different levels of footing regardless of my gaming competence.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc. We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be. So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away. - MMO_Doubter
Honestly, does liking games that are good make me a snob? We have technology nowadays that we can make BETTER games, and this only proves itself true in the single player games. MMO's pretty much all suck right now and the P2P suck less than the F2P games. End of story.
Another terrible column from Mr.Aihoshi, and even more so because he's essentially calling ANYONE with a different opinion than his a "Snob".
The FACT is, like another poster mentioned, you get what you pay for. Free games are NEVER "free", and 9/10 will cause you to spend MORE money to get the SAME basic services that pay to play gives for a FIXED amount per month.
"Free to Play", or microtransactions, interested the DEVIL of the MMORPG market for a reason (AKA: John Smedley). Microtransactions actually show a marketable profitability FAR greater than monthly payments. This is because small payments towards a final goal add up, but not before a person actually realizes how much they're spending per month.
I know this first hand since I used to have a roommate with a gambling problem and ended up losing more than $100/mo to SOE's trading card games in EQ2. Needless to say he couldn't pay his part of the rent, and I had to kick him out !
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity: Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
It really sounds like most ppl here are snobs... but hey.... most ppl here also hate WOW.... Shows how much they know.
Sub or item shop... Who cares now cause pretty much all MMOs today have item shops in some form. I just find it strange to see the ppl here talking about hating Item shops when the game they play already has one.
Another terrible column from Mr.Aihoshi, and even more so because he's essentially calling ANYONE with a different opinion than his a "Snob".
The FACT is, like another poster mentioned, you get what you pay for. Free games are NEVER "free", and 9/10 will cause you to spend MORE money to get the SAME basic services that pay to play gives for a FIXED amount per month.
"Free to Play", or microtransactions, interested the DEVIL of the MMORPG market for a reason (AKA: John Smedley). Microtransactions actually show a marketable profitability FAR greater than monthly payments. This is because small payments towards a final goal add up, but not before a person actually realizes how much they're spending per month. I know this first hand since I used to have a roommate with a gambling problem and ended up losing more than $100/mo to SOE's trading card games in EQ2. Needless to say he couldn't pay his part of the rent, and I had to kick him out !
Heres the deal mister. PPL are free to pay as much or as little that they like in F2P. If they can't handle it cause of gamblin problem or addiction - dont think that SUb based will save them cause they will just waste their TIME instead. Playing your life away like many do in the sub based game is in many ways worse. Alot of young ppl are right now PLAYING their life away in sub based games - skipping school - skipping homework - not getting a job. Hell... many of them will never even get an apartment.
Free to play gives players options if they want to play for Xtra amount of time to get items - or just buy them (like EXPpotions). Alot of the low lifes that sit infront of a pc 10 hours per day hate this idea cause it actually gives real ppl that have jobs and take part in real life a chance to progress with the money the EARN with their job.
"I could never see Eve Online doing micro transactions." Of course not; they sell game time cards that can easily be converted to ISK. You can buy anything in the game using as much real money as you want.
With all due respect, please take a look at what was said there. The author didn't say he SUPPORTED those things. he was also not in any way COMPARING those things. He named a number of hot button issues about which many people have deep rooted beliefs that aren't likely to change. If you didn't take the time to understand the context of what was said, that's your call but it's your own fault and not the author's.
Offtopic:
I don't know why but your post reminds of those players that post;
" OMGZ, I was just banned for my ign. Its not my fault they misinterperted it for something bad!!!!"
I'm not saying either of you are right, but it is odd to post something that really doesn't have any relevance to the topic at hand, and will only just ruffle feathers.
Ontopic:
I have played a bunch of F2P some were decent and some were bad. My biggest beef with them is they all tend to sacrafice gameplay to promote purchasing of the items in the cash shop.
F2P games will never meet the quality of a P2P game as long as that statement is true.
I'll never play a F2P MMORPG. I did play DDO without a sub, but that wasn't "Free" since I had to buy various things just to make the game enjoyable. And I no longer play it since I might as well have bought a sub if I was going to, but it wasn't that fun to me to make a sub worthwhile. No F2P game has had the content or quality that the P2P games *tend* to have. It's really simple: You get what you pay for.
You said it perfectly. I'll never play a F2P game; I guess this makes me an MMO "snob" according to the author. I'm actually ok with his personal opinion of me, though.
I played DDO when it was sub based. When they opened the cash shop I dropped my sub and will never go back.
There's no such thing as F2P - they're Pay to Prosper games.
Anyone remember TANSTAAFL from your Heinlein? (He writes books, for the generation that has never cracked open a book and reads all text on a screen...)
It means:
There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
All "F2P" (pay to prosper) games do is offer ridiculous status-based gameplay; like I said before, this is like me playing Scrabble with my wife and if I start losing, paying $5 to buy more tiles.
Not having a level playing field where your advancement is based on two things - 1) time spent in game and 2) player skill.
If you introduce any other element into that, such as being able to pay real market money to buy an item, I AVOID THE GAME LIKE THE PLAGUE.
I vote with my wallet. We have three MMO players in our household and I'd say our monthly bill, all combined, for all our games, is about $100 a month. In MMO sub fees. And I'm fine with this.
But I won't drop a dime or a minute of my time on this new F2P garbage. I'll support sub-fee games only; with no cash shop; period.
Comments
My problem with the F2P games is that too often they are misleading and manipulative. They claim you can play them without using the item shop, but then they consciously make the game too frustrating and unenjoyable to play without using it.
As an example, I just introduced my son to a free-to-play game. A few days later he likes the game but is already hitting me up to pay for things because it's too frustrating without it.
This feels to me like the Ally Bank bike commercial where the girl finds out if she rides her bike more than 2 feet there is a fee.
So I'm pretty down on F2P games at the moment. I won't say that I will never play one, but it's unlikely.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
i dont think its so much that though I agree with the aspect of your arguement regarding F2p and charges for extra items. But i think personally, my issue is, why am I going to pay more money per month for extra items to help me in a F2p game when i can get the same if not more content and items if i only pay $15 a month. every F2p I ever played ive done the math on, you end up exceeding the amount youd ever pay for a sub based MMO by a long shot to get to the same goal. its a money sink for alot of F2P MMO's and while I am not against them making a profit I am against them nickel and diming players, and that what alot of them do, they nickel and dime you to death. I will continue to play P2P MMO's because the amount of content, items, fun I get out of them far exceed whatever I can get out of a F2P game. You end up spending a small fortune....for what? when i can spend $15 a month and more for my money. Only thing I would agree with is, F2P MMO's have stepped up their game with quality such as graphics, core gameplay, but in the end the Item malls turn it to crap in favor of people who spend their money for that extra boost or edge. your essentially buying your way through the game. I will never advocate that.
3.4ghz Phenom II X4 965, 8GB PC12800 DDR3 GSKILL, EVGA 560GTX 2GB OC, 640GB HD SATA II, BFG 1000WATT PSU. MSI NF980-G65 TRI-SLI MOBO.
I will never play a f2p MMO, I've said it before and I will continue to say it.
It has nothing to do with being snobbish, it has everything to do with not liking the business model. I want to pay my monthly sub and get the same as everyone else. I don't want to have to keep buying little things here and there and I don't want someone who cares less about money to get much more then me just because s/he opened their wallet.
I also won't ever lease a car. I don't like that business model. I will obviously continue to buy cars and drive them but I will never lease a car. Is that snobbish too?
I get that he is the voice of f2p MMOs on this site. But to say that people who don't agree with him are snobbish is a bit ridiculous and sounds like a defense mechanism.
Some business models work for some people, some work for others. Some people get unlimited calling but pay more a month, some people get x number of free minutes only but then pay less a month. Some people lease vehicles, some buy. Some people buy movies, some rent.
So to say that someone who prefers one business model over another is a snob, is to say that you don't understand the world or the human mind.
In most cases, subscription games are simply a better value. This may change as more and more devs/suits are hopping on the greed bandwagon, but right now it's really a no-brainer in terms of value and convenience. For $15 a month, I get unlimited amounts of entertainment, and I don't have to enter multiple line items in my entertainment budget.
I've played RoM, and I spent between $20-$30 a month for the two months I played, mostly trying out accessories and things that I thought made my character look cool.
It really has nothing to do with being a snob. Flat-rate services are generally a better value over time.
...
great article...i enjoyed reading it.
It made me realize i am a mmog snob.....
but not toward playing free to play or not...but rather whether the game is good or not for my own tastes.
I think everyone should get off there high horses...and become true Gamer Snobs like me.....
Isnt it time for we the players to tell the developers of the real bad games to get a clue......
I for one dont think there are many excuses anymore for bad games....I mean just how stupid do the developers on some of these games think we as players are?
Anywise this article got me thinking......
Lets be realistic....
Why the heck isnt everyone true gammer snobs....
i bet the people who say they dont like free to play games.....isnt becasue they are free to play but becasue the ones they looked at...have some serious issues.....
(a few games come to mind with issues...i could name them here...and the issues...but that would derail this thread)
You have already made up your mind that F2P games all are designed to rip off customers and can be nothing other than that.
You have already made up your mind that F2P is a shady business practice and can be nothing other than that.
You have already made up your mind that if someone says anything positive about F2P that they have monetary interests in it and are unethical people.
It's entirely possible that you feel the only preople who play F2P are people who just want to buy their way past others or people who don't know they are being fleeced.
I'm almost certain that you feel you are speaking from a position of solid knowledge of the business model.
Some say that could possibly be, in some circles, a slight bit towards what one might consider to be sort of close to what the dictionary - and I'm not saying the dictionary is infallible here - may define as Snobbish .
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Also, I would like to add that if being a "Snob" means more MMO players will refuse to play mediocre/half finished titles, both F2P and P2P, then more people should become one.
If my refusing to play/pay for half finshed, mediocre, rushed out crap, as we have been seeing far too much of lately makes me a snob, then So Be It.
I think people are often at a loss for words so just generalize their statements.When they say NEVER,it probably means as of right NOW,or they could never SUPPORT a f2p model as of RIGHT now,they don't really mean NEVER,because things can and will change.Sp people just need to be able to read and understand outside the bubble.
As of right NOW,the F2P model is a money soaking leeching model that should not be supported, it is of LOW quality and not worthy of being supported.However a simple change could make it a good model.that change would be sponsorship,sponsors that contribute to the development of the game and sustaining the servers.This would mean a TRUE F2P game,not the lying words that developers are feeding us right now.If you D/L 30 MB of game play,then if they are CLAIMING it is Free to play,you better well get 30 mb of game play for free,witch of course is FAR from the truth.
I actually got really into online gaming though a FREE network run in early days by SEGA,called Heat.net.They operated the servers free to players,this means you could use their bandwidth to run and operate your own game servers,setup who joins and who can't.on top of that ,they offered daily prizes,giving away such things as PC hardware donated by sponsors.It really felt like a free gaming experience,with the central hub for chatting and setting up games.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Richard,
Thanks for this article.
In one fell swoop you've killed all interest I've had in what you're saying about F2Ps. And I now have an additional 20 or so minutes to play my P2Ps on Mondays
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MMO Strategy Guides
Mostly, I'm not so much as a snob, but I'm incredibly shallow. I collect pieces of gear or armor that is useless for me just because it looks cute. I can spend more real life money on cash shops for pretty items or surgery tickets than I ever would in a year with a Pay to play MMORPG. That's one of my favorite things about Free to play MMORPGs. They always include really cute costumes.
I honestly thought you were kidding, until I re-read it and realized you weren't.
Just a viewpoint about items in an MMO that never crossed my mind before, and caused a double take.
I'd put a bed sheet on my Avatar if it gave better stats......
But you are correct, F2P games do have better fluff items (in general) so I can see where that would be a draw.
Who knew?
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I honestly thought you were kidding, until I re-read it and realized you weren't.
Just a viewpoint about items in an MMO that never crossed my mind before, and caused a double take.
I'd put a bed sheet on my Avatar if it gave better stats......
But you are correct, F2P games do have better fluff items (in general) so I can see where that would be a draw.
Who knew?
Lol, in WoW, I'm always complaining how ""ugly" my DK tier is on vent. I will come to raid in my playboy bunny outfit and everyone will be like "Giggle, put on your gear".
I wouldn't say never, but I find it very unlikely that I'd play a F2P game, or more specifically a game funded mostly through a cash shop, for a significant period of time. I strongly dislike the business practice of charging money for virtual goods. I am fine with paying a subscription fee, since that's paying for a service (running servers, maintaining the game, and developing new content). I am not fine with putting a price tag on in game items and services that have nothing to do with the quality of the product, just artificial rarity and power levels created by the developers. I am of course aware that people buy gold in P2P games, which is essentially the same. I would, however, rather play a game that discourages such behavior rather than one that relies on it to make a profit.
So, yes, I guess I am a snob. If a F2P game and a P2P game were exactly the same except for a cash shop, I might play the F2P game as a trial, but I'd rather pay the subscription for the P2P game if I decided to stick with it. Similarly, I'd consider playing a F2P game if it was better than all P2P MMOs on the market. I find it highly unlikely that someone would make such a high quality game and not charge a subscribtion fee for it, though.
Since I started to work with the UT III UDK on my free time I am no longer a MMORPG snob in terms of releases, expansions, fixes, and new game play. But I am not a consumer for mini micro transactions that are there for online games. I do support the business model where it works but I “choose” not to take part. I think it is a rip off. If you don’t, then that’s cool. I won’t flame you because that would be “snobbish”.
Yet where it works it works. I think Turbine made a good decision with DDO. They made a better decision not to make LOTRO free to play and the game is good. I could never see Eve Online doing micro transactions. I think a business has to be fair to the consumer and examine what will work with their community. I prefer the subscription business model of Eve Online and LOTRO. I detest SOE's business model since they have such a bad track record with not following through or lying to their respectable communities. And I am disappointed with Cryptic Studio’s take on MMORPG's and online store since the release of CO. Cryptic has a lot of talent there but I hate their business model. I think as a consumer we need to speak out constructively.
On a side note PC games are going to make a comeback over console games. See...it is all buzz words for the month within marketing. Before the progressives it was called propaganda which is well practiced across the globe in all markets and regions for all scenarios.
I believe many members missed the points of Richard's post and some members ought to re-read the whole text again, especially the last paragraph.
That said, I noticed many members here all write something similar to this: "I've played X F2P MMORPG and it sucks because you had to buy cash so I'll never play F2P MMOs because they are all the same".
It's like saying: "That is stupid, all of those must be stupid". We all know this is entirely false and yes those who dares to say stupid things like this are Snobs. They deem themselves superior and also believe they are the best in what they do, the top 1 specialist and that regardless of what you say, proof and facts that you bring, you will NEVER be right.
Quite frankly, I've quickly learned to stop defending F2Ps against those naysayers. As we all know, the F2P market is growing and one day or another, as Richard mentionned, they will try a F2P at least once and may, possibly, like it. But until then, I do not believe we should bother pointing the truth to them as these sheeps feel safer in their little enclosure and refuse to eat the grass on the other side of the fence, even though that grass is growing in quality with every passing day.
One day they'll run out of grass and will have no choice but to leave their enclosure and look for a better field of grass.
[Mod Edit]
Woah, woah. That is totally uncalled for. Seriously, could we get a mod to edit this? That's pretty racist.
Terrible column. Please consider not posting if you aren't going to be posting things of value- however marginal they might be.
We get you love F2P. We get you want others to like said style. But making a weekly posting about how, in a roundabout way, if you don't like F2P or aren't willing to try, you're a snob.
Hey, check it out Richie: since you posted what was in effect personal ramble and bias, I'll treat you with the same...
I don't like F2P. I never did, and never will. The idea alone is enough to push me away. What I love is equal opportunity. And that can only, *TRULY* be achieved when there's a buy-in. Be up-front (pun!) about the business of the game, get it dealt with, and now the only thing you have inside of your game is equal opportunity.
I don't like F2P, because I enjoy balanced gaming. And while the mechanics of a game might not end up being balanced, it's better than knowing going in that there will be different levels of footing regardless of my gaming competence.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc.
We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be.
So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away.
- MMO_Doubter
Honestly, does liking games that are good make me a snob? We have technology nowadays that we can make BETTER games, and this only proves itself true in the single player games. MMO's pretty much all suck right now and the P2P suck less than the F2P games. End of story.
Another terrible column from Mr.Aihoshi, and even more so because he's essentially calling ANYONE with a different opinion than his a "Snob".
The FACT is, like another poster mentioned, you get what you pay for. Free games are NEVER "free", and 9/10 will cause you to spend MORE money to get the SAME basic services that pay to play gives for a FIXED amount per month.
"Free to Play", or microtransactions, interested the DEVIL of the MMORPG market for a reason (AKA: John Smedley). Microtransactions actually show a marketable profitability FAR greater than monthly payments. This is because small payments towards a final goal add up, but not before a person actually realizes how much they're spending per month.
I know this first hand since I used to have a roommate with a gambling problem and ended up losing more than $100/mo to SOE's trading card games in EQ2. Needless to say he couldn't pay his part of the rent, and I had to kick him out
!
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
It really sounds like most ppl here are snobs... but hey.... most ppl here also hate WOW.... Shows how much they know.
Sub or item shop... Who cares now cause pretty much all MMOs today have item shops in some form. I just find it strange to see the ppl here talking about hating Item shops when the game they play already has one.
"I could never see Eve Online doing micro transactions."
Of course not; they sell game time cards that can easily be converted to ISK. You can buy anything in the game using as much real money as you want.
Heres the deal mister. PPL are free to pay as much or as little that they like in F2P. If they can't handle it cause of gamblin problem or addiction - dont think that SUb based will save them cause they will just waste their TIME instead. Playing your life away like many do in the sub based game is in many ways worse. Alot of young ppl are right now PLAYING their life away in sub based games - skipping school - skipping homework - not getting a job. Hell... many of them will never even get an apartment.
Free to play gives players options if they want to play for Xtra amount of time to get items - or just buy them (like EXPpotions). Alot of the low lifes that sit infront of a pc 10 hours per day hate this idea cause it actually gives real ppl that have jobs and take part in real life a chance to progress with the money the EARN with their job.
True
Offtopic:
I don't know why but your post reminds of those players that post;
" OMGZ, I was just banned for my ign. Its not my fault they misinterperted it for something bad!!!!"
I'm not saying either of you are right, but it is odd to post something that really doesn't have any relevance to the topic at hand, and will only just ruffle feathers.
Ontopic:
I have played a bunch of F2P some were decent and some were bad. My biggest beef with them is they all tend to sacrafice gameplay to promote purchasing of the items in the cash shop.
F2P games will never meet the quality of a P2P game as long as that statement is true.
You said it perfectly. I'll never play a F2P game; I guess this makes me an MMO "snob" according to the author. I'm actually ok with his personal opinion of me, though.
I played DDO when it was sub based. When they opened the cash shop I dropped my sub and will never go back.
There's no such thing as F2P - they're Pay to Prosper games.
Anyone remember TANSTAAFL from your Heinlein? (He writes books, for the generation that has never cracked open a book and reads all text on a screen...)
It means:
There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
All "F2P" (pay to prosper) games do is offer ridiculous status-based gameplay; like I said before, this is like me playing Scrabble with my wife and if I start losing, paying $5 to buy more tiles.
Not having a level playing field where your advancement is based on two things - 1) time spent in game and 2) player skill.
If you introduce any other element into that, such as being able to pay real market money to buy an item, I AVOID THE GAME LIKE THE PLAGUE.
I vote with my wallet. We have three MMO players in our household and I'd say our monthly bill, all combined, for all our games, is about $100 a month. In MMO sub fees. And I'm fine with this.
But I won't drop a dime or a minute of my time on this new F2P garbage. I'll support sub-fee games only; with no cash shop; period.