Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
STEAM USERS: YOUR WARNING IS HERE
This discussion has been closed.
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Comments
In what i think might be a new way of approaching things i will not ttack anyone's statements made and simply put down my own view on steam.
Do i like not being able to play games while steam is not active: no.
Does it happen to me often en long: no
Do i like how steam works: hell yes. simply because of the fact i do not have any cd's cluttering my place or that when i lan at a friends place with a different comp i just login in download and gues what PLAY again.
Do i agree with the op: no, i buy a game with research done and only once in my life have i returned a game and this was because it was broken, but not because it i did not like it.
Edit( as far as pricing goes, steam offers the games at the same price as they do in stores in this country).
I did research and if i didn't like it its my fault end of story.
In conclusion Steam is good for me and the way i like to use it.
Please don't do this /=. All this will do is make their ass backwards thinking cause them to believe that more people are just buying the console versions, not because the completely fucked the PC ones, and they will just ignore the platform altogether(not that this is a huge loss given the shit they put out now). Personally, I'm for an all out boycott of Ubisoft, yet again, as they have a history of stupidity.
Bans a perma, but so are sigs in necro posts.
EAT ME MMORPG.com!
Because people still have this bullshit "OH NOEZ, STEEEEEAM ;;" irrational fear from the initial shock and awe that was the HL2 release. Most have never bothered to actually look at the changes, or the features, that have come out since then in an effort to hold out and continue to spout "Steam is the devil! *shake fist*" It's particularly evident when half the time people bitch about things that simply are not true, like not being able to make backups, or requiring you be online after the initial activation. Bitching about the initial activation is a moot point with the exception of games that require Steam, because it's an online service in the first place. That being said, even with games that require Steam activation, it's comparable to other games with retarded publisher based activation systems (which are far more sketchy with tokens and questionable server life) but with a considerably more stable backing and you get the benefit of being able to download your game unlimitedly and all the other benefits Steam support brings.
Basically, Steam is their "evil corporation" of choice to hate on, even if it's one of the best damn services out there (D2D sucks epic balls), with no logical backing other than "other people hate Steam because they're generally idiots who make poor decisions and don't read/process anything before just clicking away buying shit and being generally unreasonable".
Also, throwing Impulse's hat into the ring as "Best thing ever" next to Steam, just needs similar community support.
Bans a perma, but so are sigs in necro posts.
EAT ME MMORPG.com!
Also to be noted, the key word the OP used was "Charge back". I worked for an internet company and if you call up yelling about a charge back they will treat you as a problem customer. What's to stop you from charging back the next game you buy and don't like. People who use charge backs know how to scam the system and can be repeat offenders. We had a policy similar to Steams. Charge back customers get investigated internally to make sure they have not been scamming in other ways. And then they get banned from the website. What the OP don't understand is charge backs are very very bad for a company and to many will get the BBB on you butt fast. Most people don't even know what a charge back is unless they have used it before.
well i have just checked the Steam store and they are not even selling Silent Hunter 5 as of 17:26 GMT on the 12th March.. anyway the proof is below but i would like to say this: where have you been not to have read all the bad publicity regarding that game and THAT DRM?
Its the worst DRM in the world and requires a constant net connection, now if you don't have a stable net connection then yes you will get dumped out of the game losing all your progress etc. Its also quite possible that Ubisoft were having issues to do with their DRM servers thus making you lose connection. The DRM in question is to do with Ubisoft NOT Steam soo if you were losing connection its nothing to do with Steam, Steam is just a digital platform to buy games and can store game saves like in Torchlight ie. i have got the Guild Wars trilogy, Steam just loads up the Guild Wars launcher for me and puts me onto the login screen, if i have dc problems its to do with Guild Wars not Steam..
I wasn't a big fan of steam when Valve switch from WON to Steam but it's grown into a nice thing. Some things people don't agree with, say you were hacking in CS and get VAC banned, you will be banned in every other game (why shouldn't ya), you can still play the games you bought just not on VAC enabled servers.
I remember a while ago I had a shared Steam account, I didn't know it was VAC banned. So I bought L4D on it but after a couple of days I got to play it and found out I was banned. Sent an email to support and they refunded my money for the game straight to the card.
I'm not going to go into all this DRM - "Owned" policy going on. All I can say is if you're worried about it or something seems fishy to you no need to come on here saying Boycott Steam. Just becareful with what you buy, this Ubisoft fiasco has a lot of people up in arms.
i have 200 games on steam, have never had an issue.
anyway they clearly say that they do not give refunds before you buy it.
steamcommunity.com/id/hossame
March on! - Lets Invade Pekopon
OP I'm sorry that this happened to you, but in the eyes of STEAM you played the game for 12 hours. They don't know what happened to your computer, so they are going by their logs. Not to mention you should of done the research about new UBISOFT games before hand, but people make mistakes and they suffer for them.
It sucks you lost 50$ or whatever the price was, but I highly doubt you'll get your money back. Even if you sue them, no good will come of it because they have a log that says you were playing them game for 12 hours. Even if their system is flawed, the only proof you have is hearsay, which won't mean crap in court.
You might get credit from steam, but with the your aggressive attitude, they'll treat you like a nuisance and push you away.
Good luck to you and learn from this.
Everyone has opinions, but does that make them the universal truth??? NO!
I have gotten several refunds from steam no questions asked and very quickly. You just have to be sensible about how and why you're getting a refund.
Things I've gotten a refund for:
Games that offer a beta if you buy it. Play beta and don't like it? I've gotten a refund before game was released (Ala Global Agenda, played for 30 hours)
Complete Collections - Found out a few games didn't work (played for 3 minutes according to steam) asked for refund
I've made several purchases on steam. If I didn't like the game then its my problem, but they still gave me a refund. Don't ask for refunds because of stupid reasons and you'll get it. Buyer beware on the games you buy, it isn't steam's problem, they just supply them.
I bet he still logs into Steam to play his games.
Regardless, this whole rant is just being upset because he didn't want to work with Steam at all. I've never had an issue with them, but if I did I'd be sure to try and work it out rather than just demanding.
This is true, but it's not the Better Business Bureau that the company has to worry about. Credit card chargebacks can cause a business to be dropped from any credit card processing company they use. They then lose all ability to accept credit card payment, which is death for any internet-based business. This is why businesses will drop a customer who screams "chargeback" like a bad habit.
It should also be noted that credit card companies are more leery of fraudulent customers than they are businesses, so a customer who reflexively wields chargebacks like a club to get their way stands a good chance of losing their credit card account.
"Soloists and those who prefer small groups should never have to feel like they''re the ones getting the proverbial table scraps, as it were." - Scott Hartsman, Senior Producer, Everquest II
"People love groups. Its a fallacy that people want to play solo all the time." - Scott Hartsman, Executive Producer, Rift
I dont' get what the fuss is about. Almost noone will take back a game if it's been opened. Walmart, Best Buy, Gamestop (they'll take it back,but just buying it back as a used game).
"Regardless, this whole rant is just being upset because he didn't want to work with Steam at all. I've never had an issue with them, but if I did I'd be sure to try and work it out rather than just demanding."
Agreed, People think that all customer service is the same, it is not. What you can get away with at your local retail store is not always going to work with an internet company. I know that people who call and threaten Charge backs will just get their accounts shut down. You have to work with in the companies policy's. And always make sure to read the "Terms of agreement".
Thanks "LordDraekon" You explained it correctly. At the company I was at we had both problems. People would charge back and call the BBB.I totally forgot about the credit card processors. You are right that was the issue we had. To many complaints to the BBB and to many charge backs. That"s why they had to put together a call center to respond to those problems.
im suprised at people who spend this much money on a piece of shit system like steam without even reading some of the major rules like what will get you banned suspended or what you should watch out for so you dont get your info stolen from keylogger phising sites these are like the 3 things you will only se people talk about on the general part of there forums so i can only say that this is your own fault and not to mention there has been people everywhere talking about ubis new drm where people like you most likely just said ah and ignored it completely only to find out why people where bitching about it afterwards so i can only say that this is your own fault
To the OP...you obviously do not know your consumer rights.
You purchased software, used it for a while, and had some issues. Most companies will *not* give a refund unless proven something is wrong with the product. They said to talk to tech support for this reason. This is the norm, not the exception.I don't know where you get this sense of entitlement from.
If you get shafted after that...there is http://www.ripoffreport.com/ , and the better business bureau. You'll be lucky to get anything from it, but it does warn future users.
Punctuation goes a long way.
I hardly think Steam is shit. Everything has rules. Every company says things to protect themselves. Also, most of those rules regarding banning are easier to avoid than tripping over flat surfaces.
This is true, but it's not the Better Business Bureau that the company has to worry about. Credit card chargebacks can cause a business to be dropped from any credit card processing company they use. They then lose all ability to accept credit card payment, which is death for any internet-based business. This is why businesses will drop a customer who screams "chargeback" like a bad habit.
It should also be noted that credit card companies are more leery of fraudulent customers than they are businesses, so a customer who reflexively wields chargebacks like a club to get their way stands a good chance of losing their credit card account.
First of all, cxhargebacks are not fraudulent in any way, shape or form. They are a legitimate way for a customer to resolve billing issues and to get their money back from shady, unscrupulous companies. The recent debacle with Atari not honouring the 90 days of game time they promised people and charging for "free shipping" is evidence enough of that. There's a good reason why only 1% of all chargebacks are decided in favour of the company rather than the card holder.
Secondly, a credit card company or bank with never, ever drop a customer or take away their credit card account for using chargebacks. Who is the bank/credit card company's customer? The card holder, or the company getting chargebacks? Of course they will do everything they can to retain the business of a card holder over some company they occasionally deal with on a customer's behalf.
Third, I do agree that it's bad form to ever mention chargebacks when dealing with a business. There is no better way to spook them since they most likely hate chargebacks very much. Chargebacks are a legitimate way to get money back, but one should plan on probably never using that company's services with that card ever again, and a customer should only use chargebacks after all other means of dealing with the company are resolved.
I like UBISOFT
Your second point invalidates much of your first. We'll never know if a chargeback is warranted if the credit card companies are biased in favor of the retail customer. It's more expensive to fight a chargeback than just let it slide, most are never challenged. The company is also the customer. Credit card companies make money from both ends. If you chargeback often they will drop you, raise your interest rate, and flag your credit profile. Charge backs cost them money too. They'll figure out and act if you're abusing it.
No they absolutely will not. Please stop spreading lies about chargebacks. It helps no one when you try to make people too afraid to use them.
How about, instead of blaming the company
Blame the asswipes who crack these games forcing companies to take such measures. If people didn't do all the stupid shit to bypass paying for a game, companies wouldn't have to take these ridiculous steps to make a profit.
From a personal perspective, I don't mind the sharing/transfer of music/games online.
From a business perspective, you lose thousands of dollars.
From a logical perspective, you make more money if you try to do a DRM.
From a realistic perspective, those who cracked the game, weren't ever going to purchase the game in the first place.
The only people you can blame for shitty DRMs are your fellow gamers who screw it up for the rest of us. So deal with it. You bought a game and it's fubared, other people are having the same issue... I'm pretty sure the company is going to try and resolve the issue.
Steam should return the money, BUT there is a thing called a "Terms and Agreement" that you clicked yes to. Soooo in the long run, your complaining about something you already agreed to... GG for not reading.
Gaming is serious business.
Although I do feel for your situation you also failed to research the product you were purchasing. I can honestly say I've never had an issue with steam I own over 100 games on it and although I've had technical issues they have always worked with me to solve them. Also although you are "tied" to them so to speak you can also set Steam to offline mode and still play the single player games without issue I have done this before myself.
In this case your issue is the DRM (which is stated on the Steam page for the game that it has), you aren't willing to work on solving the issue you just want an immediate refund even though you have used the product. You are correct that states do have consumer protection for refunds but if you look closely they do have stipulations.
As people have already said it goes back to the old buyer beware, you have no excuse for not knowing the product you were purchasing.
Like I said I worked for an internet company and what I said about charge backs was exactly how we got trained on that subject and what i was explaining was our policy. I was not making anything up or trying to freak people out. I talked to banks everyday about charge backs with the customer on the line as well. And I can tell you people do abuse it. Not all do, but we did a lot of investigating about this subject and found many had used our service and charged back before. That's why we started banning them. I got hundreds of emails and phone calls everyday and you would not even believe if I told you how many people threaten Charge back in the first email they send. They had not even talked to customer service yet and wanted to threaten charge back.
First lets start with "Terms and Agreement" or ToS or EULA or anything like them are not legal contracts, me click yes is not the same as me signing a contract. You can and will win in a court of law with the right lawyer but it will cost you. Just like back in the day in arcade rooms, the sign that read "Play at your own risk" is not a legal sign and can be challenged in the court of law.
Unless you physically sign a contract or verbly comit to the contract it is not legally binding and can be challenged in any court of law.
Second True its the hackers that caused most companies to move to DRM but how far these companies have taken DRM is out of control. You play a single player game you have to be connected to the internet 24/7? That is crap.
Sooner or Later
Your second point invalidates much of your first. We'll never know if a chargeback is warranted if the credit card companies are biased in favor of the retail customer. It's more expensive to fight a chargeback than just let it slide, most are never challenged. The company is also the customer. Credit card companies make money from both ends. If you chargeback often they will drop you, raise your interest rate, and flag your credit profile. Charge backs cost them money too. They'll figure out and act if you're abusing it.
No they absolutely will not. Please stop spreading lies about chargebacks. It helps no one when you try to make people too afraid to use them.
If you abuse your credit cards they will act. Don't believe it? Read your credit card agreement. People shouldn't be afraid to charge back if it's warranted. They should be afraid to abuse them. There are companies that maintain databases of chargeback abusers and your credit card can be refused based on it. I've given my proof, it's in the fine print you sign for a credit card. Where's yours?
Actually, you did not provide any evidence, you simply made claims. Chargebacks are not tracked by credit bureaus, and there is no penalty for using them.
This is what the California Attorney General says about chargebacks: ag.ca.gov/consumers/general/credit_card_chargeback_rights.php
Notice there is absolutely no mention of penalties to card holders who ask for chargebacks. In fact, chargebacks are mandated by law and can't be used to penalize the card holder (the specific laws include: the Truth and Lending Act in the United States: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth_in_Lending_Act, and the Electronic Funds Transfer Act: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Funds_Transfer_Act, notice that neither mention any penalties to card holders for using chargebacks.)
Even if the fine print on your credit card agreement says that you will receive penalties for issuing chargebacks, such fine print is not legal. The fine print on such contracts can never go against or replace laws in your state, province, or nation.
Here are more websites on chargebacks:
Notice that absolutely none of these sites mention chargebacks being tracked by credit bureaus or causing penalties to card holders? Don't you think they would mention important information like that?
Now, I ask you again to STOP FLAT OUT LYING ABOUT CHARGEBACKS.
First lets start with "Terms and Agreement" or ToS or EULA or anything like them are not legal contracts, me click yes is not the same as me signing a contract. You can and will win in a court of law with the right lawyer but it will cost you. Just like back in the day in arcade rooms, the sign that read "Play at your own risk" is not a legal sign and can be challenged in the court of law.
Unless you physically sign a contract or verbly comit to the contract it is not legally binding and can be challenged in any court of law.
Second True its the hackers that caused most companies to move to DRM but how far these companies have taken DRM is out of control. You play a single player game you have to be connected to the internet 24/7? That is crap.
You're not going to be able to stop release groups, they cracked Ubisoft's DRM basically the day it was out in the games.
We'll see what companies will do in the future. Seeing as Ubisoft's latest and greatest idea was cracked basically the day it came out, they just screwed over the people who actually bought the game (Ubisoft that is) if things go wrong.
Not a steam issue.