It seems a bit silly to come into a thread making assertions with the express refusal to consider the information we have on hand (which is made up 99% of things ANet have told us); but go ahead and assume away, I guess. Let's talk about how GW2 will have dedicated healers and quests too, while we're at it!
It is very likely that I may have missed some crucial information, although I've tried to stay up to date with this title.
So far all I've heard is that it'll "play like an MMO" which is quite smart way to word it indeed!
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
It seems a bit silly to come into a thread making assertions with the express refusal to consider the information we have on hand (which is made up 99% of things ANet have told us); but go ahead and assume away, I guess. Let's talk about how GW2 will have dedicated healers and quests too, while we're at it!
It is very likely that I may have missed some crucial information, although I've tried to stay up to date with this title.
So far all I've heard is that it'll "play like an MMO" which is quite smart way to word it indeed!
It would be my pleasure to bring you up to speed, in case you did mss something:
From the Guild Wars 2 Wiki:
"There will be changes to the instancing system used. Persistent areas, similar to those traditionally used in other online multiplayer games, will be introduced to Guild Wars which may allow players to meet and interact while exploring. Instances will still be used to further storytelling within the game and for missions and dungeons."
Ok Weasle. You just answered any question, and ended any argument you had about the content in guild wars by this sentence.
[quote]I found myself only coming back for the expansions[/quote]
As long as you are buying the expansions, Anet is good. They've made money. Guild Wars was not designed to be a game where you had to play 20 hours a day to be any good. It was a designed to be a game where you could play now-and-then, then take a couple months off and come back for the next release. They've obviously tried to fix this with the latest expansions, with the addition of dungeons and other various activities outside of the original content. However, it did not turn out that well in Eye of the North. I think with Eye of the North, they just rushed to get out the window to begin focusing more development on Guild Wars 2.
They are trying to correct this with Guild Wars 2. They've already stated they've added dungeons and activities like bar fights, snowball fights, etc. I think it's been state that Polymock will not be included in the initial release, but I could be wrong. Been a bit since I've read the article.
[quote]
There has been no indication whether the game will be a proper MMO or not, so until the game comes out I will assume that they will do it more or less like they did GW, but hopefully bigger and better.
Whatever Arenanet says is of little value; obviously they won't say anything 'negative' about the game.[/quote]
You need to do your research on Guild Wars 2. You also need to research Anet and their marketing practices. Generally, Anet keeps their promises. If they are jumping around and don't flat out say 'hey this will be in there', then there is no guarantees. But if they are revealing content, and giving interviews about the subject, then it is in the game and is working as intended. In case of professions, the professions have been fleshed out to a point where it's safe to unveil it.
As for instances: Yes Guild Wars 2 will feature instances. They have not commented on how much instancing will be used. All they said was instancing will be used for dungeons, personal storyline, and the home instance. When they say the world is divided into various 'zones' it could mean anything. It just depends on how the zones are loaded, whether they are seamless, or require loading screen, which has not been commented on. Even WoW makes use of zones, but the information for the next zone is preloaded before you enter, making it seamless.
A lot of these concerns or unjustified responses can easily be fixed with a little research.
To answer the OP: short: yes. Long: If Anet has said no subscription fee, then there will be no subscription fee. Anet is not stupid, they know what they are doing. And they know what they are doing far better than a player posting on the forum. If they say it's possible, then it's already in use right now.
As for microtransactions: Yes, it's been stated that these microtransactions will be including. However, they will be "basically similar" to Guild Wars 2. Key word is basically. The basically could mean anything. I do not think they'll include PvP skill packs, since they've already state that everything is unlocked for players wishing to participate in high-end PvP (GvG). You do not have to worry about Anet putting any item in the shop that will give players a gameplay, or otherwise tactical advantage within the game. If they include any item, such as a weapon, then it will be easily attainable within the game. I can see them being more along the lines of costums, or various legacy items from Guild Wars 1 that are just for vanity purposes. Point is, anything they add will not provide an unfair advantage.
It would be my pleasure to bring you up to speed, in case you did mss something:
From the Guild Wars 2 Wiki:
I hope that is as good as it sounds.
Now if we got consistent version updates as well, that would be golden.
GW1 always had constant version updates. It never really had major content additions aside from things supposed to be in the release of an expansion but the game had very fex glitches and bugs due to the constant streaming of updates. OFC gw1 was mostly instanced so updates were much more easily streamed but I'd still expect relatively frequent version updates for gw2 since despite gw2 being persistant it's still based off of gw1's streaming technology. Probably have down times in gw2 though.
It would be my pleasure to bring you up to speed, in case you did mss something:
From the Guild Wars 2 Wiki:
I hope that is as good as it sounds.
Now if we got consistent version updates as well, that would be golden.
We all hope it will be as good as it sounds. Poke around on the Arenanet.com blog - there is a ton more information about their vision and things they are implementing in the game, and ANet doesn't have a history of claiming things that don't come to be (well, aside from a 4th GW chapter, and they came clean about that relatively quickly).
It does sound a bit too good to be true, so I do append a hefty "IF they can make it all happen" to all my hype and excitement, but if anyone can do it ANet sounds like they can.
I don't really mind if it only lasts me few weeks to a month- that's plenty for a normal game and I don't think it's that pricey either. Especially the co-op features have always interested me.
But IMO the game should last me years, have constant version updates and be grindy enough for me to consider it an MMO.
It doesn't really matter though, since I like other genres too. I always want to support developers that do their own thing, and those kind of games are usually the best ones.
But I'm still skeptical about the game being a proper MMO =P.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Oh my god stop with these threads already. They start making expansion content before release and they release an expansion around 9 months to a year after the first game. Then during those nine months they start on the next expansion. Obviously the box sales are enough for them to live on.
Don't worry, I am sure that Arenanet has done numerous different tests to see how they can get the game out with no subs and clearly they will make a ton of money. The servers are probably not that expensive, a lot of stuff is instanced, and people can still pay for stuff like character makeovers, name change, character slots, server transfers, maybe even racial transfers if the two races both can be the same class.
And if you're so worried about it then just buy more of the things above in between expansions. If WoW can have 3 expansions and still have people buy them, then I guarantee that GW can release expansions and they will sell. Honestly, I'd be willing to be a huge amount of money that the first game is completely finished other than bugs, and they are working on the expansions right now.
It would be my pleasure to bring you up to speed, in case you did mss something:
From the Guild Wars 2 Wiki:
I hope that is as good as it sounds.
Now if we got consistent version updates as well, that would be golden.
We all hope it will be as good as it sounds. Poke around on the Arenanet.com blog - there is a ton more information about their vision and things they are implementing in the game, and ANet doesn't have a history of claiming things that don't come to be (well, aside from a 4th GW chapter, and they came clean about that relatively quickly).
It does sound a bit too good to be true, so I do append a hefty "IF they can make it all happen" to all my hype and excitement, but if anyone can do it ANet sounds like they can.
"We're very aware that there are other MMOs that we are going to be directly compared to and competing with that have been out for years and have had time to refine themselves and have had time to fix bugs and all that, and we don't get a free pass as far as that goes. The days of, you know, releasing an MMO sort of broken and then patching it up are sort of gone.
We don't think that's an option for us, we think we've got to get this game right at launch, and we can't afford to have a lot of broken stuff. People can look at our game, and then go, wow, you know, that game's really broken I could go play that and wait for them to fix it, or I could go play this other game that's been out, you know, four or five years, hey, heck even Guild Wars 1, that has had all kinds of bug fixing and polishing done to it. We're very aware that anyone who's releasing an MMO these days, especially, you know, we have very high standards for ourselves, we've got to get it right; so yeah we're going to do our best to break things now so that you don't have to deal with them being broken when we launch."
Quote from A-Net in the recent Onrpg audio interview.
It's reassuring when a developers knows full well that you can't afford to release half broken crap these days *cough*Funcom*cough*.
I predict that the game will be 90% polished at launch and need only two or three patches at most. Maybe even just a few hotfixes. These guys seem to know exactly what I want and what everyone wants.
Companies need to realize that games really do need to be as polished as WoW for people to make the transition and this is where Guild Wars is getting everything right.
It's maybe ironic that the bad launch of AoC and WAR has taught a number of MMO companies that these days they can't get away anymore with an unfinished product or unfinished features, and that they better get it right before launch instead of after.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
11,500,000 x 15 = $172,500,000 a month x 12 = $2,070,000,000 a year
Yeah, we're being screwed.
(note: just using thier numbers, I personally doubt the 11.5 million is true, but I have no proof)
It's actually 300m: last published financial data showed that the total revenues of Blizzard for the quarter that was discussed amounted to 300 million dollar, so that'd be 100m/month.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
It would be my pleasure to bring you up to speed, in case you did mss something:
From the Guild Wars 2 Wiki:
I hope that is as good as it sounds.
Now if we got consistent version updates as well, that would be golden.
We all hope it will be as good as it sounds. Poke around on the Arenanet.com blog - there is a ton more information about their vision and things they are implementing in the game, and ANet doesn't have a history of claiming things that don't come to be (well, aside from a 4th GW chapter, and they came clean about that relatively quickly).
It does sound a bit too good to be true, so I do append a hefty "IF they can make it all happen" to all my hype and excitement, but if anyone can do it ANet sounds like they can.
"We're very aware that there are other MMOs that we are going to be directly compared to and competing with that have been out for years and have had time to refine themselves and have had time to fix bugs and all that, and we don't get a free pass as far as that goes. The days of, you know, releasing an MMO sort of broken and then patching it up are sort of gone.
We don't think that's an option for us, we think we've got to get this game right at launch, and we can't afford to have a lot of broken stuff. People can look at our game, and then go, wow, you know, that game's really broken I could go play that and wait for them to fix it, or I could go play this other game that's been out, you know, four or five years, hey, heck even Guild Wars 1, that has had all kinds of bug fixing and polishing done to it. We're very aware that anyone who's releasing an MMO these days, especially, you know, we have very high standards for ourselves, we've got to get it right; so yeah we're going to do our best to break things now so that you don't have to deal with them being broken when we launch."
Quote from A-Net in the recent Onrpg audio interview.
It's reassuring when a developers knows full well that you can't afford to release half broken crap these days *cough*Funcom*cough*.
At least hopefully it won't be broken at launch.
As I've said: Anet is not stupid. They know what they are doing. There will be things that are bugged at launch, guaranteed. However, it shouldn't be so few that people barely notice it's bugged. I'm positive all the major features will work as intended at launch with minimal bugs. Why do you think they aren't releasing open beta yet? They've understood that beta is no longer beta. Beta is now the demo for the game. People expect a high level of polish in a beta now, which to me is completely absurd. Alpha is the new beta.
Ok Weasle. You just answered any question, and ended any argument you had about the content in guild wars by this sentence.
[quote]I found myself only coming back for the expansions[/quote]
As long as you are buying the expansions, Anet is good. They've made money. Guild Wars was not designed to be a game where you had to play 20 hours a day to be any good. It was a designed to be a game where you could play now-and-then, then take a couple months off and come back for the next release. They've obviously tried to fix this with the latest expansions, with the addition of dungeons and other various activities outside of the original content. However, it did not turn out that well in Eye of the North. I think with Eye of the North, they just rushed to get out the window to begin focusing more development on Guild Wars 2.
They are trying to correct this with Guild Wars 2. They've already stated they've added dungeons and activities like bar fights, snowball fights, etc. I think it's been state that Polymock will not be included in the initial release, but I could be wrong. Been a bit since I've read the article.
I think that was my entire point. They make their money through expansions, not through retention, so it doesn't matter if you play the game for 3 days or 6 months. They try to increase the longevity of the content, but ultimately they cannot, and will not, because if they create features that transcend the itemshop or subsequent expansions, then their model fails.
In contrast, P2P games thrive on additional content being released because their sub numbers go up, and therefore their revenue goes up. Retention holds the key in a P2P scenario and P2P games are built with this in mind constantly updating content without a 50 dollar price tag, but instead, just the price of admission.
Guild Wars 2 will have more to do, with a persistent world (for the most part) but will the longevity be there? For Arenanets sake, most probably not.
Is there a specific reason why, some proof or evidence for it besides a gut feeling?
Something ANet people mentioned or such?
Call it a gut feeling. I don't think there will be that many content updates nor do I see this game being grindy either.
But ya no need to be bothered by it, we'll see what happens. I wouldn't mind playing this one for a long time, but not for a short time either.
Even without those things it would still be an MMO, it's just a different kind.
GW1 had free content updates as well as paid for expansions but the free content updates were significantly less frequent than a subscription based MMO. I expect GW2 to operate on the same model to be honest. GW1 stagnated quite quickly because of this, it's why I never played it for too long at a time. Given GW2's dynamic events system and large scale PvP campaign, however, I think ANet are actively trying to make a game that can remain entertaining in both PvE and PvP despite the infrequent updates. They're tailoring it to the business model essentially by creating a game world that will change based on player interaction rather than dev interaction.
It's going to be very different compared to what people are used to, even in GW1 I think. Like you say though, regardless of what happens it will be worth the money even if we only get a few weeks out of it.
I'm also expecting expansions to arrive sooner than in other MMO's, since for their ongoing incoming revenues the expansions are more important than in P2P MMO's.
They mentioned for GW that their aim was a Magic the Gathering-like model, with expansion appearing within each 0.5-1 year, I'm expecting something like that for GW2 too.
if I read it correctly, the initial GW2 will focus on the regions of Eye of the North and Prophecies, Tyria.
That means that the regions Cantha (Factions) and Elona (Nightfall) will be available for GW2 expansions.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I don't really mind if it only lasts me few weeks to a month- that's plenty for a normal game and I don't think it's that pricey either. Especially the co-op features have always interested me.
But IMO the game should last me years, have constant version updates and be grindy enough for me to consider it an MMO.
It doesn't really matter though, since I like other genres too. I always want to support developers that do their own thing, and those kind of games are usually the best ones.
But I'm still skeptical about the game being a proper MMO =P.
So lets see...
Compared to GW1, GW2 is going to be adding in everything that made GW1 a non-MMO (such as persistent open worlds, trade systems, housing, large scale PvP areas, etc not going to go through the whole list).
But in your opinion, not enough grind = not an MMO? Since when did massive grind define the MMO genre?
You seem to be confusing 2 different things: What an MMO is vs what type of MMO you want to play / a feature you enjoy. Not having massive grind certainly does not make something a non-MMO.
ummm, it hasn't been confirmed one way or another yet has it? I think you might just see NCSoft charge for it this time around and have a subscription of some form. If there is clarification somewhere I would love to see it, because I haven't heard anything official since sometime in 2007
I will be very surprised if this isn't subscription based.
It has always been official, said and repeated. See the GW2 FAQ:
Will there be a subscription fee for Guild Wars 2?
Nope. Like the original Guild Wars, there will be no subscription fee for Guild Wars 2. You just buy the game and play it online without paying a monthly fee.
You have to be very cautious when it comes to Arenanet!
I dont wish to sound like a drama-queen but the fact is most of the hype that Arenanet build up about its products border on lies.
The way it works is that they will tell you about small aspects of an upcoming feature but not tell you the whole truth. So when the feature is finally revealed its shown to be completly NOT what everyone was expecting.
Alliance battles is a classic example! 'Battle's verses alliances' we were expecting, lol, how foolish were we!
You have to be very cautious when it comes to Arenanet!
I dont wish to sound like a drama-queen but the fact is most of the hype that Arenanet build up about its products border on lies.
The way it works is that they will tell you about small aspects of an upcoming feature but not tell you the whole truth. So when the feature is finally revealed its shown to be completly NOT what everyone was expecting.
Alliance battles is a classic example! 'Battle's verses alliances' we were expecting, lol, how foolish were we!
Can you provide a link to them misinforming about that? I don't recall ever being disappointed with what was anounced about GW1. The alliance battles were as advertised from my experience; PvP involving an alliance of three groups on each team.
Also given the amount of detail they've gone into over things like the dynamic events system I don't see how there's much room for us to be led to misunderstand the concept. Whether it will actually work well is yet to be seen but there isn't much chance that we've misunderstood the basic concept of how it will work.
Lol. Sorry, but without proof and some links it sounds like trolling and tinfoil hat territory.
Healthy scepticism or reservedness is always good especially when there's no beta yet to see things in action, but extreme paranoia is just as faulty as extreme fanboism.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Comments
It is very likely that I may have missed some crucial information, although I've tried to stay up to date with this title.
So far all I've heard is that it'll "play like an MMO" which is quite smart way to word it indeed!
It would be my pleasure to bring you up to speed, in case you did mss something:
From the Guild Wars 2 Wiki:
I hope that is as good as it sounds.
Now if we got consistent version updates as well, that would be golden.
Ok Weasle. You just answered any question, and ended any argument you had about the content in guild wars by this sentence.
[quote]I found myself only coming back for the expansions[/quote]
As long as you are buying the expansions, Anet is good. They've made money. Guild Wars was not designed to be a game where you had to play 20 hours a day to be any good. It was a designed to be a game where you could play now-and-then, then take a couple months off and come back for the next release. They've obviously tried to fix this with the latest expansions, with the addition of dungeons and other various activities outside of the original content. However, it did not turn out that well in Eye of the North. I think with Eye of the North, they just rushed to get out the window to begin focusing more development on Guild Wars 2.
They are trying to correct this with Guild Wars 2. They've already stated they've added dungeons and activities like bar fights, snowball fights, etc. I think it's been state that Polymock will not be included in the initial release, but I could be wrong. Been a bit since I've read the article.
[quote]
There has been no indication whether the game will be a proper MMO or not, so until the game comes out I will assume that they will do it more or less like they did GW, but hopefully bigger and better.
Whatever Arenanet says is of little value; obviously they won't say anything 'negative' about the game.[/quote]
You need to do your research on Guild Wars 2. You also need to research Anet and their marketing practices. Generally, Anet keeps their promises. If they are jumping around and don't flat out say 'hey this will be in there', then there is no guarantees. But if they are revealing content, and giving interviews about the subject, then it is in the game and is working as intended. In case of professions, the professions have been fleshed out to a point where it's safe to unveil it.
As for instances: Yes Guild Wars 2 will feature instances. They have not commented on how much instancing will be used. All they said was instancing will be used for dungeons, personal storyline, and the home instance. When they say the world is divided into various 'zones' it could mean anything. It just depends on how the zones are loaded, whether they are seamless, or require loading screen, which has not been commented on. Even WoW makes use of zones, but the information for the next zone is preloaded before you enter, making it seamless.
A lot of these concerns or unjustified responses can easily be fixed with a little research.
To answer the OP: short: yes. Long: If Anet has said no subscription fee, then there will be no subscription fee. Anet is not stupid, they know what they are doing. And they know what they are doing far better than a player posting on the forum. If they say it's possible, then it's already in use right now.
As for microtransactions: Yes, it's been stated that these microtransactions will be including. However, they will be "basically similar" to Guild Wars 2. Key word is basically. The basically could mean anything. I do not think they'll include PvP skill packs, since they've already state that everything is unlocked for players wishing to participate in high-end PvP (GvG). You do not have to worry about Anet putting any item in the shop that will give players a gameplay, or otherwise tactical advantage within the game. If they include any item, such as a weapon, then it will be easily attainable within the game. I can see them being more along the lines of costums, or various legacy items from Guild Wars 1 that are just for vanity purposes. Point is, anything they add will not provide an unfair advantage.
GW1 always had constant version updates. It never really had major content additions aside from things supposed to be in the release of an expansion but the game had very fex glitches and bugs due to the constant streaming of updates. OFC gw1 was mostly instanced so updates were much more easily streamed but I'd still expect relatively frequent version updates for gw2 since despite gw2 being persistant it's still based off of gw1's streaming technology. Probably have down times in gw2 though.
We all hope it will be as good as it sounds. Poke around on the Arenanet.com blog - there is a ton more information about their vision and things they are implementing in the game, and ANet doesn't have a history of claiming things that don't come to be (well, aside from a 4th GW chapter, and they came clean about that relatively quickly).
It does sound a bit too good to be true, so I do append a hefty "IF they can make it all happen" to all my hype and excitement, but if anyone can do it ANet sounds like they can.
I don't really mind if it only lasts me few weeks to a month- that's plenty for a normal game and I don't think it's that pricey either. Especially the co-op features have always interested me.
But IMO the game should last me years, have constant version updates and be grindy enough for me to consider it an MMO.
It doesn't really matter though, since I like other genres too. I always want to support developers that do their own thing, and those kind of games are usually the best ones.
But I'm still skeptical about the game being a proper MMO =P.
Is there a specific reason why, some proof or evidence for it besides a gut feeling?
Something ANet people mentioned or such?
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Oh my god stop with these threads already. They start making expansion content before release and they release an expansion around 9 months to a year after the first game. Then during those nine months they start on the next expansion. Obviously the box sales are enough for them to live on.
Don't worry, I am sure that Arenanet has done numerous different tests to see how they can get the game out with no subs and clearly they will make a ton of money. The servers are probably not that expensive, a lot of stuff is instanced, and people can still pay for stuff like character makeovers, name change, character slots, server transfers, maybe even racial transfers if the two races both can be the same class.
And if you're so worried about it then just buy more of the things above in between expansions. If WoW can have 3 expansions and still have people buy them, then I guarantee that GW can release expansions and they will sell. Honestly, I'd be willing to be a huge amount of money that the first game is completely finished other than bugs, and they are working on the expansions right now.
"We're very aware that there are other MMOs that we are going to be directly compared to and competing with that have been out for years and have had time to refine themselves and have had time to fix bugs and all that, and we don't get a free pass as far as that goes. The days of, you know, releasing an MMO sort of broken and then patching it up are sort of gone.
We don't think that's an option for us, we think we've got to get this game right at launch, and we can't afford to have a lot of broken stuff. People can look at our game, and then go, wow, you know, that game's really broken I could go play that and wait for them to fix it, or I could go play this other game that's been out, you know, four or five years, hey, heck even Guild Wars 1, that has had all kinds of bug fixing and polishing done to it. We're very aware that anyone who's releasing an MMO these days, especially, you know, we have very high standards for ourselves, we've got to get it right; so yeah we're going to do our best to break things now so that you don't have to deal with them being broken when we launch."
Quote from A-Net in the recent Onrpg audio interview.
It's reassuring when a developers knows full well that you can't afford to release half broken crap these days *cough*Funcom*cough*.
At least hopefully it won't be broken at launch.
Call it a gut feeling. I don't think there will be that many content updates nor do I see this game being grindy either.
But ya no need to be bothered by it, we'll see what happens. I wouldn't mind playing this one for a long time, but not for a short time either.
I predict that the game will be 90% polished at launch and need only two or three patches at most. Maybe even just a few hotfixes. These guys seem to know exactly what I want and what everyone wants.
Companies need to realize that games really do need to be as polished as WoW for people to make the transition and this is where Guild Wars is getting everything right.
11,500,000 x 15 = $172,500,000 a month x 12 = $2,070,000,000 a year
Yeah, we're being screwed.
(note: just using thier numbers, I personally doubt the 11.5 million is true, but I have no proof)
It's maybe ironic that the bad launch of AoC and WAR has taught a number of MMO companies that these days they can't get away anymore with an unfinished product or unfinished features, and that they better get it right before launch instead of after.
As it should be.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
It's actually 300m: last published financial data showed that the total revenues of Blizzard for the quarter that was discussed amounted to 300 million dollar, so that'd be 100m/month.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
As I've said: Anet is not stupid. They know what they are doing. There will be things that are bugged at launch, guaranteed. However, it shouldn't be so few that people barely notice it's bugged. I'm positive all the major features will work as intended at launch with minimal bugs. Why do you think they aren't releasing open beta yet? They've understood that beta is no longer beta. Beta is now the demo for the game. People expect a high level of polish in a beta now, which to me is completely absurd. Alpha is the new beta.
I think that was my entire point. They make their money through expansions, not through retention, so it doesn't matter if you play the game for 3 days or 6 months. They try to increase the longevity of the content, but ultimately they cannot, and will not, because if they create features that transcend the itemshop or subsequent expansions, then their model fails.
In contrast, P2P games thrive on additional content being released because their sub numbers go up, and therefore their revenue goes up. Retention holds the key in a P2P scenario and P2P games are built with this in mind constantly updating content without a 50 dollar price tag, but instead, just the price of admission.
Guild Wars 2 will have more to do, with a persistent world (for the most part) but will the longevity be there? For Arenanets sake, most probably not.
Even without those things it would still be an MMO, it's just a different kind.
GW1 had free content updates as well as paid for expansions but the free content updates were significantly less frequent than a subscription based MMO. I expect GW2 to operate on the same model to be honest. GW1 stagnated quite quickly because of this, it's why I never played it for too long at a time. Given GW2's dynamic events system and large scale PvP campaign, however, I think ANet are actively trying to make a game that can remain entertaining in both PvE and PvP despite the infrequent updates. They're tailoring it to the business model essentially by creating a game world that will change based on player interaction rather than dev interaction.
It's going to be very different compared to what people are used to, even in GW1 I think. Like you say though, regardless of what happens it will be worth the money even if we only get a few weeks out of it.
They release an expansion every couple of months, that's how.
I'm also expecting expansions to arrive sooner than in other MMO's, since for their ongoing incoming revenues the expansions are more important than in P2P MMO's.
They mentioned for GW that their aim was a Magic the Gathering-like model, with expansion appearing within each 0.5-1 year, I'm expecting something like that for GW2 too.
if I read it correctly, the initial GW2 will focus on the regions of Eye of the North and Prophecies, Tyria.
That means that the regions Cantha (Factions) and Elona (Nightfall) will be available for GW2 expansions.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
So lets see...
Compared to GW1, GW2 is going to be adding in everything that made GW1 a non-MMO (such as persistent open worlds, trade systems, housing, large scale PvP areas, etc not going to go through the whole list).
But in your opinion, not enough grind = not an MMO? Since when did massive grind define the MMO genre?
You seem to be confusing 2 different things: What an MMO is vs what type of MMO you want to play / a feature you enjoy. Not having massive grind certainly does not make something a non-MMO.
It has always been official, said and repeated. See the GW2 FAQ:
http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/game-faq/
Will there be a subscription fee for Guild Wars 2?
Nope. Like the original Guild Wars, there will be no subscription fee for Guild Wars 2. You just buy the game and play it online without paying a monthly fee.
You have to be very cautious when it comes to Arenanet!
I dont wish to sound like a drama-queen but the fact is most of the hype that Arenanet build up about its products border on lies.
The way it works is that they will tell you about small aspects of an upcoming feature but not tell you the whole truth. So when the feature is finally revealed its shown to be completly NOT what everyone was expecting.
Alliance battles is a classic example! 'Battle's verses alliances' we were expecting, lol, how foolish were we!
Can you provide a link to them misinforming about that? I don't recall ever being disappointed with what was anounced about GW1. The alliance battles were as advertised from my experience; PvP involving an alliance of three groups on each team.
Also given the amount of detail they've gone into over things like the dynamic events system I don't see how there's much room for us to be led to misunderstand the concept. Whether it will actually work well is yet to be seen but there isn't much chance that we've misunderstood the basic concept of how it will work.
Lol. Sorry, but without proof and some links it sounds like trolling and tinfoil hat territory.
Healthy scepticism or reservedness is always good especially when there's no beta yet to see things in action, but extreme paranoia is just as faulty as extreme fanboism.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."