It honestly wouldn't matter if StarVault was a billion SEK in debt. The main developer is from a VERY wealthy family. All it would take is a phone call to daddy and the company would be bailed out.
Face it. StarVault has already outlived many other MMO's including the 100million dollar budget MMO APB. Even if it performed lower then expectations this quarter the fan base is large enough to cover the expenses of running a server and paying a few developers. Mortal Online simply will not die.
I was under the impression SV released when they did due to pressure from investors. So why didnt it stay in beta if more development capital was only a phone call away?
Face it. StarVault has already outlived many other MMO's including the 100million dollar budget MMO APB. Even if it performed lower then expectations this quarter the fan base is large enough to cover the expenses of running a server and paying a few developers. Mortal Online simply will not die.
It has lasted 5 months... almost...
And as for your statement that the fanbase is large enough to cover expenses... well.. obviously that's not true.. thus the loss for Q3. Income is less than expenses...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
It honestly wouldn't matter if StarVault was a billion SEK in debt. The main developer is from a VERY wealthy family. All it would take is a phone call to daddy and the company would be bailed out.
Face it. StarVault has already outlived many other MMO's including the 100million dollar budget MMO APB. Even if it performed lower then expectations this quarter the fan base is large enough to cover the expenses of running a server and paying a few developers. Mortal Online simply will not die.
"Daddy" already bailed him out once. Did you not notice, that he sold ALL HIS SHARES to be converted to cash, to reinvest into the company?
Daddy eventually is going to cut his losses. Wealthy people don't get wealthy by being stupid. Selling his shares (which are worth a pittance anyway) to get a few bucks back into the business isn't going to help him recoup the company, especially when the liabilities outstanding are worth more than the company itself, with no sign of actually affecting the cashflow situation. The bottom line is that when people come to call in their debts, and if this is from "angel" investors it may take longer, they will be in for some really bad times.
And their fanbase, as indicated by the report, is *not* able to cover the expenses. The initial injection of cash they got from box sales doesn't manifest itself in any salient way when you realize that the recurring subscriptions actually are lower than the administrative cost. That's why their operating profit is already NEGATIVE. They are fortunate for this year that they had a bunch of folks buy the box copy of the game, and give them a bit of cash injection. But the reality is that the recurring subs are falling off the map fast, and it's indicated in the numbers. Henrik won't spell it out as much, but numbers don't lie. That operating profit that is negative, and I would bet money will continue to be, is not something that is sustainable.
This is natural progression of any small business trying to make it large, things are mucky, things are slow and a profit is never assumed for a long time yet
This is natural progression of any small business trying to make it large, things are mucky, things are slow and a profit is never assumed for a long time yet
I'll let Henrick answer you:
" The number of players we have today is of course much lower than we expected"
So... this was unexpected.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
"SV is postponing work on other products/titles in order to concentrate on Mortal Online"
lol they can not even get MO running good do they have anything else they have been working on?
I guess that is Henrik running his mouth to make SV seem more serious. They seriously cant be that stupid to have done any work that is worth mentioning on any other titles, considering the state MO is in.
"SV is postponing work on other products/titles in order to concentrate on Mortal Online"
lol they can not even get MO running good do they have anything else they have been working on?
I guess that is Henrik running his mouth to make SV seem more serious. They seriously cant be that stupid to have done any work that is worth mentioning on any other titles, considering the state MO is in.
How can you be running your mouth when there is absolutely nothing else being developed?
"SV is postponing work on other products/titles in order to concentrate on Mortal Online"
lol they can not even get MO running good do they have anything else they have been working on?
I guess that is Henrik running his mouth to make SV seem more serious. They seriously cant be that stupid to have done any work that is worth mentioning on any other titles, considering the state MO is in.
How can you be running your mouth when there is absolutely nothing else being developed?
I think you misunderstood the meaning of "running your mouth", which isn't "letting secrets out", but "talking shit".
"SV is postponing work on other products/titles in order to concentrate on Mortal Online"
lol they can not even get MO running good do they have anything else they have been working on?
I guess that is Henrik running his mouth to make SV seem more serious. They seriously cant be that stupid to have done any work that is worth mentioning on any other titles, considering the state MO is in.
How can you be running your mouth when there is absolutely nothing else being developed?
I think you misunderstood the meaning of "running your mouth", which isn't "letting secrets out", but "talking shit".
I understood you, I am wondering why Henrik is acting like that
I would like or every MMO to make profit so there is competition and developers think up new ideas for their games. I would love for MO to succeed and eventually get to the point of what it should and can be. Darkfall has been making progress and I actually enjoy it now. As for MO I still am going to wait another 6 - 12 months and see how it is doing then, if not shut down. Poor APB...
APB is bought by another company and coming back, so hopefully this fix it as it had so much potienal.
Ofcourse SV has bumped into unexpected bugs. A ctiy disappeared one patch and a few days later the Q@A guy is disposed of. They're fixing it up nicely after a huge change in their systems and after that (which we're going to have to wait paitently for) they can start adding a wider range of features which this engine build allows.
Notice; Please only log into one of your accounts to reply to threads in this sub-section.
"SV is postponing work on other products/titles in order to concentrate on Mortal Online"
lol they can not even get MO running good do they have anything else they have been working on?
I guess that is Henrik running his mouth to make SV seem more serious. They seriously cant be that stupid to have done any work that is worth mentioning on any other titles, considering the state MO is in.
How can you be running your mouth when there is absolutely nothing else being developed?
I think you misunderstood the meaning of "running your mouth", which isn't "letting secrets out", but "talking shit".
I understood you, I am wondering why Henrik is acting like that
Probably to give false impression of a successfull company to the investors.
Why are they using forum members and not actual game subs?
Because if they used game subs most MMO'ers would laugh at the prospect of playing the game. Not trying to troll here but its the truth. I have logged into the game the past few days. The town of fabernum had 1 guy in the bank AFK and 2 people at the front door. Meduli had about 6 or 7 people on. How can you keep an MMO going when the amount of concurrent users is challeneged to reach the 100 mark ?? They are probably lucky to have about 300 total subscribers.
Will some of you fans do me a favor (Preferably Tizio) Start a thread on the MO forums with a direct Question to Henrik.
Henrik how many current subscribers does MO have ? See what ya get . One thing I can guarantee is you wont get a number, no way in hell.
Even if your generous and you put the current number of subs at 1,000 that would mean they are bringing in 15,000 per month. Now keeping that number in mind how do you pay 20 developers and how do you pay the bills ?
Lets assume each dev (20) makes an average of 3000 a month thats 60,000 dollars just in salary whos gonna pay these guys in 4 or 5 months when capital runs out ??? Henriks dad ?
The conversion rate from Swedish krona to dollars is like 7.5 to 1 historically. Therefore, in 9 months they made about $100,000. Not a lot to reinvest into the company.
The conversion rate from Swedish krona to dollars is like 7.5 to 1 historically. Therefore, in 9 months they made about $100,000. Not a lot to reinvest into the company.
Agreed. Im still trying to figure out how they are paying the employees.
Well, they would pay employees first. Profit is left after all expenses, so the $100,000 is left after they pay employees. But, it is not a lot of money to hire new employees. They may be able to get one or two good programmers, but I'd say one at the most with benefits included.
If they are in Sweden, I know there are tons of costs to hire people due to government regulations. I am a Swedish American by the way.
Q3 they had a loss.. thus their expenses.. were larger than their sales. They earned a profit in Q2 because they had all the sales of the game but it hadn't launched yet... so expenses were down. For instance they didn't have 24/7 coverage for the server.. etc etc.
Now Q3 hit and most box sales are gone.. so it's mostly subs.. and those subs aren't high enough to offset the expenses.. thus the loss.
For the record... pretty sure they have more than 1k subs... at least for now. The problem is that by their own statements way back before launch they really need 10-13k to stay afloat... I remember with the pre-launch hype how they were telling people that the only way they would be able to guarantee a spot on launchday was to pre-order because they were going to cap it at 20k units until they added more server capacity. Somehow... I don't think that's a problem today...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Because if they used game subs most MMO'ers would laugh at the prospect of playing the game. Not trying to troll here but its the truth. I have logged into the game the past few days. The town of fabernum had 1 guy in the bank AFK and 2 people at the front door. Meduli had about 6 or 7 people on. How can you keep an MMO going when the amount of concurrent users is challeneged to reach the 100 mark ?? They are probably lucky to have about 300 total subscribers.
That can't be right, the numbers would be a lot worse than -17 400 dollars then. 5-10K players would be bad enough.
But it is true that games with very few players like MO, DF, SWG and VG prefer to not advertise their number of players, but would you in their seat?
I read the original article in Swedish BTW, the babefish were not perfectly clear even if it was pretty useful. The report say more or less: Shape up the game or you are screwed.
And that is possible, I never thought DF would still be around but it is, MO have the same possibility.
Do not forget there are a lot of people who are paying a sub and not playing the game at all waiting for the game to meet the potential they lay on it. It seems the average fanboy has an almost religious fervor for SV.
I could not in pay for something that I think is an inferior product hoping it will "get good".
Do not forget there are a lot of people who are paying a sub and not playing the game at all waiting for the game to meet the potential they lay on it. It seems the average fanboy has an almost religious fervor for SV.
I could not in pay for something that I think is an inferior product hoping it will "get good".
No other games on the market that offer what MO is delivering = people wait a few more months for MO to be more feature complete. The game really isn't that buggy at all, the main issue at the moment is the fighting desync that can occur after the engine upgrade. However after todays patch that's greatly improved.
Adrala; 'I must admit that the fact the patch seems to be succesful so far has brought some hope to my devastated fanboish heart.
As soon as you iron out the rest of the bugs left from the epic patch and then start working on the social aspects of the game I will be eagerly comming back as I am sure many more people will do.'
People1972; 'I am very happy about this new patch after testing it out.
I am now a happy panda.
Great work getting this mess together. '
Melt16; 'This ^^
Patch is a winner. Everything looks fixed so far.
Welcome to the game my fellow South African '
Sandman1882; 'Just tried out the patch. Good job SV. This patch is a winner . PvP is working now '
Duffo; 'What I have noticed this patch has fixed lag and many other issues so good work.'
Trixxer; 'Unarmed combat animation is improved. Looks more cool now. We also got turn animation.'
Comments
I was under the impression SV released when they did due to pressure from investors. So why didnt it stay in beta if more development capital was only a phone call away?
I win!!! LOL@U
It has lasted 5 months... almost...
And as for your statement that the fanbase is large enough to cover expenses... well.. obviously that's not true.. thus the loss for Q3. Income is less than expenses...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
"Daddy" already bailed him out once. Did you not notice, that he sold ALL HIS SHARES to be converted to cash, to reinvest into the company?
Daddy eventually is going to cut his losses. Wealthy people don't get wealthy by being stupid. Selling his shares (which are worth a pittance anyway) to get a few bucks back into the business isn't going to help him recoup the company, especially when the liabilities outstanding are worth more than the company itself, with no sign of actually affecting the cashflow situation. The bottom line is that when people come to call in their debts, and if this is from "angel" investors it may take longer, they will be in for some really bad times.
And their fanbase, as indicated by the report, is *not* able to cover the expenses. The initial injection of cash they got from box sales doesn't manifest itself in any salient way when you realize that the recurring subscriptions actually are lower than the administrative cost. That's why their operating profit is already NEGATIVE. They are fortunate for this year that they had a bunch of folks buy the box copy of the game, and give them a bit of cash injection. But the reality is that the recurring subs are falling off the map fast, and it's indicated in the numbers. Henrik won't spell it out as much, but numbers don't lie. That operating profit that is negative, and I would bet money will continue to be, is not something that is sustainable.
Even if your daddy is rich.
This is natural progression of any small business trying to make it large, things are mucky, things are slow and a profit is never assumed for a long time yet
So is it just a coincidence that 2 salary employees left right before the Q3 numbers came out?
I'll let Henrick answer you:
" The number of players we have today is of course much lower than we expected"
So... this was unexpected.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Why are they using forum members and not actual game subs?
I guess that is Henrik running his mouth to make SV seem more serious. They seriously cant be that stupid to have done any work that is worth mentioning on any other titles, considering the state MO is in.
How can you be running your mouth when there is absolutely nothing else being developed?
I think you misunderstood the meaning of "running your mouth", which isn't "letting secrets out", but "talking shit".
I understood you, I am wondering why Henrik is acting like that
You have to remember it is the same Henrik when asked in IRC if the players will notice a big difference after the EPIC patch.
His reply "It will be like MO2" I guess he was referring to all the new added bugs and dissapearing cities.
Ofcourse SV has bumped into unexpected bugs. A ctiy disappeared one patch and a few days later the Q@A guy is disposed of. They're fixing it up nicely after a huge change in their systems and after that (which we're going to have to wait paitently for) they can start adding a wider range of features which this engine build allows.
Notice; Please only log into one of your accounts to reply to threads in this sub-section.
Probably to give false impression of a successfull company to the investors.
Because if they used game subs most MMO'ers would laugh at the prospect of playing the game. Not trying to troll here but its the truth. I have logged into the game the past few days. The town of fabernum had 1 guy in the bank AFK and 2 people at the front door. Meduli had about 6 or 7 people on. How can you keep an MMO going when the amount of concurrent users is challeneged to reach the 100 mark ?? They are probably lucky to have about 300 total subscribers.
http://www.prophecyguild.net
Will some of you fans do me a favor (Preferably Tizio) Start a thread on the MO forums with a direct Question to Henrik.
Henrik how many current subscribers does MO have ? See what ya get . One thing I can guarantee is you wont get a number, no way in hell.
Even if your generous and you put the current number of subs at 1,000 that would mean they are bringing in 15,000 per month. Now keeping that number in mind how do you pay 20 developers and how do you pay the bills ?
Lets assume each dev (20) makes an average of 3000 a month thats 60,000 dollars just in salary whos gonna pay these guys in 4 or 5 months when capital runs out ??? Henriks dad ?
Wake the hell up .
[mod edit]
http://www.prophecyguild.net
The conversion rate from Swedish krona to dollars is like 7.5 to 1 historically. Therefore, in 9 months they made about $100,000. Not a lot to reinvest into the company.
Agreed. Im still trying to figure out how they are paying the employees.
http://www.prophecyguild.net
Well, they would pay employees first. Profit is left after all expenses, so the $100,000 is left after they pay employees. But, it is not a lot of money to hire new employees. They may be able to get one or two good programmers, but I'd say one at the most with benefits included.
If they are in Sweden, I know there are tons of costs to hire people due to government regulations. I am a Swedish American by the way.
Q3 they had a loss.. thus their expenses.. were larger than their sales. They earned a profit in Q2 because they had all the sales of the game but it hadn't launched yet... so expenses were down. For instance they didn't have 24/7 coverage for the server.. etc etc.
Now Q3 hit and most box sales are gone.. so it's mostly subs.. and those subs aren't high enough to offset the expenses.. thus the loss.
For the record... pretty sure they have more than 1k subs... at least for now. The problem is that by their own statements way back before launch they really need 10-13k to stay afloat... I remember with the pre-launch hype how they were telling people that the only way they would be able to guarantee a spot on launchday was to pre-order because they were going to cap it at 20k units until they added more server capacity. Somehow... I don't think that's a problem today...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
That can't be right, the numbers would be a lot worse than -17 400 dollars then. 5-10K players would be bad enough.
But it is true that games with very few players like MO, DF, SWG and VG prefer to not advertise their number of players, but would you in their seat?
I read the original article in Swedish BTW, the babefish were not perfectly clear even if it was pretty useful. The report say more or less: Shape up the game or you are screwed.
And that is possible, I never thought DF would still be around but it is, MO have the same possibility.
Do not forget there are a lot of people who are paying a sub and not playing the game at all waiting for the game to meet the potential they lay on it. It seems the average fanboy has an almost religious fervor for SV.
I could not in pay for something that I think is an inferior product hoping it will "get good".
No other games on the market that offer what MO is delivering = people wait a few more months for MO to be more feature complete. The game really isn't that buggy at all, the main issue at the moment is the fighting desync that can occur after the engine upgrade. However after todays patch that's greatly improved.
Adrala; 'I must admit that the fact the patch seems to be succesful so far has brought some hope to my devastated fanboish heart.
As soon as you iron out the rest of the bugs left from the epic patch and then start working on the social aspects of the game I will be eagerly comming back as I am sure many more people will do.'
People1972; 'I am very happy about this new patch after testing it out.
'
I am now a happy panda.
Great work getting this mess together.
Melt16; 'This ^^
'
Patch is a winner. Everything looks fixed so far.
Welcome to the game my fellow South African
Sandman1882; 'Just tried out the patch. Good job SV. This patch is a winner
. PvP is working now 
'
Duffo; 'What I have noticed this patch has fixed lag and many other issues so good work.'
Trixxer; 'Unarmed combat animation is improved. Looks more cool now. We also got turn animation.'
[LoD]Addicted>
no
<[LoD]Addicted>
they fixed
<[LoD]Addicted>
the dysynce
<[LoD]Addicted>
this path
<[LoD]Addicted>
patch*
[DERP]Lti>you should encourage other members of SV to make patches like this one
[myL]Shax>
how is this new patch?
<[UW]Kuroi>
good
Do they count as general consensus?