I think it's a matter of resources and design choice.
If Rift'd be as large as Vanguard it'd be an impossible task to hunt down all the rifts, especially since they're happening in each region. Plus it just wouldn't be fun, having to fight a rift, then run for 5-15 min to the next rift, and so on. Also, it'd be far more difficult to form sizeable groups in such vastness, while in Rift the rifts are close to each other and I'm in groups half of the time I play.
So, for Trion's design of rifts, a smaller world works.
Personally, I like my MMO world bigger though.
Originally posted by fivoroth
LOTRO is definitely not larger than WoW.
LotrO IS larger than WoW, at least in world size at both their launch, and when it comes to explorable area somewhat larger too. Whether one feels larger than the other, that's subjective and different from one person to the next.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Its not very expensive to make a zone or area bigger if they dont add more content or mobs. So I dont think the world in Rift is small because they couldnt afford to make it bigger. They probably belive the typical Rift-player will prefer a world with a lot of content, other players and mobs in smaller areas.
Thus far I've enjoyed RIFT and look forward to see what it has to offer upon release . I'm burnt out by WoW and Blizzard have lost all credibility in my eyes in the way they've "streamlined" the game . As much as I love LOTRO I've gone through most of the content now and am waiting for the next expansion. Other mmos like AoC ,DDO and War don' really appeal that much to me so even if I get four-six months play out of this game initially that'll be fine by me I can always come back when they add new content . I was a little concernd too that the world was small but they do pack a lot into it .
They can't make rift that big because of the "rifts" would be to hard to control. They need to make sure players are in the area to take them down. But I agree it is still plenty big enough for casual gamers, which is what this game is geared towards atleast in the early levels. we will have to wait to find out what the end game is like at this point we can only guess.
The world in rift is small-medium. When I looked at the world map it was definitely no where near the scale of WoW. Not sure about Lotro. I always thought LOTRO had a very small world as well so I guess Rift looks pretty similar to what's in LOTRO at launch.
I remember when LotRO was launched, it was shown to be smaller than WoW was at launch, based on travel times on foot to calculate relative scales. What made things worse, though, was that LotRO zones felt even smaller than they were, because they took existing source material and scaled it down by an absurd degree.
Places that were supposed to be an hours walk apart could be 30 seconds away in game. Of course, the landmarks themselves had to be scaled down considerable as well. In spite of fairly descent sqaure milage, the game felt like the dreaded "theme park" in too many places. Literally like it was a Universal Studios Middle Earth Theme Park.
In Rift, straight line travel times mark the world as a bit on the small side, but the zones just don't feel small when you are in them.
I think that zone layout and the wide aggro ranges add to the impression as well as other factors. Some locations deep in the wilderness might only be a few minutes travel if you were invisible, but can take a while to get to as you selectively cut your way through enemies between you and your destination. Roads are safer, in many places, but not totally safe. You can get ambushed in many places if you aren't paying attention.
Also, I'm shocked at how many hours can go by questing in a single zone, with some Rifts added in. In WoW, you might clear all the quests in some zones in 1 to 3 hours, then you are pretty much done with the place. Doesn't feel that way in Rift.
It may feel huge, which is good to those that play it, but in cold, hard figures it isn't that large compared to some other MMO's.
I'm guessing you are right on the numbers, but I can say that it does feel a lot bigger than numbers might indicate.
It feels organic and immersive and they also make good use of vertical scale, which helps them to maximize the square meters.
what feels 'organic' in it?
the safari park enclosures rammed full of mobs?
i didnt find running from quest camp to quest camp all that immersive either.
rift is pure rinse and repeat gaming... all that changes from L1-30 is the backdrop of the smaller area you are in. It's the same room with different wallpaper.
LotrO IS larger than WoW, at least in world size at both their launch, and when it comes to explorable area somewhat larger too. Whether one feels larger than the other, that's subjective and different from one person to the next.
Not true. Can you access every single point on that map? People have access to flying mounts in WoW on every continent now (ignoring the instances and maybe TB). You also neglected the expansions, particularly outlands and WotLK, whicih contribute immensely to WoW's size.
A truly fair comparison would take all expansions into account for both games and not just cross sections, but totally accessible area.
This is a sequence of characters intended to produce some profound mental effect, but it has failed.
The world may indeed be huge, but that doesn't really matter if the rest of the game is terrible beyond belief.
Lucky for us then that it is not "terrible beyond belief." The game is actually quite good as long as you understand that it is not a sandbox and it is not something other than what it is.
Not even close! Idk if we are playing the same MMO, this game is garbage. 2 months it will die just like WARHAMMER did. Played every beta and I have alpha. This game has proven nothing more than to be a second rate WoW clan. Go play WoW if you want a better gaming experience, or just wait for GW2 or SWTOR!
How do you know that GW2 is huge? Is this assumption or fact? If fact, where is this information? I have seen the maps, etc, but nothing that indicates that the game is huge or comparable in size to WOW or other games.
Not coming down on you. I will be getting GW2 so am curious how "huge" it is.
How do you know that GW2 is huge? Is this assumption or fact? If fact, where is this information? I have seen the maps, etc, but nothing that indicates that the game is huge or comparable in size to WOW or other games.
Not coming down on you. I will be getting GW2 so am curious how "huge" it is.
I am a fan of Rift but lets not lie to people. The World right now is very tiny. Most AAA games have three to fours areas to level for each level. Rift has one area through 35. Each zone is is very tiny which is not bad as Trion decided to make smaller zones with less open spaces. But the world and the amount of content 1-50 is limited compared to other AAA MMOs at launch. Probably 1/4 the size of WoW at lauch. But rift,if successfull, can grow and add zones. so its not a terrible thing. And Rift's focus is not 1-50 but endgame which is a refreshing changed afetr all the games that have released with no endgame.
So its a question of what do you rpefer and is the glas half full or half empty,
Telara is tiny. Not only is it tiny, but its linear mechanics of quests dragging you around the map make it even smaller. There's no out of the way places to make the world feel bigger...nowhere you can get lost.
You are correct about the getting lost part.
I hate getting lost in an online game I pay money to have fun in. I played Mortal Online for a while thru Beta into launch and that game has no in game map or compass.
There is nothing worse to me than a game that makes finding friends and grouping a tuff experiance.
Also lets talk about content.
A game can be huge but if there is not enuff content the world does not come alive and is basically just huge empty space.
So I will take a game that is a little smaller than original WoW with all zones packed with fun stuff at every turn and an easy grouping system over those other HUGE empty, less group friendly worlds any day of the week.
This world is SOOO not huge. Not like that's a bad thing. I don't really need 3 hour treks of mindnumbing almost random landscape to get somewhere in order to feel like I'm in a large world. But still, in comparison to WoW and LotRO AT LAUNCH, it's a good bit smaller.
Someone mentioned that alot of the perceived non-smallness was due to run speed. Agree with that 100%. It feels like I'm crawling. Even that horse you ride in the starter area runs like they're in slo-mo.
This world is SOOO not huge. Not like that's a bad thing. I don't really need 3 hour treks of mindnumbing almost random landscape to get somewhere in order to feel like I'm in a large world. But still, in comparison to WoW and LotRO AT LAUNCH, it's a good bit smaller.
Someone mentioned that alot of the perceived non-smallness was due to run speed. Agree with that 100%. It feels like I'm crawling. Even that horse you ride in the starter area runs like they're in slo-mo.
Generally speaking, the populair consensus is that large open worlds are good, instance bad... but in game everyone moans and groans about travel times, "if only there were a way to quickly travel between spots"
My theory is that, give the bigass open world for the people who want to take 3 hour field trips in game, and most likely die or get ganked several times on the way, have their open world, ill take a load screen and a bathroom break or cig break over the 35min real time trip anyday.
This world is SOOO not huge. Not like that's a bad thing. I don't really need 3 hour treks of mindnumbing almost random landscape to get somewhere in order to feel like I'm in a large world. But still, in comparison to WoW and LotRO AT LAUNCH, it's a good bit smaller.
Someone mentioned that alot of the perceived non-smallness was due to run speed. Agree with that 100%. It feels like I'm crawling. Even that horse you ride in the starter area runs like they're in slo-mo.
Generally speaking, the populair consensus is that large open worlds are good, instance bad... but in game everyone moans and groans about travel times, "if only there were a way to quickly travel between spots"
My theory is that, give the bigass open world for the people who want to take 3 hour field trips in game, and most likely die or get ganked several times on the way, have their open world, ill take a load screen and a bathroom break or cig break over the 35min real time trip anyday.
and this way you dont need stupid looking mounts.
Would you even consider using something known as map-travel?
Telling people not to lie, then you lie....pretty nice....Sorry keep on trolling, don't let the truth stop ya!
I find it funny, that people live on here to troll a game they despise....I played a lot of games I don't like, I post once or twice, and I don't troll, then I move on.
It's pretty sad that you guys have nothing better to do, or atleast something you do like....People liking something or being happy with something that upsetting? I know...your just looking out for people...over...and over...and over again...even though its a free beta and people can make up their own mind , people need you on that wall!
It's kinda sad, I don't even think if I paid for a game and a company stole my money I could get that worked up over a game...Let alone one I never spent money on.
Comments
I think it's a matter of resources and design choice.
If Rift'd be as large as Vanguard it'd be an impossible task to hunt down all the rifts, especially since they're happening in each region. Plus it just wouldn't be fun, having to fight a rift, then run for 5-15 min to the next rift, and so on. Also, it'd be far more difficult to form sizeable groups in such vastness, while in Rift the rifts are close to each other and I'm in groups half of the time I play.
So, for Trion's design of rifts, a smaller world works.
Personally, I like my MMO world bigger though.
LotrO IS larger than WoW, at least in world size at both their launch, and when it comes to explorable area somewhat larger too. Whether one feels larger than the other, that's subjective and different from one person to the next.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Its not very expensive to make a zone or area bigger if they dont add more content or mobs. So I dont think the world in Rift is small because they couldnt afford to make it bigger. They probably belive the typical Rift-player will prefer a world with a lot of content, other players and mobs in smaller areas.
Its not how big it is . Its what you do with it .
Thus far I've enjoyed RIFT and look forward to see what it has to offer upon release . I'm burnt out by WoW and Blizzard have lost all credibility in my eyes in the way they've "streamlined" the game . As much as I love LOTRO I've gone through most of the content now and am waiting for the next expansion. Other mmos like AoC ,DDO and War don' really appeal that much to me so even if I get four-six months play out of this game initially that'll be fine by me I can always come back when they add new content . I was a little concernd too that the world was small but they do pack a lot into it .
My highest is 31 so far and I didn't see any "enlargement" of the world after 20.
It's just the same, linear and small (compared to most other MMORPGs) world, cramped with mobs, with little room for real exploration.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Compared to Elder Scrolls or Minecraft, it's not so big.
You should check the Earthrise world to see what a huge world means
its the WoW syndrome, not that the world is big, your character that moves too slowly...
I only get impressed if the world is bigger than Just Cause 2..
"It has potential"
-Second most used phrase on existence
"It sucks"
-Most used phrase on existence
I'm guessing you are right on the numbers, but I can say that it does feel a lot bigger than numbers might indicate.
It feels organic and immersive and they also make good use of vertical scale, which helps them to maximize the square meters.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
I remember when LotRO was launched, it was shown to be smaller than WoW was at launch, based on travel times on foot to calculate relative scales. What made things worse, though, was that LotRO zones felt even smaller than they were, because they took existing source material and scaled it down by an absurd degree.
Places that were supposed to be an hours walk apart could be 30 seconds away in game. Of course, the landmarks themselves had to be scaled down considerable as well. In spite of fairly descent sqaure milage, the game felt like the dreaded "theme park" in too many places. Literally like it was a Universal Studios Middle Earth Theme Park.
In Rift, straight line travel times mark the world as a bit on the small side, but the zones just don't feel small when you are in them.
I think that zone layout and the wide aggro ranges add to the impression as well as other factors. Some locations deep in the wilderness might only be a few minutes travel if you were invisible, but can take a while to get to as you selectively cut your way through enemies between you and your destination. Roads are safer, in many places, but not totally safe. You can get ambushed in many places if you aren't paying attention.
Also, I'm shocked at how many hours can go by questing in a single zone, with some Rifts added in. In WoW, you might clear all the quests in some zones in 1 to 3 hours, then you are pretty much done with the place. Doesn't feel that way in Rift.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
what feels 'organic' in it?
the safari park enclosures rammed full of mobs?
i didnt find running from quest camp to quest camp all that immersive either.
rift is pure rinse and repeat gaming... all that changes from L1-30 is the backdrop of the smaller area you are in. It's the same room with different wallpaper.
Not true. Can you access every single point on that map? People have access to flying mounts in WoW on every continent now (ignoring the instances and maybe TB). You also neglected the expansions, particularly outlands and WotLK, whicih contribute immensely to WoW's size.
A truly fair comparison would take all expansions into account for both games and not just cross sections, but totally accessible area.
This is a sequence of characters intended to produce some profound mental effect, but it has failed.
So in todays MMO gaming its good that the tube where you run is thin and long ?
Generation P
Vanguard and GW2 is HUGE
Lucky for us then that it is not "terrible beyond belief." The game is actually quite good as long as you understand that it is not a sandbox and it is not something other than what it is.
Not even close! Idk if we are playing the same MMO, this game is garbage. 2 months it will die just like WARHAMMER did. Played every beta and I have alpha. This game has proven nothing more than to be a second rate WoW clan. Go play WoW if you want a better gaming experience, or just wait for GW2 or SWTOR!
How do you know that GW2 is huge? Is this assumption or fact? If fact, where is this information? I have seen the maps, etc, but nothing that indicates that the game is huge or comparable in size to WOW or other games.
Not coming down on you. I will be getting GW2 so am curious how "huge" it is.
I believe: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/4059687#4059687
It seems to be larger than most of the names on that list.
Edit: The ranger is standing at the upper left corner, north of the bridge it seems, as proven in the Queensdale image.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAh1OHBI4uM&feature=player_detailpage#t=8s
http://www.wiki.guildwars2.com/images/1/17/2010_August_Queensdale.jpg
I am a fan of Rift but lets not lie to people. The World right now is very tiny. Most AAA games have three to fours areas to level for each level. Rift has one area through 35. Each zone is is very tiny which is not bad as Trion decided to make smaller zones with less open spaces. But the world and the amount of content 1-50 is limited compared to other AAA MMOs at launch. Probably 1/4 the size of WoW at lauch. But rift,if successfull, can grow and add zones. so its not a terrible thing. And Rift's focus is not 1-50 but endgame which is a refreshing changed afetr all the games that have released with no endgame.
So its a question of what do you rpefer and is the glas half full or half empty,
You are correct about the getting lost part.
I hate getting lost in an online game I pay money to have fun in. I played Mortal Online for a while thru Beta into launch and that game has no in game map or compass.
There is nothing worse to me than a game that makes finding friends and grouping a tuff experiance.
Also lets talk about content.
A game can be huge but if there is not enuff content the world does not come alive and is basically just huge empty space.
So I will take a game that is a little smaller than original WoW with all zones packed with fun stuff at every turn and an easy grouping system over those other HUGE empty, less group friendly worlds any day of the week.
This world is SOOO not huge. Not like that's a bad thing. I don't really need 3 hour treks of mindnumbing almost random landscape to get somewhere in order to feel like I'm in a large world. But still, in comparison to WoW and LotRO AT LAUNCH, it's a good bit smaller.
Someone mentioned that alot of the perceived non-smallness was due to run speed. Agree with that 100%. It feels like I'm crawling. Even that horse you ride in the starter area runs like they're in slo-mo.
Generally speaking, the populair consensus is that large open worlds are good, instance bad... but in game everyone moans and groans about travel times, "if only there were a way to quickly travel between spots"
My theory is that, give the bigass open world for the people who want to take 3 hour field trips in game, and most likely die or get ganked several times on the way, have their open world, ill take a load screen and a bathroom break or cig break over the 35min real time trip anyday.
and this way you dont need stupid looking mounts.
Would you even consider using something known as map-travel?
You know what guys? Who cares,if it has achievements ill play it
Telling people not to lie, then you lie....pretty nice....Sorry keep on trolling, don't let the truth stop ya!
I find it funny, that people live on here to troll a game they despise....I played a lot of games I don't like, I post once or twice, and I don't troll, then I move on.
It's pretty sad that you guys have nothing better to do, or atleast something you do like....People liking something or being happy with something that upsetting? I know...your just looking out for people...over...and over...and over again...even though its a free beta and people can make up their own mind , people need you on that wall!
It's kinda sad, I don't even think if I paid for a game and a company stole my money I could get that worked up over a game...Let alone one I never spent money on.