Yeah...I think you are partially correct. I am definitely bored of the:
linear questing
instanced battlegrounds with non-changing maps that represent the majority of PvP
reputation grind in the form of "dailies"
boring, unimaginative one-click crafting
grinding the same end-game dungeons to get better gear to grind the same end-game dungeons in heroic mode
If these were just better disguised even, so I wasn't aware I was being led around by the nose, I wouldn't be so bored. But when developers don't even TRY to enhance these it's like they are saying "Well here's the basic MMO. You know what to do." And then I feel like a job lay before me, not an adventure.
I gotta agree here, this formula is pretty easy to recognize these days by an old-timer like myself who has seen it all, and really the ONLY way I could play an MMO with this formula now is if:
1) Something entirely new and exciting is added into the mix. For Rift the attempt at this are the rifts/invasions and was a fine idea, but they didn't take it far enough to make them exciting to me. Right now they are pretty meaningless monster-bashes. There really are lots of cool consequences and/or variations on these that they could have (or maybe will in the future) added to make them more meaningful and fun, but until they do I didn't find them that engaging. If they really focus on this aspect in the future and make it the core of future development improvements, I might check it out again.
2) A really fun and immersive story. I think SWTOR is attempting this approach and we will see if it is good enough to overcome the above tired formula which they are also clearly following. Rift I'm afraid didn't win me over here at all but I don't think they really tried. I think they were putting their eggs in the 1) approach above and a little in the 3) approach below
3) Really mind-blowing advance in graphics. Rift looks good when you are just looking around and is far superior to WoW here for instance, but the character animations I think are nothing special and I think this impacts the feel of combat. Combat just isn't fun enough I think and the animations and animation transitions I think are a big part of this. I think developers need to take a lesson from Blizzard regarding character animations as despite the overall ancient graphic engine the WoW character animations just seem to work.
4) Really engaging PVP. PVP to me in an even simple game can make it work. Hell I still play chess (FICS) because nothing beats the unpredictability and satisfaction of defeating an real living breathing opponent. Rift is in my opinion does not do PVP well at all for several reasons
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind" 1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN 2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
4) Really engaging PVP. PVP to me in an even simple game can make it work. Hell I still play chess (FICS) because nothing beats the unpredictability and satisfaction of defeating an real living breathing opponent. Rift is in my opinion does not do PVP well at all for several reasons
This is what stopped me from buying the game. PvP isn't my main focal point per se but I do enjoy it. I'm a fair weather PvP player. The game simply is incredibly lacking in this area. I still plan on getting the game eventually though but if there would have been more effort put into this area there's a very good chance they would have got me to drop my current game and give this one a go now.
I do think it is a decent game and I am fairly impressed with how Trion is handling matters. Still, while they accomplished enough to keep this game on my radar and following it they did not gain me as a customer. Least until I need a break from my curent mmo anyways.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
The ride to 50 wasn't bad, actually decent. But being at 50 for a while does suck as all you do is the same dungeons just in expert mode and the PvP is very lackluster. So won't be staying.
I do think it is a decent game and I am fairly impressed with how Trion is handling matters. Still, while they accomplished enough to keep this game on my radar and following it they did not gain me as a customer. Least until I need a break from my curent mmo anyways.
Agree here, I saw just enough in the open beta to keep it on my radar, which is one of the reasons you still find me posting in Rift threads on this forum. There really are lots of potential in rifts/invasions that could be very exciting, and if PVP were incorporated better into them that might partially solve that problem too (needs some other fundamental fixes with PVP though as well).
In my opinion Trion needs to dedicate a team that just does nothing but enhance the rift/invasion formula. Not simply tweaking it, but really fundamentally changing how they work, consequences based on them, variations, huge variety of scripted events within them, lots of different branches they can evolve into as you battle them, etc.
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind" 1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN 2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
I do think it is a decent game and I am fairly impressed with how Trion is handling matters. Still, while they accomplished enough to keep this game on my radar and following it they did not gain me as a customer. Least until I need a break from my curent mmo anyways.
Agree here, I saw just enough in the open beta to keep it on my radar, which is one of the reasons you still find me posting in Rift threads on this forum. There really are lots of potential in rifts/invasions that could be very exciting, and if PVP were incorporated better into them that might partially solve that problem too (needs some other fundamental fixes with PVP though as well).
In my opinion Trion needs to dedicate a team that just does nothing but enhance the rift/invasion formula. Not simply tweaking it, but really fundamentally changing how they work, consequences based on them, variations, huge variety of scripted events within them, lots of different branches they can evolve into as you battle them, etc.
The endgame has Rift raids that are very exciting. You can purchase an item that gives you access to these special raids.
PvP is allowed during these rift raids and regular raids and does add a huge element of danger whenever you are trying to do rifts.
They are enhancing the formula behind the scenes and also releasing new content like in this upcomming patch that will add alot more crazy invasion style things going on. It's in the alpha patch notes and should be live next week.
I do think it is a decent game and I am fairly impressed with how Trion is handling matters. Still, while they accomplished enough to keep this game on my radar and following it they did not gain me as a customer. Least until I need a break from my curent mmo anyways.
Agree here, I saw just enough in the open beta to keep it on my radar, which is one of the reasons you still find me posting in Rift threads on this forum. There really are lots of potential in rifts/invasions that could be very exciting, and if PVP were incorporated better into them that might partially solve that problem too (needs some other fundamental fixes with PVP though as well).
In my opinion Trion needs to dedicate a team that just does nothing but enhance the rift/invasion formula. Not simply tweaking it, but really fundamentally changing how they work, consequences based on them, variations, huge variety of scripted events within them, lots of different branches they can evolve into as you battle them, etc.
The endgame has Rift raids that are very exciting. You can purchase an item that gives you access to these special raids.
PvP is allowed during these rift raids and regular raids and does add a huge element of danger whenever you are trying to do rifts.
They are enhancing the formula behind the scenes and also releasing new content like in this upcomming patch that will add alot more crazy invasion style things going on. It's in the alpha patch notes and should be live next week.
I hear ya, but I don't think you totally hear what I am saying. I know about the current rift mechanics: I played them in the beta so I understand what is involved with them and how PVP is incorporated (basically not at all, other than you are allowed to PVP but there is no integration of it into objectives or consequences or how things evolve, etc).
I also read the notes about the alpha patch and didn't see anything that would imply things are any different, other than some unique bosses and drops. Still just monster bashing.
The devs need to get a bit more innovative here in my opinion. They should all get in a room and whiteboard these rifts/invasions. Building the trees of whatif scenarios and how the game dynamics should change based on various scenarios. Right now this tree isn't very involved. 1) Fight monsters. 2A) If win then get loot and fight new monsters or clear rift. 2B) If lose then monsters expand and may briefly take over areas. 2C) You can PVP if you want or cooperate 3) Reset
That really is all that is involved now. I think the devs can do better and I'm hoping they do. I still am MMOless right now while waiting for something new...
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind" 1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN 2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
I'm leaving as soon as I hit lvl 50 with my mage. At the pace that I play I figure will take me at least another month or so. The "dynamic" content is just the same invasions over and over again and as the population thins out I would assume all the lower level zones will be ghost towns in the next several months on my shard the starter areas are already almost deserted unless an invasoin happens which will draw in players to deal with it but at level 27 I'm already doing stuff like solo closing minor rifts as there are no other players around to do so.
I'm sure rift will settle down to a healthy population probably half what it is now and if they do any full expansions I'll probably resub for a month once in a while but I have no interest in playing this long term.
More power to those who love it. I just don't find the game nearly as interesting as I thought I would.
Any company that is willing to be so heavy-handed with the nerfs (both of characters and progression speed) does not make a game that I want to play.
Yes I was a paladin. Yes I am nerfed to oblivion in 1.1
No you can't have my stuff.
You should really wait a few months after release before starting if you feel that way about nerfs. All games nerf a lot just after releasem everyone I ever played around release at least.
If you know stuff like that annoys you always wait 3 months, it will save you both money (no games like FF XIV) and a lot of frustration.
Any company that is willing to be so heavy-handed with the nerfs (both of characters and progression speed) does not make a game that I want to play.
Yes I was a paladin. Yes I am nerfed to oblivion in 1.1
No you can't have my stuff.
I never totally get why people get so upset about this. The alternative is to have poor game balance. Unless of course the developers are absolutely perfect in their balance at launch, but that would be pretty hard to achieve...
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind" 1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN 2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
Actually I was between games when I found Rift. I have played many games going all the way back to the original everquest at release. I am back to between games now. As for nerfs in games -- The main paladin talent is BOP and TTT that works off bop. I wont go into nerfs during beta because they do not count. But I will say that BOP was nerfed by over 50% when they "fixed what was not intended" meaning that they removed AP from the amount that BOP damaged monsters.
I was able to roll with that major slap to the face by stacking block to an obscene level on my character having literally over 750 block by the time the nerf of BOP from 160% to 75% was announced -- another more than halving of the primary power of a paladin.
For those who say "my paladin is fine" I doubt you have gone and played on the alpha server to see just what it did to the paladins. This second major nerf during just the first month of play guts the class. Not only does it not manage to do well against melee monsters anymore -- but it makes it so it is very hard to hold aggro in dungeons. It also doesnt address that paladins truly stink and always have stunk against any monster with a blue bar(mage mobs).
There is simply no reason whatsoever to play a primary paladin build in 1.1. Yes you can fool around with other builds and probably manage to make a semi-viable tank in the warrior tree that only has a few points of paladin but I fail to see the point in it. I already changed my build around tightening it as much as was possible after the first nerf. I simply do not trust trion that any build I come up with that is capable wont also be nerfed into the ground. Plus I am uncertain with the other nerfs to tanks in the warrior tree that a tank build is even possible in 1.1 that is even close to tank builds possible in other trees.
I have no will to play dps and no matter what build I chose I would have to do a complete refit of all of my equipment to change builds as all of my equipment has block on it and sacrifices much to stack block.
The other thing that went on was the reduction of the faction gains for doing dailies. That combined with the reduction in plaques for killing bosses and completing dungeons made me believe that all trion wants to do is draw things out and make it take longer to gear especially a warrior tank (who actually has the hardest time gearing of any class as you need to stack toughness to tank). I do not like doing the same dungeon over and over and over and that is what this change accomplishes.
----
Paladins were drawn and quartered literally. I have been through some big nerfs throughout time (I started with a druid all the way back in EQ1 and then an iksar shaman when Kunark rolled by -- so I saw them take a special note of my choice and hurt it accordingly) but never in any game have I seen them reduce the power of a character by so very much as they have here.
Thing is also -- it wasnt warrented -- nobody killed slower than I did -- the only thing I could do was handle more melee monsters at one time than them. But a dps spec could kill 2 invasions as rapidly as I could aoe down one -- albeit they would have to pick off each monster one at a time.
Paladins served their role as melee monster tanks quite well -- but that ended. And I do not want to kill the memory of the character nor do I want to deal with the pattern that Trion has set in the time of Rifts existance. (x synergy in beta, x dps of paladin x survivability of paladin x dps of paladin again x survivability of paladin again)
I tend to vote with my feet in the face of this level of change.
* Touch of Life: Now continues cooldown timer on logout.
* Balance of Power: Now deals 25-75% of weapon damage.
* Aegis of Salvation: Ranks 1 and 2 have their cooldowns changed to 1.5 seconds to match with other buffs.
* Reverent Protection: Now only affects up to 5 targets, and range increased from 10 meters to 35 meters.
Nope thats a balance pass on what was an obvious must have EZ mode talent. Still a great talent, but now you might actually need to bring a healer. Reaver also had their self healing reduced. If you have trouble with casters, play with the other souls. The whole point of Rift is that you can play a role without being pegged into one class.
I left Rift about about 20 minutes. I felt like I was playing WoW, and I left WoW because it is a terrible game now.
I most certainly was still in Azeroth.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
* Touch of Life: Now continues cooldown timer on logout.
* Balance of Power: Now deals 25-75% of weapon damage.
* Aegis of Salvation: Ranks 1 and 2 have their cooldowns changed to 1.5 seconds to match with other buffs.
* Reverent Protection: Now only affects up to 5 targets, and range increased from 10 meters to 35 meters.
Nope thats a balance pass on what was an obvious must have EZ mode talent. Still a great talent, but now you might actually need to bring a healer. Reaver also had their self healing reduced. If you have trouble with casters, play with the other souls. The whole point of Rift is that you can a role without being pegged into one class.
Yep that's what I was thinking, you can still swap sould and complete specs for near to no cost or effort.
If the paladin gets nerfed, well, screw the paladin, just swap to any other soul in the warrior calling; Warrior souls are more than competetive anyways. I'd understand all the hassle if you were stuck to one class and it gets the nerfbat. But in Rift you're stuck to a general mechanic and can always choose from 8 classes. Even mages have combinations that kinda work at levels 30 and up, although they have a hard time competing in PvP.
M
EDIT: I wanted to yell 'Nobody needs players who pick PALADIN archetypes anyways!!111', but well, you know, as I never pick tank classes you could exchange Paladin for any melee-plate class. I want my opponents to bite their keyboard while hanging in stunlock for 60 seconds, bringing death would be too easy
Any company that is willing to be so heavy-handed with the nerfs (both of characters and progression speed) does not make a game that I want to play.
Yes I was a paladin. Yes I am nerfed to oblivion in 1.1
No you can't have my stuff.
In this game there is no reason to leave if your soul of choice is hit by the nerf bat.
It takes 4 days from HC player, 2 weeks from Power player and 2 Mo from normal player to level to 50. And because the game has only 4 classes you can level every class to 50 and choose to play the FOTM all the time.
I started cleric because it seemed like a lot of fun in betas. Lately I found out it sucks in warfronts once you hit 40-49 bracket and I ditched it and started a rogue. Saboteur soul is so LoL to play compared to Justicar :P.
What I'm trying to say is you don't have to settle for certain character or class in this game but selfishly play the OP class all the time because it's no effort to level a character to cap.
P.S. I couldn't care less about PvE, all I care about is how much fun I'm having in PvP. Be it warfront or Rift's lame ORvR.
Almost everybody I know in game hasn't even looked back. Starting the 30th they are having a week long world event with unique drops and gear, plus adding new content. I'm not going anywhere.
Same had a few friend old legion/guild mates from WoW/AION/and some F2P games i played and each one of them are still playing, almost all of them higher lvls then myself.. I'd be playing a lot more if it wasn't for work but im still havin a blast.. I'll be stickin with Rift until SWTOR, i can already see that.. Trion is a great company and i'd love to support them.
This is exactly how I feel, I am not going anywhere.
Out of every 100 men, 10 should not be there, 80 are nothing but targets, 9 are the real fighters. Ah, but one, ONE of them is a warrior, and he will bring the others home. -Heraclitus 500BC
Have not tried Rift although it sounds interesting, just don't have time for all the games One thing that makes me laugh is how players get so angry when these companies attempt to retain players and actually turn a profit. Sure, there are greedy companies out there but it is well known that most MMO's lose a large number after the first month of launch. There is one fact that most companies apply when the player base grows...and that is expansion and additional content. So many players disgregard the fact that these companies must make a profit to sustain the game....when they don't; Tabula Rasa happens
Trion is stamping out builds that don't fit the traditional mold for each calling. There are some arguably over powered builds they haven't touched or have actually buffed, because they fall with in the narrow imagining of what a Warrior, Cleric, Mage or Rogue "should" be able to do.
They are basically taking away what made the game unique and are morphing it into what the critics had initially claimed it to be, "a clone game with a class system that only offers the illusion of choice".
I also agree with a poster a few posts up. The desire to keep playing the game doesn't just suffer from seeing your build nerfed. It comes from the knowledge that Trion will systematically identify and kill all the powerful or creative builds people will come up with, (with a few eceptions that become exemplars of the old, stagnant class roles), until (almost) everyone sucks equally and you end up with a game that might as well just have four pre-built classes.
Just adjust? Knowing that if you find anything that pushes the curve, it will be squashed as well? No thank you.
To be clear, we are not talking about careful adjustments to tweak builds that might be a little too far beyond an acceptable curve. What they are doing is finding these builds and making changes that don't make targeted adjustments, but rather destroy them completely.
I guess it's easier to balance the game when you eliminate synergistic skills entirely, but then you arrive at the point where the Soul System is truly just gimmick, trying to obscure that the game's classes are just like every other Fantasy MMORPG out there.
BTW, it's hard to believe that the Alpha testers, who had access to the full content while the game was in development, didn't come up with many of these same builds or that the devs didn't understand all these synergies existed. I think they probably knew and understood, but decided to save the "redesign" until after launch, so that the Soul System could serve it's purpose as "gimmick".
Either that, or they are just completely spineless and have decided to abandon their core game design because a vocal minority couldn't stand builds that could be good at something typically reserved for another class in "traditional" MMORPGs.
Have not tried Rift although it sounds interesting, just don't have time for all the games One thing that makes me laugh is how players get so angry when these companies attempt to retain players and actually turn a profit. Sure, there are greedy companies out there but it is well known that most MMO's lose a large number after the first month of launch. There is one fact that most companies apply when the player base grows...and that is expansion and additional content. So many players disgregard the fact that these companies must make a profit to sustain the game....when they don't; Tabula Rasa happens
No, we get angry when a company manages the first hurdle and actually launches with a decent game, only to kill it via ineptitude at post launch development. It used to be that the mistake continually repeated was to kill a game by launching it in sad shape. Now, things usually launch ok, but are killed by changes made during the first 3 months post launch.
The most common victim is creative game design that challanges players to break out of their rigid pre-conceptions. Some people get angry when game design does something new or different and you invariably see a lot of post launch whining attacking those elements of the game. It seems that no matter how elegant or well thought out these design elements might be, it doesn't take much pressure for the devs to completely abandon their own design and slowly destroy the foundations of their own game.
Making adjustments to retain players and turn profits? Show me the titles in the last few years where knee-jerk, ham fisted, whiner inspired changes have improved a game's subscription numbers and profits.
Comments
I gotta agree here, this formula is pretty easy to recognize these days by an old-timer like myself who has seen it all, and really the ONLY way I could play an MMO with this formula now is if:
1) Something entirely new and exciting is added into the mix. For Rift the attempt at this are the rifts/invasions and was a fine idea, but they didn't take it far enough to make them exciting to me. Right now they are pretty meaningless monster-bashes. There really are lots of cool consequences and/or variations on these that they could have (or maybe will in the future) added to make them more meaningful and fun, but until they do I didn't find them that engaging. If they really focus on this aspect in the future and make it the core of future development improvements, I might check it out again.
2) A really fun and immersive story. I think SWTOR is attempting this approach and we will see if it is good enough to overcome the above tired formula which they are also clearly following. Rift I'm afraid didn't win me over here at all but I don't think they really tried. I think they were putting their eggs in the 1) approach above and a little in the 3) approach below
3) Really mind-blowing advance in graphics. Rift looks good when you are just looking around and is far superior to WoW here for instance, but the character animations I think are nothing special and I think this impacts the feel of combat. Combat just isn't fun enough I think and the animations and animation transitions I think are a big part of this. I think developers need to take a lesson from Blizzard regarding character animations as despite the overall ancient graphic engine the WoW character animations just seem to work.
4) Really engaging PVP. PVP to me in an even simple game can make it work. Hell I still play chess (FICS) because nothing beats the unpredictability and satisfaction of defeating an real living breathing opponent. Rift is in my opinion does not do PVP well at all for several reasons
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
This is what stopped me from buying the game. PvP isn't my main focal point per se but I do enjoy it. I'm a fair weather PvP player. The game simply is incredibly lacking in this area. I still plan on getting the game eventually though but if there would have been more effort put into this area there's a very good chance they would have got me to drop my current game and give this one a go now.
I do think it is a decent game and I am fairly impressed with how Trion is handling matters. Still, while they accomplished enough to keep this game on my radar and following it they did not gain me as a customer. Least until I need a break from my curent mmo anyways.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
The ride to 50 wasn't bad, actually decent. But being at 50 for a while does suck as all you do is the same dungeons just in expert mode and the PvP is very lackluster. So won't be staying.
Agree here, I saw just enough in the open beta to keep it on my radar, which is one of the reasons you still find me posting in Rift threads on this forum. There really are lots of potential in rifts/invasions that could be very exciting, and if PVP were incorporated better into them that might partially solve that problem too (needs some other fundamental fixes with PVP though as well).
In my opinion Trion needs to dedicate a team that just does nothing but enhance the rift/invasion formula. Not simply tweaking it, but really fundamentally changing how they work, consequences based on them, variations, huge variety of scripted events within them, lots of different branches they can evolve into as you battle them, etc.
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
Haven't tried Rift yet myself.
same here. looking to future releases if they bring something different wich ofc rift did aswell not enough tho.
going back to wow is fail for whoever does that. move on ppl.
The endgame has Rift raids that are very exciting. You can purchase an item that gives you access to these special raids.
PvP is allowed during these rift raids and regular raids and does add a huge element of danger whenever you are trying to do rifts.
They are enhancing the formula behind the scenes and also releasing new content like in this upcomming patch that will add alot more crazy invasion style things going on. It's in the alpha patch notes and should be live next week.
Wonder how many people who voted actually play the game
If GM had kept up with technology like the computer industry has, we would all be driving $25 cars that got 1000 MPG - Bill Gates
I`m staying with Rift. The game is fun, and that is what it is all about to me.
I hear ya, but I don't think you totally hear what I am saying. I know about the current rift mechanics: I played them in the beta so I understand what is involved with them and how PVP is incorporated (basically not at all, other than you are allowed to PVP but there is no integration of it into objectives or consequences or how things evolve, etc).
I also read the notes about the alpha patch and didn't see anything that would imply things are any different, other than some unique bosses and drops. Still just monster bashing.
The devs need to get a bit more innovative here in my opinion. They should all get in a room and whiteboard these rifts/invasions. Building the trees of whatif scenarios and how the game dynamics should change based on various scenarios. Right now this tree isn't very involved. 1) Fight monsters. 2A) If win then get loot and fight new monsters or clear rift. 2B) If lose then monsters expand and may briefly take over areas. 2C) You can PVP if you want or cooperate 3) Reset
That really is all that is involved now. I think the devs can do better and I'm hoping they do. I still am MMOless right now while waiting for something new...
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
I'm leaving as soon as I hit lvl 50 with my mage. At the pace that I play I figure will take me at least another month or so. The "dynamic" content is just the same invasions over and over again and as the population thins out I would assume all the lower level zones will be ghost towns in the next several months on my shard the starter areas are already almost deserted unless an invasoin happens which will draw in players to deal with it but at level 27 I'm already doing stuff like solo closing minor rifts as there are no other players around to do so.
I'm sure rift will settle down to a healthy population probably half what it is now and if they do any full expansions I'll probably resub for a month once in a while but I have no interest in playing this long term.
More power to those who love it. I just don't find the game nearly as interesting as I thought I would.
I left recently.
Any company that is willing to be so heavy-handed with the nerfs (both of characters and progression speed) does not make a game that I want to play.
Yes I was a paladin. Yes I am nerfed to oblivion in 1.1
No you can't have my stuff.
This would make more sense if the changes had gone live and not still on the Alpha server.
You should really wait a few months after release before starting if you feel that way about nerfs. All games nerf a lot just after releasem everyone I ever played around release at least.
If you know stuff like that annoys you always wait 3 months, it will save you both money (no games like FF XIV) and a lot of frustration.
I never totally get why people get so upset about this. The alternative is to have poor game balance. Unless of course the developers are absolutely perfect in their balance at launch, but that would be pretty hard to achieve...
GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
2) Mystic Chests = Crass in-game cash shop advertisements
Good one, bad player going back to wow easy mode.
Actually I was between games when I found Rift. I have played many games going all the way back to the original everquest at release. I am back to between games now. As for nerfs in games -- The main paladin talent is BOP and TTT that works off bop. I wont go into nerfs during beta because they do not count. But I will say that BOP was nerfed by over 50% when they "fixed what was not intended" meaning that they removed AP from the amount that BOP damaged monsters.
I was able to roll with that major slap to the face by stacking block to an obscene level on my character having literally over 750 block by the time the nerf of BOP from 160% to 75% was announced -- another more than halving of the primary power of a paladin.
For those who say "my paladin is fine" I doubt you have gone and played on the alpha server to see just what it did to the paladins. This second major nerf during just the first month of play guts the class. Not only does it not manage to do well against melee monsters anymore -- but it makes it so it is very hard to hold aggro in dungeons. It also doesnt address that paladins truly stink and always have stunk against any monster with a blue bar(mage mobs).
There is simply no reason whatsoever to play a primary paladin build in 1.1. Yes you can fool around with other builds and probably manage to make a semi-viable tank in the warrior tree that only has a few points of paladin but I fail to see the point in it. I already changed my build around tightening it as much as was possible after the first nerf. I simply do not trust trion that any build I come up with that is capable wont also be nerfed into the ground. Plus I am uncertain with the other nerfs to tanks in the warrior tree that a tank build is even possible in 1.1 that is even close to tank builds possible in other trees.
I have no will to play dps and no matter what build I chose I would have to do a complete refit of all of my equipment to change builds as all of my equipment has block on it and sacrifices much to stack block.
The other thing that went on was the reduction of the faction gains for doing dailies. That combined with the reduction in plaques for killing bosses and completing dungeons made me believe that all trion wants to do is draw things out and make it take longer to gear especially a warrior tank (who actually has the hardest time gearing of any class as you need to stack toughness to tank). I do not like doing the same dungeon over and over and over and that is what this change accomplishes.
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Paladins were drawn and quartered literally. I have been through some big nerfs throughout time (I started with a druid all the way back in EQ1 and then an iksar shaman when Kunark rolled by -- so I saw them take a special note of my choice and hurt it accordingly) but never in any game have I seen them reduce the power of a character by so very much as they have here.
Thing is also -- it wasnt warrented -- nobody killed slower than I did -- the only thing I could do was handle more melee monsters at one time than them. But a dps spec could kill 2 invasions as rapidly as I could aoe down one -- albeit they would have to pick off each monster one at a time.
Paladins served their role as melee monster tanks quite well -- but that ended. And I do not want to kill the memory of the character nor do I want to deal with the pattern that Trion has set in the time of Rifts existance. (x synergy in beta, x dps of paladin x survivability of paladin x dps of paladin again x survivability of paladin again)
I tend to vote with my feet in the face of this level of change.
PALADIN
* Touch of Life: Now continues cooldown timer on logout.
* Balance of Power: Now deals 25-75% of weapon damage.
* Aegis of Salvation: Ranks 1 and 2 have their cooldowns changed to 1.5 seconds to match with other buffs.
* Reverent Protection: Now only affects up to 5 targets, and range increased from 10 meters to 35 meters.
Nope thats a balance pass on what was an obvious must have EZ mode talent. Still a great talent, but now you might actually need to bring a healer. Reaver also had their self healing reduced. If you have trouble with casters, play with the other souls. The whole point of Rift is that you can play a role without being pegged into one class.
I left Rift about about 20 minutes. I felt like I was playing WoW, and I left WoW because it is a terrible game now.
I most certainly was still in Azeroth.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
WTF? No subscription fee?
Yep that's what I was thinking, you can still swap sould and complete specs for near to no cost or effort.
If the paladin gets nerfed, well, screw the paladin, just swap to any other soul in the warrior calling; Warrior souls are more than competetive anyways. I'd understand all the hassle if you were stuck to one class and it gets the nerfbat. But in Rift you're stuck to a general mechanic and can always choose from 8 classes. Even mages have combinations that kinda work at levels 30 and up, although they have a hard time competing in PvP.
M
EDIT: I wanted to yell 'Nobody needs players who pick PALADIN archetypes anyways!!111', but well, you know, as I never pick tank classes you could exchange Paladin for any melee-plate class. I want my opponents to bite their keyboard while hanging in stunlock for 60 seconds, bringing death would be too easy
In this game there is no reason to leave if your soul of choice is hit by the nerf bat.
It takes 4 days from HC player, 2 weeks from Power player and 2 Mo from normal player to level to 50. And because the game has only 4 classes you can level every class to 50 and choose to play the FOTM all the time.
I started cleric because it seemed like a lot of fun in betas. Lately I found out it sucks in warfronts once you hit 40-49 bracket and I ditched it and started a rogue. Saboteur soul is so LoL to play compared to Justicar :P.
What I'm trying to say is you don't have to settle for certain character or class in this game but selfishly play the OP class all the time because it's no effort to level a character to cap.
P.S. I couldn't care less about PvE, all I care about is how much fun I'm having in PvP. Be it warfront or Rift's lame ORvR.
This is exactly how I feel, I am not going anywhere.
Out of every 100 men, 10 should not be there,
80 are nothing but targets, 9 are the real fighters.
Ah, but one, ONE of them is a warrior,
and he will bring the others home.
-Heraclitus 500BC
Have not tried Rift although it sounds interesting, just don't have time for all the games
One thing that makes me laugh is how players get so angry when these companies attempt to retain players and actually turn a profit. Sure, there are greedy companies out there but it is well known that most MMO's lose a large number after the first month of launch. There is one fact that most companies apply when the player base grows...and that is expansion and additional content. So many players disgregard the fact that these companies must make a profit to sustain the game....when they don't; Tabula Rasa happens 
Trion is stamping out builds that don't fit the traditional mold for each calling. There are some arguably over powered builds they haven't touched or have actually buffed, because they fall with in the narrow imagining of what a Warrior, Cleric, Mage or Rogue "should" be able to do.
They are basically taking away what made the game unique and are morphing it into what the critics had initially claimed it to be, "a clone game with a class system that only offers the illusion of choice".
I also agree with a poster a few posts up. The desire to keep playing the game doesn't just suffer from seeing your build nerfed. It comes from the knowledge that Trion will systematically identify and kill all the powerful or creative builds people will come up with, (with a few eceptions that become exemplars of the old, stagnant class roles), until (almost) everyone sucks equally and you end up with a game that might as well just have four pre-built classes.
Just adjust? Knowing that if you find anything that pushes the curve, it will be squashed as well? No thank you.
To be clear, we are not talking about careful adjustments to tweak builds that might be a little too far beyond an acceptable curve. What they are doing is finding these builds and making changes that don't make targeted adjustments, but rather destroy them completely.
I guess it's easier to balance the game when you eliminate synergistic skills entirely, but then you arrive at the point where the Soul System is truly just gimmick, trying to obscure that the game's classes are just like every other Fantasy MMORPG out there.
BTW, it's hard to believe that the Alpha testers, who had access to the full content while the game was in development, didn't come up with many of these same builds or that the devs didn't understand all these synergies existed. I think they probably knew and understood, but decided to save the "redesign" until after launch, so that the Soul System could serve it's purpose as "gimmick".
Either that, or they are just completely spineless and have decided to abandon their core game design because a vocal minority couldn't stand builds that could be good at something typically reserved for another class in "traditional" MMORPGs.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
No, we get angry when a company manages the first hurdle and actually launches with a decent game, only to kill it via ineptitude at post launch development. It used to be that the mistake continually repeated was to kill a game by launching it in sad shape. Now, things usually launch ok, but are killed by changes made during the first 3 months post launch.
The most common victim is creative game design that challanges players to break out of their rigid pre-conceptions. Some people get angry when game design does something new or different and you invariably see a lot of post launch whining attacking those elements of the game. It seems that no matter how elegant or well thought out these design elements might be, it doesn't take much pressure for the devs to completely abandon their own design and slowly destroy the foundations of their own game.
Making adjustments to retain players and turn profits? Show me the titles in the last few years where knee-jerk, ham fisted, whiner inspired changes have improved a game's subscription numbers and profits.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
