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Star Wars: The Old Republic: Appearance Tab Redux - Modifying Armor
SBFord
Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
The Star Wars: The Old Republic site has been home to many spirited conversations. Chief among them is a 20,000+ series of posts about the lack of an appearance tab shipping with the game. In today's SWTOR column, MMORPG.com Community Manager Mike Bitton takes another look at the discussion and offers a few thoughts. Be sure to leave us a few of your thoughts in the comments when you're finished.
I’ve personally lamented the lack of appearance tab in at least one of my columns so far. You see, I’m one of those vain players who don’t want to look like everyone else, and I also loathe the idea of having to compromise form for function. It’s 2011, and damn it, I should be able to kick-ass and look good doing it! This is especially true for a game that wants me to feel heroic. While BioWare won’t budge on an official appearance tab, they have a different system in place that allows players to modify armor. We’ve known about this system for some time, but over the past year we’ve learned that it may just be serious enough to accomplish the same goal as an appearance tab while also adding some fun layers to gameplay.
Read more of Mike Bitton's Star Wars: The Old Republic: Appearance Tab Redux - Modifying Armor.
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Comments
I would like to see the appearance tab included for release. I think it offers players just what they are looking for and desire. Not to say that the developers ideas for gear that you can use from start to end is not a bad idea and I like it a lot. I just think that the appearance tab will give that personal touch that players crave.
It doesn't look like something that would take thousands of hours to code or anything...and if their playerbase wants it so badly, why not give it to them?
Seems like such an easy way to appease their customers...
I too would like to see the appearance tab added to the game before launch. After playing City of Heroes with the amazing character customization that game has just for faces/body/hair, I have a hard time accepting games giving me less. If they can't do some sort of appearance tab though, how about putting in some way to dye our armor? Maybe the mods you add to it changes your overall look? It would only be small things, but the little things help.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Meh... I think most people are simply worried about customization and not looking the same as everyone else as is the case in most games, especially with "Tier x" gear.
Furthermore, I think everyone has jumped on the appearance tab bandwagon and think it's the only way to achieve "uniqueness". Personally, if they added in a way to dye their armor or maybe change the model via crafting I would be just as happy (even if there would be tons of people running around in all black, 'You' could still be different if you wanted).
Ah wells, BW tends to listen to folks, and if this isn't in on release, it'll be in one of the first patches...
I'm in the need to hear more about this before i make a decision. If they pull this off though and make it possible for you to have any gear that i think this makes a heck of a lot more sense then an appearance tab.
Why? Because in real life (yes i know it's a game guys) you put on the actual clothes, better clothes like suits give more stats (like higher cha) you can't in real life put on PJs go to a meeting and because your real gear is a suit get the comfort of the PJs while the stats (cha bonus) of the suit.
Now in a game i know you can't always apply real life but the less you have to...jump for something to make sense the better. If they can make it where you can equip any piece of armor and the mods dictate how good that piece is then it makes more sense not complete sense mind you but more sense.
As for the line of why create the art for these higher level items? maybe people like the look of them better then the lower level stuff. So people could still want to get it. Some people like really bad arse looking armor, some like the holy look, some like the monk look, some like the begger look. But if all of them can get the stats they want and keep the armor thats even better. It's like merging the appearance tab with the gear tab and getting the best of both worlds.
Assuming of course that this works on all levels. Right now the system sounds good, but until we see how it works in game and get more info...it's impossible really to answer any of these questions. Myself i would like it to work where you can have any piece of armor you want and still be viable.
Just a quick add at the end they did state something about being able to wear cosmetic gear and being able to raid with it (ala the tusken raider outfit).
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
I dunno, WAR has armour dye and you can add trinkets to add a little difference to your look (oops I just had to go back and edit that to put it in the present tense!) but you basically end up looking just like everyone else in your class at your level anyway: the differences are very minimal.
I've spent years playing City of Heroes, so I'm pretty spoiled when it comes to customisation options, and although I don't obsess over it, I make use of appearence tabs in LotRO.
If they do as you say and can actually make a real difference to your appearance, then I'd prefer that method - the 'pretendy clothes' appearnace tab in LotRO works... but I always know it's not what I'm really wearing.
I honestly don't think it's that much of an issue.
And I love all sorts of vanity/appearance/Wardrobe tabs.
From what we have seen, the gear looks great so far so +1 to BioWare for that. Most MMOs have forgettable or clownish starter gear.
I could definitely see BW putting this feature in down the line (Most MMOs don't ship with this sort of thing do they?). I'd recommend hanging on to an item if you really like the look of it!
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
There is also a color matching system in place that they have already told us about. Supposedly you can choose a color from your main chest piece and it will match that to the rest of your attire. This was you will not end up with pink pants, blue armor, and a yellow helmet.
I'd give them the benefit of the doubt. Afterall this is their first MMO so they deserve at least that much leeway. However, if it doesn't provide the desired level of individuality that the customers want, you'll see an Appearence Tab pretty darn quickly.
As others have said, it's something that has been done a few times before and it's not like the programmers at bioware don't know how to do it. Right now they are just being stubborn about doing it because they want to just "do things their way" and for us to "give it a try" even though more than a significant represenatation of the future customer base has told them what they want.
As I said in another post recently, it's one of those things where I say "Okay, but as I know what I want/like (i.e., Appearence Tab), I'll give your way a try. But you better "woah!!!!" the heck out of me with it."
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
Give us an appearance tab!
www.90and9.net
www.prophecymma.com
I would like to see an appearance tab also. I wouldnt be surprised if they are going to work it in after the game releases. They need to make sure the game is polished 1st before adding extras. AIon did a pretty good job of being able to modify your armor's appearance for a certain look. Hope Bioware implements this or something like it.
***Raving Rabbid wonders what will become of Ahsoka Tano in the Clone wars series!***
All my opinions are just that..opinions. If you like my opinions..coolness.If you dont like my opinion....I really dont care.
Playing: ESO, WOT, Smite, and Marvel Heroes
Personally, I hate the appearance tab... when I get my ass kicked in PvP I like it to be by someone in proper armour and not some asshat in a clown suit.
After coming back recently to RIFT which has an appearance tab, didn't before when I played at launch..
I don't know how I'd live without it.
Hopefully the modification/upgrade system is good enough to be a proper substitute for an appearance tab. It's not quite a deal-breaker for me, but my oh my does it go a LONG way in helping me really like my character and thusly invest into the game ane the world.
I don't really understand the reasoning of not putting it in if a post has been recreated 20 times. Then again Blizzard's boards had a very long thread on a female trade prince(cess?) and what did they get? And evil backstabbing trade price who as far as I know got away with screwing players over XD. So ya never know, maybe they will add apperence tabs, maybe they wont.
I belong to the apparent minority that has no need for an Appearance Tab.
When I play my games I love seing how my character slowly grows in power.
Not only with the number and variety of skills he will get, but also the look.
As a trooper I expect to start with the most basic padding to my training suit and slowly gather heavier and heavier armor and weapons, to eventually look like a freaking Behemot!
To my experience the ugly and unmatching gear only comes at a very early stage of a game, but as it progress, weather you get it from quests or you craft your own gear, the way you look starts making a lot of sense.
But that's just me.
Wow...the world may be ending next year afterall. I remember you being on board with this game a year or 3 back and it was me not going to play it. Now it seems you aren't in and, lol, I've already pre-ordered. Though, I've only pre-ordered to get a first hand look at crafting and to play Huttball (maybe some open world PvP too).
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
At this point in time an appearance tab is just an essential for all MMO's. The time needed to invest in it is far less than the time needed to create either new art assest to make end game appearances more diverse or less than the time needed to balance the idea of upgrading lower level gear. Appearance tabs are a simple and necessary solution to the "clone wars" problem all MMO's face.
Appearance tabs are a must for MMO's these days, It's the only way to diversify your character from others of your class in many cases and represents a reality of people who look and dress how they feel. We should never be restricted or forced to look alike at level cap.
If it wasn't already obivious, Daniel Erickson has totally soured me on this game.
The irony is "a year or 3 back" you probably thought of me as a yes-man/sycophant, but it was precisely that atmosphere Bioware/EA/LucasArts appears to have cultivated that's turned me off.
Anyhoo, call me a hypocrite, but I've pre-ordered as well. It's f'ing Star Wars. Damn you George Lucas, you've still got me by the balls.
It comes down to function of the system. We have seen a screen shot from Darthhater of a weapon with 3 slots to fill/mod. So are all weapons just 3? Are there different amounts based on rank of the item? Grey has 2, green has 3, blue has 4, purple has 5? Dose the base armor number change with an upgrade? Is it just the stats that get better?
There are a bunch of questions we need answered, and it may not happen until we get our hands on the game post launch. After a dev post about the crits taken away from crafted or mission found items. And the fact that crafted items will have slots instead. It seems like there will be a lot of different gear that will need to have mods. This can open up many options for crafting and the AH with dropped mod peaces.
So it could be much better for the economy to have all gear viable with the right mods. While doing the same thing as an appearance tab. If dropped, crafted and quest gear all can be changed via a mod. Then these mods will be in great demand. And we should have many different sets of gear so we are not clones as was in the OP.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore
^
This is what I'm worried about. It would ruin the RP element of the game should you see people raiding in santa costumes and tux's, or the everpresent bikini bunnies bouncing around and killing things as if they were in heavy armor...
It would have to be done right, where a character could only wear different sets or styles of the same type of armor and not go full-blown crazy anything goes and not be able to even recognize the enemy for what he/she was. Customization is good and all, but I want at least a modicome of realism to it. Such costumes can still be available for RP/fun purposes, but lets leave them out of combat...
How does an appearance tab make this more possible than the normal system of outfit customization? Honestly this is the weakest argument I've ever heard against an appearance tab.
In order to have a "tux" or "bikini" outfit, those art assest have to be present in game, nothing an appearance tab provides allows for that on its own, those assest have to be in the game.
Nah man, you're still cool with me. One of the handful of regulars here that can debate a point without getting personal or taking offense, which I like. Just thought it was kinda weird that now our sides have kinda transposed.
Anyway, I don't like DE either as he has made like comments about crafting as well. He's got a lack of personality that I'd easily have no issue leaving him stranded out in the desert of Tatooine, preferably hanging over the edge of the Sarlaac Pit.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
They weren't in WoW to begin with either, but you can now equip such items, and going by WoW's appearance tab design:
"Appearance Tab - An additional tab in the Character pane in which a character is free to equip items in the body slots (Head, Shoulders, Chest, Shirt, Tabard, Bracers, Gloves, Belt, Pants, Boots, Cape). These items do not contribute stats or armor or any special abilities (+spellpower, agility, etc), and serve only to overwrite the model of the items equipped in the Character pane, customizing the in-game model with whatever look it is you want."
Now, it is logical that down the road, SWTOR as a popular, themepark-oriented game will have fun/holiday/etc. gear for people to mess around with. Should they choose to implement the same appearance tab system, it will result in exactly what I said in my previous post, and thus I pointed out that they would have to put limits on it.
This game will not be WoW, and I don't expect BW to let anything go and completely destroy the lore element as blizzard often does, and so I made my opinion of the system known...
I think RIFT gets it just right - almost.
Has to be same slot, has to be same type of armor, has to be wearable by your character (level/class)
combine it with the 2 layer armor-dying system, magic.
Only problems are-
1. Most of the armor sets for female Guardian Plate are awful lol. Either stupid beastly looking things with horns/spikes or halter tops/bikinis.
GIve me full, metal plate armor that covers the skin and helmets that are not goofy please.
2. I'd like to see it expanded to include weapons and offhands.
Does it really matter if my Sword and Shield look like some fancy fish skeleton and crazy ninja star thing?
I just want a Gladius and Wooden round shield please...