I don´t think this game was so expensive. How much does a Star Wars license cost? How much did it cost Sony? Why was SWG shut down while Vanguard wasn´t?
Are you aware that "well made" is movie industry euphemism for "boring?" If you don't want to hurt someone's feelings and you don't want to be the first to call a turd a turd you say "That is a really well-made movie."
Playing safe and "well-made" never got anyone anywhere in entertainment industry and maybe it's time for the mmo leeches to finally start realizing that.
Maybe also like World of Warcraft you have only two options for end game content... Raiding (pve) and PvP. Nothing else. Just like WoW it seems very soon SWTOR will be getting the mechanics for parsers and with that DPS meters.
In PvP it's easy to spot the guy or gal with no talent, with no skill.... they are the sorry sap taking too many dirt naps.
In Raiding it's pretty much the same, except now everyone will know you suck right away, in your guild at least... since SWTOR appears to have been designed as a Raid-centric MMO.
So what about Players like myself that suck at PvP and absolutley hate Raiding?
Oh yes... Crafting as an end game pursuit... No WAIT.... in SWTOR you need to RAID TO CRAFT TOP TIER. ONLY RAIDERS WILL BE TOP TIER CRAFTERS. Who designed this nonsense?
Yes I think it's Nonsense. Raiders are by default the top tier Players, probably the top 25% of the playerbase or so... and they alone deserve to be the top crafters ingame? I myself feel that about as elitist and snobish as a MMO can get.
So the longer I go without playing SWTOR, the more I am learning about it as more info becomes available.... and the more I am no longer interested in purchasing and playing SWTOR.
I never Raid, and I no longer PvP. Nothing for me to do in SWTOR once I hit level 50. Why Play it?
....
Now with all that said... I did very much enjoy my time in Beta... leveling up... but why purchase a $60 MMO and sub for a month or two and then quit? Better just to find another MMO.
Maybe also like World of Warcraft you have only two options for end game content... Raiding (pve) and PvP. Nothing else. Just like WoW it seems very soon SWTOR will be getting the mechanics for parsers and with that DPS meters.
In PvP it's easy to spot the guy or gal with no talent, with no skill.... they are the sorry sap taking too many dirt naps.
In Raiding it's pretty much the same, except now everyone will know you suck right away, in your guild at least... since SWTOR appears to have been designed as a Raid-centric MMO.
So what about Players like myself that suck at PvP and absolutley hate Raiding?
Oh yes... Crafting as an end game pursuit... No WAIT.... in SWTOR you need to RAID TO CRAFT TOP TIER. ONLY RAIDERS WILL BE TOP TIER CRAFTERS. Who designed this nonsense?
Yes I think it's Nonsense. Raiders are by default the top tier Players, probably the top 25% of the playerbase or so... and they alone deserve to be the top crafters ingame? I myself feel that about as elitist and snobish as a MMO can get.
So the longer I go without playing SWTOR, the more I am learning about it as more info becomes available.... and the more I am no longer interested in purchasing and playing SWTOR.
I never Raid, and I no longer PvP. Nothing for me to do in SWTOR once I hit level 50. Why Play it?
....
Now with all that said... I did very much enjoy my time in Beta... leveling up... but why purchase a $60 MMO and sub for a month or two and then quit? Better just to find another MMO.
In daoc, you could pvp decently without raid gear, just go with your lv 50 stuff and kick some ass, now a days they got spell crafting and such, so maxing your chars stats is just getting playermade gear, so the pvp actually is skill based since everyone pretty much has the same gear, unlike wow, swtor, rift etc where its 90% gear and 10% player skill.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Originally posted by Gardavsshade Maybe also like World of Warcraft you have only two options for end game content... Raiding (pve) and PvP. Nothing else. Just like WoW it seems very soon SWTOR will be getting the mechanics for parsers and with that DPS meters. In PvP it's easy to spot the guy or gal with no talent, with no skill.... they are the sorry sap taking too many dirt naps. In Raiding it's pretty much the same, except now everyone will know you suck right away, in your guild at least... since SWTOR appears to have been designed as a Raid-centric MMO. So what about Players like myself that suck at PvP and absolutley hate Raiding? Oh yes... Crafting as an end game pursuit... No WAIT.... in SWTOR you need to RAID TO CRAFT TOP TIER. ONLY RAIDERS WILL BE TOP TIER CRAFTERS. Who designed this nonsense? Yes I think it's Nonsense. Raiders are by default the top tier Players, probably the top 25% of the playerbase or so... and they alone deserve to be the top crafters ingame? I myself feel that about as elitist and snobish as a MMO can get. So the longer I go without playing SWTOR, the more I am learning about it as more info becomes available.... and the more I am no longer interested in purchasing and playing SWTOR. I never Raid, and I no longer PvP. Nothing for me to do in SWTOR once I hit level 50. Why Play it? .... Now with all that said... I did very much enjoy my time in Beta... leveling up... but why purchase a $60 MMO and sub for a month or two and then quit? Better just to find another MMO.
In daoc, you could pvp decently without raid gear, just go with your lv 50 stuff and kick some ass, now a days they got spell crafting and such, so maxing your chars stats is just getting playermade gear, so the pvp actually is skill based since everyone pretty much has the same gear, unlike wow, swtor, rift etc where its 90% gear and 10% player skill.
Well, this is not exactly true. Templates, Buffbots and 8vs8 ruined MY DAoC. Shortage of healers even when the groups were of 8. Nostalgia is ok, but try to see your point with the eyes of your enemy.
Thats not true. There is a third option at end game other then alts which is the life blood on mmos not end game,
That is the story aspects pve wise for illum to do . I assume when they add a planet to the game it will coem with its own planetary story as well.
so u have the pve story on illum to do as well s pvp, and raid, flashpoints can also be done at end game.
the fact is what do u expect to have at end game that games dont have is something should be asked.
"Illum"?
Not sure what you mean here. I don't text so that is probably the issue.
As for what to do at end game... if you have to ask me the question "what do u expect to have at end game that games dont have"... then you wouldn't understand my answer.
Top tier Crafting in a MMO should never be only for Raiders, or only for PvPers, or some other group, it should be available to all players. As SWTOR is set up it is only for Raiders. Yes everyone can pursue crafting but only Raiders can hit top tier because the mats are Raid drops and Bind On Pickup. That is my complaint.
Maybe also like World of Warcraft you have only two options for end game content... Raiding (pve) and PvP. Nothing else. Just like WoW it seems very soon SWTOR will be getting the mechanics for parsers and with that DPS meters.
In PvP it's easy to spot the guy or gal with no talent, with no skill.... they are the sorry sap taking too many dirt naps.
In Raiding it's pretty much the same, except now everyone will know you suck right away, in your guild at least... since SWTOR appears to have been designed as a Raid-centric MMO.
So what about Players like myself that suck at PvP and absolutley hate Raiding?
Oh yes... Crafting as an end game pursuit... No WAIT.... in SWTOR you need to RAID TO CRAFT TOP TIER. ONLY RAIDERS WILL BE TOP TIER CRAFTERS. Who designed this nonsense?
Yes I think it's Nonsense. Raiders are by default the top tier Players, probably the top 25% of the playerbase or so... and they alone deserve to be the top crafters ingame? I myself feel that about as elitist and snobish as a MMO can get.
So the longer I go without playing SWTOR, the more I am learning about it as more info becomes available.... and the more I am no longer interested in purchasing and playing SWTOR.
I never Raid, and I no longer PvP. Nothing for me to do in SWTOR once I hit level 50. Why Play it?
....
Now with all that said... I did very much enjoy my time in Beta... leveling up... but why purchase a $60 MMO and sub for a month or two and then quit? Better just to find another MMO.
In daoc, you could pvp decently without raid gear, just go with your lv 50 stuff and kick some ass, now a days they got spell crafting and such, so maxing your chars stats is just getting playermade gear, so the pvp actually is skill based since everyone pretty much has the same gear, unlike wow, swtor, rift etc where its 90% gear and 10% player skill.
You miss my point, but you did try to encourage me, +1 and thanks.
Thats not true. There is a third option at end game other then alts which is the life blood on mmos not end game,
That is the story aspects pve wise for illum to do . I assume when they add a planet to the game it will coem with its own planetary story as well.
so u have the pve story on illum to do as well s pvp, and raid, flashpoints can also be done at end game.
the fact is what do u expect to have at end game that games dont have is something should be asked.
"Illum"?
Not sure what you mean here. I don't text so that is probably the issue.
As for what to do at end game... if you have to ask me the question "what do u expect to have at end game that games dont have"... then you wouldn't understand my answer.
Top tier Crafting in a MMO should never be only for Raiders, or only for PvPers, or some other group, it should be available to all players. As SWTOR is set up it is only for Raiders. Yes everyone can pursue crafting but only Raiders can hit top tier because the mats are Raid drops and Bind On Pickup. That is my complaint.
"Illum" is the last planet, its a planet for endgame pve and pvp
Nobody is forcing you to craft, for Pete's sake. It's a gimmick, an optional activity to do on the side if you get bored. There are plenty of good sets of PVP gear sold in shops and it's not like wearing top tier equipment is going to make up for numbers or player skill. Just enjoy what the game offers, and if you don't enjoy one particular aspect you can always choose to take another path.
TOR is well designed but it isn't what many MMO players had hoped for anyways.
Great design is indeed the basic thing you need to get right to make a good game, but TOR is aimed on the Bioware fans, or to be more specific fans of games like Mass effect and Dragon age.
You can make a great game and still dissapoint a lot of people.
I think it actually is good news as long as GW2 and TSW delivers as well. Then people can choose the game that fits them best and hopefully will all the choices be well made (yeah, I might be a bit optimistic with TSW, but heck, it is christmas).
I am not disppointed with SWTOR but i am not a fanboi... i dont shy to burst the bubble if those who over glorify it. It is a decent game and excellent for what it offers... and i know exactly what it offers and its limitations. I like the game.
TOR is well designed but it isn't what many MMO players had hoped for anyways.
Imo, the game is designed will in some cases, but not designed well in others -- which is why you see poeple disapointed.
To actually see why people are disappointed, a reader needs to look past the 'strawman' characterization of anyone that has a critical comment of the game, as a 10 year old spoild brat (just as someone needs to do similar to see why people enjoy the game).
For myself, I am mainly disapointed in what I consider unnecessary short cuts in what was delivered, for example:
Overuse of the Unibody/lack of Racial Diversity
Out dated UI
Generic and Dated Warzone Queue system
Some outdated PvP mechanics (ie AoEs cause flagging)
Linearness of Map
Lack of weapon diversity with in an AC
cheap space game
It is the preponderance of the little things, of things that were standard in other current MMOs that BW seemed to just ignore, that creates the disappointment.
Imo, BW should have had these things covered, as there were not 'unknown' factors, and I am not seeing evidence of how they would be massive involvements to create. As such, I see them as just a decision to ''short cut' or take the easier path, rather than go forward in delivering imo a better qualiy game.
It is like to purchase a the new BMW, only to see that they decided to put in a cheap generic stereo, cloth seating, no blue tooth, basic rims, and not offer any comfort packages. It doesn't mean that the car 'sucks', but simply that its a good car, that is missing a lot of what customers have come to expect from a quality car.
I think for the most part the people that are disappointed are the ones that bought into the SW / BW hype. People that bothered to educate themselves on what the game is either didnt buy into it or knew what they were getting.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
Just because its designed well doesn't mean you'll like it. A well designed plane won't be enjoyed by people who don't like to fly, Clearly Bioware made design choices that some people aren't going to like regardless of how well implemented those designs are.
I don´t think this game was so expensive. How much does a Star Wars license cost? How much did it cost Sony? Why was SWG shut down while Vanguard wasn´t?
I doubt the Star Wars license is prohibitive, Bioware obviously think they will make a profit even with the license on top.
It cost SoE more than they were willing to pay to keep a dying game alive.
SWG required a license renewal, SoE owns the Vanguard IP after they bought out the development team.
This site grew up on the SWG NGE mess. It has far more of the sandbox crowd than many and SWTOR isn't SWG2 made manifest come to save MMOs eveywhere from the devil of theam parks. Even if that wasn't the case it is trendy to show your indie credits by putting what you aren't into down.
If a game is mostly about combat, then the combat had better be good. If the combat is no good, then the game is no good. Voiceovers, companions, dialogue options, and a lot of other such things are really just tinkering around the edges, and can't save a predominantly combat game with poor combat. Polish only matters if the underlying game mechanics are good.
As best as I can tell, Bioware didn't even put any real effort into coming up with a good combat system. If they did, then there's mysteriously no one talking about it. If commentary mentions combat at all, it's mostly to mention in passing that it's the same old generic WoW-clone combat, and then move on to talking about less important stuff.
One of my biggest problems with the game. I simply found the combat gameplay incredibly dull and lackluster.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I hope they fix this because it'll help SWTOR out, I might even play again once this is fixed.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Comments
I don´t think this game was so expensive. How much does a Star Wars license cost? How much did it cost Sony? Why was SWG shut down while Vanguard wasn´t?
to the OP question:
Are you aware that "well made" is movie industry euphemism for "boring?" If you don't want to hurt someone's feelings and you don't want to be the first to call a turd a turd you say "That is a really well-made movie."
Playing safe and "well-made" never got anyone anywhere in entertainment industry and maybe it's time for the mmo leeches to finally start realizing that.
Maybe also like World of Warcraft you have only two options for end game content... Raiding (pve) and PvP. Nothing else. Just like WoW it seems very soon SWTOR will be getting the mechanics for parsers and with that DPS meters.
In PvP it's easy to spot the guy or gal with no talent, with no skill.... they are the sorry sap taking too many dirt naps.
In Raiding it's pretty much the same, except now everyone will know you suck right away, in your guild at least... since SWTOR appears to have been designed as a Raid-centric MMO.
So what about Players like myself that suck at PvP and absolutley hate Raiding?
Oh yes... Crafting as an end game pursuit... No WAIT.... in SWTOR you need to RAID TO CRAFT TOP TIER. ONLY RAIDERS WILL BE TOP TIER CRAFTERS. Who designed this nonsense?
Yes I think it's Nonsense. Raiders are by default the top tier Players, probably the top 25% of the playerbase or so... and they alone deserve to be the top crafters ingame? I myself feel that about as elitist and snobish as a MMO can get.
So the longer I go without playing SWTOR, the more I am learning about it as more info becomes available.... and the more I am no longer interested in purchasing and playing SWTOR.
I never Raid, and I no longer PvP. Nothing for me to do in SWTOR once I hit level 50. Why Play it?
....
Now with all that said... I did very much enjoy my time in Beta... leveling up... but why purchase a $60 MMO and sub for a month or two and then quit? Better just to find another MMO.
Thats not true. There is a third option at end game other then alts which is the life blood on mmos not end game,
That is the story aspects pve wise for illum to do . I assume when they add a planet to the game it will coem with its own planetary story as well.
so u have the pve story on illum to do as well s pvp, and raid, flashpoints can also be done at end game.
the fact is what do u expect to have at end game that games dont have is something should be asked.
In daoc, you could pvp decently without raid gear, just go with your lv 50 stuff and kick some ass, now a days they got spell crafting and such, so maxing your chars stats is just getting playermade gear, so the pvp actually is skill based since everyone pretty much has the same gear, unlike wow, swtor, rift etc where its 90% gear and 10% player skill.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!
Templates, Buffbots and 8vs8 ruined MY DAoC.
Shortage of healers even when the groups were of 8. Nostalgia is ok, but try to see your point with the eyes of your enemy.
"Illum"?
Not sure what you mean here. I don't text so that is probably the issue.
As for what to do at end game... if you have to ask me the question "what do u expect to have at end game that games dont have"... then you wouldn't understand my answer.
Top tier Crafting in a MMO should never be only for Raiders, or only for PvPers, or some other group, it should be available to all players. As SWTOR is set up it is only for Raiders. Yes everyone can pursue crafting but only Raiders can hit top tier because the mats are Raid drops and Bind On Pickup. That is my complaint.
You miss my point, but you did try to encourage me, +1 and thanks.
I feel the same way. I almost gave up on the idea of mmorpgs until Bioware started making TOR.
"Illum" is the last planet, its a planet for endgame pve and pvp
Majority of players dont RP anymore these days, I mean truly RP. Not what the game tells you how. Scripted events, etc.
Nobody is forcing you to craft, for Pete's sake. It's a gimmick, an optional activity to do on the side if you get bored. There are plenty of good sets of PVP gear sold in shops and it's not like wearing top tier equipment is going to make up for numbers or player skill. Just enjoy what the game offers, and if you don't enjoy one particular aspect you can always choose to take another path.
TOR is well designed but it isn't what many MMO players had hoped for anyways.
Great design is indeed the basic thing you need to get right to make a good game, but TOR is aimed on the Bioware fans, or to be more specific fans of games like Mass effect and Dragon age.
You can make a great game and still dissapoint a lot of people.
I think it actually is good news as long as GW2 and TSW delivers as well. Then people can choose the game that fits them best and hopefully will all the choices be well made (yeah, I might be a bit optimistic with TSW, but heck, it is christmas).
Imo, the game is designed will in some cases, but not designed well in others -- which is why you see poeple disapointed.
To actually see why people are disappointed, a reader needs to look past the 'strawman' characterization of anyone that has a critical comment of the game, as a 10 year old spoild brat (just as someone needs to do similar to see why people enjoy the game).
For myself, I am mainly disapointed in what I consider unnecessary short cuts in what was delivered, for example:
Overuse of the Unibody/lack of Racial Diversity
Out dated UI
Generic and Dated Warzone Queue system
Some outdated PvP mechanics (ie AoEs cause flagging)
Linearness of Map
Lack of weapon diversity with in an AC
cheap space game
It is the preponderance of the little things, of things that were standard in other current MMOs that BW seemed to just ignore, that creates the disappointment.
Imo, BW should have had these things covered, as there were not 'unknown' factors, and I am not seeing evidence of how they would be massive involvements to create. As such, I see them as just a decision to ''short cut' or take the easier path, rather than go forward in delivering imo a better qualiy game.
It is like to purchase a the new BMW, only to see that they decided to put in a cheap generic stereo, cloth seating, no blue tooth, basic rims, and not offer any comfort packages. It doesn't mean that the car 'sucks', but simply that its a good car, that is missing a lot of what customers have come to expect from a quality car.
I think for the most part the people that are disappointed are the ones that bought into the SW / BW hype. People that bothered to educate themselves on what the game is either didnt buy into it or knew what they were getting.
Really? This game sucks and Im not having fun? Im going to unsub right now. Thanks for the tip.
Just because its designed well doesn't mean you'll like it. A well designed plane won't be enjoyed by people who don't like to fly, Clearly Bioware made design choices that some people aren't going to like regardless of how well implemented those designs are.
I doubt the Star Wars license is prohibitive, Bioware obviously think they will make a profit even with the license on top.
It cost SoE more than they were willing to pay to keep a dying game alive.
SWG required a license renewal, SoE owns the Vanguard IP after they bought out the development team.
To answer the OP a simple am not .
good day
Disappointment comes from expectation, expectation leads to the dark side...
------- END TRANSMISSION
One of my biggest problems with the game. I simply found the combat gameplay incredibly dull and lackluster.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Design you say?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azzv3DTQgyQ&feature=autoplay&list=LLqQ3TeIad3NePDecJ35_pXQ&lf=mh_lolz&playnext=1
I hope they fix this because it'll help SWTOR out, I might even play again once this is fixed.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Many people? the correct sentence is, so few people.