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The reason this genre is failing....
nikoliath
Member UncommonPosts: 1,154
....is due to the fact that all the industry experts seem to hang out in forums. It seems many of them know better but instead of doing their work they spend endless hours telling everyone how much game "A" sucks and should have been made in format "x".
We have an abundance, nay over abundance of hardened industry veterans who lament the failings of the genre. Why punish us, go forth and create!
We have hundreds or market anylists that are able to "predict" what will happen and when. They tell us what is and isn't popular and why it isn't popular and like nothing more than rubbing our noses in our own ignorant filth. And yet none of these folks seem to return to their offices and continue the work they surely started before this industry wide "talent strike" took place.
There are game engine experts here that seem able to bemoan a developers choice in engine and go into lengthy detail, accurate we assume, about what said engine can and cannot do. Please, I beg of you, go back to work and make us your masterpiece so that we, the great unwashed can enjoy the fruits of your labour.
Amongst us there are hardened team leaders that know how to encourage and nuture a team of developers to create nearly a decades worth of content and new never before seen features in only 3 years! Go, now, please! By 2015 we could all be playing the new holy grail and you will be rich and famous.
I emplore you, oh talented ones, cross the picket lines and take up your laser pens, iPads and keyboards...create!
Comments
Deal lol
i wonder what could have brought this little rant on.
The genre is failing because by it's nature (MMORPG) it requires player interaction and server development , too many players move on to the next greatest release as if it is a competition for a "Most Games Played Award"
I couldnt agree more.
*Sarcasm detector alarm sounding*
Not intended as hate or troll, here's my paraphrased version... If you people think that the design of a holy grail game is so obvious, go build one.
My response... Yeah, if only it was so easy.
To make money on a large budget game it has to be mainstream (easy and casual friendly). If it's mainstream those who want depth and difficulty aren't happy.
To make profit on a niche game with depth and difficulty it has to be low budget. If it's niche, then people who want mainstream aren't happy. If it's low budget then people who want AAA polish aren't happy.
To run on common consumer computer hardware it has to be low-poly and highly optimized. If it's low-poly then people who want "immersive" [sic] graphics aren't happy.
So the holy grail game is big budget, is mainstream, is easy to play, has depth and difficulty, has AAA polish, runs on any hardware, and has graphics that look and feel like a CG movie. ... and we haven't even touched on sandbox vs. themepark.
To that I say good-luck.
I would do it, just for you, BUT, under your pic, it says you are currently enjoying SWTOR...Who am I to come inbetween you and your love?!
Because today's games are linear non innovative and the game makes the community, and it should have been the other way around. It was wow that appealed at the masses, and almost every other big title had to appeal on the masses too to gain a piece of the pie. But this game, and this kind of games are created to make you do repetitve things at endgame without a real effect on the gameworld. If they had features like daoc did with faction vs faction and things that generally changed the gameworld depending on who won e.t.c, it would be different. The communities would be overall different. So, endgame should be the second phase of the game, when the game really begins, like in daoc, or other similar games. I've said it again, player driven worlds, or partially driven at least. Swotr for example could have been a blast if there was actually something to do in endgame other than repetitive warzones, or raids. Putting more of that into the game won't make it better. Personally i do not like arenas and all these stuff in mmos, i like the whole game to be an arena, or at least a big part of it. No instanced crap that just give you items which you wear to go do more instanced crap. This is not what true mmorpgs were about. All these go mainly for pvp games. And if someone doesn't like pvp, then for the pve'ers well i guess something close to eq and eq2 is the deal. But most complaints are from pvp'ers for the reasons i described.
Expert no.1 - please return to your office.
By the way, many moorpgs are addictive. It's their nature. And eventually people get burned. And they essentially search for the next addiction, and that is not good, because companies make money from that but for the players it's bad. Games like daoc were not that addictive, at least for me not, but they were good nevertheless exazctly because of that, because you would login, play for a while, do some pvp, maybe a dungeon, and then logout and you had a good time and fun, it wasn't a big mindless grind to get the X weapon or armor, which while it's mindless can also be addictive for many., because the famous pvp of daoc was also more about tactics and not gear. So, all things in good measure, that is the key to success.
Posting to forums doesn't require millions of dollars.
Creating games doesn't require any creativity.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Which is why i have to laugh every time I see someone "Monday Morning Quarterbacking" on some game because they know best.
If they know so much put in the time and the work and get into the industry and make something happen. More than likely they will get a job somewhere, learn how things really are and start railing against the forums because some "gamer" said that their design was x and that they were lazy.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Expert no.1 - please return to your office.
Well, i just told you some of the mechanics that i think that they work, and yes they are from the old times, and no i am not a game developer. If you like more content, then that should be easy, but is this what you want? For example more content for swotr, and not a different game engine? You enjoy more arenas and raids? If that's your cup of tea, then disregard what i have said and i am returning to my office, but you also mentioned that the reason mmorpgs fail is not enought content, or at least that was what the title and your post says, unless i missunderstood. In my oppinion this is not the reaosn, but anyway.
A thread that isn't about whining how ye olde dayz are gone, but instead brings the focus on our so called 'veterans' and 'game development experts'?
Yeah, I'll support this one.
Inb4 Cuathon though!
MMOs have indeed been failing hard the past few years.It's a mix of things.All of the cookie cutter mmos out there nowadays.Also it's partly psychological (the players).Everytime we turn on our pc to login to <insert mmo name here> we are searching for that rush... the rush you got when you played your first truely amazing MMO.With each hour/day and new MMO we play this 'rush' is harder to achieve and harder to substain.We get bored faster.We've pretty much seen and done it all already.. in every other title we have ever played.
We continue to search for that 'rush' hoping that something brilliantly game breaking will come out and we will satisfy our addiction LOL. This isn't the case so far.Always same stuff diff. game.
Iam holding out hope for GW2.The combat style is very uniqe, unlike most mmos.
my 2c.
regards,
david
This is a major part in it.
Developers dont even try to make these things have any lasting appeal. They are made almost like they make a single player game. All refrence to single vs multiplayer argument aside these games are made like a single player game. Theres a begining and theres and end. The end mark is a little smudged its not as defined as a single player games end is, but none the less its still there. The real MMO's have an open ended game, where the player decides what he wants to do. I just consider these so called MMO's nothing more than online RPG's. I am hoping Archage can bring the MMO back tto MMORPG's
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Have to disagree.
5 years ago the majority of forums, including these ones, were arguing for quest grind ez mode themepark games. If you wanted anything else you was a 'dinosaur' who was told to accept the modern model or GTFO.
The ghost of EQ still loomed over the market then, it was a dirty word to a burned out public that still hadn't repressed the bad parts of the game enough for nostaligia to set in. They were riding high on WoW.
To put it simply, the market of five years ago didn't want what you want now. The market in 5 years won't want what you want now... Hell, in 5 years YOU probably won't even want what you want now. SWTOR 5 years ago would have been the ultimate game, it's flaws forgiven.
The only way to rejuvenate this genre is for dev to 100% ignore the forums and fashion, because what the vocals bleat about now is NOT what they will be demanding in 5 years time. Basing your design on the forums of today will just leave you out of step when you eventually launch.
Internet gamers are a fashion led fickle bunch, all too ready to take on the percieved 'cool' way of talking and arguing. They are the last people I would go to to design my game.
The way foreward is for a visionary game designer, full of guts and passion, to come forward and follow their own ideas and have confidence in their own genius, just like the devs of the games from the past that we all now love did.
Kind of like ANet are doing.
When someone can define for me what the metric is for the genre failing, I will be better able to support/refute the premise. From what I can see, the genre has probably more players than at most points in its existence. To me that doesn't scream the end/near end of it.
I could very well be wrong, and we could be on the precipice of a chasm, but I am doubtful
I self identify as a monkey.
And i don't need to be a cook to know that food i am eating is crap. But then again thats where my expertise ends. But if i am going to start telling the cook how to cook the food and what ingredients to use i better be a good cook myself or i just better shut up and find another restaurant to eat. There is difference between being arrogant 'i know it all' and a prudent and resonable critic.
...and yet. Those that say they're so tired of people posting their opinions or ideas have no qualms with recycling this old rant for the billionth time.
Whether I agree or disagree with them at least they're referring to mmos within themselves and not simply lamenting about the people playing or discussing them.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
bingo.
They all copy one another. It seems the genre is more about how much money they make compared to what kind of game they are making. It is a shame it all comes down to dollars and cents in the end. All the theings games love about mmos gets tossed out the window because of the almighty benjamin. Sad but true.
Grim Dawn, the next great action rpg!
http://www.grimdawn.com/
This thread should be titled "The reason this genre is failing...for me.", because the genre is not failing and that's a fact verifiable by numbers.
EDIT: You're right, I kinda missed the point of the thread. It's good that you're encouraging people to create! Sorry, I'm a little overly defensive today.
think you missed the point of the post
+1 ...
If you enjoy MMO gaming then the genre is not failing.
If you are tired of the 'same old' game designs then maybe its time for you to go play your console for a while.
It's simple really.
- B916
I dunno, Columbo. To me the problem seems to be that almost all devs are scared of trying new things.
Just look on TOR, they put so much work into that game but never even considered that a sci-fi game might need different mechanics than a fantasy games.
We get the same game repacked every time a new AAA game comes out and that is the reason most new games fails so badly and that the ones who do OK like Rift and tor never can go up against Wow for real.
The devs should have figured that out after WARs disaster if not earlier.
As for listening to forum a lot of good things are actually said here as well, you just need to filter away all the crap.