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Guildwars 2 PVE and PVP Problem
FateFatality
Member UncommonPosts: 93
SO HERE I GO
i was talking in another thread about Guildwars 2 PVE and PVP
So this is my problem i like guildwars 2 it looks awsome but as more info goes by and closer we are to realse of guildwars 2 i started to think hard about following list below
END GAME
PVP
PVE
DYNAMIC EVENTS
End Game:
So we have not got lot of info what Guildwars 2 End game will be like so i can only say from what anet has told us so far and info we have been given
it seems like guildwars 2 endgame consist of PVP and PVE content but seems like End game content will be more PVP then PVE
i will get to reason why i think this furthure down
PVP:
PVP is player vs player we all know this so we have WvW PVP and 5v5 PvP and i bet guildwars 2 PVP will be really good no doubt about it due to fact guildwars 2 is not gear dependent so all end game gear will be same as everyone elses with different visuals and if balance of classes is done right then PVP should be top notch
PVE:
now this is were i have my major problem as i said about PVP.
so we all know gear is cosmetic so is doing dungeons worth hassle if you can do PVP? if you can gain exp and gear and money from PVP?
This is my issue and now dynamic events so reason why dynamic events is make questing inovative and it does it looks reallllyyyy gooooodd but PROBLEM!!!! why would i bother? as mention all items are cosmetic and have very little benifits to me so theres no rewards to do it justice.... also have this feeling that there will be no incenstive to do more then whats needed in guildwars 2
we have the sidekick feature in guildwars 2 so we can do any content with friends ect but again why would i go and do any of content guildwas 2 has to offer if im not going benfit even exp/leveling has no incenstive due to this feature so all i am left with is to do pvp
Now you have story mode but we all know no matter what a single player RPG will have a better story then a MMO can offer
im just stuck on this issue and im not sure if im missing something i know games are supose be for fun but ideal of fun is be rewarded even single player games reward you for your time and fact everything is just cosmetic makes me feel like PVE will be pointless and no incenstive to do it
Comments
Why would you bother? Because you enjoy it?
I dont think gear is entirely cosmetic. GW2 isnt a mega gear game where gear makes all the difference in the world, but as far as I know, it does yield benefits and there are different classes of weapons and armor such as common, rare, etc.
As far as End Game, I think you have a fairly solid peg on that. Im not a fan of raiding though and dont bother, so it doesnt really bother me. But in most games, I dont have a reason or benefit to going back to old zones and playing and in this game I do. Which I love. But to each their own.
I'm hoping they go the route they went in GW: you hit max level before you finish a campaign, so essentially the 'endgame' PVE is ... 3/4 of the game.
Originally posted by Nailzzz
The one thing that i miss about the world pre-internet is that people used diary's to write down all the retarded crap they had floating around in there head's and no one ever had to see it.
End Game starts immediately after you log in
literally you can stay at the same beginning zone for ever if you want, you can stay at one zone and never leave it if all you want is complete every single dynamic event that is in that zone and neglect everything that is beyond that zone.
This game is about choice, they don't need to force you to enjoy the PVE, or the PVP
you want to take a break from PVP, go and explore
you want to do PVE for 2 hours, go ahead
you want to PVP for a whole year, go ahead
you want to PVE for a whole year, sure why not
this dungeon too hard for you, no problem, go PVP
Want to take a break from GW2, no problem, come back anytime, there is no subscription.
I already bought the game, If i like it, i will keep playing, if i don't like it, the game is mine, i can come back anytime
Why would I want to play PVE, i will use PVE to experiment and get used to all my personal combos and weapon swaps.
So that when i go back to PVP i can kill more efficiently.
The one thing that I hope is that there will be very harsh penalty for Cheaters and Hackers in the game, because without the subscription, if you are found to hack the game client, you should be banned for atleast a month.
Life is a Maze, so make sure you bring your GPS incase you get lost in it.
if this is true that gear is not all just cosmetic it does have a benift example
White armor is 100%
Rare is 120 to 130%
then i would do PVE content i love pve and pvp and i like mix up what i do depending how i feel
And only reason why raiding is bad at moment is no inovative Raiding but due fact Guildwars 2 combat will make raids hard and require skill and knowing whats going on will make raiding more enjoyable but again if its just cosmetic then im going be QQing -_- but if wat u say is true then improvment is a improvment and there for incenstive for me to do PVE
PRECISELY! Its a game! Play it for fun!!?? NOT uber gear!!??
They've released infos about endgame.
You just don't wanna accept them.
Gear isn't entirely cosmetic, unsure where you got that idea in your head from, but it wasn't entirely cosmetic in the first game either. First GW gave an increase in armor as the obvious example between its initial sets and the max sets, yet the biggest difference was that end sets of weapons and armor would allow you to further customize it with insignias and inscriptions.
The same will more than likely be said with GW2. The statistics on the gear are going to have some say in power, but its more about finding the style you prefer and fine-tuning the statistics of your gear to suit your playstyle. I mean sure a Necromancer in GW1 could go with just his basic armor, but a Necromancer who has invested in some +1 skill insignias will be capable of slightly more damage/etc than him. And do note I said "slightly".
End game wise, Arena.Net has stated it in the past it considers the "end game" to start right near the beginning. Levels scale down to fit the area you are in, same with the dungeons that exist in the game. This also isn't some Pay-to-play title that forces developers to string you along a boring gear-grind treadmill as a way of keeping you subscribed. They are hoping people buy the box, play the game and enjoy it enough that they don't mind paying a little later on for costume pieces or the like, or expansions when they are released.
So you'll have
1) Dynamic Events
2) Explorable Dungeons (which have so far been shown to be rather challenging to go through)
3) PvP through either the lobby-styled maps or the 2-week persistent WvWvW battles.
Also, I'm going to have to disagree quite heavily on "single player rpgs will always have better stories". That isn't a fact, its an opinion, and one I don't share. I can list off several Single Player RPGs whose stories are so cliche-ridden and dull that even Farmville would sound more intrigueing.
the thing is all gear of the same level will have the same amount of points, allow me to explain
armor lvl 80 #1 +100 power + 100 other stat + 100 other stat + 100 other stat
armor level 80 #2 +200 power + 50 other stat +50 other stat +50 other stat
that is the type of difference in stats for armor of the same level its just different allocation of points for min maxing ur build (a level 80 who is skilled can still easily beat you if they are better than you).
as for the gear treadmil, do you find grinding for gear fun? if you do then this isnt the game for you, first off each successfull dungeon run gives you a token to trade in for one of the dungeons special items. second, the game is made for people like me who just want to enjoy the game without them having to string us along with meaningless/required to proceed gear to be able to be competative. pve is anout cooperation and being able to play with your friends there are no barriers to this (except that a lower level cant play in higher level content).
point, play the game till its fun then stop playing untill you feel like picking it up again, like everyone does every game, except the games that use psychological addiction (wow gear treadmill is one example) anything where the only point to the gear is to get more gear basicly.
sry i just had to reply to this last bit, i agree on the single player rpgs wont always have better stories part, but i would rather slit my throat while drinking and breathing in hydrochloric accid than play farmville. hence all single player rpgs are automaticaly better to me than farmville, (altho some are probably just after farmville and the hydrchloric acid/ throat slitting. sry for off topic post) yaaaaay opinions
someone said it, basically gear isn't all that important but there is better gear with a lil more stats. Very minor but for the crazy min maxer.. there ya go. The end game as many have said in the past is to have fun. The explorables are really challenging from everything I have seen/read. I have gotten to play the game once and holy cow am I excited. PVP well I am not a PVPer and it looks fun even for me
Yea when you run dungeons you get gear chests. There's drops all over. Gear matters. Like I said its not the end all be all, but its there. I watched a video today where a guy completed a dungeon and got a better chunk of head armor than he had before so he equiped it.
There's different levels of gear quality. Some gear is far better than others. I really dont think you have to worry about this. I can assure you gear is not just cosmetic, it has effects like in other mmorpgs. The game is more skill based for sure, but gear has its importance.
As for your end game concerns, there may be a solution to your concern with it. But Im not entirely sure what that solution is right now. Sorry.
First answer is the correct answer. I thought the "reward" for playing games was fun.
playing:DCUO,GW2,WoW
played:SWG,LotRO,CoH,GW,FF14,ESO,AlbionOnline
Like others said, gear will be about stat selection not power. If you play a thief and focus only on criticals then why not grind the gear that has only crit based stats than have stats all over the place? That is the main reason why there will be end game for people that like gear grind.
Thats absolutely right. I totally agree.
However, some people find an in game reward or accomplishment for efforts made....fun. So we kind of have to consider that. Thats why they used to give "scores" in old video games including even tetris. Most video games (not all) have really cool things you find, earn, buy, etc. And the ones that dont almost always have a "score".
That sense of accomplishing something with your time helps people keep on trucking along. I think it has a lot to do with how human beings tend to work.
But GW2 has plenty of that, so there's no worry. Heck what....the game has at least 5 kinds of currency. And those buy things that are rewarding. Not to mention the stuff you'll get through just drops. So instead of trying to redefine to the OP what fun is, we should attempt to alleviate his concerns if they can be alleviated. What he wants as far as reward, is in the game, and plenty of it.
There's already tons of threads about this so this one is probably not going to last very long. In the meantime, here's what you have to realize; gear was similarly unimportant in GW1, and that didn't stop people from putting a hell of a lot of effort into obtaining unique skins. You couldn't imagine the lengths people went to when the ghost weapons first game out, and the effort people put even today into getting Vabian and Obsidian armor. They are money grinds that would have you begging for mercy, and they have the exact same stats as armor that you could buy for chump change.
It's a system that has proven to work, and as GW2 is aimed at people who hate the gear treadmill as much or more than Anet themselves, it's not going to change any time soon. Some people enjoy tackling difficult content just because it's fun. All these "What's the point?" threads are what I don't understand, do you really need a carrot? If it's fun, you play it, if it's not, you don't, and no amount of gear incentive is going to change that. If it did, we'd all be playing WoW, always and forever. *salt over shoulder*
Playing with people is a reward. Showing off to a lower level friend in your pretty high-level armor and skills while helping them run lowbie content, is a reward. Winning in PvP not because your gear let you, but because you were just that awesome, is a reward. Having a smile on your face while you play a game to get away from the nitty gritty that is real life, is a reward. All the loot that comes from gear-treadmills is superficial; what you remember is the fun you and your guild had doing it, not the stat bonuses they came with.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
well im getting closer to understanding reason behind that gear treadmill is not all that good and i do agree its boring end game style of gameplay
and i am starting get theres is some incenstive to farm gear ect though i have always enjoy being rewarded for my hardwork thats normal for every human and i guess i can learn to be a show off? due to what i can see visual apperance of a gear in guildwars 2 to is fact to show off
ok and i have few other concerns as well
is guildwars 2 economy has anyone got some insight how economy of guildwars 2 will be like will there be incenstive to farm example mats for crafting or gear hunting and with all diffrent currancy how well will this turn out
will player tradeing be pointless feature due to fact you can just obtain everything you need im not sure where im going with this but i feel if guildwars 2 reward system is awkward as it sounds just wonder how economy is going revolve around this
i dont want guildwars 2 having a pointless economy
and then theres leveling whats incenstive to level if i can just get sidekicked up? is it just there to boast your level? or does it have benifits that not minor?
There's only 3 different currencies (so to speak)
Gold: The basic currency, you use it to buy and sell and all that jazz, as well as being included in the next currency.
Gems: Cash Shop currency. It's only use is to obtain anything from the microtransaction store. They have also confirmed that Gems can be bought by other players for Gold, giving people alternative ways to afford a cash shop item.
Then Karma/Glory: Its use is limited to just buying from the specialty vendors. You gain Karma through Dynamic Events and Glory through PvP.
When dealing with buying from other players through, say the auction, Gold will be the only thing spent. I'm also guessing that ArenaNet isn't going to be implementing a shallow currency limit like they did in the first Guild Wars, where you could only trade up to a hundred plat (maximum amount allowed carried on character). That should mean we probably won't be dealing with item "currencies" like Ectos became.
As for the incentive to level, you only get side-kicked up in PvP. Even then though it has its limitations. Structured PvP side-kicks you up fully, but WvWvW doesn't. The reason you get sidekicked up in Structured is to remove any imbalancing factors like better gear or more skills as it also gives you access to all skills and gear (though none can be carried back to PvE)
However, WvWvW, the larger PvP environment, only boosts your level and attributes, so you'll still be limited by gear, traits, and skill by your original level. However they allow you to earn Xp here, as well as equipment. Which allows for your character to progress solely through the World PvP.
I heard about this game "Life," but I'm not sure if I'll like it because the end-game is nothing but laying in a box and rotting.
I mean . . . what's the point?
Re: SWTOR
"Remember, remember - Kakk says 'December.'"
That's pretty much it in a nutshell. ArenaNet have already explicitly said what their "so-called" endgame is about. They expect people to play the same game they were doing, prior to leveling, which means 5-man Dungeons, Dynamic Events, Exploration etc. People just seem to think "no raid, no gear grind... there must be something else." It's pretty sad at this point.
For some hardcore true believers, the Jesus 1.2 patch is supposed to be heaven on earth.
Sadly, the most exciting thing about that is the rumored zombies that rise up to accompany it.
I'm just expecting the servers to shut down before it comes out. Probably from a rock hitting it.
They add a working UI to it? Maybe I'll resub. (My character was a Hinduist.)
Re: SWTOR
"Remember, remember - Kakk says 'December.'"
GW2 is designed to have no "end game" the whole game is the end game, there's no grinding to the max level to have fun like in world of warcraft or I guess every single mmo in existance. PVE end game will probably consist of farming cool looking items and doing hard dungeons, I'm guessing there will probably be something like underworld in gw1? not sure. Although gear is only for cosmetic looks, that doesn't stop people from wanting to farm/pay for it. Hell, I for one want to get two bad ass looking axes for my warrior.
It's different from most mmos because in most mmos its just a gear grind, thats the only purpose to the game. You get max level and you kill big dragons to get gear to kill the next big dragon. That's not the way gw2 will work. The whole game is meant to be enjoyable and without any grind.
Pvp is great in the guild wars games, but I also really enjoy their pve. I plan on doing both in the end game.
i do agree PVP will be good
but i have a feeling a stronge one that PVE will not hold players attention for long
the dynamic events are very innovative yes they are but like someone else said if theres no goal to aim for in a game then what am i supose to do as a player
sure i can PVP but only so much PVP i will do until i get bored
i like to mix things up and i enjoy PVE
issue with incenstive to PVE cannot just be for a cosmetic items there has be more to PVE content then cosmetic and new way to quest if thats all there is to offer then thats very sad it may not be same gear tread mill grind as other mmos
and if cosmetic turns be a big hit then i can bet people will do dungeons like they do raids in other MMO's there for it could possible a gear run tred mill to look cool but not have stats so in theroy it could be same crap we be doing
and now i know side kicking is only for PvP that helps little more for PvE players to want to level up and im glade they removed PVE side kicking
But im not one to go around collecting titles and stuff like that im one that farms for items and mats and sells things trades with people ect i enjoy econmys aspect of a MMO