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Why am I so miserable with todays MMORPGs?
Kilsin
Member RarePosts: 515
I am getting more and more depressed these days seeing the junk that is thrown our way and when I actually took the time to stop and think about it, we have moved past one of the best MMORPG generations ever and I fear we will never see it again.
It concerns me that everything these days are micro transactions and F2P with such boring content and immersion, is it just me or do others share my mourning of the good old days where UO and EQ were supreme AAA MMOs that let your imagination run free, gave excitement, challenge and helped form some great friendships and social interactions?
I don't really like what I see in today's MMOs and am not really looking forward to anything that is coming down the track, maybe ESO if they can pull it off but unlikely, Arche Age looks good but can they fully convert the game to the Western standards and will it still have the Korean feel to it? Guild Wars 2 is quite fun but for how long?, I see GW2 as a side MMO to play when my main MMO is patching or if I wanted a break from everything but maybe that's just me.
If I could build an MMO, I would put a great deal of thought into building the best MMORPG ever build, it would contain all the good things from UO, EQ, Vanguard, TES series and what ever elements of some others game I think will work (what games would you add in to the mix for your MMORPG?). I would then mix all of these together, to incorporate an awesome PvE experience (I don't mind PvP but I am much more inclined to play PvE games and I think trying to balance the two in the same game, usually ends in tears for many players and companies) from min to max level, with in depth quests, immersive lore that you would get lost in for hours, massive open world adventuring, unique crafting like Vanguard and possible some form of Diplomacy like Vanguard, open world harvesting with no limitations (I want to be able to harvest what I want, when I want, for as long as I want...), impressive character creation and models, latest game engine like Unreal Engine 4 or CryEngine 3 (4 when its released), and many many more options like open world trading and market places, investing in shops/stalls, make it a real fantasy living world that players would enjoy being a part of.
What do you think, are you sick of seeing the MMOs they are producing these days? Do you have a dream of what your perfect MMORPG would be?
Give me an in depth, immersive, satisfying, graphically pleasing, challenging, lasting MMORPG that is subscription based and supported and loved by its Developers and company behind it, one that listens to the community supporting their game and has the common sense to make changes when needed to benefit the game going forward. I will pay more per month for a solid subscription based MMO than I will ever spend in a cash shop on a F2P game, that usually leaves a bad taste in my mouth after playing it for a while.
What do you guys and girls think?
Am I exaggerating?
Should I just suck it up and except the fact that the good old days of UO/EQ are done and dusted or is their hope that we may relive those days once again?
*Please share your thoughts in a polite manner, I do not want this to turn into a flame war or fan boi war, I mean no offence to any game in particular, I personally just am sick of seeing the junk that is on offer in today's MMORPG market, this is 2012 with awesome technology and powerful personal computers, I have much greater expectations than what is being thrown at us presently.
Comments
I think most people that are tired of the genre don't know what to play unless it's shoved in their face via some headline.
There is a tab at the top of the page here that says "game list". Go through it and look at the many ones your *not* playing.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
You seem like a person that's played nothing but MMORPG for many, many years.
My suggestion go play some high quality games outside the mmo genre for a couple years.
THen come back.
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing
The new core set for 2013 of Magic The Gathering is launching soon, maybe even today. One could get a couple premade decks and some boosters for the price of a monthly sub.
Personally I prefer to paint tabletop minis, IE Warhammer 40,000/ Warmachine, that kind of thing. There are also quite a few new offerings in that sector that are not nearly as expensive as the GW stuff.
In a round about way I am implying that you may need to, atleast for a time, move on and try something new, or even pick up something old and give it another run.
The MMO genera has moved on, KA is a wheel and it does that. Even though there are countless threads about the features we want, or used to love. Why? Money. There is lots and lots of money to be made in the video gaming industry. When the first MMOs were launched they were more of an "idea" than a product. SInce they are no longer just for a select market, as in niche, and they are mass marketed.....MMOs have had to be smothed out, some say "dumbed down", and filled with instant gratification. The majority of players has no desire, or even the understanding to appreaciate, and intence grind.
In the next few years I believe the entire gaming industry will change. TSW launched a rather interesting rehash of the concept, no high fantasy and the skill wheel system, but still it is just a themepark. GW2, has lots of new and shineys. But, again jsut another themepark. While the MMO genere struggles with its cost structure, sub F2P B2P, there is chatter about the next gen XBox to have a sub system only, gone will be the days of Gmaestop molesting gamers with 95% of retail price used games.
Enough random ranting.
MMOs change. People change. If you are miserable you need to change.
Ding Ding Ding. We have a winner.
I disagree with it being shoved in my face but I agree about the games list and I have been through it many times and just don't seem to find many things I like.
I currently play Vanguard: Saga of Heroes and have since beta, I know what you're going to say and before you do, it has changed a lot of the years and is actually quite enjoyable, hopefully they will not dumb it down anymore and continue to support it now that Brad McQuaid is back and SOE are pushing it F2P.
My fear is that I love most things about VG because it has small things from EQ and UO in it, it is not perfect by any means but it does what other games these days do not, its massive, its immersive, the graphics are nice, combat is good, classes are unique and interesting...
I am just seeing more and more games come out with less and less to offer is what I am basically getting at, it's all about making masses of money without giving us the content and depth that should go with it.
Maybe we are the problem by encouraging companies and spending our money on these new games that seem to fall short?
OP: have you tried GW2? You can get a free beta key for July 20th week end on Curse right now.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
The majority of mmos are pretty much the same except with a different skin. I would get bored too if everyone did the same thing. Time for new and better developers to lead the mmo genre to new heights. The current crop loves to copy everyone elses work but add a twist to it. I don't find it good for the long term health of the genre.
Grim Dawn, the next great action rpg!
http://www.grimdawn.com/
You are kind of correct but I do mix it up, I am currently playing:
MMO's:
Vanguard - main MMO for last 5 years
GW2 beta testing from pre purchase
TERA - played since beta and recently closed my account through bordom loved the graphics though
AION - reopened my old account since F2P launched and closed it again 2 weeks later
Waiting for ESO and ArchAge.
I have played many other MMOs including EQ, EQ2, LotrO, Rift, WoW trial, SW:TOR and others I have probably forgotten to mention.
Console:
MW3 - I continue to play MW3 a few times a week with friends - fun
Battlefield 3 - stopped playing recently but had fun for a while
Fifa 12 - fun for a change
Forza 4 - fun as I have an interest in cars and racing in real life
AC Revelations - finished loved it
Mass Effect 3 - finished loved it.
For some reason I play my FPS on Xbox 360 and all my RPG and MMOs on PC, not sure why, that is how I have grown up on games
Unfortunately I have never really been into card games whether it be in online games or MUDs, the only card games I play is pretty much Poker or Blackjack for money or with friends and a few beers.
I agree the genre has moved on, what I am wondering though is will it come back around to those games myself and a lot of other MMO gamers my age (34) enjoyed like UO, EQ...or have we seen the end of those harder subscription based games now with the younger generation coming through the industry?
I wish someone would still cater the the niche hardcore market I think is what I am trying to say, I would be very interested in seeing some numbers of players interested in that type of MMO vs today's releases.
I am watching the new Xbox closely, I hope to see it announced at next years E3, the hardware along sounds promising for console gamers and PC gamers alike
I am miserable thinking about the future of MMOs and what will happen when I stop playing Vanguard...what will there be to draw me away from it? I understand MMOs will always change and evolve as will people but my taste in gaming is just that, I can't just tell myself I no longer like hardcore old school MMOs, it is what I grew up on and love playing.
That's like someone saying your favorite food is no longer going to be served to you, it will just sit on the side for you to look at but you best change your taste and start eating something else.
Yes, I pre purchased the day it was released to the public and have been beta testing ever since, it is a fun game and one I will most likely play on the side but I can't see myself ever seriously putting a lot of time and effort into it since I love hardcore raiding and GW2 isn't that sort of game.
It is a good game though don;t get me wrong just not what I am after for my next big game.
In all fairness to the OP most of the games on that list don't offer what he's looking for, especially if they are newer titles.
"They sure don't build them like they used to" is actually a pretty accurate statement when discussing MMORPG design evolution, and for those who want them to be the same are going to be disappointed.
I gave up, now I find the fun in each new title that comes out, and don't waste any time looking for features they don't include, I can only hope one day they'll make a small comeback in future games.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I agree 100%, it's like the thinking is still there to create awesome MMOs but someone leans over their shoulder and says "This will not earn enough money, cut it from the game" or "Don't let the players have to much freedom or we won't be able to manipulate them into spending more money"...
I wish someone would slap that shoulder leaning person across the office and out onto the street, locking the door behind them and letting the Devs go crazy with awesome game ideas...
From 2000 on it seems everything has gotten worse. Movies are mostly remakes, music for the most part is God awful, and MMo's haven't lived up to the hype since 2003-04. Innovation isn't the same as old.
Care to pick which one are the "Good" games from the Shit list? Oh hell people are not happy with the Pay to play games.One or more new Pay to play comes out and it is bashed to hell..You think Free to play is any better? Thought so...Op Has a good point.. I find it more fun reading silly comments than playing any mmorpg game at the momment..Now that sad.
edit add on
I retired retroactively..Haha
id imagine its because your thirst for depth in these games has increased, but the current offerings for depth have stagnated or decreased.
pretty normal i would imagine.
Funny you mention that since I just finished watching The Amazing Spider-man last night lol. At least cellphones and Tv's got better?
Very true and the sad thing is, we are buying the garbage, this is why they keep making it!
I am positive you are correct about "I truly believe the first AAAish MMO to come out, be a sandbox with a heavy focus on player creation tools, a player dependent economy and some social hot spots will blow the genre wide open again, nearly killing all of these half hearted shallow abominations in the process, proving to all these foolish park fans that there model was always (as we boxers all know) inferior, and making all of the words I have wasted on this subject ring true, for that I will wait, and watch (all be it disgrunteledly)."
I just do not know if someone has the balls to actually step up and back a game like this and be able to bring the talent along to make it happen. There are some great minds out there that I am sure could do the job we ask of them but will it make them as much money as F2P or micro transactions? I honestly don't know, there would have to be a lot of gamers backing a new MMO like this to change the way the industry thinks and get them to make something we want, instead of something they want us to want.
I 100% agree about holding Devs to a higher standard, I think our era expect a bit more for our money and when we don't get it, we speak up...I get myself in trouble time to time on the Vanguard forums for exactly that reason, maybe I am too passionate about the games I play...who knows but I do not think I am over opinionated, I just think the standard has dropped a lot in the last 5+ years and no one seems to care or be doing anything about it...its depressing!
If you have a serious qualm with whether a game is F2P or not, then go through the list and root those out.
It's not that hard, there's a shit-ton of games out there and you're just trying to be difficult for the sake of being difficult.
~Plus Good vs Shit is subjective, and just asking me that question assures me you weren't looking for any kind of answer in the first place. You just wanted to postulate. Anyone can do the research for themeslves if they were truly interested in finding a good one, otherwise, they just want to vent and nothing will ever satisfy.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
You may be right...
I enjoyed UO back in the days but not so much now.
I enjoyed EQ back in the days but not so much now.
I enjoy Vanguard now and have for the last 5 years but it's getting to that point now, where I am waiting for the next big thing to jump over to so I can move on and evolve like I have done for the last 10-20 years, what makes me miserable, is I do not see anything in sight to jump too...I am afraid that Vanguard maybe the last true MMO in that line of games to satisfy my thirst for challenge and amazing massive open worlds, great in depth lore and freedom.
This can't possibly be the end, can it?
In all fairness to the OP most of the games on that list don't offer what he's looking for, especially if they are newer titles.
"They sure don't build them like they used to" is actually a pretty accurate statement when discussing MMORPG design evolution, and for those who want them to be the same are going to be disappointed.
I gave up, now I find the fun in each new title that comes out, and don't waste any time looking for features they don't include, I can only hope one day they'll make a small comeback in future games.
Glad to see someone pointed that out! Sounds more his own fault if anything, like there weren't any red flags prior to purchasing any of those games.All i read from the Op is another bad consumer who doesn't do enough research on products before purchasing. Consumer blames developer for not disclosing more details about the game.
KILSIN! You are 100% correct my friend!
The fact is most if not all MMORPG if they were not a MMO, but instead were a traditional multiplayer game would quite frankly stink.
On top of that they are designed with the priority of findign clever and unique ways to keep you playing.
We all went crazy over the original Everquest back in 1999, because we could play with an unfinite number of friends and meet new players and make more friends. Play with entire guilds.
Unfortunately, EQ got stale.....but....think about this....
How long do most players under the age of 21 play a MMORPG? Is it possible that with MMOs lasting 13+ years such as EQ, that as players mature, get married, get jobs they play less and/or stop. Then new under 21 year olds take there place and even stale MMOs seem like the garden of eden to these new players. Thats how stale MMOs keep going....kust my theory.
Now having said that, if devs and designers would design for FUN FIRST and clever ways to take our money 2ND, MMOs would be better. Also, looka t all the lousy anime/asian style MMOs cluttering the MMO market....90% of MMOs on this very website (MMORPG) stink.
Having played MMOs since 1999 and PC games since 1992, I can honestly ask, "why do we pay a subscription" just to be annoyed by other players? LOL! It has gotten to the point where the thrill of massive multiplayer back in 1999 with EQ is now a nightmare of annoying players in chat, griefers, cheaters, haters, whiners, and WoW kiddies stinking up the place. Its almost like you dread seeing other players other than your own RL friends or guild mates. WELL, you dont need an MMO for that, just good old multiplayer.
Why do you think all the new MMOs have so many instances? LOL because most players dont want stranger screwign up there dungeon runs! Or griefing them in it.
NOW...lets talk about F2P...you are right...its NOT FREE! LOL!
The average player will spend at least what the original cost of an MMO is $49, just by having to buy what they need to unlock areas, zones, items, quests....it stinks. YES, I realize they have to make money but man.....its more like Pay to Play and not Free to Play. In fact, its only Free to Play as a demo...seriously they are more like demos until you start forking over cash.
Oh well, I feel your pain....this is why I play "Sins of a Solar Empire: Rebellion", Skyrim, Space Marine, and other games like that. Good quality games with graphics better than any MMO and you invite your friends and guild mates and dont have to spend anymore money or deal with the jerk other players.
Many many hundreds of thousands share your pain.
Unfortunately, the CEOs that have this genre by the privates don't care about 500k or 1 million subs. They want WoW numbers. So they shoot for the casual audience by making a WoW clone (a clone of a poorly designed clone...I'm sure there's something to be said about incest there), and don't understand that you can't capture an audience that's already captivated by a similar game.
MMOs have plummetted in terms of design, innovation, depth, scale, it's all gone way down hill and is only starting to ever so slightly pick up now. But it'll never get back to where it used to be until publishers pull out of the genre.
The only games that will be even slightly innovative are the underfunded indie games that get almost no press or support.
Your jaded bro. it happens. it's the time in your life you realize..they're all pretty much the same with a few thing's you never tried thrown in the same thing you just tried 50 games before.
It Gets old and your feeling burnt thats's all.
Uh, the problem isn't being jaded. The problem is that all AAA "MM"ORPGs are just WoW clones, so they are inherently the same.
I don't think that is what Kyleran was saying at all and I think your post is a little unfair to judge me based on that.
I am not blaming anyone, I am asking the question "What happened to the good old days where games were packed with content, depths, lore, freedom, support, immersion"?
I have been doing nothing but researching for the last few years, I want another good game to move onto and call home but i don't see any.
You do not see enough of it these days and I do not see any of it in F2P games and if there is some, you have to pay to unlock it, sometimes multiple times! I am not against F2P at all, I just see a negative trend of F2P games offering less and less for more and more money.
I am wondering when gamers will draw a line in the sand and say,"Hey enough is enough, you need to start giving us decent games again for the money we pay..."
These days I see a lot of games grab you by the pix-elated throat and drag you down a specific path whether you like it or not and when you reach the end, you're done. You can create another character and do it all over again or you can throw money at your screen to make your character look better/prettier or cooler but what other options do you have?
Options are becoming scarce these days.