Before I begin writing this, I want to make sure everyone understands that this is solely my opinion, and based on my perception rather than facts. With that said, a few other things to note about me:
1) i'm a die-hard Final Fantasy fan, grew up playing it, and played FFXI for nearly 4 years, and FFXIV since P2 beta.
2) I've played dozens of MMORPGs, and even written reviews for this site and other sites, so I have seen my share of the genre.
3) I've currently got a level 49 BRD, 50 LTW, and 40 WVR/GSM, and I'm on the Ultros Server, and leader of the Veterans of Valkurm Free Company and Linkshell (DUNES)
Now I'll say that I had a great blast playing FFXIV. I've run nearly every dungeon, fought nearly every primal I can fight so far, maxed out a craft (which is wearing full HQ AF armor ^_^), nearly completed the main story quest, etc. To say "I've done a lot" is fair, as I am afforded the opportunity to play this game quite frequently (since I can play at work). I've made a few friends in game, set up some events, and tried to buiid and foster a positive community with my linkshell (which has around 100 dedicated members). I really enjoyed the game thus far, but I have numerous worries about the future.
Now, I hate doomsayers as much as anyone, but in my brief time in Eorzea, I've stumbled across several problems and concerns relating to the long-term of the game. After a very rocky start (#3102, #90000, #2002, etc) they did fix their servers and login problems, which was a great job by Square Enix. I was worried that if those problems persisted, that it would drive people away in droves. However, many new concerns have arisen, which I'm going to go into in-depth in the next few paragraphs.
Issue #1: Crafting is utterly useless
As I got my LTW to 50, I had a sense of relief. "Alright, I'm done with THAT part of the game..." I thought to myself. I figured with my newfound craft, I'd be able to start making money almost immediately in the game. There is just one small problem; there is no demand for hardly anything. Gear, which should be utilized to a degree by all classes, isn't necessary. Because of the incredible ease of the game, it hasn't been uncommon to see people wearing severely outdated gear throughout the game. I've seen level 40's rocking level 18 armor, and to no real penalty. Since there's no reason for combat classes to buy gear, there's no reason to craft combat gear. Furthermore, combat classes can get gear cheaper/free, and easier simply by doing quests and dungeons. Furthermore, due to Issue#2, people are leveling so fast and efficiently that there's no reason to EVER buy gear! In fact, the irony of crafting +gathering and +crafting gear is that the only people who buy it is fellow crafters and gatherers. Essentially, you're creating gear for crafting because it's mandatory, but crafting has no purpose other than to build more crafting gear...and, of course, materia melding. I basically spent all my gil buying crystals and ingredients to level a craft which is now essentially worthless. Also, since no one needs to buy anything... there is no economy. Gil is essentially used to skilling up a craft, or repairing your end game gear. That's it. And once you lose it, it's 10x harder to make it back, because there is ample supply, and meager demand. This is probably related to the fact that...
Issue #2: Fates have rendered the game utterly pointless
Since fates are essentially just massive zerg fests that generate 10+k exp for roughly 1 minute of work, there's no reason not to just run fates. Dungeons are slower exp, questing is slower exp, killing mobs is slower exp. Because there's no reason to do anything other than Fates, people are hitting 50 at a ridiculous pace; I've seen multiple people with 2-3 jobs at level 50, and you have to consider that we're not even at the end of the first month. Now I don't know what kind of content patches SE has planned, but people have burned through all the content the game has to offer in 1 week because of the way you can level off of Fates. I would dare to say that, if the quests weren't mandatory for advancement and gil, people would totally ignore them. Because of the abuse of the fates...
Issue #3: Everyone has hit level 50, and as such, is picking up a craft
This further nullifies the usefulness of crafting, because everyone is a level 50 Disciple of War AND a level 50 Disciple of Land/Hand. There is no demand now, and there will be even less demand as people continue to level their 2nd job/craft. Think this is an exaggeration? Go look at the diremite camps, or the ornery karakul spawns; watch how many 50's are camping these mobs for mats. Look at the incredible oversaturation of goods on the AH, and the rock-bottom prices on nearly everything. Because leveling is so easy, once you hit 50, your options are essentially to ruin dungeons, or to level up another job craft. This wouldn't be so unmanageable, except that...
Issue #4: The duty finder has far too many DPS, and not enough tanks/healers to go around
While this one is 100% preventable for the player to deal with, because of the small party size, you're getting tanks and healers geared up SUPER fast, while many DPS don't even have but 1 relic item. As such, if you're solo queueing as a DPS, enjoy your 4 hour queue timer. While this can be alleviated by grouping with LS mates, if there are none on, you can be stuck waiting around for hours on end with nothing to do, sans for crafting/gathering. This problem could have been avoided by having a slower leveling pace, but the FATE system ruined the game's pacing entirely.
Issue #5: The game is entirely too easy in all aspects
Tradecraft leves that provide 140k exp in 1 craft? Fates that add 12k combat exp for 5 seconds of work? You can 1 v 3 mobs essentially the entirety of the game? There is legitimately no challenge for 99% of the game. Dungeons are a welcome change of pace, but for those out there who don't have 3-4 hours to queue up, that aspect of the game is all but absent for people. And because of this incredible ease of access, everyone is nearing end-game (at least on the Ultros server). With everyone at level 50 DoW/DoH/DoL, guess what that leaves people to do? More fate grinding (for company seals), maxing out additional crafts, and queueing for dungeons. Additionally, the end-game is so easy that Free Companies are legitimately selling clears and relic weapon acquisitions to the highest bidders (roughly 150k gil) Which leads to...
Issue #6: There simply isn't enough to do once you hit 50
And this problem is the most alarming. I'm not sure what sort of content SE plans to pump out every month, but with players completing the game in roughly 14 days, you have to believe that whatever they do release simply won't be large enough or at a fast enough pace to keep up with the player base. Using my own observations, as soon as new content is released, nearly everyone on the server will already be ready to advance through it. As it will likely be the only content introduced, people will probably burn through it in a week, tops, effectively leading to more waiting. This was my biggest fear pre-release, the philosophy of It's not about the journey, but the game starts at 50; 1-50 should take a long time. It's much easier to control content for a handful of players rather than all players. Because 1-50 is a cakewalk, new content is going to be in demand at a rapid pace.
Issue #7: The gil-sinks, gil-gains debate (which is covered by MMORPG.com already) and the gil-sellers
For anyone who played FFXI, you no doubt remember the dreaded gil-sellers. Well they're back, and with a vengeance. In fact, the problem with gil-sellers is so dominant that every time I go to town I have to add at least 2 new names to my blacklist. They spam RELENTLESSLY in the shout chat, literally once per second, every second, non-stop. Gilsellers are not only annoying, but they're also posting bogus links for unsuspecting cheaters to click on, which in turn is phishing people's account information and leading to hacked accounts. SE allowed this to happen in FFXI, and their lack of preparedness in FFXIV is already creating a rift in the community. A hardline approach needs to be taken; I shouldn't need to blacklist over 100 names in 14 days, and basic chat moderation would solve this problem. They're also probably booming in business, as it's nearly impossible to make gil once you've hit 50 and you've used up your quest rewards. Even worse, the gil-selling is so rampant and rapid, that if you do blacklist someone, there's a new person there to take their place within 5 minutes. It's as if SE can't ban them fast enough. Try and go to a main city without using the blacklist, and your chat log will be blacking out the sun with gil-seller spam.
Issue #8: The staying power is not present.
As I said, I'm an avid final fantasy fan. I love the world, the lore, the mobs, the characters, etc. I have a great community of people to play with. However, it's 14 days in, and we're nearly out of things to do. How can I justify subscribing month after month after month if there isn't anything new or exciting for me to do? I know that I am not alone in this feeling; peruse any of the online forums. People are concerned that they're going to stagnate at a rate faster than content is introduced.
I look at all these issues, and I probably sound like I'm hating on the game. I want to be perfectly clear that I am playing the game and loving it, but that these are serious fundamental flaws. I realize I didn't point out the good things about the game. It runs very smooth, it plays very polished, I haven't experienced hardly any bugs to date. Dungeons are entertaining and exciting, the world itself is awesome looking, and the crafting system is super cool.
However, I worry if the ease, the simplicity, the lack of depth and complexity related to both combat and the economy will lead to a loss of interest in players. I still have 16 days until I need to enter payment information... but I am only new becoming skeptical that I'll even continue to play beyond that. While this IS a good game, it simply isn't a long game, and it's in dire need of some challenge and timesink aspects, or even optional features. I DO realize that the golden saucer, PvP, housing, etc, are on the way... but if they are as simple as the base of the game has been, how long will those truly hold your interest anyway? A week? 2 weeks?
I'd like to read your opinions on this. Share your name, your levels, your server, etc, and let me know what you think. Do you believe FFXIV has the staying power of other MMO's? if so, why, and if not, why not?
The thing I am more shocked about is, another "This MMO will Fail" Post. I did not expect to see that .....don't wait for the shocked face.
Originally posted by Scott23 Why are you glad to see that you are right (assuming that you are)? I never understood how people can be so happy when a game that they don't like seems to have problems.
Don't worry about the formatting, this forum software is utterly crap and mangles it for you.
Aside from that - yeah, this is what I thought when I read that. Really, your glad a game is failing and people may even lose jobs over it? Just so you sit with some sort of superiority complex and strut that you were right?
I would love it if the game stuck around for ever and people fell into some cosmic harmony playing it - nothing would make me happier for those players and that game, even if I didn't like the game personally.
I don't like WoW - they have taken a direction I don't care for, but I'm not sitting back rooting for it to fail
People like you are those who sit and watch Nascar just to see the wrecks, and get disappointed if someone doesn't die.
(just for clarification, that's not aimed at Scott23, that's aimed at whomever he was quoting, which I deleted out because the shitty forum software kept mangling it on my end too)
This is what's becoming of a lot of people in the MMO community, they just wish for game they don't like to fail, and at any chance they get bash it as much as possible. One slip up and there all over it like bacteria. The simple fact is if you dont like a game, dont play it, find something else which interests you and let those who do enjoy it do so.
I do understand at times people have concerns about decisions companies make, and wish to voice it, but 99% of the time it's just plan hate, nothing constructive or interesting, just "your games crap" and that's it.
What make this post funny is the original was posted in September but few months later FFXIV hit the 1.5 million player mark. Not sure what it's at now.
As far as I am able to tell from reading the forums, my initial thoughts are still correct. This game sucks, and I knew it would.
From my experiences in the beta, I knew it was going to fail, as there are COUNTLESS issues. I am glad to see I was right. All those haters calling me a bullshitter and I don't know what I'm talking about.
Lmao, every single metric disagrees with you. The game has far surpassed everything the developers set for it in terms of expected outcome. Sounds like u mad bro.
Excuse me, but I don't see the part where I said I was glad it failed. Can you point it out too me? I said that I am glad too see that I was right, didn't bother with a pre order, as I knew it would be a waste. Never did I say "Boy, I sure am glad this game sucks!" I just said I was glad I was right with my initial thoughts that teh game is teh suk.
[quote] Lmao, every single metric disagrees with you. The game has far surpassed everything the developers set for it in terms of expected outcome. Sounds like u mad bro. [/quote]
I'm not sure what you mean by "Every single Metric" I have not used that word used in this context. If the game has far surpassed everything the devs set for it, than I am gravely upset at their poor outlook for the game. It's a 5/10 at best. Honest opinion on the game. Not trying to hate parade it or anything, I just think it could/should have been MUCH better for what it could be.
Originally posted by Scott23 Why are you glad to see that you are right (assuming that you are)? I never understood how people can be so happy when a game that they don't like seems to have problems.
Don't worry about the formatting, this forum software is utterly crap and mangles it for you.
Aside from that - yeah, this is what I thought when I read that. Really, your glad a game is failing and people may even lose jobs over it? Just so you sit with some sort of superiority complex and strut that you were right?
I would love it if the game stuck around for ever and people fell into some cosmic harmony playing it - nothing would make me happier for those players and that game, even if I didn't like the game personally.
I don't like WoW - they have taken a direction I don't care for, but I'm not sitting back rooting for it to fail
People like you are those who sit and watch Nascar just to see the wrecks, and get disappointed if someone doesn't die.
(just for clarification, that's not aimed at Scott23, that's aimed at whomever he was quoting, which I deleted out because the shitty forum software kept mangling it on my end too)
This is what's becoming of a lot of people in the MMO community, they just wish for game they don't like to fail, and at any chance they get bash it as much as possible. One slip up and there all over it like bacteria. The simple fact is if you dont like a game, dont play it, find something else which interests you and let those who do enjoy it do so.
I do understand at times people have concerns about decisions companies make, and wish to voice it, but 99% of the time it's just plan hate, nothing constructive or interesting, just "your games crap" and that's it.
What make this post funny is the original was posted in September but few months later FFXIV hit the 1.5 million player mark. Not sure what it's at now.
Obviously you didn't read my 6000 word essay on the game, and how to improve it. lol. Oh, and it was posted in July, not September. It was posted at the end of the Beta, just before launch.
Excuse me, but I don't see the part where I said I was glad it failed. Can you point it out too me? I said that I am glad too see that I was right, didn't bother with a pre order, as I knew it would be a waste. Never did I say "Boy, I sure am glad this game sucks!" I just said I was glad I was right with my initial thoughts that teh game is teh suk.
[quote] Lmao, every single metric disagrees with you. The game has far surpassed everything the developers set for it in terms of expected outcome. Sounds like u mad bro. [/quote]
I'm not sure what you mean by "Every single Metric" I have not used that word used in this context. If the game has far surpassed everything the devs set for it, than I am gravely upset at their poor outlook for the game. It's a 5/10 at best. Honest opinion on the game. Not trying to hate parade it or anything, I just think it could/should have been MUCH better for what it could be.
Google what a metric is, it's a pretty simple concept...promise, i shouldn't hurt too much to read.
: a part of prosody that deals with metrical structure
: a standard of measurement <no metric exists that can be applied directly to happiness — Scientific Monthly>
: a mathematical function that associates a real nonnegative number analogous to distance with each pair of elements in a set such that the number is zero only if the two elements are identical, the number is the same regardless of the order in which the two elements are taken, and the number associated with one pair of elements plus that associated with one member of the pair and a third element is equal to or greater than the number associated with the other member of the pair and the third element
Which is why I was confused. I'm going to assume you used the word 'metric' as a substitute for like, the playerbase or the consumer who are playing the game? Not sure.
I would disagree on the metrics aspect as well. A lot of people failed to read between the lines when the announcement on their sub numbers came out.
Out of the 1,452,000 box units sold, they retained 600,000 after their first month. Everyone was jawing "See, the game is a success, it's doing great, and it super-ceded expectations!"
...but the neglected that the goal of 400k subscribers was the expectation for their original numbers. As many people opted to flat-out ignore, SE and Yoshi himself said they expected substantially less people would be picking up/purchasing the game when it came out. Let's play the devil's advocate and assume he expected to sell 800k copies; by that standard, he was expecting a 50% retention rate. Let's say he went for 1 million copies; at that point he went for a 40% retention rate. Based on his comments in the past, I'm thinking they expected more like 700k , which would have been around a 57% retention rate.
So, depending on how you look at it, the numbers are super favorable (+200k extra subscribers more than ever anticipated) or super alarming (ONLY +200k subscribers, despite selling an extra 400k-700k boxes).
I'd still like to see the numbers for this coming month's population, because I suspect they'll be substantially lower than last month's.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
I would disagree on the metrics aspect as well. A lot of people failed to read between the lines when the announcement on their sub numbers came out.
Out of the 1,452,000 box units sold, they retained 600,000 after their first month. Everyone was jawing "See, the game is a success, it's doing great, and it super-ceded expectations!"
...but the neglected that the goal of 400k subscribers was the expectation for their original numbers. As many people opted to flat-out ignore, SE and Yoshi himself said they expected substantially less people would be picking up/purchasing the game when it came out. Let's play the devil's advocate and assume he expected to sell 800k copies; by that standard, he was expecting a 50% retention rate. Let's say he went for 1 million copies; at that point he went for a 40% retention rate. Based on his comments in the past, I'm thinking they expected more like 700k , which would have been around a 57% retention rate.
So, depending on how you look at it, the numbers are super favorable (+200k extra subscribers more than ever anticipated) or super alarming (ONLY +200k subscribers, despite selling an extra 400k-700k boxes).
I'd still like to see the numbers for this coming month's population, because I suspect they'll be substantially lower than last month's.
I believe the 6 month mark is the most healthy prognosticator of long term success. I think, whatever number we have in February or March will be the stable point in terms of subscription numbers.
By that time, we will have had 2 content patches and people will know if it's their mmo of choice. I think this game will stabalize exactly where YoshiP preducted.... 400-450k. He said that, that's enough to make the game a long terms success.
I already know FFXIV is the game for me. I didn't rush through the content... i havn't set foot in Coil. I'm really looking forward to some casual PvP, housing, and Crystal Tower. The two classes I chose to focus on, Warrior/Scholar are primarily in i70 gear which makes them perfect to set foot in Crystal Tower, where it will still be challenging and fun. I'll work on coil as soon as I have i80 gear from Crystal Tower.
This game doesn't need WoW like numbers and no mmo will ever reach that. It doesn't matter if 400k people play FFXIV and 2 million play GW2. Subscription vs. F2P (apples and oranges).
TLDR: 6 month mark greatest predictor of how stable a subscriber base will be. I predict 400 - 450k as the average subscriber base for this game for years to come.
I agree with the OP. As of writing this my subscription is over as I found the game incredibly boring.
I got my Paladin to 50, with Armorer as my 50 craft, and Miner as my gathering. Only times I felt my crafting was useful was giving myself HQ gear with melds on it while leveling and even then the boost wasn't as noticeable as I'd hoped. All of it became obsolete the moment I got AF (2 of the easiest quests ever.) and started collecting DL gear, which again was piss easy to get.
The ONLY time you NEED a party is for Fates. All the way to 50 you have no need to group up with anyone.
I ran through multiple higher level zones as a level 10 and not once did I feel threatened, everything was designed to make you feel safe and if you did get into any trouble then sprint took care of any potential aggro.
No one is a bad ass in XIV. You know that moment when you grouped up with someone and you were in shock and awe of the damage they could do or how well they play? Holy shit, 1.5k damage WS! Yeah, well you get none of that in XIV. Everyone felt generic and almost NPC like to me. No e-peen on this ship. The spells and skills are pathetic. It's all a rotation, just another cheap WoW clone.
Everything was designed for lazy gamers. Sorry, I mean casual gamers? Dungeon Finder, quick teleport to any town on the World Map, Leve quests giving insane amount of exp for HQ hand ins (1 HQ Mythril Ingot LOL), 12k exp for 2Min fates.
I'm by no means a hardcore gamer, but I want at least some amount of difficulty in my games. I could really go on, but it's making me depressed that I wasted money on this WoW clone with FF slapped on the title. So I'll just end it here.
I do not believe the game will fail and go away. Look how long FFXI has lasted on the population it has. BUT I do believe the population will keep dropping. When in beta and early access I saw way too many people that were able to hit 50 in a week or two. This was not a handful it was a mass amount! Then Yoshi says "Let them have their fun" as they FATE'd to 50 with ease. Now many of them are the ones complaining on the forums about end game content and nothing to do. This game is almost as easy as WoW and Rift. Most Final Fantasy 11 players and FF fans in general were hoping for a more challenging game.
I may come back and test it out after the next patch, but not overly excited with the housing anyways.
Originally posted by Scott23 Why are you glad to see that you are right (assuming that you are)? I never understood how people can be so happy when a game that they don't like seems to have problems.
This is what's becoming of a lot of people in the MMO community, they just wish for game they don't like to fail, and at any chance they get bash it as much as possible. One slip up and there all over it like bacteria. The simple fact is if you dont like a game, dont play it, find something else which interests you and let those who do enjoy it do so.
I do understand at times people have concerns about decisions companies make, and wish to voice it, but 99% of the time it's just plan hate, nothing constructive or interesting, just "your games crap" and that's it.
What make this post funny is the original was posted in September but few months later FFXIV hit the 1.5 million player mark. Not sure what it's at now.
I don't know if anyone, aside from perhaps a few who are still living with the parents and have no perspective in the matter, would actually want to see developers lose their livelihoods - especially for having produced something that they had no directive power in. The artists, programmers, writers, musicians, etc... they're not the ones calling the shots. They're just doing what they're paid to do, which is whatever they're told to do by the people who are calling the shots. It's nice to imagine they'd be all willing to stand on ceremony and refuse to contribute to another generic themepark game. But when many of these people have bills, families, etc... well... that's what I meant by "perspective" earlier .
I think it's more in line with many MMO gamers in general waiting for some kind of MMO version of the "100th Monkey" effect to take place. That is, for the genre to collectively reach a point where developers, publishers and bean counters all sorta "wake up" from this WoW-induced daze they've been in for the last decade almost, and realize "oh shit, we've been chasing an unsustainable model. We need to rethink this thing..."
Each MMO that's announced represents a new hope that maybe... just maybe... this will be the MMO to finally break the trend and stop following the color-by-number template that is the standard themepark MMO. When it isn't, well... then maybe we're one more disappointment closer to finally seeing a fresh, new approach to the genre. And if not this one, maybe the next one...
I personally don't want to see any MMO "fail", as in "be shut down permanently". People do have jobs, and no matter how unpopular, those MMOs will still have dedicated players who fully enjoy playing them. I do want to see Publishers, Developers and Bean Counters wake the hell up, though.
John Smedley and SOE - supposedly - have realized this. But I don't know. That remains to be seen.
I don't know if anyone, aside from perhaps a few who are still living with the parents and have no perspective in the matter, would actually want to see developers lose their livelihoods - especially for having produced something that they had no directive power in. The artists, programmers, writers, musicians, etc... they're not the ones calling the shots. They're just doing what they're paid to do, which is whatever they're told to do by the people who are calling the shots. It's nice to imagine they'd be all willing to stand on ceremony and refuse to contribute to another generic themepark game. But when many of these people have bills, families, etc... well... that's what I meant by "perspective" earlier .
I think it's more in line with many MMO gamers in general waiting for some kind of MMO version of the "100th Monkey" effect to take place. That is, for the genre to collectively reach a point where developers, publishers and bean counters all sorta "wake up" from this WoW-induced daze they've been in for the last decade almost, and realize "oh shit, we've been chasing an unsustainable model. We need to rethink this thing..."
Each MMO that's announced represents a new hope that maybe... just maybe... this will be the MMO to finally break the trend and stop following the color-by-number template that is the standard themepark MMO. When it isn't, well... then maybe we're one more disappointment closer to finally seeing a fresh, new approach to the genre. And if not this one, maybe the next one...
I personally don't want to see any MMO "fail", as in "be shut down permanently". People do have jobs, and no matter how unpopular, those MMOs will still have dedicated players who fully enjoy playing them. I do want to see Publishers, Developers and Bean Counters wake the hell up, though.
John Smedley and SOE - supposedly - have realized this. But I don't know. That remains to be seen.
I don't know if you got the chance to play Planetside 2, but that showed me all I needed to see to know that he did not, in fact, learn his lesson. It took such a long, dreadful amount of time to do anything in that game, and they rushed release (again) despite that being the problem with the first PS too.
I truly believe SOE is incapable of learning their lesson. There are many MMO developers out there, but no one boasts a stable of letdowns/failures like SOE, and I do mean absolutely no one.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
You really want to use SOE as an example? My goodness, they have sucked so bad since their Launch platform going all the way back to Infantry. They have learned *nothing* since then and have stuck with the same general platform.
There is a reason why the themepark exists, it is a proven design that delivers. We've seen innovation before and guess what - it failed. Saga of Ryzom was quite a bit ahead of its time. Failed. There's been dozens of indie attempts to break the molds. Failed. They don't get the population required to keep going or the small population prevents the game from breaking out.
Businesses are practical. Most aren't going to take the significant risk to change things. There's no good metric to base design decision, no good data to back up moves. That's the risk/reward of the bleeding edge.
Think about it. WoW started as an amalgamation of existing systems that were present in MMOs for years (Lineage, Ultima, ect.). That is the WoW model - they aren't innovators they are copy artists with slick execution.
IMO; FFXI was one of the best, if not the best mmorpg ever created. I've waited years for a similar experience and have not found it yet.
WoW was totally a different experience in itself and I cannot compare the two. I've played countless mmo's since cancelling FFXI sub and I was seriously expecting FFXIV to satisfy the thirst FFXI left me with but it never happened, even with ARR.
I have concluded that there will never be another game like FFXI, FFXIV is not even to be compared. It's likes apples and oranges to me.
IMO; FFXI was one of the best, if not the best mmorpg ever created. I've waited years for a similar experience and have not found it yet.
WoW was totally a different experience in itself and I cannot compare the two. I've played countless mmo's since cancelling FFXI sub and I was seriously expecting FFXIV to satisfy the thirst FFXI left me with but it never happened, even with ARR.
I have concluded that there will never be another game like FFXI, FFXIV is not even to be compared. It's likes apples and oranges to me.
Games are, like any piece of entertainment, a product of it's time. Produced for the consumer preferences of the era.
We already have several decades - if not centuries - of entertainment to reflect back on. People just don't get what's directly in front of them. A movie made in the 50's is not for me nor most people that live in this day and age.
That doesn't make them bad movies, nor does it make our generation "dumb" for not appreciating them.
I am sure that most people implicitly know this. But they can't look to the modern times and realize that the reality hasn't changed at all. Sadly, neither have the people. Like older people before us, we too are going to be repeating the same age old mantra when the time comes. Good ol' days yadda yadda.
I just feel sad for the new generations to come, as this time the old people know how to use the internet.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
John Smedley and SOE - supposedly - have realized this. But I don't know. That remains to be seen.
I don't know if you got the chance to play Planetside 2, but that showed me all I needed to see to know that he did not, in fact, learn his lesson. It took such a long, dreadful amount of time to do anything in that game, and they rushed release (again) despite that being the problem with the first PS too.
I truly believe SOE is incapable of learning their lesson. There are many MMO developers out there, but no one boasts a stable of letdowns/failures like SOE, and I do mean absolutely no one.
Well, PS2 isn't the game they'd have 'learned it' with, though. It's specifically EQ:N that I'm referring to. They scrapped the first two designs of EQ:N because they realized it was ultimately the same thing everyone (including them) had been putting out the last decade almost. They realized that it's an unsustainable model and that more player-driven (rather than developer-driven) content is a better approach to take.
You really want to use SOE as an example? My goodness, they have sucked so bad since their Launch platform going all the way back to Infantry. They have learned *nothing* since then and have stuck with the same general platform.
There is a reason why the themepark exists, it is a proven design that delivers. We've seen innovation before and guess what - it failed. Saga of Ryzom was quite a bit ahead of its time. Failed. There's been dozens of indie attempts to break the molds. Failed. They don't get the population required to keep going or the small population prevents the game from breaking out.
Businesses are practical. Most aren't going to take the significant risk to change things. There's no good metric to base design decision, no good data to back up moves. That's the risk/reward of the bleeding edge.
Think about it. WoW started as an amalgamation of existing systems that were present in MMOs for years (Lineage, Ultima, ect.). That is the WoW model - they aren't innovators they are copy artists with slick execution.
"Themepark" is a general design model that can encompass any number of different types of content, just as there are many different types of rides at a real theme park that one can choose to go on.
That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about the specific approach developers have been pursuing within that Themepark model which is based around static designer-created content (quests, instances, raids). Content that takes developers months to create is completed inside of a month - sometimes much sooner - leaving players with the option of hopping on the raid grind treadmill, rolling yet another alt, or moving on to something else until the next major update comes out.
This is the pattern the industry has been following, and it's been proving itself to be unsustainable. Even worseis that developers are making the content increasingly faster, easier and focusing more on "convenience" over "effort", which means more people are getting through it even more quickly, exacerbating the issue.
This is what has brought Smedley (again, so he says) to realize that static content-driven gameplay is not the way forward. More dynamic player-driven content is... ergo Everquest Next and its various new gameplay concepts.
Again, in concept it sounds like a solid idea. But I always come back to the same question with Smedley... how much of what he says is real, and how much is PR hype. Hence, why I said "it remains to be seen". He's got the right idea, though, where static content is concerned. You don't need to listen to an industry insider to see how that's been (d)evolving over the past several years.
I don't know if the problem is even static content, to be honest. I find the biggest problem is that it's just getting easier, more mindless, and more dumbed down to the point where people are losing interest in absurdly fast.
Look at FFXIV's combat and customization options. There is less flexibility in this AAA MMO than any other MMO in the last decade. Yes, you can add in skills from other classes... but the core of the combat system and character development is so elementary and basic that there's no really complex options. Just to use an example (not saying it's REQUIRED by the way, just that it is an option), look at MMO's that have skill trees, at the least. Classes have SOME variety based on a play style with those. Look at say, Eve, which has even more options available based on ship types and skills learned.
That's not present in FFXIV at all. All classes look identical, and they'll play identical to anyone else of the same class (barring slight differences in numbers based on gear). But things like elemental damage, skill variation, talent trees, runes, masteries, gems, whatever you wanna call them, are all painfully absent. I still remember when Yoshi P said, not even kidding, people aren't interested in things like elemental damage. What...?
The unsustainable part is true. As easy as FFXIV is, you'd need to pump out content 2x a month to keep the average player occupied consistently. Mind you, that content would also have to be meaningful, because if it's just endless grinding, people will also lose interest, too. The only reason more people haven't cleared FFXIV in it's entirety is because of hard progression timers/caps (Myth tomes, Coil timers).
MMO's could, in my opinion, follow the same, exact themepark approach they have been following for years... so long as they were challenging. As it stands though, they just keep making it more and more mindless, and less and less enjoyable.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
I don't know if the problem is even static content, to be honest. I find the biggest problem is that it's just getting easier, more mindless, and more dumbed down to the point where people are losing interest in absurdly fast.
It's a combo of both, each contributing to the same problem.
Static content has a high amount of built-in obsolescence to begin with. Once it's done... it's no longer relevant (at least on that character). Once you leave an area, you seldom ever have a reason to go back. That zone has served its purpose, getting you from level "x" to level "y", and now it's time to move on to the next quest hub in the next zone, for the next wave of levels.
The ease/mindlessness of it plays into the idea of "letting people progress quickly through the game", which means that not only do all that content and all those zones and areas become obsolete as soon as you've turned in the last quest, but they become so even faster because the content has become so dumbed-down and mindless.
Look at FFXIV's combat and customization options. There is less flexibility in this AAA MMO than any other MMO in the last decade. Yes, you can add in skills from other classes... but the core of the combat system and character development is so elementary and basic that there's no really complex options. Just to use an example (not saying it's REQUIRED by the way, just that it is an option), look at MMO's that have skill trees, at the least. Classes have SOME variety based on a play style with those. Look at say, Eve, which has even more options available based on ship types and skills learned.
That's not present in FFXIV at all. All classes look identical, and they'll play identical to anyone else of the same class (barring slight differences in numbers based on gear). But things like elemental damage, skill variation, talent trees, runes, masteries, gems, whatever you wanna call them, are all painfully absent. I still remember when Yoshi P said, not even kidding, people aren't interested in things like elemental damage. What...?
Yeah, he's made a lot of head-scratch inducing remarks to that end, especially as re-launch drew nearer. He seems to relate a lot of things to "stress". He's afraid of "stressing out" the players. Somehow having an elemental wheel would be "stressful" to him. Making fishing a more involved, interactive mini-game was a no-go because "clicking buttons is stressful" (as opposed to clicking buttons for literally everything else in the game....?). He made decisions to omit content that people clearly wanted in the game; things that would provide more options... more things for people to do to mix it up. He said "no" because those things were not how he wanted people playing the game. To be frank, it seemed at times that he was more interested in making his own "dream MMO" for himself, than he was in making something for the thousands who'd be playing it.
When I think back over the months of ARR's development (in which I was highly interested), it occurs to me now - in hindsight - that the times he seemed the most brilliant is when he had the least to say, or perhaps had to say the least. It was more visual stuff, screenshots, videos... Descriptions of general concepts and plans. It was seldom ever anything very specific. He seemed to deliberately avoid certain topics when asked, and people assumed "okay well the game's still in development, so he's just being smart about it".
However, it's when we started nearing the game's later Beta stages, when getting that info that was previously "off-limits" out there became more important - that his more "WTF?" type remarks and intentions started to be revealed. It's almost like he knew what parts of the design were weak or would be unpopular, and so delayed revealing those details until the very last minute.
Again, that wasn't obvious at the time. But in retrospect, it's interesting what info was released, and what info was held back.
The unsustainable part is true. As easy as FFXIV is, you'd need to pump out content 2x a month to keep the average player occupied consistently. Mind you, that content would also have to be meaningful, because if it's just endless grinding, people will also lose interest, too. The only reason more people haven't cleared FFXIV in it's entirety is because of hard progression timers/caps (Myth tomes, Coil timers).
True. Friends of mine - all very casual players (a few hours a night, maybe 3-4 nights a week tops) were nearing level cap within the first month. The only way they could slow things down was by stopping whatever progress they were making, and doing other things that didn't reward xp. I noticed the same thing when I played it; it took more effort to not level quickly. That's another thing I'm noticing in many newer MMOs. They're in such a damn hurry to get you to level cap, it almost makes you wonder why they even bother with the low-mid levels in those games. Mind you, I prefer the journey to the destination. I don't want the game to go fast, so to me, it's frustrating when it is, even despite my efforts to slow it down.
MMO's could, in my opinion, follow the same, exact themepark approach they have been following for years... so long as they were challenging. As it stands though, they just keep making it more and more mindless, and less and less enjoyable.
Indeed. As I was explaining (or trying to anyway heh) to someone else in a previous post in this thread, Themepark is not a strict definition of "exactly what a game is supposed to be like". It's a Framework. It can be used in any of a variety of ways. Someone could definitely create a themepark type MMO that didn't race you through the levels, that didn't make it all about the end-game raid/gear grind, that didn't focus on "faster, easier xp", but instead focused on challenging content, on exploration, on adventure, etc.
A well designed themepark MMO could keep people playing for years - without boredom - through well-paced, intelligently designed and well-distributed relevant content across all levels. There are already MMOs that have done this. Of course, those MMOs were a bit more old-school, and didn't have the "modern MMO gamer" for whom "getting to level cap quickly" is the "holy grail" and the only reason to play.
Unfortunately, because the people signing the checks are getting their info based on market data, all they're going to see is "which MMO is making the most money... we have to emulate that". And for now, WoW is still the 800 lb. gorilla in that room, and so that's who they keep trying to emulate...and coming up short. They don't listen to the players.. only to their $$$. And for now, the $$$ still says "emulate WoW". Hence, WoW-like themeparks is what we'll continue to get, with ever shallower content, ever faster leveling, ever more convenience, ever less challenge or depth.
If you think this game is not going to go free to play you're deluded. The base of the game can happily support free to play with a cash shop, all you have to do is look at the core of the game and compare it to a current f2p title and how it makes money, it's designed to be able to swap to f2p really easily. If you can't see the writing on the wall you are simply refusing to see it. Cosmetics, cosmetic tabs built in, mounts, pets, fantasias. It will come, SE are not above such things...especially in their current position.
It never happened with ffxi because it cost them 10 million to create that game (which meant it easily made the money back from subs and full price box sales over a few years), was launched well before f2p and is on systems totally unable to offer a proper f2p system and make money from it. Ps2 can't run a secure cash shop system ingame so it is p2p or bust for that game.
So stop using FFXI as an excuse for anything, this is not FFXI.
Indeed. Your statements also bring to light an interesting double-standard among many who claim ARR will never go F2P...
Mention FFXI in just about any other context, and you're pretty much guaranteed to be told how FFXI doesn't count because "it was made at a different time, the MMO genre has changed, players have moved on, there were fewer options then... stop living in the past..." and any of a number of other reasons they conjure up and/or regurgitate to explain why XI's undeniable success somehow "doesn't matter" in the context of discussing a "more modern MMO like ARR".
Yet... Bring up the possibility of SE switching to F2P/Cash Shop - a revenue model that has been enthusiastically embraced by both players and developers/publishers as a new and "modern" way to approach monetization.. and those very same people who denounced everything else to do with FFXI will suddenly embrace it as THE absolute Ace In The Hole proof that SE would never go that route with ARR.
Funny how that works, isn't it?
There's also how Yoshi-P has flat out stated that while F2P/Cash Shop isn't his first choice, that he has considered a F2P/Cash Shop approach for ARR if it ever came to that. Why put thought into something like that - with considerable detail and reasoning, based on his explanation - if you've already determined "it'll never happen"?
The only way a sensible person would think this won't go free to play is believing a company in serious financial trouble simply won't do it out of principle and is ok with losing a large amount of money because of that. There is no way this game won't go free to play and it amazes me intelligent people can't see that.
Yep. If/when ARR should ever reach a point where it's just not sustainable with subs, you bet your behind the people making the real decisions at SE are going to be open to making that change. There's not a damn thing Yoshi-P will have to say about it, beyond "Yes, sir."
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989 Yeah, as much as I love the game, the next content patch (2.1) will not have any progression past Binding Coil of Bahamut. Leaving the vast majority of the player base who has already completed the game with nothing to look forward to other than getting gear for their other classes/alts. Due to the fact that my guild has already downed all 5 turns I'm personally not subscribing to the game until I know there's content in the game that'll keep me going. So I've taken my money and gone to Wakfu . Good lucky to all of those who are still progressing through the game.
Hehe wow that is interesting. Just goes to show how varied our tastes and expectations are from game to game and even with the same game.
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The thing I am more shocked about is, another "This MMO will Fail" Post. I did not expect to see that .....don't wait for the shocked face.
This is what's becoming of a lot of people in the MMO community, they just wish for game they don't like to fail, and at any chance they get bash it as much as possible. One slip up and there all over it like bacteria. The simple fact is if you dont like a game, dont play it, find something else which interests you and let those who do enjoy it do so.
I do understand at times people have concerns about decisions companies make, and wish to voice it, but 99% of the time it's just plan hate, nothing constructive or interesting, just "your games crap" and that's it.
What make this post funny is the original was posted in September but few months later FFXIV hit the 1.5 million player mark. Not sure what it's at now.
Lmao, every single metric disagrees with you. The game has far surpassed everything the developers set for it in terms of expected outcome. Sounds like u mad bro.
Excuse me, but I don't see the part where I said I was glad it failed. Can you point it out too me? I said that I am glad too see that I was right, didn't bother with a pre order, as I knew it would be a waste. Never did I say "Boy, I sure am glad this game sucks!" I just said I was glad I was right with my initial thoughts that teh game is teh suk.
[quote] Lmao, every single metric disagrees with you. The game has far surpassed everything the developers set for it in terms of expected outcome. Sounds like u mad bro. [/quote]
I'm not sure what you mean by "Every single Metric" I have not used that word used in this context. If the game has far surpassed everything the devs set for it, than I am gravely upset at their poor outlook for the game. It's a 5/10 at best. Honest opinion on the game. Not trying to hate parade it or anything, I just think it could/should have been MUCH better for what it could be.
Obviously you didn't read my 6000 word essay on the game, and how to improve it. lol. Oh, and it was posted in July, not September. It was posted at the end of the Beta, just before launch.
Google what a metric is, it's a pretty simple concept...promise, i shouldn't hurt too much to read.
I did...
: a standard of measurement <no metric exists that can be applied directly to happiness — Scientific Monthly>
: a mathematical function that associates a real nonnegative number analogous to distance with each pair of elements in a set such that the number is zero only if the two elements are identical, the number is the same regardless of the order in which the two elements are taken, and the number associated with one pair of elements plus that associated with one member of the pair and a third element is equal to or greater than the number associated with the other member of the pair and the third element
I would disagree on the metrics aspect as well. A lot of people failed to read between the lines when the announcement on their sub numbers came out.
Out of the 1,452,000 box units sold, they retained 600,000 after their first month. Everyone was jawing "See, the game is a success, it's doing great, and it super-ceded expectations!"
...but the neglected that the goal of 400k subscribers was the expectation for their original numbers. As many people opted to flat-out ignore, SE and Yoshi himself said they expected substantially less people would be picking up/purchasing the game when it came out. Let's play the devil's advocate and assume he expected to sell 800k copies; by that standard, he was expecting a 50% retention rate. Let's say he went for 1 million copies; at that point he went for a 40% retention rate. Based on his comments in the past, I'm thinking they expected more like 700k , which would have been around a 57% retention rate.
So, depending on how you look at it, the numbers are super favorable (+200k extra subscribers more than ever anticipated) or super alarming (ONLY +200k subscribers, despite selling an extra 400k-700k boxes).
I'd still like to see the numbers for this coming month's population, because I suspect they'll be substantially lower than last month's.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
I believe the 6 month mark is the most healthy prognosticator of long term success. I think, whatever number we have in February or March will be the stable point in terms of subscription numbers.
By that time, we will have had 2 content patches and people will know if it's their mmo of choice. I think this game will stabalize exactly where YoshiP preducted.... 400-450k. He said that, that's enough to make the game a long terms success.
I already know FFXIV is the game for me. I didn't rush through the content... i havn't set foot in Coil. I'm really looking forward to some casual PvP, housing, and Crystal Tower. The two classes I chose to focus on, Warrior/Scholar are primarily in i70 gear which makes them perfect to set foot in Crystal Tower, where it will still be challenging and fun. I'll work on coil as soon as I have i80 gear from Crystal Tower.
This game doesn't need WoW like numbers and no mmo will ever reach that. It doesn't matter if 400k people play FFXIV and 2 million play GW2. Subscription vs. F2P (apples and oranges).
TLDR: 6 month mark greatest predictor of how stable a subscriber base will be. I predict 400 - 450k as the average subscriber base for this game for years to come.
I agree with the OP. As of writing this my subscription is over as I found the game incredibly boring.
I got my Paladin to 50, with Armorer as my 50 craft, and Miner as my gathering. Only times I felt my crafting was useful was giving myself HQ gear with melds on it while leveling and even then the boost wasn't as noticeable as I'd hoped. All of it became obsolete the moment I got AF (2 of the easiest quests ever.) and started collecting DL gear, which again was piss easy to get.
The ONLY time you NEED a party is for Fates. All the way to 50 you have no need to group up with anyone.
I ran through multiple higher level zones as a level 10 and not once did I feel threatened, everything was designed to make you feel safe and if you did get into any trouble then sprint took care of any potential aggro.
No one is a bad ass in XIV. You know that moment when you grouped up with someone and you were in shock and awe of the damage they could do or how well they play? Holy shit, 1.5k damage WS! Yeah, well you get none of that in XIV. Everyone felt generic and almost NPC like to me. No e-peen on this ship. The spells and skills are pathetic. It's all a rotation, just another cheap WoW clone.
Everything was designed for lazy gamers. Sorry, I mean casual gamers? Dungeon Finder, quick teleport to any town on the World Map, Leve quests giving insane amount of exp for HQ hand ins (1 HQ Mythril Ingot LOL), 12k exp for 2Min fates.
I'm by no means a hardcore gamer, but I want at least some amount of difficulty in my games. I could really go on, but it's making me depressed that I wasted money on this WoW clone with FF slapped on the title. So I'll just end it here.
I do not believe the game will fail and go away. Look how long FFXI has lasted on the population it has. BUT I do believe the population will keep dropping. When in beta and early access I saw way too many people that were able to hit 50 in a week or two. This was not a handful it was a mass amount! Then Yoshi says "Let them have their fun" as they FATE'd to 50 with ease. Now many of them are the ones complaining on the forums about end game content and nothing to do. This game is almost as easy as WoW and Rift. Most Final Fantasy 11 players and FF fans in general were hoping for a more challenging game.
I may come back and test it out after the next patch, but not overly excited with the housing anyways.
I don't know if anyone, aside from perhaps a few who are still living with the parents and have no perspective in the matter, would actually want to see developers lose their livelihoods - especially for having produced something that they had no directive power in. The artists, programmers, writers, musicians, etc... they're not the ones calling the shots. They're just doing what they're paid to do, which is whatever they're told to do by the people who are calling the shots. It's nice to imagine they'd be all willing to stand on ceremony and refuse to contribute to another generic themepark game. But when many of these people have bills, families, etc... well... that's what I meant by "perspective" earlier
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I think it's more in line with many MMO gamers in general waiting for some kind of MMO version of the "100th Monkey" effect to take place. That is, for the genre to collectively reach a point where developers, publishers and bean counters all sorta "wake up" from this WoW-induced daze they've been in for the last decade almost, and realize "oh shit, we've been chasing an unsustainable model. We need to rethink this thing..."
Each MMO that's announced represents a new hope that maybe... just maybe... this will be the MMO to finally break the trend and stop following the color-by-number template that is the standard themepark MMO. When it isn't, well... then maybe we're one more disappointment closer to finally seeing a fresh, new approach to the genre. And if not this one, maybe the next one...
I personally don't want to see any MMO "fail", as in "be shut down permanently". People do have jobs, and no matter how unpopular, those MMOs will still have dedicated players who fully enjoy playing them. I do want to see Publishers, Developers and Bean Counters wake the hell up, though.
John Smedley and SOE - supposedly - have realized this. But I don't know. That remains to be seen.
I don't know if you got the chance to play Planetside 2, but that showed me all I needed to see to know that he did not, in fact, learn his lesson. It took such a long, dreadful amount of time to do anything in that game, and they rushed release (again) despite that being the problem with the first PS too.
I truly believe SOE is incapable of learning their lesson. There are many MMO developers out there, but no one boasts a stable of letdowns/failures like SOE, and I do mean absolutely no one.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
You really want to use SOE as an example? My goodness, they have sucked so bad since their Launch platform going all the way back to Infantry. They have learned *nothing* since then and have stuck with the same general platform.
There is a reason why the themepark exists, it is a proven design that delivers. We've seen innovation before and guess what - it failed. Saga of Ryzom was quite a bit ahead of its time. Failed. There's been dozens of indie attempts to break the molds. Failed. They don't get the population required to keep going or the small population prevents the game from breaking out.
Businesses are practical. Most aren't going to take the significant risk to change things. There's no good metric to base design decision, no good data to back up moves. That's the risk/reward of the bleeding edge.
Think about it. WoW started as an amalgamation of existing systems that were present in MMOs for years (Lineage, Ultima, ect.). That is the WoW model - they aren't innovators they are copy artists with slick execution.
IMO; FFXI was one of the best, if not the best mmorpg ever created. I've waited years for a similar experience and have not found it yet.
WoW was totally a different experience in itself and I cannot compare the two. I've played countless mmo's since cancelling FFXI sub and I was seriously expecting FFXIV to satisfy the thirst FFXI left me with but it never happened, even with ARR.
I have concluded that there will never be another game like FFXI, FFXIV is not even to be compared. It's likes apples and oranges to me.
Games are, like any piece of entertainment, a product of it's time. Produced for the consumer preferences of the era.
We already have several decades - if not centuries - of entertainment to reflect back on. People just don't get what's directly in front of them. A movie made in the 50's is not for me nor most people that live in this day and age.
That doesn't make them bad movies, nor does it make our generation "dumb" for not appreciating them.
I am sure that most people implicitly know this. But they can't look to the modern times and realize that the reality hasn't changed at all. Sadly, neither have the people. Like older people before us, we too are going to be repeating the same age old mantra when the time comes. Good ol' days yadda yadda.
I just feel sad for the new generations to come, as this time the old people know how to use the internet.
Well, PS2 isn't the game they'd have 'learned it' with, though. It's specifically EQ:N that I'm referring to. They scrapped the first two designs of EQ:N because they realized it was ultimately the same thing everyone (including them) had been putting out the last decade almost. They realized that it's an unsustainable model and that more player-driven (rather than developer-driven) content is a better approach to take.
Like I said, though... that remains to be seen.
Smedley does love spinning him some PR.
its an old game that was revamped and launched at the right time.
toush wood never will I play that kind of mindless crap again.
"Themepark" is a general design model that can encompass any number of different types of content, just as there are many different types of rides at a real theme park that one can choose to go on.
That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about the specific approach developers have been pursuing within that Themepark model which is based around static designer-created content (quests, instances, raids). Content that takes developers months to create is completed inside of a month - sometimes much sooner - leaving players with the option of hopping on the raid grind treadmill, rolling yet another alt, or moving on to something else until the next major update comes out.
This is the pattern the industry has been following, and it's been proving itself to be unsustainable. Even worse is that developers are making the content increasingly faster, easier and focusing more on "convenience" over "effort", which means more people are getting through it even more quickly, exacerbating the issue.
This is what has brought Smedley (again, so he says) to realize that static content-driven gameplay is not the way forward. More dynamic player-driven content is... ergo Everquest Next and its various new gameplay concepts.
Again, in concept it sounds like a solid idea. But I always come back to the same question with Smedley... how much of what he says is real, and how much is PR hype. Hence, why I said "it remains to be seen". He's got the right idea, though, where static content is concerned. You don't need to listen to an industry insider to see how that's been (d)evolving over the past several years.
I don't know if the problem is even static content, to be honest. I find the biggest problem is that it's just getting easier, more mindless, and more dumbed down to the point where people are losing interest in absurdly fast.
Look at FFXIV's combat and customization options. There is less flexibility in this AAA MMO than any other MMO in the last decade. Yes, you can add in skills from other classes... but the core of the combat system and character development is so elementary and basic that there's no really complex options. Just to use an example (not saying it's REQUIRED by the way, just that it is an option), look at MMO's that have skill trees, at the least. Classes have SOME variety based on a play style with those. Look at say, Eve, which has even more options available based on ship types and skills learned.
That's not present in FFXIV at all. All classes look identical, and they'll play identical to anyone else of the same class (barring slight differences in numbers based on gear). But things like elemental damage, skill variation, talent trees, runes, masteries, gems, whatever you wanna call them, are all painfully absent. I still remember when Yoshi P said, not even kidding, people aren't interested in things like elemental damage. What...?
The unsustainable part is true. As easy as FFXIV is, you'd need to pump out content 2x a month to keep the average player occupied consistently. Mind you, that content would also have to be meaningful, because if it's just endless grinding, people will also lose interest, too. The only reason more people haven't cleared FFXIV in it's entirety is because of hard progression timers/caps (Myth tomes, Coil timers).
MMO's could, in my opinion, follow the same, exact themepark approach they have been following for years... so long as they were challenging. As it stands though, they just keep making it more and more mindless, and less and less enjoyable.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Hehe wow that is interesting. Just goes to show how varied our tastes and expectations are from game to game and even with the same game.