You do get that RPGs and questing go hand in hand? This has been the case as far back as I can remember. Even old school 8 bit RPGs did it. Gota ask, if you are sick of them, maybe you need a break from this type of game. Go play fighting games for a while or something.
Also with Wildstar, stop doing task missions, they are not required. Just do the main story and go level a different way, dungeons, Shiphand missions, PvP. There are lots of options.
Not really. I played MMOs since Meridian 59 and far from all games had quests, some had few quests (like Meridian had and it was the first MMO) while others were heavy on quests.
Doing dungeons and stuff do help to get quest-heavy games feel less railroaded and hiding the quests like GW2 does with DEs also help but there is a personal preference to how much quests a game should have. That OP think WS have too much while others don't isn't really that strange.
Questing is one way to drive the story forward and to tell you what you should do next (you can call it hand holding) but it is far from the only way. Lineage had just a few tutorial quests (at launch at least, played the beta and a while after) and it still was fun at the time.But there are plenty of other ways to get the story onward and have things to do.
RPG games are after all based on pen and paper RPGs and they don't require quests at all even if you usually have a certain goal at a time that in some ways can be similar to a quests, or with some GMs be exactly a quest. In some of them you either make up your own goals whenever you feel for it or just play to have fun without any specific goals at all.
Personally I think MMOs should have some quests, but those should be epic ones that takes time and skill to complete (like throwing the one ring in mount Doom to mention one quest from literature) and you should only have a few ones at ones. Full questlogs with a zillion often similar and easy quests get boring fast and I tend to loose both focus and interest that way.
I also think GW2 are on the right way with one thing: all DEs there needs to be done now instead of whenever you feel for it and are close, that makes them feel more urgent and focuses player on actually completing them.
But no, MMOs don't need quests to be MMOs, they just need to let your character interact with the world and others(players or npcs) and let your character grow as you play. That and being massive online of course.
It's very interesting. I see a lot of stuff (mostly on this site, which always has tons of negativity regarding anything that isn't "old school") about the leveling being too slow, the game being too difficult, etc., and it really makes me shake my head. If the leveling was fast and the quests were few, or the game was easy, a lot of the same types of people would complain there too. I'm down with everyone having their own opinion and all, but I think some people need to accept the fact that no matter what, they will never be satisfied.
Personally, I've enjoyed the experience thoroughly, and I'm glad the adventure (leveling, gaining XP, etc.) has been longer than some games and the story has been great. Combined with the combat system, I've had a blast. I'm glad not too many people are hitting end-game too fast. It's the way it should be. As a long-time RPG'er, the journey means something to me, and I don't want it to be a short memory.
Well said... I agree 100%.
I do have to say that I think the MMORPG community is probably the hardest group of folks to satisfy. People will say games like WoW use to be awesome but now suck because they are way too easy but then when a game comes out that isn't super fast and easy the same folks will say, "The game is too much of a grind and it's boring!". The game can't be both hard and easy.
Another thing that always gets me is when people say, "I don't like this game because it requires you to group for quests/dungeons!", yeah no kidding, you're playing an MMO not a single player RPG.
I mean this is the first game in a long time that has come along at launch and has had so much to offer. The combat system is way better than ESO, WoW, FFXIV, etc, it's fast paced and not clunky. There is player housing which is a super cool feature that gives you something else to do when you just feel like chilling. There is PvP for people that like to pew pew things other than NPCs. There are more than enough quests to do that if you find a specific hub boring you can just move to the next. Not to mention that they are actually releasing a content patch one month after launch.
I can see people not liking Wildstar because they aren't into the setting of space and they prefer more traditional fantasy type lore but I can't not understand how anyone that considers themselves an MMO gamer would not totally be into this game. In my opinion if you say that you don't like this game because of anything other than the setting you are either not really into the MMORPG genre anymore, you're burnt out on it, or you were never really a fan of the genre to begin with.
WildStar levelling is slow? Apparently most of you never played LineAge. LineAge levelling makes Wildstar feel like warp speed.
To the point where people are tired of questing, why even bother playing a MMORPG? No matter how much you cry and whine about quests in a MMO, it's still a RPG at the end of the day, RPG = quests, flame and troll all you want, RPG = quests and nothing in the world will change that.
You do get that RPGs and questing go hand in hand? This has been the case as far back as I can remember. Even old school 8 bit RPGs did it. Gota ask, if you are sick of them, maybe you need a break from this type of game. Go play fighting games for a while or something.
Also with Wildstar, stop doing task missions, they are not required. Just do the main story and go level a different way, dungeons, Shiphand missions, PvP. There are lots of options.
Not really. I played MMOs since Meridian 59 and far from all games had quests, some had few quests (like Meridian had and it was the first MMO) while others were heavy on quests.
Doing dungeons and stuff do help to get quest-heavy games feel less railroaded and hiding the quests like GW2 does with DEs also help but there is a personal preference to how much quests a game should have. That OP think WS have too much while others don't isn't really that strange.
Questing is one way to drive the story forward and to tell you what you should do next (you can call it hand holding) but it is far from the only way. Lineage had just a few tutorial quests (at launch at least, played the beta and a while after) and it still was fun at the time.But there are plenty of other ways to get the story onward and have things to do.
RPG games are after all based on pen and paper RPGs and they don't require quests at all even if you usually have a certain goal at a time that in some ways can be similar to a quests, or with some GMs be exactly a quest. In some of them you either make up your own goals whenever you feel for it or just play to have fun without any specific goals at all.
Personally I think MMOs should have some quests, but those should be epic ones that takes time and skill to complete (like throwing the one ring in mount Doom to mention one quest from literature) and you should only have a few ones at ones. Full questlogs with a zillion often similar and easy quests get boring fast and I tend to loose both focus and interest that way.
I also think GW2 are on the right way with one thing: all DEs there needs to be done now instead of whenever you feel for it and are close, that makes them feel more urgent and focuses player on actually completing them.
But no, MMOs don't need quests to be MMOs, they just need to let your character interact with the world and others(players or npcs) and let your character grow as you play. That and being massive online of course.
Quest, goal, story progression be that PnP, RPG or a mmorpg all have some type of quest system. Call it what you may but its there. I used to be a GM for PnP and every story was a quest/adventure with side stories and side quests. There not as in your face with an exclamation mark in your face. But the mechanics behind it is in every RPG. GW2 did a good job of not so in your face I agree. But read the thread, as stated you dont need to do all the task quests, thats 95% of the quests in WS. Do the main story quest and use all the other content to level, its can be done and many are doing just that.
WildStar levelling is slow? Apparently most of you never played LineAge. LineAge levelling makes Wildstar feel like warp speed.
To the point where people are tired of questing, why even bother playing a MMORPG? No matter how much you cry and whine about quests in a MMO, it's still a RPG at the end of the day, RPG = quests, flame and troll all you want, RPG = quests and nothing in the world will change that.
I seriously think most people that think the lvling process is slow probably started playing the genre after vanilla WoW. I mean if you think back to EQ, vanilla WoW, LoTRO, EQ2, Vanguard, etc, Wildstar is no where near as slow.
Wildstar is slow in comparison to current day WoW where you can level to 90 in 2 days played time or the casual fest that is GW2 but it's not that slow in comparison the older games in the genre (which I believe the devs were going for).
WildStar levelling is slow? Apparently most of you never played LineAge. LineAge levelling makes Wildstar feel like warp speed.
To the point where people are tired of questing, why even bother playing a MMORPG? No matter how much you cry and whine about quests in a MMO, it's still a RPG at the end of the day, RPG = quests, flame and troll all you want, RPG = quests and nothing in the world will change that.
You do get that RPGs and questing go hand in hand? This has been the case as far back as I can remember.
It's different. I don't know why it's different (some of the Wildstar quests actually had a surprising amount of depth), but it is.
All I know is mmos like SWTOR and secret world made me care about the story and the quests I was doing and the npcs I was interacting with. MMOs like WoW and Wildstar don't. The quests are just numbers on a checklist. In fact, the questing is so bad in WoW I don't know a single person that doesn't race to lvl 15 just so they can hope into LFD and never think about the experience again (least 'till they hit expansion gates).
It's the same for me in Wildstar. When I made an alt, I quit the process at lvl 6 and just started chain-queuing the same godawful battleground over and over again--and I still find it to be a more enjoyable experience. I'll probably continue all the way up to 50 this way since the other bg takes too long and adventures/dungeons aren't really viable for leveling.
Maybe I'm just burned out, but the whole process of questing in these types of mmos is so mind-numbingly boring and meaningless, and the more involved combat makes doing it all on autopilot while multitasking awkward.
Wow.. you summed up my feelings on it also lol. In Secret World, SWTOR and lately, FF14, I actually find myself reading and getting into the quest and story line. Games like Wildstar kinda just make you want to hit max level clicking through the quest at full speed and just seeing what you need to turn it in.
People hate tasks that are simple mob grinds, not realising that basic task like quests are a direct descendant of mob grinding mmo - with periodic rewards added. Personally I prefer my quests to have meaning and a storyline i like.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
It's not the questing per say that bothered me enough to stop playing, it was the, I am in the THIRD zone and have about 100 quests, all going in different directions and places which lead to even MORE quests. On top of that, I was a scientist. Too much to handle for me.
Just drop everything appart from the main quests, or the quests that interest you. I'm not saying you ate doing this, but some are hitting an area where there are quests, and falling back to old habits of xp farming.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Originally posted by elocke Yes. However, I actually like questing in my games, but there comes a point where the pacing needs to be just right. Wildstar doesn't do the pacing well at all. I stopped playing this week at 44 due to quest and slow leveling overload. I had this problem with Rift too. When a quest should give double to triple the xp but doesn't tells you how bad it is. This is one area WoW at least figured out. Their leveling pacing via quests is just about perfect.
I like the slower level speed. I find MMOs are making lazy gamers and it starts with the easy leveling system. Its not even slowed down that much in WS, just enough you know it. Im an old EQ1 vet, you should try what they used to call hell levels back in that game. When you get max level I like to feel like I earned something epic. Not WoW style where I can crank out a max level with little effort.
See, that's the thing though. The only viable xp is questing. PVP is an option but with only 2 BGs to choose from that gets stale real fast. If there was another alternative, like pugging adventures/dungeons in between questing that didn't take 2 hours or frustrate one to the point of skipping the content in the first place, then the leveling pace wouldn't be so bad.
Something else you all old timers seem to forget, there was more to the games back then, at least in FFXI there was and I know that was a clone of EQ1, where leveling multiple times was FUN because of the sheer amount of stuff to do and unlock on the way to level cap. Endgame was something for elitists to tackle while the rest of the playerbase had just as much fun and rewards on the way up.
Can we apply that to today's MMOs? I don't think we can. All of their rewards aside from story come at the cap. Sure you can unlock mounts and housing and content but nothing on par with EQ/FFXI content. So, yes the pace of leveling when the rewards are all stockpiled at the end and the actual multiplayer part of the game really comes forth, is too slow. So no, leveling to max level isn't as rewarding as it was in those older games.
Oh, I've resubbed to FFXI this week and have been having a blast doing all the content that one needs to do on the way up. I'm not even considering endgame content as I want to see all the inbetween stuff.
See, that's the thing though. The only viable xp is questing. PVP is an option but with only 2 BGs to choose from that gets stale real fast. If there was another alternative, like pugging adventures/dungeons in between questing that didn't take 2 hours or frustrate one to the point of skipping the content in the first place, then the leveling pace wouldn't be so bad.
In my opinion this statement is the exact issue that most "gamers" have. You are not happy with 2 PvP BGs to level with, you want 4. You don't like running adventures because they are "too difficult" and you get frustrated so you would just rather not do them so you are "forced" to quest. In other words, you don't really want to enjoy the game you just want to fly through it without having to concentrate or focus on it.
My point is, I would rather a dungeon take 4 hours (like BRS in WoW in vanilla) to complete so that when I am done I actually feel some sense of accomplishment as opposed to just feeling like, what's next. In a lot of the older games PvP didn't even award XP and there weren't any battlegrounds so your only PvP experience while leveling was killing people lower level than you and being killed by people higher level as you ran from quest to quest.
There are tons of ways to get experience in the game... If you don't like questing, do dungeons, PvP, etc. You don't like waiting for queues, then OS tank or heals. You don't like PuGing then find a guild and make friends so you can run with them. Kind of see where I am going with this?
I got didn't get past level 13, and I was REALLY pushing myself.
and I played lots of mmos which are somehow considered to be grindfests like darkfall 1&2, haven, salem.
and no you cannot compare wildstar quests to a real RPG, even ESO tried to directly recreate skyrims quest and fell epically short. quality > quantity.
Originally posted by elocke Yes. However, I actually like questing in my games, but there comes a point where the pacing needs to be just right. Wildstar doesn't do the pacing well at all. I stopped playing this week at 44 due to quest and slow leveling overload. I had this problem with Rift too. When a quest should give double to triple the xp but doesn't tells you how bad it is. This is one area WoW at least figured out. Their leveling pacing via quests is just about perfect.
I like the slower level speed. I find MMOs are making lazy gamers and it starts with the easy leveling system. Its not even slowed down that much in WS, just enough you know it. Im an old EQ1 vet, you should try what they used to call hell levels back in that game. When you get max level I like to feel like I earned something epic. Not WoW style where I can crank out a max level with little effort.
See, that's the thing though. The only viable xp is questing. PVP is an option but with only 2 BGs to choose from that gets stale real fast. If there was another alternative, like pugging adventures/dungeons in between questing that didn't take 2 hours or frustrate one to the point of skipping the content in the first place, then the leveling pace wouldn't be so bad.
Something else you all old timers seem to forget, there was more to the games back then, at least in FFXI there was and I know that was a clone of EQ1, where leveling multiple times was FUN because of the sheer amount of stuff to do and unlock on the way to level cap. Endgame was something for elitists to tackle while the rest of the playerbase had just as much fun and rewards on the way up.
Can we apply that to today's MMOs? I don't think we can. All of their rewards aside from story come at the cap. Sure you can unlock mounts and housing and content but nothing on par with EQ/FFXI content. So, yes the pace of leveling when the rewards are all stockpiled at the end and the actual multiplayer part of the game really comes forth, is too slow. So no, leveling to max level isn't as rewarding as it was in those older games.
Oh, I've resubbed to FFXI this week and have been having a blast doing all the content that one needs to do on the way up. I'm not even considering endgame content as I want to see all the inbetween stuff.
But thats what WS is doing. Going back to MMO roots. Things are not handed out on a silver platter like most MMOs today. Its designed for the hard core player. Knowing that getting to the end game means something. That being able to walk into a raid means you spent time setting that up. To run a dungeon means its not any pug will do. You need to know your class and be dressed for that dungeon and your role. This is what this game is for. People who fit the style.
Seeing people freak out because its to hard or cant figure out how to level makes me smile. The options are there you just need to read. Its like the people upset only 1 starting area. If they had read they would know they have 2 options. So what if you level slower when your not questing!!! Your leveling in whats considered end game play. MMOs never should be a race and when they became one, things started going bad and so did the communities. This game is worth getting to end game, you just need to learn, this is kicking it old school with a modern twist.
Originally posted by elocke Yes. However, I actually like questing in my games, but there comes a point where the pacing needs to be just right. Wildstar doesn't do the pacing well at all. I stopped playing this week at 44 due to quest and slow leveling overload. I had this problem with Rift too. When a quest should give double to triple the xp but doesn't tells you how bad it is. This is one area WoW at least figured out. Their leveling pacing via quests is just about perfect.
I like the slower level speed. I find MMOs are making lazy gamers and it starts with the easy leveling system. Its not even slowed down that much in WS, just enough you know it. Im an old EQ1 vet, you should try what they used to call hell levels back in that game. When you get max level I like to feel like I earned something epic. Not WoW style where I can crank out a max level with little effort.
See, that's the thing though. The only viable xp is questing. PVP is an option but with only 2 BGs to choose from that gets stale real fast. If there was another alternative, like pugging adventures/dungeons in between questing that didn't take 2 hours or frustrate one to the point of skipping the content in the first place, then the leveling pace wouldn't be so bad.
Something else you all old timers seem to forget, there was more to the games back then, at least in FFXI there was and I know that was a clone of EQ1, where leveling multiple times was FUN because of the sheer amount of stuff to do and unlock on the way to level cap. Endgame was something for elitists to tackle while the rest of the playerbase had just as much fun and rewards on the way up.
Can we apply that to today's MMOs? I don't think we can. All of their rewards aside from story come at the cap. Sure you can unlock mounts and housing and content but nothing on par with EQ/FFXI content. So, yes the pace of leveling when the rewards are all stockpiled at the end and the actual multiplayer part of the game really comes forth, is too slow. So no, leveling to max level isn't as rewarding as it was in those older games.
Oh, I've resubbed to FFXI this week and have been having a blast doing all the content that one needs to do on the way up. I'm not even considering endgame content as I want to see all the inbetween stuff.
But thats what WS is doing. Going back to MMO roots. Things are not handed out on a silver platter like most MMOs today. Its designed for the hard core player. Knowing that getting to the end game means something. That being able to walk into a raid means you spent time setting that up. To run a dungeon means its not any pug will do. You need to know your class and be dressed for that dungeon and your role. This is what this game is for. People who fit the style.
Seeing people freak out because its to hard or cant figure out how to level makes me smile. The options are there you just need to read. Its like the people upset only 1 starting area. If they had read they would know they have 2 options. So what if you level slower when your not questing!!! Your leveling in whats considered end game play. MMOs never should be a race and when they became one, things started going bad and so did the communities. This game is worth getting to end game, you just need to learn, this is kicking it old school with a modern twist.
If they were going back to the roots, then there would be a large open world without funneling people through small instances. There would be a real death penalty and the game wouldn't be on the rail quest hub to quest hubs that take a month to hit max level.
WildStar levelling is slow? Apparently most of you never played LineAge. LineAge levelling makes Wildstar feel like warp speed.
To the point where people are tired of questing, why even bother playing a MMORPG? No matter how much you cry and whine about quests in a MMO, it's still a RPG at the end of the day, RPG = quests, flame and troll all you want, RPG = quests and nothing in the world will change that.
I seriously think most people that think the lvling process is slow probably started playing the genre after vanilla WoW. I mean if you think back to EQ, vanilla WoW, LoTRO, EQ2, Vanguard, etc, Wildstar is no where near as slow.
Wildstar is slow in comparison to current day WoW where you can level to 90 in 2 days played time or the casual fest that is GW2 but it's not that slow in comparison the older games in the genre (which I believe the devs were going for).
Almost every one of those had you hit max within 2-3 months. Only EQ might be longer.
But thats what WS is doing. Going back to MMO roots. Things are not handed out on a silver platter like most MMOs today. Its designed for the hard core player. Knowing that getting to the end game means something. That being able to walk into a raid means you spent time setting that up. To run a dungeon means its not any pug will do. You need to know your class and be dressed for that dungeon and your role. This is what this game is for. People who fit the style.
Seeing people freak out because its to hard or cant figure out how to level makes me smile. The options are there you just need to read. Its like the people upset only 1 starting area. If they had read they would know they have 2 options. So what if you level slower when your not questing!!! Your leveling in whats considered end game play. MMOs never should be a race and when they became one, things started going bad and so did the communities. This game is worth getting to end game, you just need to learn, this is kicking it old school with a modern twist.
[mod edit] There are problems with this game leveling wise. Play Rift and then play WS, tell me which has more options? Play WoW; more options, play anything, play LOTRO; more options. SWTOR; more options, GW2: more options, Archeage; more options FFXIV; more options.
For some reason ESO and WS thought quests were the only thing that should level you, this is not the direction I want MMOs to be going! If Endgame is what makes your game good, that isn't a GOOD thing.
And as far as being too fast or slow, If someone like me who works and has a life outside of games but who levels quickly, I think dumping 72 hours into a game should get me pretty close to max level. 4 days played is a good marker.
Wildstar is too Old School if you ask me.
Now Playing: Bless / Summoners War Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
For some reason ESO and WS thought quests were the only thing that should level you, this is not the direction I want MMOs to be going! If Endgame is what makes your game good, that isn't a GOOD thing.
Just for the record, after 6 you can level through PVP and after 15 through dungeons/adventures Questing is only one option of leveling for just this reason.
Anyhoo not really arguing, just chiming in. We figured a lot of folks would be bored with questing in MMOs no matter what, so aimed to have different leveling paths.
Jeremy Gaffney Executive Producer, Carbine Studios (Wildstar Online)
Been playing MMOS for over 10 years now and still love questing and enjoy leveling through it. And i bet i am in the majority crowd.
Quests over grinding mobs like a gold farmer..any day and every day.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.' -Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid." -Luke McKinney
Comments
I just un-subbed because despite the myriad of quests and activities to do in game, I'm bored!
I think that I might be getting burned out on conventional MMOs. I need a new formula to explore...perhaps I'll give EvE or something similar a try.
Not really. I played MMOs since Meridian 59 and far from all games had quests, some had few quests (like Meridian had and it was the first MMO) while others were heavy on quests.
Doing dungeons and stuff do help to get quest-heavy games feel less railroaded and hiding the quests like GW2 does with DEs also help but there is a personal preference to how much quests a game should have. That OP think WS have too much while others don't isn't really that strange.
Questing is one way to drive the story forward and to tell you what you should do next (you can call it hand holding) but it is far from the only way. Lineage had just a few tutorial quests (at launch at least, played the beta and a while after) and it still was fun at the time.But there are plenty of other ways to get the story onward and have things to do.
RPG games are after all based on pen and paper RPGs and they don't require quests at all even if you usually have a certain goal at a time that in some ways can be similar to a quests, or with some GMs be exactly a quest. In some of them you either make up your own goals whenever you feel for it or just play to have fun without any specific goals at all.
Personally I think MMOs should have some quests, but those should be epic ones that takes time and skill to complete (like throwing the one ring in mount Doom to mention one quest from literature) and you should only have a few ones at ones. Full questlogs with a zillion often similar and easy quests get boring fast and I tend to loose both focus and interest that way.
I also think GW2 are on the right way with one thing: all DEs there needs to be done now instead of whenever you feel for it and are close, that makes them feel more urgent and focuses player on actually completing them.
But no, MMOs don't need quests to be MMOs, they just need to let your character interact with the world and others(players or npcs) and let your character grow as you play. That and being massive online of course.
Well said... I agree 100%.
I do have to say that I think the MMORPG community is probably the hardest group of folks to satisfy. People will say games like WoW use to be awesome but now suck because they are way too easy but then when a game comes out that isn't super fast and easy the same folks will say, "The game is too much of a grind and it's boring!". The game can't be both hard and easy.
Another thing that always gets me is when people say, "I don't like this game because it requires you to group for quests/dungeons!", yeah no kidding, you're playing an MMO not a single player RPG.
I mean this is the first game in a long time that has come along at launch and has had so much to offer. The combat system is way better than ESO, WoW, FFXIV, etc, it's fast paced and not clunky. There is player housing which is a super cool feature that gives you something else to do when you just feel like chilling. There is PvP for people that like to pew pew things other than NPCs. There are more than enough quests to do that if you find a specific hub boring you can just move to the next. Not to mention that they are actually releasing a content patch one month after launch.
I can see people not liking Wildstar because they aren't into the setting of space and they prefer more traditional fantasy type lore but I can't not understand how anyone that considers themselves an MMO gamer would not totally be into this game. In my opinion if you say that you don't like this game because of anything other than the setting you are either not really into the MMORPG genre anymore, you're burnt out on it, or you were never really a fan of the genre to begin with.
WildStar levelling is slow? Apparently most of you never played LineAge. LineAge levelling makes Wildstar feel like warp speed.
To the point where people are tired of questing, why even bother playing a MMORPG? No matter how much you cry and whine about quests in a MMO, it's still a RPG at the end of the day, RPG = quests, flame and troll all you want, RPG = quests and nothing in the world will change that.
Quest, goal, story progression be that PnP, RPG or a mmorpg all have some type of quest system. Call it what you may but its there. I used to be a GM for PnP and every story was a quest/adventure with side stories and side quests. There not as in your face with an exclamation mark in your face. But the mechanics behind it is in every RPG. GW2 did a good job of not so in your face I agree. But read the thread, as stated you dont need to do all the task quests, thats 95% of the quests in WS. Do the main story quest and use all the other content to level, its can be done and many are doing just that.
I seriously think most people that think the lvling process is slow probably started playing the genre after vanilla WoW. I mean if you think back to EQ, vanilla WoW, LoTRO, EQ2, Vanguard, etc, Wildstar is no where near as slow.
Wildstar is slow in comparison to current day WoW where you can level to 90 in 2 days played time or the casual fest that is GW2 but it's not that slow in comparison the older games in the genre (which I believe the devs were going for).
L2 = mobs xp
i played L2 long time but pserver
Wow.. you summed up my feelings on it also lol. In Secret World, SWTOR and lately, FF14, I actually find myself reading and getting into the quest and story line. Games like Wildstar kinda just make you want to hit max level clicking through the quest at full speed and just seeing what you need to turn it in.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
I find some quests chains in Wildstar are pretty engaging - the first one that stood out for me so far is the Falkran quest line on the Exile side.
For the most part the tasks are pretty mind numbing - kill x of y or collect y of x.
Originally posted by Arskaaa
"when players learned tacticks in dungeon/raids, its bread".
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Odd, I found they have been very creative for many of the tasks, enough that the kill ten rats quests dont bug me.
RAWR
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
See, that's the thing though. The only viable xp is questing. PVP is an option but with only 2 BGs to choose from that gets stale real fast. If there was another alternative, like pugging adventures/dungeons in between questing that didn't take 2 hours or frustrate one to the point of skipping the content in the first place, then the leveling pace wouldn't be so bad.
Something else you all old timers seem to forget, there was more to the games back then, at least in FFXI there was and I know that was a clone of EQ1, where leveling multiple times was FUN because of the sheer amount of stuff to do and unlock on the way to level cap. Endgame was something for elitists to tackle while the rest of the playerbase had just as much fun and rewards on the way up.
Can we apply that to today's MMOs? I don't think we can. All of their rewards aside from story come at the cap. Sure you can unlock mounts and housing and content but nothing on par with EQ/FFXI content. So, yes the pace of leveling when the rewards are all stockpiled at the end and the actual multiplayer part of the game really comes forth, is too slow. So no, leveling to max level isn't as rewarding as it was in those older games.
Oh, I've resubbed to FFXI this week and have been having a blast doing all the content that one needs to do on the way up. I'm not even considering endgame content as I want to see all the inbetween stuff.
In my opinion this statement is the exact issue that most "gamers" have. You are not happy with 2 PvP BGs to level with, you want 4. You don't like running adventures because they are "too difficult" and you get frustrated so you would just rather not do them so you are "forced" to quest. In other words, you don't really want to enjoy the game you just want to fly through it without having to concentrate or focus on it.
My point is, I would rather a dungeon take 4 hours (like BRS in WoW in vanilla) to complete so that when I am done I actually feel some sense of accomplishment as opposed to just feeling like, what's next. In a lot of the older games PvP didn't even award XP and there weren't any battlegrounds so your only PvP experience while leveling was killing people lower level than you and being killed by people higher level as you ran from quest to quest.
There are tons of ways to get experience in the game... If you don't like questing, do dungeons, PvP, etc. You don't like waiting for queues, then OS tank or heals. You don't like PuGing then find a guild and make friends so you can run with them. Kind of see where I am going with this?
I got didn't get past level 13, and I was REALLY pushing myself.
and I played lots of mmos which are somehow considered to be grindfests like darkfall 1&2, haven, salem.
and no you cannot compare wildstar quests to a real RPG, even ESO tried to directly recreate skyrims quest and fell epically short. quality > quantity.
My blog:
But thats what WS is doing. Going back to MMO roots. Things are not handed out on a silver platter like most MMOs today. Its designed for the hard core player. Knowing that getting to the end game means something. That being able to walk into a raid means you spent time setting that up. To run a dungeon means its not any pug will do. You need to know your class and be dressed for that dungeon and your role. This is what this game is for. People who fit the style.
Seeing people freak out because its to hard or cant figure out how to level makes me smile. The options are there you just need to read. Its like the people upset only 1 starting area. If they had read they would know they have 2 options. So what if you level slower when your not questing!!! Your leveling in whats considered end game play. MMOs never should be a race and when they became one, things started going bad and so did the communities. This game is worth getting to end game, you just need to learn, this is kicking it old school with a modern twist.
If they were going back to the roots, then there would be a large open world without funneling people through small instances. There would be a real death penalty and the game wouldn't be on the rail quest hub to quest hubs that take a month to hit max level.
Almost every one of those had you hit max within 2-3 months. Only EQ might be longer.
Try asheron's call, which took 2-3 years.
How much time took for first lvl 50?
Yeah, old school.
Lobby game?
Yeah old school
Why do people whohave no idea about old school talk about old school?
Beats me.
Oh yea, i forgot, they think WoW is old school, nvm.
[mod edit] There are problems with this game leveling wise. Play Rift and then play WS, tell me which has more options? Play WoW; more options, play anything, play LOTRO; more options. SWTOR; more options, GW2: more options, Archeage; more options FFXIV; more options.
For some reason ESO and WS thought quests were the only thing that should level you, this is not the direction I want MMOs to be going! If Endgame is what makes your game good, that isn't a GOOD thing.
And as far as being too fast or slow, If someone like me who works and has a life outside of games but who levels quickly, I think dumping 72 hours into a game should get me pretty close to max level. 4 days played is a good marker.
Wildstar is too Old School if you ask me.
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
Just for the record, after 6 you can level through PVP and after 15 through dungeons/adventures
Questing is only one option of leveling for just this reason.
Anyhoo not really arguing, just chiming in. We figured a lot of folks would be bored with questing in MMOs no matter what, so aimed to have different leveling paths.
Jeremy Gaffney
Executive Producer, Carbine Studios (Wildstar Online)
Been playing MMOS for over 10 years now and still love questing and enjoy leveling through it. And i bet i am in the majority crowd.
Quests over grinding mobs like a gold farmer..any day and every day.
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