Originally posted by SEANMCAD If a dev said they plan to break away from old school conventional thinking and explorer making an MMO with no combat at all what would you say?
I would say "no combat" is not a game. Don't tell me what is NOT in the game. Tell me what is in the game.
Is it going to be a puzzle game? Building game?
the implict purpose of the question was not to spoon feed others but rather to get other to think outside of the box.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD If a dev said they plan to break away from old school conventional thinking and explorer making an MMO with no combat at all what would you say?
I would say Landmark is boring as crap
^ This
"The King and the Pawn return to the same box at the end of the game"
Originally posted by SEANMCAD If a dev said they plan to break away from old school conventional thinking and explorer making an MMO with no combat at all what would you say?
I would say "no combat" is not a game. Don't tell me what is NOT in the game. Tell me what is in the game.
Is it going to be a puzzle game? Building game?
the implict purpose of the question was not to spoon feed others but rath. to get other to think outside of the box.
"outside of the box" is not always fun. There are reasons we have boxes.
But again, saying what it is not ... is not a game .. box or no box. Tell me a new out-of-the-box gameplay and I will comment on whether i like it or not.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD If a dev said they plan to break away from old school conventional thinking and explorer making an MMO with no combat at all what would you say?
I would say "no combat" is not a game. Don't tell me what is NOT in the game. Tell me what is in the game.
Is it going to be a puzzle game? Building game?
the implict purpose of the question was not to spoon feed others but rath. to get other to think outside of the box.
"outside of the box" is not always fun. There are reasons we have boxes.
But again, saying what it is not ... is not a game .. box or no box. Tell me a new out-of-the-box gameplay and I will comment on whether i like it or not.
Tell me what it is NOT .. is useless.
again...no offense but you are asking me to spoon feed you, that is not the purpose of the question.
can you think of an MMO that would be fun without combat? that is what the question was supposed to inspire, not me to do it for you
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Originally posted by SEANMCADIf a dev said they plan to break away from old school conventional thinking and explorer making an MMO with no combat at all what would you say?
I would say Landmark is boring as crap
I enjoy Landmark, and I'm not really looking forward to the "features" they plan to add i.e., combat.
can you think of an MMO that would be fun without combat? that is what the question was supposed to inspire, not me to do it for you
Yes. A stealth game. A puzzle game. There are 10 thousand ways of doing puzzles in MP, or stealth without killing.
So? You may as well ask what movies could be fun without super heroes, which is a vague and useless questions.
So I guess the follow up quesiton is this.
why are there so many MMOs that have mostly just killing?
(i am helping you along the path a little bit anyway)
see .. that is the spirit of discussion. Asking a totally blue sky question is not always conducive to discussions.
The answer is simple ... it sells. Players like violence. In fact, it is not just MMOs. MOST video games are combat centric. For every Sherlock Holmes Crime & Punishment, there are 100x FPS which sells better.
Even most of the indie game efforts are combat related. For every Gone Home, there are many more Orcs Must Die.
can you think of an MMO that would be fun without combat? that is what the question was supposed to inspire, not me to do it for you
Yes. A stealth game. A puzzle game. There are 10 thousand ways of doing puzzles in MP, or stealth without killing.
So? You may as well ask what movies could be fun without super heroes, which is a vague and useless questions.
So I guess the follow up quesiton is this.
why are there so many MMOs that have mostly just killing?
(i am helping you along the path a little bit anyway)
see .. that is the spirit of discussion. Asking a totally blue sky question is not always conducive to discussions.
The answer is simple ... it sells. Players like violence. In fact, it is not just MMOs. MOST video games are combat centric. For every Sherlock Holmes Crime & Punishment, there are 100x FPS which sells better.
Even most of the indie game efforts are combat related. For every Gone Home, there are many more Orcs Must Die.
so your answer to my orginal question would be this:
'yes but it wouldnt sell as well'
see how easy that was?
now I disagree with you and we can have a debate on that but lets first meet up to this point. Your answer to my orginal question is?
...
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
can you think of an MMO that would be fun without combat? that is what the question was supposed to inspire, not me to do it for you
Yes. A stealth game. A puzzle game. There are 10 thousand ways of doing puzzles in MP, or stealth without killing.
So? You may as well ask what movies could be fun without super heroes, which is a vague and useless questions.
So I guess the follow up quesiton is this.
why are there so many MMOs that have mostly just killing?
(i am helping you along the path a little bit anyway)
see .. that is the spirit of discussion. Asking a totally blue sky question is not always conducive to discussions.
The answer is simple ... it sells. Players like violence. In fact, it is not just MMOs. MOST video games are combat centric. For every Sherlock Holmes Crime & Punishment, there are 100x FPS which sells better.
Even most of the indie game efforts are combat related. For every Gone Home, there are many more Orcs Must Die.
so your answer to my orginal question would be this:
'yes but it wouldnt sell as well'
see how easy that was?
now I disagree with you and we can have a debate on that but lets first meet up to this point. Your answer to my orginal question is?
...
"no combat" is not a game. That is a silly way of trying to develop something. Find an idea first.
(and oh, i don't think taht dev would be very successful when all he has is what "not to do")
"no combat" is not a game. That is a silly way of trying to develop something. Find an idea first.
(and oh, i don't think taht dev would be very successful when all he has is what "not to do")
the reason I framed the question as I did was to see how many people could imagine a game without combat. My theory is that so many gamers are so used to one way to play a game that they can not think of any other way to play that would be as or more enjoyable.
Your response (unable to think of any game that is non-combat) kind of proves my theory.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
The last MMO where you could actually do something other than combat and have an effect on the game world was SWG. There were a bunch of non combat skill trees. Eventually, they "improved" the game by removing a lot of that stuff in favor of a more traditional leveling experience...yea, that worked.
the reason I framed the question as I did was to see how many people could imagine a game without combat. My theory is that so many gamers are so used to one way to play a game that they can not think of any other way to play that would be as or more enjoyable.
Your response (unable to think of any game that is non-combat) kind of proves my theory.
I think that is the issue. People don't imagine games. They use them as entertainment products. Why bother imagining (or designing) games when there are professionals doing it for you?
This is exactly like movies. I doubt my imagination will be anywhere as enjoyable as Joss Whedon's.
the reason I framed the question as I did was to see how many people could imagine a game without combat. My theory is that so many gamers are so used to one way to play a game that they can not think of any other way to play that would be as or more enjoyable.
Your response (unable to think of any game that is non-combat) kind of proves my theory.
I think that is the issue. People don't imagine games. They use them as entertainment products. Why bother imagining (or designing) games when there are professionals doing it for you?
This is exactly like movies. I doubt my imagination will be anywhere as enjoyable as Joss Whedon's.
so you are suggesting that the best people to imagine games are those people who dont play games.
interesting.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Originally posted by KyutaSyuko Not as in-depth as discussed but here's something might be worth checking out http://world.needforspeed.com/
In Test Drive Unlimited, I got a Dodge Charger. Painted it orange, put a confederate flag on it with an 01 on the doors, and called it the General Lee.
the reason I framed the question as I did was to see how many people could imagine a game without combat. My theory is that so many gamers are so used to one way to play a game that they can not think of any other way to play that would be as or more enjoyable.
Your response (unable to think of any game that is non-combat) kind of proves my theory.
I think that is the issue. People don't imagine games. They use them as entertainment products. Why bother imagining (or designing) games when there are professionals doing it for you?
This is exactly like movies. I doubt my imagination will be anywhere as enjoyable as Joss Whedon's.
so you are suggesting that the best people to imagine games are those people who dont play games.
interesting.
Games dev don't play games? That is news to me.
Plus, if they can make good fun games for me, i wouldn't care less if they play games or not.
the reason I framed the question as I did was to see how many people could imagine a game without combat. My theory is that so many gamers are so used to one way to play a game that they can not think of any other way to play that would be as or more enjoyable.
Your response (unable to think of any game that is non-combat) kind of proves my theory.
I think that is the issue. People don't imagine games. They use them as entertainment products. Why bother imagining (or designing) games when there are professionals doing it for you?
This is exactly like movies. I doubt my imagination will be anywhere as enjoyable as Joss Whedon's.
so you are suggesting that the best people to imagine games are those people who dont play games.
interesting.
Games dev don't play games? That is news to me.
Plus, if they can make good fun games for me, i wouldn't care less if they play games or not.
derp....
what I was suggesting is that gamers turn into game designers. gamers who can imagine turn into game designers, if gamers can not imagine, designers will not either.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Any MMO made will have combat, even if you take out the "physical" combat there will be "verbal" combat, SWTOR Fleet and WoW's main cities are good examples. Even if you made "The Game of Life" board game an MMO people are gonna combat verbally. The human race likes to fight, especially from the safety of their computer screen.
Originally posted by Ericcompton Any MMO made will have combat, even if you take out the "physical" combat there will be "verbal" combat, SWTOR Fleet and WoW's main cities are good examples. Even if you made "The Game of Life" board game an MMO people are gonna combat verbally. The human race likes to fight, especially from the safety of their computer screen.
myth.
humans do fight that is true, but they cooperate more than they fight. If what you suggest was true people would fight more in real life.
A building game would be just one example of a non-combat game
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
what I was suggesting is that gamers turn into game designers. gamers who can imagine turn into game designers, if gamers can not imagine, designers will not either.
Not all gamers turn into game designers. In fact, very few of them do. There are tens of millions of gamers just in the US. How many game developers are there?
Whether gamers imagine or not, on average, has little to do with game development.
If they're re-creating farmville then go! haha just kidding.
I like the idea though it is hard for them to sell it to a lot of players.
If they can offer something amazing in the gameplay then go. That is how "simulator" games gain its spotlight.
Make those simulator games an MMO, then add trading with each other to make it interactive, then we might have a game here.
I think simulator games (as an idea for games) is awesome.
Tons of options there.
I come from a generation in which as a young person I was told I should do other things other than gaming, things like real life. Fair enough, why not make games like real life activities that normally would take a huge investment of time to involve in. I think there should be a lot more simultion games
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
I come from a generation in which as a young person I was told I should do other things other than gaming, things like real life. Fair enough, why not make games like real life activities that normally would take a huge investment of time to involve in. I think there should be a lot more simultion games
Because many play games to get AWAY from real life activities?
Have you played Euro truck? There is certainly a small market for that kind of game. But driving a truck around europe? Not my kind of fun.
Everjane is a game I am super curious about. The general idea is really neat. It's a social game about being social and throwing parties. It's a really neat concept were being social and roleplaying is a core part of the game rather then a side thing. I don't have the highest confidence in how they will execute it, but I really want to see how it all works out.
Originally posted by SEANMCAD If a dev said they plan to break away from old school conventional thinking and explorer making an MMO with no combat at all what would you say?
I'd have to say no thank you.
I have no interest in non-combat activities, not crafting, not building, not mining, etc unless they are in support of earning income or gear to support my combat related activities.
I'm not a big PVP fan, but my MMO's have to be combat oriented, a la EVE, or L2, or DAOC.
No interest in things such as driving or flight simulations, puzzle games (hate when my RPG's have puzzles) or anything else for that matter.
Not interested in exploring, unless it leads to riches again, to support my combat.
It's just what I like to do, so far I've never found a non-combat type game activity that I enjoy playing. Even back when I played traditional board games, I preferred Axis and Allies, Stratego, and Risk over Life, Monopoly or other no combat related games.
So a game like this would just not be appealing in any way that I can think of.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Comments
the implict purpose of the question was not to spoon feed others but rather to get other to think outside of the box.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
^ This
"outside of the box" is not always fun. There are reasons we have boxes.
But again, saying what it is not ... is not a game .. box or no box. Tell me a new out-of-the-box gameplay and I will comment on whether i like it or not.
Tell me what it is NOT .. is useless.
again...no offense but you are asking me to spoon feed you, that is not the purpose of the question.
can you think of an MMO that would be fun without combat? that is what the question was supposed to inspire, not me to do it for you
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
I enjoy Landmark, and I'm not really looking forward to the "features" they plan to add i.e., combat.
Yes. A stealth game. A puzzle game. There are 10 thousand ways of doing puzzles in MP, or stealth without killing.
So? You may as well ask what movies could be fun without super heroes, which is a vague and useless questions.
So I guess the follow up quesiton is this.
why are there so many MMOs that have mostly just killing?
(i am helping you along the path a little bit anyway)
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
see .. that is the spirit of discussion. Asking a totally blue sky question is not always conducive to discussions.
The answer is simple ... it sells. Players like violence. In fact, it is not just MMOs. MOST video games are combat centric. For every Sherlock Holmes Crime & Punishment, there are 100x FPS which sells better.
Even most of the indie game efforts are combat related. For every Gone Home, there are many more Orcs Must Die.
so your answer to my orginal question would be this:
'yes but it wouldnt sell as well'
see how easy that was?
now I disagree with you and we can have a debate on that but lets first meet up to this point. Your answer to my orginal question is?
...
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
"no combat" is not a game. That is a silly way of trying to develop something. Find an idea first.
(and oh, i don't think taht dev would be very successful when all he has is what "not to do")
the reason I framed the question as I did was to see how many people could imagine a game without combat. My theory is that so many gamers are so used to one way to play a game that they can not think of any other way to play that would be as or more enjoyable.
Your response (unable to think of any game that is non-combat) kind of proves my theory.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
I think that is the issue. People don't imagine games. They use them as entertainment products. Why bother imagining (or designing) games when there are professionals doing it for you?
This is exactly like movies. I doubt my imagination will be anywhere as enjoyable as Joss Whedon's.
so you are suggesting that the best people to imagine games are those people who dont play games.
interesting.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
In Test Drive Unlimited, I got a Dodge Charger. Painted it orange, put a confederate flag on it with an 01 on the doors, and called it the General Lee.
Games dev don't play games? That is news to me.
Plus, if they can make good fun games for me, i wouldn't care less if they play games or not.
derp....
what I was suggesting is that gamers turn into game designers. gamers who can imagine turn into game designers, if gamers can not imagine, designers will not either.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
myth.
humans do fight that is true, but they cooperate more than they fight. If what you suggest was true people would fight more in real life.
A building game would be just one example of a non-combat game
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Not all gamers turn into game designers. In fact, very few of them do. There are tens of millions of gamers just in the US. How many game developers are there?
Whether gamers imagine or not, on average, has little to do with game development.
If they're re-creating farmville then go! haha just kidding.
I like the idea though it is hard for them to sell it to a lot of players.
If they can offer something amazing in the gameplay then go. That is how "simulator" games gain its spotlight.
Make those simulator games an MMO, then add trading with each other to make it interactive, then we might have a game here.
I think simulator games (as an idea for games) is awesome.
Tons of options there.
I come from a generation in which as a young person I was told I should do other things other than gaming, things like real life. Fair enough, why not make games like real life activities that normally would take a huge investment of time to involve in. I think there should be a lot more simultion games
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Because many play games to get AWAY from real life activities?
Have you played Euro truck? There is certainly a small market for that kind of game. But driving a truck around europe? Not my kind of fun.
Everjane is a game I am super curious about. The general idea is really neat. It's a social game about being social and throwing parties. It's a really neat concept were being social and roleplaying is a core part of the game rather then a side thing. I don't have the highest confidence in how they will execute it, but I really want to see how it all works out.
I'd have to say no thank you.
I have no interest in non-combat activities, not crafting, not building, not mining, etc unless they are in support of earning income or gear to support my combat related activities.
I'm not a big PVP fan, but my MMO's have to be combat oriented, a la EVE, or L2, or DAOC.
No interest in things such as driving or flight simulations, puzzle games (hate when my RPG's have puzzles) or anything else for that matter.
Not interested in exploring, unless it leads to riches again, to support my combat.
It's just what I like to do, so far I've never found a non-combat type game activity that I enjoy playing. Even back when I played traditional board games, I preferred Axis and Allies, Stratego, and Risk over Life, Monopoly or other no combat related games.
So a game like this would just not be appealing in any way that I can think of.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon