Originally posted by Ginaz I played this a bit and overall it was OK but the whole labour point system worries me. It just seems completely unnecessary and a giant cock block to playing how you want to play. It doesn't matter what you think of labour points, the first time you go to do something and you can't because you lack the points you'll see just how bad it is. You basically have 2 options. Find a way to stay logged in or buy the labour point potions.
I think Labor Point management is supposed to play a strategic factor in the game in and of itself.
What kind of strategy is it that doesn't let me craft, extract resources or open loot? Is it the kind of strategy that forces people to sub or buy potions from the cash shop?
In Wushu it was an economic strategy. What it did there was prevent the market from being flooded with goods, plus it added some realism. You should not be able to craft 100 swords in 5 minutes just because you have the materials.. Labor takes energy. Labor points seem to be similar to energy in Wushu.
I could be completely wrong about AA, but that's why they are there in Wushu.
OK, so why do I need labour points to open loot or extract resources?
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
I remember I did some quests at the beginning, but as soon as I started to PVP and build stuff, I never took a quest again? LOL you're just too close minded to realize you don't HAVE to quest in this game perhaps?
Originally posted by GinazI played this a bit and overall it was OK but the whole labour point system worries me. It just seems completely unnecessary and a giant cock block to playing how you want to play. It doesn't matter what you think of labour points, the first time you go to do something and you can't because you lack the points you'll see just how bad it is. You basically have 2 options. Find a way to stay logged in or buy the labour point potions.
I think Labor Point management is supposed to play a strategic factor in the game in and of itself.
Its a monetization tool, plain and simple.
There are other ways to limit supply and progression while still letting crafters actually play the game as much as they want to.
This is why i have quit supporting and no longer play these single player game designs.I also despise ANY game that is using tons of hand holding like ! or ? or an y colored markers over npc heads.As soon as i see that i know it is another Wow clone to which i have no interest.Developers need to wake up,there is no longer any longevity for copy cat same old same old games.
That's why they now try to maximize profits before people realize they been duped with yet another badly designed clone by selling $100++ Early Access Special Alpha Founders Club Editions. That's why they come up with systems we know from Facebook and mobile games that put up content and playtime walls like the Labor Point system in AA.
----
They don't care about longevity any more, they know the game is dead within 6 Months. It's the maximum Profit within the first 3 month they are looking for.
----
Is there hope for us, that want real MMORPGs back? I doubt it...
I will admit to forking over 150 bucks for what at the time looked like a good deal. I played Alpha before the fuckover patch. It was hard (And still is) since I only have a small farm (1) and was skilling up to become a Tailor.
After the 4.1 or 4.2 patch everything changed. I could get others who owned workbenches to make cotton bundles for me. When the cotton was ready, I harvested it and banked my worms for a time i would go fishing. I cannot do that now. It now takes 30K Gathering skill to make a Cotton Seed Bundle. As for fishing? No more waterlogged sacks or chests for you boys.
All recipes have changed and all for the worse. I can hardly imagine trying handicrafts as the only thing I made before is fishing rods. I've never seen any gems besides 2 Emeralds and a Ruby that I got from low level alt's. My main has never gotten any gemstone from a fortuna node.
There is nothing in the cash shop really worth what they are charging. Pet mount armor so my Mirage horse can run 10% faster? My lvl 30 pet armor already had a 5% faster run speed, and there is not much difference in the speeds.
Gliders? so what.
Costumes - Bleh
Labor Potions. Since I only have a small farm I usually don't use very much labor harvesting the few crops I am able to plant. I am sick of planting 43 single cotton plants on my small farm. For wood, I can only plant Aspen, Rubber, or bamboo.
I own a Royal Cloth Armor Form. Only after the purchase did I find I cannot put the form on my small farm - it has to go in a house of some kind.
This game has been over hyped and over sold. Even as they sell Founders Packs they continue to give free keys for free play to thousands.
Beta? I loked at the first one and deleted the file after 10 minutes. I haven't bothered with the second Beta; and won't enter them until the game goes live.
I've never been good at pvp, so I focused on crafting. I've not seen a game where the crafting was so screwed up. A close second is of course the early crafting of SWG, and that other loser known as EQ2. In EQ2 as a scribe I had to make 150 different crafting items in the hopes of making 1 perfect pen. Far more items to make the other components needed. SoE finally changed that screwball crafting system.
I will give the Live version 7 days. After that i will cut my losses and tell the game creators/translators KMA.
I only wish I could get a clawback, but playing 1 second of Alpha prevents that.
Bad news for most of you then, I'm not leaving (see my first post). I'm going to stick around, craft the most miserable, tedious, lucrative cap I now know people will NEED, sell it for huge profit and make people realize how pathetic this game is compared to what it could and should have been. Basically, it's going to be people like me that will stick around and make this game suck really hard for anyone that comes along afterwards - 4 day head-start + patron status = pain for anyone starting later.
Every game has handled crating better than this one... and I do mean EVERY game. As I said in #3; it's complicated for the sake of being complicated. Most recipes have no rhyme or reason and many rely on random drops from loot bags or crop harvests. It's nothing simple like Chop tree -> Make log -> Carve stick -> create fishing pole.
Here's how the recipe really looks: Bamboo stick (carpentry) -> Fishing hook (Handicraft) -> Fishing line (Weaving loom) -> Wooden reel (Carpentry). Oh right... bamboo pole requires Bamboo (carpentry) 2 fabrics (Tailoring 5,000 skill). Fabric requires 100 cotton... found by growing or gathering on farms.
How is this some kind of revolutionary system?! Almost any game lets you craft something that should be a simple beginner tool from basic supplies. Not AA! The game's intent is to make you grind for the sake of making you grind doing the most meaningless tasks in the game. Gring levels like AC had me do? No problem. Grind crafting like UO had me do? Still no issue. Grind a useless skill to advance another useless skill to grind the one I want. Hell no! The rewards DO NOT outweigh the costs in this game.
I keep seeing folks on this board say that AA does not support solo play styles and i would like to say to them that maybe they should try it solo first as there is plenty to do alone at least as much as most other games i have played..
While i do agree in principle that AA just like almost any truly great game is far more fun played in a group there is still plenty you can do alone if you wish, however it is much slower and more lonely as you would expect because guilds are where the real power fun in this game will come.
But imho you do not have to partake in any these activities to enjoy this game as an intentional free spirit/outsider roleplayers and true solo players generally enjoy the rugged more impoverished yet completely self made loner life and AA offers as much if not more of it than most games but its self made rewards will require both sweat of the brow and much patience to achieve and there is indeed a large part of the game a loner cant indulge in just like in real life..
While you can have fun playing alone or guilded up this game is not for folks that want to devour content like a swarm of locusts this game is seriously built for the long haul and will require much time and effort to achieve great things..
Its about "your journey" however you play it..
This left me wonder how long you played as an "outsider"? I spent about 50 hours in the game this beta (thanks to a nasty illness that kept me home) and played solo 99% of that time.
One problem is the immersion killer that happens right around... level 20 or so. You know, the quest that tells you, outright, in the actual wording of the quest itself, to "get a level 30 mentor". Bravo game, you just mentioned a number level in an Role Playing Game.
I leveled up and soloed the dungeon. I died repeatedly but liked the challenge. I got to, what I thought was, the boss and couldn't kill her. Went back with my one and only group I ever joined, watched them run like lambs to a slaughter and ignore me (reminding me why I hate grouping in these games). Then found out that 1 "boss" I fought was just the tip of the iceberg and there were about 4 more after that! No way to solo that one!!!!
Next came in the crafting tree when I wanted to expand my farm. Yeah, this epically brutal quest. You need to cross the ocean from one continent to the other. While I agree that this makes for some nice PvP focused content, it's another example of the game making you work in a group. You have to cross monster infested waters that can swallow you in 2 hits, while avoiding all player contact since even your own faction can decide to kill you and steal your goods once in PvP territory. The only way to do this safely is to find a ship to beg a ride off of or build one... requiring a lot of people to gather a lot of resources.
So either way, whether it's crafting or the questing route, this game forces you into a group. The only thing you can do outside of a group? I dunno... maybe gather some rocks?
This left me wonder how long you played as an "outsider"? I spent about 50 hours in the game this beta (thanks to a nasty illness that kept me home) and played solo 99% of that time.
One problem is the immersion killer that happens right around... level 20 or so. You know, the quest that tells you, outright, in the actual wording of the quest itself, to "get a level 30 mentor". Bravo game, you just mentioned a number level in an Role Playing Game.
I leveled up and soloed the dungeon. I died repeatedly but liked the challenge. I got to, what I thought was, the boss and couldn't kill her. Went back with my one and only group I ever joined, watched them run like lambs to a slaughter and ignore me (reminding me why I hate grouping in these games). Then found out that 1 "boss" I fought was just the tip of the iceberg and there were about 4 more after that! No way to solo that one!!!!
Next came in the crafting tree when I wanted to expand my farm. Yeah, this epically brutal quest. You need to cross the ocean from one continent to the other. While I agree that this makes for some nice PvP focused content, it's another example of the game making you work in a group. You have to cross monster infested waters that can swallow you in 2 hits, while avoiding all player contact since even your own faction can decide to kill you and steal your goods once in PvP territory. The only way to do this safely is to find a ship to beg a ride off of or build one... requiring a lot of people to gather a lot of resources.
So either way, whether it's crafting or the questing route, this game forces you into a group. The only thing you can do outside of a group? I dunno... maybe gather some rocks?
For the Dungeon, I'm not sure why you really wanted to solo it. It tells you at the door it requires a minimum of 3 players.
Your "brutal" crafting quest is a joke. I traveled by myself with my trade pack by carriage down to Two Crowns and pulled out my rowboat and rowed across to deliver it on the enemy docks (which are guarded by Neutral Guards btw).
There are a lot of activities in this game which are designed to be done solo, and a lot designed for group play. I don't see how this is any different from any other MMO.
What I do see is this game has an ease of entry and the tutorial is a bit deceptive. Once you start to realize the complexity of the game systems, people just get overwhelmed that they can't comprehend all the nuances at once. Personally I'm glad a game has finally come along that has some depth.
This left me wonder how long you played as an "outsider"? I spent about 50 hours in the game this beta (thanks to a nasty illness that kept me home) and played solo 99% of that time.
One problem is the immersion killer that happens right around... level 20 or so. You know, the quest that tells you, outright, in the actual wording of the quest itself, to "get a level 30 mentor". Bravo game, you just mentioned a number level in an Role Playing Game.
I leveled up and soloed the dungeon. I died repeatedly but liked the challenge. I got to, what I thought was, the boss and couldn't kill her. Went back with my one and only group I ever joined, watched them run like lambs to a slaughter and ignore me (reminding me why I hate grouping in these games). Then found out that 1 "boss" I fought was just the tip of the iceberg and there were about 4 more after that! No way to solo that one!!!!
Next came in the crafting tree when I wanted to expand my farm. Yeah, this epically brutal quest. You need to cross the ocean from one continent to the other. While I agree that this makes for some nice PvP focused content, it's another example of the game making you work in a group. You have to cross monster infested waters that can swallow you in 2 hits, while avoiding all player contact since even your own faction can decide to kill you and steal your goods once in PvP territory. The only way to do this safely is to find a ship to beg a ride off of or build one... requiring a lot of people to gather a lot of resources.
So either way, whether it's crafting or the questing route, this game forces you into a group. The only thing you can do outside of a group? I dunno... maybe gather some rocks?
For the Dungeon, I'm not sure why you really wanted to solo it. It tells you at the door it requires a minimum of 3 players.
Your "brutal" crafting quest is a joke. I traveled by myself with my trade pack by carriage down to Two Crowns and pulled out my rowboat and rowed across to deliver it on the enemy docks (which are guarded by Neutral Guards btw).
There are a lot of activities in this game which are designed to be done solo, and a lot designed for group play. I don't see how this is any different from any other MMO.
What I do see is this game has an ease of entry and the tutorial is a bit deceptive. Once you start to realize the complexity of the game systems, people just get overwhelmed that they can't comprehend all the nuances at once. Personally I'm glad a game has finally come along that has some depth.
Point made, thank you very much. Quest tells you you need 3 people. Lots of solo play opportunity there.
You got lucky... very very lucky with your trade quest. 4 most common outcomes - 1 Jellyfish = instadeath. 2 - those other fish things that swarm you it seems. 3 Alliance faction being asshats. 4 Enemy faction PvP. If any one of those happens, kiss the trade pack goodbye and have fun farming 4 hours worth of material all over again.
Boy the fanbois are out in force in this thread. This game is craptastic. It's not an open world sandbox game as advertised. This is a typical MMO in which PvP is it's main focus. It has serious game design flaws that make the game unbearable for anyone that isn't a troll. Like to gank people 20+ levels below you? Then this game is for you. Like to kill your own faction then switch to non-hostile mode immediately so if your victim wants to retaliate they take a penalty, then this game is for you.
Sadly OP, AA has always been a P2W Korean Grinder. There was no switch up, some people just enjoy that style of game. I have a feeling they will end up having to drop the LP system entirely for the west because that crap doesn't fly with people who care about their money and time as much as we do.
I see Trion dropping the LP system, adding in PvE servers, and possibly reworking patron rewards again for sub members before release or shortly thereafter. They are going to lose far too much money by not addressing those 3 things, and they know it, Trion is a good company, and they aren't stupid.
I'm mostly interested to see what they come up with after removing LP and adding some PvE servers.
Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV Have played: You name it If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.
Sadly OP, AA has always been a P2W Korean Grinder. There was no switch up, some people just enjoy that style of game. I have a feeling they will end up having to drop the LP system entirely for the west because that crap doesn't fly with people who care about their money and time as much as we do.
I see Trion dropping the LP system, adding in PvE servers, and possibly reworking patron rewards again for sub members before release or shortly thereafter. They are going to lose far too much money by not addressing those 3 things, and they know it, Trion is a good company, and they aren't stupid.
I'm mostly interested to see what they come up with after removing LP and adding some PvE servers.
IF XL Games doesn't want to remove the LP system, nothing Trion can say will change that. After all, Trion is the go between in the west, between customers and the developer. It hasn't been removed in either the Asian or Russian variant, why would they remove it here. Too many things would need to be redone.
Comments
OK, so why do I need labour points to open loot or extract resources?
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
What questing????????
I remember I did some quests at the beginning, but as soon as I started to PVP and build stuff, I never took a quest again? LOL you're just too close minded to realize you don't HAVE to quest in this game perhaps?
Its a monetization tool, plain and simple.
There are other ways to limit supply and progression while still letting crafters actually play the game as much as they want to.
That's why they now try to maximize profits before people realize they been duped with yet another badly designed clone by selling $100++ Early Access Special Alpha Founders Club Editions. That's why they come up with systems we know from Facebook and mobile games that put up content and playtime walls like the Labor Point system in AA.
----
They don't care about longevity any more, they know the game is dead within 6 Months. It's the maximum Profit within the first 3 month they are looking for.
----
Is there hope for us, that want real MMORPGs back? I doubt it...
I will admit to forking over 150 bucks for what at the time looked like a good deal. I played Alpha before the fuckover patch. It was hard (And still is) since I only have a small farm (1) and was skilling up to become a Tailor.
After the 4.1 or 4.2 patch everything changed. I could get others who owned workbenches to make cotton bundles for me. When the cotton was ready, I harvested it and banked my worms for a time i would go fishing. I cannot do that now. It now takes 30K Gathering skill to make a Cotton Seed Bundle. As for fishing? No more waterlogged sacks or chests for you boys.
All recipes have changed and all for the worse. I can hardly imagine trying handicrafts as the only thing I made before is fishing rods. I've never seen any gems besides 2 Emeralds and a Ruby that I got from low level alt's. My main has never gotten any gemstone from a fortuna node.
There is nothing in the cash shop really worth what they are charging. Pet mount armor so my Mirage horse can run 10% faster? My lvl 30 pet armor already had a 5% faster run speed, and there is not much difference in the speeds.
Gliders? so what.
Costumes - Bleh
Labor Potions. Since I only have a small farm I usually don't use very much labor harvesting the few crops I am able to plant. I am sick of planting 43 single cotton plants on my small farm. For wood, I can only plant Aspen, Rubber, or bamboo.
I own a Royal Cloth Armor Form. Only after the purchase did I find I cannot put the form on my small farm - it has to go in a house of some kind.
This game has been over hyped and over sold. Even as they sell Founders Packs they continue to give free keys for free play to thousands.
Beta? I loked at the first one and deleted the file after 10 minutes. I haven't bothered with the second Beta; and won't enter them until the game goes live.
I've never been good at pvp, so I focused on crafting. I've not seen a game where the crafting was so screwed up. A close second is of course the early crafting of SWG, and that other loser known as EQ2. In EQ2 as a scribe I had to make 150 different crafting items in the hopes of making 1 perfect pen. Far more items to make the other components needed. SoE finally changed that screwball crafting system.
I will give the Live version 7 days. After that i will cut my losses and tell the game creators/translators KMA.
I only wish I could get a clawback, but playing 1 second of Alpha prevents that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0
"My Fantasy is having two men at once...
One Cooking and One Cleaning!"
---------------------------
"A good man can make you feel sexy,
strong and able to take on the whole world...
oh sorry...that's wine...wine does that..."
This left me wonder how long you played as an "outsider"? I spent about 50 hours in the game this beta (thanks to a nasty illness that kept me home) and played solo 99% of that time.
One problem is the immersion killer that happens right around... level 20 or so. You know, the quest that tells you, outright, in the actual wording of the quest itself, to "get a level 30 mentor". Bravo game, you just mentioned a number level in an Role Playing Game.
I leveled up and soloed the dungeon. I died repeatedly but liked the challenge. I got to, what I thought was, the boss and couldn't kill her. Went back with my one and only group I ever joined, watched them run like lambs to a slaughter and ignore me (reminding me why I hate grouping in these games). Then found out that 1 "boss" I fought was just the tip of the iceberg and there were about 4 more after that! No way to solo that one!!!!
Next came in the crafting tree when I wanted to expand my farm. Yeah, this epically brutal quest. You need to cross the ocean from one continent to the other. While I agree that this makes for some nice PvP focused content, it's another example of the game making you work in a group. You have to cross monster infested waters that can swallow you in 2 hits, while avoiding all player contact since even your own faction can decide to kill you and steal your goods once in PvP territory. The only way to do this safely is to find a ship to beg a ride off of or build one... requiring a lot of people to gather a lot of resources.
So either way, whether it's crafting or the questing route, this game forces you into a group. The only thing you can do outside of a group? I dunno... maybe gather some rocks?
For the Dungeon, I'm not sure why you really wanted to solo it. It tells you at the door it requires a minimum of 3 players.
Your "brutal" crafting quest is a joke. I traveled by myself with my trade pack by carriage down to Two Crowns and pulled out my rowboat and rowed across to deliver it on the enemy docks (which are guarded by Neutral Guards btw).
There are a lot of activities in this game which are designed to be done solo, and a lot designed for group play. I don't see how this is any different from any other MMO.
What I do see is this game has an ease of entry and the tutorial is a bit deceptive. Once you start to realize the complexity of the game systems, people just get overwhelmed that they can't comprehend all the nuances at once. Personally I'm glad a game has finally come along that has some depth.
Point made, thank you very much. Quest tells you you need 3 people. Lots of solo play opportunity there.
You got lucky... very very lucky with your trade quest. 4 most common outcomes - 1 Jellyfish = instadeath. 2 - those other fish things that swarm you it seems. 3 Alliance faction being asshats. 4 Enemy faction PvP. If any one of those happens, kiss the trade pack goodbye and have fun farming 4 hours worth of material all over again.
Sadly OP, AA has always been a P2W Korean Grinder. There was no switch up, some people just enjoy that style of game. I have a feeling they will end up having to drop the LP system entirely for the west because that crap doesn't fly with people who care about their money and time as much as we do.
I see Trion dropping the LP system, adding in PvE servers, and possibly reworking patron rewards again for sub members before release or shortly thereafter. They are going to lose far too much money by not addressing those 3 things, and they know it, Trion is a good company, and they aren't stupid.
I'm mostly interested to see what they come up with after removing LP and adding some PvE servers.
Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.
IF XL Games doesn't want to remove the LP system, nothing Trion can say will change that. After all, Trion is the go between in the west, between customers and the developer. It hasn't been removed in either the Asian or Russian variant, why would they remove it here. Too many things would need to be redone.