Yes, I personally had no idea there was a rule regarding 'multiple accounts'. What happened is I purchased a new hard drive and could not remember for the life of me my old password to this account nor the email that was tied to it (I created it in 2005), and resorted to another account. I finally tried a password the other day for this account on a whim and it worked. Now I am using this account as my sole means of chatting, etc. since this is indeed my original account.
Lots of nice stuff there, but the more nice you try to include, the more likely it is that you will not have not only some of that, but everything, as you simply try to do everything at once.
And if you think it's necessary to write it down several times on one page alone, not to speak of other pages, it sounds to me that you are either unsure yourself want you want to do, you try to convince people with words instead of letting the game speak, or both.
And big names mean nothing. Nearly all have tried their hands on a new game by now, and all are rather dubious at best. For McQuaid himself this is even more true - Vanguard can hardly be called a huge success.
If -and only if, no one can really tell who was it that made a game a sucess with hundreds of people working on it for years - it was McQuaid that made EverQuest and SWG that good, why did Vanguard fail? Isn't it more likely that it was either someone else or at least a combination of certain people working together? Or something else entirely - simply a product of it's time, hitting the sweet spot.
To simply believe some words *meant* to soothe you and to make for good PR when it has been proven time and again that developers and publishers are not only not capable of delivering everything they promise, but often enough never even try? And then even deny it was ever promised, despite it still being written so on their own website like it was years earlier when they first released their games features.
By now i think it's more likely to find what i want by looking for a game that wants to do everything the way i hate. They will surely fail to deliver on what they promised like everybody else. They'll not implement some features, change others beyond recognition and introduce stuff that was never even mentioned..and voilà, there is my dream game.
I don't think anyone is saying that McQuaid alone made EQ a good game. Brad himself has credited MUDs to be the main source of inspiration for Everquest, and he wasn't responsible for creating those.
As to Vanguard failing, if you actually played Vanguard you know it failed because it was a buggy, half finished mess filled with exploits and hacks. Its failure had absolutely nothing to do with the underlying concept for the game.
So my major concern with this project right now is not having proper funding and not being up to par art wise to be a next gen mmo. They are switching to unity 5 which makes massive improvements to the visuals on the game, but the art still seems to be a bit dated. The art was originally so dated in the first kick starter that even with his name and a huge player base wanting this type of game he couldn't hit his goal.
This is in stark contrast to a game like star citizen which has done everything correctly. Chris Roberts formed the company with an entertainment lawyer who understands business and he used his years of marketing experience from movies and gaming to put together an awesome kickstarter campaign. That snowballed into almost 74 million raised and becoming the biggest crowd funded project in history.
Fact is Brad McQuaid has a great understanding of rpg concepts and applies them well to a massive online game, but he needs someone who understands business and marketing to push his work. He continually makes companies to rise to the top then complains about being a manager and not a designer. I really hope this time around he has a partner who can take the reins of the business.
I want this game to succeed more than anyone on this forum. The concepts both new and old they are applying to this game is everything I want in my mmo, but they need more than just us old school guys on board for this game to be a mass success; They need to make the game visually appealing enough that new players will give it a try and fall in love with all the concepts we know to be great.
So my major concern with this project right now is not having proper funding and not being up to par art wise to be a next gen mmo. They are switching to unity 5 which makes massive improvements to the visuals on the game, but the art still seems to be a bit dated. The art was originally so dated in the first kick starter that even with his name and a huge player base wanting this type of game he couldn't hit his goal.
There were many reasons that the Kickstarter failed; arguably, the art was one of the minor ones - it was more of a lack of anything to show. Basically his name alone and the idea raised $450k.
As far as the current art, there hasn't been much created/released as of yet with the current team. The release of the dwarves/Archai are some of the first major concept art shown.
This is in stark contrast to a game like star citizen which has done everything correctly. Chris Roberts formed the company with an entertainment lawyer who understands business and he used his years of marketing experience from movies and gaming to put together an awesome kickstarter campaign. That snowballed into almost 74 million raised and becoming the biggest crowd funded project in history.
Don't disagree here, they captured lightning in a bottle and did everything right along the way to maximize that lightning.
Fact is Brad McQuaid has a great understanding of rpg concepts and applies them well to a massive online game, but he needs someone who understands business and marketing to push his work. He continually makes companies to rise to the top then complains about being a manager and not a designer. I really hope this time around he has a partner who can take the reins of the business.
Time will tell, but he released his CEO title over to Chris Rowan (Kuripan) so hopefully those mistakes won't repeat.
I want this game to succeed more than anyone on this forum. The concepts both new and old they are applying to this game is everything I want in my mmo, but they need more than just us old school guys on board for this game to be a mass success; They need to make the game visually appealing enough that new players will give it a try and fall in love with all the concepts we know to be great.
I think we all want the game to succeed and I agree it will need a larger playerbase than those commenting / following right now. But, it is still being marketed as a niche game, and if it can be built on a smaller budget (even with an investor) it won't need as many players in order to generate a profit. I think once the game is released - especially if there is a free trial, the new blood will check it out. The important thing is to have that "hook" like EQ did to keep you wanting to come back and subscribing afterwards.
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How amazing, even on january people here were bad mouthing brad and calling him thief, junkie what not and saying this is a failed project and scam but now people are saying "this is the game we are looking for". Some of us said that this game is most likely to come out than the prodigal EQNext, we were called "fanboi". And here it is, developing at a steady pace and acquiring expectation while EQNext nearly dead. Please, feel free to call us "fanboi" again.
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Have we heard about the game that "is exactly what I (and others) have been longing for" while it's still in development?
How many times has the game that "is exactly what I (and others) have been longing for" actually released and turned out to not have been the game that "is exactly what I (and others) have been longing for"?
I would suggest we tone it down a little and take a "wait and see" approach. Let's wait and see what actually develops before we call out the next savior of the genre. I can't count how many people were giving that title to EQN only a few months ago.
EQN was always a garbage title from the moment they started describing it. It was an obvious action/arcade WoW clone riding a technical gimmick.
While I agree getting overly hyped is pointless, keep in mind that Brad's Vision created EQ and Vanguard. Though Vanguard had a very rocky release, the game eventually worked many of those problems out and turned out to be a very solid game that defied the cancer of current MMOs for many years until SoE killed it by trying to make it like the mainstream MMOs.
This just depends on your perspective. Being limited to 8 spell gems in original EQ made you have to strategize your encounters and use your spell abilities wisely. I know I was rotating spells in and out often and you could tell good players pretty easily based off their rotation of spells/spell usage. I think it's a good thing, but I could see others wanting every spell available to them.
Exactly, EQ had a ton of spells to choose from, but you were limited on what you could have active at any time. You had to think about what was more important for the current task at hand. Were you going to be inside or outside, daytime or night? Invis or fighting? Undead or Living mobs? etc... You had a wide selection of spells, but you had to choose which ones were going to be immediately useable. You could always change in combat (if you didn't have aggro and could root the mob to avoid instant sit agro), but that was very difficult, so you had to be ready ahead of time.
This is far different than what the poster was describing with current MMOs which limit your slots because they have limited spells/abilities in the first place. They weren't designed to facilitate the above style of play. TSW is the only other game I know that has limited slots due to an honest attempt at making it a selection factor of abilities and uses.
Originally posted by jesteralways How amazing, even on january people here were bad mouthing brad and calling him thief, junkie what not and saying this is a failed project and scam but now people are saying "this is the game we are looking for". Some of us said that this game is most likely to come out than the prodigal EQNext, we were called "fanboi". And here it is, developing at a steady pace and acquiring expectation while EQNext nearly dead. Please, feel free to call us "fanboi" again.
Lets be fair though. When some were dismissing this game, it was around the time of the Kickstarter and to be honest, with what they provided during the campaign, it really did deserve some backlash. They learned though, licked their wounds and soldiered on to produce something that actually shows they have a product. Some people needed that as this industry has been nothing but backstabbing and let downs for years.
EQNext I agree, that game was junk from the get go. It was obvious to any old school player that the game was a market hype for the WoW crowd.
Personally, until Pantheon started making some progress, I was under the impression that the only other MMO I would play before my subscription in life ran out would be Vanguard EMU and that is still a ways off.
Heard/read so many posts about the perfect MMO that is coming -soon- and turned out to be a junkyard of code.
Agreed, but my fear is not the developers over selling Brad's "Vision", rather it is the current generation of MMO Locusts and how they destroy everything they touch. I have watched them kill every game that even attempted to meet my expectations. As long as they don't cater to the mainstream, the game will be acceptable to me. Everything Brad has produced I have found to be within my expectations of them after the smoke cleared. This game will be no different. I may not like every aspect of his implementations, I may disagree with some of his Vision goals, but I will take his Vision over anything that the mainstream wants blindly. That is how bad the current generation of MMOs are. They are so bad that they couldn't get me to play them, even if they paid me.
Heard/read so many posts about the perfect MMO that is coming -soon- and turned out to be a junkyard of code.
Agreed, but my fear is not the developers over selling Brad's "Vision", rather it is the current generation of MMO Locusts and how they destroy everything they touch. I have watched them kill every game that even attempted to meet my expectations. As long as they don't cater to the mainstream, the game will be acceptable to me. Everything Brad has produced I have found to be within my expectations of them after the smoke cleared. This game will be no different. I may not like every aspect of his implementations, I may disagree with some of his Vision goals, but I will take his Vision over anything that the mainstream wants blindly. That is how bad the current generation of MMOs are. They are so bad that they couldn't get me to play them, even if they paid me.
Couldn't agree more. Ive played every mmo since 1998 and there simply isn't anything on today's current market that resembles an rpg. I don't even hate World of warcraft, but its so far disconnected from the rpg experience that its basically a 3d lobby. I refuse to go back and play everquest with 20 year old technology trying to relive my past, but that doesn't mean that the core concepts are not still relevant.
This game will get made and it will be a niche product initally, but all it takes is 1 or 2 popular streamers to jump on the bandwagon and it can be another huge successful title. They also don't have the overhead they would with a studio so even if the game starts off with 200k subscribers it will financially successful. Lets be real tho even a badly done mmo can get a million subs these days at launch.
As far as people hyping the game and being let down in the past. That just comes with the history of expectations in the industry. To think that this game is destined to fail because other games did a good job hyping their games is just narrow minded. If you want this game then financially support it and buy into the product just like the fans of star citizen have and give them no reason to fail.
Personally I am going to write a letter to them this week in regards to their support packages and lack of financial tracking. One of the reasons Its hard to support the game is because they don't track their funds and they don't have incentive packages for their long time supporters like star citizen did. It also would be nice to know where those funds go so we can see the progress being made.
Heard/read so many posts about the perfect MMO that is coming -soon- and turned out to be a junkyard of code.
Agreed, but my fear is not the developers over selling Brad's "Vision", rather it is the current generation of MMO Locusts and how they destroy everything they touch. I have watched them kill every game that even attempted to meet my expectations. As long as they don't cater to the mainstream, the game will be acceptable to me. Everything Brad has produced I have found to be within my expectations of them after the smoke cleared. This game will be no different. I may not like every aspect of his implementations, I may disagree with some of his Vision goals, but I will take his Vision over anything that the mainstream wants blindly. That is how bad the current generation of MMOs are. They are so bad that they couldn't get me to play them, even if they paid me.
Couldn't agree more. Ive played every mmo since 1998 and there simply isn't anything on today's current market that resembles an rpg. I don't even hate World of warcraft, but its so far disconnected from the rpg experience that its basically a 3d lobby. I refuse to go back and play everquest with 20 year old technology trying to relive my past, but that doesn't mean that the core concepts are not still relevant.
This game will get made and it will be a niche product initally, but all it takes is 1 or 2 popular streamers to jump on the bandwagon and it can be another huge successful title. They also don't have the overhead they would with a studio so even if the game starts off with 200k subscribers it will financially successful. Lets be real tho even a badly done mmo can get a million subs these days at launch.
As far as people hyping the game and being let down in the past. That just comes with the history of expectations in the industry. To think that this game is destined to fail because other games did a good job hyping their games is just narrow minded. If you want this game then financially support it and buy into the product just like the fans of star citizen have and give them no reason to fail.
Personally I am going to write a letter to them this week in regards to their support packages and lack of financial tracking. One of the reasons Its hard to support the game is because they don't track their funds and they don't have incentive packages for their long time supporters like star citizen did. It also would be nice to know where those funds go so we can see the progress being made.
World of Warcraft is more than enough RPG and it is also more than enough MMORPG. Just because something doesn't float your boat doesn't mean it is not RPG or MMORPG.
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And the current trend is that "visionaries" from various development houses are minting millions based on talk alone. It isnt worth it to invest any time or money on promises anymore since that is the bulk of the "development" that is coming out off late.
Let them make a game worth buying and I will buy it. Until then, good luck to these guys and no thanks.
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World of Warcraft is more than enough RPG and it is also more than enough MMORPG. Just because something doesn't float your boat doesn't mean it is not RPG or MMORPG.
I think his point is that it has drifted away from core aspects of RPG mechanics. WoW is much more about the "play" than it is the development of the character. Also, the game encourages a fast travel through the content which kind of works against the whole character development and progression aspect. Truthfully, WoW plays more like an action/arcade game than it is a progression based RPG.
Yes, which is a good thing. Even in EQ PvP was an afterthought (though they were one of the few games that actually had separate rule set servers for PvP and PvE). PvP detracts from the focus of a solid PvE experience.
Nothing wrong with PvP though, but it is about time they start making PvP focused games and PvE ones. These hybrid models don't end up making either focus happy.
Looks like Crowfall may be the way to go though if you are into true PvP.
Yes, which is a good thing. Even in EQ PvP was an afterthought (though they were one of the few games that actually had separate rule set servers for PvP and PvE). PvP detracts from the focus of a solid PvE experience.
Nothing wrong with PvP though, but it is about time they start making PvP focused games and PvE ones. These hybrid models don't end up making either focus happy.
Looks like Crowfall may be the way to go though if you are into true PvP.
You can bet there will be PvP servers. They are talking about it more and more, but are afraid too much talk of it will alienate the majority of their fanbase. However, the focus of the game is not PvP, which is a good thing. My favorite PvP MMO was classic Everquest because it wasn't trying to be about PvP, it was just about providing an immersive RPG experience first and foremost. The class diversity, contested content and competition made it perfect for PvP without having to design "PvP content" and alter the game and class mechanics.
The worst thing modern mmorpgs are doing in my opinion is focusing on "PvP content" and class balance while neglecting all the other aspects that facilitate the creation of a vibrant virtual world.
You can bet there will be PvP servers. They are talking about it more and more, but are afraid too much talk of it will alienate the majority of their fanbase. However, the focus of the game is not PvP, which is a good thing. My favorite PvP MMO was classic Everquest because it wasn't trying to be about PvP, it was just about providing an immersive RPG experience first and foremost. The class diversity, contested content and competition made it perfect for PvP without having to design "PvP content" and alter the game and class mechanics.
The worst thing modern mmorpgs are doing in my opinion is focusing on "PvP content" and class balance while neglecting all the other aspects that facilitate the creation of a vibrant virtual world.
Well, last time I saw them talk about it, it was a pretty clear that it was a no and it wasn't the focus. Things can change, but the fact is that PvP and PvE don't mix well. EQ it worked ok (there were still tons of problems) because of the separate rule set and servers. PvP balance never had any effect on the PvE servers and that is the only way it can exist without destroying the PvE game. Being that this would require extra work, I just don't see it being given much attention and they will be better off spending their time on the PvE game. Maybe down the road, after they have released the game and things are going smoothly, they can experiment with a PvP server that has separate rule sets, but it is detrimental to give it any thought until the PvE is solid. That is the only way I think they will end up achieving what the original EQ servers had.
Thanks for posting that link - I never looked at the kickstarter. I totally agree with the ideals of combat as they are describing there. I played StarWars:TOR today for the first time and while the game looks great, the combat is just a faceroll on 1-2-3-4. I miss the days when [froglok jin wizard begins casting Gate] and you frantically try to get off a stun before it happens. There is a huge difference in immersion during combat if your actions actually change the outcome.
Yep, I gave Swotor a solid try. The last straw for me, around hour 30, was when I had finished an entire quest and EVERY SINGLE ENEMY encounter went like this;
Get in range (zero danger)
Press big damage button (zero danger)
Press second big damage button (enemies aware of me, start to move)
Sadly every game looks amazing on paper, then they take your money , put out a half finished game and leave you disappointed, and I truly think this game is the same.
You can bet there will be PvP servers. They are talking about it more and more, but are afraid too much talk of it will alienate the majority of their fanbase. However, the focus of the game is not PvP, which is a good thing. My favorite PvP MMO was classic Everquest because it wasn't trying to be about PvP, it was just about providing an immersive RPG experience first and foremost. The class diversity, contested content and competition made it perfect for PvP without having to design "PvP content" and alter the game and class mechanics.
The worst thing modern mmorpgs are doing in my opinion is focusing on "PvP content" and class balance while neglecting all the other aspects that facilitate the creation of a vibrant virtual world.
Well, last time I saw them talk about it, it was a pretty clear that it was a no and it wasn't the focus. Things can change, but the fact is that PvP and PvE don't mix well. EQ it worked ok (there were still tons of problems) because of the separate rule set and servers. PvP balance never had any effect on the PvE servers and that is the only way it can exist without destroying the PvE game. Being that this would require extra work, I just don't see it being given much attention and they will be better off spending their time on the PvE game. Maybe down the road, after they have released the game and things are going smoothly, they can experiment with a PvP server that has separate rule sets, but it is detrimental to give it any thought until the PvE is solid. That is the only way I think they will end up achieving what the original EQ servers had.
It was said originally that it would be a post launch feature. However, I've heard the current team is more enthusiastic about having pvp servers. Whether they will actually have pvp servers at launch is unknown.
As far as PvP and PvE not mixing well, thats silly. EQ proved that PvP worked perfectly fine with PvE and is still my favorite PvP game of all time. As long as you aren't trying to balance classes according to PvP, its not a problem. Yes, resists in PvP required a little tweaking, and certain abilities like charm and fear were nerfed, but other than that PvP was very straight forward. Same with Vanguard. The fact that each class was equally valuable, yet still unique, is what made EQ very different from usual MMOs where every class has to be some sort of viable threat in PvP. Classic RPG mechanics are perfectly viable, and having a cleric or enchanter that can't kill anyone is still super powerful in group combat, which is what Pantheon is focused on.
As long as you aren't trying to balance classes according to PvP, its not a problem.
That is what you do have to balance around. All you have to do to 'balance' PVE is to make sure no classes suck so bad that they are unwanted in PVE content (see: SWTOR dps operatives a month after release)
And the current trend is that "visionaries" from various development houses are minting millions based on talk alone. It isnt worth it to invest any time or money on promises anymore since that is the bulk of the "development" that is coming out off late.
Let them make a game worth buying and I will buy it. Until then, good luck to these guys and no thanks.
[mod edit]
[mod edit]
Seeing as how there is no one else that has even demonstrated a basic understanding of what made early mmorpgs like EQ enjoyable, we are looking forward to Pantheon, regardless of how long or hopeless the process of creating this game may seem to you.
Obviously it is too much to ask for a game first and money later, being that the only games getting funded by investors and dev studios are the same tired breed of arcade mmos that have been pumped out for the last decade. We therefore gladly forfeit our money if it means theres even a chance of creating a game like Everquest again. Even the bleak hope and enjoyment garnered from discussing such a thing is more fun than the modern mmo.
Comments
I don't think anyone is saying that McQuaid alone made EQ a good game. Brad himself has credited MUDs to be the main source of inspiration for Everquest, and he wasn't responsible for creating those.
As to Vanguard failing, if you actually played Vanguard you know it failed because it was a buggy, half finished mess filled with exploits and hacks. Its failure had absolutely nothing to do with the underlying concept for the game.
So my major concern with this project right now is not having proper funding and not being up to par art wise to be a next gen mmo. They are switching to unity 5 which makes massive improvements to the visuals on the game, but the art still seems to be a bit dated. The art was originally so dated in the first kick starter that even with his name and a huge player base wanting this type of game he couldn't hit his goal.
This is in stark contrast to a game like star citizen which has done everything correctly. Chris Roberts formed the company with an entertainment lawyer who understands business and he used his years of marketing experience from movies and gaming to put together an awesome kickstarter campaign. That snowballed into almost 74 million raised and becoming the biggest crowd funded project in history.
Fact is Brad McQuaid has a great understanding of rpg concepts and applies them well to a massive online game, but he needs someone who understands business and marketing to push his work. He continually makes companies to rise to the top then complains about being a manager and not a designer. I really hope this time around he has a partner who can take the reins of the business.
I want this game to succeed more than anyone on this forum. The concepts both new and old they are applying to this game is everything I want in my mmo, but they need more than just us old school guys on board for this game to be a mass success; They need to make the game visually appealing enough that new players will give it a try and fall in love with all the concepts we know to be great.
There were many reasons that the Kickstarter failed; arguably, the art was one of the minor ones - it was more of a lack of anything to show. Basically his name alone and the idea raised $450k.
As far as the current art, there hasn't been much created/released as of yet with the current team. The release of the dwarves/Archai are some of the first major concept art shown.
Don't disagree here, they captured lightning in a bottle and did everything right along the way to maximize that lightning.
Time will tell, but he released his CEO title over to Chris Rowan (Kuripan) so hopefully those mistakes won't repeat.
I think we all want the game to succeed and I agree it will need a larger playerbase than those commenting / following right now. But, it is still being marketed as a niche game, and if it can be built on a smaller budget (even with an investor) it won't need as many players in order to generate a profit. I think once the game is released - especially if there is a free trial, the new blood will check it out. The important thing is to have that "hook" like EQ did to keep you wanting to come back and subscribing afterwards.
GPOTY
The game do sound fun but Im a bit worried we get another SIGIL here and this time without a SOE to buy them out.
Brad always have fun ideas but he suck with money.
If it releases and if it is in at least acceptable shape I will play it though as long as it stays somewhat true to their ideas.
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EQN was always a garbage title from the moment they started describing it. It was an obvious action/arcade WoW clone riding a technical gimmick.
While I agree getting overly hyped is pointless, keep in mind that Brad's Vision created EQ and Vanguard. Though Vanguard had a very rocky release, the game eventually worked many of those problems out and turned out to be a very solid game that defied the cancer of current MMOs for many years until SoE killed it by trying to make it like the mainstream MMOs.
Exactly, EQ had a ton of spells to choose from, but you were limited on what you could have active at any time. You had to think about what was more important for the current task at hand. Were you going to be inside or outside, daytime or night? Invis or fighting? Undead or Living mobs? etc... You had a wide selection of spells, but you had to choose which ones were going to be immediately useable. You could always change in combat (if you didn't have aggro and could root the mob to avoid instant sit agro), but that was very difficult, so you had to be ready ahead of time.
This is far different than what the poster was describing with current MMOs which limit your slots because they have limited spells/abilities in the first place. They weren't designed to facilitate the above style of play. TSW is the only other game I know that has limited slots due to an honest attempt at making it a selection factor of abilities and uses.
Heard/read so many posts about the perfect MMO that is coming -soon- and turned out to be a junkyard of code.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Lets be fair though. When some were dismissing this game, it was around the time of the Kickstarter and to be honest, with what they provided during the campaign, it really did deserve some backlash. They learned though, licked their wounds and soldiered on to produce something that actually shows they have a product. Some people needed that as this industry has been nothing but backstabbing and let downs for years.
EQNext I agree, that game was junk from the get go. It was obvious to any old school player that the game was a market hype for the WoW crowd.
Personally, until Pantheon started making some progress, I was under the impression that the only other MMO I would play before my subscription in life ran out would be Vanguard EMU and that is still a ways off.
Agreed, but my fear is not the developers over selling Brad's "Vision", rather it is the current generation of MMO Locusts and how they destroy everything they touch. I have watched them kill every game that even attempted to meet my expectations. As long as they don't cater to the mainstream, the game will be acceptable to me. Everything Brad has produced I have found to be within my expectations of them after the smoke cleared. This game will be no different. I may not like every aspect of his implementations, I may disagree with some of his Vision goals, but I will take his Vision over anything that the mainstream wants blindly. That is how bad the current generation of MMOs are. They are so bad that they couldn't get me to play them, even if they paid me.
Couldn't agree more. Ive played every mmo since 1998 and there simply isn't anything on today's current market that resembles an rpg. I don't even hate World of warcraft, but its so far disconnected from the rpg experience that its basically a 3d lobby. I refuse to go back and play everquest with 20 year old technology trying to relive my past, but that doesn't mean that the core concepts are not still relevant.
This game will get made and it will be a niche product initally, but all it takes is 1 or 2 popular streamers to jump on the bandwagon and it can be another huge successful title. They also don't have the overhead they would with a studio so even if the game starts off with 200k subscribers it will financially successful. Lets be real tho even a badly done mmo can get a million subs these days at launch.
As far as people hyping the game and being let down in the past. That just comes with the history of expectations in the industry. To think that this game is destined to fail because other games did a good job hyping their games is just narrow minded. If you want this game then financially support it and buy into the product just like the fans of star citizen have and give them no reason to fail.
Personally I am going to write a letter to them this week in regards to their support packages and lack of financial tracking. One of the reasons Its hard to support the game is because they don't track their funds and they don't have incentive packages for their long time supporters like star citizen did. It also would be nice to know where those funds go so we can see the progress being made.
World of Warcraft is more than enough RPG and it is also more than enough MMORPG. Just because something doesn't float your boat doesn't mean it is not RPG or MMORPG.
Boobs are LIFE, Boobs are LOVE, Boobs are JUSTICE, Boobs are mankind's HOPES and DREAMS. People who complain about boobs have lost their humanity.
Talk is cheap.
And the current trend is that "visionaries" from various development houses are minting millions based on talk alone. It isnt worth it to invest any time or money on promises anymore since that is the bulk of the "development" that is coming out off late.
Let them make a game worth buying and I will buy it. Until then, good luck to these guys and no thanks.
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A proud User of [[Adblock Plus]], to block out all the bullshit paid advertisements (also read as "game reviews") spam on mmorpg.com.
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Now after release, repeating the very same words from back then would be like preaching to the choir on this site.
I think his point is that it has drifted away from core aspects of RPG mechanics. WoW is much more about the "play" than it is the development of the character. Also, the game encourages a fast travel through the content which kind of works against the whole character development and progression aspect. Truthfully, WoW plays more like an action/arcade game than it is a progression based RPG.
Yes, which is a good thing. Even in EQ PvP was an afterthought (though they were one of the few games that actually had separate rule set servers for PvP and PvE). PvP detracts from the focus of a solid PvE experience.
Nothing wrong with PvP though, but it is about time they start making PvP focused games and PvE ones. These hybrid models don't end up making either focus happy.
Looks like Crowfall may be the way to go though if you are into true PvP.
You can bet there will be PvP servers. They are talking about it more and more, but are afraid too much talk of it will alienate the majority of their fanbase. However, the focus of the game is not PvP, which is a good thing. My favorite PvP MMO was classic Everquest because it wasn't trying to be about PvP, it was just about providing an immersive RPG experience first and foremost. The class diversity, contested content and competition made it perfect for PvP without having to design "PvP content" and alter the game and class mechanics.
The worst thing modern mmorpgs are doing in my opinion is focusing on "PvP content" and class balance while neglecting all the other aspects that facilitate the creation of a vibrant virtual world.
Well, last time I saw them talk about it, it was a pretty clear that it was a no and it wasn't the focus. Things can change, but the fact is that PvP and PvE don't mix well. EQ it worked ok (there were still tons of problems) because of the separate rule set and servers. PvP balance never had any effect on the PvE servers and that is the only way it can exist without destroying the PvE game. Being that this would require extra work, I just don't see it being given much attention and they will be better off spending their time on the PvE game. Maybe down the road, after they have released the game and things are going smoothly, they can experiment with a PvP server that has separate rule sets, but it is detrimental to give it any thought until the PvE is solid. That is the only way I think they will end up achieving what the original EQ servers had.
Yep, I gave Swotor a solid try. The last straw for me, around hour 30, was when I had finished an entire quest and EVERY SINGLE ENEMY encounter went like this;
Get in range (zero danger)
Press big damage button (zero danger)
Press second big damage button (enemies aware of me, start to move)
Press absurdly big damage button (enemies dead).
Loot.
Uninstall.
Sadly every game looks amazing on paper, then they take your money , put out a half finished game and leave you disappointed, and I truly think this game is the same.
I can see why kickstarter failed
Amen. I'll be excited for this once the path to release has been determined.
It was said originally that it would be a post launch feature. However, I've heard the current team is more enthusiastic about having pvp servers. Whether they will actually have pvp servers at launch is unknown.
As far as PvP and PvE not mixing well, thats silly. EQ proved that PvP worked perfectly fine with PvE and is still my favorite PvP game of all time. As long as you aren't trying to balance classes according to PvP, its not a problem. Yes, resists in PvP required a little tweaking, and certain abilities like charm and fear were nerfed, but other than that PvP was very straight forward. Same with Vanguard. The fact that each class was equally valuable, yet still unique, is what made EQ very different from usual MMOs where every class has to be some sort of viable threat in PvP. Classic RPG mechanics are perfectly viable, and having a cleric or enchanter that can't kill anyone is still super powerful in group combat, which is what Pantheon is focused on.
That is what you do have to balance around. All you have to do to 'balance' PVE is to make sure no classes suck so bad that they are unwanted in PVE content (see: SWTOR dps operatives a month after release)
Waiting for:
The Repopulation
Albion Online
Seeing as how there is no one else that has even demonstrated a basic understanding of what made early mmorpgs like EQ enjoyable, we are looking forward to Pantheon, regardless of how long or hopeless the process of creating this game may seem to you.
Obviously it is too much to ask for a game first and money later, being that the only games getting funded by investors and dev studios are the same tired breed of arcade mmos that have been pumped out for the last decade. We therefore gladly forfeit our money if it means theres even a chance of creating a game like Everquest again. Even the bleak hope and enjoyment garnered from discussing such a thing is more fun than the modern mmo.