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The Greatest MMOs of All Time - Number 5 through 1 a Editorial at MMORPG.com

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  • marik_ishtarmarik_ishtar Member UncommonPosts: 20
    edited October 2015
    Could people stop complaining about the list? The author's list is clearly based on more than just 1 factor. For those who don't get it - WoW: They might have stole (got inspired by) many mechanics from other games, but this doesn't change the fact, that the game still had those mechanics implemented. They have put and are still putting a lot of work into implementing every single one of those mechanics that they thought it would make their players happy, in game. Yes, there are many of us who didn't like World of Warcraft, but this doesn't make the game bad. The game was and still is successful, so clearly they know what they are doing. And clearly, the game is good. It just doesn't suit our taste. And same goes for Guild Wars 2. Guild Wars 2 has one of the best and friendliest online communities. when the game got free, veteran players practically camped in front of the spawning places, to greet and meet the new players, helping them with their first steps, giving them gold to buy things, ect. Besides that, GW2 has AWESOME graphics for a mmorpg. At the same time, mechanically, it's the mmorpg that (finally) broke the old semi-turnbased combat that was present in mmos. Yes, some other mmos tried to do it as well, but failed, as lag killed their system. Of course, same as every mmorpg, GW2 has it's share of faults, but the developers keep talking with the community and in many cases react based on their opinion. At the same time constant playable story updates (first it was every 2 weeks, then, after the players explained that they felt too shackled by it, they changed it to 1 per month) with a rich story, new content, mechanics, and after 3 years, their first expansion is getting released. Except for the expansion (which you don't need in order to play) the game and all the content that it's getting is free. This list is created by taking in consideration many factors, (including profit that the games brought to their companies), so try to avoid writing hate speeches as most of your arguments are only based on 1 factor - your personal opinion of a game. So please, before commenting - everyone would want their favorite game to be on the top 3 list - but just because you liked one of the games more than others, it doesn't mean that other games are worse.
  • ReizlaReizla Member RarePosts: 4,092
    Remarkeble that there's a lot of VERY OLD and DISCONTINIUED names in the list....
  • FayEverdunesFayEverdunes Member UncommonPosts: 12
    Aori said:
    A lot of people defending GW2 but whats so special about it? What does it offer? What did it bring to the table that no other MMO has before? I just don't get it.

    This is an honest question, I got bored with it quick, it is simply an unappealing game.
    A lot of people already listed a lot of stuff GW2 has done to improve the genre. The question is, why do you find it boring? How much have you played? How did you play it? What have you tried within the game? I mean, sure it's not everyones cup of tea but saying it's just boring doesn't really help to understand your opinion.
  • FayEverdunesFayEverdunes Member UncommonPosts: 12
    MrSyn said:
    Can anyone tell me why GW2 is so high up?... i went back several months after the launch and went on one of the low lvl alts. Was hardly anyone around doing the zone events and was really tedious doing them solo. Was fun at launch when it was populated any lots of people around but not solo.

    So it must be the pvp that makes this so high up?... but then again ESO pvp much the same but not even on the list *confused* or did the world get populated again so most not doing events solo?
    I would suggest trying GW2 again :) It has massively improved since launch and it's very active. With the expansion also comes new cool stuff like a new WvW map and Guild Halls and Raids etc. As a non-expac account I think you can get access to WvW and Guild Halls ... not sure about raids they're probably only accessible to HoT accounts. The base game is now also F2P so why not get a friend to join you? Also, join a guild :)
  • l2avisml2avism Member UncommonPosts: 386
    [sarcasm alert]
    I've sat down with the fine folks at MMORPG.com and we have decided to revise the list as follows:

    1. Shadowbane
    2. EVE
    ...truncated...
    34. Furcadia
    35. WOW

  • SoaraSoara Member UncommonPosts: 78
    I am surprised Runescape, Planetside 2, and Path of Exile weren't higher up on the list............but I am glad them, and Anarchy Online made it to the tops =)
  • GettCoupedGettCouped Member UncommonPosts: 47
    Well done. But for me, nothing will ever be as good as UO was (except for the obvious dated 2.5D art), for it's total freedom and Sandboxyness. Surprisingly (for a Sandboxer), I was glad to see CoH rated highly. For a level grind, it was a fun game to just "hack and slash" in. Great character creation fun.
    I loved Warhammer, but I am surprised that it gets credit for inventing public quests when UO had PQs that you needed to do to Summon the Harrower. I quoted you because I agree with how great UO was/is and believe it should get credit for PQs.
  • JermzyJermzy Member UncommonPosts: 211
    DMKano said:
    Brenics said:
    I see so many thinking EQ should be #2 or heck even #1, well I have to say what bothers me is EQ beats Asherons Call, they both came out around the same time and I always thought AC was a better game. 

    They were 2 very different games - EQ1 came out march of 1999, AC launched  8 months later - I played both at launch and continued playing EQ1 while playing AC (also had a UO account running as my best RL friend was heavily into UO)

    All the gen1 MMOS (UO,EQ1, AC, AO, DAOC, SWG) offered a completely different gameplay experience IMO.

    I really loved all of those games - IMO that's the top 6 games right there.
    This.  Sadly, most of todays gamers have not had the joy of experiencing these legends.  They got it right, awesome communities, laid a great foundation for other games to follow and excell, ie WoW, ESO, GW2 etc etc etc.
    Haroo!
  • FayEverdunesFayEverdunes Member UncommonPosts: 12
    edited October 2015
    Even though it wouldn't probably even make the top 100 with how niche it is, Myst Online is truly a gem that deserves a shout out. It's still up and running www.mystonline.com - drop me a PM if anyone wants to try it... fair warning though this isn't anything like a traditional MMO, not even remotely. :)
  • ste2000ste2000 Member EpicPosts: 6,194
    The Top 5 are actually ok.
    Though personally I would have put Ultima Online as number 5 instead of CoH.
    EQ was the game that launched the genre but UO was the one that introduced the Sandbox and PvP elements in it.

    I would also put EQ as number 2 it is WoW daddy after all and the game that really started it all.

    GW2 deserves to be top 5, I am not so much of a casual player but I agree that objectively GW2 brought lots of innovation in the Themepark genre.
    It is possibly the only Thempark that is not a WoW copy and paste which in itself is an achievement.

  • MpfiveMpfive Member UncommonPosts: 308
    Thornrage said:
    Where is Elder Scrolls Online? No way Rift or Planetside 2 or even Wildstar is better than ESO.
    It's cool to hate ESO it seems. As for WoW being number one, no way, 6-7 years ago maybe, not now
  • MrBum21MrBum21 Member UncommonPosts: 405
    this list needs more cow bell, and love for Asheron's Call. I mean how can a game with 2 hours of buffing before a raid not make the top 5?? in all seriousness though the game was and still is very unique, would love to see a true sequel to the game.

    the missing link in a chain of destruction.

    All spelling and typographical errors are based soely on the fact that i just dont care. If you must point out my lack of atention to detail, please do it with a smile.

  • pingopingo Member UncommonPosts: 608
    Rhoklaw said:
    If you need some arguments as to why GW2 isn't a great game, try these on for size...
    • Non Trinity Combat - Most likely designed with the idea that combat in GW2 would be more action oriented. I personally think it has more flaws than benefits. It would have been better to do what TERA did with combat and they still managed to keep the Trinity system.
    • WvWvW - So ANet's take on DAoC's tri realm combat was probably better than Mythic Entertainments successor WarHammer Online, I personally think ESO's Cyrodill did a much better job of capturing the true elements found in DAoC's RvR. GW2 maps were too small and you ended up with the same problem if not a worse case scenario than WAR with rotating keeps. On top of that, it was a complete chaotic zergfest.
    • When GW2 launched, it boasted Dynamic content like it was some randomly generated, once in a lifetime event. Oh hell no. It wasn't Dynamic at all in any sense of the word. Every event in GW2 was repeatable ad nauseam.
    • Don't even get me started on the friggin jumping puzzles. They even went as far as to incorporate this crap in PvP zones. Yes, that's what every MMO needs, lol.
    • Forced levels in every zone is a great way to increase veteran players to visit old zones to help out newbies. However, why not use a mentoring system instead? No one wants to fight through EVERY zone when trying to complete a map.

    So, theres 5 things that I didn't care for at all about GW2. The worst of those 5 being the lack of a trinity system and the fact their so called Dynamic content was a complete farce during the game's initial promotion prior to launch.

    All of your reasons are poor and ignorant. You clearly don't understand the game at all.

    1) MANY people, myself included like GW2. F**K trinity. trinity is pathetic and boring. a one-shoe-fits-all lame approach to reduce players role into one thing. GW2 has gotten a lot better at throwing encounters at you that gives much stronger role definitions while retaining the action.
    TERA, has rooting, among many other problems. GW2 edges out a healer-bot and 3d party APIs for moving support, and is more exciting because healers and tankers are not overpowered and sponges. traditional MMOs are so damn boring. 
    GW2 now has a soft-trinity with the way they have raids. game is inclusive in ways across ALL classes in no way any other game is.


    2) I didn't play ESO so I can't say how good their RvR is, but GW2s WvW is not zerg fest. I am roaming 50% of the time, and when I run with my guild, many a times have we as a smaller group killed a zerg. So saying it is mindless "zerg" is the poor vitirol of someone who went into WvW and got killed once and logged out.

    There are hundreds of videos on youtube of people with skill and inguinity and teamwork overcoming zergs, trolling, ambusing and just stacking through it. WvW is not perfect, but it is by far the best I have seen. 


    3) uhm. You're projected you're own overhyped reading into what they said dynamic events were. They always said it was events that moves on a chain, and that they would bounce back on that chain. They've never said it was a once-in-a-lifetime thing. Countless interviews will attest to this. 
    This is just classic fanboy overhype of not having your expectations in check. Dynamic events are great, and they nailed them in a way that exceeded the ones you find in FFXIV, Warhammer Online and Rift. 

    They are not perfect, they have problems, but these are the only real alternative to traditional fetch questing, and they are vastly superior in grouping people together socially. 



    4) Many people love the jumping puzzles. myself included. you sound bitter and salty. They are hard and takes a lot of skill. 




    5) Forced levels in every zone is (you mean level scaling) is a great way to make all of the content relevant. bosses and mobs and chests and rewards all yield rewards that are inflated to your levels. it means that instead of grinding end-game zones you can keep repeating the ENTIRE GAMES ZONES, instead of being reduced to wastelands of forgotten "levelling" content that just sits there in transit.

    secondly, having down-scaling is not that big of a deal. when a veteran player gets downscaled in ascended gear, they are still levels above, and still have wayyyyy higher stats than other players who arent as downscaled, and with all the abillities unlocked and slots unlocked and traits unlocked you do feel immensely powerful going through regular mobs.

    I can tell you don't know what you are talking about because if you did you would things like this. It's the words of someone who gave the game up without really understanding it on its own premise. 

    If you don't like the game, fine. but don't say crap that is flat-out lies just because you weren't willing to meet the game on its own terms. Nobody said it was perfect, but nobody said you had judge it against your crazy misunderstandings of what the game is, because you clearly don't get it.
    And I don't say that as an insult. I say it as a challenge- I've met hundreds of people in the game who initially hated GW2, left it, and then when they came back to try it a long time after, "it clicked" and they "got it". The game angers people who grew up with a WoW/EQ background because in many ways it is the anti-thesis of those. 
  • marik_ishtarmarik_ishtar Member UncommonPosts: 20
    edited October 2015
    pingo said:
    I've met hundreds of people in the game who initially hated GW2, left it, and then when they came back to try it a long time after, "it clicked" and they "got it". The game angers people who grew up with a WoW/EQ background because in many ways it is the anti-thesis of those. 

    Totally agree. I was one of them. I was used to grindfest games. A friend told me to buy gw2. I did, tried it and.. well it wasn't for me. Then after a few months, I tried it again, and poof. Suddenly it got to me. Now, I enjoy doing most of it's content. I'm not a WvW lover, but I LOVE doing jumping puzzles for the lulz :D
    Also, I like the fact that the game is not gear > skills. It definitelly takes skills to be good. And the good thing about not having a defined trinity meta, is that you can't blame the healer for your own death. It's all on you.
    I also love the story - and all the small things they are adding it - like, when you play the Sylvari, you'll occasionally hear Mordremoth as if he's trying to get influence your mind and such. 
    GW2 is full of details so instead of rushing trough the content a player should really rather enjoy the game.
    That's why I like GW2. It's a GAME, we're supposed to have a good time from the moment we log in and not just after we reach a certain level and trade our social lifetime for raiding stuff to get better loot. 

    People forgot that mmorps are games. And games are supposed to be fun. Not just at a specific point (when we get to max level and when we gear up), but all the time. And that's ANET's moto. It's not about the destination, it's about the journey. And as soon as people realize that, they start enjoying the game more than any other mmorpg on the market.
  • ste2000ste2000 Member EpicPosts: 6,194
    edited October 2015
    Mpfive said:
    It's cool to hate ESO it seems. As for WoW being number one, no way, 6-7 years ago maybe, not now
    ESO might be an ok game but it is not a game changer, it is a mish mash of everything and it is all done well, but it has introduced nothing to the genre.
    In some regards it is actually pretty disappointing since we all expected a bit more from Bethesda/Zenimax, after all Skyrim is the best and more successful RPG of the last 10 years, and that's all due to its no nonsense approach of doing what it feels right for the game rather than what is most convenient (see the combat discussions).

    With ESO Zenimax adopted the opposite philosophy, they chose to do what it was more popular rather than what it felt better for the game, so in the end they made a pretty average MMO that neither offend nor it excites anyone.
    It is a moneymaker product child of the Marketing department, they took no risks.

    No I don't hate ESO, it is a good game, but nothing to rave about.

  • mindw0rkmindw0rk Member UncommonPosts: 1,356
    edited October 2015
    1. WoW 2. EVE Online 3. The Secret World 4. Star Wars: Galaxies 5. GW2
  • BitripBitrip Member UncommonPosts: 279
    I'm sure ESO didn't make the cut because enough people haven't played it yet....they need a trial!!

    image
    Now, which one of you will adorn me today?

  • goemoegoemoe Member UncommonPosts: 290
    Most useless article of all MMORPG articles up to date. At least put some "of the websites staff" into the headline.
  • keitholikeitholi Member UncommonPosts: 140
    Eve before UO? Blasphemy! Spreadsheets online is good, but no way better than UO.
  • marik_ishtarmarik_ishtar Member UncommonPosts: 20
    Aori said:
    Nothing about the game was appealing when I tried it, I got to level 20 and just couldn't go on anymore. I saw no innovation, the PvP was terrible. I felt like I was on some aimless journey, I didn't feel myself progressing as a character. 
      When did you try it? And I do kinda agree with what you're saying. I got the same problem, altho' I must say that once I changed my perception of mmorpgs (so, stopped focusing on rushing to level 80 and farm like fuck for my gear, repeat with new updates, ect..), I started to enjoy the game. It's really about the journey and not just about the ending point. If you are able to change your view, you will see how good Guild Wars really is. It offers a lot of fun as soon as you login. 
  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 Member UncommonPosts: 2,770
    edited October 2015
    The Greatest list separated by sub genre makes it look so underwhelming.

     SciFi

    Star Wars Galaxies
    EVE Online
    Anarchy Online
    Star Wars: The Old Republic
    WildStar
    Planetside 2
    Planetside
    Fallen Earth

     Fantasy

    World of Warcraft
    Guild Wars 2
    EverQuest
    City of Heroes
    Ultima Online
    Final Fantasy XIV
    Dark Age of Camelot
    Final Fantasy XI
    Asheron’s Call
    Meridian 59
    Rift
    EverQuest 2
    The Secret World
    Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning
    Runescape
    Lord of the Rings Online
    TERA
    Darkfall
    Lineage
    Path of Exile
    Age of Conan
    Wizard101
    Ragnarok Online
    Lineage 2
    Shadowbane
    Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
    A Tale in the Desert
  • MarcelinoMarcelino Member UncommonPosts: 124
    So happy WoW was at number one. Even tho Ive now left the game, it still had the biggest impact on me in my 15 years of playing MMO's. Defo deserves the top spot. but seriously...city of heros at number 5?? Ive heard so many bad things about the game. I guess i shouldn't really comment untill ive actually tried it :)
  • adamaj74adamaj74 Member UncommonPosts: 19
    Thornrage said:
    Of the 35 they listed, this is how I would have listed them:

    1-World of Warcraft
    2-Star Wars Galaxies
    3-City of Heroes
    4-EverQuest
    5-Guild Wars 2
    6-EVE Online
    7-Ultima Online
    8-Star Wars: The Old Republic
    9-The Secret World
    10-Lord of the Rings Online
    11-Age of Conan
    12-Rift
    13-Anarchy Online
    14-Runescape
    15-Everquest 2
    16-Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning
    17-Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
    18-TERA
    19-Planetside 2
    20-Final Fantasy XIV
    21-Dark Age of Camelot
    22-Shadowbane
    23-Lineage 2
    24-Darkfall
    25-Final Fantasy XI
    26-Asheron’s Call
    27-Meridian 59
    28-Wizard101
    29-Fallen Earth
    30-Lineage
    31-Planetside
    32-Path of Exile
    33-WildStar
    34-Ragnarok Online
    35-A Tale in the Desert

    However, I am disappointed that Elder Scrolls Online did not make the list. ESO is one of the better MMOs out there and as such it was a mistake leaving it off. I would have placed ESO 4th.

    I would like to know why ESO is not on the list.
    Frankly, I'm shocked too. ESO was up there for me, but we polled around 40 writers and staffers, and not enough voted for ESO. Here's hoping it makes it in when we do this again in a couple years.
    If Wildstar made the list and ESO didn't, then I would think you guys would have had the sense to say, "Hmmm, something's not quite right with our methodology here.", and adjust accordingly.
  • AinianuAinianu Member CommonPosts: 2
    edited October 2015
    As with all lists like this it is opinion based. 
    I dont even play GW2 atm but i would still place this above WoW. GW2 seems to be a game that develops either a love or hate reaction, but i base my opinion purely on the quality of content, it is a game i regularly get bored of and then equally as often return to and every time the detail and polish of the game is the first thing i notice after coming back from whatever mmo i was playing.
    'Best' is very subjective and how you measure this can vary from individual to individual, for example if you measure on subscribers, WoW would be 1st, if you measure on polish, again WoW would be probably 2nd after GW2, if you measure on original ideas? WoW wouldnt even make the top 10 really. 
     If i was to make my own 'tops' list i would rate based on whether i feel they have made a contribution to MMO's in general, unique aspects, their gameplay, polish and detail. (Some will weigh heavily on some rather than others obviously) 

     I would have rated the top 5 as 
    1: Everquest (The core of modern MMO's are mostly traced back to this, the raiding in this game imo has still not been beaten) 
    2: Dark Age of Camelot (To me this has always been the birthplace of competitive pvp, or RvR, and whilst UO had pvp prior to this it was a different style and more comparable to EVE) 
    3: Guild Wars 2 (Mainly for reasons above, its level of polish, detail and continued content additions make it exceptional in todays mmo market) 
    4: Starwars Galaxies (the sandbox elements was truely exceptional for its era and whilst many games have touched on these elements since none have really captured the true sandbox feel that SWG had) 
    5: World of Warcraft (whilst many rate it higher, it is a game that people love or hate. I personally dislike the game intently but give it a place here that it deserves for the simple fact that it changed a lot in mmo standards in accessibility, but nothing in the game was as ground breaking as the ones listed above hence the 5th spot) 

    Honourable mentions: Ultima Online, EVE, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Vanguard. All of which i would place next on that list in some order. UO for its open world pvp, EVE for its economy, DDO for its interesting dungeon experience and VG for its scope of game in attempts to be the next EQ (though it fell far short it was still a great game imo and had other things to offer) 

     Games i feel have been either over-hyped or rated: Wildstar, Elder Scrolls Online, City of Heroes. ESO was not on the list and given some of the names on there i think it should have been, but its unlikely i would place it in a top 10. Though my experience with ESO was only as a beta tester and i found it both very unoriginal next to other mmo's and a let down to the Elder Scrolls name, not a bad game, just not worth a subscription imo. City of Heroes i likewise only played in beta and found the gameplay extremely shallow, more akin to grand theft auto. Wildstar the gameplay itself just felt like GW2 but without the same level of polish, and graphics that really held off any level of immersion into the game, but that is likely a personal thing.
  • FoomerangFoomerang Member UncommonPosts: 5,628
    Its unfortunate that games like UO and SWG are considered the same genre as GW2 and SWTOR.

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