Religious aversion to classes who traffic with demons?

MightyUnclean · November 2020

There's a few MMOs and other games with classes who interact with demons and use them to their advantage. The most obvious example I can think of is warlocks in WoW. Out of curiosity, and without passing judgement one way or the other, does anyone have an aversion to playing these classes because of religious beliefs?

Ungood · November 2020

I can't say that I do. I mean, I don't normally play finger wiggler casters, and prefer to play more melee types.

But that didn't prevent me from playing things like shadow knights in EQ, (I mean outside the fact they sucked, obviously)

Honestly, I just don't see it as anything other than pixels/lore, not anything real. But then again, I used to play old school D&D and a slew of fantasy games and the like, and never saw any of it as real.

I am actually a little worried about people that take games too serious or entertain that it is real or whatever.

Wizardry · November 2020

My take is that if people are THAT religious,they are likely not playing video games.

FrodoFragins · November 2020

Since I'm not religious, this isn't a good example for me. But I'll tell you what turns me off of games real quick.

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kitarad · November 2020

I would not say I am religious but I do go to temple. The demons don't affect me at all perhaps because Hinduism doesn't have the same black and white ideas. Also because you only get reincarnated into a better form after living a life that deserves it. There are no last minute absolutions and demons in Hinduism have value. They are not couched in the same mould other religions tend to place them in.

You can also worship some demons like Kali. There are temples for Kali and it is not considered wrong to do so. They aren't equated to the Devil or anything like that. Hinduism considers Devils as natural so it's a different concept from other religions. We don't actually have a heaven or hell just reincarnation until the perfect form is reached.

I have also never associated my gaming to any religious beliefs.

Sovrath · November 2020

My mother was religious and at one point she even made me get rid of a drawing of a bat-winged, I suppose "demon", when I was younger. I ended up just hiding it.

I then had the Dungeons and Dragons books that had "demons" so I sadly marked them out so that if she found the books she would see I was "on the right path."

I regret doing that as now when I go through the books when feeling nostalgic I see all those scored pages.

I'm not religious so it doesn't bother me in the least.

Sovrath · November 2020

Wizardry said:

My take is that if people are THAT religious,they are likely not playing video games.

There are different degrees of religion. there are video games that are just "games" and have nothing to do with "evil" or spirits.

that wouldn't bother some religious people.

But if one was part of an extremely devout organization I would bet that would be true.

Scot · November 2020

It does not bother me, but the gods of games, typically a pantheon of some sort have been removed from modern MMOs. So the question could be asked why not the demons? I see no reason why gaming does not have both, they are great story staples.

AlBQuirky · November 2020

No bother for me, but I'm more spiritual than religious.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

Yes. Will not play any content like that.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

Sovrath said:

Wizardry said:

My take is that if people are THAT religious,they are likely not playing video games.

There are different degrees of religion. there are video games that are just "games" and have nothing to do with "evil" or spirits.

that wouldn't bother some religious people.

But if one was part of an extremely devout organization I would bet that would be true.

It also depends on what the story is. So you have something labeled a demon dose not make it a demon from Christian influence. Demon that is from the bible, its root/translation comes from the meaning "To appose God". So the demon in WoW do not conflict with the bible. They are not real demons. They are creatures from another realm that want to conquer the universe. Some devs just dont know what the term Demon means.

Sovrath · November 2020

Nanfoodle said:

Sovrath said:

Wizardry said:

My take is that if people are THAT religious,they are likely not playing video games.

There are different degrees of religion. there are video games that are just "games" and have nothing to do with "evil" or spirits.

that wouldn't bother some religious people.

But if one was part of an extremely devout organization I would bet that would be true.

It also depends on what the story is. So you have something labeled a demon dose not make it a demon from Christian influence. Demon that is from the bible, its root/translation comes from the meaning "To appose God". So the demon in WoW do not conflict with the bible. They are not real demons. They are creatures from another realm that want to conquer the universe. Some devs just dont know what the term Demon means.

That's absolutely true. Having said that, I've know some very religious people over the course of my life and "some" of them wouldn't care for that explanation.

I think it's perfectly apt.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

Scot said:

It does not bother me, but the gods of games, typically a pantheon of some sort have been removed from modern MMOs. So the question could be asked why not the demons? I see no reason why gaming does not have both, they are great story staples.

I do like it when games move away from Gods or that they make up their own lore. Where I walk away is when it touches on real world religion. I also walk away when the lore is just overly dark.

xpsync · November 2020

I was raised but never continued, overall i strongly i believe people need something to believe in.

When you consider that after the first tools were invented 90,000 years ago and with all we have learned through science and technology, we are still in the same situation, we have no idea what the universe is, why is it, what is it? It's hard to not believe that humans have always believed in a higher power as the answer.

One of the most powerful quotes of all time was in the movie Contact when Ellie asks Palmer to prove that god exists, his rebuttal was to ask if she loved her father, ofc she emphatically responds Yes! he in turn asks her to... prove it!

katzklaw · November 2020

i am a Christian. very strict upbringing, but have my own views on things now, but still, Christian.

one of my favorite class types in most games i play is the thief/rogue. i just tend to really enjoy the class mechanics

i have also played various casters (including recently a warlock), altho they are no my preferred classes or playstyles.... either for the experience of it, or for a past life (the DDO reincarnation grind) i realize the game is just pixels, and the character is just a role. i am like an actor, i am not my character.

Scot · November 2020

Sovrath said:

Nanfoodle said:

Sovrath said:

Wizardry said:

My take is that if people are THAT religious,they are likely not playing video games.

There are different degrees of religion. there are video games that are just "games" and have nothing to do with "evil" or spirits.

that wouldn't bother some religious people.

But if one was part of an extremely devout organization I would bet that would be true.

It also depends on what the story is. So you have something labeled a demon dose not make it a demon from Christian influence. Demon that is from the bible, its root/translation comes from the meaning "To appose God". So the demon in WoW do not conflict with the bible. They are not real demons. They are creatures from another realm that want to conquer the universe. Some devs just dont know what the term Demon means.

That's absolutely true. Having said that, I've know some very religious people over the course of my life and "some" of them wouldn't care for that explanation.

I think it's perfectly apt.

I am not that sure how many of us remember when DnD and roleplaying games in general were "the work of the devil". While largely an American phenomenon, we were not untouched by that idea in the UK. I do not think it is prevalent now however, the internet has taken over as the "go to" that is to blame for anything to do with children and teens.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

Sovrath said:

Nanfoodle said:

Sovrath said:

Wizardry said:

My take is that if people are THAT religious,they are likely not playing video games.

There are different degrees of religion. there are video games that are just "games" and have nothing to do with "evil" or spirits.

that wouldn't bother some religious people.

But if one was part of an extremely devout organization I would bet that would be true.

It also depends on what the story is. So you have something labeled a demon dose not make it a demon from Christian influence. Demon that is from the bible, its root/translation comes from the meaning "To appose God". So the demon in WoW do not conflict with the bible. They are not real demons. They are creatures from another realm that want to conquer the universe. Some devs just dont know what the term Demon means.

That's absolutely true. Having said that, I've know some very religious people over the course of my life and "some" of them wouldn't care for that explanation.

I think it's perfectly apt.

IMO context matters. With the explanation I gave above, you think of something you see in WoW. Dog like beast (labeled a demon) digging holes in the ground eating rabbits and really doing nothing nefariously. Without the ability to think "therefore I am", how do their thoughts and actions make them a demon? Again, an example of devs just putting a name on something to make it scary.

As for Christians disagreeing with me. Thats their right.

Sovrath · November 2020

Nanfoodle said:

IMO context matters. With the explanation I gave above, you think of something you see in WoW. Dog like beast (labeled a demon) digging holes in the ground eating rabbits and really doing nothing nefariously. Without the ability to think "therefore I am", how do their thoughts and actions make them a demon? Again, an example of devs just putting a name on something to make it scary.

As for Christians disagreeing with me. Thats their right.

Well, of course it's their right.

I'm just pointing out that some people see "monster" and immediately attribute "evil" to it.

It's important to note that there are extremely religious people out there who do take things in stride, who don't shove it down others' throats and are generally accepting of other people.

For some, seeing "religious" means very strict things and that's simply not always the case.

xpsync · November 2020

My gamer answer is, never thought about it tbh and will continue this way going forward, it's a game.

The question is very thought provoking though as there are many, many extremely strict religions world wide with different gods and beliefs.

Agree with Wizardry, they probably don't play anyway.

Jamar870 · November 2020

So Nanfoodle are you saying that christianty is the only faith that has a "proper" definition of demon? Also how would you place the demons in WoW that are part of the Burning Legion?

GladDog · November 2020

The key is to separate these things. I'm very active in my church, teaching at the pulpit at least once a month, and running the service at least once a month. I teach people about the Bible all the time, run study groups etc... But you don't hear much of that from me because games is entertainment. I play 'magic' characters and use 'sorcery' in games because it is fun. But that is a completely separate world for me. I can play my Dark Scrapper in City of Heroes, then 5 minutes later start a bible study because I treat games as they should be treated - entertainment.

I'm also very much a Christian Conservative, but I don't talk politics in games either. Its a different world with a different culture. I'm not interested in 'reforming the heathens', I'm interested in playing a game and having fun. I have a number of friends that are diametrically opposed politically that I count as very good friends - we just don't talk about politics, we talk about games.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

Sovrath said:

Nanfoodle said:

IMO context matters. With the explanation I gave above, you think of something you see in WoW. Dog like beast (labeled a demon) digging holes in the ground eating rabbits and really doing nothing nefariously. Without the ability to think "therefore I am", how do their thoughts and actions make them a demon? Again, an example of devs just putting a name on something to make it scary.

As for Christians disagreeing with me. Thats their right.

Well, of course it's their right.

I'm just pointing out that some people see "monster" and immediately attribute "evil" to it.

It's important to note that there are extremely religious people out there who do take things in stride, who don't shove it down others' throats and are generally accepting of other people.

For some, seeing "religious" means very strict things and that's simply not always the case.

Some look at it as the only option, chucking the baby out with the bathwater. Baby has bath water on it, so its still dirty and needs to go as well. Its interesting when you learn the Greek and Hebrew words used in the bible and there meaning. It really shows what was really said. Things are easily taken out of context.

I tend to find the reason for the law and ask how this applies in my modern world. Often the reason for the law is what matters, not the law. Like the Jews were told to burry their feces outside the city. This law has no meaning for us today. If they didnt follow that law, people would get sick and die. Today we flush that away. So the meaning of the law, keep clean.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

Jamar870 said:

So Nanfoodle are you saying that christianty is the only faith that has a "proper" definition of demon? Also how would you place the demons in WoW that are part of the Burning Legion?

No its the only one that matters for me. For someone else, its their faith that defines that. Im not gonna make decisions for myself based on someone else's faith.

Nanfoodle · November 2020

GladDog said:

The key is to separate these things. I'm very active in my church, teaching at the pulpit at least once a month, and running the service at least once a month. I teach people about the Bible all the time, run study groups etc... But you don't hear much of that from me because games is entertainment. I play 'magic' characters and use 'sorcery' in games because it is fun. But that is a completely separate world for me. I can play my Dark Scrapper in City of Heroes, then 5 minutes later start a bible study because I treat games as they should be treated - entertainment.

I'm also very much a Christian Conservative, but I don't talk politics in games either. Its a different world with a different culture. I'm not interested in 'reforming the heathens', I'm interested in playing a game and having fun. I have a number of friends that are diametrically opposed politically that I count as very good friends - we just don't talk about politics, we talk about games.

This is the most I have talked about religion when it comes to gaming on any public medium. I also agree, games is not the place to talk to people about the bible. God has given us all free will, its up to each person to decide how use it.

GladDog · November 2020

I do have to admit there have been a few games I played in the past that were so out there that I stopped playing them because of my Christian beliefs. But those are rare, and you REALLY have to push the pedal to the metal to get under my skin that far.

Gorwe · November 2020

MightyUnclean said:

There's a few MMOs and other games with classes who interact with demons and use them to their advantage. The most obvious example I can think of is warlocks in WoW. Out of curiosity, and without passing judgement one way or the other, does anyone have an aversion to playing these classes because of religious beliefs?

I have aversion toward something else(not because Religion, no): Shapeshifting. I often feel like all the character aesthetics and customization go to waste and you are not really yourself when you Shapeshift. It all feels so fake to me, I really dislike Shapeshifting. Wonder what this is linked to.

About Demonology and Necromancy, I don't mind. Hell, I even find it interesting, as long as it's not too gruesome. I am more interested in Demo, but either works.

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Religious aversion to classes who traffic with demons?

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