I don’t get the problem, ESO players are pussies. What’s new?
/Cheers, Lahnmir
Hmm, let me see if I can figure this out. Kyleran's current game is ESO, his avatar is a cat, and another name for cat is pussy, hence ESO players are pussies. There you go.
Constantine, The Console Poster
"One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
The fact that this was said by someone not affiliated with the game, and yet the players are turning into a bunch of crybabies about it.. really proves their point that the players are a bunch of crybabies, and every single bit of scorn and contempt is in fact well founded.
But this just reinforces to me, that if I ever did opt to make a game, that I would not engage in the public in any way, and I would warn my team and staff to not engage either, and just have PR take care of things.
Sometimes you just gotta have that wall up, it's the best for everyone.
If you can't refrain from insulting a consumer base your company depends on in such a public way, then yes, you definitely should let PR handle all public communications.
However, the mistake is assuming that always means there's a problem with the customers instead of one's own employees or temperament. It is not hard to *refrain* from insulting your husband's player base on a very public stream you know is populated by said player base. That's not very hard for well-adjusted people to do.
Life would be great if people would not be inconsolable little fuck shits.. wouldn't it?
And in all fairness, It's not that hard to simply not be a crybaby like a little bitch about shit either.
.. and yet, we all saw clearly that people were going on some unaffiliated streamers site, and bitching about their husbands game.
What level of complete depraved crying little shit must you be to do that, and when you see that, yes, it is clearly the problem on the clients end... 100% and it's shit like that, is why they have such contempt for their player base. I have my issues with what some games have done, but I keep my bitching where it belongs, like on this site, and on topics about those games directly.
Which again, is why If I ever made a game, I would not allow any staff to casually interact with the player base, at all, period, and everything would go through PR.
That would work both ways, as there is no way in hell I would let any players directly contact my staff, and any that tried would have restraining orders put against them, if not charges pressed against them for harassment.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
i would let my staff ( assuming i had staff) be themselves. It would be glorious!
LOL, you mean as your product crashed and burned before it got off the ground... I am sure the Kicksterter QA's would be a hoot tho.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I'm late to this particular party. Is it my turn to be offended and/or outraged by the things said in this thread? Just trying to get into the correct mindset.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
I'm late to this particular party. Is it my turn to be offended and/or outraged by the things said in this thread? Just trying to get into the correct mindset.
That depends. Do you enjoy being outraged when someone you had never heard of says something stupid?
People online in general are crybabies. I remember when people online were whining about Miles Morales, because he is Bla....errr...I mean.....they thought he was a PC move.....Now everyone magically loves him........
......... but you cant say the 1st thing that comes to your mind when you hold a position of customer relations.......Not saying that is her title, but that is your business when you are producing things for the consumer.
People online in general are crybabies. I remember when people online were whining about Miles Morales, because he is Bla....errr...I mean.....they thought he was a PC move.....Now everyone magically loves him........
......... but you cant say the 1st thing that comes to your mind when you hold a position of customer relations.......Not saying that is her title, but that is your business when you are producing things for the consumer.
Funny, but bad look.
Her "title" in relationship to Zenimax is "spouse of employee" so theoretically she is free to have her own opinion of other players, in ESO or elsewhere.
I did ask my wife to not publically slag on my employer, at least until after I retire.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
maybe not saying or not being allowed to say what you feel is the problem.
look what's its lead to: A bunch of thin skin crybaby retards that cant take any criticism at all and blow up the whole internet over the most trivial things. This opens anyone to attack if you think about it since the herd is so easily moved.
how are we/they better off? More importantly who quit because of her outburst?
maybe not saying or not being allowed to say what you feel is the problem.
look what's its lead to: A bunch of thin skin crybaby retards that cant take any criticism at all and blow up the whole internet over the most trivial things. This opens anyone to attack if you think about it since the herd is so easily moved.
how are we/they better off? More importantly who quit because of her outburst?
People make their own hell sometimes.
Mock outrage is very fashionable these days, it shows someone cares.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
maybe not saying or not being allowed to say what you feel is the problem.
look what's its lead to: A bunch of thin skin crybaby retards that cant take any criticism at all and blow up the whole internet over the most trivial things. This opens anyone to attack if you think about it since the herd is so easily moved.
how are we/they better off? More importantly who quit because of her outburst?
People make their own hell sometimes.
Read about the Roman mob and the politics involved with it.
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
maybe not saying or not being allowed to say what you feel is the problem.
look what's its lead to: A bunch of thin skin crybaby retards that cant take any criticism at all and blow up the whole internet over the most trivial things. This opens anyone to attack if you think about it since the herd is so easily moved.
how are we/they better off? More importantly who quit because of her outburst?
People make their own hell sometimes.
You never worked in Retail, have you?
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
maybe not saying or not being allowed to say what you feel is the problem.
look what's its lead to: A bunch of thin skin crybaby retards that cant take any criticism at all and blow up the whole internet over the most trivial things. This opens anyone to attack if you think about it since the herd is so easily moved.
how are we/they better off? More importantly who quit because of her outburst?
People make their own hell sometimes.
You never worked in Retail, have you?
it is impossible to not agree with your point.
However, it would be nice to see developers offer more direct and very clear communication about the vision they have for their game even going into detail describing what players will not enjoy their title.
ESO needs to state very clearly that their title is not primarily a PVP title and they’re not going to rewrite server code to support a small percentage of the population. If that is the case.
Instead, developers try to straddle the fence and it causes confusion and is in large part responsible for complaining in their communities.
Not only this- complaining from players indicates they want to continue enjoying the product enough to come to the developer with said complaints.
Worst case scenario for Zen is they actually just quit without a peep, leaving Zen bleeding players without any idea why.
There's a whole spectrum between this supposed "faux outrage" that it's very cool to blame everything on these days and just general customer complaint. Companies generally want you to complain instead of silently finding a new product to enjoy, whether you want to believe it or not.
ESO obviously tried to capitalize on DAOC's brilliant 3-way PvP zone play. They adopted the same 3-way setup, with optional PvP in a separate zone, like DAOC. One thing that made DAOC unique was that each of the 3 factions had their own set of classes, and each class was fairly complicated, with multiple possible builds. In ESO all 3 factions have the same classes, and classes are very limited in what options they have.
But the engine in ESO never could handle the load. In PvE, you can just shard off multiple instances, but in PvP, you either can host 100's of people or you can't. And ESO basically can't.
So the complaining from the PvP crowd started on day one, and has continued ever since. But Zeni discovered that the PvP crowd was not the main money maker, PvE is. So even while the PvP players say the game is unplayable, ESO developers say they are "killing it", and they are.
At this late date, they are not going to re-write the engine for a small minority of players. It just isn't going to happen.
my basic thinking is that cyrodiil is a miracle it works at all. The general ask is another miracle on top of that which is the architecture rewrite which might also include changes to gameplay.
Not only this- complaining from players indicates they want to continue enjoying the product enough to come to the developer with said complaints.
Worst case scenario for Zen is they actually just quit without a peep, leaving Zen bleeding players without any idea why.
Well, there is a line distinguishing rational complaints and irrational ones.
A player who complains because of something that they really find game breaking will do it at most once, and then leave the game if it is not fixed.
Gamers that complain for every little thing time after time and still go back to play the game really are whiners and crybabies and their protests become toothless (boy who cried wolf). Devs do get desensitized to player complaints once they become too frequent and irrational and are not followed by action.
Only, there's very little real evidence on offer for a single player doing this here, much less entire groups. Just a bunch of folks here making generalizations.
I can get behind the claim, but without some real evidence we have a group of players continuing the behavior you describe, it truly is just a guess that makes us feel better about our perspective on the events.
Did the player on that stream commit said behavior? If they weren't guilty of it, then the behavior you describe is completely irrelevant if we're being honest.
Only, there's very little real evidence on offer for a single player doing this here, much less entire groups. Just a bunch of folks here making generalizations.
I can get behind the claim, but without some real evidence we have a group of players continuing the behavior you describe, it truly is just a guess that makes us feel better about our perspective on the events.
Did the player on that stream commit said behavior? If they weren't guilty of it, then the behavior you describe is completely irrelevant if we're being honest.
Fair enough. No real evidence or numbers, and you are right on this being just a guess from my side and my personal perspective.
But anecdotally I can say that I have been seeing posts with complaints about ESO PVP performance in these forums and elsewhere for years now. Do you think my assessment is wrong and that this is just isolated incidents?
No, I truly do believe that some folks will always complain. But, being that's a given, we really have to try and resist applying it to every case where a complaint is made. This guy could've recently gotten into ESO and hit up Cyrodiil, got hit with the lag, saw it has been an ongoing problem, and took to finding ways to highlight it to the devs because he really wants to enjoy the PvP side now that he's completed the main campaign or something.
Or, he could be some old codger that just won't move on because he likes being angry. I think the streamer felt this was the case.
From a social perspective absent specific information, however, the most benevolent bet is to move forward assuming the complaint is made in good faith. From a business perspective, it's a must.
they basically just told everyone what they needed to do to fix it so you can see why they have been silent on the subject for so long.
most eso players arent either raiders or pvpers and 99% of the issues are in those two categories due to limitations of the game itself.
if you look at their content structure its mostly overland stories and dungeons which tells me that it has been unfeasible to fix these things for a very long time.
Only, there's very little real evidence on offer for a single player doing this here, much less entire groups. Just a bunch of folks here making generalizations.
I can get behind the claim, but without some real evidence we have a group of players continuing the behavior you describe, it truly is just a guess that makes us feel better about our perspective on the events.
Did the player on that stream commit said behavior? If they weren't guilty of it, then the behavior you describe is completely irrelevant if we're being honest.
Fair enough. No real evidence or numbers, and you are right on this being just a guess from my side and my personal perspective.
But anecdotally I can say that I have been seeing posts with complaints about ESO PVP performance in these forums and elsewhere for years now. Do you think my assessment is wrong and that this is just isolated incidents?
No, I truly do believe that some folks will always complain. But, being that's a given, we really have to try and resist applying it to every case where a complaint is made. This guy could've recently gotten into ESO and hit up Cyrodiil, got hit with the lag, saw it has been an ongoing problem, and took to finding ways to highlight it to the devs because he really wants to enjoy the PvP side now that he's completed the main campaign or something.
Or, he could be some old codger that just won't move on because he likes being angry. I think the streamer felt this was the case.
From a social perspective absent specific information, however, the most benevolent bet is to move forward assuming the complaint is made in good faith. From a business perspective, it's a must.
nahh.. to hunt down the Wife's Stream, and then ask her about something that has absolutely nothing to do with her at all, nothing she has any control over, or even working knowledge of, is not some new player that just loves the game sooo damn much, and only wants the best.
That's some jackass who wants to bitch to anyone that they can find about their butthurt, and no doubt already exhausted all their other means, and still wanted to be an insufferable ass about it.
Want to bring something to the Dev's attention, use their proper channels, like their Official Forums, Discord, Facebook Page, or other Social Media, like game review sites, or some other means where their brand and name is linked to it.
If they care, they will respond, if they don't.. they won't.
The only mistake that women made, was getting baited by a troll. She should have just deleted/ignored them and moved on. Which, when you think about it, is what the main PR people do anyway.
If you think devs don't know what is wrong with their game, a game they spend 40+ hours a week working on, in a professional sense, that pays their bills and provides for them, you are something special and precious.
Most Devs know damn well what is wrong with their game, and it's systems, it's all just a question of if they have the tools, talent, time and money to fix things correctly.
For a lot of games.. the answer is NO to that list, and person calling the shots basically said "Fuck them"
And PR knows this all too well, their job however, is just having someone who can tell the unwashed masses to go to hell, in such a way that they will look forward to the trip.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
This is from the same people who are so incompetent at their work that they made a animation cancelling bug become a feature.
Merits of the dev team in general aside, I agree that it's never a good idea to have something like animation canceling become "intended." If it is intended, the animations should flow properly to signal this.
The first iteration of medieval brawlers included some ridiculous swing manipulation mechanics that made fights look and feel incredibly silly. I didn't get into these brawlers until improvements were made where swing manipulation still occurs and can be used strategically, but it's limited enough to make sense logically and visually in action.
Comments
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
And in all fairness, It's not that hard to simply not be a crybaby like a little bitch about shit either.
.. and yet, we all saw clearly that people were going on some unaffiliated streamers site, and bitching about their husbands game.
What level of complete depraved crying little shit must you be to do that, and when you see that, yes, it is clearly the problem on the clients end... 100% and it's shit like that, is why they have such contempt for their player base. I have my issues with what some games have done, but I keep my bitching where it belongs, like on this site, and on topics about those games directly.
Which again, is why If I ever made a game, I would not allow any staff to casually interact with the player base, at all, period, and everything would go through PR.
That would work both ways, as there is no way in hell I would let any players directly contact my staff, and any that tried would have restraining orders put against them, if not charges pressed against them for harassment.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
I did ask my wife to not publically slag on my employer, at least until after I retire.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
look what's its lead to: A bunch of thin skin crybaby retards that cant take any criticism at all and blow up the whole internet over the most trivial things. This opens anyone to attack if you think about it since the herd is so easily moved.
how are we/they better off? More importantly who quit because of her outburst?
People make their own hell sometimes.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Worst case scenario for Zen is they actually just quit without a peep, leaving Zen bleeding players without any idea why.
There's a whole spectrum between this supposed "faux outrage" that it's very cool to blame everything on these days and just general customer complaint. Companies generally want you to complain instead of silently finding a new product to enjoy, whether you want to believe it or not.
------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.
careful what you wish for.
I can get behind the claim, but without some real evidence we have a group of players continuing the behavior you describe, it truly is just a guess that makes us feel better about our perspective on the events.
Did the player on that stream commit said behavior? If they weren't guilty of it, then the behavior you describe is completely irrelevant if we're being honest.
Or, he could be some old codger that just won't move on because he likes being angry. I think the streamer felt this was the case.
From a social perspective absent specific information, however, the most benevolent bet is to move forward assuming the complaint is made in good faith. From a business perspective, it's a must.
most eso players arent either raiders or pvpers and 99% of the issues are in those two categories due to limitations of the game itself.
if you look at their content structure its mostly overland stories and dungeons which tells me that it has been unfeasible to fix these things for a very long time.
That's some jackass who wants to bitch to anyone that they can find about their butthurt, and no doubt already exhausted all their other means, and still wanted to be an insufferable ass about it.
Want to bring something to the Dev's attention, use their proper channels, like their Official Forums, Discord, Facebook Page, or other Social Media, like game review sites, or some other means where their brand and name is linked to it.
If they care, they will respond, if they don't.. they won't.
The only mistake that women made, was getting baited by a troll. She should have just deleted/ignored them and moved on. Which, when you think about it, is what the main PR people do anyway.
If you think devs don't know what is wrong with their game, a game they spend 40+ hours a week working on, in a professional sense, that pays their bills and provides for them, you are something special and precious.
Most Devs know damn well what is wrong with their game, and it's systems, it's all just a question of if they have the tools, talent, time and money to fix things correctly.
For a lot of games.. the answer is NO to that list, and person calling the shots basically said "Fuck them"
And PR knows this all too well, their job however, is just having someone who can tell the unwashed masses to go to hell, in such a way that they will look forward to the trip.
The first iteration of medieval brawlers included some ridiculous swing manipulation mechanics that made fights look and feel incredibly silly. I didn't get into these brawlers until improvements were made where swing manipulation still occurs and can be used strategically, but it's limited enough to make sense logically and visually in action.