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Famous last words "This game is not for everyone"
glim3mer
Member UncommonPosts: 154
After reading a post made by Brad (owner or ceo or whatever "boss" of this game) I decided to take his "advice" and really go read up about this game by the official sites F.A.Q's and by other related sites from SOE and Sigil, before deciding if this game is for me or not. So I did, Brad said, read up about this game before you judge and I did.
At first I was just browsing around looking for a game to play. I have played MCO (Motor City Online, by EA) for a year and a half, I have played SWG for nearly two and a half years, I have played EQ2 for about 3 months, I have played WoW for nearly two years, I have played Matrix Online for a few months, I have played City of Hereos/Villains for around six months and I have played Ultima Online way back in the days for about nine months. What I want to say by all this, is that I have played many MMOG's and I am "today" bored of the lot of them and I am looking for a new game. My all time favorite was SWG pre-CU era "for the record".
Anyways, so I'm looking for a game, but I am really picky or actually specific with what I want, cause I know the kind of things I enjoy. What I am looking for is a game where by, Player housing is possible (similar to SWG and UO) for me its a MUST. If there is no player housing, no property for me to own and feel like I "own" something in this game, I cant get hooked. I really want a game with skills rather then class based. I really like the freedom of knowing, "hey if what I pick today, if I dont like it in 5 months from now, I can just "adjust" my skills and not lose my characters advancement by having to create a new character. Im the kind of guy who likes to try everything before I can pick, so games like COV I ended up spending about a month just testing out different "power sets" before I finally made my character which I kept. I think that was the beginning of the end for me, believe it or not. I want a free world, so NO instances and the number one thing I want, is NO GROUPING forced!! I Hate the fact that people who simply like to be part of a group have an advancetage in a 1 v 1 scenario with a person who likes to hang by himself because his time doesnt permit to "commit" and dedicate a "pre-determined" amount of play time. I sit on the computer, sometimes I play for 5 hours without interruption, other time I need to log off after 20 minutes, Im not always in control of my time, so if Im about to raid and I got to log off, guess what.... too bad for me right? well NO, I dont want to "need" other people in order for me to also have access to "phat loot", so that brings the next thing I want Player made economy, where the best item in the game is craftable not a loot drop. Or if it is a loot drop, its a one in a million drop so say one or two people per server will have it and everyone else will need to buy crafted items to be "elite".
So I had my hopes up for this game when I heard that player houses was available. But after reading all those AFQ's, I quickly found out that Vanguard will be class based which, if this what the only thing, I wouldnt mind it, but it will also be group and raid oriented game. And they say that althea solo play will be possible it will not yield as rewarding as group raiding. Which suxs for my taste.
Back to my analogy about why I hate it in some games where people who raid are better in 1 v 1 then people who solo is cause even if you look at it "logically" in a 1 v 1 fight, you dont have your friends to back you up, its me against you, but simply because you and your friends are able to farm bosses that me alone cannot kill, you end up getting gear, regardless of the fact that I might spend as much time if not more time then you online. In WOW most people would simply come online only for raid night and end up having all the "phat loot" and me that spent more time online then most "raiders" dint get a chance to get anything nice, cause I simply couldnt stay online for 4 hours straight most of the time. I could usually play two hours log of, come back later play two more hours, log off, long on for a few more hours in the late hours... and so on.
Bottom line, I was looking forward to this game cause it had the first element Im looking for in a game (player houses) but is lacking all the other elements (skills based, solo friendly, player made economy, craftable "phat" items) so Im really dissappointed.
Comments
well, you will be missed. bb then.
not that youll believe me and i dont feel like going into this on every new topic, but its not going to be raid and group only. SOME of the phat loot will only be available to crafters and diplomats.
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My concern is if the game is going to revolve around raiding and "itemization" Im not interested. Im still not interested if some "phat loot" is available in a non-raid fascion like you say about crafters and diplomats but in a Raid oriented game or more like end-game. The point is, if the game is made/designed for raiding and grouping and is designed to be loot based, its not for me.
Im trying to gather more info about this game, but everywhere Im looking so far Im reading that: raiding = better loot then non-raiding and game advancement at level cap will be item based just like WoW.
I also raid somewhere just before that they are trying to attract the "solo" player to this game now. But all indications so far are saying "raid centric" game.
Im not sure what to believe, on one hand Brad could be liying to people saying "come come its solo friendly" just to get subscribers and on the other hand he could be telling the truth. Do you believe a guy who is making money of you telling you he isnt in it for the money but rather the "love of it all" or not.
Anyways..... a lot of thoughs going in my mind. And Im mostly thinking out loud here. I wish it was as simple as it was when I picked up SWG back in November 03'. Buy game, install, play for 2+ years. Now we got to look over our sholders to see if the sales person isnt laughing at us for selling us a crappy MMO.
Go give WAR a look, I think you will like what you see. BTW, the poster who replied is typical of Vanguard posters, they will drive most players from the game with their nasty attitude. Yea you will be missed! These same nasty people will whine when this game gets cancelled, and it will. None of the groupers or soloers believe a word of spin coming from Brad. I believe this will be an EQ clone like:
Raider BP- 60AC 100hps with +2hp regen
Group BP- 40AC 25hps with no effects
Soloer BP- 30AC 0hps with no effects
etc, etc, etc on each slot with maybe one better item from group play that all raiders will carry and have of course. So a raider will have 5500hps 1200AC, group player 3000hps and 900AC, soloer 2000hps and 750AC, and all the best loot dropping group mobs will require raid gear to kill!
If you have any questions please ask. I have moved on to WoW from eq and no longer have any desire to play a dead game. Thank you. (posted by another selling his account in EQ1)
Any idea if Warhammer will have player houses?
Hard to find any solid information, but it seems like that: no. Or at least not during launch - BIIIIIIG maybe after launch.
"I know I said this was my last post, but you my friend are a idiotic moron." -Shadow4482
I have posted before that I want to like skill based games
because the customization sounds cool but I always find that I actually
don't like playing skill based games. I really didn't like UO once I
had others to compare it to and I absolutely hated AC1.
While
EQ wasn't solo friendly by any definition it was not solo impossible
once there was enough territory to support hundreds of soloers. I will
be happy if Vanguard is the same as far as soloing goes. My guess is
that folks who solo won't even realize what they are missing if they
don't group. The soloer will be able to have a completely enjoyable in
game life and will not feel like a second class citizen unless he is
the type of asshole who just looks for things to bitch about.
As far as I can tell Vanguard will have a player made economy and very nice crafted gear (I hate the term Phat ).
As far as the title of the the thread, I think we will find as the MMOG
industry grows, "not for everyone" games will take the lion share of
the subscribers.
Sigil and Vanguard is just the
PVEbeginning of a new wave in online games and the multiple ruleset
servers. I know it has been done before by many games but Sigil is
going to take it to an extreme.
PVP FFA
PVE w/ RP
PVP FFA w/ RP
PvE Ironman permadeath
PVE with global auctions (yikes)
Point is that in the future the smart MMOG developer will have
different servers that will appeal to very different tastes in game
play style. So "This game is not for evryone" will be replaced with
"this server is not for everyone."
I have NO idea what you were reading because:
1) It does have a skill system, as in skills you can learn and you can't master them all.
2) It is a player economy. You only by starter items & mounts. A VAST majority of items in-game are player made.
3) The best items in the game are crafted, made from rare ingredient drops.
That all said, GL in your future gaming!
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
What didn't you like about the beta? Did you go on the forum and say what you didn't like?
Why didn't you like the graphics? What system are you running it on. Maybe it's your system. The game looks really good on a decent computer. Why didn't you like the combat system. How many lvls did you play? some say the true combat system didn't show it glory till lvl 20+.
This is the thing that amazes me about the fans of this game. There is always some reason why if you don't like it it's your fault. Your computer isn't good enough. You weren't high enough level. You didn't do ___. Whatever.
I played EQ 1, and I can tell you what kind of computer I had back then. It was shit (even taking into account what year it was). I had a dial up connection and it sucked too. Still, at the lower levels of the game, I was having a ball! My character got to max level and I enjoyed each and every one of those levels. I had just as much fun at level 6 as I had later (crappy computer, crappy connection, and crappy graphics notwithstanding.
)
But now the attitude is fun is something that comes later, after you buy a brand new computer and after you get to level ___ (what goes in that blank depends on who you talk to, but it's always a level much higher than where you are now).
No. A thousand times no. Make the game fun at every level. Make it fun for people no matter what their playstyle. Design and program it well enough where it can run properly without having the latest hardware. I want to hear more legitimate reasons why Vanguard is fun and fewer excuses why it's mine and everyone else's fault that it isn't.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
If Developers try to please both groups they will fail, as each group will find dislikes about the game. But if they decide to target and aim to please one group in perticular, a game will be successful.
Sadly alot of developers dont realise this.
/end rant
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I'm not saying its your fault if you don't like the game. All im saying is ppl should give the game a chance instead of judging a book by its cover.
The time is you have to follow a certain trend at the first 20 lvl. It's the part of the game where ppl are learning and it's what ppl see first. You can't have a tough combat system within the first 10 lvls because it would put most ppl off.
On the point about the graphics. All im saying is if you want the best graphics you have to buy the best hardware. Graphics doesn't = fun.
Mainly i'm just asking why he doesn't like the beta. All he said is he doesn't liek the combat and graphics. What i want to now is why.
Sorry, this is a bit off topic but there's something fundamentally wrong with this signature "--12 days to level 63 and 10 AA's, EQ is no harder or easier then WOW, get over the fact WoW is no easier then EQ. Many others leveled just as fast as I did on new servers. You leveled slowly because you lacked skills and the ability to do it quickly. No other player assisted me in leveling by PLing me or anything stupid like that and I didn't buy any items or pp!"
1: If you're levelling past 50 you're levelling on the *NEW* exp curve (or one of the many new xp curves), also you're levelling with many skills, abilities and hand-holding mechanics that weren't there on release. Initially you would not be reaching level 50 (which was the cap back then) in 12 days.
So, yes, levelling in EQ was drastically harder than it was in WoW, whether you want to believe it or not, as you obviously weren't there before EQ bagan scaling down the risk & challenge involved weith levelling (something WoW never had itself at any point).
Just needed to point that out for you so you can alter your sig as you see fit, I don't think anyone would argue that the current incarnation of EQ offers any real challenge or risk or time commitment (aside from raiding requiring time commitment obviously), but before it began imitating WoW to such disgusting degrees, it certainly was a challenge to level and took a lot longer due to extreme xp curves.
Thanks
Faranthil Tanathalos
EverQuest 1 - Ranger
Star Wars Galaxies - Master Ranger
Everquest2 - Ranger WarhammerOnline - Shadow Warrior
WOW - Hunter
That's right I like bows and arrows.
See thats the big misconseption IMO, simply because 2 or more people are teamed up together, doesnt mean they are working harder. Unless ofcourse if the game is designed for this kind of thing, like this game might be from the sounds of it by having "combo" attacks and "responsive" options based on what your teammate is doing.
In SWG for example, where it wasent loot based, or atleast loot rewards where too few and far between that made crafted items the norm that people used, well in that game a soloer was just as good in PvP then a raider. PvE dint determine the outcome of PvP. In WoW though, the best PvPer is the best PvEer and I hated that. Some people will say NO, its skills above all and that was wrong. Cause when someone using a bow is shooting arrows at you doing triple the damage then your bow, you have no chance, skills or not.
What SWG did that was awsome, was this: They made "dungeons" where the loot form "bosses" was really awsome but dint gimp the crafted items. For example, the reward was a "new" set of armor but the stats on it was just as good as the best crafted or so it was suppose to be. This way, people that wanted to look different or wanted to do PvE and be rewared had the option to do the dungeon, and in the same time people like me that wanted to prepare for PvP, I simply went shopping, bought me a set of good crafted armor and I was good to go. So everyone was happy like that, PvEer, PvPer, soloer, raider, crafter....everyone.
Another thing I dont like is class based, but thats another topic, but in a nutshell, people will say a class system is the only way to balance classes and I say to you, no, go play Matrix Online and you will find something new. Matrix I believe started a good idea and I believe it can be very awsome and can really become the "next generation" if done well. This is how it would work:
You have "classes" but you start from scratch, so as you "grind" or quest you learn boxes or skills from your class, now the moment you decide "hey I dont like this class" you can unload that class and load a new class BUT you start from scratch that new class. Anytime you decide, hey I dont like that class you can unload it and load the previous class you had and continue from where you left off, so this way, people can experience all the classes with their character, people arent stuck with one class, and assuming you sit down and work hard on creating a balance, you can then split the classes in two or three and load and unload parts of one class while loading parts of another class making it seem like you are picking your own skills from the list of classes. Similarly to SWG. Matrix did that cause it fitted well with the concept of loading any skill into your memory, but any other game can do that by using differnet ideas like if your holding a one handed sword then you can only use Fencer skills, if you are holding a Two-handed Mace then you can only be a warrior or whatever, if you are holding a wand then you can only use spells.... anyways, thats just an idea based on the Matrix Online concept that I found originally effective and fun.
But back to my original point PvE shouldnt determine who is better at PvP.
that guys sig doesnt bother to many people honestly, most of us know when we see something stupid. i personnally just have a good laugh and move on.
i dont know about the rest of you guys, but i read poster history when i see something neg. just to get a feel for where this guy gets his ideals. if you do the same, youll realize that there are some of them that are simply trolls. they just want start fights in the forums, nothing constructive ever comes out of their mouths. read scaramoosh's for a good laugh. or Amathe's. or Sebbonx's. youll see what im talking about. Sebbonx's was a especially funny to read after reading what he wrote about me. to a troll, the favorite word of insult is "fanboi". lol, thats so funny, cause to a mature player, all that means is that they cant come up with a real insult.
Oo and the "its going to be cancelled" thing, typical trolling there, hey dumbass, its not even been released yet. sorry to feed the troll, but i had to say something about that. and your numbers on the equips are way off. but since you dont read, i wouldnt expect you to know that. and last, but not least (in me book anyway), if pointing out the trolls that just wanna start trouble in the Vanguard forums makes me a Vanboi, well, cool, im a Vanboi then. wow, kinda ruins your feeble attempt at an insult when it doesnt insult me, huh?
and finally, i meant no offense by me original statement. its pretty simple really. the OP says that he has read up on Vanguard, and im not one to call someone a lier unless they prove themselves to be a lier. so no amount of convincing on me part would have changed his/her mind, so i was just letting him/her know that in other words, sorry that you feel that way, but im not going to be losing any sleep over it. i realize after rereading it, that it might have been worded differently. so if it caused offense, i apologize.
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I didn't bother reading much past here, because you have completely contradicted yourself, which bodes ill for the rest of your post. You're really picky? Uh huh. You've played half the games out there for many months each, some for years. And then you say player housing is an absolute "MUST" and yes, you did capitalize it. Yet you played WoW for 2 years, Motor City Online for 1 1/2 years, and a couple of others for a few months that have, let's see, NO player housing. Looks to me like you went fishing for reasons to dislike Vanguard and this was the best you could come up with, even though player housing very obviously has nothing to do with which games you are happy to play for years and years.
And no, I'm not a fanboy. I think this is my first post in the Vanguard forums and I've only been peripherally aware of the game. But the glaring contradiction in this post caught my eye.