Think it was Wranger who stated that a query of the subs had revealed that about 20% where dual accounts... so 80% of the playerbase is uniqe accounts... rest is someones double or third accounts (and some even more).
Today my subs have ended (atleast on my main), my second account is expire on the 12th...
I had a goodbye thread that ofcourse got flamed to death by someone there .. but no worries... I don't really tought it would be different
also I have stated that I will be back once the Dev's do the right thing, someone asking .. what is the right thing... well the answer is simple... just read the thread and grant some wishes.
So you can't fire T20 because they already have punished him, they can fire him if his action have caused the company to loose money... because this is a new incident if you think of it.
However ... I do not ask for T20's head here, they say they have punished him and that is that... however they have not answered properly why the bpo's where left in the corp for 6 months, they have not punished BoB for having these ... financially that is.
They have not punished SirMolle for action where he posted names of the hacker on the forums... something that resulted people phoning the hackers boss, so that information must have been pretty accurate right ?
CCP did however and have confirmed that they banned the hacker NOT because he hacked BoB's forums ... but for posting information about SirMolle (and that I don't disagree about ... however we can demand that justice is served here and SirMolle should be banned for the things he did).
However CCP say they don't have evidence for this... despite someone posted this to them (petitions) aparently.
i wasnt flaming you thats your own misinterpretation of my post i was asking you a honest question. you are the one who is aggressively counter attacking at everything even when that something isnt an attack against you.
It seems from many of your posts here that you do indeed dislike the community and the game to me it seems quite obvious. I could be wrong but thats the impresion you are giving. and assuming everyone is flaming you is a bit paranoid is it not?
from my point of veiw and observation you have lost your cool and are attacking everyone here almost blindly if they disagree with you or criticize you even if they are doing so calmly and constructively.
oh but you were flaming.
trolling
making up fud
The timing was perfect...
now stop omitting and ignoring what IS happening and what IS said...just so you can flame and troll.
ccp the "we cheat for our buddies and are proud of it" company...
Did you noticed people stoping to play in your corp/alliance?
yes
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
At this moment there are 32.132 players online in tranquility I guess the scandal, didnt made people drop EVE, i think that just somme haters are telling they canceled their imaginary accounts. Did you noticed people stoping to play in your corp/alliance? Regards
Kinda a funny aint it. This guy is either wrangler or Keiron. He is comming here to do damage control. Sorry your numbers have always been suspect.
How many of those 32,132 playing accounts are:
Dual or tripple accounts?
Macro farmers:
Better yet how many of those accounts really pay to play? GTC sales are one of the most stupid things CCP ever did.
i could only wish he were kieron. then i could say very happy words to him, and not worry about him getting me banned because he's a very very very non-nice hitler youth.
edited to add: someone has to pay cash for the GTCs. so if one person is buying a few hundred dollars worth of GTCs/month and others are just using isk to pay for them... there's still money going into ccp's pockets.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
i was not flaming you i was however criticizing you... howeve rI was doing it in a consrtuctive manner instead of blasting you i was pointing out what i saw calmly and maturely. its not my fault if your misinterpretting what im saying
however if you would be able to understand me better if i was being a complete ass i can arrange that
anyway. im fully aware of what going on in the eve community and honestly I could really care less. a few people left because a Gm cheated and helped his alliance and now theres claims of another one doing it. honestly to me its trivial everyone is up in arms people act like its the first time a GM has cheated ina game and they act like they can acually do something about it. the problem here is that you cant most of the playbase either doesnt know about it or doesnt care. the few that acually do care dont hold enough sway to even matter. to CCP it would take a much larger movement than what is currently there untill then we are simply unimportant faceless critics (whether it be good or bad)
the reason i decided to post what i posted is that from my point of veiw you are counter attacking people. from my point of veiw you are being very aggressive about how you take your opinion on this matter. while agressive isnt bad. when you turn it tward a person who has no ill will tward you it is
i was not flaming you i was however criticizing you... howeve rI was doing it in a consrtuctive manner instead of blasting you i was pointing out what i saw calmly and maturely. its not my fault if your misinterpretting what im saying
however if you would be able to understand me better if i was being a complete ass i can arrange that
anyway. im fully aware of what going on in the eve community and honestly I could really care less. a few people left because a Gm cheated and helped his alliance and now theres claims of another one doing it. honestly to me its trivial everyone is up in arms people act like its the first time a GM has cheated ina game and they act like they can acually do something about it. the problem here is that you cant most of the playbase either doesnt know about it or doesnt care. the few that acually do care dont hold enough sway to even matter. to CCP it would take a much larger movement than what is currently there untill then we are simply unimportant faceless critics (whether it be good or bad)
the reason i decided to post what i posted is that from my point of veiw you are counter attacking people. from my point of veiw you are being very aggressive about how you take your opinion on this matter. while agressive isnt bad. when you turn it tward a person who has no ill will tward you it is
hah nice try but im no sheep. As i said i don't care about the scandal and even if it did impact my character in some way i prolly still wouldnt care. I don't put enough stock into any game i play to let anything that happens on it effect me enought to get me to care. I have more important things to acually care about like bettering myself and working tward my dreams. To me eve is a social and entertaiment tool nothing more so to me you people getting so serious and worked up about these things seems quite silly.
I do have my own opinions about damn near everything and am not some mindless drone like your tring to call me. the diffrence is the ammount of importance i place on a game and the events that happen therein.
i was not flaming you i was however criticizing you... howeve rI was doing it in a consrtuctive manner instead of blasting you i was pointing out what i saw calmly and maturely. its not my fault if your misinterpretting what im saying
however if you would be able to understand me better if i was being a complete ass i can arrange that
anyway. im fully aware of what going on in the eve community and honestly I could really care less. a few people left because a Gm cheated and helped his alliance and now theres claims of another one doing it. honestly to me its trivial everyone is up in arms people act like its the first time a GM has cheated ina game and they act like they can acually do something about it. the problem here is that you cant most of the playbase either doesnt know about it or doesnt care. the few that acually do care dont hold enough sway to even matter. to CCP it would take a much larger movement than what is currently there untill then we are simply unimportant faceless critics (whether it be good or bad)
the reason i decided to post what i posted is that from my point of veiw you are counter attacking people. from my point of veiw you are being very aggressive about how you take your opinion on this matter. while agressive isnt bad. when you turn it tward a person who has no ill will tward you it is
I kind of disagree with this point true Bawdy is posting a lot of counter points but it is hardly agressive what he posts and even so some of his points are pretty accurate.
I have no problem atall with his counterpoints its the way he accuses anyone who has an opinion in favor of CCP of being asskissers and the assumption that i was flaming him when i wasnt and then the reassumption that i was flamming when i tried to straighten out the misscommunication that makes it seem thatway to me. and to me is only affirmed by his attempt to insult me when i gave my veiw on the subject matter
At this moment there are 32.132 players online in tranquility I guess the scandal, didnt made people drop EVE, i think that just somme haters are telling they canceled their imaginary accounts. Did you noticed people stoping to play in your corp/alliance? Regards
Kinda a funny aint it. This guy is either wrangler or Keiron. He is comming here to do damage control. Sorry your numbers have always been suspect.
How many of those 32,132 playing accounts are:
Dual or tripple accounts?
Macro farmers:
Better yet how many of those accounts really pay to play? GTC sales are one of the most stupid things CCP ever did.
Um... Why are you even asking this? Do you really think there's been a sudden spike of these kinds of accounts/activities? There hasn't. The fact is that active playerbase has been completely uninterested in this 'issue'. Most players don't care, have gotten over it, or just want to play the damn game and could care less what goes on in 0.0....
Bottom line: All the things you mention above go on normally. Unless there was a radical spike in that activity in the past 2 weeks then your point is completely invalid. Furthermore people who actually PLAY the game have stated, multiple times, that nobody (or at the most a VERY small number) in their alliances has quit the game. I am tight with 4 alliances and know their folks well. Nobody in Vent or TS for those alliances has made any statements about quitting the game over it. Most, in fact, feel that the issue has been blown way out of proportion. The few offended by it feel that while CCP took their sweet time they did eventually deal with it in an adequate manner.
Bottom line: CCP has been very good to the players of EVE over the years. We have no reason to distrust them the way you folks seem to. They have stated that they have put processes, applications and teams in place to prevent future occurances. I'm satisfied with that now that they took the BPO's out of circulation.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
So in other word you accept that CCP lets BoB off the hook, not punishing BoB for the income they have/might have had for the past 6 months on these bpo's ? you accept that CCP lets SirMolle off the hook for a bannable offence ? while enforcing this ruthless on others.. (thinking of naming this Hacker).
This is just a few points that CCP refuse to deal with ...
I don't think that there will be any noticeable drop in online numbers. Where I do see potential loss is in new players to the game. But this could be balanced out with an excellent marketing campaign, for example...
Usually you get 1000 players/month with $5000 in marketing.
Because of the scandal you will only get 250 players this month.
CCP puts $20000 into marketing.
This month CCP still gets 1000 new players.
Everything looks like no loss to growth.
The point is that it will be very very difficult for CCP to tell if the scandal effects them. And by extension without details it will be impossible for the rest of us to know.
At the end of the day the hit CCP takes is a reputation one - they have a tarnished image. It will be a hard one to shake. I can't imagine how difficult it will be for T20 in particular to go to any events, post, or participate in the community. It's to bad too. He was a good guy who made a serious mistake. Too bad CCP handled it so piss poorly.
So in other word you accept that CCP lets BoB off the hook, not punishing BoB for the income they have/might have had for the past 6 months on these bpo's ? you accept that CCP lets SirMolle off the hook for a bannable offence ? while enforcing this ruthless on others.. (thinking of naming this Hacker). This is just a few points that CCP refuse to deal with ...
Exactly what did "BoB" do wrong? 1 member of 1 corporation gave a friend in his corporation some BPO's before "quitting" the game. For all we know his friend had no idea the BPO's were obtained in any way beyond the norm.
So you're saying an entire alliance of approximately 2000 players should be 'punished' because ONE GM couldn't control his impulses? I could give a rats ass what SirMolle did. Frankly I could care less what happens to SirMolle or Kugutsman they are minor blips on a very big radar in my EVE world. If you choose to obsess over this incident go for it. Personally I have a lot more important things to worry about in my life than what two egomaniacs do on a game I play in my spare time for recreation and relaxation. Frankly I'm tired of the witch hunts on these forums. Bottom line: I am thankful that the issue got taken care of. As to Kugutsman vs. SirMolle? I'm not CCP, it's NOT my game... It's not My headache and it's not my problem. Last time I checked CCP owned the servers we play on, owns the game we play and owns the bandwidth we use to play it. What you or I *want* to happen is irellevant. It's a privately owned company, how they chose to deal with their employees is entirely up to them (in reference to your huge moan fest about T20 not getting fired). Frankly it's not your decision to make. Nor is it mine. If it were me? I'd have fired him. If it were me? I'd have banned SirMolle too.
But am I going to quit a game I enjoy because some asshat chooses to post drivel about the devs on an almost weekly basis? No. Am I going to quit because the Devs chose to ban a hacker and not ban the guy who posted factual information about the hacker when the hacker was outright lying about certain people? No. Frankly I could care less.
But go on with your witch hunt. I'm sure it'll be much more fruitful and catch just as many witches as the Salem Trials did.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Exactly what did "BoB" do wrong? 1 member of 1 corporation gave a friend in his corporation some BPO's before "quitting" the game. For all we know his friend had no idea the BPO's were obtained in any way beyond the norm.
So you're saying an entire alliance of approximately 2000 players should be 'punished' because ONE GM couldn't control his impulses? I could give a rats ass what SirMolle did. Frankly I could care less what happens to SirMolle or Kugutsman they are minor blips on a very big radar in my EVE world. If you choose to obsess over this incident go for it. Personally I have a lot more important things to worry about in my life than what two egomaniacs do on a game I play in my spare time for recreation and relaxation. Frankly I'm tired of the witch hunts on these forums. Bottom line: I am thankful that the issue got taken care of. As to Kugutsman vs. SirMolle? I'm not CCP, it's NOT my game... It's not My headache and it's not my problem. Last time I checked CCP owned the servers we play on, owns the game we play and owns the bandwidth we use to play it. What you or I *want* to happen is irellevant. It's a privately owned company, how they chose to deal with their employees is entirely up to them (in reference to your huge moan fest about T20 not getting fired). Frankly it's not your decision to make. Nor is it mine. If it were me? I'd have fired him. If it were me? I'd have banned SirMolle too.
But am I going to quit a game I enjoy because some asshat chooses to post drivel about the devs on an almost weekly basis? No. Am I going to quit because the Devs chose to ban a hacker and not ban the guy who posted factual information about the hacker when the hacker was outright lying about certain people? No. Frankly I could care less.
But go on with your witch hunt. I'm sure it'll be much more fruitful and catch just as many witches as the Salem Trials did.
I was agreeing with you right up to the point where you used the "it's not our game it's there game they can do what they want" argument.
At the end of the day it's true. I pay them to access their game. All I ask in return is that they provide me with the service I percieve to be getting. So, if CCP wants to start a corporation in game and use cheat codes and god modes am I entitled to stop them? Nope. But I would hope that I would know that going into it. Because in that case I wouldn't pay for the service.
As for witch hunting. I don't think anyone here has the resources to be on the witch hunt. We are more like the stable boys of the people that have gone on the witch hunt, sitting around, talking about the witch hunt that other people are on. And why not talk about it? Hell, they still talk about the Salem trials to this day!
I said CCP have refused and state that they don't know how much BoB have benefitted from having illegally obtained tech 2 bpo's in their alliance, they don't even estimate.... they say they won't deal with that, only to remove the bpo's 6 months AFTER the incident and only AFTER it became clear on the forums.
Do you think they would remove the bpo's if it had not been revealed by the hacker ? and nobody but the invovled people knew ?
Anyone benefiting from a exploit gets their isk removed ... that is normal procedure by CCP, there are always people who have been set back like 1 billion isk and so on.. just search the forums and you see others have been punished by CCP because they used a exploit.
Using illegally obtained bpo's is a exploit... any value they have gained from this should be removed... if they can't figure the exact numbers they need to estimate, anything else will be seen as favorite one part in the game... and is unacceptable.
The same goes for SirMolle situation...
About T20 if you have seen what I have written about it you will find out I have NEVER asked for his head, or that he needs to be fired... infact I have stated that CCP say they have punished him once already and that he can't be punished twice for the same crime.
Facts is that CCP only confessed to things they could not hide or cover-up ... in the end ... that does not really get CCP into any good light here... that only imply that CCP might have more stuff they don't want to confess about that could be very damaging for the game.
In the end... I never have had much dealings with BoB apart from that they almost blew up a freighter I had... that costed me 60 million isk to repair... should I get a refund under the assumption that those weapons they used might come from illegally obtained bpo's ??? Facts is that I give a shit about that... what I don't give a shit about is how CCP did handle this and clearly showed favorism about BoB ... where they have NOT punished BoB or members of BoB for breach of EULA that they have banned and punished others for.
And as a result I have canceled both my accounts and they will stay closed to CCP do the right thing here.
In excess of 2000 people have canceled...but their time has to run out.
People with time left are loging in to change skills and play out what they paid for, but they have canceled.
Look at cold front, and unless you are blind, there is a drop in the logins, all corolating to the scandal exposure...
BS
Prove it or admit you're pulling numbers out of thin air. Where are you getting "in excess of 2000 players have cancelled" from?
I don't buy it. Makhai alliance is over 300 members... not a single person quit over this. Hydra alliance is over 700 members... again... not a single person left over this.
So out of 1000 players ZERO have left EVE over it, that's a *fact*. I'm not saying NOBODY has left the game... but I'm not buying that 2,000+ have left either. Even if that site is accurate, which I don't think it is,... 2,000 out of 170,000 is peanuts.
That's 1k people you're saying didn't quit because of the scandal. Did you personally ask each one of them?
please stop the moaning EvE remains an outstanding game if you want to go off to some where else ... bye
I'm certain what the esteemed Zarniewoop meant was, if you want to go off to somewhere else... bye. But please, since this is a forum to discuss a game, on a site that reviews games, which by its very nature is the most appropriate place to talk about what you like and don't like about a game - do post here. Tell people what you think. Allow others to hear your opinion. Don't ram it down their throats, and ignore people that try to ram it down yours.
I'm certain that's what he meant. Afterall - if these boards contained nothing but post after fanboi post of "yeah, it's great" where would the need to have these boards about Eve be?
And in the spirit of the esteemed Zarniewoop I will insert a smilie to emphasize my point, because that is a clever and pointed thing to do:
I played Eve for 1-2 month this past summer,but I didn't have the time to commit to learn and participate with my corporation.So i canceled the subscription.However,now i have more time to be active and contribute,so I restarted my subscription this past month
I think the main problem Eve faces is the high learning curve
Played EVE for over two years. I just canceled my one and only account.
But honestly it wasn't due to the Dev/GM fiasco - it was due to a game that is unraveling. See I think that CCP, even though they try, lack the creative and programming skills to take the game where they want it to go.
They are trying with the aqusition of White Wolf, at least in the content area to provide some injections of fresh story content. But in the end thats going to all get focused on WoD.
I don't think they posses the programming talent to fix the code problems in the game. You can see that by all of the bugs, flaws and exploits in the game. I think they want to fix them (sometimes) I just don''t think they have the skills to do it.
Because of all that they are sacrificing players that they know can't and won't be satisfied with what they do have the talent to deliver. So if your deal is PVE, industry (mostly), research your going to be increasingly pushed out of the game.
I don't think people are quitting Eve Online at all. The numbers logged in every evening/weekend are ~28,000.
All this trolling is BANDWAGON!
Come on! - People quitting the game over some blueprint?! Get real! Get a life!
People in real life cheat about much worse things than that! Doesn't mean to say YOU give up!!
And if a silly developer cheats again - CCP might fire them - BUT if this ever happens, don't expect to hear about it - it would all be too personal for the person fired.
I'm not sure Bandwagon Troll thread is exactly true. Yes there are a lot of people here who played or play EVE who have gotten burnt by other players or some of the game mechanics. Like I said, I quit over lack of anything else to do. CCP has a real problem with creating content, that's why they keep trumping the "player driven content" card. Mainly because they don't have the talent to pull off their vision.
I still believe CCP is going to continue to marginilze it's PVE and industrial players because they just don't understand that market well enough to continue to support it the way that player would like. They are taking the best approach they can ... keep downplaying PVE game style until they are weeded out, and hope you get a big enough influx of PVP players to offset the loss.
The problem with that idea is that so much PVP is dependant on PVE ISK flows to support it. How do you get rid of it and still have enough cash flow to support the other? I would worry this would eventually start shutting off small gang PVP because most smaller corps don't have as deep pockets to keep it up forever. That leaves only the Alliance's left to support it. And with the Blob, who needs to fight anyway .. just lag each other into submission without firing a shot.
On a personal note, Jack you must be concerned about CCP's future. You've spent a lot of time going from thread to thread in defence of them.
4 people have stopped playing EVE in my corporation. 3 have moved out of 0.0 space into empire for a more casual game (including me) because at the moment 0.0 alliance game is quite broken and unbalanced. They and several other corporation mates have cancelled extra accounts (BPO lottery (-->going away) toons, POS/industry toons, cyno network toons) .... approx. 20 positions cancelled or in hibernation. Thats about 10 % of my corp. Thats some 300 EUROs less for CCP.
You wont see much of that in the "People online" number, as most of these accounts are secondary and tertiary accounts. That does not mean CCP wont see the effect in their wallet, especially once the multiple-month advance payment accounts are not being renewed.
Have fun
Erillion
Originally posted by WARCRYtm
At this moment there are 32.132 players online in tranquility I guess the scandal, didnt made people drop EVE, i think that just somme haters are telling they canceled their imaginary accounts. Did you noticed people stoping to play in your corp/alliance? Regards
Firstly, you put your point very well. I was actually tired when I wrote what I did above; it comes across as a rant! However, I hope Eve Online continues to improve, simply because I wish CCP all the best.
I don't think the issues you mention will kill Eve. This is because your issues are relative detail that either people might not be affected by, or detail that is sceduled to be improved apon this summer. However, I can see how they would turn current players away in the long-term. In my opinion, it will be outside competition that is the biggest risk. For example, Pirates of the Burning Sea could take away the fan base over night if it's good enough (but this is my personal opinion).
On the other hand, Eve Online is science fiction so it has a greater potential to adapt. As it's science fiction, teamtalk does not seem unnatural. In addition, Eve should soon have it's own teamtalk system, further improving a community feel. In contrast, PotBS is confined by history.
This summer, PvE should improve because level 4 missions are changing, level 6 will be introduced, and level 7 missions may be introduced.
I wonder if you are a little inpatient for change - it takes a long time to design new gaming aspects (years rather than months).
Ultimately, I wish CCP and Eve all the best because it's so easy to be negative, but only positive attitudes produce good results. Destroying is easier than creating. For example, you've got to have a dream to make a dream come true. In life, there are plenty of people who will critisise your aims, but I think fate favours those who are encouraged to their goals.
Hello CaptRedHand Firstly, you put your point very well. I was actually tired when I wrote what I did above; it comes across as a rant! However, I hope Eve Online continues to improve, simply because I wish CCP all the best. I don't think the issues you mention will kill Eve. This is because your issues are relative detail that either people might not be affected by, or detail that is sceduled to be improved apon this summer. However, I can see how they would turn current players away in the long-term. In my opinion, it will be outside competition that is the biggest risk. For example, Pirates of the Burning Sea could take away the fan base over night if it's good enough (but this is my personal opinion). On the other hand, Eve Online is science fiction so it has a greater potential to adapt. As it's science fiction, teamtalk does not seem unnatural. In addition, Eve should soon have it's own teamtalk system, further improving a community feel. In contrast, PotBS is confined by history. This summer, PvE should improve because level 4 missions are changing, level 6 will be introduced, and level 7 missions may be introduced. I wonder if you are a little inpatient for change - it takes a long time to design new gaming aspects (years rather than months). Ultimately, I wish CCP and Eve all the best because it's so easy to be negative, but only positive attitudes produce good results. Destroying is easier than creating. For example, you've got to have a dream to make a dream come true. In life, there are plenty of people who will critisise your aims, but I think fate favours those who are encouraged to their goals.
LARGE TEXT MAKES ME RIGHT!
CCP is one of the worst development companies to grace the MMORPG world. They can't fix most of the problems with their game (Bugs from early alpha still exist), they don't listen to the majority of players (The ones in empire), they lie ("No dev cheated!"), they call "bugs" unannounced "features" (No password POS shield bug), they blame the players for the current state of the game (Blobbing and node crashes), they play favorites (BoB), they are some of the slowest content developers (Six months for new content, if we are lucky), they don't enforce the rules fairly (Kug banned, Sirmolle doesn't get banned for the same offense), and they don't know how to program (Didn't document code).
These guys are right down there with SOE, but atleast EQ2 is fun!
Comments
Think it was Wranger who stated that a query of the subs had revealed that about 20% where dual accounts... so 80% of the playerbase is uniqe accounts... rest is someones double or third accounts (and some even more).
Today my subs have ended (atleast on my main), my second account is expire on the 12th...
I had a goodbye thread that ofcourse got flamed to death by someone there .. but no worries... I don't really tought it would be different
also I have stated that I will be back once the Dev's do the right thing, someone asking .. what is the right thing... well the answer is simple... just read the thread and grant some wishes.
So you can't fire T20 because they already have punished him, they can fire him if his action have caused the company to loose money... because this is a new incident if you think of it.
However ... I do not ask for T20's head here, they say they have punished him and that is that... however they have not answered properly why the bpo's where left in the corp for 6 months, they have not punished BoB for having these ... financially that is.
They have not punished SirMolle for action where he posted names of the hacker on the forums... something that resulted people phoning the hackers boss, so that information must have been pretty accurate right ?
CCP did however and have confirmed that they banned the hacker NOT because he hacked BoB's forums ... but for posting information about SirMolle (and that I don't disagree about ... however we can demand that justice is served here and SirMolle should be banned for the things he did).
However CCP say they don't have evidence for this... despite someone posted this to them (petitions) aparently.
trolling
making up fud
The timing was perfect...
now stop omitting and ignoring what IS happening and what IS said...just so you can flame and troll.
ccp the "we cheat for our buddies and are proud of it" company...
yes
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Kinda a funny aint it. This guy is either wrangler or Keiron. He is comming here to do damage control. Sorry your numbers have always been suspect.
How many of those 32,132 playing accounts are:
Dual or tripple accounts?
Macro farmers:
Better yet how many of those accounts really pay to play? GTC sales are one of the most stupid things CCP ever did.
i could only wish he were kieron. then i could say very happy words to him, and not worry about him getting me banned because he's a very very very non-nice hitler youth.
edited to add: someone has to pay cash for the GTCs. so if one person is buying a few hundred dollars worth of GTCs/month and others are just using isk to pay for them... there's still money going into ccp's pockets.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
however if you would be able to understand me better if i was being a complete ass i can arrange that
anyway. im fully aware of what going on in the eve community and honestly I could really care less. a few people left because a Gm cheated and helped his alliance and now theres claims of another one doing it. honestly to me its trivial everyone is up in arms people act like its the first time a GM has cheated ina game and they act like they can acually do something about it. the problem here is that you cant most of the playbase either doesnt know about it or doesnt care. the few that acually do care dont hold enough sway to even matter. to CCP it would take a much larger movement than what is currently there untill then we are simply unimportant faceless critics (whether it be good or bad)
the reason i decided to post what i posted is that from my point of veiw you are counter attacking people. from my point of veiw you are being very aggressive about how you take your opinion on this matter. while agressive isnt bad. when you turn it tward a person who has no ill will tward you it is
ccp the "we cheat for our buddies and are proud of it" company...
I do have my own opinions about damn near everything and am not some mindless drone like your tring to call me. the diffrence is the ammount of importance i place on a game and the events that happen therein.
Kinda a funny aint it. This guy is either wrangler or Keiron. He is comming here to do damage control. Sorry your numbers have always been suspect.
How many of those 32,132 playing accounts are:
Dual or tripple accounts?
Macro farmers:
Better yet how many of those accounts really pay to play? GTC sales are one of the most stupid things CCP ever did.
Um... Why are you even asking this? Do you really think there's been a sudden spike of these kinds of accounts/activities? There hasn't. The fact is that active playerbase has been completely uninterested in this 'issue'. Most players don't care, have gotten over it, or just want to play the damn game and could care less what goes on in 0.0....
Bottom line: All the things you mention above go on normally. Unless there was a radical spike in that activity in the past 2 weeks then your point is completely invalid. Furthermore people who actually PLAY the game have stated, multiple times, that nobody (or at the most a VERY small number) in their alliances has quit the game. I am tight with 4 alliances and know their folks well. Nobody in Vent or TS for those alliances has made any statements about quitting the game over it. Most, in fact, feel that the issue has been blown way out of proportion. The few offended by it feel that while CCP took their sweet time they did eventually deal with it in an adequate manner.
Bottom line: CCP has been very good to the players of EVE over the years. We have no reason to distrust them the way you folks seem to. They have stated that they have put processes, applications and teams in place to prevent future occurances. I'm satisfied with that now that they took the BPO's out of circulation.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
So in other word you accept that CCP lets BoB off the hook, not punishing BoB for the income they have/might have had for the past 6 months on these bpo's ? you accept that CCP lets SirMolle off the hook for a bannable offence ? while enforcing this ruthless on others.. (thinking of naming this Hacker).
This is just a few points that CCP refuse to deal with ...
I've said it once, I'll say it again.
I don't think that there will be any noticeable drop in online numbers. Where I do see potential loss is in new players to the game. But this could be balanced out with an excellent marketing campaign, for example...
Usually you get 1000 players/month with $5000 in marketing.
Because of the scandal you will only get 250 players this month.
CCP puts $20000 into marketing.
This month CCP still gets 1000 new players.
Everything looks like no loss to growth.
The point is that it will be very very difficult for CCP to tell if the scandal effects them. And by extension without details it will be impossible for the rest of us to know.
At the end of the day the hit CCP takes is a reputation one - they have a tarnished image. It will be a hard one to shake. I can't imagine how difficult it will be for T20 in particular to go to any events, post, or participate in the community. It's to bad too. He was a good guy who made a serious mistake. Too bad CCP handled it so piss poorly.
Exactly what did "BoB" do wrong? 1 member of 1 corporation gave a friend in his corporation some BPO's before "quitting" the game. For all we know his friend had no idea the BPO's were obtained in any way beyond the norm.
So you're saying an entire alliance of approximately 2000 players should be 'punished' because ONE GM couldn't control his impulses? I could give a rats ass what SirMolle did. Frankly I could care less what happens to SirMolle or Kugutsman they are minor blips on a very big radar in my EVE world. If you choose to obsess over this incident go for it. Personally I have a lot more important things to worry about in my life than what two egomaniacs do on a game I play in my spare time for recreation and relaxation. Frankly I'm tired of the witch hunts on these forums. Bottom line: I am thankful that the issue got taken care of. As to Kugutsman vs. SirMolle? I'm not CCP, it's NOT my game... It's not My headache and it's not my problem. Last time I checked CCP owned the servers we play on, owns the game we play and owns the bandwidth we use to play it. What you or I *want* to happen is irellevant. It's a privately owned company, how they chose to deal with their employees is entirely up to them (in reference to your huge moan fest about T20 not getting fired). Frankly it's not your decision to make. Nor is it mine. If it were me? I'd have fired him. If it were me? I'd have banned SirMolle too.
But am I going to quit a game I enjoy because some asshat chooses to post drivel about the devs on an almost weekly basis? No. Am I going to quit because the Devs chose to ban a hacker and not ban the guy who posted factual information about the hacker when the hacker was outright lying about certain people? No. Frankly I could care less.
But go on with your witch hunt. I'm sure it'll be much more fruitful and catch just as many witches as the Salem Trials did.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
I was agreeing with you right up to the point where you used the "it's not our game it's there game they can do what they want" argument.
At the end of the day it's true. I pay them to access their game. All I ask in return is that they provide me with the service I percieve to be getting. So, if CCP wants to start a corporation in game and use cheat codes and god modes am I entitled to stop them? Nope. But I would hope that I would know that going into it. Because in that case I wouldn't pay for the service.
As for witch hunting. I don't think anyone here has the resources to be on the witch hunt. We are more like the stable boys of the people that have gone on the witch hunt, sitting around, talking about the witch hunt that other people are on. And why not talk about it? Hell, they still talk about the Salem trials to this day!
I said CCP have refused and state that they don't know how much BoB have benefitted from having illegally obtained tech 2 bpo's in their alliance, they don't even estimate.... they say they won't deal with that, only to remove the bpo's 6 months AFTER the incident and only AFTER it became clear on the forums.
Do you think they would remove the bpo's if it had not been revealed by the hacker ? and nobody but the invovled people knew ?
Anyone benefiting from a exploit gets their isk removed ... that is normal procedure by CCP, there are always people who have been set back like 1 billion isk and so on.. just search the forums and you see others have been punished by CCP because they used a exploit.
Using illegally obtained bpo's is a exploit... any value they have gained from this should be removed... if they can't figure the exact numbers they need to estimate, anything else will be seen as favorite one part in the game... and is unacceptable.
The same goes for SirMolle situation...
About T20 if you have seen what I have written about it you will find out I have NEVER asked for his head, or that he needs to be fired... infact I have stated that CCP say they have punished him once already and that he can't be punished twice for the same crime.
Facts is that CCP only confessed to things they could not hide or cover-up ... in the end ... that does not really get CCP into any good light here... that only imply that CCP might have more stuff they don't want to confess about that could be very damaging for the game.
In the end... I never have had much dealings with BoB apart from that they almost blew up a freighter I had... that costed me 60 million isk to repair... should I get a refund under the assumption that those weapons they used might come from illegally obtained bpo's ??? Facts is that I give a shit about that... what I don't give a shit about is how CCP did handle this and clearly showed favorism about BoB ... where they have NOT punished BoB or members of BoB for breach of EULA that they have banned and punished others for.
And as a result I have canceled both my accounts and they will stay closed to CCP do the right thing here.
Prove it or admit you're pulling numbers out of thin air. Where are you getting "in excess of 2000 players have cancelled" from?
I don't buy it. Makhai alliance is over 300 members... not a single person quit over this. Hydra alliance is over 700 members... again... not a single person left over this.
So out of 1000 players ZERO have left EVE over it, that's a *fact*. I'm not saying NOBODY has left the game... but I'm not buying that 2,000+ have left either. Even if that site is accurate, which I don't think it is,... 2,000 out of 170,000 is peanuts.
That's 1k people you're saying didn't quit because of the scandal. Did you personally ask each one of them?
I didn't think so.
http://www.TheGamersAssociation.com
please stop the moaning
EvE remains an outstanding game
if you want to go off to some where else ... bye
I'm certain what the esteemed Zarniewoop meant was, if you want to go off to somewhere else... bye. But please, since this is a forum to discuss a game, on a site that reviews games, which by its very nature is the most appropriate place to talk about what you like and don't like about a game - do post here. Tell people what you think. Allow others to hear your opinion. Don't ram it down their throats, and ignore people that try to ram it down yours.
I'm certain that's what he meant. Afterall - if these boards contained nothing but post after fanboi post of "yeah, it's great" where would the need to have these boards about Eve be?
And in the spirit of the esteemed Zarniewoop I will insert a smilie to emphasize my point, because that is a clever and pointed thing to do:
I agree that Eve is very good game.
I played Eve for 1-2 month this past summer,but I didn't have the time to commit to learn and participate with my corporation.So i canceled the subscription.However,now i have more time to be active and contribute,so I restarted my subscription this past month
I think the main problem Eve faces is the high learning curve
But honestly it wasn't due to the Dev/GM fiasco - it was due to a game that is unraveling. See I think that CCP, even though they try, lack the creative and programming skills to take the game where they want it to go.
They are trying with the aqusition of White Wolf, at least in the content area to provide some injections of fresh story content. But in the end thats going to all get focused on WoD.
I don't think they posses the programming talent to fix the code problems in the game. You can see that by all of the bugs, flaws and exploits in the game. I think they want to fix them (sometimes) I just don''t think they have the skills to do it.
Because of all that they are sacrificing players that they know can't and won't be satisfied with what they do have the talent to deliver. So if your deal is PVE, industry (mostly), research your going to be increasingly pushed out of the game.
I don't think people are quitting Eve Online at all. The numbers logged in every evening/weekend are ~28,000.
All this trolling is BANDWAGON!
Come on! - People quitting the game over some blueprint?! Get real! Get a life!
People in real life cheat about much worse things than that! Doesn't mean to say YOU give up!!
And if a silly developer cheats again - CCP might fire them - BUT if this ever happens, don't expect to hear about it - it would all be too personal for the person fired.
I still believe CCP is going to continue to marginilze it's PVE and industrial players because they just don't understand that market well enough to continue to support it the way that player would like. They are taking the best approach they can ... keep downplaying PVE game style until they are weeded out, and hope you get a big enough influx of PVP players to offset the loss.
The problem with that idea is that so much PVP is dependant on PVE ISK flows to support it. How do you get rid of it and still have enough cash flow to support the other? I would worry this would eventually start shutting off small gang PVP because most smaller corps don't have as deep pockets to keep it up forever. That leaves only the Alliance's left to support it. And with the Blob, who needs to fight anyway .. just lag each other into submission without firing a shot.
On a personal note, Jack you must be concerned about CCP's future. You've spent a lot of time going from thread to thread in defence of them.
4 people have stopped playing EVE in my corporation. 3 have moved out of 0.0 space into empire for a more casual game (including me) because at the moment 0.0 alliance game is quite broken and unbalanced. They and several other corporation mates have cancelled extra accounts (BPO lottery (-->going away) toons, POS/industry toons, cyno network toons) .... approx. 20 positions cancelled or in hibernation. Thats about 10 % of my corp. Thats some 300 EUROs less for CCP.
You wont see much of that in the "People online" number, as most of these accounts are secondary and tertiary accounts. That does not mean CCP wont see the effect in their wallet, especially once the multiple-month advance payment accounts are not being renewed.
Have fun
Erillion
Hello CaptRedHand
Firstly, you put your point very well. I was actually tired when I wrote what I did above; it comes across as a rant! However, I hope Eve Online continues to improve, simply because I wish CCP all the best.
I don't think the issues you mention will kill Eve. This is because your issues are relative detail that either people might not be affected by, or detail that is sceduled to be improved apon this summer. However, I can see how they would turn current players away in the long-term. In my opinion, it will be outside competition that is the biggest risk. For example, Pirates of the Burning Sea could take away the fan base over night if it's good enough (but this is my personal opinion).
On the other hand, Eve Online is science fiction so it has a greater potential to adapt. As it's science fiction, teamtalk does not seem unnatural. In addition, Eve should soon have it's own teamtalk system, further improving a community feel. In contrast, PotBS is confined by history.
This summer, PvE should improve because level 4 missions are changing, level 6 will be introduced, and level 7 missions may be introduced.
I wonder if you are a little inpatient for change - it takes a long time to design new gaming aspects (years rather than months).
Ultimately, I wish CCP and Eve all the best because it's so easy to be negative, but only positive attitudes produce good results. Destroying is easier than creating. For example, you've got to have a dream to make a dream come true. In life, there are plenty of people who will critisise your aims, but I think fate favours those who are encouraged to their goals.
LARGE TEXT MAKES ME RIGHT!
CCP is one of the worst development companies to grace the MMORPG world. They can't fix most of the problems with their game (Bugs from early alpha still exist), they don't listen to the majority of players (The ones in empire), they lie ("No dev cheated!"), they call "bugs" unannounced "features" (No password POS shield bug), they blame the players for the current state of the game (Blobbing and node crashes), they play favorites (BoB), they are some of the slowest content developers (Six months for new content, if we are lucky), they don't enforce the rules fairly (Kug banned, Sirmolle doesn't get banned for the same offense), and they don't know how to program (Didn't document code).
These guys are right down there with SOE, but atleast EQ2 is fun!