You know around where we live - we have this shop that sells nothing but cat related items. I kid you not...a spatula city of a different light. After I had finished laughing when I heard about it, I began to see what the web had to say about it. I was utterly amazed at the near fanatacism of its customer base. The amount of money and time they spent there was staggering. I mean who in the holy H-E-double hockey sticks buys cloths for a cat and tries to dress them?
Yet, people do. Their cats are their cause. Their money and time - theirs to spend. Their reasoning - entirely their own and even though I can't comprehend trying to get a cat in a tuxedo... I cannot deride them for the happiness they derive from all of it.
Same for SWG, I played my hand at mmos - EQ, AO, COH, WoW and the like. All of which I logged in and out of and treated it like a game...a hobby if you will.
As a ranger though, it wasn't a game. It was a way of life. My alternate identity and lifestyle after 9 PM EST. I had friends all send me messages the minute I logged on and when I logged off - I felt like I not only had accomplished something but I also belonged somewhere outside of my normal routine.
SWG made me happy, My character was an extension of myself. I had screenshots of moments that I cheerished and stories to tell at camp that kept an audience hanging onto every word.
The loss I felt when I could never go back is like the loss of your first true love. You move on but even your friends know that you never forgot. I would be lead to believe that people posting to this area of the site are like myself. Those who feel like that extension of themselves was murdered. They weren't given a choice. They fought like myself in the forums and through every means possible - they fought and were ignored.
Nope, if what I just said sounds like putting a cat in a tux - I really don't think I can explain it any better. Laugh and move on. Leave us to our bitter retribution. Its our way of keeping true the memories that we lost and its our cause to prevent history from being repeated. Despite all the bytes seemingly wasted in threads all over the web - I assure you our pain and efforts have held some beasts at bay that would have otherwise been let loose on the mmo community.
I'd just like to add in the obligatory "who cares?" to this typical thread. We get it. You hate SOE. You made a big blog about it. You're the people's champion (tho 99% of said people think you're a giant tool). Keep pumping in these useless waste of space posts! (much like mine).
Yup, if you don't care, feel free to move along.
Couldnt agree more and i hate tossing my hat into these posts, but i really just want to know when it'll stop. It's not so much an issue that i dont care. It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG.
What business is it of yours? Why does what other people say on an internet forum bother you so much you need to post your erzatz psychoanalyisis of them? Why do you need to resort to namecalling over it?
If you hate tossing your hat in, who DO you?
Your behavior makes far less sense than the other people here.
Because it clutters up the forums and prevents me from finding useful information that i may be trying to obtain? Point is: the whole song and dance you all are putting on is old and tired. As i said, i understand your frustration, but at this point it's literally just a drawn out diatrabe so that when the invenitable happens you guys can jump and and say "WE TOLD YOU SO!"
It would be one thing if it were different people coming here and posting their displeasure, but it isnt. It's the same 10 cronies posting over and over and over and over and over about each and every little thing that they find as a fault with a game they stopped playing years ago and about a company they hate. Take this thread for example. A dev wanted to keep a thread on topic and since the OP didnt like that answer, he comes here and posts yet another rant about how bad SWG has become and how little SOE cares about babies and puppies.
You are more than welcome to question my motives (which i question myself), but everything i've witnessed thus far borders on obsession... over a dead game.
i cant fault you for feeling like that. SWG gave me much of the same feeling for my length of subscription. But it is what it is. We all know SOE/LA screwed the pooch on SWG and all we can do is await some brave company to come along and attempt to ressurect the ideal of Star Wars in an MMO universe.
That being said, tho, i dont see the service that you are providing here. I agree that making an opinion heard is valuable. I disagree in trying to pick apart every little thing a dev says for the sake of supporting your argument. Once again, i throw this post in the example ring. The complaint registered here is a stretch at best to support your opinion, yet here we have a 3 page thread dominating the what could be useful SWG forums.
There's a saying "choose your battles". This was one that didnt need to be fought and does not lend to your cause. To be honest, it does nothing but hurt your image (no offense). just look at the reaction you're getting from me. As i said, i'm usually just browsing these forums looking for any new info on SWG and its progress, but this post raised my ire simply because of it's level of ridiculousness. Most of the time i dont care and will just pass these posts, but it's just becoming burdensome listening to you guys. I promise i'm not the only one who shares this opinion. If you want to be taken seriously, choose your battles.
Originally posted by Sam123jo0123 Originally posted by Fishermage
Originally posted by Phyluxia
Originally posted by Fishermage
Originally posted by Phyluxia I'd just like to add in the obligatory "who cares?" to this typical thread. We get it. You hate SOE. You made a big blog about it. You're the people's champion (tho 99% of said people think you're a giant tool). Keep pumping in these useless waste of space posts! (much like mine).
Yup, if you don't care, feel free to move along.
Couldnt agree more and i hate tossing my hat into these posts, but i really just want to know when it'll stop. It's not so much an issue that i dont care. It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG. What business is it of yours? Why does what other people say on an internet forum bother you so much you need to post your erzatz psychoanalyisis of them? Why do you need to resort to namecalling over it?
If you hate tossing your hat in, who DO you? Your behavior makes far less sense than the other people here.
Why does it matter to you if someone feels you should get over it?
Phyluxia, i completely agree with you, it's been more than 2 years to the day, many have moved on, many have accepted it, it is only a game and i don't understand why people got so attached.
because I am curious about all human emotions, interactions, and pathologies. All people matter to me. I understand why people here post -- they feel they've lost the greatest game they ever had, and feel SOE was unethical. They have a REASON to be here. The people posting "get over it" don't. Unless they are simply cruel people who like being mean.
If that poster REALLY felt people should get over it, he would try and help them get over it, not tell them people feel they are "tools" which is a bizarre use of the word anyway. I find the sincerity of you "get over it" guys highly susppect. I see no compassion here, only mean spiritedness in your posts.
If you don't understand why people were/are so attached to SWG you never will, but why do YOU need to post here? You have lost nothing, you evidently have no horse in this race. Are you simply trolling to anger others? Do you enjoy watching people who are unhappy about something? Why post at all? You don't care, so you shouldn't post.
It doesn't bother me that you DO post, I just would like to know what YOU get out of it. It doesn't matter to me in the least that someone feels taht people here should get over it, but I am curious as to WHY they bother posting it. feeling it is one thing, posting about it, complete with namecalling, is another.
Phyluxia, i completely agree with you, it's been more than 2 years to the day, many have moved on, many have accepted it, it is only a game and i don't understand why people got so attached.
"Moving on..."
It has been three years now and the debates continue to this day. No postings of "move on" will ease the burn of the customers.
"It is only a game..."
Star Wars is the largest Sci-Fi IP in the world, the Real World. It is an IP that people are passionate about and want it to be more than "just a game." Virtual Worlds, MMO's, Persistent Worlds, are not the same as simple games, there can be more to it.
The negative comments towards SWG and SOE/LAE will continue until a new Star Wars MMO is released and under new management. Then and only then, will the Star Wars fan base have moved on.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
Originally posted by Phyluxia Originally posted by Fishermage
Originally posted by Phyluxia
Originally posted by Fishermage
Originally posted by Phyluxia I'd just like to add in the obligatory "who cares?" to this typical thread. We get it. You hate SOE. You made a big blog about it. You're the people's champion (tho 99% of said people think you're a giant tool). Keep pumping in these useless waste of space posts! (much like mine).
Yup, if you don't care, feel free to move along.
Couldnt agree more and i hate tossing my hat into these posts, but i really just want to know when it'll stop. It's not so much an issue that i dont care. It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG. What business is it of yours? Why does what other people say on an internet forum bother you so much you need to post your erzatz psychoanalyisis of them? Why do you need to resort to namecalling over it?
If you hate tossing your hat in, who DO you? Your behavior makes far less sense than the other people here.
Because it clutters up the forums and prevents me from finding useful information that i may be trying to obtain? Point is: the whole song and dance you all are putting on is old and tired. As i said, i understand your frustration, but at this point it's literally just a drawn out diatrabe so that when the invenitable happens you guys can jump and and say "WE TOLD YOU SO!" It would be one thing if it were different people coming here and posting their displeasure, but it isnt. It's the same 10 cronies posting over and over and over and over and over about each and every little thing that they find as a fault with a game they stopped playing years ago and about a company they hate. Take this thread for example. A dev wanted to keep a thread on topic and since the OP didnt like that answer, he comes here and posts yet another rant about how bad SWG has become and how little SOE cares about babies and puppies. You are more than welcome to question my motives (which i question myself), but everything i've witnessed thus far borders on obsession... over a dead game.
I certainly will question your motives. Why do you care that it clutters up its own forum? Don't you have other, less cluttered forums you can play on? This forum was created for the discussion going on. How does your contribution add to the discussion? Aren't you the one actually cluttering things up by coming here and shamelessly attacking those you feel are mentally ill? How is that compassionate?
Your motives are HIGHLY questionable.
Now, you call the people who post here cronies. Of whom? Tools? of whom? I suggest you check your definitions here. Who are we working for? Who are we cronies of? Blizzard? Do you think this is some sercet campaign by another MMO company, and we serve them?
It seems FAR more likely that the people who come here and post "get over it" are cronies and tools of SOE than the other way around, after all, they obviously don't enjoy seeing one of their products attacked.
Again, I say this all because I can understand why the disngruntled vets post on a forum that was created for such a purpose. What I can't understand is why someone with no horse in the race would come here and launch unsolicited personal attacks on them.
Forums are bad sometimes, before the NGE my post count on the SWG forums was at 90 but after the NGE I reached 1200+ before I quit. Obraik has like 6K+ on here and almost 8K on SWG forums, that's ALOT for someone that likes the game too much, when I liked the game I barely posted on the forums unless it was something I was selling/trading/buying.
Please take your tinfoil hat off. Everyone who speaks out against you does not work for SOE.
As i said, for my own personal reasons, i still keep tabs on information about this game. Yet it seems most 3rd party informational sources have been bogged down by these kinds of posts, rendering them useless to the common person. You say you care about all people... how bout the people who dont agree with you who are simply here for information and dont want to see 90% of the posts created by the same 10 people ranting about topics that are flimsy attempts (at best) to support their argument.
My point is simple, and stated above: You've gone from voicing an opinion to knitpicking and making arguments based on EXTREMELY shaky "evidence". This post especially is extremely pety. My original posts were a bit overboard and i apologize for that, but seriously guys.
And for the record: I dont play any SOE games, work for them, etc etc. This is just one man's opinion about the argument you guys are presenting.
Originally posted by Phyluxia Please take your tinfoil hat off. Everyone who speaks out against you does not work for SOE. As i said, for my own personal reasons, i still keep tabs on information about this game. Yet it seems most 3rd party informational sources have been bogged down by these kinds of posts, rendering them useless to the common person. You say you care about all people... how bout the people who dont agree with you who are simply here for information and dont want to see 90% of the posts created by the same 10 people ranting about topics that are flimsy attempts (at best) to support their argument. My point is simple, and stated above: You've gone from voicing an opinion to knitpicking and making arguments based on EXTREMELY shaky "evidence". This post especially is extremely pety. My original posts were a bit overboard and i apologize for that, but seriously guys. And for the record: I dont play any SOE games, work for them, etc etc. This is just one man's opinion about the argument you guys are presenting.
Please take your own tinfoil hat off. I only said it was far more likely that YOU are a tool than any of us are. YOu were the one who accused people of being tools and cronies. I responded with a much more plausable scenario. I don't think you work for anyone; which makes your posting here even weirder.
I pick my battles and I posted here not due to the topic of the thread but rather to your earlier post which read: "It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG."
You asked in the SWG Veterans Forum and I answered you as a Vet.
As for this post - I agree with the issue. The solution to the low pop problem will not come from tools that allow you to search a server with a low pop. Its like saying having a isle directory to your local mom and pop grocery store will help you find the lobsters that they don't carry.
Please take your tinfoil hat off. Everyone who speaks out against you does not work for SOE.
As i said, for my own personal reasons, i still keep tabs on information about this game. Yet it seems most 3rd party informational sources have been bogged down by these kinds of posts, rendering them useless to the common person. You say you care about all people... how bout the people who dont agree with you who are simply here for information and dont want to see 90% of the posts created by the same 10 people ranting about topics that are flimsy attempts (at best) to support their argument.
My point is simple, and stated above: You've gone from voicing an opinion to knitpicking and making arguments based on EXTREMELY shaky "evidence". This post especially is extremely pety. My original posts were a bit overboard and i apologize for that, but seriously guys.
And for the record: I dont play any SOE games, work for them, etc etc. This is just one man's opinion about the argument you guys are presenting.
Please take your own tinfoil hat off. I only said it was far more likely that YOU are a tool than any of us are. YOu were the one who accused people of being tools and cronies. I responded with a much more plausable scenario. I don't think you work for anyone; which makes your posting here even weirder.
And i'll reiterate again, i was a bit harsh in my original post and apologize for the name calling. Lets get past that. You seem to be more worried about my presence than debating the substance of my argument in the past few posts. Lets get past the name calling (both of us) and we can talk if you wish.
Originally posted by Phyluxia Originally posted by Fishermage
Originally posted by Phyluxia Please take your tinfoil hat off. Everyone who speaks out against you does not work for SOE. As i said, for my own personal reasons, i still keep tabs on information about this game. Yet it seems most 3rd party informational sources have been bogged down by these kinds of posts, rendering them useless to the common person. You say you care about all people... how bout the people who dont agree with you who are simply here for information and dont want to see 90% of the posts created by the same 10 people ranting about topics that are flimsy attempts (at best) to support their argument. My point is simple, and stated above: You've gone from voicing an opinion to knitpicking and making arguments based on EXTREMELY shaky "evidence". This post especially is extremely pety. My original posts were a bit overboard and i apologize for that, but seriously guys. And for the record: I dont play any SOE games, work for them, etc etc. This is just one man's opinion about the argument you guys are presenting.
Please take your own tinfoil hat off. I only said it was far more likely that YOU are a tool than any of us are. YOu were the one who accused people of being tools and cronies. I responded with a much more plausable scenario. I don't think you work for anyone; which makes your posting here even weirder.
And i'll reiterate again, i was a bit harsh in my original post and apologize for the name calling. Lets get past that. You seem to be more worried about my presence than debating the substance of my argument in the past few posts. Lets get past the name calling (both of us) and we can talk if you wish.
You told me to take off a tinfoil hat, THEN apologized for namecalling in the beginning. I responded to your "tinfoil hat" comment in your "apology."
Now, what argument, pray tell, are you making? What have we to discuss? I never commented on anything you have to say, and as such I don't think we really have anything of substance to discuss. All I WAS doing was questioning why you need to come here, psycholanalyze people, call them names, and then when called upon it, you tell them to take off the tinfoil hat. If you DO have anything of substance to say, please do.
I would be most interested. Perhaps then I might be illuminated as to why you are posting here in the first place.
kefkah seems to have caught on. Might follow his lead instead of picking apart the nuances of my posts.
*breadcrumb* i'm arguing that your no longer voicing an opinion and are simply quoting anythng and everything from the SWG forums that you can warp to enhance your argument... thus weakinging it by the petiness of the logical connection. However, kefkah did make a good point. I'll respond to that in a bit and give you time to ponder.
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY?
Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
Originally posted by Phyluxia kefkah seems to have caught on. Might follow his lead instead of picking apart the nuances of my posts. *breadcrumb* i'm arguing that your no longer voicing an opinion and are simply quoting anythng and everything from the SWG forums that you can warp to enhance your argument... thus weakinging it by the petiness of the logical connection. However, kefkah did make a good point. I'll respond to that in a bit and give you time to ponder.
I'm not arguing anything; I STILL haven't commented on the OP, merely questioned as to why you care. What difference does it make to you how well people here make their arguments? If none of it matters to you, why come here and troll?
Bad arguments don't weaken good arguments. If someone here presents a weak case, it is just that, separate from itself, a weak case. No harm no foul, not important. This is why I didn't post in this one, since I dodn't find much I agreed with here, and it wasn't very important to me.
It wasn't until YOU came in with your namecalling and your psychoanalysis -- then I questioned you WHY do YOU bother?
Why do you care if someone here presents a weak argument or a strong one on this issue? If YOU have gotten over it, why troll here at all? I'm still curious.
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY? Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
Plus, I feel we are doing SOE, LEC, and the industry a favor by providing a more honest post mortem of what they did than they will provide for themselves. They still are deluded enough to thinking the main problem was a communication problem, not an ethical one.
If we love MMOs it is incumbent upon us to tell the truth so it won't happen again, and their myths will not cintrinue without being corrected.
Plus this thing brought us all together, and to me, that's pretty cool.
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY? Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
Very well said, I couldn't agree more......
And that is why I refuse to own any SOE games and even why I refuse to buy a Playstation3 and that is really sad.
Until SOE is completely changed, bugs fixed, customer service on an actual service level, Smedely is fired, a complete overhaul of the current band of designers and corporate fanboi's, and a year of praises on the forums of customers telling us how wonderful SOE is, will I then CONSIDER returning to SOE games and purchasing Sony products.
And that is why I refuse to own any SOE games and even why I refuse to buy a Playstation3 and that is really sad. Until SOE is completely changed, bugs fixed, customer service on an actual service level, Smedely is fired, a complete overhaul of the current band of designers and corporate fanboi's, and a year of praises on the forums of customers telling us how wonderful SOE is, will I then CONSIDER returning to SOE games and purchasing Sony products.
I'm glad to see that you get it. It's not a game thing, its a company thing. Matter of fact, for me...if SWG had been the only bad thing they had done I'd have forgiven them for it. Its not....not even close. They treat EQ, EQ2, Vanguard, and even planetside players very poorly. Its all of their games, and all of their players. They really did a number on EQOA too....did you know that out of all the classes in that game only 3 were really usable in raids? A small handful of healers, one guy to port, a tank, and ranged dps. Until the CM's came...that really only left Necros for DPS. A warrior, some priests, and a caster. No rogues, no shadowknights, no bards, no magicians, no rangers....this list goes on. All the bosses had damage shields and AoE's that killed everything near em.
If I wanted, I could drag up a few thousand issues between their games to show you all. All in all, they just don't care. They make a game, and leave it to rot while soaking up all the money they can on it. Anyone or anything that says different is removed.
I kind of baffles me to why they came up with this grouping system, sure it could work on big servers but smaller servers has a tight knit community- most guilds will only take along their own guildmates or coallition guildies when doing instances and such, I found this out on other games with small servers (City of Heroes, Liberty server for eg), it's very difficult to get involved with people unless you're in a guild they know of and this isn't very healthy for new players.
I know for a fact they'll go ahead with this anyways on the next chapter, and I doubt it'll change much or get used much, this grouping system already exists in WoW and it gets little to no use.
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY? Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
Well said regarding why I continue to post about SOE and SWG.
One thing I'd say though is that some of my friends, very few but some, still play SWG because frankly it's the only StarWars game in town, and they met some really excellent people that also love StarWars.
I'll be happy when a new StarWars MMO comes along. That way they'll be able to have adventures in a galaxy far, far away with their buddies AND get treated with the respect they deserve.
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY? Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
SOE is a complete and utter FAILURE and a JOKE amongst MMO publishers.
F- your customers is a piss poor attitude for success when your customers have the option of firing you every month.
Please take your tinfoil hat off. Everyone who speaks out against you does not work for SOE. As i said, for my own personal reasons, i still keep tabs on information about this game. Yet it seems most 3rd party informational sources have been bogged down by these kinds of posts, rendering them useless to the common person. You say you care about all people... how bout the people who dont agree with you who are simply here for information and dont want to see 90% of the posts created by the same 10 people ranting about topics that are flimsy attempts (at best) to support their argument. My point is simple, and stated above: You've gone from voicing an opinion to knitpicking and making arguments based on EXTREMELY shaky "evidence". This post especially is extremely pety. My original posts were a bit overboard and i apologize for that, but seriously guys. And for the record: I dont play any SOE games, work for them, etc etc. This is just one man's opinion about the argument you guys are presenting.
Telling other people what should or shouldn't be important to them is a good way to start a conflict imo. Let's take the issue of server mergers for example. Here's why this isn't petty to many. SOE invited veteran players out to a face to face meeting, heard their concerns, and Mr. Smedley himself promised to fast track server mergers that day, in person, to address the population concerns.
Mr. Smedley and his company have a credibility gap. The fact that they STILL haven't addressed the population issues, and that he STILL hasn't followed through on what he told people in person he would do is a present and ongoing concern about the credibility of Smedley and SOE. It's a big deal to people, and it's the latest in a pattern of telling people what they want to hear and then doing the opposite, if anything.
AFTER promising people that he was going to fast track server mergers at these face to face meetings, allegedly to rebuild trust, the new SOE party line is that there will be no server mergers, and that grouping tools etc. will be implemented instead.
Now that you're aware of the history regarding this issue, maybe you won't be so quick to dismiss it as petty.
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY? Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
Phyluxia get your butt of the forum. If you dont like it don't read it. MMORPG.com made the Veterens Refuge so we could air these grievences. If u have a problem with that then please do not come into this particular forum and don't look at any of the threads.
SWG is like meeting the hottest chick of all time and then have her give you every STD in the book and then she dresses a monkey up like a baby sues for child support and the judge says yes
Comments
You know around where we live - we have this shop that sells nothing but cat related items. I kid you not...a spatula city of a different light. After I had finished laughing when I heard about it, I began to see what the web had to say about it. I was utterly amazed at the near fanatacism of its customer base. The amount of money and time they spent there was staggering. I mean who in the holy H-E-double hockey sticks buys cloths for a cat and tries to dress them?
Yet, people do. Their cats are their cause. Their money and time - theirs to spend. Their reasoning - entirely their own and even though I can't comprehend trying to get a cat in a tuxedo... I cannot deride them for the happiness they derive from all of it.
Same for SWG, I played my hand at mmos - EQ, AO, COH, WoW and the like. All of which I logged in and out of and treated it like a game...a hobby if you will.
As a ranger though, it wasn't a game. It was a way of life. My alternate identity and lifestyle after 9 PM EST. I had friends all send me messages the minute I logged on and when I logged off - I felt like I not only had accomplished something but I also belonged somewhere outside of my normal routine.
SWG made me happy, My character was an extension of myself. I had screenshots of moments that I cheerished and stories to tell at camp that kept an audience hanging onto every word.
The loss I felt when I could never go back is like the loss of your first true love. You move on but even your friends know that you never forgot. I would be lead to believe that people posting to this area of the site are like myself. Those who feel like that extension of themselves was murdered. They weren't given a choice. They fought like myself in the forums and through every means possible - they fought and were ignored.
Nope, if what I just said sounds like putting a cat in a tux - I really don't think I can explain it any better. Laugh and move on. Leave us to our bitter retribution. Its our way of keeping true the memories that we lost and its our cause to prevent history from being repeated. Despite all the bytes seemingly wasted in threads all over the web - I assure you our pain and efforts have held some beasts at bay that would have otherwise been let loose on the mmo community.
Couldnt agree more and i hate tossing my hat into these posts, but i really just want to know when it'll stop. It's not so much an issue that i dont care. It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG.
What business is it of yours? Why does what other people say on an internet forum bother you so much you need to post your erzatz psychoanalyisis of them? Why do you need to resort to namecalling over it?
If you hate tossing your hat in, who DO you?
Your behavior makes far less sense than the other people here.
Because it clutters up the forums and prevents me from finding useful information that i may be trying to obtain? Point is: the whole song and dance you all are putting on is old and tired. As i said, i understand your frustration, but at this point it's literally just a drawn out diatrabe so that when the invenitable happens you guys can jump and and say "WE TOLD YOU SO!"
It would be one thing if it were different people coming here and posting their displeasure, but it isnt. It's the same 10 cronies posting over and over and over and over and over about each and every little thing that they find as a fault with a game they stopped playing years ago and about a company they hate. Take this thread for example. A dev wanted to keep a thread on topic and since the OP didnt like that answer, he comes here and posts yet another rant about how bad SWG has become and how little SOE cares about babies and puppies.
You are more than welcome to question my motives (which i question myself), but everything i've witnessed thus far borders on obsession... over a dead game.
i cant fault you for feeling like that. SWG gave me much of the same feeling for my length of subscription. But it is what it is. We all know SOE/LA screwed the pooch on SWG and all we can do is await some brave company to come along and attempt to ressurect the ideal of Star Wars in an MMO universe.
That being said, tho, i dont see the service that you are providing here. I agree that making an opinion heard is valuable. I disagree in trying to pick apart every little thing a dev says for the sake of supporting your argument. Once again, i throw this post in the example ring. The complaint registered here is a stretch at best to support your opinion, yet here we have a 3 page thread dominating the what could be useful SWG forums.
There's a saying "choose your battles". This was one that didnt need to be fought and does not lend to your cause. To be honest, it does nothing but hurt your image (no offense). just look at the reaction you're getting from me. As i said, i'm usually just browsing these forums looking for any new info on SWG and its progress, but this post raised my ire simply because of it's level of ridiculousness. Most of the time i dont care and will just pass these posts, but it's just becoming burdensome listening to you guys. I promise i'm not the only one who shares this opinion. If you want to be taken seriously, choose your battles.
Couldnt agree more and i hate tossing my hat into these posts, but i really just want to know when it'll stop. It's not so much an issue that i dont care. It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG.
What business is it of yours? Why does what other people say on an internet forum bother you so much you need to post your erzatz psychoanalyisis of them? Why do you need to resort to namecalling over it?
If you hate tossing your hat in, who DO you?
Your behavior makes far less sense than the other people here.
Why does it matter to you if someone feels you should get over it?
Phyluxia, i completely agree with you, it's been more than 2 years to the day, many have moved on, many have accepted it, it is only a game and i don't understand why people got so attached.
because I am curious about all human emotions, interactions, and pathologies. All people matter to me. I understand why people here post -- they feel they've lost the greatest game they ever had, and feel SOE was unethical. They have a REASON to be here. The people posting "get over it" don't. Unless they are simply cruel people who like being mean.
If that poster REALLY felt people should get over it, he would try and help them get over it, not tell them people feel they are "tools" which is a bizarre use of the word anyway. I find the sincerity of you "get over it" guys highly susppect. I see no compassion here, only mean spiritedness in your posts.
If you don't understand why people were/are so attached to SWG you never will, but why do YOU need to post here? You have lost nothing, you evidently have no horse in this race. Are you simply trolling to anger others? Do you enjoy watching people who are unhappy about something? Why post at all? You don't care, so you shouldn't post.
It doesn't bother me that you DO post, I just would like to know what YOU get out of it. It doesn't matter to me in the least that someone feels taht people here should get over it, but I am curious as to WHY they bother posting it. feeling it is one thing, posting about it, complete with namecalling, is another.
fishermage.blogspot.com
It has been three years now and the debates continue to this day. No postings of "move on" will ease the burn of the customers.
"It is only a game..."
Star Wars is the largest Sci-Fi IP in the world, the Real World. It is an IP that people are passionate about and want it to be more than "just a game." Virtual Worlds, MMO's, Persistent Worlds, are not the same as simple games, there can be more to it.
The negative comments towards SWG and SOE/LAE will continue until a new Star Wars MMO is released and under new management. Then and only then, will the Star Wars fan base have moved on.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
Couldnt agree more and i hate tossing my hat into these posts, but i really just want to know when it'll stop. It's not so much an issue that i dont care. It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG.
What business is it of yours? Why does what other people say on an internet forum bother you so much you need to post your erzatz psychoanalyisis of them? Why do you need to resort to namecalling over it?
If you hate tossing your hat in, who DO you?
Your behavior makes far less sense than the other people here.
Because it clutters up the forums and prevents me from finding useful information that i may be trying to obtain? Point is: the whole song and dance you all are putting on is old and tired. As i said, i understand your frustration, but at this point it's literally just a drawn out diatrabe so that when the invenitable happens you guys can jump and and say "WE TOLD YOU SO!"
It would be one thing if it were different people coming here and posting their displeasure, but it isnt. It's the same 10 cronies posting over and over and over and over and over about each and every little thing that they find as a fault with a game they stopped playing years ago and about a company they hate. Take this thread for example. A dev wanted to keep a thread on topic and since the OP didnt like that answer, he comes here and posts yet another rant about how bad SWG has become and how little SOE cares about babies and puppies.
You are more than welcome to question my motives (which i question myself), but everything i've witnessed thus far borders on obsession... over a dead game.
I certainly will question your motives. Why do you care that it clutters up its own forum? Don't you have other, less cluttered forums you can play on? This forum was created for the discussion going on. How does your contribution add to the discussion? Aren't you the one actually cluttering things up by coming here and shamelessly attacking those you feel are mentally ill? How is that compassionate?
Your motives are HIGHLY questionable.
Now, you call the people who post here cronies. Of whom? Tools? of whom? I suggest you check your definitions here. Who are we working for? Who are we cronies of? Blizzard? Do you think this is some sercet campaign by another MMO company, and we serve them?
It seems FAR more likely that the people who come here and post "get over it" are cronies and tools of SOE than the other way around, after all, they obviously don't enjoy seeing one of their products attacked.
Again, I say this all because I can understand why the disngruntled vets post on a forum that was created for such a purpose. What I can't understand is why someone with no horse in the race would come here and launch unsolicited personal attacks on them.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Forums are bad sometimes, before the NGE my post count on the SWG forums was at 90 but after the NGE I reached 1200+ before I quit. Obraik has like 6K+ on here and almost 8K on SWG forums, that's ALOT for someone that likes the game too much, when I liked the game I barely posted on the forums unless it was something I was selling/trading/buying.
Please take your tinfoil hat off. Everyone who speaks out against you does not work for SOE.
As i said, for my own personal reasons, i still keep tabs on information about this game. Yet it seems most 3rd party informational sources have been bogged down by these kinds of posts, rendering them useless to the common person. You say you care about all people... how bout the people who dont agree with you who are simply here for information and dont want to see 90% of the posts created by the same 10 people ranting about topics that are flimsy attempts (at best) to support their argument.
My point is simple, and stated above: You've gone from voicing an opinion to knitpicking and making arguments based on EXTREMELY shaky "evidence". This post especially is extremely pety. My original posts were a bit overboard and i apologize for that, but seriously guys.
And for the record: I dont play any SOE games, work for them, etc etc. This is just one man's opinion about the argument you guys are presenting.
Please take your own tinfoil hat off. I only said it was far more likely that YOU are a tool than any of us are. YOu were the one who accused people of being tools and cronies. I responded with a much more plausable scenario. I don't think you work for anyone; which makes your posting here even weirder.
fishermage.blogspot.com
"It's more like why do some people care so much? I understand the situation and what went down, but how long does it take to get over it? Most relationship break-ups dont take this long to get over... and i promise you drop a lot more money in those than you did in SWG."
You asked in the SWG Veterans Forum and I answered you as a Vet.
As for this post - I agree with the issue. The solution to the low pop problem will not come from tools that allow you to search a server with a low pop. Its like saying having a isle directory to your local mom and pop grocery store will help you find the lobsters that they don't carry.
Please take your own tinfoil hat off. I only said it was far more likely that YOU are a tool than any of us are. YOu were the one who accused people of being tools and cronies. I responded with a much more plausable scenario. I don't think you work for anyone; which makes your posting here even weirder.
And i'll reiterate again, i was a bit harsh in my original post and apologize for the name calling. Lets get past that. You seem to be more worried about my presence than debating the substance of my argument in the past few posts. Lets get past the name calling (both of us) and we can talk if you wish.
Please take your own tinfoil hat off. I only said it was far more likely that YOU are a tool than any of us are. YOu were the one who accused people of being tools and cronies. I responded with a much more plausable scenario. I don't think you work for anyone; which makes your posting here even weirder.
And i'll reiterate again, i was a bit harsh in my original post and apologize for the name calling. Lets get past that. You seem to be more worried about my presence than debating the substance of my argument in the past few posts. Lets get past the name calling (both of us) and we can talk if you wish.
You told me to take off a tinfoil hat, THEN apologized for namecalling in the beginning. I responded to your "tinfoil hat" comment in your "apology."
Now, what argument, pray tell, are you making? What have we to discuss? I never commented on anything you have to say, and as such I don't think we really have anything of substance to discuss. All I WAS doing was questioning why you need to come here, psycholanalyze people, call them names, and then when called upon it, you tell them to take off the tinfoil hat. If you DO have anything of substance to say, please do.
I would be most interested. Perhaps then I might be illuminated as to why you are posting here in the first place.
fishermage.blogspot.com
kefkah seems to have caught on. Might follow his lead instead of picking apart the nuances of my posts.
*breadcrumb* i'm arguing that your no longer voicing an opinion and are simply quoting anythng and everything from the SWG forums that you can warp to enhance your argument... thus weakinging it by the petiness of the logical connection. However, kefkah did make a good point. I'll respond to that in a bit and give you time to ponder.
Ha ha....
How funny....the fans still think that this fervor is about the vets love of SWG. I can see that the issues here, and thus...the reason for this kind of hate, are a bit above your heads.
I shall assist you all. Everyone is long "over" the game. They aren't posting here to "save" the game. They do not wish to "play" the game again. This issue, in fact, has nothing to do with the "game". Now that you have that stupid ideal out of your heads, lets get to the really simple reason for all of this.
SOE is a company. Not a "Mom and Pop" store company either. They make lots of things that reach to lots of people in lots of markets. They will make new things in the future. If their business practices are poor, and their treatment of customers is historically and consistently poor, then it needs to be known as such. Not just once...not twice...but all the time. Some people have never dealt with them before, some forget over time if they haven't received as terrible treatment as SWG fans have. It is vital to keep that information alive so that everyone who may be considering SOE products can know, in advance, about the quality of treatment they will receive.
As for when it will stop...that part is easy. It has nothing to do with SWG either. This crap stops when SOE decides to act like a company that DEEPLY cares about its supporters....instead of treating them like filth all of the time. This is the only company I know of that religiously gets away with doing horrible things to its customers and being praised for it. You supporters are pretty dumb in my mind, you know for a fact that these guys are real tools...and instead of forcing the company to make changes that could only benefit you...you keep rallying behind them. Every game they have running is full of complaints about them and the way they treat players. Why are you so blind to that? WHY?
Whether its just a game or not....you should demand better for your continued financial support of a company. You are making them filthy rich...they get to live lives that most of us can only dream of because of these games. Why don't you expect a little more from them in regard to plain old respect?
I'm not arguing anything; I STILL haven't commented on the OP, merely questioned as to why you care. What difference does it make to you how well people here make their arguments? If none of it matters to you, why come here and troll?
Bad arguments don't weaken good arguments. If someone here presents a weak case, it is just that, separate from itself, a weak case. No harm no foul, not important. This is why I didn't post in this one, since I dodn't find much I agreed with here, and it wasn't very important to me.
It wasn't until YOU came in with your namecalling and your psychoanalysis -- then I questioned you WHY do YOU bother?
Why do you care if someone here presents a weak argument or a strong one on this issue? If YOU have gotten over it, why troll here at all? I'm still curious.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Plus, I feel we are doing SOE, LEC, and the industry a favor by providing a more honest post mortem of what they did than they will provide for themselves. They still are deluded enough to thinking the main problem was a communication problem, not an ethical one.
If we love MMOs it is incumbent upon us to tell the truth so it won't happen again, and their myths will not cintrinue without being corrected.
Plus this thing brought us all together, and to me, that's pretty cool.
fishermage.blogspot.com
Very well said, I couldn't agree more......
And that is why I refuse to own any SOE games and even why I refuse to buy a Playstation3 and that is really sad.
Until SOE is completely changed, bugs fixed, customer service on an actual service level, Smedely is fired, a complete overhaul of the current band of designers and corporate fanboi's, and a year of praises on the forums of customers telling us how wonderful SOE is, will I then CONSIDER returning to SOE games and purchasing Sony products.
I'm glad to see that you get it. It's not a game thing, its a company thing. Matter of fact, for me...if SWG had been the only bad thing they had done I'd have forgiven them for it. Its not....not even close. They treat EQ, EQ2, Vanguard, and even planetside players very poorly. Its all of their games, and all of their players. They really did a number on EQOA too....did you know that out of all the classes in that game only 3 were really usable in raids? A small handful of healers, one guy to port, a tank, and ranged dps. Until the CM's came...that really only left Necros for DPS. A warrior, some priests, and a caster. No rogues, no shadowknights, no bards, no magicians, no rangers....this list goes on. All the bosses had damage shields and AoE's that killed everything near em.
If I wanted, I could drag up a few thousand issues between their games to show you all. All in all, they just don't care. They make a game, and leave it to rot while soaking up all the money they can on it. Anyone or anything that says different is removed.
I kind of baffles me to why they came up with this grouping system, sure it could work on big servers but smaller servers has a tight knit community- most guilds will only take along their own guildmates or coallition guildies when doing instances and such, I found this out on other games with small servers (City of Heroes, Liberty server for eg), it's very difficult to get involved with people unless you're in a guild they know of and this isn't very healthy for new players.
I know for a fact they'll go ahead with this anyways on the next chapter, and I doubt it'll change much or get used much, this grouping system already exists in WoW and it gets little to no use.
One thing I'd say though is that some of my friends, very few but some, still play SWG because frankly it's the only StarWars game in town, and they met some really excellent people that also love StarWars.
I'll be happy when a new StarWars MMO comes along. That way they'll be able to have adventures in a galaxy far, far away with their buddies AND get treated with the respect they deserve.
SOE is a complete and utter FAILURE and a JOKE amongst MMO publishers.
F- your customers is a piss poor attitude for success when your customers have the option of firing you every month.
Mr. Smedley and his company have a credibility gap. The fact that they STILL haven't addressed the population issues, and that he STILL hasn't followed through on what he told people in person he would do is a present and ongoing concern about the credibility of Smedley and SOE. It's a big deal to people, and it's the latest in a pattern of telling people what they want to hear and then doing the opposite, if anything.
AFTER promising people that he was going to fast track server mergers at these face to face meetings, allegedly to rebuild trust, the new SOE party line is that there will be no server mergers, and that grouping tools etc. will be implemented instead.
Now that you're aware of the history regarding this issue, maybe you won't be so quick to dismiss it as petty.
Amen
Phyluxia get your butt of the forum. If you dont like it don't read it. MMORPG.com made the Veterens Refuge so we could air these grievences. If u have a problem with that then please do not come into this particular forum and don't look at any of the threads.
SWG is like meeting the hottest chick of all time and then have her give you every STD in the book and then she dresses a monkey up like a baby sues for child support and the judge says yes