I hope it won't be a wipe, but if it is, I have 0-50 down to a science! Seriously though, I joined free trial after gameforge went south, then made it to 50 in magic/melee, bought a key on amazon, then the day I ported to mainland, the server shut down!
I really can't wait to see thr rest. Most helpful and welcoming community you could ever ask for...
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
jealousy isnt a good reason to want a wipe of characters, sure people get jealous of flashy titles but its all a bit silly too. If its a wipe so be it, my gear took a hell of alot more work than the fancy titles people covet though so I'm hoping not.
In terms of levels I could easily reach 4 base masters within 2 month if need be, i.e melee/ele/dig/2x craft.
when we started on the german servers after aris went down within like 3 days we were all close to 200 in at least 1 skill (GoJ) I think Mardock was 160ish dig etc. The larger guilds wont suffer at all.
Even if there'd be a wipe... Ryzom was...is...should remain...yes, should remain skill-based not measured in numbers. Or in short: it's relying more on player experience than gathered experience points.
An experienced player can, erhh, could, travel around all of Atys (carefully...) on his own, an inexperienced Master-Of-Something can, erhh, could, not...
This was nicely proven on Cho (anyone remember?), it was only a matter of slightly more than a week for the first "Master of" to appear - even if it was only to claim OPs (which I fear would happen again - they should be disabled for the first weeks...)
May Ma-Duk light your souls
...activating morph from silent reader to active poster... ...pending... ...pending... ...pending...
Atys is home away from home.. always place to go even its behind next hill . I really miss that sitting some hill and watching how gingo or etc attacks somethink , or just beeing there and chat whit your guild. And i have told only real sandbox mmo currently is EvE or Vanguard but always said that they never seen sunset in thesos. And community is the best what i have seen in any other mmo. So stingarom and swim in oasis would be nice but mostly invading desert stock that will be fun.... i only wish birdies will come back someday.
I'm honestly hoping it will be a wipe for several reasons. 1) Everyone starts on an equal playing field all over again, enduring the harsh environments and reliving the days most of us old-timers have the best memories of. When we had to work togheter to achieve things that seem so obvious when you have a couple masters. Who will supply better gear and fast enough to allow others to progress at a steady pace? Who will make it to other lands? Who will manage to control a higher level Outpost? When will the first supremes be dug? 2) It would allow time for the new company to settle in, and get to work on fixing/adding what was still left out. 3) Skill levels don't mean a lot; it's wisdom and experience gained that count. I might have to work hard to get all my craft and forage levels there again, but I still have my recipes and knowledge on crafting. But it would indeed depend on what agreement was made on the purchase I suppose.
Oooh yeah...
Sorry but your third point nullifies the others.
It´s not Skill that counts, right. So, witch real Newbe could compete with our knowledge of Level-Spots?
Of Mat-Spots? Of how to get from A to B without dying?
Exactly - None.
So real Newbes would be completely lost in a world where for about two month an arms race par excellance would run its course and then settle back into the same status Q as before.
Because you can depend on the old guilds and alliances getting back together again and trying to get their old OPs again and maybe one or two more. But still, those with more RL time on their hands would win the day, because they´d level faster.
In a Game of Grind vs. Mind the Grind always wins. Those that do not play for simple levels would indeed be hard pressed to even keep up with the others. Remember there are two other servers out there and at least on Leanon we had a good portion of RP-Players that didn´t really care for who owned witch OP but owned one themselves. Those could in such a scenario forget to ever regain this status.
And real Newbes, where would they be?
They´d be drafted into the arms race as cannon fodder, nothing more.
Greed would rule the day even more as before, everyone would struggle to get at least 250 Elemental ASAP! What kind of "play" would that be? With every single Mob being wiped the second he respawned just for the XP...
We´d have maybe 1 week before the first cats started flowing from an OP, then those that ´d have OPs would zoom past all others and gain control of as many other OPs as they could, with no chance for others to ever get one. If worst comes to worst, there´d be a good chance that ONE guild/alliance would control the Catalyzer market exclusively. Would you want that?
Yeah, that would be a Game I´d "love" to return to.
Reliving the old memories? Forget it, I once ran from Zora to all other Citys with a lvl 10 Charakter, and died about 5 times. Others can do that too. So, nope. Sorry but that wouldn´t be our "old Atys".
I´m one of the "old timers" and as much as I miss these times, they´re never to return, even with a complete wipe.
Sad, but true.
CU
Acridiel / MaDSaM
Ryzom, we dare to be different. Do you dare to adapt?
hope there is a wipe, and that's not coming from bitter new player who couldnt catch up :-)
but would really like to see some thought going into a relaunch, cant say i am convinced that just booting up the servers and letting all the die hard fans get on with it will do anybody any favours in the long run.
but meh, i only popped into mmorpg for old times sake, havent played any games for months. and now i find this bombshell. going to go back to sleep again until there is some concrete news.
ps kill the outposts until they can be put back in game to create fun not anger
Greed would rule the day even more as before, everyone would struggle to get at least 250 Elemental ASAP!
...snippety...
We´d have maybe 1 week before the first cats started flowing from an OP, then those that ´d have OPs would zoom past all others and gain control of as many other OPs as they could... snippety... Acridiel / MaDSaM
*waves*
Greed is almost exclusively the fuel for any group of MMO players... to some extent that was different on Atys until they "wiped" "old Atys" with the introduction of commonly available XP catalyzers. That was my opinion back then and it still is. It was fitting into the scenario built up by the temples first and the outposts afterwards, though ;-)
Whether there'd be a wipe or not - the OP race will happen upon a possible reopening. Well, if they are available to conquer, that is... While it might help to remove cats at least at first, it will (sadly? - we'll see) not be up to the toon's character if the whole situation after the first days of celebration of Atys' revival have ended turns out to be the same old & dirty trench fights. Rather, it'll be that toon's master of strings, the player's, character. It was the best community of all, after all. We'll see if it remembers old virtues :-)
And yes... someone has to be the croaker so you have something to smile benignly on *grin*
hf & gn8
...activating morph from silent reader to active poster... ...pending... ...pending... ...pending...
If its a wipe I wont come back. I had all 5 lands harvest at level 250. No way in heck would I do that over in the same lifetime. I love to dig and craft but jeez was that brutal.
It never ceases to amaze me at the players who make the game they play sound like they worked hard instead of play hard LOL Its a game dude and meant to be played and enjoyed. Personally I think a complete wipe would be a good thing they would probably gain new subscribers who are interested (Like Me) in starting from scratch with everyone else starting from the bottom as well. There is nothing more fun then everyone starting from the beginning and advancing together. Either way I still plan on playing this game soon as its live again. In the mean time I will be messin around in EQ2 or SWG.
Originally posted by rushin hope there is a wipe, and that's not coming from bitter new player who couldnt catch up :-) but would really like to see some thought going into a relaunch, cant say i am convinced that just booting up the servers and letting all the die hard fans get on with it will do anybody any favours in the long run. but meh, i only popped into mmorpg for old times sake, havent played any games for months. and now i find this bombshell. going to go back to sleep again until there is some concrete news. ps kill the outposts until they can be put back in game to create fun not anger
I have to agree with Rushin. A wipe out and a fresh start would be the best direction as long as there is the feeling of a new game-world, may give the new owners enough time to work on those poorly implemented features and the chance of doing it right this time. Relocating mats and mobs shouldn't be too hard, and bringing back Kitin patrols would be a good idea.
The thought of those that have work so hard in foraging PR and other lands losing their levels and title is a bit scary. Maybe they can be compensated in other ways, like unique titles, rare armor and weapons. You know, the usual rewards given to beta testers.
But really, the idea of exploring Atys anew is exciting.
Personally I think a complete wipe would be a good thing they would probably gain new subscribers who are interested (Like Me) in starting from scratch with everyone else starting from the bottom as well.
Score 1 for the tall poppy syndrome theory!
Originally posted by Seiren
I have to agree with Rushin. A wipe out and a fresh start would be the best direction as long as there is the feeling of a new game-world...
And this is where the 'wipe' argument turns circular. Not meaning to pick on you Seiren, just your post was the most recent.
Pro-wipe: We should wipe for a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: You mean you just want to drag everyone else back to your level?
Pro-wipe: No, levels mean nothing. They're easy to gain. Game experience is more important anyway.
Anti-wipe: Uhuh...
Pro-wipe: No really, we just want a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: So levels are meaningless but resetting them will give us a "fresh start", even though you'll have all that game-experience under your belt... Riiiiight.
Pro-wipe: But moving on, wiping will give developers a chance to fix all the problems.
Anti-wipe: These problems that have existed for a long time?
Pro-wipe: Yeah those ones.
Anti-wipe: Didn't you say it wouldn't take long to regain those levels? So how much time would that give developers?
Pro-wipe: Well yeah, but...
--------
I can only see two reasons for a wipe, neither of them good:
1) Players ala Battleskar wanting to drag everyone else back to their level. And kudos to him for having the nads to just come out and say it.
2) The new game owners wanting to artificially extend the logevity of the game by making players replay it all from scratch.
I think Madsam also makes some good points and it takes me back to a few mmos I played on release. There's this insane mad levelling rush, led a bit by folk from beta who know where all the good stuff is and use that knowledge to corner markets and price-gouge. It's all race, race, race and not so much about actually enjoying the game.
And if they actually want to pick up and retain new players, wiping the existing player database could be disastrous. The game's history is already quite rocky enough, having changed ownership several times due to essentially failing. Can you imagine trying to market this game to new players if they wiped the player database on top of that?
Yeah, come and play this twice-failed four-year old mmo. Chances are you'll be able to play for oh, maybe 12 months before we go bankrupt again and oh yeah, even if the game continues under new owners, you could lose your character cos that's already happened once.
Wiping the player database... well Spiderweb International would be better off releasing a statement that they're former SOE renegades who were responsible for the NGE.
[I'm not a native speaker so please excuse spelling and grammar faults ]
Through a wipe a few players would win a little, but many would lose much.
1) The loss caused by a wipe isn't just about stupid levels or mats, it's about the loss of the virtual soul of your avatar, his life that is the sum of his abilities, his souvenirs collected over the years, his friendslist. If you create your character new from scratch, it's NOT the same character. The stories about the temple wars are not the same if the temples of a new server aren't the product of lived history anymore, the history WE, the players forged together. The products of all the diplomatic negotiations, the results of hate and love between the chars - all would be turned to ashes. Of course there will be new stories, but there will be deep deep scars and breaks in the character's profile that would make RP very hard, without introducing ridiculous things like divine intervention or memory loss.
With a wipe all characters would die. There will be always an "old" avatar who died in a kind of nuclear catastrophy and burnt with all his skills, memories, souvenirs and achievements to ashes. "Make a new one." Would you say to parents who lost their child: "Make a new one?" Of course this example is exaggerated, but I think you get the point.
And no, I'm NOT looking forward to the death of my avatar I've built up over three years, the loss of the planet WE changed, that carries OUR footsteps, the destruction of the last three years of roleplay, fights, events, no, im NOT looking forward to this.
Ryzom once advertised that the players can change the planet and the planet's history. So we DID change the planet with our avatars, with our fights, alliances, events. We DID write history. How can give someone a shit on all this and shout: "Wipe it, wipe it"? Everyone who wants to see this history die, who wants to wipe off the things we've built up, kicks the soul of Ryzom by kicking one of the core thoughts of the game.
2) How long would the "wipe-effect" last? The "good old times" wouldn't be brought back through this. The Old Ones know about the level spots, the boss mobs, the trek routes, the OP-tactics. The feeling to discover a world is tied to your brain, not to your levels. A wipe wouldn't bring it back.
New players can't take any profit out of this. The old ones will outlevel them with ease, they take control over the OPs, the level and foraging spots, the economy. The damage of a wipe as stated above would be done, but nothing new or better would be achieved for new players.
How much time does a player need to level the most important skills (Melee, heal, ele) to 250 if he knows about the spots and maybe supported by crystals? Two, three months? After one month there would be the first who have elemental magics on 250, after two months the first master foragers, after three months the first multi-250ies. And these people would then think: "Oh, great. I'm now there where I was before the wipe..." and then I'm curious what they think if they compare their 3-Months-Grinding-Fun against the loss of 3 years.
Let it be four or five months and the old ones got back their 250 in the important skills and the oh-so-great "Let's start new" effect (that was diminished by our old knowledge anyway!) is over.
You would punish the decent loyal long-term players that do events, RP and don't only think about grinding. And you would push the extreme grinders and aggressive powergamers. And this helps the community? This helps new players? This helps the company to bring Ryzom forward?
And the newbies? They would face overcrowded levelspots. They can't outlevel our knowledge. They would come into the old guilds that reformed. After three months after the wipe the newbies wouldn't face another atys than one that hasn't been wiped out. So where is the effect, the profit of a wipe for newbies?
Maybe you could attract new players through a wipe? "Come play Ryzom, we've deleted all the avatars of our long-term loyal customers!" That sounds good in my ears, I cant wait to join such a game. Maybe if I join the game and if im lucky I will have the chance that my avatar will get deleted too... Sorry for the polemics, but I can't the see benefit for new players or a benefit for Ryzom in a wipe.
To sacrifice all that we've gone through in the last three years, all that we've built up in politics, game culture, history, events for just 3 Months of heavy grinding with NO profit for new players. *shakes head*
The wipe-effect will be absolutely short-term. In skills, in guilds, in dappers, in OPs.
3) A wipe won't bring back the old feeling. The thrill when you first entered the roots, the excitement when you first met a huge named... that's not tied to your levels. You won't have the same thrill. It's an illusion that you will get back that feeling through a wipe.
Yes, I will play Ryzom even if there is a wipe. But I would hate the wipe. It's the death of OUR planet and OUR history for some months of grind-fest, leading to the same results we have now with no use for new players.
Think twice before you want a wipe. Consider short-term to long-term. Consider what we lose and what we gain.
Advertisement and development are the keys. No wipe. A wipe won't attract new players but has the potential of repelling old long-term loyal paying customers. What kind of silly marketing strategy is that?
---------------------- Playing: Ryzom, Vanguard, Everquest 2 Cancelled: RF online, WoW, Sword of the New World, Rappelz Looking forward to: Spellborn
Personally I think a complete wipe would be a good thing they would probably gain new subscribers who are interested (Like Me) in starting from scratch with everyone else starting from the bottom as well.
Score 1 for the tall poppy syndrome theory!
Originally posted by Seiren
I have to agree with Rushin. A wipe out and a fresh start would be the best direction as long as there is the feeling of a new game-world...
And this is where the 'wipe' argument turns circular. Not meaning to pick on you Seiren, just your post was the most recent.
Pro-wipe: We should wipe for a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: You mean you just want to drag everyone else back to your level?
Pro-wipe: No, levels mean nothing. They're easy to gain. Game experience is more important anyway.
Anti-wipe: Uhuh...
Pro-wipe: No really, we just want a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: So levels are meaningless but resetting them will give us a "fresh start", even though you'll have all that game-experience under your belt... Riiiiight.
Pro-wipe: But moving on, wiping will give developers a chance to fix all the problems.
Anti-wipe: These problems that have existed for a long time?
Pro-wipe: Yeah those ones.
Anti-wipe: Didn't you say it wouldn't take long to regain those levels? So how much time would that give developers?
Pro-wipe: Well yeah, but...
--------
I can only see two reasons for a wipe, neither of them good:
1) Players ala Battleskar wanting to drag everyone else back to their level. And kudos to him for having the nads to just come out and say it.
2) The new game owners wanting to artificially extend the logevity of the game by making players replay it all from scratch.
I think Madsam also makes some good points and it takes me back to a few mmos I played on release. There's this insane mad levelling rush, led a bit by folk from beta who know where all the good stuff is and use that knowledge to corner markets and price-gouge. It's all race, race, race and not so much about actually enjoying the game.
And if they actually want to pick up and retain new players, wiping the existing player database could be disastrous. The game's history is already quite rocky enough, having changed ownership several times due to essentially failing. Can you imagine trying to market this game to new players if they wiped the player database on top of that?
Yeah, come and play this twice-failed four-year old mmo. Chances are you'll be able to play for oh, maybe 12 months before we go bankrupt again and oh yeah, even if the game continues under new owners, you could lose your character cos that's already happened once.
Wiping the player database... well Spiderweb International would be better off releasing a statement that they're former SOE renegades who were responsible for the NGE.
Dude if came to a wipe or no Ryzom what would you choose? Its not like your getting to enjoy the game or anything you may have accomplished right now. I personally do not care what they do just get the game going again so some of us new players can begin our adventures in Atys. Gripe ,complain do what you will the truth is its all gone right now so if its a wipe or not makes no difference.
By the way I think this is the 1st game I know of that has a real possibility of being ressurected from the dead that I know of be grateful you may have another chance to play it. I would love to see Earth and Beyond get another chance woth a new company,but it will not ever happen. I have played several mmo's and accomplished alot including SWG Jedi if they would start a new classic server as a complete wipe I would have no complaints about starting over again evern tho I worked (Actually had fun grinding it) for it.
Dude if came to a wipe or no Ryzom what would you choose? Its not like your getting to enjoy the game or anything you may have accomplished right now. I personally do not care what they do just get the game going again so some of us new players can begin our adventures in Atys. Gripe ,complain do what you will the truth is its all gone right now so if its a wipe or not makes no difference.
I think someone in the company that owns ryzom (Spiderweb?) is observing the community. And I think that someone there tries to get an idea of the feelings of the player concerning several themes.
And I also think that the topic "wipe yes or no" is something that they have to consider. And if the over-all impression is: NO WIPE they may tend to keep the database instead of dropping it if the whole community favors a wipe.
So the discussion about it isn't completely useless, I think the overall-impression concerning that topic can be important.
---------------------- Playing: Ryzom, Vanguard, Everquest 2 Cancelled: RF online, WoW, Sword of the New World, Rappelz Looking forward to: Spellborn
If there was a wipe I'd probably join the game. The main reason I didnt play much more than reaching the mainland was lack of anyone to play with since most people were all mastery heroes out in who knows where the dangerous lands were
After a wipe you would face the same problem again after one or two months - the starter regions would be as empty as before. A wipe isn't a solution.
I play three years now and i still have so many melee-Levels (one-hand and two-hand) that are low. And if I look around in my guild there are even more that have Levels below 100. In Ryzom you will hardly found someone who hasn't some low-skills even after years of playing. That's one of the biggest advantages of ryzom.
---------------------- Playing: Ryzom, Vanguard, Everquest 2 Cancelled: RF online, WoW, Sword of the New World, Rappelz Looking forward to: Spellborn
If there was a wipe I'd probably join the game. The main reason I didnt play much more than reaching the mainland was lack of anyone to play with since most people were all mastery heroes out in who knows where the dangerous lands were
That's really strange, m8. Most of people that reached more masters, still had many other lower. It was really fun for me to go teaming with new guildies getting the chance to play with other, low level, skills.
And for sure i would be happy to level with you if we just got the chance to team together.
The skill system of Ryzom is so good that you don't need any *artificial* releveling such as *sidekick* in CoH or other names i dont remember in other mmo, also encouraging you to start different without rolling another char.
Just for people not knowing the whole skill system of Ryzom:
Comments
I hope it won't be a wipe, but if it is, I have 0-50 down to a science! Seriously though, I joined free trial after gameforge went south, then made it to 50 in magic/melee, bought a key on amazon, then the day I ported to mainland, the server shut down!
I really can't wait to see thr rest. Most helpful and welcoming community you could ever ask for...
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
jealousy isnt a good reason to want a wipe of characters, sure people get jealous of flashy titles but its all a bit silly too. If its a wipe so be it, my gear took a hell of alot more work than the fancy titles people covet though so I'm hoping not.
In terms of levels I could easily reach 4 base masters within 2 month if need be, i.e melee/ele/dig/2x craft.
when we started on the german servers after aris went down within like 3 days we were all close to 200 in at least 1 skill (GoJ) I think Mardock was 160ish dig etc. The larger guilds wont suffer at all.
and if wipe happens it only means massive trekking spree witch would be serious fun
Even if there'd be a wipe... Ryzom was...is...should remain...yes, should remain skill-based not measured in numbers. Or in short: it's relying more on player experience than gathered experience points.
An experienced player can, erhh, could, travel around all of Atys (carefully...) on his own, an inexperienced Master-Of-Something can, erhh, could, not...
This was nicely proven on Cho (anyone remember?), it was only a matter of slightly more than a week for the first "Master of" to appear - even if it was only to claim OPs (which I fear would happen again - they should be disabled for the first weeks...)
May Ma-Duk light your souls
...activating morph from silent reader to active poster...
...pending...
...pending...
...pending...
You think people are never silly? Or just Ryzom players are never silly?
Whatever you're smoking, pass it around.
I don't think it will be a wype. And I really don't care. I haven't play a decent game since I left. I want Ryzom back.
Atys is home away from home.. always place to go even its behind next hill . I really miss that sitting some hill and watching how gingo or etc attacks somethink , or just beeing there and chat whit your guild. And i have told only real sandbox mmo currently is EvE or Vanguard but always said that they never seen sunset in thesos. And community is the best what i have seen in any other mmo. So stingarom and swim in oasis would be nice but mostly invading desert stock that will be fun.... i only wish birdies will come back someday.
Oooh yeah...
Sorry but your third point nullifies the others.
It´s not Skill that counts, right. So, witch real Newbe could compete with our knowledge of Level-Spots?
Of Mat-Spots? Of how to get from A to B without dying?
Exactly - None.
So real Newbes would be completely lost in a world where for about two month an arms race par excellance would run its course and then settle back into the same status Q as before.
Because you can depend on the old guilds and alliances getting back together again and trying to get their old OPs again and maybe one or two more. But still, those with more RL time on their hands would win the day, because they´d level faster.
In a Game of Grind vs. Mind the Grind always wins. Those that do not play for simple levels would indeed be hard pressed to even keep up with the others. Remember there are two other servers out there and at least on Leanon we had a good portion of RP-Players that didn´t really care for who owned witch OP but owned one themselves. Those could in such a scenario forget to ever regain this status.
And real Newbes, where would they be?
They´d be drafted into the arms race as cannon fodder, nothing more.
Greed would rule the day even more as before, everyone would struggle to get at least 250 Elemental ASAP! What kind of "play" would that be? With every single Mob being wiped the second he respawned just for the XP...
We´d have maybe 1 week before the first cats started flowing from an OP, then those that ´d have OPs would zoom past all others and gain control of as many other OPs as they could, with no chance for others to ever get one. If worst comes to worst, there´d be a good chance that ONE guild/alliance would control the Catalyzer market exclusively. Would you want that?
Yeah, that would be a Game I´d "love" to return to.
Reliving the old memories? Forget it, I once ran from Zora to all other Citys with a lvl 10 Charakter, and died about 5 times. Others can do that too. So, nope. Sorry but that wouldn´t be our "old Atys".
I´m one of the "old timers" and as much as I miss these times, they´re never to return, even with a complete wipe.
Sad, but true.
CU
Acridiel / MaDSaM
Do you dare to adapt?
hope there is a wipe, and that's not coming from bitter new player who couldnt catch up :-)
but would really like to see some thought going into a relaunch, cant say i am convinced that just booting up the servers and letting all the die hard fans get on with it will do anybody any favours in the long run.
but meh, i only popped into mmorpg for old times sake, havent played any games for months. and now i find this bombshell. going to go back to sleep again until there is some concrete news.
ps kill the outposts until they can be put back in game to create fun not anger
I sure hope so.
My god has horns.... nah, I don't think he is real either.
*waves*
Greed is almost exclusively the fuel for any group of MMO players... to some extent that was different on Atys until they "wiped" "old Atys" with the introduction of commonly available XP catalyzers. That was my opinion back then and it still is. It was fitting into the scenario built up by the temples first and the outposts afterwards, though ;-)
Whether there'd be a wipe or not - the OP race will happen upon a possible reopening. Well, if they are available to conquer, that is... While it might help to remove cats at least at first, it will (sadly? - we'll see) not be up to the toon's character if the whole situation after the first days of celebration of Atys' revival have ended turns out to be the same old & dirty trench fights. Rather, it'll be that toon's master of strings, the player's, character. It was the best community of all, after all. We'll see if it remembers old virtues :-)
And yes... someone has to be the croaker so you have something to smile benignly on *grin*
hf & gn8
...activating morph from silent reader to active poster...
...pending...
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It never ceases to amaze me at the players who make the game they play sound like they worked hard instead of play hard LOL Its a game dude and meant to be played and enjoyed. Personally I think a complete wipe would be a good thing they would probably gain new subscribers who are interested (Like Me) in starting from scratch with everyone else starting from the bottom as well. There is nothing more fun then everyone starting from the beginning and advancing together. Either way I still plan on playing this game soon as its live again. In the mean time I will be messin around in EQ2 or SWG.
I have to agree with Rushin. A wipe out and a fresh start would be the best direction as long as there is the feeling of a new game-world, may give the new owners enough time to work on those poorly implemented features and the chance of doing it right this time. Relocating mats and mobs shouldn't be too hard, and bringing back Kitin patrols would be a good idea.
The thought of those that have work so hard in foraging PR and other lands losing their levels and title is a bit scary. Maybe they can be compensated in other ways, like unique titles, rare armor and weapons. You know, the usual rewards given to beta testers.
But really, the idea of exploring Atys anew is exciting.
Score 1 for the tall poppy syndrome theory!
And this is where the 'wipe' argument turns circular. Not meaning to pick on you Seiren, just your post was the most recent.
Pro-wipe: We should wipe for a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: You mean you just want to drag everyone else back to your level?
Pro-wipe: No, levels mean nothing. They're easy to gain. Game experience is more important anyway.
Anti-wipe: Uhuh...
Pro-wipe: No really, we just want a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: So levels are meaningless but resetting them will give us a "fresh start", even though you'll have all that game-experience under your belt... Riiiiight.
Pro-wipe: But moving on, wiping will give developers a chance to fix all the problems.
Anti-wipe: These problems that have existed for a long time?
Pro-wipe: Yeah those ones.
Anti-wipe: Didn't you say it wouldn't take long to regain those levels? So how much time would that give developers?
Pro-wipe: Well yeah, but...
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I can only see two reasons for a wipe, neither of them good:
1) Players ala Battleskar wanting to drag everyone else back to their level. And kudos to him for having the nads to just come out and say it.
2) The new game owners wanting to artificially extend the logevity of the game by making players replay it all from scratch.
I think Madsam also makes some good points and it takes me back to a few mmos I played on release. There's this insane mad levelling rush, led a bit by folk from beta who know where all the good stuff is and use that knowledge to corner markets and price-gouge. It's all race, race, race and not so much about actually enjoying the game.
And if they actually want to pick up and retain new players, wiping the existing player database could be disastrous. The game's history is already quite rocky enough, having changed ownership several times due to essentially failing. Can you imagine trying to market this game to new players if they wiped the player database on top of that?
Yeah, come and play this twice-failed four-year old mmo. Chances are you'll be able to play for oh, maybe 12 months before we go bankrupt again and oh yeah, even if the game continues under new owners, you could lose your character cos that's already happened once.
Wiping the player database... well Spiderweb International would be better off releasing a statement that they're former SOE renegades who were responsible for the NGE.
[I'm not a native speaker so please excuse spelling and grammar faults
]
Through a wipe a few players would win a little, but many would lose much.
1) The loss caused by a wipe isn't just about stupid levels or mats, it's about the loss of the virtual soul of your avatar, his life that is the sum of his abilities, his souvenirs collected over the years, his friendslist. If you create your character new from scratch, it's NOT the same character. The stories about the temple wars are not the same if the temples of a new server aren't the product of lived history anymore, the history WE, the players forged together. The products of all the diplomatic negotiations, the results of hate and love between the chars - all would be turned to ashes. Of course there will be new stories, but there will be deep deep scars and breaks in the character's profile that would make RP very hard, without introducing ridiculous things like divine intervention or memory loss.
With a wipe all characters would die. There will be always an "old" avatar who died in a kind of nuclear catastrophy and burnt with all his skills, memories, souvenirs and achievements to ashes. "Make a new one." Would you say to parents who lost their child: "Make a new one?" Of course this example is exaggerated, but I think you get the point.
And no, I'm NOT looking forward to the death of my avatar I've built up over three years, the loss of the planet WE changed, that carries OUR footsteps, the destruction of the last three years of roleplay, fights, events, no, im NOT looking forward to this.
Ryzom once advertised that the players can change the planet and the planet's history. So we DID change the planet with our avatars, with our fights, alliances, events. We DID write history. How can give someone a shit on all this and shout: "Wipe it, wipe it"? Everyone who wants to see this history die, who wants to wipe off the things we've built up, kicks the soul of Ryzom by kicking one of the core thoughts of the game.
2) How long would the "wipe-effect" last? The "good old times" wouldn't be brought back through this. The Old Ones know about the level spots, the boss mobs, the trek routes, the OP-tactics. The feeling to discover a world is tied to your brain, not to your levels. A wipe wouldn't bring it back.
New players can't take any profit out of this. The old ones will outlevel them with ease, they take control over the OPs, the level and foraging spots, the economy. The damage of a wipe as stated above would be done, but nothing new or better would be achieved for new players.
How much time does a player need to level the most important skills (Melee, heal, ele) to 250 if he knows about the spots and maybe supported by crystals? Two, three months? After one month there would be the first who have elemental magics on 250, after two months the first master foragers, after three months the first multi-250ies. And these people would then think: "Oh, great. I'm now there where I was before the wipe..." and then I'm curious what they think if they compare their 3-Months-Grinding-Fun against the loss of 3 years.
Let it be four or five months and the old ones got back their 250 in the important skills and the oh-so-great "Let's start new" effect (that was diminished by our old knowledge anyway!) is over.
You would punish the decent loyal long-term players that do events, RP and don't only think about grinding. And you would push the extreme grinders and aggressive powergamers. And this helps the community? This helps new players? This helps the company to bring Ryzom forward?
And the newbies? They would face overcrowded levelspots. They can't outlevel our knowledge. They would come into the old guilds that reformed. After three months after the wipe the newbies wouldn't face another atys than one that hasn't been wiped out. So where is the effect, the profit of a wipe for newbies?
Maybe you could attract new players through a wipe? "Come play Ryzom, we've deleted all the avatars of our long-term loyal customers!" That sounds good in my ears, I cant wait to join such a game. Maybe if I join the game and if im lucky I will have the chance that my avatar will get deleted too... Sorry for the polemics, but I can't the see benefit for new players or a benefit for Ryzom in a wipe.
To sacrifice all that we've gone through in the last three years, all that we've built up in politics, game culture, history, events for just 3 Months of heavy grinding with NO profit for new players. *shakes head*
The wipe-effect will be absolutely short-term. In skills, in guilds, in dappers, in OPs.
3) A wipe won't bring back the old feeling. The thrill when you first entered the roots, the excitement when you first met a huge named... that's not tied to your levels. You won't have the same thrill. It's an illusion that you will get back that feeling through a wipe.
Yes, I will play Ryzom even if there is a wipe. But I would hate the wipe. It's the death of OUR planet and OUR history for some months of grind-fest, leading to the same results we have now with no use for new players.
Think twice before you want a wipe. Consider short-term to long-term. Consider what we lose and what we gain.
Advertisement and development are the keys. No wipe. A wipe won't attract new players but has the potential of repelling old long-term loyal paying customers. What kind of silly marketing strategy is that?
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Playing: Ryzom, Vanguard, Everquest 2
Cancelled: RF online, WoW, Sword of the New World, Rappelz
Looking forward to: Spellborn
Dentom, i quote every single word you wrote.
Why don't you post this in the official forum too?
Nickname registered on www.mynickname.org
He did - in the German Forums...consider this a more publically accessible translation
...activating morph from silent reader to active poster...
...pending...
...pending...
...pending...
*agrees with dentom*
Besides, the whole wipe idea/rumour is still as ridiculously unlikely as ever.
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In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on August 13, 2008.
Score 1 for the tall poppy syndrome theory!
And this is where the 'wipe' argument turns circular. Not meaning to pick on you Seiren, just your post was the most recent.
Pro-wipe: We should wipe for a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: You mean you just want to drag everyone else back to your level?
Pro-wipe: No, levels mean nothing. They're easy to gain. Game experience is more important anyway.
Anti-wipe: Uhuh...
Pro-wipe: No really, we just want a fresh start.
Anti-wipe: So levels are meaningless but resetting them will give us a "fresh start", even though you'll have all that game-experience under your belt... Riiiiight.
Pro-wipe: But moving on, wiping will give developers a chance to fix all the problems.
Anti-wipe: These problems that have existed for a long time?
Pro-wipe: Yeah those ones.
Anti-wipe: Didn't you say it wouldn't take long to regain those levels? So how much time would that give developers?
Pro-wipe: Well yeah, but...
--------
I can only see two reasons for a wipe, neither of them good:
1) Players ala Battleskar wanting to drag everyone else back to their level. And kudos to him for having the nads to just come out and say it.
2) The new game owners wanting to artificially extend the logevity of the game by making players replay it all from scratch.
I think Madsam also makes some good points and it takes me back to a few mmos I played on release. There's this insane mad levelling rush, led a bit by folk from beta who know where all the good stuff is and use that knowledge to corner markets and price-gouge. It's all race, race, race and not so much about actually enjoying the game.
And if they actually want to pick up and retain new players, wiping the existing player database could be disastrous. The game's history is already quite rocky enough, having changed ownership several times due to essentially failing. Can you imagine trying to market this game to new players if they wiped the player database on top of that?
Yeah, come and play this twice-failed four-year old mmo. Chances are you'll be able to play for oh, maybe 12 months before we go bankrupt again and oh yeah, even if the game continues under new owners, you could lose your character cos that's already happened once.
Wiping the player database... well Spiderweb International would be better off releasing a statement that they're former SOE renegades who were responsible for the NGE.
Dude if came to a wipe or no Ryzom what would you choose? Its not like your getting to enjoy the game or anything you may have accomplished right now. I personally do not care what they do just get the game going again so some of us new players can begin our adventures in Atys. Gripe ,complain do what you will the truth is its all gone right now so if its a wipe or not makes no difference.
By the way I think this is the 1st game I know of that has a real possibility of being ressurected from the dead that I know of be grateful you may have another chance to play it. I would love to see Earth and Beyond get another chance woth a new company,but it will not ever happen. I have played several mmo's and accomplished alot including SWG Jedi if they would start a new classic server as a complete wipe I would have no complaints about starting over again evern tho I worked (Actually had fun grinding it) for it.
I think someone in the company that owns ryzom (Spiderweb?) is observing the community. And I think that someone there tries to get an idea of the feelings of the player concerning several themes.
And I also think that the topic "wipe yes or no" is something that they have to consider. And if the over-all impression is: NO WIPE they may tend to keep the database instead of dropping it if the whole community favors a wipe.
So the discussion about it isn't completely useless, I think the overall-impression concerning that topic can be important.
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Playing: Ryzom, Vanguard, Everquest 2
Cancelled: RF online, WoW, Sword of the New World, Rappelz
Looking forward to: Spellborn
If there was a wipe I'd probably join the game. The main reason I didnt play much more than reaching the mainland was lack of anyone to play with since most people were all mastery heroes out in who knows where the dangerous lands were
After a wipe you would face the same problem again after one or two months - the starter regions would be as empty as before. A wipe isn't a solution.
I play three years now and i still have so many melee-Levels (one-hand and two-hand) that are low. And if I look around in my guild there are even more that have Levels below 100. In Ryzom you will hardly found someone who hasn't some low-skills even after years of playing. That's one of the biggest advantages of ryzom.
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Playing: Ryzom, Vanguard, Everquest 2
Cancelled: RF online, WoW, Sword of the New World, Rappelz
Looking forward to: Spellborn
That's really strange, m8. Most of people that reached more masters, still had many other lower. It was really fun for me to go teaming with new guildies getting the chance to play with other, low level, skills.
And for sure i would be happy to level with you if we just got the chance to team together.
The skill system of Ryzom is so good that you don't need any *artificial* releveling such as *sidekick* in CoH or other names i dont remember in other mmo, also encouraging you to start different without rolling another char.
Just for people not knowing the whole skill system of Ryzom:
ballisticmystix.net/
as you can see, skills branch at certain levels, ending up with a huge tree of skills, and each can be mastered at 250.
Nickname registered on www.mynickname.org
Why would they wipe? That would be a very dumb business decision.