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A Sad Day for Warhammer Online
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BTW
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Reviresco/mj.jpg
Stole it from the VN Boards.
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Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!
I have to disagree, i am the consumer, I refuse to pay for something unfinished.let me just stop you right there, a mmo is never finnished, what you consider a mmo finnished and what i do is different and is really only existent in the mmo world till the game dies. I would like for you to name a few games that have no cut anything, but rather then tell you it just didnt make it and was added later. I can think of a big one, its known as WoW You either do it right or not at all. For you to say its unreasonable to get upset, you have incredibly low standards. Could say you have to high standerds for this kind of industry You will continue to support the industry and continue to encourage them to put out unfinished games once again , your view and mine is different because they know the player base will buy it and put up with a half made game for an entire year, thus giving them millions of dollars in the processa bad game will not make that much money for that long , look at AOC it had a spike when it came out and that was the end of it. And if the game declines, they can rinse their hands of it and walk away with profit.
When it comes to your options, i go with delay the game and according to their perfectionist standards, delay the game yet again. I don't care, release the game right, or not at all. I will not pay for a game that is not done.then by by, i will enjoy my game because its about fun not OMG THEY CUT THINGS AND EVERY MMO HAS DONE IT BEFORE BECAUSE ITS COMPLETELY UNREASONABLE IN A DEVLOPMENT OF A GAME THAT TAKES 4+ YEARS TO ASSUME WHAT GUY A SAID AT DAY 1 STANDS TRUE AT DAY 712
I would also like to say those 4 capital cities never existed to you, you never played thus never had them, thus them not having them means you dont loose anything.
You're right i lost nothing because i choose not to pay for an unfinished game. When it comes to your reasoning behind the game never being finished. They are basing their game off of "Balance", or thats how it would seem when they made the 4 archetypes. I can understand cutting cities and dungeons, and cutting the special (insert name here) event, but classes? No. That's a game feature that should be in the game from the beginning. Obviously MMOs grow and are not static, but adding in a class at the last minute sets you up for a royal pain in the arse for fixing it up to par with the other classes and configuring it with everything in the game including tome of knowledge, quests, and everything pretty much. Theres a difference between post content, and foundational content that is SUPPOSE TO BE THERE AT THE BEGINNING OF THE GAME.
The point is, is that if Mythic had never released any information about these cities, and then when they released the game it said "there are two capital cities: one for each faction" you would not know the difference. sure, you may wish they had a city for each race, but you would never even know that it was in the original plans. And it would stll be just as "finished" in your eyes.
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"Capitalism is currently working as intended."
I have to disagree, i am the consumer, I refuse to pay for something unfinished. You either do it right or not at all. For you to say its unreasonable to get upset, you have incredibly low standards. You will continue to support the industry and continue to encourage them to put out unfinished games because they know the player base will buy it and put up with a half made game for an entire year, thus giving them millions of dollars in the process. And if the game declines, they can rinse their hands of it and walk away with profit.
When it comes to your options, i go with delay the game and according to their perfectionist standards, delay the game yet again. I don't care, release the game right, or not at all. I will not pay for a game that is not done.
And what would you be doing if they delayed the game until Q4 2009 or Q1 2010? My assumption is you'd be complaining about that. And we can't forget that this is a business. And you can't forget that EA does still own Mythic. Do you think that EA would just keep pouring money into this game? No, because EA doesn't care about quality. Probably what happened was EA put pressure on them for release, said, "we can't keep spending money on this, you can't delay it." Publishers ruin games all the time, and what Mythic did was take the necessary steps to make sure that EA would not permanently damage the game they have been working on long before EA bought them. And you know that this is very well something EA would say to them.
No, i wouldn't be complaining and i wouldn't be thinking about it at all to be honest, life isn't all about games. Theres so much more to do, i just came on here to state my points. It's not my fault that they sold out to EA and now are paying the price, thats still no excuse to release an unfinished game and expect the consumer to eat it, nope. I'll just be looking for the next game from a company that refuses to sell out or to release before they are finished.
I have to disagree, i am the consumer, I refuse to pay for something unfinished. You either do it right or not at all. For you to say its unreasonable to get upset, you have incredibly low standards. You will continue to support the industry and continue to encourage them to put out unfinished games because they know the player base will buy it and put up with a half made game for an entire year, thus giving them millions of dollars in the process. And if the game declines, they can rinse their hands of it and walk away with profit.
When it comes to your options, i go with delay the game and according to their perfectionist standards, delay the game yet again. I don't care, release the game right, or not at all. I will not pay for a game that is not done.
And what would you be doing if they delayed the game until Q4 2009 or Q1 2010? My assumption is you'd be complaining about that. And we can't forget that this is a business. And you can't forget that EA does still own Mythic. Do you think that EA would just keep pouring money into this game? No, because EA doesn't care about quality. Probably what happened was EA put pressure on them for release, said, "we can't keep spending money on this, you can't delay it." Publishers ruin games all the time, and what Mythic did was take the necessary steps to make sure that EA would not permanently damage the game they have been working on long before EA bought them. And you know that this is very well something EA would say to them.
No, i wouldn't be complaining and i wouldn't be thinking about it at all to be honest, life isn't all about games. Theres so much more to do, i just came on here to state my points. It's not my fault that they sold out to EA and now are paying the price, thats still no excuse to release an unfinished game and expect the consumer to eat it, nope. I'll just be looking for the next game from a company that refuses to sell out or to release before they are finished.
*waves* bye bye now. Good luck.
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Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!
And i think thats because you and many others are desperate for an MMO right now that you're willing to put up with anything and set low standards even though they just cut major content out and now you will have to wait longer to receive it. Its harder to add in content and polish it while the game has already gone retail. I think the fortresses are a cop out, a band aid on a broken bone. Just hashing something together quickly to make up for the huge gap in their game.
if i wanted low standers id play WOTLK CAUSE ITS ADDING SO MANY NEW THINGS RIGHT!?!?!?!?!?
Also one thing, i never understoff, for you people who wish to push it back, well you are the consumer just simply dont buy it till then kthxbye
You don't understand that a game needs to be done right the first time? Or risk losing subscribers who will never return, thus making the game have less money to be used to improving it? If you settle for less your whole life, you will get less again and again. I could care less about WoW get over it, I don't play WoW and nobody should, that game should have died 2 years ago.
I have to disagree, i am the consumer, I refuse to pay for something unfinished. You either do it right or not at all. For you to say its unreasonable to get upset, you have incredibly low standards. You will continue to support the industry and continue to encourage them to put out unfinished games because they know the player base will buy it and put up with a half made game for an entire year, thus giving them millions of dollars in the process. And if the game declines, they can rinse their hands of it and walk away with profit.
When it comes to your options, i go with delay the game and according to their perfectionist standards, delay the game yet again. I don't care, release the game right, or not at all. I will not pay for a game that is not done.
And what would you be doing if they delayed the game until Q4 2009 or Q1 2010? My assumption is you'd be complaining about that. And we can't forget that this is a business. And you can't forget that EA does still own Mythic. Do you think that EA would just keep pouring money into this game? No, because EA doesn't care about quality. Probably what happened was EA put pressure on them for release, said, "we can't keep spending money on this, you can't delay it." Publishers ruin games all the time, and what Mythic did was take the necessary steps to make sure that EA would not permanently damage the game they have been working on long before EA bought them. And you know that this is very well something EA would say to them.
No, i wouldn't be complaining and i wouldn't be thinking about it at all to be honest, life isn't all about games. Theres so much more to do, i just came on here to state my points. It's not my fault that they sold out to EA and now are paying the price, thats still no excuse to release an unfinished game and expect the consumer to eat it, nope. I'll just be looking for the next game from a company that refuses to sell out or to release before they are finished.
You can call it "selling out" or whatever you want, but it's undeniable that EA has recourses that Mythic could never have unless they had been sold to EA. To this day I trust Mr. Mark Jacob's decision, because I have faith that he would not have sold his company if he didn't think it would benefit the game they were developing and the game they are still supporting.
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"Capitalism is currently working as intended."
Nice post OP. I will no judge a game until I played it myself, if it is fun, I wouldnt mind paying the sub. Honestly the way they hype the game now is very similar to Failcom's AoC, and that the thing I am scaried of. I really want this game to success because I like Warhammer's lore. However, I would rather they cut some content and have the core element of the game ready to launch and refine the game as it goes, other than push out a broken, unfinished game like "the name cannot be spoken" 3 months ago. Mystic is known to have 50 billion expensions, if those cut contents are in those expensions, I for one will be very pissed off and will prob cancel the sub.
Will the game success? I think it will since the launch will get a lot of the Aoc hatebois and the bored WoW fanbois to try this game. Will the game last tho? Only time will tell.
This is entirely correct, you can not determine if a game is finished or not until the game is released, if it is released with crappy content (as it would have been if there were no cuts) then it would be unfinished, but they have decided to only release the finished content
you could interperet this in 1 of 2 ways: 1) the game is finished if ALL of the content is implemented and finished, in which case the game will always be adding content so it will NEVER be finished or. 2) the game is finished when the content THAT is implemented is finished, in which case the cuts support the fact the at the game will be finished, but we'll wait and see.....
and THEY CANNNOT delay the game any longer, it has been delayed enough...read the post about publishers and EA
Believe us people who have played the CB, WAR is done right. We can't tell you how, or why, but we'll tell you it is, and tell you to wait a week or two so we can tell you in detail. Have patience, young padawan.
Sorry wrong. And you played all these classes to know they were essential?
Don't judge a game until you play it. And I'm not just saying that, many people have played it, and do not feel the way you do. This I get from other forums, that are not so picky about NDAs.
You can tell yourself that you are well informed about the game, and have "done your research" but the OP shows to anyone who has half a clue, that you dont know a damn thing about the current state of the game, or anything specific about it.
But thats ok, ignorance is alot easier, and less time consuming than learning about the topic you are talking about.
Tell me exactly what I'm wrong about, they are cutting out the major capital cities, am i right? They are cutting 4 classes, you agree? What am i wrong about?
Are you in Beta?
Hearing that 4 classes are being cut and 4 capital cities which were very much anticipated by a lot of people including myself, you don't need to be in beta to realize that there is something very wrong with that. But no I am not in beta. They gave us Podcasts to tell us what they were doing, so we get an overview of what is happening. The original plan was way better and not the one they are doing now. They have cut out essential classes and unbalanced the game and they force people to alter their playstyles and continue to pay for it. Nope. By the time they get all that in, IF THEY EVER, a better MMO will be out.
You can tell yourself that you are well informed about the game, and have "done your research" but the OP shows to anyone who has half a clue, that you dont know a damn thing about the current state of the game, or anything specific about it.
But thats ok, ignorance is alot easier, and less time consuming than learning about the topic you are talking about.
Tell me exactly what I'm wrong about, they are cutting out the major capital cities, am i right? They are cutting 4 classes, you agree? What am i wrong about?
Are you in Beta?
Hearing that 4 classes are being cut and 4 capital cities which were very much anticipated by a lot of people including myself, you don't need to be in beta to realize that there is something very wrong with that. But no I am not in beta. They gave us Podcasts to tell us what they were doing, so we get an overview of what is happening. The original plan was way better and not the one they are doing now. They have cut out essential classes and unbalanced the game and they force people to alter their playstyles and continue to pay for it. Nope. By the time they get all that in, IF THEY EVER, a better MMO will be out.
But you don't know how much it REALLY affects the gameplay now. It may turn out to be a good thing. Let's wait until Launch to decide...because that is the real determining factor.
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Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!
This is entirely correct, you can not determine if a game is finished or not until the game is released, if it is released with crappy content (as it would have been if there were no cuts) then it would be unfinished, but they have decided to only release the finished content
you could interperet this in 1 of 2 ways: 1) the game is finished if ALL of the content is implemented and finished, in which case the game will always be adding content so it will NEVER be finished or. 2) the game is finished when the content THAT is implemented is finished, in which case the cuts support the fact the at the game will be finished, but we'll wait and see.....
and THEY CANNNOT delay the game any longer, it has been delayed enough...read the post about publishers and EA
I can't count the number of times I have read in interviews or posts from developers how much content from a game is cut, or how many games are not released even after years of development. This is a normal and vital part of the industry, otherwise we would have a whole lot of crap on the market and in our games. Unfortunately, the times people are upset about it is when the company has been openly communicated with the costumers about what they hoped to have in the game.
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"Capitalism is currently working as intended."
You can tell yourself that you are well informed about the game, and have "done your research" but the OP shows to anyone who has half a clue, that you dont know a damn thing about the current state of the game, or anything specific about it.
But thats ok, ignorance is alot easier, and less time consuming than learning about the topic you are talking about.
Tell me exactly what I'm wrong about, they are cutting out the major capital cities, am i right? They are cutting 4 classes, you agree? What am i wrong about?
If you don't like the 20 classes left then don't play. How many classes does WoW have? 9? Geez if they had a game that promised 1000 classes and they cut 10 people will still be complaining lmao.
You're right i won't play, theres a difference between a game that has 40 classes and no connection at all, and then theres a huge difference when you have a game that is built from its foundation of FOUR ARCHETYPES that work together to form a team, and when you don't have them you are weaker for it. Then when you have 3 instead of the 4 going up against the race with 4, you are going to get stomped. Sure people can come over and help, but what about their battlefronts and their public quests, and their tome of knowledge, and their role playing experience, nope, throw that out the window. Just going to have to deal with another terrain and suck it up, and keep paying monthly for it.
Well I just have to say I hope you are going Destruction pref Chaos and just do the Chaos battlefront while we in order steam roll Dark Elf and Greenskin and open the Chaos cities from those battlefronts. What? you mean you have not seen the new podcast explaining you have to control 2 of the 3 battlefronts to open the city seige so it won't be just one battlefront over and over and over? oh....
I saw the new podcast, but its going along with what i was saying. Those 4 capital cities don't exist and the four classes are gone, its just about the order and chaos battlefront now. So yes you have to take those fortresses in the other zones but its narrowed down, which i don't think they should have done and it wasn't the picture they painted months ago to us. They drop the ball on us at the last second.
Troll, just a troll...
Presented with proof from a dev podcast that his assumpsion is wrong, he still clings and insist his assumpsion is true and continues to argue that its still just one and only really one battleground to fight over. Ignoring the fact it's now a realm city and not just a racial city. If he actually watched the podcast he would admit the one and only one battleground assumsion is wrong. The podcast clearly shows all 3 battlefront is still there and you have to fight over and win 2 of the 3 to open a city. If anything there is more needed to capture a capital city now than before. Meaning more battles, more RvR, more WAAAAARG!! You have to win 2 battlefront now instade of just one racial battlefront.
He dismiss the capture of the fortess as minor when from the pod cast to capture a fortess you need to control all four tiers in that battlefront (i.e. same as capturing a single city if there were 6). But to him that is minor and trivial because only the empire/chaos battlefront is all there is. Willfull blindness and ignorance.
The OP is just a troll and not really wanting enlightment as proven by being presented by correct information he ignores it and insist his OP is "the one true interperation".
And with that I am out of this thread and taking my bread crumbs home and nolonger feeding the troll
Ignore prelaunch hype and stop buying MMOs you haven't played first. Follow those simple rules and you'll have low expectations and save money. Above all you'll be able to laugh when the marketing fog machine runs out of smoke.
So they are adding in an untested 5th tier, when we are on the verge of open beta, thats very smart.
WAR would not announce "we are shooting ourselves in the foot." Clearly their openess about it should be reassuring to the customers who are finally seeing some publishers with integrity!! Too many games have been published with vast open spaces of crap. Id rather have a little concentrated polished content than oceans of garbage with bugs and imbalance. You may have lost your favorite class or the most intruiging city, but im sure it was done for our benefit as gamers.
Compliments to blizzard tho on this part... they just dont tell you ANYTHING about the game unless it's already in it... so when they release people go "wow... so much stuff and it's a finished game"... and the thing the players DON'T know is that in development they cut TONS of things... you just never heard about it...
Their vision of the game was 24 classes and 6 capital living cities, and then they dropped the ball and changed their minds because of whatever reason or whatever excuse they decided to pull out. There is no excuse, delay the game, and get it done, period. That's what they were selling to players, and thats what drove people to the game, not 2 capital cities and missing classes.
As for the comment about melee vs caster, you missed my point. What i meant was that it was part of the archetype formula that they spoke of and the counter against casters was MELEE DPS which they removed from the greenskin and dwarf fronts which is what i was talking about. Which is why they will get owned and it will be a shoot out and hardly any melee fighting at all, unless the runepriest wants to play wack a mole with goblin shamans and squig herders.
You can tell yourself that you are well informed about the game, and have "done your research" but the OP shows to anyone who has half a clue, that you dont know a damn thing about the current state of the game, or anything specific about it.
But thats ok, ignorance is alot easier, and less time consuming than learning about the topic you are talking about.
Tell me exactly what I'm wrong about, they are cutting out the major capital cities, am i right? They are cutting 4 classes, you agree? What am i wrong about?
Are you in Beta?
Hearing that 4 classes are being cut and 4 capital cities which were very much anticipated by a lot of people including myself, you don't need to be in beta to realize that there is something very wrong with that. But no I am not in beta. They gave us Podcasts to tell us what they were doing, so we get an overview of what is happening. The original plan was way better and not the one they are doing now. They have cut out essential classes and unbalanced the game and they force people to alter their playstyles and continue to pay for it. Nope. By the time they get all that in, IF THEY EVER, a better MMO will be out.
If you were in beta you'd be singing a different tune. The fact is you DO have to be in beta to know how much has changed, and you also are assuming in your OP that the game is rushed..... If you listen to anyone in beta, or read any review you'll know that they have all said that this is the most polished game they've seen pre-release.
If a game is the most polished game they've seen prerelease and there's still a month before launch, can you really say it's rushed and unfinished?
The fact is that you're missing things that were never there to begin with.
The beta testers never saw the other 4 cities, therefore they weren't there, they only briefly played 2 of the four missing classes and never played the other two, so 2 of the classes that are missing now were never there.
If you knew all of the things that got cut before release from single player games your head would spin. The fact is, you're complaining about something you've never seen, and arguing that something should be there based on zero facts, only conjecture based on what's drawn on paper.
We all know from AoC that things that seem like great ideas aren't necessarily great ones in practice.
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I live to fight, and fight to live.
as far as i'm concerned there are still 4 archtypes; 5 tanks, 5 mele, 6 ranged, 6 healers; yes they are not equal, that does not mean that the game is imbalanced, nor can you prove that that makes the game imbalanced
watever they tell you now, or told you before dosn't matter, nothing is permanent untill release, the game is not unfinished (read my prevous post), if this turns you off then don't buy the game, but don't QQ to them for making a game you don't like
you keep coming back and reposting things that people have already told you are wrong, thus said you are a troll and are spamming.....somone that the WAR communitly will be happy to get rid of
Are you serious, were you around for WoW's pre-release. Doesn't anyone remember WoWs pre-release. I feel like I am taking crazy pills! Does anyone else here remember what was "promised" to be in WoW? Those game breaking things they dropped that totally made the game a flop. I swear to god most of the people who post here have 5 minute attention spans.
Sent me an email if you want me to mail you some pizza rolls.
Hearing that 4 classes are being cut and 4 capital cities which were very much anticipated by a lot of people including myself, you don't need to be in beta to realize that there is something very wrong with that. But no I am not in beta. They gave us Podcasts to tell us what they were doing, so we get an overview of what is happening. The original plan was way better and not the one they are doing now. They have cut out essential classes and unbalanced the game and they force people to alter their playstyles and continue to pay for it. Nope. By the time they get all that in, IF THEY EVER, a better MMO will be out.
Sorry but you don't know that it won't be better the way it is now, if you haven't played with all of that in, you just can't. More isn't always better. Good lord.
Trust me, play it before you judge. There are plenty off classes to pick from right now. And plenty of areas for combat. You don't want to water things down by adding things that aren't needed just to have more.
Are you serious, were you around for WoW's pre-release. Doesn't anyone remember WoWs pre-release. I feel like I am taking crazy pills! Does anyone else here remember what was "promised" to be in WoW? Those game breaking things they dropped that totally made the game a flop. I swear to god most of the people who post here have 5 minute attention spans.
TBH... no... i never followed wow since i was never a fan of anything that blizzard made except for diablo... so i'm more or less talking about diablo, not wow... but did they promise things and not deliver? well yea... everyone does... they just have better record of not talking about it
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