One of my friends in Funcom told me about the methods they use to "fire" people:
It is very hard to fire people in Norway, or.. maybe not hard, but you need a proper reason. And since the bad management people in Funcom seldomly have proper reasons they harrass or spread lies about the ones they don't like until they leave. Or if they look upon them as a threat (like: they have many friends in the company, a good reputation or know stuff that can cause trouble for Funcom or they simply have opinions that dont fit that well with the management.) then they give them a nice package. It is hard to say no to such a package, because you understand when you get it that they don't want you there and you get an "easy" way out. Who wants to be somewhere where you are not wanted anyways?
BTW: CobraSolidus: You talk about people being disgrunteled, but I've never seen such a disgrunteled guy as you before. Congrats. You're obviously a big crap talker so I won't even bother replying to you.
Lieven: Where can I read the full story when it is done? Maybe you could make a blog somewhere? I'm sorry to hear what you've been through though, must have been pretty tough... You got in trouble with the very same Technical Director that interviewed me, and my first impression of him was'nt exactly OK. They should fire people like him, that cause trouble for the honest people in Funcom.
Not like it could get any worse, the game is closing down within the year anyway.
Want to bet?
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Not like it could get any worse, the game is closing down within the year anyway.
Nah, I don't think so. I hope that the people responsible for the things that have been unveiled to the public lately will be replaced, (looks like that process is atleast started, with Gaute fresh in mind.) because I know there are a lot of talented and great people in Funcom, and they do deserve better.
Not like it could get any worse, the game is closing down within the year anyway.
Want to bet? :)
I will bet yah $20 AoC is shut down by this time next year or the defunct Funcom sold it to another company.
How is a company with 300 employees (so they say) supposed to stay in business with a game that has at the most 40k subs (889 xfire users yesterday hahahaha!) with more leaving every week, in debt up to their ass, poor management, disgruntled employees. a game that is piss poor designed, etc etc. Hell......they cant even figure out how to transfer characters in a decent amount of time.
Everything about Funcom bleeds failure. Anyone who doesnt see the writing on the wall is blind.
I will bet yah $20 AoC is shut down by this time next year or the defunct Funcom sold it to another company. How is a company with 300 employees (so they say) supposed to stay in business with a game that has at the most 40k subs (889 xfire users yesterday hahahaha!) with more leaving every week, in debt up to their ass, poor management, disgruntled employees. a game that is piss poor designed, etc etc. Hell......they cant even figure out how to transfer characters in a decent amount of time. Everything about Funcom bleeds failure. Anyone who doesnt see the writing on the wall is blind.
People said the same thing about Anarchy Online, a game that now is actually profitable. Sure it took years to break even and it only has a few thousand active subscribers and no massive server lists, but it IS profitable. Age of Conan is too big and too high profile to be shut down, as long as a few thousand people will want to pay and play, it will break even and return a profit at some point.
My guess, and that's a guess, is that there are around 75 to 100k subscribers left and that is PLENTY. If they can maintain that for another 6 months, then the game will have paid for itself. Is AoC the success that Funcom wanted it to be? Probably not (though i don't know for sure as none of us know the real numbers). Will the server shut down in less than 12 months - i don't think so.
Funcom has a lot of history - one part of that history is to have the most horrific launch of an MMO (Anarchy Online) and turn the game around to be profitable. And one person associated with that was Craig - who is now in charge of AoC. That could bode well and i hope it does.
And to give a short version of my story: I guess I started as a promising employee, of which they had really high expectations. I myself was a bit over courageous as well, and I ended up with a task that was a bit too big for someone who didn't know their code yet, so I grosly underestimated the amount of time it was going to cost. After some time, they took me off the task, and my reputation got a big blow. Then for the rest of the time, the things I got to do weren't really that important, but I did them fine. The feedback I got from my direct lead was fine, but mr Pål the technical director felt like it was still needed to keep destroying my reputation even further. Of course I got worried about this, so talked with my direct lead about it, and she said that I shouldn't worry, as the rest of management know what that guy was like, and they didn't really take him serious anyway. Then there was this meeting, where I got offered 3 months of pay if I would resign. Which of couse sucked. Then I started looking for a new job, and after some interviews with a certain company, they offered me a position as lead. I didn't take it though, for obvious reasons, but I figured that it was kinda important to understand where it went wrong at funcom, as the dots didn't really seem to connect any more. So I first contacted my previous lead, and later kjetil the hr dude, but they were just acting like they were dealing with an annoying customer, which finally turned me into the disgruntled little ex employee I am now. The long version, which I'm currently writing is much more saucy, but I probably won't post it here anyway, as it may be a bit too personal on some stuff:).
My god are you for real? lol. Are you posting your lifes serenade on these forums? I am very happy to see that FC take people with low coding efficiency off the project. Do you really think FC (the evil monster) would on purpose (for personal reasons) take you of the project? NO, truth is if you were an excellent programmer you would have been promoted, but you were not so you got demoted. I see nothing wrong in this. And by the way, did you know that when you give a deadline for a project that thats actually supposed to match the date when you are done? You can get fired for less dude (in any industry). lol. Reading your posts and how FC professionally moved ahead through your performance issues I am very optimistic on their behalf.
Another thing, reading all your posts you almost come accross quite trollish. It's almost like I have read your posts somewhere else... Let me think about that one..
Because just getting a new job is so easy It might be very easy if you are willing to move to another country to develop games, but for those who have family that have job here and maybe kids too, just mooving to another country isn't something you do over night. Funcom is breaking the laws when people work overtime without getting paid, it's easy to say that is how the businiess is, but still they have to follow the laws.
You see what you say there is the crux of the whole situation. FC never asked anybody to go nutto and work all the time. If a worker love his work so much that he rather stay and do his work all the time, does not mean he should and even less can he expect FC to start paying overtime. Anyone noodling around in the office at evening time unless asked to are there purely on their own initiative. NO PAY !
Ow, believe me, they don't even ask you to work overtime, they politely force you to do it. And not just a bit, but a lot.
Do you mean as in they ask you ok mister project manager, whats the time required for project A, and then you sit down and say B after a while. However when some time passes and B start to creep up on you and you realize that you are fare behind your deadline. You damn right thats pressure, but it's the kind of pressure any project manager have to deal with. You are not supposed to be late. Did you know that? You see this whole thing about AoC patching that got delayed and delayed over the summer was not really acceptable. And I am glad FC obviously have started to do something about this. A project manager is responsible for his project!
Originally posted by ZeGerman1942 Originally posted by Hamrtime2
I will bet yah $20 AoC is shut down by this time next year or the defunct Funcom sold it to another company. How is a company with 300 employees (so they say) supposed to stay in business with a game that has at the most 40k subs (889 xfire users yesterday hahahaha!) with more leaving every week, in debt up to their ass, poor management, disgruntled employees. a game that is piss poor designed, etc etc. Hell......they cant even figure out how to transfer characters in a decent amount of time. Everything about Funcom bleeds failure. Anyone who doesnt see the writing on the wall is blind.
People said the same thing about Anarchy Online, a game that now is actually profitable. Sure it took years to break even and it only has a few thousand active subscribers and no massive server lists, but it IS profitable. Age of Conan is too big and too high profile to be shut down, as long as a few thousand people will want to pay and play, it will break even and return a profit at some point. My guess, and that's a guess, is that there are around 75 to 100k subscribers left and that is PLENTY. If they can maintain that for another 6 months, then the game will have paid for itself. Is AoC the success that Funcom wanted it to be? Probably not (though i don't know for sure as none of us know the real numbers). Will the server shut down in less than 12 months - i don't think so. Funcom has a lot of history - one part of that history is to have the most horrific launch of an MMO (Anarchy Online) and turn the game around to be profitable. And one person associated with that was Craig - who is now in charge of AoC. That could bode well and i hope it does.
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money.
Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value?
Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Do you mean as in they ask you ok mister project manager, whats the time required for project A, and then you sit down and say B after a while. However when some time passes and B start to creep up on you and you realize that you are fare behind your deadline. You damn right thats pressure, but it's the kind of pressure any project manager have to deal with. You are not supposed to be late. Did you know that? You see this whole thing about AoC patching that got delayed and delayed over the summer was not really acceptable. And I am glad FC obviously have started to do something about this. A project manager is responsible for his project!
Hmm, CobraSolidus = Pål?
You can stop being ignorant now and stop saying that anyone who mention anything bad about Funcom are lazy and stupid. It's not their fault it's been a long time since you got layed.
I think it's great that people who have been done wrong to like this give the ones responsible a hard time, it's not fair if they have to keep it all inside and just deal with it on their own, while the bad management people just keep on hurting more and more workers.
[quote][i]Originally posted by CobraSolidus[/i] [quote][i]Originally posted by Lieven[/i] My god are you for real? lol. Are you posting your lifes serenade on these forums? [color=#ff0000]I am very happy to see that FC take people with low coding efficiency off the project. Do you really think FC (the evil monster) would on purpose (for personal reasons) take you of the project? NO, truth is if you were an excellent programmer you would have been promoted, but you were not so you got demoted. I see nothing wrong in this. And by the way, did you know that when you give a deadline for a project that thats actually supposed to match the date when you are done? You can get fired for less dude (in any industry). lol. Reading your posts and how FC professionally moved ahead through your performance issues I am very optimistic on their behalf. Another thing, reading all your posts you almost come accross quite trollish. It's almost like I have read your posts somewhere else... Let me think about that one..
/[quote] So Cobra is in the business of bashing disgruntled ex-funcom employees...oh the shame. By looking at AoC is evident that they didnt.[/color]
It really is amazing to see a poster such as cobrasolidus in this thread, trying to hit an alltime low.
Cobrasolidus et al. have relentlessly told others that their opinions around AoC was worthless unless they had played within the last month or so.
Yet these same people, who have (apparently) absolutely no knowlegde of gamedevelopment, programming, computergfx design, sw project management and the work conditions within Funcom suddenly feel they haveto post their incredible (lack of) insight?
At least it seems Avery got the message instead of entering "cobrastupido-mode".
Thanks to the posters with some insight. I think a lot of us saw the blatant lack of direction in project management when the game was launched.
We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!! (repeat ad infinitum)
Originally posted by Halandir It really is amazing to see a poster such as cobrasolidus in this thread, trying to hit an alltime low. Cobrasolidus et al. have relentlessly told others that their opinions around AoC was worthless unless they had played within the last month or so. Yet these same people, who have (apparently) absolutely no knowlegde of gamedevelopment, programming, computergfx design, sw project management and the work conditions within Funcom suddenly feel they have to post their incredible (lack of) insight? At least it seems Avery got the message instead of entering "cobrastupido-mode". Thanks to the posters with some insight. I think a lot of us saw the blatant lack of direction in project management when the game was launched.
I should dig up the post cobra made around 5-6 weeks ago that said Funcom stock would go up because of the people returning to AoC...its gone down around 40% since then. LOL
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money. Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value? Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try. Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money.
Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value?
Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money. Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value? Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Well lets just agree to disagree here
You are basing your numbers on XFire and assumptions, and i base mine on other things and assumptions. Neither of us has the full information, so we are both guessing to some extent. But i would take your 20$ bet that AoC is still around at christmas next year
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money.
Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value?
Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
Better question imo would be why such animosity towards anyone that doesn't seem to agree with how FC does things?
I will point out , the debt is there. As well, Xfire is generaly used to gauge the popularity of a game, It seems many feel this is not permitted with AoC even though it is with other games. It's basicaly a survey in how it works. Not all players use Xfire which allows it to be a sample of the community.
Edited to add: Don't misconstrude this as me agreeing that AoC will tank soon. I actually think it will be around for years to come. As long as a game makes there money back, most companies will keep it around until the profit stops.
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money. Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value? Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try. Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
I think that question can be asked to anyone who paid $50 or $100 (like me) for an incomplete game that was masked by lies and deception. There are too many reasons really but the last straw was when I got banned for 1 week from the forums for asking a question about memory leaks and other bugs (I think thats what it was). After I tried to get on the forums and found out I was banned, I canceled my subscription and deleted AoC from my computer. I vowed never to return until someone else takes over AoC.
I was even a fanboi myself before the launch of AoC. I would stick up for Amazing Avery (aka Rev Jones) when he would defend AoC to other posters who said the game wasnt ready for launch and other things about AoC.
I have never lied about anything in any post about AoC. I just tell it like it is and fanbois of Funcom cant stand it. I have even said good things about AoC. For example: Ive said that I think Tortage is the best noob area and leveling of any mmo Ive ever played. Too bad the rest of the game sucks.
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money.
Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value?
Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
I think that question can be asked to anyone who paid $50 or $100 (like me) for an incomplete game that was masked by lies and deception. There are too many reasons really but the last straw was when I got banned for 1 week from the forums for asking a question about memory leaks and other bugs (I think thats what it was). After I tried to get on the forums and found out I was banned, I canceled my subscription and deleted AoC from my computer. I vowed never to return until someone else takes over AoC.
I have never lied about anything in any post about AoC. I just tell it like it is and fanbois of Funcom cant stand it. I have even said good things about AoC. For example: Ive said that I think Tortage is the best noob area and leveling of any mmo Ive ever played. Too bad the rest of the game sucks.
Never lied eh? But how can you know that everything you have said can be backed up by facts?
you post a serious amount of crap you never will be able to back up with facts, and until you can prove it it will be a lie no natter what you claim.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money.
Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value?
Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
Better question imo would be why such animosity towards anyone that doesn't seem to agree with how FC does things?
I will point out , the debt is there. As well, Xfire is generaly used to gauge the popularity of a game, It seems many feel this is not permitted with AoC even though it is with other games. It's basicaly a survey in how it works. Not all players use Xfire which allows it to be a sample of the community.
Edited to add: Don't misconstrude this as me agreeing that AoC will tank soon. I actually think it will be around for years to come. As long as a game makes there money back, most companies will keep it around until the profit stops.
Reason I ask him is simple, look at his post history you will see an quite large bunch of posts that are solely negative towards AoC or Funcom. He does seem to be a true hater towards the game and Funcom, and I am amazed how people can put that much time into hating a game and posting crap about it on the forums.
Xfire is as I have alweays said at best a way to measure the popularity of a game. Xfire will never give the true number of subscriber, any estimate by using xfire will be based around guessing at best. Xfire however does show the popularity of the game. a lot of the people seem to use Xfire as a "solid" proof of subscriber numbers it never will be, there is simply too many factors that you have to assume on.
I too think the game will last for many years, even with only 30k subscribers it is more worth for funcom to keep the game alive on few servers to generate money then destroy it. Sure it takes longer, but ti will cover the loss they would have had to take if they stopped the game.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Crashloop: If proof is what you want then just read the text on your Age of Conan case about DX10, massive siege battles, etc. It does not say it is PLANNED to be in there, it says it IS in the game. Or view some of the interviews with Erling Ellingsen.. The list goes on. How many times must people be shown proof to actually see it? Some people treat Funcom as if it they are the creators of their own delusional religion.
Originally posted by Crashloop Originally posted by Hamrtime2
Originally posted by Crashloop
Originally posted by Hamrtime2
Originally posted by zymurgeist Originally posted by Hamrtime2
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money. Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value? Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try. Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
I think that question can be asked to anyone who paid $50 or $100 (like me) for an incomplete game that was masked by lies and deception. There are too many reasons really but the last straw was when I got banned for 1 week from the forums for asking a question about memory leaks and other bugs (I think thats what it was). After I tried to get on the forums and found out I was banned, I canceled my subscription and deleted AoC from my computer. I vowed never to return until someone else takes over AoC. I have never lied about anything in any post about AoC. I just tell it like it is and fanbois of Funcom cant stand it. I have even said good things about AoC. For example: Ive said that I think Tortage is the best noob area and leveling of any mmo Ive ever played. Too bad the rest of the game sucks.
Never lied eh? But how can you know that everything you have said can be backed up by facts? you post a serious amount of crap you never will be able to back up with facts, and until you can prove it it will be a lie no natter what you claim.
No...I have NEVER lied about facts. Most of my posts are true to what is fact or of my own opinion. Look through my post history and show me 1 post where I have lied about Funcom like some other fanboi posters here have done. You wont be able to do it.
Crashloop: If proof is what you want then just read the text on your Age of Conan case about DX10, massive siege battles, etc. It does not say it is PLANNED to be in there, it says it IS in the game. Or view som of the interviews with Erling Ellingsen.. The list goes on. How many times must people be shown proof to actually see it? Some people treat Funcom as if it they are the creators of their own delusional religion.
I have the collectors edition so I don't have that written on my box, but accordingly to others it says enhanced for directx10. Massive siege battles was a joke, but that I assumed before I bought the game. I'm not blind to the fact that they promised a lot, but guess what so have most other MMO's I have seen done. And at launch half the features doesn't quite work at all, or they will ahve to be redone to improve them. If anyone thought siege battles would be awesome when they hadn't even tested them during beta other then internal testing, well then I want those people to raise their hands so I can sell them some Coca Cola bottles with oxygen in.
Constantly basing their opinion about the game on how it was at launch rather then how it is today is stupid, wait no it is retarded at best. Yes the game had huge flaws at launch, no doubts there, but hello you can't redo the past, it ain't frickin possible. Yes Funcom faled royally to live up to the hype they created, they fell and burned for it too. The tide however has turned lately the game has improved a lot, but people are still hung up in what the box says rather then how the game is today. But if people want to live in the past rather then move on I won't deny them that fact, but the 100% true fact is after Craig Morrison took over as GD the game has improved a ton. And it will continue to do so as long as Funcom releases the same quality patches we have seen lately.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Better question imo would be why such animosity towards anyone that doesn't seem to agree with how FC does things? I will point out , the debt is there. As well, Xfire is generaly used to gauge the popularity of a game, It seems many feel this is not permitted with AoC even though it is with other games. It's basicaly a survey in how it works. Not all players use Xfire which allows it to be a sample of the community. Edited to add: Don't misconstrude this as me agreeing that AoC will tank soon. I actually think it will be around for years to come. As long as a game makes there money back, most companies will keep it around until the profit stops.
We don't know how much actual debt Funcom has. Yet plenty of people post as if they do. We do know they secured at least 40 million in outside funding (there was a press release about it). We don't know how much if any of that has been re-paid yet.
Personally I get sick of X-fire related posts for any MMO. X-Fire does one thing.. it shows you how many people are using X-fire with a paticular MMO.
The problem is:
1) You don't know what percentage of any paticular MMO's playerbase uses X-fire
2) Since you don't know (1) you can't really guage how a game is doing subscriber wise.
Obviously AoC is not where it shouuld be or at least where I would think Funcom would want it to be. Yet people keep trying to claim a "total subscriber" base number based on X-fire.
People keep trying to claim that Anarchy Online is free to play and generates no income.
Yet totally ignore that "froob" accounts view "in game ads" and that the company behind those is paying Funcom a fee to show them. Which is why Funcom keeps the "froob" offer going.. because it makes them money.
We don't even know how much money it makes... but I see more companies adding this to various kinds of online products. So it must be generating a decent amount of income for other companies to be using this type of service.
You know what.. I spent over $100 to play this game too. It was somewhat like living the Anarchy Online launch over again.
Personally I had a lot of fun at this launch tho. It was the random changes after it went live.. that seemed to be made by someone with a blindfold and a dartboard that got me to quit. So to me the game wasn't trash but the leadership on the game was non existent or in a drug coma after launch.
Anyway this thread was about a different topic.. and I still don't know the answer to that. Personally I don't want this game to fail or go away. Oh and I don't even currently play it.. but it would be bad for the industry.
I guess the Funcom haters want to keep having WoW clones to choose from.. or wait till we get the WoW NGE because its to hard for the masses to learn.. and we can all play 2 iconic classes in every MMO. This is what the failing games of the industry inspire the "new games" to do.. so they don't fail.
Investors don't like losing money.
*clarity*
No I am not saying anyone should go play this game so it doesn't fail. I am saying as long as games keep not living up to investor expectations.... we are going to keep going down a path that supposedly no one here wants to go down. Investors don't post here.. they don't care what you or I want... and I'm fairly certain there isn't any MMO released since WoW.. that has made its investors happy.
Comments
One of my friends in Funcom told me about the methods they use to "fire" people:
It is very hard to fire people in Norway, or.. maybe not hard, but you need a proper reason. And since the bad management people in Funcom seldomly have proper reasons they harrass or spread lies about the ones they don't like until they leave. Or if they look upon them as a threat (like: they have many friends in the company, a good reputation or know stuff that can cause trouble for Funcom or they simply have opinions that dont fit that well with the management.) then they give them a nice package. It is hard to say no to such a package, because you understand when you get it that they don't want you there and you get an "easy" way out. Who wants to be somewhere where you are not wanted anyways?
BTW: CobraSolidus: You talk about people being disgrunteled, but I've never seen such a disgrunteled guy as you before. Congrats. You're obviously a big crap talker so I won't even bother replying to you.
Lieven: Where can I read the full story when it is done? Maybe you could make a blog somewhere?
I'm sorry to hear what you've been through though, must have been pretty tough... You got in trouble with the very same Technical Director that interviewed me, and my first impression of him was'nt exactly OK. They should fire people like him, that cause trouble for the honest people in Funcom.
Not like it could get any worse, the game is closing down within the year anyway.
Want to bet?
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Nah, I don't think so. I hope that the people responsible for the things that have been unveiled to the public lately will be replaced, (looks like that process is atleast started, with Gaute fresh in mind.) because I know there are a lot of talented and great people in Funcom, and they do deserve better.
I will bet yah $20 AoC is shut down by this time next year or the defunct Funcom sold it to another company.
How is a company with 300 employees (so they say) supposed to stay in business with a game that has at the most 40k subs (889 xfire users yesterday hahahaha!) with more leaving every week, in debt up to their ass, poor management, disgruntled employees. a game that is piss poor designed, etc etc. Hell......they cant even figure out how to transfer characters in a decent amount of time.
Everything about Funcom bleeds failure. Anyone who doesnt see the writing on the wall is blind.
People said the same thing about Anarchy Online, a game that now is actually profitable. Sure it took years to break even and it only has a few thousand active subscribers and no massive server lists, but it IS profitable. Age of Conan is too big and too high profile to be shut down, as long as a few thousand people will want to pay and play, it will break even and return a profit at some point.
My guess, and that's a guess, is that there are around 75 to 100k subscribers left and that is PLENTY. If they can maintain that for another 6 months, then the game will have paid for itself. Is AoC the success that Funcom wanted it to be? Probably not (though i don't know for sure as none of us know the real numbers). Will the server shut down in less than 12 months - i don't think so.
Funcom has a lot of history - one part of that history is to have the most horrific launch of an MMO (Anarchy Online) and turn the game around to be profitable. And one person associated with that was Craig - who is now in charge of AoC. That could bode well and i hope it does.
My god are you for real? lol. Are you posting your lifes serenade on these forums? I am very happy to see that FC take people with low coding efficiency off the project. Do you really think FC (the evil monster) would on purpose (for personal reasons) take you of the project? NO, truth is if you were an excellent programmer you would have been promoted, but you were not so you got demoted. I see nothing wrong in this. And by the way, did you know that when you give a deadline for a project that thats actually supposed to match the date when you are done? You can get fired for less dude (in any industry). lol. Reading your posts and how FC professionally moved ahead through your performance issues I am very optimistic on their behalf.
Another thing, reading all your posts you almost come accross quite trollish. It's almost like I have read your posts somewhere else... Let me think about that one..
You see what you say there is the crux of the whole situation. FC never asked anybody to go nutto and work all the time. If a worker love his work so much that he rather stay and do his work all the time, does not mean he should and even less can he expect FC to start paying overtime. Anyone noodling around in the office at evening time unless asked to are there purely on their own initiative. NO PAY !
Ow, believe me, they don't even ask you to work overtime, they politely force you to do it. And not just a bit, but a lot.
Do you mean as in they ask you ok mister project manager, whats the time required for project A, and then you sit down and say B after a while. However when some time passes and B start to creep up on you and you realize that you are fare behind your deadline. You damn right thats pressure, but it's the kind of pressure any project manager have to deal with. You are not supposed to be late. Did you know that? You see this whole thing about AoC patching that got delayed and delayed over the summer was not really acceptable. And I am glad FC obviously have started to do something about this. A project manager is responsible for his project!
People said the same thing about Anarchy Online, a game that now is actually profitable. Sure it took years to break even and it only has a few thousand active subscribers and no massive server lists, but it IS profitable. Age of Conan is too big and too high profile to be shut down, as long as a few thousand people will want to pay and play, it will break even and return a profit at some point.
My guess, and that's a guess, is that there are around 75 to 100k subscribers left and that is PLENTY. If they can maintain that for another 6 months, then the game will have paid for itself. Is AoC the success that Funcom wanted it to be? Probably not (though i don't know for sure as none of us know the real numbers). Will the server shut down in less than 12 months - i don't think so.
Funcom has a lot of history - one part of that history is to have the most horrific launch of an MMO (Anarchy Online) and turn the game around to be profitable. And one person associated with that was Craig - who is now in charge of AoC. That could bode well and i hope it does.
Funcom didnt have the debt they have now when they made AO. AO didnt cost 50 million to make either. AO is pretty much a f2p mmo so it doesnt make any money.
Im not sure where youre comin up with 75-100k subs but if you go by the xfire average, AoC has less than 40k subs with less every month. How do you think AoC will have paid for itself in 6 months? Even with 40k subs there is NO WAY Funcom can pay off its debt, pay payroll, and keep running the servers. There is simply no way. Why do you think their stock has lost 92% of its value?
Like Ive said before. When the hammer falls, Im gonna be the one here on mmorpg.com with the first "I told you so" thread.
Hmm, CobraSolidus = Pål?
You can stop being ignorant now and stop saying that anyone who mention anything bad about Funcom are lazy and stupid. It's not their fault it's been a long time since you got layed.
I think it's great that people who have been done wrong to like this give the ones responsible a hard time, it's not fair if they have to keep it all inside and just deal with it on their own, while the bad management people just keep on hurting more and more workers.
[quote][i]Originally posted by CobraSolidus[/i] [quote][i]Originally posted by Lieven[/i] My god are you for real? lol. Are you posting your lifes serenade on these forums? [color=#ff0000]I am very happy to see that FC take people with low coding efficiency off the project. Do you really think FC (the evil monster) would on purpose (for personal reasons) take you of the project? NO, truth is if you were an excellent programmer you would have been promoted, but you were not so you got demoted. I see nothing wrong in this. And by the way, did you know that when you give a deadline for a project that thats actually supposed to match the date when you are done? You can get fired for less dude (in any industry). lol. Reading your posts and how FC professionally moved ahead through your performance issues I am very optimistic on their behalf. Another thing, reading all your posts you almost come accross quite trollish. It's almost like I have read your posts somewhere else... Let me think about that one..
/[quote] So Cobra is in the business of bashing disgruntled ex-funcom employees...oh the shame. By looking at AoC is evident that they didnt.[/color]
It really is amazing to see a poster such as cobrasolidus in this thread, trying to hit an alltime low.
Cobrasolidus et al. have relentlessly told others that their opinions around AoC was worthless unless they had played within the last month or so.
Yet these same people, who have (apparently) absolutely no knowlegde of gamedevelopment, programming, computergfx design, sw project management and the work conditions within Funcom suddenly feel they have to post their incredible (lack of) insight?
At least it seems Avery got the message instead of entering "cobrastupido-mode".
Thanks to the posters with some insight. I think a lot of us saw the blatant lack of direction in project management when the game was launched.
We dont need casuals in our games!!! Errm... Well we DO need casuals to fund and populate our games - But the games should be all about "hardcore" because: We dont need casuals in our games!!!
(repeat ad infinitum)
I should dig up the post cobra made around 5-6 weeks ago that said Funcom stock would go up because of the people returning to AoC...its gone down around 40% since then. LOL
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Well lets just agree to disagree here
You are basing your numbers on XFire and assumptions, and i base mine on other things and assumptions. Neither of us has the full information, so we are both guessing to some extent. But i would take your 20$ bet that AoC is still around at christmas next year
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
Better question imo would be why such animosity towards anyone that doesn't seem to agree with how FC does things?
I will point out , the debt is there. As well, Xfire is generaly used to gauge the popularity of a game, It seems many feel this is not permitted with AoC even though it is with other games. It's basicaly a survey in how it works. Not all players use Xfire which allows it to be a sample of the community.
Edited to add: Don't misconstrude this as me agreeing that AoC will tank soon. I actually think it will be around for years to come. As long as a game makes there money back, most companies will keep it around until the profit stops.
I think that question can be asked to anyone who paid $50 or $100 (like me) for an incomplete game that was masked by lies and deception. There are too many reasons really but the last straw was when I got banned for 1 week from the forums for asking a question about memory leaks and other bugs (I think thats what it was). After I tried to get on the forums and found out I was banned, I canceled my subscription and deleted AoC from my computer. I vowed never to return until someone else takes over AoC.
I was even a fanboi myself before the launch of AoC. I would stick up for Amazing Avery (aka Rev Jones) when he would defend AoC to other posters who said the game wasnt ready for launch and other things about AoC.
I have never lied about anything in any post about AoC. I just tell it like it is and fanbois of Funcom cant stand it. I have even said good things about AoC. For example: Ive said that I think Tortage is the best noob area and leveling of any mmo Ive ever played. Too bad the rest of the game sucks.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
I think that question can be asked to anyone who paid $50 or $100 (like me) for an incomplete game that was masked by lies and deception. There are too many reasons really but the last straw was when I got banned for 1 week from the forums for asking a question about memory leaks and other bugs (I think thats what it was). After I tried to get on the forums and found out I was banned, I canceled my subscription and deleted AoC from my computer. I vowed never to return until someone else takes over AoC.
I have never lied about anything in any post about AoC. I just tell it like it is and fanbois of Funcom cant stand it. I have even said good things about AoC. For example: Ive said that I think Tortage is the best noob area and leveling of any mmo Ive ever played. Too bad the rest of the game sucks.
Never lied eh? But how can you know that everything you have said can be backed up by facts?
you post a serious amount of crap you never will be able to back up with facts, and until you can prove it it will be a lie no natter what you claim.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
Better question imo would be why such animosity towards anyone that doesn't seem to agree with how FC does things?
I will point out , the debt is there. As well, Xfire is generaly used to gauge the popularity of a game, It seems many feel this is not permitted with AoC even though it is with other games. It's basicaly a survey in how it works. Not all players use Xfire which allows it to be a sample of the community.
Edited to add: Don't misconstrude this as me agreeing that AoC will tank soon. I actually think it will be around for years to come. As long as a game makes there money back, most companies will keep it around until the profit stops.
Reason I ask him is simple, look at his post history you will see an quite large bunch of posts that are solely negative towards AoC or Funcom. He does seem to be a true hater towards the game and Funcom, and I am amazed how people can put that much time into hating a game and posting crap about it on the forums.
Xfire is as I have alweays said at best a way to measure the popularity of a game. Xfire will never give the true number of subscriber, any estimate by using xfire will be based around guessing at best. Xfire however does show the popularity of the game. a lot of the people seem to use Xfire as a "solid" proof of subscriber numbers it never will be, there is simply too many factors that you have to assume on.
I too think the game will last for many years, even with only 30k subscribers it is more worth for funcom to keep the game alive on few servers to generate money then destroy it. Sure it takes longer, but ti will cover the loss they would have had to take if they stopped the game.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Crashloop: If proof is what you want then just read the text on your Age of Conan case about DX10, massive siege battles, etc. It does not say it is PLANNED to be in there, it says it IS in the game. Or view some of the interviews with Erling Ellingsen.. The list goes on. How many times must people be shown proof to actually see it? Some people treat Funcom as if it they are the creators of their own delusional religion.
Another junior economist. AoC is not Funcom's only revenue stream. Xfire does not measure number of subscriptions paid. AoC was largely paid for by previous profits and the sale of stock.
Once agian another xfire hater when it doesnt suit them. I guess AoC is the exception to the norm when it comes to xfire numbers.....nice try.
Thats why they are in debt over 16m right? Nice try again though.
I find it interesting to see how much you hate funcom, is there any reason?
I think that question can be asked to anyone who paid $50 or $100 (like me) for an incomplete game that was masked by lies and deception. There are too many reasons really but the last straw was when I got banned for 1 week from the forums for asking a question about memory leaks and other bugs (I think thats what it was). After I tried to get on the forums and found out I was banned, I canceled my subscription and deleted AoC from my computer. I vowed never to return until someone else takes over AoC.
I have never lied about anything in any post about AoC. I just tell it like it is and fanbois of Funcom cant stand it. I have even said good things about AoC. For example: Ive said that I think Tortage is the best noob area and leveling of any mmo Ive ever played. Too bad the rest of the game sucks.
Never lied eh? But how can you know that everything you have said can be backed up by facts?
you post a serious amount of crap you never will be able to back up with facts, and until you can prove it it will be a lie no natter what you claim.
No...I have NEVER lied about facts. Most of my posts are true to what is fact or of my own opinion. Look through my post history and show me 1 post where I have lied about Funcom like some other fanboi posters here have done. You wont be able to do it.
I have the collectors edition so I don't have that written on my box, but accordingly to others it says enhanced for directx10. Massive siege battles was a joke, but that I assumed before I bought the game. I'm not blind to the fact that they promised a lot, but guess what so have most other MMO's I have seen done. And at launch half the features doesn't quite work at all, or they will ahve to be redone to improve them. If anyone thought siege battles would be awesome when they hadn't even tested them during beta other then internal testing, well then I want those people to raise their hands so I can sell them some Coca Cola bottles with oxygen in.
Constantly basing their opinion about the game on how it was at launch rather then how it is today is stupid, wait no it is retarded at best. Yes the game had huge flaws at launch, no doubts there, but hello you can't redo the past, it ain't frickin possible. Yes Funcom faled royally to live up to the hype they created, they fell and burned for it too. The tide however has turned lately the game has improved a lot, but people are still hung up in what the box says rather then how the game is today. But if people want to live in the past rather then move on I won't deny them that fact, but the 100% true fact is after Craig Morrison took over as GD the game has improved a ton. And it will continue to do so as long as Funcom releases the same quality patches we have seen lately.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
We don't know how much actual debt Funcom has. Yet plenty of people post as if they do. We do know they secured at least 40 million in outside funding (there was a press release about it). We don't know how much if any of that has been re-paid yet.
Personally I get sick of X-fire related posts for any MMO. X-Fire does one thing.. it shows you how many people are using X-fire with a paticular MMO.
The problem is:
1) You don't know what percentage of any paticular MMO's playerbase uses X-fire
2) Since you don't know (1) you can't really guage how a game is doing subscriber wise.
Obviously AoC is not where it shouuld be or at least where I would think Funcom would want it to be. Yet people keep trying to claim a "total subscriber" base number based on X-fire.
People keep trying to claim that Anarchy Online is free to play and generates no income.
Yet totally ignore that "froob" accounts view "in game ads" and that the company behind those is paying Funcom a fee to show them. Which is why Funcom keeps the "froob" offer going.. because it makes them money.
We don't even know how much money it makes... but I see more companies adding this to various kinds of online products. So it must be generating a decent amount of income for other companies to be using this type of service.
You know what.. I spent over $100 to play this game too. It was somewhat like living the Anarchy Online launch over again.
Personally I had a lot of fun at this launch tho. It was the random changes after it went live.. that seemed to be made by someone with a blindfold and a dartboard that got me to quit. So to me the game wasn't trash but the leadership on the game was non existent or in a drug coma after launch.
Anyway this thread was about a different topic.. and I still don't know the answer to that. Personally I don't want this game to fail or go away. Oh and I don't even currently play it.. but it would be bad for the industry.
I guess the Funcom haters want to keep having WoW clones to choose from.. or wait till we get the WoW NGE because its to hard for the masses to learn.. and we can all play 2 iconic classes in every MMO. This is what the failing games of the industry inspire the "new games" to do.. so they don't fail.
Investors don't like losing money.
*clarity*
No I am not saying anyone should go play this game so it doesn't fail. I am saying as long as games keep not living up to investor expectations.... we are going to keep going down a path that supposedly no one here wants to go down. Investors don't post here.. they don't care what you or I want... and I'm fairly certain there isn't any MMO released since WoW.. that has made its investors happy.