haha let me tell you and it alot of fluff thats not needed...for the price and in light that W7 is coming out
for what?
Home 64 is all you needed
Windows 7 is coming up and that all anyone will need
i have used vista since release and yea it has a lot of problems but all those tweeks can be done by yourself.
i think the real bonus of that would be the Dolby pack seeing if it has DDL but that being said you do you know running a DDL to A AV Reciver? ..i am that would have been nice. to bad its a day late.
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
I will also need to buy Windows Vista. How much does that cost?
Well the cost of Vista's going to very depending on where you buy it and which one you buy but from newegg.com:
Home Basic (you should really try to avoid this one) - 89.99
Home Premium - 99.99
Business - 139.99
Ultimate (has the most features and is the one I would recommend if you know what you're doing with it) - 179.99 (the 64 bit version is actually listed as a dollar cheaper for some reason...)
These prices are as of this post and are subject to change...
Also these are OEM versions which means you just get the CD and key, no pretty box.
Vista black....lol come on
first of all you can get Home 64 bit
you dont need black...its bloatware.
AND Windows 7 is coming in 2 to 7 month
its more stable than both XP and vista
Uses only 1 gig of ram and Supports the new DX10 and DX 11
DX9 is being phazed out as we speak
LOL you just admitted you dont even know what Vista Black edition is. From what I have read of your posts above, its all talk with a high and mighty attitude, but theres no real knowledge and or experience backing up your rants. AMD can and does compete quite well in the market as a matter of fact, furthermore, the best of the best is never needed for a hobby which is about constant upgrading over time. AMD holds up well, its priced much better and in the end are more efficient for gamers.
From what I have read of your posts above, its all talk with a high and mighty attitude, but theres no real knowledge and or experience backing up your rants. ????????
First of all the wall of text was long did i need to put it all in writing? When 5 minuts of google could do if for me.
And it takes 2....where is all your Facts to debate that im not giving out solid info.
What are you runing for a PC? what have you build in your life?
I know i have build both Setups and many more and have hands on Exp.
What are you bringing to the table...Flaming rants as well?
PS you said "Ultimate (has the most features and is the one I would recommend if you know what you're doing with it) - 179.99 (the 64 bit version is actually listed as a dollar cheaper for some reason...)" Not Vista Black....lol
when i said vista black i was thinking about Ultimate didnt even know there was a Black ed. so you just tryed to one up me with the wrong version...tisk tisk.
DID some looking to things and this is what i found. " Vista Black" is a Hack that can be downloaded not A MS product...
The Windows Vista Black Edition is a modified Vista distribution that is optimized for Gaming. It is not a valid, legal retail boxed version....lol man your funny
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
I think this rig would do quite nicely for online MMOs and such. Though I do see one weakness with this CPU, that being the Hard Drive. The new thing nowadays is the SSD RAID 0. SSD = Solid State Drive.
I'm not sure which SSD Brif would consider to swap for the factory Hard Drive. Maybe DreadKnot can shed some light on this topic?
I think this rig would do quite nicely for online MMOs and such. Though I do see one weakness with this CPU, that being the Hard Drive. The new thing nowadays is the SSD RAID 0. SSD = Solid State Drive. I'm not sure which SSD Brif would consider to swap for the factory Hard Drive. Maybe DreadKnot can shed some light on this topic?
its not bad for a pre built PC...one of the guys in my guild just got that model
Operating System Genuine Microsoft® Windows Vista® Home Premium (64-bit) with SP12
Good
Memory 6144MB 1066MHz DDR3 Three Channel Memory (3 x 2048MB Modules)10
Bad no name (most likely Kingston value ram) not sure tho
Chassis Premium Tower Desktop with Media Control Interface with a Stunning Jet-Black Finish and Copper Metallic Accents
Bad (pre build PC's are made to fit the OG parts hard to upgrade aftermarket Fans,New cards and what not....Who know what sort of wire managment is inside. Air flow is key.)
Video NVIDIA® GeForce® GTS 150 Graphics with 1GB DDR3 Discrete Video Memory (Ports 2x DVI-I, S-Video)11
Good (its ok but a few dollors more gets you a 260 ,280, 275, 285
Hard Drive 750GB 7200RPM SATA II hard drive5
Bad (if its not a WD)
Audio 8-Channel (7.1) HD Audio
Application Software Microsoft® Works 9.0, Microsoft® Money Essentials & Microsoft® Office Home and Student 2007 (60-daycomplimentary trial period)4
Digital Media Software Cyberlink® Power2 Go™, & Cyberlink® LabelPrint
Good
Power Supply 750W Power Supply
? dont know the Brand
Security Software Norton Internet Security 2009 (60-day trial)8
bad (bloatwear)
Warranty 1 Year Parts and Labor Limited Warranty with Toll-Free Tech Support12
Weight 31 lbs. (14.1 kg) system unit only / Approximately 37 lbs. (16.8 kg.) box
Good if you know nothing about computers
But if you look at the i7 Setup i built for him up in the posts he will get way more for a few dollors more.
but not bad if you dont want to spend alot or will not Learn to build your own.
Final note I would never buy a gateway or any other Consumer PC.
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
That's some lazy linking. First, on guru3d the 720BE beat the i7 920 in one game and TIED IT in all 5 other games when settings are turned up to normal. Tomshardware always benchmarks CPUs at the lowest graphics settings to see how the CPU alone performs. At HIGH graphics settings the GPU bottlenecks in all cases except for prohibitively expensive SLI setups. Furthermore the tomshardware.com links don't even have the Phenom II on it, you're comparing current gen Intel CPU's to last gen AMD there, worthless benchmarks. All of which make those charts useless.
Moving on to cpubenchmark.com (a pure CPU test - no gaming here), first we have the Phenom II x4 940 $190 handily beating the Intel Q9300 $240 (not including mobo, as Intel's mobo's are generally more expensive), of course it gets crushed by the $280 i7 920 (which was likely on a $350 mobo as well as the more expensive DDR3). This still proves nothing for games and only shows price disparity.
When talking GAME benchmarking, graphics settings turned up to what you would play at, the CPU speeds don't play a big factor. If for some reason you need the high cpu horsepower for something outside of games by all means buy a hefty Intel cpu.
Also I *tried* to put together an i7 920 system for his price range but when you add in the needed monitor, printer, speakers, Windows and then aim for a video card that would need the extra cpu power in an i7 920 - there was no way to make price. Try including everything he needs and your build is way out of his range not including shipping.
Try to keep your advice relevant to the budget and needs of the person asking. And don't assume anyone is looking for a flame war there's no reason we can't just discuss hardware. It sounds to me like you just enjoy spending money though.
Also as far as your preference for WD hard drives: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/2tb-hdd-caviar,2261-8.html Seagate's 7200 rpm drives beat out WD 7200 rpm hard drives in performance AND sound decibel level. Of course they are both very reliable and carry 5 year warranties and I actually would use either brand.
As far as CPUs go I'd avoid Intel right now. Firstly the Intel dual core processors are a good price and perform in current games well, however if you're plasnning on upgrading forget it. The LGA 775 socket is obsolete now, so if you wanted a new processor say next year you'd need a new motherboard as well as a new processor.
An i7? Well it's a new socket but is expensive, the CPU is costly and the motherboards will cost up to three times the price of an AMD motherboard. Added to this Intel are releasing a new socket this year for the i5 chip, so where are they going to take this socket? Is one going to be obsolete? Are they going to develop both alongside eachother? Either way I don't see this being a good thing.
AMD has had a rough time the last couple of years, this year I see them making a fresh forray into the market with the AM3 processor and AM3 socket motherboards. AMD motherboards have a superior chipset to Intel and are cheaper and less bloated.
AMD has just released the X4 955 BE a high end AM3 chip but still cheaper than an i7 and still outperforms it, with all AM3 chips being backwards compatible with AM2+ boards. I have gone with the X3 720 BE, at a mere £120 or $145 it provides all my processor needs and allows me to invest in a higher end GPU for gaming. If the processor is too slow for a game in the future it's a black edition with an unlocked multiplier and will overclock to 3.7ghz on a stock air cooler.
Intel has the fastest chip when running a single application as in a benchmark test, although due to its inferior architecture when multi tasking if fails and the AMD will be quicker. Even an X3 720 can defeat an i7 920 easily on some multi tasking benchmarks. As to gaming there would be no noticable difference between an i7 965 etreme and an X3 720 BE both with a top end GPU such as a 4850x2 0r a 4890 or 285. The only sizable difference you'd notice is about £/$1000 difference to your bank account!
I'm getting Vista myself until next year and any problems with the new windows, and there will be problems. Also another thing to remember is chicks dig AMD, intel has more turn offs than route 66 FACT!
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience"
From what I have read of your posts above, its all talk with a high and mighty attitude, but theres no real knowledge and or experience backing up your rants. ???????? First of all the wall of text was long did i need to put it all in writing? When 5 minuts of google could do if for me. And it takes 2....where is all your Facts to debate that im not giving out solid info. What are you runing for a PC? what have you build in your life? I know i have build both Setups and many more and have hands on Exp. What are you bringing to the table...Flaming rants as well? PS you said "Ultimate (has the most features and is the one I would recommend if you know what you're doing with it) - 179.99 (the 64 bit version is actually listed as a dollar cheaper for some reason...)" Not Vista Black....lol
when i said vista black i was thinking about Ultimate didnt even know there was a Black ed. so you just tryed to one up me with the wrong version...tisk tisk. DID some looking to things and this is what i found. " Vista Black" is a Hack that can be downloaded not A MS product... The Windows Vista Black Edition is a modified Vista distribution that is optimized for Gaming. It is not a valid, legal retail boxed version....lol man your funny
Are you on drugs or something? (thats not an insult, i really want to know given the manner of your responses) Where did I try to "one up" you, whatever that means given the context? Vista Black Edition is a modified OS that operates better, i could care less if it was "official" or not. I already stated it was different, fact is you mocked me for mentioning it because you thought it was something else...while at the same time going on about how much more knowledgeable you are than everyone else. Just admit it, you are a google warrior. Given your statements towards others and the given topic in this thread, its fairly clear you are not as computer saavy as you want people to think. Generally it helps to think before you comment. Btw, you might have missed it but I did provide a link to information on Vista Black. Kinda funny you overlooked that. I suppose the "lol man your funny" comment doesnt make sense either, in a manner of speaking the jokes on you.
Essentially we are giving the OP advice, having google warriors come in and belittle other posters in order to sound more tech saavy is kind of fruitless in my opinion.
I totally agree on the AMD processor, and I really love Intel processors.
The new Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition is an amazing chip for the price. Clock for clock it's as fast if not faster than the Q9550, and it can hit 4.4 GHZ on air. Also, you can get better motherboards for cheaper...
As for i7, there's almost no advantage for gaming. Server apps and encoding sure thing, but dollar per FPS it's a total waste of money for gaming, use the $$ on the GPU or a new monitor.
As for GPUs, the ATI 4870 1GB or GTX 260 is what you should have your eyes on. If you want to spend more, get 2 of them of a 4870x2, because those cards are the best bang for your buck.
From what I have read of your posts above, its all talk with a high and mighty attitude, but theres no real knowledge and or experience backing up your rants. ???????? First of all the wall of text was long did i need to put it all in writing? When 5 minuts of google could do if for me. And it takes 2....where is all your Facts to debate that im not giving out solid info. What are you runing for a PC? what have you build in your life? I know i have build both Setups and many more and have hands on Exp. What are you bringing to the table...Flaming rants as well? PS you said "Ultimate (has the most features and is the one I would recommend if you know what you're doing with it) - 179.99 (the 64 bit version is actually listed as a dollar cheaper for some reason...)" Not Vista Black....lol
when i said vista black i was thinking about Ultimate didnt even know there was a Black ed. so you just tryed to one up me with the wrong version...tisk tisk. DID some looking to things and this is what i found. " Vista Black" is a Hack that can be downloaded not A MS product... The Windows Vista Black Edition is a modified Vista distribution that is optimized for Gaming. It is not a valid, legal retail boxed version....lol man your funny
Are you on drugs or something? (thats not an insult, i really want to know given the manner of your responses) Where did I try to "one up" you, whatever that means given the context? Vista Black Edition is a modified OS that operates better, i could care less if it was "official" or not. I already stated it was different, fact is you mocked me for mentioning it because you thought it was something else...while at the same time going on about how much more knowledgeable you are than everyone else. Just admit it, you are a google warrior. Given your statements towards others and the given topic in this thread, its fairly clear you are not as computer saavy as you want people to think. Generally it helps to think before you comment. Btw, you might have missed it but I did provide a link to information on Vista Black. Kinda funny you overlooked that. I suppose the "lol man your funny" comment doesnt make sense either, in a manner of speaking the jokes on you.
Essentially we are giving the OP advice, having google warriors come in and belittle other posters in order to sound more tech saavy is kind of fruitless in my opinion.
i think its you that is smoking the pipe? back track much? i commented on the fact you recomended "Vista Ultimate"......then I laughed at you . Then pop up with "Vista Black" as your proof to state that Vista Ultimate was better, using a Modified OS full Bloat pre installed drivers and a few bells. to make Vista Ultimate look better???????????? Yea if you got Ultimate and then downloaded the "HACK" it could be better. But thats not what you were OG talking about. For the cost of Vista Ultimate right now its not worth recomending that OS to anyone right now or ever for that matter.
And for a google warrior? once agian "clueless" im sitting in a computer room full of PC's and Parts that i build weekly....
you still havent let us know your back ground, or your PC's you run... to back up your claims.
And everything that you have Stated in this thread has come from a google as well.....what is wrong with you.
PS and on top of it you found the wrong OS to post .
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
That's some lazy linking. First, on guru3d the 720BE beat the i7 920 in one game and TIED IT in all 5 other games when settings are turned up to normal. Tomshardware always benchmarks CPUs at the lowest graphics settings to see how the CPU alone performs. At HIGH graphics settings the GPU bottlenecks in all cases except for prohibitively expensive SLI setups. Furthermore the tomshardware.com links don't even have the Phenom II on it, you're comparing current gen Intel CPU's to last gen AMD there, worthless benchmarks. All of which make those charts useless.
Moving on to cpubenchmark.com (a pure CPU test - no gaming here), first we have the Phenom II x4 940 $190 handily beating the Intel Q9300 $240 (not including mobo, as Intel's mobo's are generally more expensive), of course it gets crushed by the $280 i7 920 (which was likely on a $350 mobo as well as the more expensive DDR3). This still proves nothing for games and only shows price disparity.
When talking GAME benchmarking, graphics settings turned up to what you would play at, the CPU speeds don't play a big factor. If for some reason you need the high cpu horsepower for something outside of games by all means buy a hefty Intel cpu.
Also I *tried* to put together an i7 920 system for his price range but when you add in the needed monitor, printer, speakers, Windows and then aim for a video card that would need the extra cpu power in an i7 920 - there was no way to make price. Try including everything he needs and your build is way out of his range not including shipping.
Try to keep your advice relevant to the budget and needs of the person asking. And don't assume anyone is looking for a flame war there's no reason we can't just discuss hardware. It sounds to me like you just enjoy spending money though.
Also as far as your preference for WD hard drives:
Seagate's 7200 rpm drives beat out WD 7200 rpm hard drives in performance AND sound decibel level. Of course they are both very reliable and carry 5 year warranties and I actually would use either brand.
first of all i priced out 2 PC's low end and high you only commented on the i7. Low end under 1k without the input devices. that putting him around 1.3k. and Stated IF HE had a liitle beit more he could go with the high end......... That would b e a better futture proof setup with more nuts.
To the others topics....
Almost no Benchmark program can realy define how a CPU or GPU can perform of the Spetrum of APPs and Games.
What one do you go by then.?
And the statement that games dont need CPU? wow.. yea they do.. Some games are more geared to CPU prosessing than GPU....... I beleave COD series Fallout 3 are a few.
Windows and then aim for a video card that would need the extra cpu power in an i7 920?
why would you buy GPU that just match your CPU at the moment? so 3 months from now he wants to go Sli... and not have the Power he needs to free up a bottleneck? and rebuy a new CPU.?
At HIGH graphics settings the GPU bottlenecks in all cases except for prohibitively expensive SLI setups? wrong....
My GTX 280's in SLI were bottlenecked, i got them 3 days after they came out. i had my CPU at stock. Ran Vantage. low score
OC'ed my CPU. I dont remeber the CPU AND GPU's scores but i know my GPU score doubled to an over all 5000 points ,to a 24500 score. (at the time only one PC was higher @ 25000)
so from my Q9450 @ 2.6 to OC @ 3.6 freed up the bottle neck.
And no offence , but what card Do you have that needed to be un -bottlenecked? i have had 4 so far....(2 GTX 280 1 GTX 295 and 1 GTX 285.)
When talking GAME benchmarking, graphics settings turned up to what you would play at, the CPU speeds don't play a big factor. If for some reason you need the high cpu horsepower for something outside of games by all means buy a hefty Intel cpu.....
with this statement your saying Buy a PC dedicated to just one App? lol So if you decide down the line do do anything else than gaming to need to upgrade or rebuild?....and thats cost effective?
you buy a year ahead if your on a buget for a PC. You dont buy on par or less than the market is going......that is the same in most Products......that like spending money on a DVD collection when everthing is flipping to Blue ray.
You give it a little room so you can grow with it. Most gamers will upgrage at least 2 times a year. i know this.. 80% of my clan does (every few months someone is buying something new)
I understand that Benchmarks are right and wrong and also Bias and unbias.. i posted just the first few i came across to prove a point that i can post crap too. if you read back you Will see.
there was a 2009 CPU gaming Benchmark that was for gaming, and for the life of me i can find it....but the point is unless you are actually sitting if front of the Tech, or have used it...in cannot Say what is better...We should all know by now what Hype is.
On the other note When was the last Intel CPU you have useded? And compaired yourself what is faster and better for games?
I have 2 AMD's sitting in my room and 2 Intel's. And Intel stomps them out. I use programs like Adobe CS 3/4 and i have this instaled right now. Battlefield 2, Project Reality, COD 5, Age Of Conan, WOW, Lord of the rings on-line, DDO, Crysis, Far Cry 2, Fallout 3 Insurgency, Red Orchestra, Grid, And Brothers and Arms.......A full list of past and present.
Now you keep bringing up "IN Games"
what are you running to back up those claims? I can run all of this Full max And my GPU Maxed. Unless you are running games like this. and have had to Driver tweak, OC.... everything in your System and still make it Stable. if you haven't even done a min of this. What makes you think that you really know what a chip can do? Reading an AD? a benchmark? (90% of them are Full of shit)
Also it comes down to..... Yes every chip that comes out has pros and cons. Every chip can "one up" the later. But when you buy Chip you look performance, reliability , and company, Much like you would, if you were shopping for a car.
For example GM motors Could be going out of business.(I Know Crazy... Bankrupt?)....IF that happens and even that it hasn't happened. NO one is buying a GM made Car...Why? Why would you buy a car that may not have support. Parts,Labor.etc.
And after reading alittle about the state of AMD and chips.. Even AMD and fans are Stating that "Hopefully this "black" will get AMD on track. "This Chip Can Stand up to Intel." look at how its worded. Sounds like they have been in the Shadow of Intel. Play it like it is... the Mayor of Green boat VA. last night in an interview, Stated. "Hopefully the New Corvette will get GM back on track, and get people buying GM."
Well im not saying that AMD is going out of Business. But they are not a safe bet. And if G fuck-in M can kick the bucket then i wouldn't hold out for AMD to ever keep up, or stay on top of Intel....Flat out.
even Most AMD Fans know this.
But right now every where you look Intel is the most reviewed. Rated and Fastest gaming rigs on the planet. And even know that it could be marketing or people following the trend. the Safe bet is all ways where the money is.
And quit with the Price shit.. the i7 . is $100 more than "Black". This is PC gaming, if your crying over $100... I see an xbox in someones future.
Read this Review and Benchmark.....it States all your conerns about giming and no gaming Benchmark tools...
you will noitce At the "put it together " Part that you can build both Setups for under 1000.. that meaning you will have to buy the very best that ATI & AMD has to offer to get a ATI & AMD Setup to Match A i7 & Nvidia Setup. (Give or take)
So once agian AMD fans Are useing lower value Parts with low prices covering up for thet fact that AMD has the Same prices at the high end..... that are A little lower than Intel High end. and i didnt get this from the artical....it just another sample.
And you can see by the Site , they Review more AMD Chips with good ratings than Intel...SO no Bias here.
Also from what I know most AMD chips untill the "Black" NO DDR3 support...I could be wrong.... but comparing 454 Big block with flat tires, to a Vortech 6000 on racing slicks.......?
but I don't have the "Black" chip. But i know my AMD MB doesn't take DDR 3.
I priced this guy one of the Fastest PC's on the plant for in his budget range .so what are you all talking about.?!
I know its a fact , first hand. I'M sitting in the step before it as I'm writing. less than a year ago..I was running that fast shit for gaming. now its a few steps back
Quad Core Q9450 overclocked @3.6 ...............................................upgrading to i7 920 OC @ 4.0 air: when its back on sale for $220
Zalman 9700 CPU cooler
EVGA 790i ultra ....................................................................................going with EVGA x58 the fast MB on the planet.
Munchkin DDR3 4gigs 1600 7.7.6:18 T ..............................................going 6gig tripple channel 1800h DDR3......will be nice over kill for Windows 7 that uses 1gig.
EVGA GTX 295 Overclocked @ 690/ 1468/ 1166 .............................going sli 285's ....going tri if the new series are $500+ agian
WD Raptor X 150gig X2 Raid 0 ..............................................................adding 2 More
Corsiar h1000watt PSU
Smasung 26 inch LCD syncmaster 1900x1200 ,........................................Matorx Tripplehead2go....google it oh yea!
Wacom Cintq 21 inch digtal art monitor
logitech G15 keayboard
logitech MX laser mouse
logitech 5.1suround
Simply Put Listen to somone that Plays the games you want to play ,and someone that runs the systems that you are thing about running... Not Exp review readers....
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
Intel > Amd plain and simple and prices are great. Having a $300 dollar videocard means nothing if you don't have a highly overclocked cpu.
You dont need to over clock your CPU, INTEL or AMD. In fact, I never recomend overclocking, its not even necessary any more since CPUs are much faster and cheaper. Overclocking can cause damages you dont want, and you have to make sure both your case, cooling system, and all are going to keep it at a safe temp.
"Having a $300 dollar videocard means nothing if you don't have a highly overclocked cpu." Is a false statement. A GPU will run fine regardless, and in fact is not reliant on a OCed cpu in this day and age. Furthermore, considering the rate at which PC gamers tend to upgrade and use their rigs, AMD is the best CPU. Its mobos and cpus are cheaper and over all more efficient.
Yes i agree that a system will run fine with a stock cpu, but there is up to %40 of performance sitting untapped.
You really need to do some research on overclocking. Its the quickest and easy way to add fps performance. As far as AMD being better you need to read alittle more. AMD has been years behind Intel since 2006, especially with the i series now.
Just about every highend Graphics card is bottlenecked by the CPU.
Have you even done any 3dmark or game benchmarking?? Obviously not.
For example: Intel Q6600 at stock 2.4ghz with a 9800gtx stock scores around 10.5k on 3dmark06.
Intel Q6600 at 3.0ghz 9800gtx stock scores around 13k.
Thats a %25 increase in performance with very little effort. With a cheap aftermarket CPU cooler the cpu still stays under 50c full load. (Q6600s regularly hit 3.6ghz with little effort)
Yes, 3dmark06 scores the CPU seperately, but looking at the GPU score it jumps %20 aswell and frames overall are 15-20% higher aswell.
AMD or Intel, overclocking adds FPS on ANY!! setup. Its a no brainer, overclock your cpu even if its a just 10% OC. Overclock your GPU aswell. People worry about shortening the lifetime of your components when overclocking, its means nothing anyways since most to all people replace their PC within 5-6 years.
As far as CPUs go I'd avoid Intel right now. Firstly the Intel dual core processors are a good price and perform in current games well, however if you're plasnning on upgrading forget it. The LGA 775 socket is obsolete now, so if you wanted a new processor say next year you'd need a new motherboard as well as a new processor. An i7? Well it's a new socket but is expensive, the CPU is costly and the motherboards will cost up to three times the price of an AMD motherboard. Added to this Intel are releasing a new socket this year for the i5 chip, so where are they going to take this socket? Is one going to be obsolete? Are they going to develop both alongside eachother? Either way I don't see this being a good thing. AMD has had a rough time the last couple of years, this year I see them making a fresh forray into the market with the AM3 processor and AM3 socket motherboards. AMD motherboards have a superior chipset to Intel and are cheaper and less bloated. AMD has just released the X4 955 BE a high end AM3 chip but still cheaper than an i7 and still outperforms it, with all AM3 chips being backwards compatible with AM2+ boards. I have gone with the X3 720 BE, at a mere £120 or $145 it provides all my processor needs and allows me to invest in a higher end GPU for gaming. If the processor is too slow for a game in the future it's a black edition with an unlocked multiplier and will overclock to 3.7ghz on a stock air cooler. Intel has the fastest chip when running a single application as in a benchmark test, although due to its inferior architecture when multi tasking if fails and the AMD will be quicker. Even an X3 720 can defeat an i7 920 easily on some multi tasking benchmarks. As to gaming there would be no noticable difference between an i7 965 etreme and an X3 720 BE both with a top end GPU such as a 4850x2 0r a 4890 or 285. The only sizable difference you'd notice is about £/$1000 difference to your bank account! I'm getting Vista myself until next year and any problems with the new windows, and there will be problems. Also another thing to remember is chicks dig AMD, intel has more turn offs than route 66 FACT!
As far as CPUs go I'd avoid Intel right now. Firstly the Intel dual core processors are a good price and perform in current games well, however if you're plasnning on upgrading forget it. The LGA 775 socket is obsolete now, so if you wanted a new processor say next year you'd need a new motherboard as well as a new processor.
REPLY- You have clearly smoked yourself retarted!!! Today you can still purchase a P4 system. So your guess at the LGA 775 socket is obsolete now is simlply wrong!
Now can you tell me how old that shit is..They still sell AGP slot cards for Muck sake!
An i7? Well it's a new socket but is expensive, the CPU is costly and the motherboards will cost up to three times the price of an AMD motherboard.
REPLY- Dont compair the bottom of the line AMD MB to the X58 board because thats the only way your going to find 3 to 1 price ratio
Added to this Intel are releasing a new socket this year for the i5 chip, so where are they going to take this socket? Is one going to be obsolete? Either way I don't see this being a good thing.
REPLY- NO!..Both chips will be sold... And I don't think you can see anything with those blinders on!
AMD motherboards have a superior chipset to Intel and are cheaper and less bloated.
REPLY- Maybe with a single card it might be superior, but when it comes to SLI and TRI -SLI your chipset dosn't have a leg to stand on!
I dont use the bloatware you speek of.....Reva Tuner is all you need.
AMD has just released the X4 955 BE a high end AM3 chip but still cheaper than an i7 and still outperforms it, with all AM3 chips being backwards compatible with AM2+ boards. I have gone with the X3 720 BE, at a mere £120 or $145 it provides all my processor needs and allows me to invest in a higher end GPU for gaming. If the processor is too slow for a game in the future it's a black edition with an unlocked multiplier and will overclock to 3.7ghz on a stock air cooler
REPLY- It's being compaired to the Q9550 lol..And the Q9650 will kick the shit out of it....
Intel has the fastest chip when running a single application as in a benchmark test, although due to its inferior architecture when multi tasking if fails and the AMD will be quicker. Even an X3 720 can defeat an i7 920 easily on some multi tasking benchmarks. As to gaming there would be no noticable difference between an i7 965 etreme and an X3 720 BE both with a top end GPU such as a 4850x2 0r a 4890 or 285. The only sizable difference you'd notice is about £/$1000 difference to your bank account!
REPLY- This is why people OC the cheaper hardware....So your statments above mean nothing!
I'm getting Vista myself until next year and any problems with the new windows, and there will be problems. Also another thing to remember is chicks dig AMD, intel has more turn offs than route 66 FACT!
REPLY- Yep...Im more than sure that your going to have problems...and chicks could care less what computer your running. Try not to use the word "FACT" in your post because your not fooling anyone!
Intel > Amd plain and simple and prices are great. Having a $300 dollar videocard means nothing if you don't have a highly overclocked cpu.
You dont need to over clock your CPU, INTEL or AMD. In fact, I never recomend overclocking, its not even necessary any more since CPUs are much faster and cheaper. Overclocking can cause damages you dont want, and you have to make sure both your case, cooling system, and all are going to keep it at a safe temp.
"Having a $300 dollar videocard means nothing if you don't have a highly overclocked cpu." Is a false statement. A GPU will run fine regardless, and in fact is not reliant on a OCed cpu in this day and age. Furthermore, considering the rate at which PC gamers tend to upgrade and use their rigs, AMD is the best CPU. Its mobos and cpus are cheaper and over all more efficient.
Yes i agree that a system will run fine with a stock cpu, but there is up to %40 of performance sitting untapped.
You really need to do some research on overclocking. Its the quickest and easy way to add fps performance. As far as AMD being better you need to read alittle more. AMD has been years behind Intel since 2006, especially with the i series now.
Just about every highend Graphics card is bottlenecked by the CPU.
Have you even done any 3dmark or game benchmarking?? Obviously not.
For example: Intel Q6600 at stock 2.4ghz with a 9800gtx stock scores around 10.5k on 3dmark06.
Intel Q6600 at 3.0ghz 9800gtx stock scores around 13k.
Thats a %25 increase in performance with very little effort. With a cheap aftermarket CPU cooler the cpu still stays under 50c full load. (Q6600s regularly hit 3.6ghz with little effort)
Yes, 3dmark06 scores the CPU seperately, but looking at the GPU score it jumps %20 aswell and frames overall are 15-20% higher aswell.
AMD or Intel, overclocking adds FPS on ANY!! setup. Its a no brainer, overclock your cpu even if its a just 10% OC. Overclock your GPU aswell. People worry about shortening the lifetime of your components when overclocking, its means nothing anyways since most to all people replace their PC within 5-6 years.
Im running this...And I built this rig 13+ months ago....to play games and some internet use and that's it! (keeps the processes down to a min)
EVGA 780i
INTEL e8400 @ 4.05 GHz (would of been the e8500 or e8600 but they wernt out yet)
2-EVGA 9800 GTX + (SLI) 804/1702/2249 clocks
patriot DDR2 1200 @ 1150 MHz 5-5-5-12
Antec 900 case (would of purchased the 1200 but they were't out yet)
Ac Freezer 7 pro CPU cooler ( CPU has never seen 55 degrees c )
OCZ 1000w PSU
2 -WD 160 GIG 7200 sata 3.0 16mb cashe drives in raid (0)
Maxtor 250 gig storage drive
Pioneer dvd / burner
upgraded 3 months ago:
Matrox TH2go and 3 Sceptre 20.2 displays @ 1680 x 1050 native rez. ( 3x 1680 x1050 gives you an overall 5040 x 1050 across 3 screens)
This system has been as soild as they come!
Now.. the games I play with this setup, with an avg. 60 frames or better..
at max settings...
BF2- 60 to 80 fps
Project reality ( a BF2 mod) 60 to 80 fps
AIX (Bf2 mod) 70 to 90 fps
POE2 80 to 100 fps
BF 2142 70 to 90 fps
HL2 80-90 fps
HL-2 MOD..insurgency 90 to 100 fps
Red orchestra 80 fps
Cod 4 60 to 80 fps
COD WAW 60 fps some times dips in the 50's
Med to high settings 60 fps or better:
Burnout Paradice City Ulti box 60 to 70 fps
Fallout 3- 60 fps
Fronlines 70 to 80 fps
NFS carbon 60 to 70 fps
med setting @ 60 fps or better
Wanted. wepons of fate 60 fps and dips a times
hawx 60 to 70 fps
Farcry 2 playable across 3 screens@ med settings
Crysis playable across 3 screens at med settings
These are real world numbers and you will not find them on any serch engines!
My next upgrade will be a Q9650 when needed (and will OC the hell out of it,) with games that support Qcore. Maybe 2- 285's when the price drops or 2- 300 series cards if the price is right. But I don't see DX 11 being used anytime soon! Or I might get the 3rd 9800GTX ($104.00) Who knows, but I have many options.
As for MMO's this system will play them all other that maybe AOC @ 60 fps or better.
As you can see...It is very important for me to overclock and if I didn't.. half of them games would be unplayable at that rez...!
Intel Q6600 at 3.0ghz 9800gtx stock scores around 13k.
REPLY- That sounds about right...My clocks (CPU and GPU) I got 16.0k on one card, and 22.0k on 2 9800 gtx's.with 177.xx drivers.
Originally posted by Brif I built this here for about $1600, I would like to spend a little less, but whatever. I don't know much about computer parts so give me advice on what I should add, remove, or change. Case - Red PSI ArmorX Gaming Tower Case Power Supply - 800 Watt Power Supply - Quad SLI Ready CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Processor (4x 2.66GHz/8MB L3 Cache) Processor Cooling - Certified CPU Fan and Heatsink Motherboard - Asus P6T Intel X58 Chipset CrossFire and SLI Supported w/7.1 Sound, Triple-Channel DDR3, Gb LAN, S-ATA Raid, USB 2.0, 3-Way SLI PCI-E MB 3-Way SLI RAM - 12 GB [2 GB X6] DDR3-1600 Triple Memory Module Video Card - NVIDIA GeForce 9800GTX+ 1GB Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache] DVD Drive - 16x DVD-ROM Drive CD-RW/DVD-RW Drive - [5X Blu-Ray] Sony Optiarc BC-5100S BLU-RAY Reader & DVD±R/±RW Burner Combo Drive Sound Card - 3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard Network Card - Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100) Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers Flash Media Reader/Writer - 12-In-1 Internal Flash Media Card Reader/Writer Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
First you should either get the 750W or 850W Corsair TX PSU on there - they don't say what brand the 800W generic one is which isn't a great sign.
6GB is the sweet spot for an i7 system. 12GB is not really necessary, you can save $150 right there.
The i7 920 is kinda going to waste unless you SLI the 9800GTX+ or get a 285 GTX. If you are planning to get a Geforce 300 series at the end of the year then that setup is fine until then. ibuypower.com seems to realy overcharge on their video cards though so if you want to SLI the 9800GTX+ you should order the PC with just 1 then order another 9800GTX+ from Newegg with the cash you saved on the ram.
Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache]
DVD Drive - 16x DVD-ROM Drive
CD-RW/DVD-RW Drive - [5X Blu-Ray] Sony Optiarc BC-5100S BLU-RAY Reader & DVD±R/±RW Burner Combo Drive
Sound Card - 3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard
Network Card - Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100)
Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers
Flash Media Reader/Writer - 12-In-1 Internal Flash Media Card Reader/Writer
Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
First you should either get the 750W or 850W Corsair TX PSU on there - they don't say what brand the 800W generic one is which isn't a great sign.
6GB is the sweet spot for an i7 system. 12GB is not really necessary, you can save $150 right there.
The i7 920 is kinda going to waste unless you SLI the 9800GTX+ or get a 285 GTX. If you are planning to get a Geforce 300 series at the end of the year then that setup is fine until then. ibuypower.com seems to realy overcharge on their video cards though so if you want to SLI the 9800GTX+ you should order the PC with just 1 then order another 9800GTX+ from Newegg with the cash you saved on the ram.
What he said!!! Try the 800w psu with the 2 cards...If it fails send it back...you should be ok tho. You only need 6 gigs of ram! If you can get the 512 meg 9800 GTX+ with the box....Do so. @ 1680 x 1050 (22") i was getting any where from 160 fps and up in COD WAW @ max settings....Overclocked on both cards. @ stock settings you should ge about 130-140 fps.
Originally posted by Brif So is this better? Power Supply - 750 Watt -- Corsair CMPSU-750TX Power Supply Quad SLI Ready CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Processor (4x 2.66GHz/8MB L3 Cache) Motherboard - Asus P6T Intel X58 Chipset CrossFire and SLI Supported w/7.1 Sound, Triple-Channel DDR3, Gb LAN, S-ATA Raid, USB 2.0, 3-Way SLI PCI-E MB 3-Way SLI RAM - 6 GB [2 GB X3] DDR3-1333 Triple Memory Module Video Card - 2x NVIDIA GeForce 9800GTX+ 1GB Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache] Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
Yes that looks good. Although you can save another 30 or 40 bucks by putting in the 2nd video card yourself which is a very easy task - but if you feel you want it preinstalled it's not an issue.
Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache]
Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers
Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
Yes that looks good. Although you can save another 30 or 40 bucks by putting in the 2nd video card yourself which is a very easy task - but if you feel you want it preinstalled it's not an issue.
I'm going to buy the 2nd video card from newegg, I just listed what it would have.
Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache]
Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers
Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
Yes that looks good. Although you can save another 30 or 40 bucks by putting in the 2nd video card yourself which is a very easy task - but if you feel you want it preinstalled it's not an issue.
I'm going to buy the 2nd video card from newegg, I just listed what it would have.
Is there anything else I need to change?
Make sure the Ram your getting is a Supported by Asus...they will have a list @ Asus website with a list of Tested Memory
And if your going for looks then go with that case. if your going for Performance Go with the Antecc 1200. it is the best Case on the market. (i have built 4 pcs with this case)
Dreadknot Approved!
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
On the Intel/AMD debate, there shouldn't be one. Investing in Core2 architecture is a waste of money. Intel is no longer supporting the architecture, and the current Phenom IIs outperform Core2 chips. The question should be between investing in Core i7 that has maybe 1~2 years of support from Intel, or investing in AM3 that will have atleast 2 years of chip support.
Comparitavily, the choice between a Core i7 and a Phenom II chip is not easy. Core i7 will outperform a Phenom II chip in nearly every benchmark you throw at it except for gaming and a handful of CAD applications. However, a Phenom II chip will have continued upgradability, lower cost, similiar gaming performance, and lower power requirements with the platform. I would say the better pick at this moment is the Phenom II. Depending on how much you prioritize the processor, the better picks are the Phenom II 720BE and 955BE, or the Core i7 920.
The real choice is do you want a nVidia solution or AMD, both of which are quite valid. If you are spending $1500 on a gaming system, I would aim at a Quad Crossfire/sli solution depending on which platform you want. This will give your system unnecessary muscle for gaming that will not be matched for atleast 2 years looking at all the games currently in development. Or wait until June for nVidias and AMDs new GPUs to hit the market that will most likely be powerhouses. Then I would get an 800~1200w PSU depending on how many GPUs you used.
I would also get 1-128GB SSD simply for quick data access off HDD, and 8~12GB ram. Then maybe a Blu-Ray player since you can have the budget for it and the system can handle it.
Also a meaty and well designed full-tower case is something that you will enjoy for a decade.
Yes, its always better to build it yourself. On the Intel/AMD debate, there shouldn't be one. Investing in Core2 architecture is a waste of money. Intel is no longer supporting the architecture, and the current Phenom IIs outperform Core2 chips. The question should be between investing in Core i7 that has maybe 1~2 years of support from Intel, or investing in AM3 that will have atleast 2 years of chip support. Comparitavily, the choice between a Core i7 and a Phenom II chip is not easy. Core i7 will outperform a Phenom II chip in nearly every benchmark you throw at it except for gaming and a handful of CAD applications. However, a Phenom II chip will have continued upgradability, lower cost, similiar gaming performance, and lower power requirements with the platform. I would say the better pick at this moment is the Phenom II. Depending on how much you prioritize the processor, the better picks are the Phenom II 720BE and 955BE, or the Core i7 920. The real choice is do you want a nVidia solution or AMD, both of which are quite valid. If you are spending $1500 on a gaming system, I would aim at a Quad Crossfire/sli solution depending on which platform you want. This will give your system unnecessary muscle for gaming that will not be matched for atleast 2 years looking at all the games currently in development. Or wait until June for nVidias and AMDs new GPUs to hit the market that will most likely be powerhouses. Then I would get an 800~1200w PSU depending on how many GPUs you used. I would also get 1-128GB SSD simply for quick data access off HDD, and 8~12GB ram. Then maybe a Blu-Ray player since you can have the budget for it and the system can handle it. Also a meaty and well designed full-tower case is something that you will enjoy for a decade.
humor me....Prove this "Core i7 will outperform a Phenom II chip in nearly every benchmark you throw at it except for gaming"
the gaming part.....i have a point...you show you after.
Also while your at it. find me the prices on those Chips . Side by side.
then show me the OC benchmarks side by side of the 920 and the AMD..
I will did it also..
PS try and find a unbias site for thoses benchmarks.
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
As can be clearly seen by the gaming benches, CPUs really don't make much a difference to performance. On the other hand you need to spend atleast $194 on a motherboard with a Core i7, and their chips cost 10% more. Ontop of it neither of the Intel products have an upgrade future. Intel Core i7 drops support soon with Intel Core i5, Intel Socket 775 has already stopped future development. Where as with AMD you can use motherboards from 2006, this will probably stop when a Fusion chip is released. Simply for gaming using an Intel solution will cost more and garner no real improvements for gaming tasks. Also with more productivity tasks going to the GPU, its even losing ground in areas were the CPU traditionally mattered.
To me wasting a money on a Core i7 if you are aiming at a gaming computer is impractical, just like investing in a now dead socket. I still would recommend a Core i7 920 if he wasn't aiming at making a gaming machine.
On the overclocking front Core i7 920 gets to 4.0 ghz with stock voltage, AMD 955BE gets to 3.8 ghz at stock both being 1.35v. The Core i7 is also more effecient then the Phenom II in clock to clock.
Comments
haha let me tell you and it alot of fluff thats not needed...for the price and in light that W7 is coming out
for what?
Home 64 is all you needed
Windows 7 is coming up and that all anyone will need
i have used vista since release and yea it has a lot of problems but all those tweeks can be done by yourself.
i think the real bonus of that would be the Dolby pack seeing if it has DDL but that being said you do you know running a DDL to A AV Reciver? ..i am that would have been nice. to bad its a day late.
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
Well the cost of Vista's going to very depending on where you buy it and which one you buy but from newegg.com:
Home Basic (you should really try to avoid this one) - 89.99
Home Premium - 99.99
Business - 139.99
Ultimate (has the most features and is the one I would recommend if you know what you're doing with it) - 179.99 (the 64 bit version is actually listed as a dollar cheaper for some reason...)
These prices are as of this post and are subject to change...
Also these are OEM versions which means you just get the CD and key, no pretty box.
Vista black....lol come on
first of all you can get Home 64 bit
you dont need black...its bloatware.
AND Windows 7 is coming in 2 to 7 month
its more stable than both XP and vista
Uses only 1 gig of ram and Supports the new DX10 and DX 11
DX9 is being phazed out as we speak
LOL you just admitted you dont even know what Vista Black edition is. From what I have read of your posts above, its all talk with a high and mighty attitude, but theres no real knowledge and or experience backing up your rants. AMD can and does compete quite well in the market as a matter of fact, furthermore, the best of the best is never needed for a hobby which is about constant upgrading over time. AMD holds up well, its priced much better and in the end are more efficient for gamers.
From what I have read of your posts above, its all talk with a high and mighty attitude, but theres no real knowledge and or experience backing up your rants. ????????
First of all the wall of text was long did i need to put it all in writing? When 5 minuts of google could do if for me.
And it takes 2....where is all your Facts to debate that im not giving out solid info.
What are you runing for a PC? what have you build in your life?
I know i have build both Setups and many more and have hands on Exp.
What are you bringing to the table...Flaming rants as well?
PS you said "Ultimate (has the most features and is the one I would recommend if you know what you're doing with it) - 179.99 (the 64 bit version is actually listed as a dollar cheaper for some reason...)" Not Vista Black....lol
when i said vista black i was thinking about Ultimate didnt even know there was a Black ed. so you just tryed to one up me with the wrong version...tisk tisk.
DID some looking to things and this is what i found. " Vista Black" is a Hack that can be downloaded not A MS product...
The Windows Vista Black Edition is a modified Vista distribution that is optimized for Gaming. It is not a valid, legal retail boxed version....lol man your funny
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
Hey all.
Woulden't life be easier if Brif went with something like this:
http://www.gateway.com/systems/product/529668250.php
I think this rig would do quite nicely for online MMOs and such. Though I do see one weakness with this CPU, that being the Hard Drive. The new thing nowadays is the SSD RAID 0. SSD = Solid State Drive.
I'm not sure which SSD Brif would consider to swap for the factory Hard Drive. Maybe DreadKnot can shed some light on this topic?
Neweggs good, frys electronics is also good.
For about 1300 bucks I could build you a fairly badass system from those sites.
its not bad for a pre built PC...one of the guys in my guild just got that model
good and bad:
Processor Intel® Core™ i7-920 Processor1 (2.66GHz Quad-Core with Intelreg; Hyper-Threading & Turbo Speed Technology)9
good
Operating System Genuine Microsoft® Windows Vista® Home Premium (64-bit) with SP12
Good
Memory 6144MB 1066MHz DDR3 Three Channel Memory (3 x 2048MB Modules)10
Bad no name (most likely Kingston value ram) not sure tho
Chassis Premium Tower Desktop with Media Control Interface with a Stunning Jet-Black Finish and Copper Metallic Accents
Bad (pre build PC's are made to fit the OG parts hard to upgrade aftermarket Fans,New cards and what not....Who know what sort of wire managment is inside. Air flow is key.)
Video NVIDIA® GeForce® GTS 150 Graphics with 1GB DDR3 Discrete Video Memory (Ports 2x DVI-I, S-Video)11
Good (its ok but a few dollors more gets you a 260 ,280, 275, 285
Hard Drive 750GB 7200RPM SATA II hard drive5
Bad (if its not a WD)
Audio 8-Channel (7.1) HD Audio
Application Software Microsoft® Works 9.0, Microsoft® Money Essentials & Microsoft® Office Home and Student 2007 (60-daycomplimentary trial period)4
Bad (Bloatware)
Available Expansion Slots Available: 1 - PCI-E x16, 0 - PCI-E x4, 0 - PCI-E x1
Good (to a point)
Digital Media Software Cyberlink® Power2 Go™, & Cyberlink® LabelPrint
Good
Power Supply 750W Power Supply
? dont know the Brand
Security Software Norton Internet Security 2009 (60-day trial)8
bad (bloatwear)
Warranty 1 Year Parts and Labor Limited Warranty with Toll-Free Tech Support12
Weight 31 lbs. (14.1 kg) system unit only / Approximately 37 lbs. (16.8 kg.) box
Good if you know nothing about computers
But if you look at the i7 Setup i built for him up in the posts he will get way more for a few dollors more.
but not bad if you dont want to spend alot or will not Learn to build your own.
Final note I would never buy a gateway or any other Consumer PC.
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
That's some lazy linking. First, on guru3d the 720BE beat the i7 920 in one game and TIED IT in all 5 other games when settings are turned up to normal. Tomshardware always benchmarks CPUs at the lowest graphics settings to see how the CPU alone performs. At HIGH graphics settings the GPU bottlenecks in all cases except for prohibitively expensive SLI setups. Furthermore the tomshardware.com links don't even have the Phenom II on it, you're comparing current gen Intel CPU's to last gen AMD there, worthless benchmarks. All of which make those charts useless.
Moving on to cpubenchmark.com (a pure CPU test - no gaming here), first we have the Phenom II x4 940 $190 handily beating the Intel Q9300 $240 (not including mobo, as Intel's mobo's are generally more expensive), of course it gets crushed by the $280 i7 920 (which was likely on a $350 mobo as well as the more expensive DDR3). This still proves nothing for games and only shows price disparity.
When talking GAME benchmarking, graphics settings turned up to what you would play at, the CPU speeds don't play a big factor. If for some reason you need the high cpu horsepower for something outside of games by all means buy a hefty Intel cpu.
Also I *tried* to put together an i7 920 system for his price range but when you add in the needed monitor, printer, speakers, Windows and then aim for a video card that would need the extra cpu power in an i7 920 - there was no way to make price. Try including everything he needs and your build is way out of his range not including shipping.
Try to keep your advice relevant to the budget and needs of the person asking. And don't assume anyone is looking for a flame war there's no reason we can't just discuss hardware. It sounds to me like you just enjoy spending money though.
Also as far as your preference for WD hard drives:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/2tb-hdd-caviar,2261-8.html
Seagate's 7200 rpm drives beat out WD 7200 rpm hard drives in performance AND sound decibel level. Of course they are both very reliable and carry 5 year warranties and I actually would use either brand.
As far as CPUs go I'd avoid Intel right now. Firstly the Intel dual core processors are a good price and perform in current games well, however if you're plasnning on upgrading forget it. The LGA 775 socket is obsolete now, so if you wanted a new processor say next year you'd need a new motherboard as well as a new processor.
An i7? Well it's a new socket but is expensive, the CPU is costly and the motherboards will cost up to three times the price of an AMD motherboard. Added to this Intel are releasing a new socket this year for the i5 chip, so where are they going to take this socket? Is one going to be obsolete? Are they going to develop both alongside eachother? Either way I don't see this being a good thing.
AMD has had a rough time the last couple of years, this year I see them making a fresh forray into the market with the AM3 processor and AM3 socket motherboards. AMD motherboards have a superior chipset to Intel and are cheaper and less bloated.
AMD has just released the X4 955 BE a high end AM3 chip but still cheaper than an i7 and still outperforms it, with all AM3 chips being backwards compatible with AM2+ boards. I have gone with the X3 720 BE, at a mere £120 or $145 it provides all my processor needs and allows me to invest in a higher end GPU for gaming. If the processor is too slow for a game in the future it's a black edition with an unlocked multiplier and will overclock to 3.7ghz on a stock air cooler.
Intel has the fastest chip when running a single application as in a benchmark test, although due to its inferior architecture when multi tasking if fails and the AMD will be quicker. Even an X3 720 can defeat an i7 920 easily on some multi tasking benchmarks. As to gaming there would be no noticable difference between an i7 965 etreme and an X3 720 BE both with a top end GPU such as a 4850x2 0r a 4890 or 285. The only sizable difference you'd notice is about £/$1000 difference to your bank account!
I'm getting Vista myself until next year and any problems with the new windows, and there will be problems. Also another thing to remember is chicks dig AMD, intel has more turn offs than route 66 FACT!
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience"
CS Lewis
Are you on drugs or something? (thats not an insult, i really want to know given the manner of your responses) Where did I try to "one up" you, whatever that means given the context? Vista Black Edition is a modified OS that operates better, i could care less if it was "official" or not. I already stated it was different, fact is you mocked me for mentioning it because you thought it was something else...while at the same time going on about how much more knowledgeable you are than everyone else. Just admit it, you are a google warrior. Given your statements towards others and the given topic in this thread, its fairly clear you are not as computer saavy as you want people to think. Generally it helps to think before you comment. Btw, you might have missed it but I did provide a link to information on Vista Black. Kinda funny you overlooked that. I suppose the "lol man your funny" comment doesnt make sense either, in a manner of speaking the jokes on you.
Essentially we are giving the OP advice, having google warriors come in and belittle other posters in order to sound more tech saavy is kind of fruitless in my opinion.
I totally agree on the AMD processor, and I really love Intel processors.
The new Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition is an amazing chip for the price. Clock for clock it's as fast if not faster than the Q9550, and it can hit 4.4 GHZ on air. Also, you can get better motherboards for cheaper...
As for i7, there's almost no advantage for gaming. Server apps and encoding sure thing, but dollar per FPS it's a total waste of money for gaming, use the $$ on the GPU or a new monitor.
As for GPUs, the ATI 4870 1GB or GTX 260 is what you should have your eyes on. If you want to spend more, get 2 of them of a 4870x2, because those cards are the best bang for your buck.
Are you on drugs or something? (thats not an insult, i really want to know given the manner of your responses) Where did I try to "one up" you, whatever that means given the context? Vista Black Edition is a modified OS that operates better, i could care less if it was "official" or not. I already stated it was different, fact is you mocked me for mentioning it because you thought it was something else...while at the same time going on about how much more knowledgeable you are than everyone else. Just admit it, you are a google warrior. Given your statements towards others and the given topic in this thread, its fairly clear you are not as computer saavy as you want people to think. Generally it helps to think before you comment. Btw, you might have missed it but I did provide a link to information on Vista Black. Kinda funny you overlooked that. I suppose the "lol man your funny" comment doesnt make sense either, in a manner of speaking the jokes on you.
Essentially we are giving the OP advice, having google warriors come in and belittle other posters in order to sound more tech saavy is kind of fruitless in my opinion.
i think its you that is smoking the pipe? back track much? i commented on the fact you recomended "Vista Ultimate"......then I laughed at you . Then pop up with "Vista Black" as your proof to state that Vista Ultimate was better, using a Modified OS full Bloat pre installed drivers and a few bells. to make Vista Ultimate look better???????????? Yea if you got Ultimate and then downloaded the "HACK" it could be better. But thats not what you were OG talking about. For the cost of Vista Ultimate right now its not worth recomending that OS to anyone right now or ever for that matter.
And for a google warrior? once agian "clueless" im sitting in a computer room full of PC's and Parts that i build weekly....
you still havent let us know your back ground, or your PC's you run... to back up your claims.
And everything that you have Stated in this thread has come from a google as well.....what is wrong with you.
PS and on top of it you found the wrong OS to post .
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
That's some lazy linking. First, on guru3d the 720BE beat the i7 920 in one game and TIED IT in all 5 other games when settings are turned up to normal. Tomshardware always benchmarks CPUs at the lowest graphics settings to see how the CPU alone performs. At HIGH graphics settings the GPU bottlenecks in all cases except for prohibitively expensive SLI setups. Furthermore the tomshardware.com links don't even have the Phenom II on it, you're comparing current gen Intel CPU's to last gen AMD there, worthless benchmarks. All of which make those charts useless.
Moving on to cpubenchmark.com (a pure CPU test - no gaming here), first we have the Phenom II x4 940 $190 handily beating the Intel Q9300 $240 (not including mobo, as Intel's mobo's are generally more expensive), of course it gets crushed by the $280 i7 920 (which was likely on a $350 mobo as well as the more expensive DDR3). This still proves nothing for games and only shows price disparity.
When talking GAME benchmarking, graphics settings turned up to what you would play at, the CPU speeds don't play a big factor. If for some reason you need the high cpu horsepower for something outside of games by all means buy a hefty Intel cpu.
Also I *tried* to put together an i7 920 system for his price range but when you add in the needed monitor, printer, speakers, Windows and then aim for a video card that would need the extra cpu power in an i7 920 - there was no way to make price. Try including everything he needs and your build is way out of his range not including shipping.
Try to keep your advice relevant to the budget and needs of the person asking. And don't assume anyone is looking for a flame war there's no reason we can't just discuss hardware. It sounds to me like you just enjoy spending money though.
Also as far as your preference for WD hard drives:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/2tb-hdd-caviar,2261-8.html
Seagate's 7200 rpm drives beat out WD 7200 rpm hard drives in performance AND sound decibel level. Of course they are both very reliable and carry 5 year warranties and I actually would use either brand.
first of all i priced out 2 PC's low end and high you only commented on the i7. Low end under 1k without the input devices. that putting him around 1.3k. and Stated IF HE had a liitle beit more he could go with the high end......... That would b e a better futture proof setup with more nuts.
To the others topics....
Almost no Benchmark program can realy define how a CPU or GPU can perform of the Spetrum of APPs and Games.
What one do you go by then.?
And the statement that games dont need CPU? wow.. yea they do.. Some games are more geared to CPU prosessing than GPU....... I beleave COD series Fallout 3 are a few.
Windows and then aim for a video card that would need the extra cpu power in an i7 920?
why would you buy GPU that just match your CPU at the moment? so 3 months from now he wants to go Sli... and not have the Power he needs to free up a bottleneck? and rebuy a new CPU.?
At HIGH graphics settings the GPU bottlenecks in all cases except for prohibitively expensive SLI setups? wrong....
My GTX 280's in SLI were bottlenecked, i got them 3 days after they came out. i had my CPU at stock. Ran Vantage. low score
OC'ed my CPU. I dont remeber the CPU AND GPU's scores but i know my GPU score doubled to an over all 5000 points ,to a 24500 score. (at the time only one PC was higher @ 25000)
so from my Q9450 @ 2.6 to OC @ 3.6 freed up the bottle neck.
And no offence , but what card Do you have that needed to be un -bottlenecked? i have had 4 so far....(2 GTX 280 1 GTX 295 and 1 GTX 285.)
When talking GAME benchmarking, graphics settings turned up to what you would play at, the CPU speeds don't play a big factor. If for some reason you need the high cpu horsepower for something outside of games by all means buy a hefty Intel cpu.....
with this statement your saying Buy a PC dedicated to just one App? lol So if you decide down the line do do anything else than gaming to need to upgrade or rebuild?....and thats cost effective?
you buy a year ahead if your on a buget for a PC. You dont buy on par or less than the market is going......that is the same in most Products......that like spending money on a DVD collection when everthing is flipping to Blue ray.
You give it a little room so you can grow with it. Most gamers will upgrage at least 2 times a year. i know this.. 80% of my clan does (every few months someone is buying something new)
I understand that Benchmarks are right and wrong and also Bias and unbias.. i posted just the first few i came across to prove a point that i can post crap too. if you read back you Will see.
there was a 2009 CPU gaming Benchmark that was for gaming, and for the life of me i can find it....but the point is unless you are actually sitting if front of the Tech, or have used it...in cannot Say what is better...We should all know by now what Hype is.
On the other note When was the last Intel CPU you have useded? And compaired yourself what is faster and better for games?
I have 2 AMD's sitting in my room and 2 Intel's. And Intel stomps them out. I use programs like Adobe CS 3/4 and i have this instaled right now. Battlefield 2, Project Reality, COD 5, Age Of Conan, WOW, Lord of the rings on-line, DDO, Crysis, Far Cry 2, Fallout 3 Insurgency, Red Orchestra, Grid, And Brothers and Arms.......A full list of past and present.
Now you keep bringing up "IN Games"
what are you running to back up those claims? I can run all of this Full max And my GPU Maxed. Unless you are running games like this. and have had to Driver tweak, OC.... everything in your System and still make it Stable. if you haven't even done a min of this. What makes you think that you really know what a chip can do? Reading an AD? a benchmark? (90% of them are Full of shit)
Also it comes down to..... Yes every chip that comes out has pros and cons. Every chip can "one up" the later. But when you buy Chip you look performance, reliability , and company, Much like you would, if you were shopping for a car.
For example GM motors Could be going out of business.(I Know Crazy... Bankrupt?)....IF that happens and even that it hasn't happened. NO one is buying a GM made Car...Why? Why would you buy a car that may not have support. Parts,Labor.etc.
And after reading alittle about the state of AMD and chips.. Even AMD and fans are Stating that "Hopefully this "black" will get AMD on track. "This Chip Can Stand up to Intel." look at how its worded. Sounds like they have been in the Shadow of Intel. Play it like it is... the Mayor of Green boat VA. last night in an interview, Stated. "Hopefully the New Corvette will get GM back on track, and get people buying GM."
Well im not saying that AMD is going out of Business. But they are not a safe bet. And if G fuck-in M can kick the bucket then i wouldn't hold out for AMD to ever keep up, or stay on top of Intel....Flat out.
even Most AMD Fans know this.
But right now every where you look Intel is the most reviewed. Rated and Fastest gaming rigs on the planet. And even know that it could be marketing or people following the trend. the Safe bet is all ways where the money is.
And quit with the Price shit.. the i7 . is $100 more than "Black". This is PC gaming, if your crying over $100... I see an xbox in someones future.
Read this Review and Benchmark.....it States all your conerns about giming and no gaming Benchmark tools...
http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/processors/298-ici7920
http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/processors/584-amd-phenom-ii-955-x4-be-dragon-platform?start=16
you will noitce At the "put it together " Part that you can build both Setups for under 1000.. that meaning you will have to buy the very best that ATI & AMD has to offer to get a ATI & AMD Setup to Match A i7 & Nvidia Setup. (Give or take)
So once agian AMD fans Are useing lower value Parts with low prices covering up for thet fact that AMD has the Same prices at the high end..... that are A little lower than Intel High end. and i didnt get this from the artical....it just another sample.
And you can see by the Site , they Review more AMD Chips with good ratings than Intel...SO no Bias here.
Also from what I know most AMD chips untill the "Black" NO DDR3 support...I could be wrong.... but comparing 454 Big block with flat tires, to a Vortech 6000 on racing slicks.......?
but I don't have the "Black" chip. But i know my AMD MB doesn't take DDR 3.
I priced this guy one of the Fastest PC's on the plant for in his budget range .so what are you all talking about.?!
I know its a fact , first hand. I'M sitting in the step before it as I'm writing. less than a year ago..I was running that fast shit for gaming. now its a few steps back
http://55six.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=356
Antec 1200 full tower
Quad Core Q9450 overclocked @3.6 ...............................................upgrading to i7 920 OC @ 4.0 air: when its back on sale for $220
Zalman 9700 CPU cooler
EVGA 790i ultra ....................................................................................going with EVGA x58 the fast MB on the planet.
Munchkin DDR3 4gigs 1600 7.7.6:18 T ..............................................going 6gig tripple channel 1800h DDR3......will be nice over kill for Windows 7 that uses 1gig.
EVGA GTX 295 Overclocked @ 690/ 1468/ 1166 .............................going sli 285's ....going tri if the new series are $500+ agian
WD Raptor X 150gig X2 Raid 0 ..............................................................adding 2 More
Corsiar h1000watt PSU
Smasung 26 inch LCD syncmaster 1900x1200 ,........................................Matorx Tripplehead2go....google it oh yea!
Wacom Cintq 21 inch digtal art monitor
logitech G15 keayboard
logitech MX laser mouse
logitech 5.1suround
Simply Put Listen to somone that Plays the games you want to play ,and someone that runs the systems that you are thing about running... Not Exp review readers....
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
You dont need to over clock your CPU, INTEL or AMD. In fact, I never recomend overclocking, its not even necessary any more since CPUs are much faster and cheaper. Overclocking can cause damages you dont want, and you have to make sure both your case, cooling system, and all are going to keep it at a safe temp.
"Having a $300 dollar videocard means nothing if you don't have a highly overclocked cpu." Is a false statement. A GPU will run fine regardless, and in fact is not reliant on a OCed cpu in this day and age. Furthermore, considering the rate at which PC gamers tend to upgrade and use their rigs, AMD is the best CPU. Its mobos and cpus are cheaper and over all more efficient.
Yes i agree that a system will run fine with a stock cpu, but there is up to %40 of performance sitting untapped.
You really need to do some research on overclocking. Its the quickest and easy way to add fps performance. As far as AMD being better you need to read alittle more. AMD has been years behind Intel since 2006, especially with the i series now.
Just about every highend Graphics card is bottlenecked by the CPU.
Have you even done any 3dmark or game benchmarking?? Obviously not.
For example: Intel Q6600 at stock 2.4ghz with a 9800gtx stock scores around 10.5k on 3dmark06.
Intel Q6600 at 3.0ghz 9800gtx stock scores around 13k.
Thats a %25 increase in performance with very little effort. With a cheap aftermarket CPU cooler the cpu still stays under 50c full load. (Q6600s regularly hit 3.6ghz with little effort)
Yes, 3dmark06 scores the CPU seperately, but looking at the GPU score it jumps %20 aswell and frames overall are 15-20% higher aswell.
AMD or Intel, overclocking adds FPS on ANY!! setup. Its a no brainer, overclock your cpu even if its a just 10% OC. Overclock your GPU aswell. People worry about shortening the lifetime of your components when overclocking, its means nothing anyways since most to all people replace their PC within 5-6 years.
As far as CPUs go I'd avoid Intel right now. Firstly the Intel dual core processors are a good price and perform in current games well, however if you're plasnning on upgrading forget it. The LGA 775 socket is obsolete now, so if you wanted a new processor say next year you'd need a new motherboard as well as a new processor.
REPLY- You have clearly smoked yourself retarted!!! Today you can still purchase a P4 system. So your guess at the LGA 775 socket is obsolete now is simlply wrong!
Now can you tell me how old that shit is..They still sell AGP slot cards for Muck sake!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116027
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138079
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010380048%201069609639&name=AGP%204X%2f8X
An i7? Well it's a new socket but is expensive, the CPU is costly and the motherboards will cost up to three times the price of an AMD motherboard.
REPLY- Dont compair the bottom of the line AMD MB to the X58 board because thats the only way your going to find 3 to 1 price ratio
Added to this Intel are releasing a new socket this year for the i5 chip, so where are they going to take this socket? Is one going to be obsolete? Either way I don't see this being a good thing.
REPLY- NO!..Both chips will be sold... And I don't think you can see anything with those blinders on!
AMD motherboards have a superior chipset to Intel and are cheaper and less bloated.
REPLY- Maybe with a single card it might be superior, but when it comes to SLI and TRI -SLI your chipset dosn't have a leg to stand on!
I dont use the bloatware you speek of.....Reva Tuner is all you need.
AMD has just released the X4 955 BE a high end AM3 chip but still cheaper than an i7 and still outperforms it, with all AM3 chips being backwards compatible with AM2+ boards. I have gone with the X3 720 BE, at a mere £120 or $145 it provides all my processor needs and allows me to invest in a higher end GPU for gaming. If the processor is too slow for a game in the future it's a black edition with an unlocked multiplier and will overclock to 3.7ghz on a stock air cooler
REPLY- It's being compaired to the Q9550 lol..And the Q9650 will kick the shit out of it....
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/phenom-x4-955,2278-12.html
Intel has the fastest chip when running a single application as in a benchmark test, although due to its inferior architecture when multi tasking if fails and the AMD will be quicker. Even an X3 720 can defeat an i7 920 easily on some multi tasking benchmarks. As to gaming there would be no noticable difference between an i7 965 etreme and an X3 720 BE both with a top end GPU such as a 4850x2 0r a 4890 or 285. The only sizable difference you'd notice is about £/$1000 difference to your bank account!
REPLY- This is why people OC the cheaper hardware....So your statments above mean nothing!
I'm getting Vista myself until next year and any problems with the new windows, and there will be problems. Also another thing to remember is chicks dig AMD, intel has more turn offs than route 66 FACT!
REPLY- Yep...Im more than sure that your going to have problems...and chicks could care less what computer your running. Try not to use the word "FACT" in your post because your not fooling anyone!
You dont need to over clock your CPU, INTEL or AMD. In fact, I never recomend overclocking, its not even necessary any more since CPUs are much faster and cheaper. Overclocking can cause damages you dont want, and you have to make sure both your case, cooling system, and all are going to keep it at a safe temp.
"Having a $300 dollar videocard means nothing if you don't have a highly overclocked cpu." Is a false statement. A GPU will run fine regardless, and in fact is not reliant on a OCed cpu in this day and age. Furthermore, considering the rate at which PC gamers tend to upgrade and use their rigs, AMD is the best CPU. Its mobos and cpus are cheaper and over all more efficient.
Yes i agree that a system will run fine with a stock cpu, but there is up to %40 of performance sitting untapped.
You really need to do some research on overclocking. Its the quickest and easy way to add fps performance. As far as AMD being better you need to read alittle more. AMD has been years behind Intel since 2006, especially with the i series now.
Just about every highend Graphics card is bottlenecked by the CPU.
Have you even done any 3dmark or game benchmarking?? Obviously not.
For example: Intel Q6600 at stock 2.4ghz with a 9800gtx stock scores around 10.5k on 3dmark06.
Intel Q6600 at 3.0ghz 9800gtx stock scores around 13k.
Thats a %25 increase in performance with very little effort. With a cheap aftermarket CPU cooler the cpu still stays under 50c full load. (Q6600s regularly hit 3.6ghz with little effort)
Yes, 3dmark06 scores the CPU seperately, but looking at the GPU score it jumps %20 aswell and frames overall are 15-20% higher aswell.
AMD or Intel, overclocking adds FPS on ANY!! setup. Its a no brainer, overclock your cpu even if its a just 10% OC. Overclock your GPU aswell. People worry about shortening the lifetime of your components when overclocking, its means nothing anyways since most to all people replace their PC within 5-6 years.
Im running this...And I built this rig 13+ months ago....to play games and some internet use and that's it! (keeps the processes down to a min)
EVGA 780i
INTEL e8400 @ 4.05 GHz (would of been the e8500 or e8600 but they wernt out yet)
2-EVGA 9800 GTX + (SLI) 804/1702/2249 clocks
patriot DDR2 1200 @ 1150 MHz 5-5-5-12
Antec 900 case (would of purchased the 1200 but they were't out yet)
Ac Freezer 7 pro CPU cooler ( CPU has never seen 55 degrees c )
OCZ 1000w PSU
2 -WD 160 GIG 7200 sata 3.0 16mb cashe drives in raid (0)
Maxtor 250 gig storage drive
Pioneer dvd / burner
upgraded 3 months ago:
Matrox TH2go and 3 Sceptre 20.2 displays @ 1680 x 1050 native rez. ( 3x 1680 x1050 gives you an overall 5040 x 1050 across 3 screens)
This system has been as soild as they come!
Now.. the games I play with this setup, with an avg. 60 frames or better..
at max settings...
BF2- 60 to 80 fps
Project reality ( a BF2 mod) 60 to 80 fps
AIX (Bf2 mod) 70 to 90 fps
POE2 80 to 100 fps
BF 2142 70 to 90 fps
HL2 80-90 fps
HL-2 MOD..insurgency 90 to 100 fps
Red orchestra 80 fps
Cod 4 60 to 80 fps
COD WAW 60 fps some times dips in the 50's
Med to high settings 60 fps or better:
Burnout Paradice City Ulti box 60 to 70 fps
Fallout 3- 60 fps
Fronlines 70 to 80 fps
NFS carbon 60 to 70 fps
med setting @ 60 fps or better
Wanted. wepons of fate 60 fps and dips a times
hawx 60 to 70 fps
Farcry 2 playable across 3 screens@ med settings
Crysis playable across 3 screens at med settings
These are real world numbers and you will not find them on any serch engines!
My next upgrade will be a Q9650 when needed (and will OC the hell out of it,) with games that support Qcore. Maybe 2- 285's when the price drops or 2- 300 series cards if the price is right. But I don't see DX 11 being used anytime soon! Or I might get the 3rd 9800GTX ($104.00) Who knows, but I have many options.
As for MMO's this system will play them all other that maybe AOC @ 60 fps or better.
As you can see...It is very important for me to overclock and if I didn't.. half of them games would be unplayable at that rez...!
Intel Q6600 at 3.0ghz 9800gtx stock scores around 13k.
REPLY- That sounds about right...My clocks (CPU and GPU) I got 16.0k on one card, and 22.0k on 2 9800 gtx's.with 177.xx drivers.
I built this here for about $1600, I would like to spend a little less, but whatever.
I don't know much about computer parts so give me advice on what I should add, remove, or change.
Case - Red PSI ArmorX Gaming Tower Case
Power Supply - 800 Watt Power Supply - Quad SLI Ready
CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Processor (4x 2.66GHz/8MB L3 Cache)
Processor Cooling - Certified CPU Fan and Heatsink
Motherboard - Asus P6T Intel X58 Chipset CrossFire and SLI Supported w/7.1 Sound, Triple-Channel DDR3, Gb LAN, S-ATA Raid, USB 2.0, 3-Way SLI PCI-E MB 3-Way SLI
RAM - 12 GB [2 GB X6] DDR3-1600 Triple Memory Module
Video Card - NVIDIA GeForce 9800GTX+ 1GB
Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache]
DVD Drive - 16x DVD-ROM Drive
CD-RW/DVD-RW Drive - [5X Blu-Ray] Sony Optiarc BC-5100S BLU-RAY Reader & DVD±R/±RW Burner Combo Drive
Sound Card - 3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard
Network Card - Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100)
Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers
Flash Media Reader/Writer - 12-In-1 Internal Flash Media Card Reader/Writer
Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
First you should either get the 750W or 850W Corsair TX PSU on there - they don't say what brand the 800W generic one is which isn't a great sign.
6GB is the sweet spot for an i7 system. 12GB is not really necessary, you can save $150 right there.
The i7 920 is kinda going to waste unless you SLI the 9800GTX+ or get a 285 GTX. If you are planning to get a Geforce 300 series at the end of the year then that setup is fine until then. ibuypower.com seems to realy overcharge on their video cards though so if you want to SLI the 9800GTX+ you should order the PC with just 1 then order another 9800GTX+ from Newegg with the cash you saved on the ram.
First you should either get the 750W or 850W Corsair TX PSU on there - they don't say what brand the 800W generic one is which isn't a great sign.
6GB is the sweet spot for an i7 system. 12GB is not really necessary, you can save $150 right there.
The i7 920 is kinda going to waste unless you SLI the 9800GTX+ or get a 285 GTX. If you are planning to get a Geforce 300 series at the end of the year then that setup is fine until then. ibuypower.com seems to realy overcharge on their video cards though so if you want to SLI the 9800GTX+ you should order the PC with just 1 then order another 9800GTX+ from Newegg with the cash you saved on the ram.
What he said!!! Try the 800w psu with the 2 cards...If it fails send it back...you should be ok tho. You only need 6 gigs of ram! If you can get the 512 meg 9800 GTX+ with the box....Do so. @ 1680 x 1050 (22") i was getting any where from 160 fps and up in COD WAW @ max settings....Overclocked on both cards. @ stock settings you should ge about 130-140 fps.
So is this better?
Power Supply - 750 Watt -- Corsair CMPSU-750TX Power Supply Quad SLI Ready
CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Processor (4x 2.66GHz/8MB L3 Cache)
Motherboard - Asus P6T Intel X58 Chipset CrossFire and SLI Supported w/7.1 Sound, Triple-Channel DDR3, Gb LAN, S-ATA Raid, USB 2.0, 3-Way SLI PCI-E MB 3-Way SLI
RAM - 6 GB [2 GB X3] DDR3-1333 Triple Memory Module
Video Card - 2x NVIDIA GeForce 9800GTX+ 1GB
Hard Drive - 500 GB HARD DRIVE [Serial-ATA-II, 3Gb, 7200 RPM, 16M Cache]
Monitor - ASUS 22" Widescreen VH222H TFT LCD Monitor 16:9 Full HD 1080P /w Built in Speakers
Operating System - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit
Yes that looks good. Although you can save another 30 or 40 bucks by putting in the 2nd video card yourself which is a very easy task - but if you feel you want it preinstalled it's not an issue.
Yes that looks good. Although you can save another 30 or 40 bucks by putting in the 2nd video card yourself which is a very easy task - but if you feel you want it preinstalled it's not an issue.
I'm going to buy the 2nd video card from newegg, I just listed what it would have.
Is there anything else I need to change?
Yes that looks good. Although you can save another 30 or 40 bucks by putting in the 2nd video card yourself which is a very easy task - but if you feel you want it preinstalled it's not an issue.
I'm going to buy the 2nd video card from newegg, I just listed what it would have.
Is there anything else I need to change?
Make sure the Ram your getting is a Supported by Asus...they will have a list @ Asus website with a list of Tested Memory
And if your going for looks then go with that case. if your going for Performance Go with the Antecc 1200. it is the best Case on the market. (i have built 4 pcs with this case)
Dreadknot Approved!
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
Would it be cheaper just to buy all the parts from Newegg and assemble it myself?
Yes, its always better to build it yourself.
On the Intel/AMD debate, there shouldn't be one. Investing in Core2 architecture is a waste of money. Intel is no longer supporting the architecture, and the current Phenom IIs outperform Core2 chips. The question should be between investing in Core i7 that has maybe 1~2 years of support from Intel, or investing in AM3 that will have atleast 2 years of chip support.
Comparitavily, the choice between a Core i7 and a Phenom II chip is not easy. Core i7 will outperform a Phenom II chip in nearly every benchmark you throw at it except for gaming and a handful of CAD applications. However, a Phenom II chip will have continued upgradability, lower cost, similiar gaming performance, and lower power requirements with the platform. I would say the better pick at this moment is the Phenom II. Depending on how much you prioritize the processor, the better picks are the Phenom II 720BE and 955BE, or the Core i7 920.
The real choice is do you want a nVidia solution or AMD, both of which are quite valid. If you are spending $1500 on a gaming system, I would aim at a Quad Crossfire/sli solution depending on which platform you want. This will give your system unnecessary muscle for gaming that will not be matched for atleast 2 years looking at all the games currently in development. Or wait until June for nVidias and AMDs new GPUs to hit the market that will most likely be powerhouses. Then I would get an 800~1200w PSU depending on how many GPUs you used.
I would also get 1-128GB SSD simply for quick data access off HDD, and 8~12GB ram. Then maybe a Blu-Ray player since you can have the budget for it and the system can handle it.
Also a meaty and well designed full-tower case is something that you will enjoy for a decade.
humor me....Prove this "Core i7 will outperform a Phenom II chip in nearly every benchmark you throw at it except for gaming"
the gaming part.....i have a point...you show you after.
Also while your at it. find me the prices on those Chips . Side by side.
then show me the OC benchmarks side by side of the 920 and the AMD..
I will did it also..
PS try and find a unbias site for thoses benchmarks.
"Beauty is only is only skin deep..." said the AMD/ATI fan. "Blah..Thats just what ugly people say..." said the Intel/Nvidia fan. You want price / performance, use the dollar menu..
Toms Hardware Benches
AMD 955BE Introduction
AMD 720BE Introduction
Anandtech Benches
AMD 955BE Introduction
AMD 720BE Introduction
AMD 720BE $145
AMD 955BE $245
Intel E8400 $167.99
Intel Q9550s $349.99
Intel Core i7 920 $288.99
As can be clearly seen by the gaming benches, CPUs really don't make much a difference to performance. On the other hand you need to spend atleast $194 on a motherboard with a Core i7, and their chips cost 10% more. Ontop of it neither of the Intel products have an upgrade future. Intel Core i7 drops support soon with Intel Core i5, Intel Socket 775 has already stopped future development. Where as with AMD you can use motherboards from 2006, this will probably stop when a Fusion chip is released. Simply for gaming using an Intel solution will cost more and garner no real improvements for gaming tasks. Also with more productivity tasks going to the GPU, its even losing ground in areas were the CPU traditionally mattered.
To me wasting a money on a Core i7 if you are aiming at a gaming computer is impractical, just like investing in a now dead socket. I still would recommend a Core i7 920 if he wasn't aiming at making a gaming machine.
On the overclocking front Core i7 920 gets to 4.0 ghz with stock voltage, AMD 955BE gets to 3.8 ghz at stock both being 1.35v. The Core i7 is also more effecient then the Phenom II in clock to clock.