Originally posted by Aeraized There is Phasing, If 15 different people enter a Hut, Everyone except your party and NPCs will be phased out, It gives the illusion that you are the only people accepting this task and there is not some 10 year old Wookie next to you humping your leg.
Oh, nice .. thanks for that info. I was very impressed with the seamless micro-instancing that WoW brought in with Wrath of the Lich King, and I was wondering how TOR was going to handle the story stuff; do you know if it's seamless (no loading screens or big glowing portals) .. ?
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
Originally posted by Aeraized There is Phasing, If 15 different people enter a Hut, Everyone except your party and NPCs will be phased out, It gives the illusion that you are the only people accepting this task and there is not some 10 year old Wookie next to you humping your leg.
Oh, nice .. thanks for that info. I was very impressed with the seamless micro-instancing that WoW brought in with Wrath of the Lich King, and I was wondering how TOR was going to handle the story stuff; do you know if it's seamless (no loading screens or big glowing portals) .. ?
There was no loading screen, but there was a sort of see-through barrier, I'm assuming that will be removed later on.
There is also free roaming Creatures and Enemies wandering around in the world, like other Sandbox games, so you can go on a killing spree if you so wish.
What the hell has happened to this community. Over the last few years the MMORPG.com forum community has eroded quite a bit, and this thread is a prime example of everything that is wrong with these forums.
There are so many posts in this thread that are either flat out lies or so uninformed about the subject matter that they are laughable. Yet, the posters seem to think they are presenting valid points.
My favorite are all of the "facts" being posted about TOR when none of us know anything about how the game is going to play. I can only assume that the posters are getting their "facts" from their own minds because looking at Bioware's other games, such as KOTOR, saying that TOR will be more linear than other MMO games is... just... dumb.
/sigh
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY! Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless. Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.
Are you kidding me? What blows my mind is people who play mmo's and do everything in thier power to try and make it a fps. If it wasnt what people wanted, they wouldnt make it. Accept that your vision of what a game should be is flawed.
You dont think they do thier homework before they spent the kind of money it takes to develop a mmo? Your thinking is self centered and way off base.
When I said i had "time", i meant virtual time, i got no RL "time" for you.
Do you seriously expect any developer to tell you any aspect of their game is sub par? If it was sub par wouldn't they just fix it and let you be none the wiser? Your anger is your own issue. They're not responsible for it. The last thing they owe you is an explanation.
A feature can be great in a developers eyes but lacking and horribly executed in the eyes of the player! It's happened time and time again. Have you been living under a rock?
So what's your point? If they tell you it's all rainbows and sparkles are you going to know any more than you do now? You have no basis to make a judgement. You won't until people get in the game and see how it's actually made. Even if you completely disagree with what they're doing they're not going to change it to suit you. If they make a bad game and it bombs it's no skin off your nose either way. Just wait and see what happens. Life will go on I assure you.
Fine, it's your money going to waste not mine. I just don't want to hear any massive QQ/whine post after the shit hits the fan.
I like classes and story. That's what makes an RPG and RPG. A role is the class you play and the game advances you through that class in a story. 'Nuff said. It's like taking guns away from FPS and replacing them with shoe horns. Wait? What? Why?
after reading the replies it seems like quite a few people actually give a crap about storylines....
Thank you, I dont think anyone can even value the topics starter anymore. For calling Bioware assholes for developing a storyline.. The way he said it to jsut made him sound like a whinny 9 year old with the swearing...
ALSO.. take into consideration of the messed up gameplay that will result from said " 4th pillar ", aka the storyline..
Think about it.. Bioware is pushing this storyline crap down our throats yet logically from what we know, it's flawed.. Let me explain before you flame.. Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to? Lets look at this people.. These so called choices in the 4th pillar are nothing more then gaining or losing faction (rep) points with one side or the other.. NO matter how you sugarcoat it or relabel it.. Therefore, If multiple players are all taking different paths to the end game, this logically means 1) ALL players not taking the same path should be disallowed from grouping with others, or 2) Bioware allows the grouping, ignoring the faction or rep status and temporary putting the storyline element on the backburner..
I have a gut feeling that much of these storyline quest will be instanced so that Bioware can circumvent the faction rules of their own game.. I'm sure we'll ge a lame excuse how the choice ONLY effects the person taking the quest and others within the party are not effected by who's getting killed or not.. PLUS.. I hope there isn't too much instancing, as WoW is already seeing how servers can get overwelmed.. I have a bad feeling about this..
ALSO.. take into consideration of the messed up gameplay that will result from said " 4th pillar ", aka the storyline.. Think about it.. Bioware is pushing this storyline crap down our throats yet logically from what we know, it's flawed.. Let me explain before you flame.. Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to? Lets look at this people.. These so called choices in the 4th pillar are nothing more then gaining or losing faction (rep) points with one side or the other.. NO matter how you sugarcoat it or relabel it.. Therefore, If multiple players are all taking different paths to the end game, this logically means 1) ALL players not taking the same path should be disallowed from grouping with others, or 2) Bioware allows the grouping, ignoring the faction or rep status and temporary putting the storyline element on the backburner.. Are you basing on this assumption on some evidence?
For all you (and I) know, storyline choices could lead to different bonuses to stats/abilities, they could lead to different mission branches, item rewards or yes, they could lead to different reputations with factions in the Star Wars universe, but you're assume that making different choices will put two (for example) Smugglers on different "teams" making it impossible for them to interact cooperatively. Has anyone even said whether or not it will be possible for Jedi and Sith to group? I have a gut feeling that much of these storyline quest will be instanced so that Bioware can circumvent the faction rules of their own game.. I'm sure we'll ge a lame excuse how the choice ONLY effects the person taking the quest and others within the party are not effected by who's getting killed or not.. PLUS.. I hope there isn't too much instancing, as WoW is already seeing how servers can get overwelmed.. I have a bad feeling about this.. Someone mentioned earlier in the thread that the storyline missions employed phasing; that's a sort of seamless micro-instancing where you might walk into a cantina full of other players, approach a table with a storyline NPC who attacks you, forcing you to kill him to defend yourself.
If what was mentioned earlier is correct, your group would "phase" into your own mini-instance when the encounter with the NPC began, to prevent any other players from interfering with your storyline quest and once the encounter had ended, you'd re-phase back into the shared world.
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
ALSO.. take into consideration of the messed up gameplay that will result from said " 4th pillar ", aka the storyline.. Think about it.. Bioware is pushing this storyline crap down our throats yet logically from what we know, it's flawed.. Let me explain before you flame.. Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to? Lets look at this people.. These so called choices in the 4th pillar are nothing more then gaining or losing faction (rep) points with one side or the other.. NO matter how you sugarcoat it or relabel it.. Therefore, If multiple players are all taking different paths to the end game, this logically means 1) ALL players not taking the same path should be disallowed from grouping with others, or 2) Bioware allows the grouping, ignoring the faction or rep status and temporary putting the storyline element on the backburner.. Are you basing on this assumption on some evidence?
For all you (and I) know, storyline choices could lead to different bonuses to stats/abilities, they could lead to different mission branches, item rewards or yes, they could lead to different reputations with factions in the Star Wars universe, but you're assume that making different choices will put two (for example) Smugglers on different "teams" making it impossible for them to interact cooperatively. Has anyone even said whether or not it will be possible for Jedi and Sith to group? I have a gut feeling that much of these storyline quest will be instanced so that Bioware can circumvent the faction rules of their own game.. I'm sure we'll ge a lame excuse how the choice ONLY effects the person taking the quest and others within the party are not effected by who's getting killed or not.. PLUS.. I hope there isn't too much instancing, as WoW is already seeing how servers can get overwelmed.. I have a bad feeling about this.. Someone mentioned earlier in the thread that the storyline missions employed phasing; that's a sort of seamless micro-instancing where you might walk into a cantina full of other players, approach a table with a storyline NPC who attacks you, forcing you to kill him to defend yourself.
If what was mentioned earlier is correct, your group would "phase" into your own mini-instance when the encounter with the NPC began, to prevent any other players from interfering with your storyline quest and once the encounter had ended, you'd re-phase back into the shared world.
That is exactly the issue.. I heard too about "phasing" which is nothing more then soft instancing while BENDING the rules.. What phasing does is allow players to attack or not attack targets they SHOULDN'T be allowed to target in the first place.. There will be times that player A will be hated by X faction, while player B will be friendly with them.. Both players will be grouped together and phasing allows Player B to target and kill mob that is from X faction, when actually it's a friendly target.. Basically "phasing" allows Bioware to excuse themselves from what they brag about.. If player A gets jumped by mob from X faction, player B should be UNABLE to do anything about it.. However, because of logic problems, Bioware is going to install the phasing gameplay to bend their own rules..
Originally posted by Rydeson That is exactly the issue.. I heard too about "phasing" which is nothing more then soft instancing while BENDING the rules.. What phasing does is allow players to attack or not attack targets they SHOULDN'T be allowed to target in the first place.. There will be times that player A will be hated by X faction, while player B will be friendly with them.. Both players will be grouped together and phasing allows Player B to target and kill mob that is from X faction, when actually it's a friendly target.. Basically "phasing" allows Bioware to excuse themselves from what they brag about.. If player A gets jumped by mob from X faction, player B should be UNABLE to do anything about it.. However, because of logic problems, Bioware is going to install the phasing gameplay to bend their own rules.. Real smart and STUPID
And do you have a source/basis for this assumption?
Since when did being in a faction make every faction member immune to you shooting them in the face with a blaster?
Maybe that's another choice for the player; to intercede and help your buddy (and therefore lose faction standing) or to hang back, preserving your faction standing but forcing your buddy to face the encounter alone.
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
Well, heck, if I was a crafty design officer at Bioware I would easily create a server for people like the OP. Just remove all dialouge and options and plop the player down in the game world. They can run around pvp each other, then bop to various areas with mobs waiting for players to level up with and drop loot. North American server name: SAMEASOTHER MMOS EU Server Name: DARKFALL Problem Solved
ROFLMAO ...awesome post just awesome funniest thing I have read all day. I look forward to your next one.
LOL, that quote was great.
The possibility of finally having a great STORY driven MMO is what makes me look forward to SWTOR. Bioware's other games were all based on great stories (Mass effect, Kotor, Kotor2, Baldur's gate, etc). The story telling and gameplay design of Bioware is what makes their games great.
You know...you can get the same " Interactive Movie Expierence " from 90% of console games nowadays right? Because that's all that trash is over there. Except then you wouldn't have to pay a monthly fee!
*gasp*
I liked Bioware's console games for their story and gameplay. For example, playing Mass effect on hardcore and above is a non stop rush. You need good planning and good reactions to succeed. I hope that Bioware brings that same level of intensity to SWTOR. So far Bioware has not let me down so they remain one of the few companies that I am willing to buy their products before reviews.
I actually like having some sort of story as I really have enjoyed the books about the World of Warcraft and currently have ordered the new LK one hard cover edition. Without a story we get no books and heck no movie ... hmmmm man I hope there is a WOW movie one day ...
I actually like having some sort of story as I really have enjoyed the books about the World of Warcraft and currently have ordered the new LK one hard cover edition. Without a story we get no books and heck no movie ... hmmmm man I hope there is a WOW movie one day ...
I enjoyed WoW as a whole after I read a couple of the books. The game really didn't have near the tedious feel that it did before.
Originally posted by Rydeson That is exactly the issue.. I heard too about "phasing" which is nothing more then soft instancing while BENDING the rules.. What phasing does is allow players to attack or not attack targets they SHOULDN'T be allowed to target in the first place.. There will be times that player A will be hated by X faction, while player B will be friendly with them.. Both players will be grouped together and phasing allows Player B to target and kill mob that is from X faction, when actually it's a friendly target.. Basically "phasing" allows Bioware to excuse themselves from what they brag about.. If player A gets jumped by mob from X faction, player B should be UNABLE to do anything about it.. However, because of logic problems, Bioware is going to install the phasing gameplay to bend their own rules.. Real smart and STUPID
And do you have a source/basis for this assumption?
Since when did being in a faction make every faction member immune to you shooting them in the face with a blaster?
Maybe that's another choice for the player; to intercede and help your buddy (and therefore lose faction standing) or to hang back, preserving your faction standing but forcing your buddy to face the encounter alone.
Indeed, the harsh criticisms based on speculation are really astounding. Do people know exactly how this is going to work, or are they imagining the worst and working themselves up over it?
It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY! Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless. Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.
Newsflash jackass you don't speak for more than a small handful of friends not the mmo base as you seem to think and I for one do care about story since no other mmo has ever done a good job of conveying one in the first place get a clue and speak for yourself not the masses then you may actually make a valid point.
Funny thing is it took me four pages to find anyone who agreed with the op hence my own venom towards him speak for yourself and don't presume to know what everyone wants cause you obviously don't.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
ALSO.. take into consideration of the messed up gameplay that will result from said " 4th pillar ", aka the storyline.. Think about it.. Bioware is pushing this storyline crap down our throats yet logically from what we know, it's flawed.. Let me explain before you flame.. Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to? Lets look at this people.. These so called choices in the 4th pillar are nothing more then gaining or losing faction (rep) points with one side or the other.. NO matter how you sugarcoat it or relabel it.. Therefore, If multiple players are all taking different paths to the end game, this logically means 1) ALL players not taking the same path should be disallowed from grouping with others, or 2) Bioware allows the grouping, ignoring the faction or rep status and temporary putting the storyline element on the backburner.. I have a gut feeling that much of these storyline quest will be instanced so that Bioware can circumvent the faction rules of their own game.. I'm sure we'll ge a lame excuse how the choice ONLY effects the person taking the quest and others within the party are not effected by who's getting killed or not.. PLUS.. I hope there isn't too much instancing, as WoW is already seeing how servers can get overwelmed.. I have a bad feeling about this..
Your logic is flawed and you lack creativity. But let's take a closer look at your scenario...
"Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to?"
Well if your choice is to align yourself with the Sith Empire, and your friend's choice is to curry favor with the Republic, then no. You most likely will not be able to group up, and it's debatable whether or not you should be allowed to.
Exception to the rule: a third party/event threatens both the Sith and Republic. You're briefly able to join forces to thwart a common enemy.
But what if the choices aren't so polarizing?
Let's say you and your friend are both aligned with the Republic. However, you're a smuggler, while your buddy is a Jedi. Will some of your choices/motives conflict? Most likely. Does that mean you won't be able to group? Not necessarily.
For example, as a smuggler, you may have brokered a pseudo-alliance with a Hutt faction. However, your pal as a Jedi has undermined their criminal activities whenever given the opportunity.
Does this mean you can't team up? Absolutely not. However, it does seem likely that it may very well threaten your standings with the Hutt, and your chum's position within the Jedi Council. Why shouldn't it?
Looking at many posts in these forums, and the sales of games NOT mmos, I'd say the numbers prove you are wrong. As people gravitate from other gaming genres to MMOs, they want the same feeling they get playing Gears of War, Halo, or Final Fantasy. They want to feel like they are the hero, that they are a part of the story, and what they do matters to the game. They want story, and they want to be a part of that story.
You don't see the forest for the trees. The biggest part of any game is immersion. If you are doing a quest that influences the story of the game, that is immersion. Going to x and killing y is not immersion. It is grind. They are spending millions in complex storylines and days worth of audio dialogue, to create a unique experience for every player, and you are saying that is cookie-cutter and not what players want?
I think you are the one that needs to get a damn clue.
You can't be more right. You're either right or you're not.
And people don't want "the same feeling they get playing Gears of War, Halo, or Final Fantasy" if they did, they'd go out and play 'Gears of War, Halo or Final Fantasy'.
And when it comes to immersion, here's where you are catastrophically deluding yourself. How can anyone be immersed if they have to follow a pre-set story on rails and are forced to make one of four pre-written responses every three minutes? Do you know what immersion is? It's not being forcefed your own actions in a one-story-fits-all themepark.
WAKE UP^^
You both made opinions but haggus I believe has it more right than you immersion can be found in either of the things you both proclaim to not be immersive immersion is subjective to the individual dealing with said experience and I for one find immersion in kill x amount of y why? Because that's why Tazmanian tigers don't exist not because one guy went out and killed a bunch, people thought the species was dangerous and put out a bounty on that animal when it was all said and done the animal was wiped out by hundreds of people and I doubt anyone shied away from the hunt because there were hundreds more hunting them impairing there own immersion. So in this respect I find immersion in even the mundane quests you bash Haggus while at the same time hubert I can find immersion in making a choice of three options especially when it will have such far reaching ramifications for the rest of my game. I mean up to this point we have been playing games that basically gives us a slew of quests take it or leave it and even more so the ability to drop those quests right in front of the quest giver for whatever reason we choose which is excitingly out the door now it will be interesting to have real consequences to the actions we take and the decisions we make and either way you guys slice it that's as immersive as a person allows sorry those things don't meet your own lofty standards but it is what it is.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY! Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless. Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.
Newsflash jackass you don't speak for more than a small handful of friends not the mmo base as you seem to think and I for one do care about story since no other mmo has ever done a good job of conveying one in the first place get a clue and speak for yourself not the masses then you may actually make a valid point.
He's speaking about the MMO community as a whole, not enraged star wars fanatics like yourself all up in arms to defend their nerdfantasy.
It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY! Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless. Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.
Newsflash jackass you don't speak for more than a small handful of friends not the mmo base as you seem to think and I for one do care about story since no other mmo has ever done a good job of conveying one in the first place get a clue and speak for yourself not the masses then you may actually make a valid point.
He's speaking about the MMO community as a whole, not enraged star wars fanatics like yourself all up in arms to defend their nerdfantasy.
So, one angry nerd—who attempts to bolster his voice by assuming he speaks for the whole MMO nerd community—carries more weight than one (presumed) Star Wars nerd speaking for himself?
Do they make a slide rule for these types of equations?
There's a poll on the SW: ToR boards right now where BioWare has asked members of that community what aspects of MMOs they are most interested in. As of about quarter after eight CST tonight, 17 Jun 2009, the results are as follows (in order of ranked importance for your convenience):
"You are obviously confusing a mature rating with actual maturity." -Asherman
Maybe MMO is not your genre, go play Modern Warfare...or something you can be all twitchy...and rank up all night. This is seriously getting tired. -Ranyr
There's a poll on the SW: ToR boards right now where BioWare has asked members of that community what aspects of MMOs they are most interested in. As of about quarter after eight CST tonight, 17 Jun 2009, the results are as follows (in order of ranked importance for your convenience): Story: 58.55% Exploring: 50.46% PvE: 49.83% PvP: 44.93% Community: 39.99% Questing: 39.59% Roleplaying: 33.88% Crafting: 31.84%
I don't know if I should thank you for posting it, as it is very interesting and good information to have, or if I should be angry, because now a bunch of asshats from mmorpg.com are going to flood their forums in order to skew the vote.
It shows that those who are most looking forward to the game are definitely interested in story. As am I.
Comments
Nothing wrong with being skeptical. That's prudent. But bitter and angry? Really?? Over a video game?
Some people play as a hobby and a passion, so yes. Over a video game. And unfortunatly for us we're at the mercy of the developers.
Oh, nice .. thanks for that info. I was very impressed with the seamless micro-instancing that WoW brought in with Wrath of the Lich King, and I was wondering how TOR was going to handle the story stuff; do you know if it's seamless (no loading screens or big glowing portals) .. ?
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
Oh, nice .. thanks for that info. I was very impressed with the seamless micro-instancing that WoW brought in with Wrath of the Lich King, and I was wondering how TOR was going to handle the story stuff; do you know if it's seamless (no loading screens or big glowing portals) .. ?
There was no loading screen, but there was a sort of see-through barrier, I'm assuming that will be removed later on.
There is also free roaming Creatures and Enemies wandering around in the world, like other Sandbox games, so you can go on a killing spree if you so wish.
What the hell has happened to this community. Over the last few years the MMORPG.com forum community has eroded quite a bit, and this thread is a prime example of everything that is wrong with these forums.
There are so many posts in this thread that are either flat out lies or so uninformed about the subject matter that they are laughable. Yet, the posters seem to think they are presenting valid points.
My favorite are all of the "facts" being posted about TOR when none of us know anything about how the game is going to play. I can only assume that the posters are getting their "facts" from their own minds because looking at Bioware's other games, such as KOTOR, saying that TOR will be more linear than other MMO games is... just... dumb.
/sigh
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
Are you kidding me? What blows my mind is people who play mmo's and do everything in thier power to try and make it a fps. If it wasnt what people wanted, they wouldnt make it. Accept that your vision of what a game should be is flawed.
You dont think they do thier homework before they spent the kind of money it takes to develop a mmo? Your thinking is self centered and way off base.
When I said i had "time", i meant virtual time, i got no RL "time" for you.
A feature can be great in a developers eyes but lacking and horribly executed in the eyes of the player! It's happened time and time again. Have you been living under a rock?
So what's your point? If they tell you it's all rainbows and sparkles are you going to know any more than you do now? You have no basis to make a judgement. You won't until people get in the game and see how it's actually made. Even if you completely disagree with what they're doing they're not going to change it to suit you. If they make a bad game and it bombs it's no skin off your nose either way. Just wait and see what happens. Life will go on I assure you.
Fine, it's your money going to waste not mine. I just don't want to hear any massive QQ/whine post after the shit hits the fan.
/salute
I like classes and story. That's what makes an RPG and RPG. A role is the class you play and the game advances you through that class in a story. 'Nuff said. It's like taking guns away from FPS and replacing them with shoe horns. Wait? What? Why?
after reading the replies it seems like quite a few people actually give a crap about storylines....
Thank you, I dont think anyone can even value the topics starter anymore. For calling Bioware assholes for developing a storyline.. The way he said it to jsut made him sound like a whinny 9 year old with the swearing...
ALSO.. take into consideration of the messed up gameplay that will result from said " 4th pillar ", aka the storyline..
Think about it.. Bioware is pushing this storyline crap down our throats yet logically from what we know, it's flawed.. Let me explain before you flame.. Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to? Lets look at this people.. These so called choices in the 4th pillar are nothing more then gaining or losing faction (rep) points with one side or the other.. NO matter how you sugarcoat it or relabel it.. Therefore, If multiple players are all taking different paths to the end game, this logically means 1) ALL players not taking the same path should be disallowed from grouping with others, or 2) Bioware allows the grouping, ignoring the faction or rep status and temporary putting the storyline element on the backburner..
I have a gut feeling that much of these storyline quest will be instanced so that Bioware can circumvent the faction rules of their own game.. I'm sure we'll ge a lame excuse how the choice ONLY effects the person taking the quest and others within the party are not effected by who's getting killed or not.. PLUS.. I hope there isn't too much instancing, as WoW is already seeing how servers can get overwelmed.. I have a bad feeling about this..
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
That is exactly the issue.. I heard too about "phasing" which is nothing more then soft instancing while BENDING the rules.. What phasing does is allow players to attack or not attack targets they SHOULDN'T be allowed to target in the first place.. There will be times that player A will be hated by X faction, while player B will be friendly with them.. Both players will be grouped together and phasing allows Player B to target and kill mob that is from X faction, when actually it's a friendly target.. Basically "phasing" allows Bioware to excuse themselves from what they brag about.. If player A gets jumped by mob from X faction, player B should be UNABLE to do anything about it.. However, because of logic problems, Bioware is going to install the phasing gameplay to bend their own rules..
Real smart and STUPID
And do you have a source/basis for this assumption?
Since when did being in a faction make every faction member immune to you shooting them in the face with a blaster?
Maybe that's another choice for the player; to intercede and help your buddy (and therefore lose faction standing) or to hang back, preserving your faction standing but forcing your buddy to face the encounter alone.
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift
ROFLMAO ...awesome post just awesome funniest thing I have read all day. I look forward to your next one.
LOL, that quote was great.
The possibility of finally having a great STORY driven MMO is what makes me look forward to SWTOR. Bioware's other games were all based on great stories (Mass effect, Kotor, Kotor2, Baldur's gate, etc). The story telling and gameplay design of Bioware is what makes their games great.
You know...you can get the same " Interactive Movie Expierence " from 90% of console games nowadays right? Because that's all that trash is over there. Except then you wouldn't have to pay a monthly fee!
*gasp*
I liked Bioware's console games for their story and gameplay. For example, playing Mass effect on hardcore and above is a non stop rush. You need good planning and good reactions to succeed. I hope that Bioware brings that same level of intensity to SWTOR. So far Bioware has not let me down so they remain one of the few companies that I am willing to buy their products before reviews.
I actually like having some sort of story as I really have enjoyed the books about the World of Warcraft and currently have ordered the new LK one hard cover edition. Without a story we get no books and heck no movie ... hmmmm man I hope there is a WOW movie one day ...
I enjoyed WoW as a whole after I read a couple of the books. The game really didn't have near the tedious feel that it did before.
But that's just me.
And do you have a source/basis for this assumption?
Since when did being in a faction make every faction member immune to you shooting them in the face with a blaster?
Maybe that's another choice for the player; to intercede and help your buddy (and therefore lose faction standing) or to hang back, preserving your faction standing but forcing your buddy to face the encounter alone.
Indeed, the harsh criticisms based on speculation are really astounding. Do people know exactly how this is going to work, or are they imagining the worst and working themselves up over it?
Newsflash jackass you don't speak for more than a small handful of friends not the mmo base as you seem to think and I for one do care about story since no other mmo has ever done a good job of conveying one in the first place get a clue and speak for yourself not the masses then you may actually make a valid point.
Funny thing is it took me four pages to find anyone who agreed with the op hence my own venom towards him speak for yourself and don't presume to know what everyone wants cause you obviously don't.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Your logic is flawed and you lack creativity. But let's take a closer look at your scenario...
"Lets assume 2 friends start characters together, yet they do not make the same choices when advancing thru their character.. How are they able to group up? and should they be allowed to?"
Well if your choice is to align yourself with the Sith Empire, and your friend's choice is to curry favor with the Republic, then no. You most likely will not be able to group up, and it's debatable whether or not you should be allowed to.
Exception to the rule: a third party/event threatens both the Sith and Republic. You're briefly able to join forces to thwart a common enemy.
But what if the choices aren't so polarizing?
Let's say you and your friend are both aligned with the Republic. However, you're a smuggler, while your buddy is a Jedi. Will some of your choices/motives conflict? Most likely. Does that mean you won't be able to group? Not necessarily.
For example, as a smuggler, you may have brokered a pseudo-alliance with a Hutt faction. However, your pal as a Jedi has undermined their criminal activities whenever given the opportunity.
Does this mean you can't team up? Absolutely not. However, it does seem likely that it may very well threaten your standings with the Hutt, and your chum's position within the Jedi Council. Why shouldn't it?
Big font doesn't make you more right.
Looking at many posts in these forums, and the sales of games NOT mmos, I'd say the numbers prove you are wrong. As people gravitate from other gaming genres to MMOs, they want the same feeling they get playing Gears of War, Halo, or Final Fantasy. They want to feel like they are the hero, that they are a part of the story, and what they do matters to the game. They want story, and they want to be a part of that story.
You don't see the forest for the trees. The biggest part of any game is immersion. If you are doing a quest that influences the story of the game, that is immersion. Going to x and killing y is not immersion. It is grind. They are spending millions in complex storylines and days worth of audio dialogue, to create a unique experience for every player, and you are saying that is cookie-cutter and not what players want?
I think you are the one that needs to get a damn clue.
You can't be more right. You're either right or you're not.
And people don't want "the same feeling they get playing Gears of War, Halo, or Final Fantasy" if they did, they'd go out and play 'Gears of War, Halo or Final Fantasy'.
And when it comes to immersion, here's where you are catastrophically deluding yourself. How can anyone be immersed if they have to follow a pre-set story on rails and are forced to make one of four pre-written responses every three minutes? Do you know what immersion is? It's not being forcefed your own actions in a one-story-fits-all themepark.
WAKE UP^^
You both made opinions but haggus I believe has it more right than you immersion can be found in either of the things you both proclaim to not be immersive immersion is subjective to the individual dealing with said experience and I for one find immersion in kill x amount of y why? Because that's why Tazmanian tigers don't exist not because one guy went out and killed a bunch, people thought the species was dangerous and put out a bounty on that animal when it was all said and done the animal was wiped out by hundreds of people and I doubt anyone shied away from the hunt because there were hundreds more hunting them impairing there own immersion. So in this respect I find immersion in even the mundane quests you bash Haggus while at the same time hubert I can find immersion in making a choice of three options especially when it will have such far reaching ramifications for the rest of my game. I mean up to this point we have been playing games that basically gives us a slew of quests take it or leave it and even more so the ability to drop those quests right in front of the quest giver for whatever reason we choose which is excitingly out the door now it will be interesting to have real consequences to the actions we take and the decisions we make and either way you guys slice it that's as immersive as a person allows sorry those things don't meet your own lofty standards but it is what it is.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Newsflash jackass you don't speak for more than a small handful of friends not the mmo base as you seem to think and I for one do care about story since no other mmo has ever done a good job of conveying one in the first place get a clue and speak for yourself not the masses then you may actually make a valid point.
He's speaking about the MMO community as a whole, not enraged star wars fanatics like yourself all up in arms to defend their nerdfantasy.
this post makes my eyes have herpes
There are times when one must ask themselves is it my passion that truly frightens you? Or your own?
Newsflash jackass you don't speak for more than a small handful of friends not the mmo base as you seem to think and I for one do care about story since no other mmo has ever done a good job of conveying one in the first place get a clue and speak for yourself not the masses then you may actually make a valid point.
He's speaking about the MMO community as a whole, not enraged star wars fanatics like yourself all up in arms to defend their nerdfantasy.
So, one angry nerd—who attempts to bolster his voice by assuming he speaks for the whole MMO nerd community—carries more weight than one (presumed) Star Wars nerd speaking for himself?
Do they make a slide rule for these types of equations?
There's a poll on the SW: ToR boards right now where BioWare has asked members of that community what aspects of MMOs they are most interested in. As of about quarter after eight CST tonight, 17 Jun 2009, the results are as follows (in order of ranked importance for your convenience):
Story: 58.55%
Exploring: 50.46%
PvE: 49.83%
PvP: 44.93%
Community: 39.99%
Questing: 39.59%
Roleplaying: 33.88%
Crafting: 31.84%
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=18374
Firebrand Art
"You are obviously confusing a mature rating with actual maturity." -Asherman
Maybe MMO is not your genre, go play Modern Warfare...or something you can be all twitchy...and rank up all night. This is seriously getting tired. -Ranyr
Wow... that's pretty telling, isn't it?
I don't know if I should thank you for posting it, as it is very interesting and good information to have, or if I should be angry, because now a bunch of asshats from mmorpg.com are going to flood their forums in order to skew the vote.
It shows that those who are most looking forward to the game are definitely interested in story. As am I.