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Blaming Blizzard for bad MMORPG's is just silly.
Teala
Member RarePosts: 7,627
People are constantly slamming Blizzard for all the POS MMORPG's that have been released since its debut and this is just silly. Let's look at this from another angle. If Ford produces a bad car do we blame Honda? If Maytag produces a bad washer to we blame Westinghouse? No. You blame the people responsible - the company behind the product. Why is it then that in the case of MMORPG's when ever a game is released and it turns out bad so many people turn and point the finger at Blizzard instead of the people and company behind the game? Did Blizzard make the game? Did they produce the game? Did they have anything to do with the gmes design or how it was programmed or what direction the games designer took it?
The simple and correct answer is - No. No they did not. It was the games designers and producers that created and released the game and not Blizzard. If they triedto copy Blizzard's game design and failed - then it is still not Blizzards fault but the company that tried to copy it - it is their fault.
So the next time you go pointing a finger at Blizzard - think about the reality of it. Blizzard didn't make that game - that other company did. They designed it. They produced it. They released it. Just as when Ford makes a car that is bad we don't go blaming Honda for it - we blame Ford.
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If Ford created a piece of junk car and sold a record number of them and then GM, Toyota and on and on did the same hoping to cash in then yeah, i would blame Ford for the influx of junk on the market.
You can't redefine sucessful as junk. I think nearly every mass production car since the early 70's is fugly. That doesn't make me the worlds foremost authority on automobile styling. Obviously someone likes all those cars.
I cant agree with that. If the only cars available are all fugly (which I do agree) you still need a car so you buy the least fugly. We are limited to what we buy, by what is available.
Crybabies need someone to hate on, and its Blizzard.
Exactly. People are making games that are, face it, strikingly similar to WoW because they ARE trying to copy that ineffable thing that makes WoW so popular. WoW is shit, and the other games are even worse, so they are super-shit. People are trying to snag that market share by copying what exists instead of trying something new. I do, however, blame the companies doing it more than Blizzard, but Blizzard is the reason this is happening.
And you cannot deny that it is happening.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
WTF? No subscription fee?
Great analogy.
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Great analogy.
Its called capitalism. Luckily, Honda and Toyota make better cars than Ford and GM, which is why they didn't need to be saved(or close to it).
Why these companies aren't striving to be better than WoW should be the question. I think they are purposely creating the same thing, but with less quality. Makes no business sense, and it shows.
I'm confident we will get back to capitalism in the MMO market. Right now, its a pretty uncompetitive. You have Blizzard with like 80% of the market share? That's insane.
Great analogy.
That's a pretty shitty analogy actually. Who decided it was junk? 1 of 100 people? You obviously don't like WoW so of course it's great analogy to you. In fact it doesn't matter if it is the worlds best car or a piece of shit, it sold a record number. Of course competitors are gonna try and copy it. But the copies aren't as good as the original which is the problem.
I absolutely shudder to think where PC gaming would be without Blizzard.
Blizzard created the standard for RTS with warcraft 1-2 and SC1 (and SC2 is shaping up to be absolutely amazing).
Blizzard is about the only people who can make a truly great hack'n'slash game with Diablo1 and then the masterpiece than is D2 (D3 is still too early to tell, but looks alright) Don't sit there and tell me TQ or Dungeon Siege comes even !@#$ing close.
Blizzard came in and made people actually create AAA mmo's! They created a system which a lot of people truly like, and improve on it in every major content patch (removing tedious things, making things more enjoyable for new players, yet making the sense of progression actual on the new content). I will say that this has hurt good ideas, as the barrier to entry (fiscally and quality wise) is almost insurmountable, except for a company like blizzard who understands quality development takes time and money.
edit: The real barrier to entry is player expectations of brand new games to not have bugs and have the content of a 5 year insanely well funded game.
Blizzard owns the PC gaming market. They are the last developer outside of Bethesda I can trust in the PC market. Trusting a company is a crazy thing in this day and age--cherish it.
I actually thought TQ was better then Diablo, as far as features go. I expect D3 to be damn good though.SC2, not so much, looking and sounding pretty meh. Plus buying three different boxes to play Terran ,Zerg, Protoss story? People will probably buy one for the multiplayer and torrent the rest to experience the story. Didn't they also take out LAN?
I don't blame Blizz for the other compagnies bad games, but I do blame Blizz for the regression of MMORPG's communities quality.
WoW brought millions of clueless sheeple to the genre which, imo, don't even want or like MMORPG's. They just mindlessly follow the herd... Those guys( & gals) are actively influencing the genre toward the single player game "Me, myself & I" mindset & thats pitiful for a genre that is supposse to be "Massive" & "Multiplayer" & "Role playing".
Blizz is guilty of mass advertizement that resulted in an influx of morons condammed to surfe the commerial "brainwashed" thrends all their pitiful life.
Maybe I'm a bit harsh, but thats kinda how I feel when I think about the piss poor community we have today.
Sorry if I offended some WoW fanbois & no you are not all morons & sheeps.
That doesn't make sense. Piece of junk cars do not sell record numbers. Piece of junk games don't sell record numbers either.
WoW is a good game. It is not easier than any other MMO out there, it's just more accessible. Therein lies the difference which confuses people.
Edit: I also don't understand where the instant gratification thing is coming from. For example, It took me about a month to collect enough gold to purchase my first epic flying mount back in The Burning Crusade. Where is that instant gratification? Where is the "me, me, me, now, now, now?" I worked for a month to get it because I wanted it. Was I gratified? Yes I was. Was it instant? Only if you consider a month to be instant.
I can't tell if this was a blow to the people that enjoy soloing or the communities attitudes.
I like soloing. Soloing has nothing to do with playing a SP game. It's about playing at your own pace, not having to be speed up or slowed down. You can claim everything that drops and do practically what you want. The problem with grouping in WoW is it became entirely to serious. Grouping revolves only around benefits. It's not encouraged for fun. If you was forced to group every night for raids, wouldn't you wanna have some alone time?
Again, I'm not so sure what you was getting at. Hopefully I explained that right.
Oh and for what it's worth Massive Multiplayer Role Playing has nothing to do with grouping, grouping should be and should always be an option, not something forced on you. There is more reasons to play a MMO then grouping.
Also, if you think that the other 2 SC2 campaigns wont also improve on the multiplayer then you deserve the same except double.
People blame WoW for everything that is wrong in the MMO genre. Its easy and all the "cool kids" are doing it.
But why stop at just MMOs?
WoW also causes cancer, caused the recession and the swine flu and is the cause of every war ever.
Great analogy.
That's a pretty shitty analogy actually. Who decided it was junk? 1 of 100 people? You obviously don't like WoW so of course it's great analogy to you. In fact it doesn't matter if it is the worlds best car or a piece of shit, it sold a record number. Of course competitors are gonna try and copy it. But the copies aren't as good as the original which is the problem.
Actually, any serious game reviewer that is able to look beyond flash and polish to see the game underneath. Notice I said, serious. Not many of those guys left though.
WoW was released with horrible reviews from those kinds of places, but amazing reviews from places that have a habit of hyping bad, but high budget games. Your faithful MMORPG.com's release review was terrible, but it was changed a few years ago after WoW hit it's record MMO numbers to keep people from leaving. I don't blame them one bit, it would have pretty much killed their site.
I have yet to meet a gamer, that understands game mechanics, that has said WoW was a good game. Only about 1/20 true gamers, really understand game mechanics and play games based on that though.
I've actually played WoW off an on since it was closed beta. It's really not a good game, but it did tied me over for the last year or so. It's playable, to an extent. But, on the other hand, I see EVE as a beautiful game that has so many great aspects.... but for me it's not playable due to a couple key factors. Mechanically though, it's a work of art and I'm glad it's found a dedicated player base to keep it alive.
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Also, if you think that the other 2 SC2 campaigns wont also improve on the multiplayer then you deserve the same except double.
LOL?
Apparently Blizzard sees a nice way to make some money off of this. If nobody really cared about the story then why sell the box with one campaign per box? It's a good business move to sell updates and story separate. I'm just not going to go for it. SC was a good game, it just wasn't that good. It's my opinion, I guess I'm wrong though, right?
You can't redefine sucessful as junk. I think nearly every mass production car since the early 70's is fugly. That doesn't make me the worlds foremost authority on automobile styling. Obviously someone likes all those cars.
Really?
McDonald's.
Very successful and the very definition of junk (food).
I can't tell if this was a blow to the people that enjoy soloing or the communities attitudes.
I like soloing. Soloing has nothing to do with playing a SP game. It's about playing at your own pace, not having to be speed up or slowed down. You can claim everything that drops and do practically what you want. The problem with grouping in WoW is it became entirely to serious. Grouping revolves only around benefits. It's not encouraged for fun. If you was forced to group every night for raids, wouldn't you wanna have some alone time?
Again, I'm not so sure what you was getting at. Hopefully I explained that right.
Oh and for what it's worth Massive Multiplayer Role Playing has nothing to do with grouping, grouping should be and should always be an option, not something forced on you. There is more reasons to play a MMO then grouping.
Its about the communiies attitudes for the most part, sorry if it wasn't clear enough.
As for group vs solo, MMO's should always give you reason to group, but never force you to. On this matter, I like how Aion is made. I think an easy balance to stike would be 50/50 solo/group at all level tiers ... you can skip 50% of the game if you wish, but don't expect to have to best stuff, thats just unrealistic imo.
I find it ironic that most the folks who put down WoW now were probably big time WoW players back in 2005- 07. I think most people rag on WoW because it is the cool thing to do.
World of Warcraft is a damn fine game. Of course, it is not perfect, but it is a solid title. The simple fact is most of these "haters" are former WoW fans who simply played the game so much that they don't find it fun anymore. It's kinda like gorging on a food till you get sick and that ruins a favorite food for you till the day you die.
Familiarity breeds contempt. In this case it is so true.
The reason some of today's titles are a let down is very simple: They simply suck. Sure, some companies are trying to copy and cash in on WoW's success, but that is the fault of the copycats, not Blizzard.
The other reason so many games "suck" is that they don't really suck. That's right, they don't suck. Players are just acting like spoiled brats. Sure, some games really do bight, but there are many good titles out there. It's just that it is fashionable to bash any title to look cool regardless of how the game actually is.
There are some truely bad games out there as well as some very good ones, but I can make a valid case that it may well be the players themselves who are "full of fail"... not the games.
You can't redefine sucessful as junk. I think nearly every mass production car since the early 70's is fugly. That doesn't make me the worlds foremost authority on automobile styling. Obviously someone likes all those cars.
Really?
McDonald's.
Very successful and the very definition of junk (food).
McDonald's provides food -- a necessity. it is popular because the food it provides is cheap and for about $7 or so you can get a complete meal. Since there are a lot of poor people in the US, cheap food is a hot commodity.
World of Warcraft provides entertainment in a form of a video game -- not a necessity. The game is popular because it appeals to a lot of people. Since WoW is a totally optional form of entertainment and if the game sucked it would never have gotten so popular, I don't see how the McDonald's analogy works in this case.
I agree that it is unrealistic to have the best gear from soloing. My problem with grouping in WoW, is it never encourages you to do it for fun. I think this is why so many want world PvP back in WoW. It was something that was not required or forced, it was something you grouped for, for fun. Nothing more. There was no benefits.
This all reflects in the communities attitude. My guild has kicked people for not bringing pots, buff food, or screwing up on a fight, even if it was there first time there, hell I have seen people that pull less dps then required, but survived boss fights that the high dps could not. It's not about fun anymore, it's about benificial things. And there are plenty of guilds out there like this, so I don't wanna hear "thats just your guild". Over a coarse of five years I have seen a ton of guilds just like the one I was in before leaving WoW. This type of crap even happens in PuGs.
So basically what I'm saying. Having benifits is fine, but don't take the fun out of it. I don't blame Blizzard for this to be honest, I blame the community for getting out of hand with it.
before somebody takes this the wrong way, it's not the entire community, just most of the people I have ran into.
I think the mmorpg market just isn't big enough. Blizzard dont' leave room for other game to success.
Totally agree. I dont point the finger at anyone but the company making the MMO. Ncsoft/anet ftw!!
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
The McDonald's analogy is old and overused. It's not "clever" any more.
(I don't play WoW right now, and I'm not a fanboy, just to get that out there ...)
Blizzard did something that no company has done before. They were able to create an iteration of the MMORPG formula that actually appealed to people who, prior to that, had no interest in online gaming. These were not the same people (techies, geeks, D&D'ers, RPG'ers, etc) that drooled when they first read about UO, and played UO, EQ, and every other MMO they could get their hands on since. These are more "average people" to whom WoW actually caters very effectively.
So they were successful.
WoW has it's merits. It's accessible. It can cater to hardcore players and casual players in the same game world. It's about as polished as any MMORPG. And, feel free to disagree, but between high-end raids and high-rating arenas, also boasts some of the most difficult challenges. In sum, it's quite a package.
And so Blizzard (or more accurately, Vivendi) made a lot of money.
And now everyone wants a piece of the pie.
So, for the duration of the "near future" there will undoubtedly be more "WoW-clones." Sooner or later, though, someone else will create a different, successful iteration of the MMO formula, and only then will the MMO genre transform again.
And I look forward to it. 5 years of WoW's rule is enough ... and though I don't play, I've had an active sub since day 1. I need some new candy!
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Played - UO, FFXI, WAR, WoW, EVE
Currently - Bored.
Other companies could tap into the WoW crowd if they stopped trying to out WoW, WoW. The people trying to leave WoW are not looking for another WoW to play. It has nothing to do with room, it has more so to do with games trying to be like it.