Lastly, if anyone has been keeping up with the STO forums and announcements, you would have read that the devs and pro testers have a vested intertest in Star Trek. Every one of them has been a fan of the franchise for years and years. The Mythic devs were big Warhammer fans, supposedly. Star Trek fans can be evil when it comes to their critical reviews; Cryptic knows they have a HOT hand grenade in their hands. They have already been receiving volumes of input from fans in regards to gaffs and errors on continuum; they have been making huge efforts to make changes to correct these continuity holes before release. I believe that this "personal investment" in the product may see a level of quality that we may not have seen before. If I were working for Cryptic, my family would probably be torqued at me, since I am already a workaholic. I would get lost in what I was doing to make it a really great game. Watch the video of the tour that is available; these Trekkies and Trekkers have Star Trek memorabilia all over the office and their personal cubicles.
I'm sure that's no accident. Jeebus, people are gullible.
Having worked at Games Workshop for a while at an official retail store and having been involved in the table-top wargaming hobby for over a decade...I've yet to figure out how they were fans of the Warhammer IP. Maybe in a sense of this company is going to let us used an established IP to make a game that very loosely lives up to the spirit of what the game's lore entails? I certainly don't believe the game they created is an effort by true fans of the game who have played it in any great detail for a number of years.
The same way the developers at Cryptic are "hardcore Star Trek fans who do in-depth analysis of the episodes and movies to decide what design decisions to make to ensure an authentic Star Trek experience".
If I had to guess, I would say that initial box sales is the #1 most important thing to todays MMORPG investors. I agree with you that it seems completely ass backwards, but that's just the way Hollywood works, baby.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
I think players sould vote with their feet, but not staff writers or MMO sites. They should say the truth as they see it but running ads for what they feel is dubous is fine. It is for us to make are minds up and not to join the game.
I think players sould vote with their feet, but not staff writers or MMO sites. They should say the truth as they see it but running ads for what they feel is dubous is fine. It is for us to make are minds up and not to join the game.
I just don't see the "grassroots" infrastructure to mobilize gamers to vote with there feet. What's needed for that to happen is for a core group of dedicated people to come together and build a Gamer's Union and build a significant member base to which course of action can easily be communicated and that the members actually carry out. As it is putting up a post on one of many gaming forums and expecting a large, significant turnout is ineffective.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Another article from Mr Wood having a go at MMO marketing. He is really not going to get that invite to the MMO PR Christmas party is he? I think a lot of MMO’s now have their main focus on initial sales. They are being conceived and built like solo games, which only need to last a player one to two months. In the solo game market you don’t need the content to keep a player subbing. The strategy is that as long as enough initial sales are made it does not matter if the MMO is a long term success, a profit has been made already.
Well, I don't know what the "cut" is for the company on box sales. Its quite possible they only make $10 a box ... or they might make $30 (I'd really like to know what that number is).
But even if its $30 a box and they sell a million copies, that's only $30M ... when you hear bonuses of $20M for early release thrown around (like we're hearing for STO) then the box sales don't cover development, deployment, PR costs, servers, etc.
I'm thinking they rely heavily on the people that buy the box, tinker with the game for a couple of months, stop playing and don't cancel their monthly ... heck I have plenty of friends that subscribe to games they aren't playing for months before they get around to canceling the subscription.
I agree on all counts with the O.P.. It's nice to see these issues highlighted in the columns. Players have said similar things in forums, but game companies usually just dismiss good forum feedback, calling it the useless rants of the vocal minority.
A lot of the gaming houses that have taken this position are now in the toilet, or heading there too btw. Makes me wonder what it takes to actually get them to recognize important feedback.
Beta hype is another angle that might be considered as well to boost box sales. I think for most people a new game that does things a bit differently from what has been seen is refreshing and instills hope in people which translates into good word of mouth. Of course we all know that after the "honeymoon" things look a bit different but thats after the millions of boxes have been sold. Aion was a stroke of genius with their beta weekends, allowing only a portion to be seen and promising revolutionary PVP to come later.So was the beta for testing or to generate hype?
They are awarding bonuses of $20M to STO for early release, is that for real? You are creating a situation where designers will say ‘job done’ when they know it is not.
The idea of a Gamers Union is a fascinating one, it would give a coherence to our issues, someone might actually take notice then. There are many gamer sites, if they could come together to have one voice you could get the industry to wake up. You are going to get many opinions about the way MMO’s should go, that’s fine as long as it is not the one way they are all headed currently.
... The idea of a Gamers Union is a fascinating one, it would give a coherence to our issues, someone might actually take notice then. There are many gamer sites, if they could come together to have one voice you could get the industry to wake up. You are going to get many opinions about the way MMO’s should go, that’s fine as long as it is not the one way they are all headed currently.
I thought the Stardock Gamer's Bill of Rights was a good start... not much came of it though?
... The idea of a Gamers Union is a fascinating one, it would give a coherence to our issues, someone might actually take notice then. There are many gamer sites, if they could come together to have one voice you could get the industry to wake up. You are going to get many opinions about the way MMO’s should go, that’s fine as long as it is not the one way they are all headed currently.
I thought the Stardock Gamer's Bill of Rights was a good start... not much came of it though?
At the very least, if some gaming companies ever ask themselves, "Hey why are the masses avoiding our games like the plague?" work like this should give them some helpful information, if they're willing to listen.
They are awarding bonuses of $20M to STO for early release, is that for real? You are creating a situation where designers will say ‘job done’ when they know it is not. The idea of a Gamers Union is a fascinating one, it would give a coherence to our issues, someone might actually take notice then. There are many gamer sites, if they could come together to have one voice you could get the industry to wake up. You are going to get many opinions about the way MMO’s should go, that’s fine as long as it is not the one way they are all headed currently.
Actually, I think the industry woke up. Gamers of mmos are pretty much extremely disloyal and impatient, pretty quick to pass judgement and move to next game. I have seen many post in games saying that "I am only playing game X until game Y release". Company would have to be dumb to not restrain their investments considering that the boom of mmo players is pretty much over with the addition of the economic crisis. Well established games already recover their investments and they are pretty comfortable, with their current player base.
I think the mmo industry will be reduced to a few well established p2p games and some f2p ones. It is pretty much sad that probably the innovation will take a big hit because it is easy to try innovate in single player games, going to multiplayer options. Saving money of servers and avoiding dealing with moody players is a winner.
I got lured into CO due to friends and access to the STO BETA. Luckily, I didnt purchase the lifetime membership. I am quite happy about my LOTRO lifetime membership.
I am a bit dissappointed with the process of getting in STO as it is a game I have looking forward to. Wont be suckered again as they really got me in my weakspot for a need of a good SCI FI game. Tried EVE and Fallen Earth. Both are good games, but didnt have the staying power for me.
I tryout BETAs for two reasons... help the game become better and see if the game will be able to keep my interest.
Aion's getting rap3d by bots at the moment. I don't think it'll live long enough to see a worthwhile investment in those "one million boxes sold" subscriptions.
Good read and I agree. Buyer beware. If you intend to pay to get into a close beta, make sure it is actually a closed beta and not a showcase of the lower levels to draw you into the game.
Real beta's are a pain. Your there to test the game and break it anyway you can and provide feedback to the dev and they actually chat with you about shortcomings. The dev's try and fix items and rinse and repeat until the game is playable. These days your there to preview the game and go out and tell everyone how fantastic it is. Then you get the game and realize yep these levels were great but where is the rest of the game.
Check into the beta and find out what your really going to be doing. Previewing a game the first 10 to 30 levels is not a beta test it is a preview thought up from a marketing firm.
I'm sure it's been said somewhere in the 140 responses that I didn't have time to read everyone but I blame players.
Players used to get into betas because they cared and wanted to help. In recent years players try to get into betas to get the low down on how to power level their character and to find bugs they WON'T report to abuse on launch. So players have made it a big deal to get into a closed beta.
It only takes someone with moderate brains to realize it was an untapped profit market and to start using it as a sales pitch.
I think it´s fine that companies reward loyal customers with beta-access to new products. Actually I like the idea.
QFT.
Treating us to inside access, is like Fileplanet offering it's subscribers a perk like beta access to stuff. Just good business sense to dangle a shiny carrot in front of our eyes.
We've already proven we have an interest in their stuff, so getting someone dedicated enough to plink down 250 bones for the box and the lifetime subscription to beta seems like a good idea.
I do agree with OP though, that turnover is probably a good indicator of game health.
Personally, I love CO and don't regret the purchase of the lifetime sub.
And that CO promo with STO closed Beta Invite, was a maneuver worthy of a Ferengi. I did not appreciate personally at all, specially since it was advertised in STO's website too, fishing for eager STO fans.
- Duke Suraknar - Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
OK Here is my problem with the way Cryptic handled the lifetime subs. At 600.00 you have paid for a lifetime sub for CO, But the box costs $50.00, Leaving 37 months of subs left that the money bought. Meaning to me that you would have to play CO regularly for 3 years b4 the lifetime started to pay off. Sorry but it seems a rip off to me. I have played many MMOs over the years and very rarely does any of them attract that kind of loyalty, The devs just don't put in enough content to keep anyone playing that long (games like EVE are an exception here).
Usually after the third expansion, they seem to quit altogether with content and just coast. A lot of the people I play with bought the lifetime sub and now I don't even see them playing anymore. Of course the STO beta might be running 24/7 but who knows?
Couldn't agree more with Jon on this. Good article and i commend you for singling out offenders and getting down to the gritty details. Keep up the good work.
Just to make things clear... I speak for myself and no one else, unless i state otherwise mine is just an opinion. A fact is something that can be independently verified, you may challenge such but with proof. You have every right to disagree with me through sound argument, i believe in constructive debate, but baseless aggression will warrant an unkind response.
Comments
I'm sure that's no accident. Jeebus, people are gullible.
Having worked at Games Workshop for a while at an official retail store and having been involved in the table-top wargaming hobby for over a decade...I've yet to figure out how they were fans of the Warhammer IP. Maybe in a sense of this company is going to let us used an established IP to make a game that very loosely lives up to the spirit of what the game's lore entails? I certainly don't believe the game they created is an effort by true fans of the game who have played it in any great detail for a number of years.
The same way the developers at Cryptic are "hardcore Star Trek fans who do in-depth analysis of the episodes and movies to decide what design decisions to make to ensure an authentic Star Trek experience".
If I had to guess, I would say that initial box sales is the #1 most important thing to todays MMORPG investors. I agree with you that it seems completely ass backwards, but that's just the way Hollywood works, baby.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
I think players sould vote with their feet, but not staff writers or MMO sites. They should say the truth as they see it but running ads for what they feel is dubous is fine. It is for us to make are minds up and not to join the game.
I just don't see the "grassroots" infrastructure to mobilize gamers to vote with there feet. What's needed for that to happen is for a core group of dedicated people to come together and build a Gamer's Union and build a significant member base to which course of action can easily be communicated and that the members actually carry out. As it is putting up a post on one of many gaming forums and expecting a large, significant turnout is ineffective.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
Well, I don't know what the "cut" is for the company on box sales. Its quite possible they only make $10 a box ... or they might make $30 (I'd really like to know what that number is).
But even if its $30 a box and they sell a million copies, that's only $30M ... when you hear bonuses of $20M for early release thrown around (like we're hearing for STO) then the box sales don't cover development, deployment, PR costs, servers, etc.
I'm thinking they rely heavily on the people that buy the box, tinker with the game for a couple of months, stop playing and don't cancel their monthly ... heck I have plenty of friends that subscribe to games they aren't playing for months before they get around to canceling the subscription.
I agree on all counts with the O.P.. It's nice to see these issues highlighted in the columns. Players have said similar things in forums, but game companies usually just dismiss good forum feedback, calling it the useless rants of the vocal minority.
A lot of the gaming houses that have taken this position are now in the toilet, or heading there too btw. Makes me wonder what it takes to actually get them to recognize important feedback.
Beta hype is another angle that might be considered as well to boost box sales. I think for most people a new game that does things a bit differently from what has been seen is refreshing and instills hope in people which translates into good word of mouth. Of course we all know that after the "honeymoon" things look a bit different but thats after the millions of boxes have been sold. Aion was a stroke of genius with their beta weekends, allowing only a portion to be seen and promising revolutionary PVP to come later.So was the beta for testing or to generate hype?
They are awarding bonuses of $20M to STO for early release, is that for real? You are creating a situation where designers will say ‘job done’ when they know it is not.
The idea of a Gamers Union is a fascinating one, it would give a coherence to our issues, someone might actually take notice then. There are many gamer sites, if they could come together to have one voice you could get the industry to wake up. You are going to get many opinions about the way MMO’s should go, that’s fine as long as it is not the one way they are all headed currently.
I thought the Stardock Gamer's Bill of Rights was a good start... not much came of it though?
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
I thought the Stardock Gamer's Bill of Rights was a good start... not much came of it though?
At the very least, if some gaming companies ever ask themselves, "Hey why are the masses avoiding our games like the plague?" work like this should give them some helpful information, if they're willing to listen.
Actually, I think the industry woke up. Gamers of mmos are pretty much extremely disloyal and impatient, pretty quick to pass judgement and move to next game. I have seen many post in games saying that "I am only playing game X until game Y release". Company would have to be dumb to not restrain their investments considering that the boom of mmo players is pretty much over with the addition of the economic crisis. Well established games already recover their investments and they are pretty comfortable, with their current player base.
I think the mmo industry will be reduced to a few well established p2p games and some f2p ones. It is pretty much sad that probably the innovation will take a big hit because it is easy to try innovate in single player games, going to multiplayer options. Saving money of servers and avoiding dealing with moody players is a winner.
I got lured into CO due to friends and access to the STO BETA. Luckily, I didnt purchase the lifetime membership. I am quite happy about my LOTRO lifetime membership.
I am a bit dissappointed with the process of getting in STO as it is a game I have looking forward to. Wont be suckered again as they really got me in my weakspot for a need of a good SCI FI game. Tried EVE and Fallen Earth. Both are good games, but didnt have the staying power for me.
I tryout BETAs for two reasons... help the game become better and see if the game will be able to keep my interest.
Good article btw
Triston Master Carbine/Master Swords (SWG Eclipse)
Triston 29 Warden (EQ2 Permafrost)
Weland 70 Hunter (WoW Hellscream)
Suidan 36 Cleric (Vanguard Flamehammer)
Suidan 50 Champion (LOTR Gladden)
Aion's getting rap3d by bots at the moment. I don't think it'll live long enough to see a worthwhile investment in those "one million boxes sold" subscriptions.
Good read and I agree. Buyer beware. If you intend to pay to get into a close beta, make sure it is actually a closed beta and not a showcase of the lower levels to draw you into the game.
Real beta's are a pain. Your there to test the game and break it anyway you can and provide feedback to the dev and they actually chat with you about shortcomings. The dev's try and fix items and rinse and repeat until the game is playable. These days your there to preview the game and go out and tell everyone how fantastic it is. Then you get the game and realize yep these levels were great but where is the rest of the game.
Check into the beta and find out what your really going to be doing. Previewing a game the first 10 to 30 levels is not a beta test it is a preview thought up from a marketing firm.
I'm sure it's been said somewhere in the 140 responses that I didn't have time to read everyone but I blame players.
Players used to get into betas because they cared and wanted to help. In recent years players try to get into betas to get the low down on how to power level their character and to find bugs they WON'T report to abuse on launch. So players have made it a big deal to get into a closed beta.
It only takes someone with moderate brains to realize it was an untapped profit market and to start using it as a sales pitch.
QFT.
Treating us to inside access, is like Fileplanet offering it's subscribers a perk like beta access to stuff. Just good business sense to dangle a shiny carrot in front of our eyes.
We've already proven we have an interest in their stuff, so getting someone dedicated enough to plink down 250 bones for the box and the lifetime subscription to beta seems like a good idea.
I do agree with OP though, that turnover is probably a good indicator of game health.
Personally, I love CO and don't regret the purchase of the lifetime sub.
Betta's usually sell for 7 bucks in canada. 12 if you want to keep the jar and get some food.
Make it so...
I agree with most the article expressed.
And that CO promo with STO closed Beta Invite, was a maneuver worthy of a Ferengi. I did not appreciate personally at all, specially since it was advertised in STO's website too, fishing for eager STO fans.
Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
OK Here is my problem with the way Cryptic handled the lifetime subs. At 600.00 you have paid for a lifetime sub for CO, But the box costs $50.00, Leaving 37 months of subs left that the money bought. Meaning to me that you would have to play CO regularly for 3 years b4 the lifetime started to pay off. Sorry but it seems a rip off to me. I have played many MMOs over the years and very rarely does any of them attract that kind of loyalty, The devs just don't put in enough content to keep anyone playing that long (games like EVE are an exception here).
Usually after the third expansion, they seem to quit altogether with content and just coast. A lot of the people I play with bought the lifetime sub and now I don't even see them playing anymore. Of course the STO beta might be running 24/7 but who knows?
Couldn't agree more with Jon on this. Good article and i commend you for singling out offenders and getting down to the gritty details. Keep up the good work.
Just to make things clear...
I speak for myself and no one else, unless i state otherwise mine is just an opinion. A fact is something that can be independently verified, you may challenge such but with proof. You have every right to disagree with me through sound argument, i believe in constructive debate, but baseless aggression will warrant an unkind response.
Agree with all points made
DEFINITION OF REALITY: Graphics ok, Sound ok, Gold drops need more work...