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Bummer
TheHatter
Member Posts: 2,547
Anyone else bummed about this game?
I've known for a long time it was going to be more like WoW than SWG and that it was going to be more small group/single player centric game for a long time. But still, my personal hype has gone from a 10 to a 6 back to a 8 and now it's back under 4 with the recent news that's came out about this game.
It's Bioware, but c'mon. This game looks like it's going to be bad.... real bad. I'm still going to buy it when it launches (unless I get a closed beta), but I really don't have high hopes for it. I'm just going to buy it because it is Bioware and I still have a small bit of hope for the game being a good play, whether or not it's a real MMO or a GW/DDO instanced multiplayer game.
The first time my hype for this game dropped, was when they went on for months about it being fully voiced. I mean, that's cool and all but they were hyping that aspect of it for a long long time... which kinda raised flags. Then recently, when some new gameplay vids came out and some new information came out, I started thinking that it might actually be a good game. But, now with the new classes and how they are setup, it pretty much hits my blog dead on and I don't like that. I just want to play someone in the world, not a Jedi. Honestly, I thought they were going to throw in some new classes and not base the game off the movies. The pre-KoToR lore is pretty deep and has alot more variety to the things people have done. They could have easily hit on some of that.
Comments
They've been hammering it in since the beginning that they want you to play an "iconic" Star Wars character. I don't see the problem; sounds like your hype should have started at 4 and stayed there.
No they haven't, if they have why did they chose the classes they chose then? Everyone is a very iconic class, instead of something they could have easily put into the game out of the hundreds to chose from. That's like telling a crack head not to buy crack, then dropping him off in the ghetto and handing him $500 in $20 bills.
Edit: I read "they don't want you..." heh wishful thinking I guess. I haven't seen that, but even still, the classes look very cut and dry with no to hardly any originality. Just because they want you to play an iconic character, still doesn't mean they couldn't have thrown a little bit of originality to the class design. Granted, nobody really knows what those classes do, but they really do look cookie cutter with a Star Wars icing.
Why should my hype have started at 4? Are you just flaming to flame? Cause that's what it sounds like. I really hope the game is going to be great, but they really haven't been making it seem that way.
Edit2:
Personally, the icons from the Star Wars series really haven't been my drawing points to the stories. It's been the deep lore that they have created. Even if you just go by the first trilogy of movies, it's a really deep universe with lots of stuff written in between the lines. The second trilogy really built onto that part of it and that's what made me really start to enjoy the series. It wasn't the Bounty Hunters or the Jedis or the Sith, it was everyone else living in the world. Much deeper and much more believable than say Star Trek or any other major SciFi series. (Firefly tops them all though! And maybe Dune, but I only read the first book.)
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OMG, you know next to nothing about the game and you're freaking out. For gods sakes, chill out. Sick to death of the moaning by certain members of the population that just doesn't stop. If you don't think you're interested in the game, then just don't play, don't go posting on their board about how much the game sucks because doing otherwise is called trolling. Thats what I do. Its called "being an adult".
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me.
They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well.
They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
OP it sounds like you are more of a fan of sandbox games than what Bioware is intending with TOR. If you enjoy the Bioware single-player games, I have a good feeling you will enjoy this game. However, if you are looking for a game more like SWG/UO/Fallen Earth, you will be very disappointed.
If you had an expectation like that, your hype should have started low and stayed there... Bioware has laid out a pretty clear explanation of their intentions for this game from the beginning.
I had the expectation when I FIRST heard about the game in PC Gamer, but it quickly went away when I saw the site.
I don't expect it to be like that now and I am a fan of Bioware single player games, but this just doesn't look like it's really going to be all that great even compared to their single player games. To me, it seems that they might be stretching themselves pretty thin on several different things and when any development company does that, indy or corporate, the results really aren't all that great and you are left with a game that feels half done... because it really is.
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OMG, you know next to nothing about the game and you're freaking out. For gods sakes, chill out. Sick to death of the moaning by certain members of the population that just doesn't stop. If you don't think you're interested in the game, then just don't play, don't go posting on their board about how much the game sucks because doing otherwise is called trolling. Thats what I do. Its called "being an adult".
Wow someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed. He's expressing his concerns for the game and doing it in a adult manner. We don't need your childish antics to dumb down this thread.
Anyways back on topic. I really hope this game is a hit, but like everyone else said "There's not enough information to make a complete judgement." Only time will tell.
Like someone else said, you seem to be more of a sandbox type of MMOer. By no means this is a bad thing, but this game seems like it won't be your cup of tea then. Who knows, maybe it will/
Everyone has opinions, but does that make them the universal truth??? NO!
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
The problem with your statement is simply just how wrong it is. For example...Smugglers will have access to black market medicines, (from what i've read) The ranged sith and jedi classes both have a small heal but aren't dedicated healers. As for you not wanting to play an iconic character? like a jedi? or any of the classes it seems, from the way you've talked, then why even play the game? Hop on WoW make a lvl 1 on an RP server and there you go, go be a bartender or some other RP shit. Of course there are going to be similarities to other mmos, it's going to have the key elements (again from what i've read) that any good MMO needs, but it also has a lot of new things. If you'd go and read more you'd also know that they have been focusing on the single player/story element of the game mostly up untill now so that's what you're going to see. They have said they have TONS of mechanics and things that they havn't shown us because it's still under development. People keep talking about NPC's like it's a bad thing, when im fairly sure (Once again, based on what i've read) that you only get 1 companion and the point of this companion is to make soloing easier. You aren't going to be running raids with NPC's (which they have stated, raids -instances-flashpoints among other things, will all be in the game) Also, what's cookie cutter about they jedi's? name another star wars game where you can play as not only sith and jedi but being broken down into melee/tank, ranged/melee. No other company has done that (Correct me if im wrong, but i've played a ton of star wars games, and you're either a soldier or a jedi knight). I think you're putting way to much thought and emotion into this game as you've not seen ANYTHING besides the classes and planets. They havn't even released how crafting, progression or anything really for that matter works and you've already gone all over the charts as to how good or bad this game is gonna be. Just wait and stop judging so soon.
Even though you don't give much in the ways of details into why you think the game has already failed in your opinion, at least it's not a total hatefest post.
But I would change the wording on the poll. Your opening statement says "Anyone else bummed about the game" While the poll question says, "Am I alone in this feeling".
We do know the classes, and people are making assumptions, especially about how pvp will play out. It's weird to me that people hate/love the game already so much to the point of bashing it/bashing anyone who has an opinion that doesn't agree with loving the game. With still so little known, forming an INFORMED opinion is impossible. More than likely, loving/hating Bioware, Love of your current game/Hate of something that might take players away, Love of themepark/love of sandbox (and vice versa) have really mucked up on peoples thoughts. And of course, there are just people that love to hate games.
Also, an add on to my last post- The original post also talks about not using the story of the old republic because the classes are based on the star wars films? that's not true at all. They are only comparing the classes to them so you get an idea of what they are and what they do, it's the easiest way to familiarize the audience with the classes. The entire game is based in TOR lore...so i dunno what you mean with all that.
I had the expectation when I FIRST heard about the game in PC Gamer, but it quickly went away when I saw the site.
I don't expect it to be like that now and I am a fan of Bioware single player games, but this just doesn't look like it's really going to be all that great even compared to their single player games. To me, it seems that they might be stretching themselves pretty thin on several different things and when any development company does that, indy or corporate, the results really aren't all that great and you are left with a game that feels half done... because it really is.
I don't think you need to worry about them stretching themselves thin. Bioware opened up an entirely new office for the creation of this game. It is almost entirely a separate team than the ones working on their other games.
Personally I am very optimistic about this game's chances. Bioware is doing the one thing that all MMO developers should do when making one of these games... they are waiting until it is ready to release. The game has already been in development for 3+ years and it probably won't be out until late 2010 or early 2011. That tells me they are taking all the time they need to make sure this is a solid and polished product.
I don't think you need to worry about them stretching themselves thin. Bioware opened up an entirely new office for the creation of this game. It is almost entirely a separate team than the ones working on their other games.
Personally I am very optimistic about this game's chances. Bioware is doing the one thing that all MMO developers should do when making one of these games... they are waiting until it is ready to release. The game has already been in development for 3+ years and it probably won't be out until late 2010 or early 2011. That tells me they are taking all the time they need to make sure this is a solid and polished product.
I agree, from what i have seen so far this seems correct. Bioware doesnt strike me as the type of company that will release something unless its 100%.
OMG, you know next to nothing about the game and you're freaking out. For gods sakes, chill out. Sick to death of the moaning by certain members of the population that just doesn't stop. If you don't think you're interested in the game, then just don't play, don't go posting on their board about how much the game sucks because doing otherwise is called trolling. Thats what I do. Its called "being an adult".
Wow someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed. He's expressing his concerns for the game and doing it in a adult manner. We don't need your childish antics to dumb down this thread.
Anyways back on topic. I really hope this game is a hit, but like everyone else said "There's not enough information to make a complete judgement." Only time will tell.
Like someone else said, you seem to be more of a sandbox type of MMOer. By no means this is a bad thing, but this game seems like it won't be your cup of tea then. Who knows, maybe it will/
No honey, its not about waking up on the wrong side of the bed, its about hearing the same arguments for months on end that are based on nothing but rumor and fearmongering with no more proof behind them now than there was a year ago. I'm sick of hearing it, yet it doesn't stop. I've never seen the kind of bashing on any other game forum thats on here.
Most people, for most other games, just leave if they don't like the concept of a game. But for some reason, on this one, because it doesn't kiss the butt of a certain segment (usually the PvP sect, though not always), but instead caters to a set of gamers that NEVER get proper attention (that of storyline lovers), this one is bashed constantly. Nearly every single thread on here is bashing the game based on rumor.
I'm sorry, its incredibly aggravating. I come to this forum to actually discuss aspects of the game that we KNOW about and talk about things that we hope it will have. Instead, 95% of the threads on here talk about how much this game is going to suck with not a shred of proof behind the claim. I've never even seen it this bad on SOE threads. Even the SWG forums aren't this bad and that game was totally screwed over by the devs.
No, its not waking up on the wrong side of the bed, its getting sick to death of a certain behavior thats continually tolerated on this forum.
@Moirae,
Well, if you had actually read the original post instead of just reading the title, like so many people do here, then you would see it's not about fear mongering, it's not about jumping to conclusions, it's about a general concern for a game based on a series I adore.
The reason that this game is watched so heavily is because of it's name. It's Star Wars, probably the biggest IP that there has ever been. It's such a deep game and the fact that Bioware seems to be making it really rather shallow is not a good thing.
You may enjoy your story driven games and feel that your crowd is overlooked, when it's not. It's just not a very applicable thing to put into a game that is supposed to have no end and relies on subscriptions to make the majority of it's money. What you're looking for is a multplayer RPG, not a MMO. Those can be story driven and have an end.
If anyone's going to pull it off, it would be Bioware. I've always loved the stories in their games, much more than the ones brought to us by Blizzard. But, that's the thing too... if the game has only been in development for 3yrs that's another flag, because if the game is going to have the story depth it says it's going to have, then that's an extremely short amount of time. WoW took 5yrs of development and the game had very shallow stories and Vanilla was actually a very short game for a MMO, with a very small world. 3yrs is about the average time for a single player game and do you really want to pay a monthly fee for a game that's strictly single player or small group based and heavily instanced?
Honestly, if it's good I would. But, the problem is that many people like to cry about spending less than a single meal at McDonalds once a month to play a game. But, at the same time if it's a complete single player game, then I wouldn't want to pay it either.
There is nothing wrong about discussing the fears about game X or game Y. I'm not sure how many MMOs you've played and I'm not sure how long you've been in the genre. But, I've been playing for 10yrs now and to be completely honest. I'm pretty f'ing tired of being let down extremely hard by pretty much every game that's been released in those 10yrs. There are a few that have come out that have been ok, but still weren't nearly what was promised. WoW was nothing that was promised and has strayed very very far from what was promised over the years.
So if you think I'm fear mongering, or w/e you want to call it. You can just stay out of the thread. Nobody is making you click the thread. You may think that people like me shouldn't be allowed on the forums, well I got new for ya... people like you aren't. Because, I don't think you realize it but you're Trolling, which is in fact against the forum TOS. So is making personal attacks, which is what you did in the post I replied to. I don't reply to trolls, that's why I didn't touch your last post.
Like I said, don't like it? Don't click it.
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Look I would relax. Bioware isnt looking to copy whats already been done. Bioware makes good games, they have a wonderful track record and I'm happy they are the ones making this game.
No there isnt enough information out yet, time will tell. However, give them a chance for the love of god. Bioware has yet to really dissipoint me, granted they havent made a mmo yet. I have a feeling the game will be a lot of fun, no it wont be a sandbox, but thats ok if the game is still solid with some good pvp.
Look I would relax. Bioware isnt looking to copy whats already been done. Bioware makes good games, they have a wonderful track record and I'm happy they are the ones making this game.
No there isnt enough information out yet, time will tell. However, give them a chance for the love of god. Bioware has yet to really dissipoint me, granted they havent made a mmo yet. I have a feeling the game will be a lot of fun, no it wont be a sandbox, but thats ok if the game is still solid with some good pvp.
Thank you, exactly. Nearly all my favorite games come from Bioware, and I'm willing to give them a chance before I start running around whining about how the game is going to suck. Bioware is one of the best game companies in the world. Its time to give them a chance before we freak out.
You know what? I'm tired of being let down by games too. But all those games are all copying each other with different graphics and maybe one or two things to make them unique. This game, on the other hand, is pretty much TOTALLY unique. That doesn't mean its automatically going to suck. Its time that a game company challenged the status quo. And I'm sick to death of everyone freaking out about it. Since when did different become the enemy? The first world country's are supposed to be about challenging established norms and being willing to take a chance. Whats really interesting is that its a Canadian company thats more willing to do so than an American company.
Look I would relax. Bioware isnt looking to copy whats already been done. Bioware makes good games, they have a wonderful track record and I'm happy they are the ones making this game.
No there isnt enough information out yet, time will tell. However, give them a chance for the love of god. Bioware has yet to really dissipoint me, granted they havent made a mmo yet. I have a feeling the game will be a lot of fun, no it wont be a sandbox, but thats ok if the game is still solid with some good pvp.
Thank you, exactly. Nearly all my favorite games come from Bioware, and I'm willing to give them a chance before I start running around whining about how the game is going to suck. Bioware is one of the best game companies in the world. Its time to give them a chance before we freak out.
You know what? I'm tired of being let down by games too. But all those games are all copying each other with different graphics and maybe one or two things to make them unique. This game, on the other hand, is pretty much TOTALLY unique. That doesn't mean its automatically going to suck. Its time that a game company challenged the status quo. And I'm sick to death of everyone freaking out about it. Since when did different become the enemy? The first world country's are supposed to be about challenging established norms and being willing to take a chance. Whats really interesting is that its a Canadian company thats more willing to do so than an American company.
You're just as bad as someone who bashes the game at this point. There isn't enough real info to go on yet, but you're slapping a crown on it anyway.
Here come the usual platitudes:
TOTALLY unique: No proof, but none needed, I guess. Seems unlikely, however.
It's time a game company challenges the status quo: Yeah, that's never been done before. It's not like Age of Conan, Darkfall, WAR, Mortal Online, TCoS, etc weren't claiming to challenge that same status quo in one way or another.... (/sarcasm) Being different doesn't ensure a game will suck, but it also doesn't ensure it'll be great either.
Look, I think only one thing can be said about SW:TOR right now, and it's the same for every MMO that has come out, or will come out. It'll launch, and it'll have gameplay and features that will appeal to some players, while it will also not appeal to others. The only way to know if any one person will like it is for them to play it.
Unfortunately, to the lovers, it'll be the uncontested "greatest game ever". To the haters, it'll "suck". ""How dare you hate it!" "How dare you enjoy it!" There rarely appears to be a middle ground to the average MMO forum poster.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
In retrospect, I should have worded a few things differently and gave it a different title. But, that's what I was trying to bring into this thread. A real discussion about the game and not "IT'S GOING TO ROCK!" or "IT'S GOING TO BLOW!".
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No they haven't, if they have why did they chose the classes they chose then? Everyone is a very iconic class, instead of something they could have easily put into the game out of the hundreds to chose from. That's like telling a crack head not to buy crack, then dropping him off in the ghetto and handing him $500 in $20 bills.
Edit: I read "they don't want you..." heh wishful thinking I guess. I haven't seen that, but even still, the classes look very cut and dry with no to hardly any originality. Just because they want you to play an iconic character, still doesn't mean they couldn't have thrown a little bit of originality to the class design. Granted, nobody really knows what those classes do, but they really do look cookie cutter with a Star Wars icing.
Why should my hype have started at 4? Are you just flaming to flame? Cause that's what it sounds like. I really hope the game is going to be great, but they really haven't been making it seem that way.
Edit2:
Personally, the icons from the Star Wars series really haven't been my drawing points to the stories. It's been the deep lore that they have created. Even if you just go by the first trilogy of movies, it's a really deep universe with lots of stuff written in between the lines. The second trilogy really built onto that part of it and that's what made me really start to enjoy the series. It wasn't the Bounty Hunters or the Jedis or the Sith, it was everyone else living in the world. Much deeper and much more believable than say Star Trek or any other major SciFi series. (Firefly tops them all though! And maybe Dune, but I only read the first book.)
Ah, okay. So you just want to see some different types of classes, not the Healer/Tank/Melee DPS/Ranged DPS kind of archetypes, eh? If there was a Jedi, but he played differently than a Melee DPS character in another MMO, would you be happier? This is a traditional MMO, and the "Holy Trinity" is nigh invincible. Recently, the trend seems to be have all classes be more like hybrids; they don't necessarily have to fill one role or another. Let's take the Consular, for example. A first glance would suggest it's a caster DPS, but then you think, "The Republic already has the Trooper... so the Consular must be a healer!" Yup, further reading suggests it's the healer class. But do you really think you won't see DPS Consulars? Consulars that focus on this "Force manipulation" to, say, strangle an enemy instead of binding a bleeding wound.
Will Consulars be able to heal and DPS effectively, if they specialize correctly? That remains to be seen. Will a middle-of-the-road path be viable? Probably. I suspect the Jedi Knight will have a Tank or "Suicide Bomber" choice (where he does a ton of damage in a short amount of time, but sacrifices survivability to do so). Trooper will probably focus either on highly destructive but slow, long-range attacks vs. faster, more rapid attacks in closer quarters. Smuggler seems like a Jack-of-all-trades at this point, so I'm not sure what its paths will look like. Still, you catch my drift.
I said your hype should've started at 4 because I misunderstood what you wanted. I thought you didn't like that we had to be a Jedi; you wanted a choice to be something less popular in the Star Wars universe, like some new Republic military unit that is viable in the lore but one that's never been specifically mentioned before. Bioware stated that this is exactly not what they want for this game, so that's why I said your hype should've started at 4 and stayed there.
I also agree that Star Wars has a lot of lore to work with, and it's a complete universe that is deeper than what is portrayed in the movies.
Look I would relax. Bioware isnt looking to copy whats already been done. Bioware makes good games, they have a wonderful track record and I'm happy they are the ones making this game.
No there isnt enough information out yet, time will tell. However, give them a chance for the love of god. Bioware has yet to really dissipoint me, granted they havent made a mmo yet. I have a feeling the game will be a lot of fun, no it wont be a sandbox, but thats ok if the game is still solid with some good pvp.
Thank you, exactly. Nearly all my favorite games come from Bioware, and I'm willing to give them a chance before I start running around whining about how the game is going to suck. Bioware is one of the best game companies in the world. Its time to give them a chance before we freak out.
You know what? I'm tired of being let down by games too. But all those games are all copying each other with different graphics and maybe one or two things to make them unique. This game, on the other hand, is pretty much TOTALLY unique. That doesn't mean its automatically going to suck. Its time that a game company challenged the status quo. And I'm sick to death of everyone freaking out about it. Since when did different become the enemy? The first world country's are supposed to be about challenging established norms and being willing to take a chance. Whats really interesting is that its a Canadian company thats more willing to do so than an American company.
You're just as bad as someone who bashes the game at this point. There isn't enough real info to go on yet, but you're slapping a crown on it anyway.
Here come the usual platitudes:
TOTALLY unique: No proof, but none needed, I guess. Seems unlikely, however.
It's time a game company challenges the status quo: Yeah, that's never been done before. It's not like Age of Conan, Darkfall, WAR, Mortal Online, TCoS, etc weren't claiming to challenge that same status quo in one way or another.... (/sarcasm) Being different doesn't ensure a game will suck, but it also doesn't ensure it'll be great either.
Look, I think only one thing can be said about SW:TOR right now, and it's the same for every MMO that has come out, or will come out. It'll launch, and it'll have gameplay and features that will appeal to some players, while it will also not appeal to others. The only way to know if any one person will like it is for them to play it.
Unfortunately, to the lovers, it'll be the uncontested "greatest game ever". To the haters, it'll "suck". ""How dare you hate it!" "How dare you enjoy it!" There rarely appears to be a middle ground to the average MMO forum poster.
Really, and where did I do that exactly? Nowhere. Not once did I say that this is the king of kings of all games. I said that this game isn't a carbon copy of other games, and it isn't. I said that its totally unique, and it is. I said that the company thats making it is one of the best game companies in the world, and it is. How is that saying that this is the greatest game ever? Stop putting words in my mouth.
I like the direction Bioware is going with this game. It literally looks like a multi-player version of their other games.
Here you go.
darthhater.com/2009/12/03/smuggler-class-trees/
Scoundrel sounds fun to me.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.