Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by StuBidasoe Originally posted by Gameloading There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game. I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances. I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
So watching another played kill a named mob only to have it respawn a couple minutes later...that doesn't break your immersion?
Would you have preferred in your version of Episode 3 for Anakin to have killed Count Dooku only to have him respawn a couple minutes later, and have Ani kill him again...repeat ad nausuem.
I suppose that is your idea of immersion then.
That's nice. I'll pass. I like my crazy version of TOR where the named Sith Lord stays dead when I decapitate him.
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
That isn't the game BioWare is making. They've said from day one that SWTOR is all about storyline.
I don't see the issue with instancing important storyline parts. It won't take away from the persistant world that much if done correctly, imo. There will still be a living, breathing world to interact with just like any other MMO but when you walk through a certain door into a room containing an important npc to your story it will be instanced as not to ruin story immersion. Not all npc will be instanced nor will most of the world, just certain parts that pertain to your story. This shouldn't stop people from interacting or take way from immersion in a living world that you want.
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Before EQ2 changed the spawn times, I've waited 45 minutes or more for people to go away or miss getting to the mob before I did. Sometimes a half second would make the difference between me being able to grab the mob and someone else reacting sooner. So yes, it is possible.
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Instancing in ToR: Key Plot Points (flashpoints). Group Content (raids,dungeons etc).
While everything else is said to be open. I think that answers that overused excuse "why not play X sprgp".
Open world and interaction with that storyline.
I'm sure the next person will follow up with "ToRs not a MMO" because they base everything off their own uninformed biased opinion, it's pretty cliche now. But feel free to spew more non-sense, it won't be me looking like a idiot on release day.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience? In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Instancing in ToR: Key Plot Points (flashpoints). Group Content (raids,dungeons etc).
While everything else is said to be open. I think that answers that overused excuse "why not play X sprgp".
Open world and interaction with that storyline.
I'm sure the next person will follow up with "ToRs not a MMO" because they base everything off their own uninformed biased opinion, it's pretty cliche now. But feel free to spew more non-sense, it won't be me looking like a idiot on release day.
Come on Greed. I'll let you borrow my sons Ewok costume and you can look like an idiot on release day too. That is assuming you're more than 3' tall. If you're 3' tall then you won't actually look like an idiot.
Come on Greed. I'll let you borrow my sons Ewok costume and you can look like an idiot on release day too. That is assuming you're more than 3' tall. If you're 3' tall then you won't actually look like an idiot.
Do they even make 6'5" ewok costumes? If they did, I'd probably be confused with a Wookiee.
The people that bash a game are equal to those that say a game is amazing at this point in a games development. How can you KNOW a game is so amazing? How can you say, as a fact, that the game is terrible? Yet we have people on both sides saying that. Do I want to play TOR? Shoure. It's bioware so I will give them a chance. But I won't come here saying this is a wow killer, or the best game ever, or that this is the cutting edge game.
Untill proven wrong. I see this game as two types intertwined. If you only play one or the other. You will miss half the game.
I see the main focus of the game on the SPG/multiplayer story arc. That is what is in the media the most because it is the most different from other games. That part of the game is linear. You follow your story making decisions that change your light side dark side and skill tree. You can follow this story from planet to planet from level one to cap with or without friends.
The second part is the MMO. This part we have not seen. It is all speculation, but in interviews, it has been said that the planets will offer more quests than just the story arc. This leads me to believe each planet will have many side quests in an open world and instances just like any other MMO. You will have solo, group, raid and possibly PvP mixed in all in the same area as your story as well as places you will have to explore to find.
Based on what I have seen in the videos. I will be playing this game. How good or bad it will be will have to wait for release. Speculation is fun. That is why this and other sites exist. But without all the facts laid out to see. None of us can say this will be the best or worst game ever. We can only give an opinion based on past experiences. Mine tells me I will like this game. I can't tell anyone else how they will feel.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them? R.A.Salvatore
The people that bash a game are equal to those that say a game is amazing at this point in a games development. How can you KNOW a game is so amazing? How can you say, as a fact, that the game is terrible? Yet we have people on both sides saying that. Do I want to play TOR? Shoure. It's bioware so I will give them a chance. But I won't come here saying this is a wow killer, or the best game ever, or that this is the cutting edge game.
I agree. Now tell me where you see 3/4 of a page on here full of threads saying how wonderful this game is going to be vs the number of threads saying this game is going to suck. Prove it. I bet you can't. Because 3/4 of the threads on here are talking about how this game is going to suck.
All good points. I'm like you. I'll buy the game. However, if it doesn't have something new and fresh to offer, why would I leave the other MMO's I play to start grinding all over again. In all honesty, I love the Star Wars universe. I am not a fan of Star Trek, but the Star Trek game is looking much more innovative and interesting. Moirae, I know you like to personally attack posters, but don't bother telling me to grow up for gods (is that plural or are you missing a possessive punctuation) sakes. Such responses are not productive and don't add to what I think was a good conversation the gentleman started. I have seen you post that twice now. Stop trying to stifle the marketplace of mmo ideas.
In short, I think the poster has brought up some good points, was honest in his feelings, and I am glad he shared. We always oscillate in our thoughts when awaiting a much anticipated game. I know I have been.
A tip of the hat to the Hatter for having the fadoras to place such an honest post in this forum.
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
Yes they can WoW has done it already in icecrown, which changes while your questing out in the area. Why would BioWare not be able to do this if not better, specially in a world that will be somewhat instanced.
Also, the living world is the game.....Or am I the only one who likes to travel around and find different areas of games just for the hell of it?
I apologize for bringing WoW into the picture of things but WoW runs on story mode most of the time and it has survived well.
Last but not least, I just hope is not a big a grind as Aion has been so far and I refuse to play WoW. Has been a couple months since my account died =P.
They've been hammering it in since the beginning that they want you to play an "iconic" Star Wars character. I don't see the problem; sounds like your hype should have started at 4 and stayed there.
No they haven't, if they have why did they chose the classes they chose then? Everyone is a very iconic class, instead of something they could have easily put into the game out of the hundreds to chose from. That's like telling a crack head not to buy crack, then dropping him off in the ghetto and handing him $500 in $20 bills.
Edit: I read "they don't want you..." heh wishful thinking I guess. I haven't seen that, but even still, the classes look very cut and dry with no to hardly any originality. Just because they want you to play an iconic character, still doesn't mean they couldn't have thrown a little bit of originality to the class design. Granted, nobody really knows what those classes do, but they really do look cookie cutter with a Star Wars icing.
Why should my hype have started at 4? Are you just flaming to flame? Cause that's what it sounds like. I really hope the game is going to be great, but they really haven't been making it seem that way.
Edit2:
Personally, the icons from the Star Wars series really haven't been my drawing points to the stories. It's been the deep lore that they have created. Even if you just go by the first trilogy of movies, it's a really deep universe with lots of stuff written in between the lines. The second trilogy really built onto that part of it and that's what made me really start to enjoy the series. It wasn't the Bounty Hunters or the Jedis or the Sith, it was everyone else living in the world. Much deeper and much more believable than say Star Trek or any other major SciFi series. (Firefly tops them all though! And maybe Dune, but I only read the first book.)
Let me get this straight... Your main gripe with the game is that you'll be a hero? You want to be Uncle Owen on his moisture farm fixing vaperators, not Luke Skywalker challenging Darth Vader?
Hmm... I see. I have two thoughts here: First, Bioware doesn't do the Uncle Owen thing. If you ever expected that from this game, then your expectations were badly misplaced. You're a legendary Sith master and the Big Bad Guy in KOTOR for goodness sakes (though you don't know that.) I seriously doubt they're gonna allow you to make a Twi'lek dancer in some second rate cantina somewhere. Second, this is not pre-NGE Star Wars Galaxies. Wishing it was and complaining about it will never make it pre-NGE Star Wars Galaxies. pre-NGE Star Wars Galaxies is dead, and if you want it back so badly, maybe join one of the fan efforts attempting to resurrect it (I believe there are at least two.)
Maybe if you ask very, very nicely Bioware will make some sort of non-hero expansion pack for those who strive for mediocrity.
There just isn't enough information out there to see where Bioware is taking the game, but I have to admit there are a few warning flags up for me. They continue to keep talking about storyline, how It's going to be a storydriven game.
I'm not saying story doesn't have a place in MMORPGs, but it shouldn't be the main focus of one.
No matter how much effort you put into it, a storydriven experience in an mmorpg will never be as good as in a singleplayer game because you can't really change the world around you nor can it tell a storyline as well. They also mentioned they will use even more instancing than other mmorpgs. I'm not saying that every mmorpg has to be s sandbox but I do think that instancing should be reduced to a minimum. They just break the immersion and makes it feel more like a game and less like a living world.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Instancing in ToR: Key Plot Points (flashpoints). Group Content (raids,dungeons etc).
While everything else is said to be open. I think that answers that overused excuse "why not play X sprgp".
Open world and interaction with that storyline.
I'm sure the next person will follow up with "ToRs not a MMO" because they base everything off their own uninformed biased opinion, it's pretty cliche now. But feel free to spew more non-sense, it won't be me looking like a idiot on release day.
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs.
So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs. So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs. So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs. So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs. So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Link to evidence of other races playable in the game? Oh, and please come up with something better than one flyaway comment by a dev at a gamecon conference who would agree to anything so long as it keeps him away from his basement cubicle and the smell of his own feet.
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs. So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
I don't have a link but it was mentioned in an interview that they expect the game to have more instances than other mmorpgs.
The problem with the things you mentioned is that they really don't give that sense of immersion the way a singleplayer game does. You know the moment you create a new character, the characters you killed on your other character will return. You know that a vast majority of players had the exact or a similar experience you had. They just were in different instances.
It's for this reason that i'm not a big fan of storytelling in mmorpgs and instead rather have a bigger emphasis on world design.
I think being able to build your own house adds far more immersion than an epic storyline does.
Ofcourse it's important to keep in mind that this is all just speculation. I just hope that Star Wars: ToR doesn't become a game like City of Heroes.
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Link to evidence of other races playable in the game? Oh, and please come up with something better than one flyaway comment by a dev at a gamecon conference who would agree to anything so long as it keeps him away from his basement cubicle and the smell of his own feet.
Hmmm? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler?
Didn't think so.
Here is an official forum post on the SWTOR forums.
First of all, lets just state what this game is and isn't, things that are neither good or bad, just different concepts:
What is not, A sandbox game, a game in which you are just another body in the universe, a total departure on what MMO's are right now. Raids in which 20 people will be beating on 1 guy.
What this game is: Lore one of the main pillars, key events in the story will be instanced (similar to LOTRO), Will have a variant of the trinity.
Now, people will like or not like aspects of the game, that does not mean is a good game or a bad game, just likes and dislikes of individuals. I personally like a linear game more than a sandbox game and the market in general does too, the big games or game out there is not a sandbox and every company wants to get the player base of that game, chances are, people that play WoW will not play on a sandbox game.
We have very little info on what they are doing, the gameplay videos at points get me very excited and at points I feel like I don't want to play the game but in reality, until we try the game will not know. My perfect example, I saw gamplay videos of AoC and WAR and espcecially AoC I was very excited and I thought it was an awesome system, reality is, when I got in the beta, I hate it it. So I learned that videos really mean nothing.
There are posts saying that the classes are not original, I have to disagree with that at this point, I don't think the originality comes from the name of the class or the descritprion but again, with the gameplay we will see how original they are, example, WAR had very original classes, Disciple of Khaine in writing was depraved and cool, the bright wizard seemed really fun to play, the aquig herder just fun, when I played them, well, they didn't live up to the expectations, so maybe the classes are just "iconic and boring" in their names but they might play really original and fun. We don't really know, we can only wait and see, test and then have a valid opinion on the game, right now, it's all speculation.
Anyone else bummed about this game? I've known for a long time it was going to be more like WoW than SWG and that it was going to be more small group/single player centric game for a long time. But still, my personal hype has gone from a 10 to a 6 back to a 8 and now it's back under 4 with the recent news that's came out about this game. It's Bioware, but c'mon. This game looks like it's going to be bad.... real bad. I'm still going to buy it when it launches (unless I get a closed beta), but I really don't have high hopes for it. I'm just going to buy it because it is Bioware and I still have a small bit of hope for the game being a good play, whether or not it's a real MMO or a GW/DDO instanced multiplayer game. The first time my hype for this game dropped, was when they went on for months about it being fully voiced. I mean, that's cool and all but they were hyping that aspect of it for a long long time... which kinda raised flags. Then recently, when some new gameplay vids came out and some new information came out, I started thinking that it might actually be a good game. But, now with the new classes and how they are setup, it pretty much hits my blog dead on and I don't like that. I just want to play someone in the world, not a Jedi. Honestly, I thought they were going to throw in some new classes and not base the game off the movies. The pre-KoToR lore is pretty deep and has alot more variety to the things people have done. They could have easily hit on some of that.
No I'm not bummed at all. One problem faced by many mmo's is somehow we as players sometimes seem to consider an mmo that can't keep us interested enough to play "forever" a failure or bad game. This in no way reflects what my opinion of the game is but as you've stated with it being a Bioware product we can be assured it will be of the highest production standards and values and will have a very interesting story to tell, it may well not be worth playing forever but who thinks it isn't going to be worth it to play until, well you get sick of it?
What I'm asking is if you bought and played the game and at whatever pace you played it it took you three months to reach "endgame" and decide to retire do you think that you will not have been entertained by the experience? My money is on yes and I simply don't look to mmo's to keep me playing forever as none have to this point but I'm fairly glad for the experiences I have had.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Link to evidence of other races playable in the game? Oh, and please come up with something better than one flyaway comment by a dev at a gamecon conference who would agree to anything so long as it keeps him away from his basement cubicle and the smell of his own feet.
Hmmm? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler?
Didn't think so.
Here is an official forum post on the SWTOR forums.
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs. So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
I don't have a link but it was mentioned in an interview that they expect the game to have more instances than other mmorpgs.
The problem with the things you mentioned is that they really don't give that sense of immersion the way a singleplayer game does. You know the moment you create a new character, the characters you killed on your other character will return. You know that a vast majority of players had the exact or a similar experience you had. They just were in different instances.
It's for this reason that i'm not a big fan of storytelling in mmorpgs and instead rather have a bigger emphasis on world design.
I think being able to build your own house adds far more immersion than an epic storyline does.
Ofcourse it's important to keep in mind that this is all just speculation. I just hope that Star Wars: ToR doesn't become a game like City of Heroes.
Nothing against you, but I'm not going to buy it until I get a link of some sort. I'm pretty up to date on the interviews. I'll also say I won't doubt it.
Part of the flashpoints is doing it once and only once. The group content will be be the same for each class, but that's inevitable and If it wasn't the same you would be calling it a sprpg due to never grouping. The moment you create a new character in ToR you're delivered a new story with new flashpoints. I would say the immersion will be far better in ToR then any other MMO.
As for a Boss and killing him more then once on the same character. As I said, it's inevitable. My problem is the zergs that would take place if it was not instanced (azuregos in vanilla WoW). It would be cool if developers could constantly deliver new content every day, but right now it's just not realistic. There will be points where Immersion is not all that wonderful, but I will take a instance over a world boss that never respawns until they can deliver content fast enough to make up for the boss I just killed.
I'll agree with you about CoH. I have my doubts with BioWare, I mostly think they will do fine though. Keep in mind, ToR certainly wont be for everybody, hell it might not even be for me and if that's true, I hope they can bring something to the genre for other developers consideration.
Comments
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
So watching another played kill a named mob only to have it respawn a couple minutes later...that doesn't break your immersion?
Would you have preferred in your version of Episode 3 for Anakin to have killed Count Dooku only to have him respawn a couple minutes later, and have Ani kill him again...repeat ad nausuem.
I suppose that is your idea of immersion then.
That's nice. I'll pass. I like my crazy version of TOR where the named Sith Lord stays dead when I decapitate him.
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My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
That isn't the game BioWare is making. They've said from day one that SWTOR is all about storyline.
I don't see the issue with instancing important storyline parts. It won't take away from the persistant world that much if done correctly, imo. There will still be a living, breathing world to interact with just like any other MMO but when you walk through a certain door into a room containing an important npc to your story it will be instanced as not to ruin story immersion. Not all npc will be instanced nor will most of the world, just certain parts that pertain to your story. This shouldn't stop people from interacting or take way from immersion in a living world that you want.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Before EQ2 changed the spawn times, I've waited 45 minutes or more for people to go away or miss getting to the mob before I did. Sometimes a half second would make the difference between me being able to grab the mob and someone else reacting sooner. So yes, it is possible.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Instancing in ToR: Key Plot Points (flashpoints). Group Content (raids,dungeons etc).
While everything else is said to be open. I think that answers that overused excuse "why not play X sprgp".
Open world and interaction with that storyline.
I'm sure the next person will follow up with "ToRs not a MMO" because they base everything off their own uninformed biased opinion, it's pretty cliche now. But feel free to spew more non-sense, it won't be me looking like a idiot on release day.
Instancing in ToR: Key Plot Points (flashpoints). Group Content (raids,dungeons etc).
While everything else is said to be open. I think that answers that overused excuse "why not play X sprgp".
Open world and interaction with that storyline.
I'm sure the next person will follow up with "ToRs not a MMO" because they base everything off their own uninformed biased opinion, it's pretty cliche now. But feel free to spew more non-sense, it won't be me looking like a idiot on release day.
Come on Greed. I'll let you borrow my sons Ewok costume and you can look like an idiot on release day too. That is assuming you're more than 3' tall. If you're 3' tall then you won't actually look like an idiot.
Do they even make 6'5" ewok costumes? If they did, I'd probably be confused with a Wookiee.
Gotta agree with rahn or rohn about what he said.
The people that bash a game are equal to those that say a game is amazing at this point in a games development. How can you KNOW a game is so amazing? How can you say, as a fact, that the game is terrible? Yet we have people on both sides saying that. Do I want to play TOR? Shoure. It's bioware so I will give them a chance. But I won't come here saying this is a wow killer, or the best game ever, or that this is the cutting edge game.
Untill proven wrong. I see this game as two types intertwined. If you only play one or the other. You will miss half the game.
I see the main focus of the game on the SPG/multiplayer story arc. That is what is in the media the most because it is the most different from other games. That part of the game is linear. You follow your story making decisions that change your light side dark side and skill tree. You can follow this story from planet to planet from level one to cap with or without friends.
The second part is the MMO. This part we have not seen. It is all speculation, but in interviews, it has been said that the planets will offer more quests than just the story arc. This leads me to believe each planet will have many side quests in an open world and instances just like any other MMO. You will have solo, group, raid and possibly PvP mixed in all in the same area as your story as well as places you will have to explore to find.
Based on what I have seen in the videos. I will be playing this game. How good or bad it will be will have to wait for release. Speculation is fun. That is why this and other sites exist. But without all the facts laid out to see. None of us can say this will be the best or worst game ever. We can only give an opinion based on past experiences. Mine tells me I will like this game. I can't tell anyone else how they will feel.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore
I agree. Now tell me where you see 3/4 of a page on here full of threads saying how wonderful this game is going to be vs the number of threads saying this game is going to suck. Prove it. I bet you can't. Because 3/4 of the threads on here are talking about how this game is going to suck.
All good points. I'm like you. I'll buy the game. However, if it doesn't have something new and fresh to offer, why would I leave the other MMO's I play to start grinding all over again. In all honesty, I love the Star Wars universe. I am not a fan of Star Trek, but the Star Trek game is looking much more innovative and interesting. Moirae, I know you like to personally attack posters, but don't bother telling me to grow up for gods (is that plural or are you missing a possessive punctuation) sakes. Such responses are not productive and don't add to what I think was a good conversation the gentleman started. I have seen you post that twice now. Stop trying to stifle the marketplace of mmo ideas.
In short, I think the poster has brought up some good points, was honest in his feelings, and I am glad he shared. We always oscillate in our thoughts when awaiting a much anticipated game. I know I have been.
A tip of the hat to the Hatter for having the fadoras to place such an honest post in this forum.
May the Force be with us all to get along.
Yes they can WoW has done it already in icecrown, which changes while your questing out in the area. Why would BioWare not be able to do this if not better, specially in a world that will be somewhat instanced.
Also, the living world is the game.....Or am I the only one who likes to travel around and find different areas of games just for the hell of it?
I apologize for bringing WoW into the picture of things but WoW runs on story mode most of the time and it has survived well.
Last but not least, I just hope is not a big a grind as Aion has been so far and I refuse to play WoW. Has been a couple months since my account died =P.
No they haven't, if they have why did they chose the classes they chose then? Everyone is a very iconic class, instead of something they could have easily put into the game out of the hundreds to chose from. That's like telling a crack head not to buy crack, then dropping him off in the ghetto and handing him $500 in $20 bills.
Edit: I read "they don't want you..." heh wishful thinking I guess. I haven't seen that, but even still, the classes look very cut and dry with no to hardly any originality. Just because they want you to play an iconic character, still doesn't mean they couldn't have thrown a little bit of originality to the class design. Granted, nobody really knows what those classes do, but they really do look cookie cutter with a Star Wars icing.
Why should my hype have started at 4? Are you just flaming to flame? Cause that's what it sounds like. I really hope the game is going to be great, but they really haven't been making it seem that way.
Edit2:
Personally, the icons from the Star Wars series really haven't been my drawing points to the stories. It's been the deep lore that they have created. Even if you just go by the first trilogy of movies, it's a really deep universe with lots of stuff written in between the lines. The second trilogy really built onto that part of it and that's what made me really start to enjoy the series. It wasn't the Bounty Hunters or the Jedis or the Sith, it was everyone else living in the world. Much deeper and much more believable than say Star Trek or any other major SciFi series. (Firefly tops them all though! And maybe Dune, but I only read the first book.)
Let me get this straight... Your main gripe with the game is that you'll be a hero? You want to be Uncle Owen on his moisture farm fixing vaperators, not Luke Skywalker challenging Darth Vader?
Hmm... I see. I have two thoughts here: First, Bioware doesn't do the Uncle Owen thing. If you ever expected that from this game, then your expectations were badly misplaced. You're a legendary Sith master and the Big Bad Guy in KOTOR for goodness sakes (though you don't know that.) I seriously doubt they're gonna allow you to make a Twi'lek dancer in some second rate cantina somewhere. Second, this is not pre-NGE Star Wars Galaxies. Wishing it was and complaining about it will never make it pre-NGE Star Wars Galaxies. pre-NGE Star Wars Galaxies is dead, and if you want it back so badly, maybe join one of the fan efforts attempting to resurrect it (I believe there are at least two.)
Maybe if you ask very, very nicely Bioware will make some sort of non-hero expansion pack for those who strive for mediocrity.
My understanding about the volume of instancing is actually to keep immersion in the story, not break immersion. Such as if you are given a task to go speak with a npc about getting a particular focusing crystal but this same npc can be killed and happens to drop a much wanted item. You won't have to worry about his spawn being camped by players for his loot. You will be able to speak with him in your own instance pertaining to your story. Then when you walk out the door you will be back in the persistant world. I'm on the fence about how well this will be pulled off. Hopefully it will work seemlessly to where you won't even notice the small story instances.
I have seen immersion broke by other players more often then by instancing. Nothing worse then waiting for spawns with a dozen other players to ruin immersion or having XxDarthVaderxX jumping around begging for credits.
While instancing creates bigger immersion in the story section at hand, it actually breaks the immersion of being in a living, breathing world. It doesn't make much sense that you can't see other players when you're in an instance.
Here's the problem with what you suggest. If you CAN see the other players, it means other players get the mobs before you do and YOU have to wait, sometimes for hours, because of so many other people. The instances take care of that problem. As much as I find instancing to be aggravating, I prefer it to being forced to wait for hours to kill a single mob.
Come on lets be realistic: How often does it happen that you have to wait for hours to kill a single mob?
From my experience, not that many. Yes it is annoying but at the same time, that's what part of being a virtual world is all about. You interact with other players.
To the poster above me: If you want that experience so badly, why would you play an mmorpg? Why wouldn't you just play a game like Dragon Age or Mass Effect, which deliver exactly that experience?
In my opinion, an mmorpg should be more about having an open world and interaction with other players and less about a storyline.
Instancing in ToR: Key Plot Points (flashpoints). Group Content (raids,dungeons etc).
While everything else is said to be open. I think that answers that overused excuse "why not play X sprgp".
Open world and interaction with that storyline.
I'm sure the next person will follow up with "ToRs not a MMO" because they base everything off their own uninformed biased opinion, it's pretty cliche now. But feel free to spew more non-sense, it won't be me looking like a idiot on release day.
Thats really not saying anything. How much of the game makes up of instances? Bioware already confirmed in an interview they will have more instances than most other mmorpgs.
So why not just play a singleplayer game if you want everything the instances offers, and play an mmorpg when you want the world feeling?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Exactly my point about instancing. Thanks.
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Link to evidence of other races playable in the game? Oh, and please come up with something better than one flyaway comment by a dev at a gamecon conference who would agree to anything so long as it keeps him away from his basement cubicle and the smell of his own feet.
Hmmm? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler?
Didn't think so.
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
I don't have a link but it was mentioned in an interview that they expect the game to have more instances than other mmorpgs.
The problem with the things you mentioned is that they really don't give that sense of immersion the way a singleplayer game does. You know the moment you create a new character, the characters you killed on your other character will return. You know that a vast majority of players had the exact or a similar experience you had. They just were in different instances.
It's for this reason that i'm not a big fan of storytelling in mmorpgs and instead rather have a bigger emphasis on world design.
I think being able to build your own house adds far more immersion than an epic storyline does.
Ofcourse it's important to keep in mind that this is all just speculation. I just hope that Star Wars: ToR doesn't become a game like City of Heroes.
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Link to evidence of other races playable in the game? Oh, and please come up with something better than one flyaway comment by a dev at a gamecon conference who would agree to anything so long as it keeps him away from his basement cubicle and the smell of his own feet.
Hmmm? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler?
Didn't think so.
Here is an official forum post on the SWTOR forums.
swtor.com/community/showthread.php
Since you obviously don't bother with research, here's the quote for you.
"You will be able to play other species, we just have not announced those other species yet."
I stand by my "uninformed SWTOR troll" assessment of you.
First of all, lets just state what this game is and isn't, things that are neither good or bad, just different concepts:
What is not, A sandbox game, a game in which you are just another body in the universe, a total departure on what MMO's are right now. Raids in which 20 people will be beating on 1 guy.
What this game is: Lore one of the main pillars, key events in the story will be instanced (similar to LOTRO), Will have a variant of the trinity.
Now, people will like or not like aspects of the game, that does not mean is a good game or a bad game, just likes and dislikes of individuals. I personally like a linear game more than a sandbox game and the market in general does too, the big games or game out there is not a sandbox and every company wants to get the player base of that game, chances are, people that play WoW will not play on a sandbox game.
We have very little info on what they are doing, the gameplay videos at points get me very excited and at points I feel like I don't want to play the game but in reality, until we try the game will not know. My perfect example, I saw gamplay videos of AoC and WAR and espcecially AoC I was very excited and I thought it was an awesome system, reality is, when I got in the beta, I hate it it. So I learned that videos really mean nothing.
There are posts saying that the classes are not original, I have to disagree with that at this point, I don't think the originality comes from the name of the class or the descritprion but again, with the gameplay we will see how original they are, example, WAR had very original classes, Disciple of Khaine in writing was depraved and cool, the bright wizard seemed really fun to play, the aquig herder just fun, when I played them, well, they didn't live up to the expectations, so maybe the classes are just "iconic and boring" in their names but they might play really original and fun. We don't really know, we can only wait and see, test and then have a valid opinion on the game, right now, it's all speculation.
No I'm not bummed at all. One problem faced by many mmo's is somehow we as players sometimes seem to consider an mmo that can't keep us interested enough to play "forever" a failure or bad game. This in no way reflects what my opinion of the game is but as you've stated with it being a Bioware product we can be assured it will be of the highest production standards and values and will have a very interesting story to tell, it may well not be worth playing forever but who thinks it isn't going to be worth it to play until, well you get sick of it?
What I'm asking is if you bought and played the game and at whatever pace you played it it took you three months to reach "endgame" and decide to retire do you think that you will not have been entertained by the experience? My money is on yes and I simply don't look to mmo's to keep me playing forever as none have to this point but I'm fairly glad for the experiences I have had.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Face it, mate. For all your shilling of this game, it's going to be a basic SPG with some online features. It doesn't matter what the developers say at gamecons - we've heard enough lies, mistakes and ambiguities from devs and producers like Julio Torres and Dallas Dickinson before - games are always very different from the hype. I know fanbois like you and Moirae will have a simultaneous nerdgasm to even contemplate the thought but, be warned, the game isn't shaping up to be anything very special.
Says the same troll that insisted there would only be humans playable in SWTOR. Thanks for the usual uninformed warning.
Link to evidence of other races playable in the game? Oh, and please come up with something better than one flyaway comment by a dev at a gamecon conference who would agree to anything so long as it keeps him away from his basement cubicle and the smell of his own feet.
Hmmm? Anyone? Anyone? Buehler?
Didn't think so.
Here is an official forum post on the SWTOR forums.
swtor.com/community/showthread.php
Since you obviously don't bother with research, here's the quote for you.
"You will be able to play other species, we just have not announced those other species yet."
I stand by my "uninformed SWTOR troll" assessment of you.
Oh yeah, that's real authoritative.
Where did the say they was loading the game up with instances? Linky?
Even if they were, I already told you what you needed to know. Key points and group content would be instanced, I welcome plenty of that. Instancing key points will not break immersion, it will enhance it. When I kill the captain displayed in the Flashpoint demo I would not want to wait for him to spawn while 4 other people stood there bouncing around. When my group and I are downing bosses I would rather it be instanced so it doesn't turn into a multi-zerg guild rush to tag.
If the world will be open to explore with every other player, why would I play a singleplayer game? Besides I can't play Mass Effect 2 or DA:O with my guild can I?
I don't have a link but it was mentioned in an interview that they expect the game to have more instances than other mmorpgs.
The problem with the things you mentioned is that they really don't give that sense of immersion the way a singleplayer game does. You know the moment you create a new character, the characters you killed on your other character will return. You know that a vast majority of players had the exact or a similar experience you had. They just were in different instances.
It's for this reason that i'm not a big fan of storytelling in mmorpgs and instead rather have a bigger emphasis on world design.
I think being able to build your own house adds far more immersion than an epic storyline does.
Ofcourse it's important to keep in mind that this is all just speculation. I just hope that Star Wars: ToR doesn't become a game like City of Heroes.
Nothing against you, but I'm not going to buy it until I get a link of some sort. I'm pretty up to date on the interviews. I'll also say I won't doubt it.
Part of the flashpoints is doing it once and only once. The group content will be be the same for each class, but that's inevitable and If it wasn't the same you would be calling it a sprpg due to never grouping. The moment you create a new character in ToR you're delivered a new story with new flashpoints. I would say the immersion will be far better in ToR then any other MMO.
As for a Boss and killing him more then once on the same character. As I said, it's inevitable. My problem is the zergs that would take place if it was not instanced (azuregos in vanilla WoW). It would be cool if developers could constantly deliver new content every day, but right now it's just not realistic. There will be points where Immersion is not all that wonderful, but I will take a instance over a world boss that never respawns until they can deliver content fast enough to make up for the boss I just killed.
I'll agree with you about CoH. I have my doubts with BioWare, I mostly think they will do fine though. Keep in mind, ToR certainly wont be for everybody, hell it might not even be for me and if that's true, I hope they can bring something to the genre for other developers consideration.