I think this is a humongous joke, not the game so much as the players getting their money back. If you bought this game IN BETA because you couldn't wait to play it, and then saw what a pre alpha game was like and got scared, you should not get your money back. You should also not get your money back when they don't release on time. Many MMOs don't release on time, their shipping dates get pushed back, and the community the MO appeals to.. the so called "Hardcore" crowd should have known better in the first place. If you get your money back, consider yourself lucky, because you shouldn't.... they should keep it and consider it a stupid tax for buying something before you had proof it would be worth the cash.
We purchased the game NOT the beta as the developers said. The game has not come out yet, so we deserve a refund for it. We pre-purchased the GAME not the beta, simple as that.
Again... we bought GAME NOT THE BETA
Yeah right. I find it hard to believe you didn't know what you were in for back when you bought it, no one could honestly have believed that a game going into beta in early summer was launching in September.
The developers asked people to purchase the beta to help them out in bringing the game to release.
So you didn't get a boxed copy. Who cares, what did you plan to do with it, frame it and put it on the mantle?
I just see sour grapes from people who definitely knew better but now expect us to believe they had no idea that this is how it might all turn out.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I think this is a humongous joke, not the game so much as the players getting their money back. If you bought this game IN BETA because you couldn't wait to play it, and then saw what a pre alpha game was like and got scared, you should not get your money back. You should also not get your money back when they don't release on time. Many MMOs don't release on time, their shipping dates get pushed back, and the community the MO appeals to.. the so called "Hardcore" crowd should have known better in the first place. If you get your money back, consider yourself lucky, because you shouldn't.... they should keep it and consider it a stupid tax for buying something before you had proof it would be worth the cash.
We purchased the game NOT the beta as the developers said. The game has not come out yet, so we deserve a refund for it. We pre-purchased the GAME not the beta, simple as that.
Again... we bought GAME NOT THE BETA
And the release date was pushed back.... so when you buy a GAME that gets pushed back, you still bought THE GAME... not the beta, even though it was pushed back. You only get your money back when theres NO GAME. The game is just a couple weeks from launch. Rationalizing it one way or another, this wouldn'tve happened if the game was more ready for release, and if you hadn't already spent months in pre production while the game had problems. Theres something to be said for those that can't wait until OB to play the game... which, in all honesty is just the glorified free trial for most games.
Back when they announced the beta access for paying players, I bet you all thought you were getting in on the ground floor to get an edge... now you rationalize taking your money back because of a short postponement? I'm not saying that I think you should buy the game, I just think its a double standard, and you made your decision early on, and they should force you to live up to that decision. At the end of the day, lesson learned either way I guess.
I think this is a humongous joke, not the game so much as the players getting their money back. If you bought this game IN BETA because you couldn't wait to play it, and then saw what a pre alpha game was like and got scared, you should not get your money back. You should also not get your money back when they don't release on time. Many MMOs don't release on time, their shipping dates get pushed back, and the community the MO appeals to.. the so called "Hardcore" crowd should have known better in the first place. If you get your money back, consider yourself lucky, because you shouldn't.... they should keep it and consider it a stupid tax for buying something before you had proof it would be worth the cash.
Luckily we have rules which govern how you must conduct business. When you agree to accept Visa/Mastercard you are contractually obligated to follow these rules. You are not allowed to make your own up as you go along. Software is not unique, Mortal online is not unique and Star vault is not unique. SV did not follow the rules related to charging a customer and delivering a product, thus their contract with Visa/MC required that they return the money they unilaterally decided to keep as an interest free 6+ month loan. This is why we have these rules and contracts.. so that it's not up to someone's whim on whether they think it's a joke or not.
I'm not a benefactor that is donating to a cause... if I were I'd send my money to help the people in Haiti and not a video game company. No.. I am a consumer and as such there are universal expectations about the behavior of a company doing business. If SV doesn't follow the rules they get slapped down. If THEY don't like those rules perhaps THEY should have done research on their Visa/MC contracts before they signed them.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Originally posted by Kyleran So you didn't get a boxed copy. Who cares, what did you plan to do with it, frame it and put it on the mantle?
I care, I purchased the box and it hasn't been shipped after they said it was 3 weeks ago. I paid for it and I do not like being lied to about it being shipped when it wasn't.
Purchasing a box of an unfinished game thinking it will ship on the estimated date is niave to put it nicely.
All of the posts of people like that will not deter me in the slightest of trying this game once it is released, but I'm also a person who never preorders anything because it's not worth it. But I certainly wouldn't of preordered a non finished game and then been mad when they didn't ship me a copy before it finished.
I had preordered a few games back in the day that go pushed back months and no one made a fuss then, suddenly people are surprised that pre-ordering (ordering something before it's ready hence the pre) doesn't guarantee a date. That's why it is always an estimate.
Purchasing a box of an unfinished game thinking it will ship on the estimated date is niave to put it nicely.
All of the posts of people like that will not deter me in the slightest of trying this game once it is released, but I'm also a person who never preorders anything because it's not worth it. But I certainly wouldn't of preordered a non finished game and then been mad when they didn't ship me a copy before it finished.
I had preordered a few games back in the day that go pushed back months and no one made a fuss then, suddenly people are surprised that pre-ordering (ordering something before it's ready hence the pre) doesn't guarantee a date. That's why it is always an estimate.
People are crazy.
I must be crazy since I pre-ordered the 1st day it was released. They said they would ship it in September, then pushed it back to December, now January. Probably going to push it back another few months, because of that people are getting refunds.
I think this is a humongous joke, not the game so much as the players getting their money back. If you bought this game IN BETA because you couldn't wait to play it, and then saw what a pre alpha game was like and got scared, you should not get your money back. You should also not get your money back when they don't release on time. Many MMOs don't release on time, their shipping dates get pushed back, and the community the MO appeals to.. the so called "Hardcore" crowd should have known better in the first place. If you get your money back, consider yourself lucky, because you shouldn't.... they should keep it and consider it a stupid tax for buying something before you had proof it would be worth the cash.
Luckily we have rules which govern how you must conduct business. When you agree to accept Visa/Mastercard you are contractually obligated to follow these rules. You are not allowed to make your own up as you go along. Software is not unique, Mortal online is not unique and Star vault is not unique. SV did not follow the rules related to charging a customer and delivering a product, thus their contract with Visa/MC required that they return the money they unilaterally decided to keep as an interest free 6+ month loan. This is why we have these rules and contracts.. so that it's not up to someone's whim on whether they think it's a joke or not.
I'm not a benefactor that is donating to a cause... if I were I'd send my money to help the people in Haiti and not a video game company. No.. I am a consumer and as such there are universal expectations about the behavior of a company doing business. If SV doesn't follow the rules they get slapped down. If THEY don't like those rules perhaps THEY should have done research on their Visa/MC contracts before they signed them.
And what expectations did they not live up to? I don't think you understand that they are following all the rules. You agreed when you bought the game. YOU agreed when you accepted the terms and agreements. Visa and Mastercard will charge back ANYTHING unless it is contested. They are following the same exact rules all MMOs use when dealing with preorders. Whatabout cryptics LIFETIME memberships? Weeks after CO launched there were posts about those that wanted refunds. I wonder how those turned out? They spent 200 dollars on a lifetime membership BEFORE the game launched... roughly before OB started -- the same thing with STO. SV is releasing the game this month, they still are releasing a product, YOU took the terms on yourself to take the promotional items of early beta access when you bought the game in the first place and YOU used it.
YOU accepted the terms and agreements, YOU authorized them to charge the payment. They didn't defraud you as they were still providing you a product with an amended shipping date, they didn't reneg on their deal or their contract, they pushed the date back. account.mortalonline.com/public/pdf/refund_policy.pdf "During the nature of an Open Beta, Mortal Online will not be functioning up to the standards of the Gold Release of the game. This kind of Beta issues are not eligible for reimburersement."
Whats most likely lucky for a good deal of players right now, is that it would be more expensive to put 50 - 80 dollars in collections and contest those that are pulling back funds then just let it go. Not that I really care that much, but in the real world, when dealing with money, you should be held accountable for your actions..... obviously that doesn't mean you are.. but a stupid decision is a stupid decision.
I think this is a humongous joke, not the game so much as the players getting their money back. If you bought this game IN BETA because you couldn't wait to play it, and then saw what a pre alpha game was like and got scared, you should not get your money back. You should also not get your money back when they don't release on time. Many MMOs don't release on time, their shipping dates get pushed back, and the community the MO appeals to.. the so called "Hardcore" crowd should have known better in the first place. If you get your money back, consider yourself lucky, because you shouldn't.... they should keep it and consider it a stupid tax for buying something before you had proof it would be worth the cash.
Luckily we have rules which govern how you must conduct business. When you agree to accept Visa/Mastercard you are contractually obligated to follow these rules. You are not allowed to make your own up as you go along. Software is not unique, Mortal online is not unique and Star vault is not unique. SV did not follow the rules related to charging a customer and delivering a product, thus their contract with Visa/MC required that they return the money they unilaterally decided to keep as an interest free 6+ month loan. This is why we have these rules and contracts.. so that it's not up to someone's whim on whether they think it's a joke or not.
I'm not a benefactor that is donating to a cause... if I were I'd send my money to help the people in Haiti and not a video game company. No.. I am a consumer and as such there are universal expectations about the behavior of a company doing business. If SV doesn't follow the rules they get slapped down. If THEY don't like those rules perhaps THEY should have done research on their Visa/MC contracts before they signed them.
And what expectations did they not live up to? I don't think you understand that they are following all the rules. You agreed when you bought the game. YOU agreed when you accepted the terms and agreements. Visa and Mastercard will charge back ANYTHING unless it is contested. They are following the same exact rules all MMOs use when dealing with preorders. Whatabout cryptics LIFETIME memberships? Weeks after CO launched there were posts about those that wanted refunds. I wonder how those turned out? They spent 200 dollars on a lifetime membership BEFORE the game launched... roughly before OB started -- the same thing with STO. SV is releasing the game this month, they still are releasing a product, YOU took the terms on yourself to take the promotional items of early beta access when you bought the game in the first place and YOU used it.
YOU accepted the terms and agreements, YOU authorized them to charge the payment. They didn't defraud you as they were still providing you a product with an amended shipping date, they didn't reneg on their deal or their contract, they pushed the date back. account.mortalonline.com/public/pdf/refund_policy.pdf "During the nature of an Open Beta, Mortal Online will not be functioning up to the standards of the Gold Release of the game. This kind of Beta issues are not eligible for reimburersement."
Whats most likely lucky for a good deal of players right now, is that it would be more expensive to put 50 - 80 dollars in collections and contest those that are pulling back funds then just let it go. Not that I really care that much, but in the real world, when dealing with money, you should be held accountable for your actions..... obviously that doesn't mean you are.. but a stupid decision is a stupid decision.
Their refund policy is extremely vague and probably illegal. Using funds for an open ended loan, saying "we dont have to pay you back if we dont want to" and then pushing back when they were shipping the boxes and pushing back their launch months and months. All that added together can be used to justify a refund. Don't blame people for their actions when its Starvault that has caused all these problems. If they violate the terms of service with the credit card companies, people should be able to get a refund, thats the "real world"
"I can't speak for Star Vault, but from what I have seen on the forums, you likely won't be getting a refund through them. If you'd like to try to get a refund from them, email support@starvault.se asking for one, and you might have to wait a while to get it, as they don't have support staff. Honestly though, they probably won't even respond to it, since it doesn't qualify for a refund as stated in their September update (and in the refund policy, which has not changed to my knowledge).
If you don't recieve a response from them in a reasonable amount of time (whatever that may be), then go through your credit card company. At least then you can say that you gave SV a chance to process the refund themselves.
Then again, they are supposed to have shipped out some of the boxes already, so although I know others have received refunds through their CC companies prior to this, I'm not sure whether or not this would still be possible."
And what expectations did they not live up to? I don't think you understand that they are following all the rules. You agreed when you bought the game. YOU agreed when you accepted the terms and agreements. Visa and Mastercard will charge back ANYTHING unless it is contested. They are following the same exact rules all MMOs use when dealing with preorders. Whatabout cryptics LIFETIME memberships? Weeks after CO launched there were posts about those that wanted refunds. I wonder how those turned out? They spent 200 dollars on a lifetime membership BEFORE the game launched... roughly before OB started -- the same thing with STO. SV is releasing the game this month, they still are releasing a product, YOU took the terms on yourself to take the promotional items of early beta access when you bought the game in the first place and YOU used it.
YOU accepted the terms and agreements, YOU authorized them to charge the payment. They didn't defraud you as they were still providing you a product with an amended shipping date, they didn't reneg on their deal or their contract, they pushed the date back. account.mortalonline.com/public/pdf/refund_policy.pdf "During the nature of an Open Beta, Mortal Online will not be functioning up to the standards of the Gold Release of the game. This kind of Beta issues are not eligible for reimburersement."
Whats most likely lucky for a good deal of players right now, is that it would be more expensive to put 50 - 80 dollars in collections and contest those that are pulling back funds then just let it go. Not that I really care that much, but in the real world, when dealing with money, you should be held accountable for your actions..... obviously that doesn't mean you are.. but a stupid decision is a stupid decision.
No.. you are 100% wrong. Please... I did NOT accept any terms and agreements when I ordered the game. Nope.. no popups.. nothing I clicked on.. nadda. Part of THEIR terms with Visa is that THEY will deliver the product within a certain amount of time. You CANNOT charge someone in July and not deliver a product 6 months later and not give the money back if asked. THOSE are the terms they agreed to and it is NOT superceded by some clicky on the left side of an order page that you don;t even have to read when placing your order...
The REALITY of the situation is that SV was wrong and they have paid the price. If THEY didn't want to be held to deliver a product within a certain timeframe after charging us.. THEY shouldn't have accepted Visa. They can't make their own rules up no matter how much they might like to.
The REALITY is that I got $75 back plus $5 in interest.. plus they had to pay a fee to my bank as a Recovery Charge since THEY didn;t follow the rules. I believe it is $100 but I am not sure.
Simple way of looking at it.. They have provided NO product. I have provided NO payment.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
No.. you are 100% wrong. Please... I did NOT accept any terms and agreements when I ordered the game. Nope.. no popups.. nothing I clicked on.. nadda. Part of THEIR terms with Visa is that THEY will deliver the product within a certain amount of time. You CANNOT charge someone in July and not deliver a product 6 months later and not give the money back if asked. THOSE are the terms they agreed to and it is NOT superceded by some clicky on the left side of an order page that you don;t even have to read when placing your order...
The REALITY of the situation is that SV was wrong and they have paid the price. If THEY didn't want to be held to deliver a product within a certain timeframe after charging us.. THEY shouldn't have accepted Visa. They can't make their own rules up no matter how much they might like to. The REALITY is that I got $75 back plus $5 in interest.. plus they had to pay a fee to my bank as a Recovery Charge since THEY didn;t follow the rules. I believe it is $100 but I am not sure.
Simple way of looking at it.. They have provided NO product. I have provided NO payment.
Pretty bad you had to capitalize all of those words just so he would understand. What you say is legitimate and I agree. No product (beta is not a product) so a refund is in order.
And what expectations did they not live up to? I don't think you understand that they are following all the rules. You agreed when you bought the game. YOU agreed when you accepted the terms and agreements. Visa and Mastercard will charge back ANYTHING unless it is contested. They are following the same exact rules all MMOs use when dealing with preorders. Whatabout cryptics LIFETIME memberships? Weeks after CO launched there were posts about those that wanted refunds. I wonder how those turned out? They spent 200 dollars on a lifetime membership BEFORE the game launched... roughly before OB started -- the same thing with STO. SV is releasing the game this month, they still are releasing a product, YOU took the terms on yourself to take the promotional items of early beta access when you bought the game in the first place and YOU used it.
YOU accepted the terms and agreements, YOU authorized them to charge the payment. They didn't defraud you as they were still providing you a product with an amended shipping date, they didn't reneg on their deal or their contract, they pushed the date back. account.mortalonline.com/public/pdf/refund_policy.pdf "During the nature of an Open Beta, Mortal Online will not be functioning up to the standards of the Gold Release of the game. This kind of Beta issues are not eligible for reimburersement."
Whats most likely lucky for a good deal of players right now, is that it would be more expensive to put 50 - 80 dollars in collections and contest those that are pulling back funds then just let it go. Not that I really care that much, but in the real world, when dealing with money, you should be held accountable for your actions..... obviously that doesn't mean you are.. but a stupid decision is a stupid decision.
No.. you are 100% wrong. Please... I did NOT accept any terms and agreements when I ordered the game. Nope.. no popups.. nothing I clicked on.. nadda. Part of THEIR terms with Visa is that THEY will deliver the product within a certain amount of time. You CANNOT charge someone in July and not deliver a product 6 months later and not give the money back if asked. THOSE are the terms they agreed to and it is NOT superceded by some clicky on the left side of an order page that you don;t even have to read when placing your order...
The REALITY of the situation is that SV was wrong and they have paid the price. If THEY didn't want to be held to deliver a product within a certain timeframe after charging us.. THEY shouldn't have accepted Visa. They can't make their own rules up no matter how much they might like to.
The REALITY is that I got $75 back plus $5 in interest.. plus they had to pay a fee to my bank as a Recovery Charge since THEY didn;t follow the rules. I believe it is $100 but I am not sure.
Simple way of looking at it.. They have provided NO product. I have provided NO payment.
The game. We bought the game, its not officially out so they have not given us the actual game yet. We still have 2 weeks until launch. (also can be applied to the box)
They SPECIFICALLY said they were not selling beta. I didn't buy beta. I bought a game. Actually my Receipt says: "DVD Box containing the game Mortal Online"
No DVD box received.. no game received. Over 6 months now.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
The game. We bought the game, its not officially out so they have not given us the actual game yet. We still have 2 weeks until launch. (also can be applied to the box)
i may be mistaken but when you buy something you get it right then. from what ive been reading everyone paid to pre-order the game with the option to participate in the beta testing of the game.
The game. We bought the game, its not officially out so they have not given us the actual game yet. We still have 2 weeks until launch. (also can be applied to the box)
i may be mistaken but when you buy something you get it right then. from what ive been reading everyone paid to pre-order the game with the option to participate in the beta testing of the game.
Again, we did not buy the beta, we bought the game. The game is not out yet so we should be able to get a refund. Also, the box was never shipped after 6 months, another reason why people wanted the refund. Some people are weary of purchasing products from unknown companies, thats why there are terms of service with Visa / Master Card for fraud protection. Some people can use that to get refunds as SV has not shipped the boxes they said they shipped and the game is constantly getting pushed back in every newsletter they release. They should have had their release set in stone at the very beginning, not push it back every month or every time they released a newsletter. That throws up red flags for an unknown company, even for MMO veterans.
i may be mistaken but when you buy something you get it right then. from what ive been reading everyone paid to pre-order the game with the option to participate in the beta testing of the game.
We did not pay for the beta.. we paid for the game. huge difference. If they charged me $10 for the beta then I couldn;t get a refund for that once I used it.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
i may be mistaken but when you buy something you get it right then. from what ive been reading everyone paid to pre-order the game with the option to participate in the beta testing of the game.
We did not pay for the beta.. we paid for the game. huge difference. If they charged me $10 for the beta then I couldn;t get a refund for that once I used it.
I would have paid $5 to get into their beta from the beginning, as they would have been selling BETA ACCESS. We purchased the game, which gave us beta access as a perk. It was not the game.
so the two of you were unhappy with the state of the game after being in the beta test so you wanted your money back?
Why shouldn't we get a refund for a product we do not actually own yet? The game is released in 2 weeks, until then we are in the beta, we do not own the game. (also lying about shipping the boxes has thrown many other people over as well)
so the two of you were unhappy with the state of the game after being in the beta test so you wanted your money back?
Why shouldn't we get a refund for a product we do not actually own yet? The game is released in 2 weeks, until then we are in the beta, we do not own the game. (also lying about shipping the boxes has thrown many other people over as well)
so the both of you are pissed over not getting a box and want your money back?
so the two of you were unhappy with the state of the game after being in the beta test so you wanted your money back?
Not even close my friend. I bought the game in July.. logged into beta.. spent 2 minutes stuck in "Sausage lake' which was litterally a lake of naked guys that couldnt move. Logged in maybe a total of 3 times since then.
My issue was that they SAID they were charging me for something in July that would be shipped in September. that didn;t seem unreasonable. Then Sept passed and nothing happened. Then people started claiming they were given tracking numbers.. which were fake. I still waited.. assuming I would give them until Dec.. In Dec they postposed AGAIN. I sent 5 messages to support and posted on their forums. They never.. even responded to me.
So here I am.. no product.. no response to my messages.. and out $75. So at THAT point I decide I have had enough and Email my Card Company. They wanted a copy of the receipt and the last day I would have accepted the product. I sent them copies of my messages that were never answered. They then contacted SV/GlobalConnect or "MALMO" as it showed on my charge who agreed that they had not sent any product. About 6-7 days after I contacted my card company my charge was reversed and all interest refunded.
EDIT TO ADD:
I didn;t pre-order the game to get free beta access. The one reason I pre-ordered was because one of the Developers said that pre-ordering was the only way to ensure you would be playing the game on launch day. I was in Darkfall when it went online with that crazy ordering scenario and 75% of the people got locked out. I was lucky to get in (was a fun 6 months) .. but I didn't want to get shutout from this game... Little did I know...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
so the two of you were unhappy with the state of the game after being in the beta test so you wanted your money back?
Why shouldn't we get a refund for a product we do not actually own yet? The game is released in 2 weeks, until then we are in the beta, we do not own the game. (also lying about shipping the boxes has thrown many other people over as well)
so the both of you are pissed over not getting a box and want your money back?
From what I have seen, SV has conducted themselves unprofessionally and the terrible management decisions they had, such as the 2 week vacation they took, I decided to move on and get my money back. What is wrong with that? Why would I not try to get a refund for it when its not even officially released yet? And why should I not try to get my money back if they lied about shipping the boxes?
Its impossible to defend the box issue anyway you spin it.
Go back to WoW. *plays Benny Hill theme* In all seriousness, while I get where you are coming from with the sad fanaticism of MO fans, what is to be said about these "scam historians" who have been keeping lists like this, only for the sake of cramming it down throats? I'd have to say you folk have a serious issue too. Go play some other game, rather that trying to sabotage this one after being underwhelmed by it. Totally just as pathetic as the fanboi thing we all see (though not as lame as that guy who gets banned every 4 hours after trying to post bullshit, only to come back for more).
I am trying to make sure people actually know whats going on and not to spend money on this until after the release. I am trying to warn people not to buy it due to the fanboy hype and distortion of what is actually happening. I think its a public service to help people save money...
Well you know there are two sides to every coin, as much as you want to warn it seems some fans want to advertise. Of course on both sides you are within your own right to do so. It's obvious some people believe enough in the game that they will throw money at it in order to see it. It's obvious some people want to spend a lot of their time tearing down any notion of this being a decent game. I don't really look at either side as right or wrong, just simply people doing what they want with their time and/or money.
If only both sides could respect each others view, they're would be no problem. For starters why not drop teh fanboi and hater crap?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Well you know there are two sides to every coin, as much as you want to warn it seems some fans want to advertise. Of course on both sides you are within your own right to do so. It's obvious some people believe enough in the game that they will throw money at it in order to see it. It's obvious some people want to spend a lot of their time tearing down any notion of this being a decent game. I don't really look at either side as right or wrong, just simply people doing what they want with their time and/or money. If only both sides could respect each others view, they're would be no problem. For starters why not drop teh fanboi and hater crap?
Yea, I am wrong for using the fanboy/hater thing. Thats my bad, will try to stop doing that. its a bad habbit due to posting on the MO forums and getting flamed constantly for criticizing their game gods =P
Comments
We purchased the game NOT the beta as the developers said. The game has not come out yet, so we deserve a refund for it. We pre-purchased the GAME not the beta, simple as that.
Again... we bought GAME NOT THE BETA
Yeah right. I find it hard to believe you didn't know what you were in for back when you bought it, no one could honestly have believed that a game going into beta in early summer was launching in September.
The developers asked people to purchase the beta to help them out in bringing the game to release.
So you didn't get a boxed copy. Who cares, what did you plan to do with it, frame it and put it on the mantle?
I just see sour grapes from people who definitely knew better but now expect us to believe they had no idea that this is how it might all turn out.
C'mon, we weren't born yesterday.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
We purchased the game NOT the beta as the developers said. The game has not come out yet, so we deserve a refund for it. We pre-purchased the GAME not the beta, simple as that.
Again... we bought GAME NOT THE BETA
And the release date was pushed back.... so when you buy a GAME that gets pushed back, you still bought THE GAME... not the beta, even though it was pushed back. You only get your money back when theres NO GAME. The game is just a couple weeks from launch. Rationalizing it one way or another, this wouldn'tve happened if the game was more ready for release, and if you hadn't already spent months in pre production while the game had problems. Theres something to be said for those that can't wait until OB to play the game... which, in all honesty is just the glorified free trial for most games.
Back when they announced the beta access for paying players, I bet you all thought you were getting in on the ground floor to get an edge... now you rationalize taking your money back because of a short postponement? I'm not saying that I think you should buy the game, I just think its a double standard, and you made your decision early on, and they should force you to live up to that decision. At the end of the day, lesson learned either way I guess.
Luckily we have rules which govern how you must conduct business. When you agree to accept Visa/Mastercard you are contractually obligated to follow these rules. You are not allowed to make your own up as you go along. Software is not unique, Mortal online is not unique and Star vault is not unique. SV did not follow the rules related to charging a customer and delivering a product, thus their contract with Visa/MC required that they return the money they unilaterally decided to keep as an interest free 6+ month loan. This is why we have these rules and contracts.. so that it's not up to someone's whim on whether they think it's a joke or not.
I'm not a benefactor that is donating to a cause... if I were I'd send my money to help the people in Haiti and not a video game company. No.. I am a consumer and as such there are universal expectations about the behavior of a company doing business. If SV doesn't follow the rules they get slapped down. If THEY don't like those rules perhaps THEY should have done research on their Visa/MC contracts before they signed them.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I care, I purchased the box and it hasn't been shipped after they said it was 3 weeks ago. I paid for it and I do not like being lied to about it being shipped when it wasn't.
Purchasing a box of an unfinished game thinking it will ship on the estimated date is niave to put it nicely.
All of the posts of people like that will not deter me in the slightest of trying this game once it is released, but I'm also a person who never preorders anything because it's not worth it. But I certainly wouldn't of preordered a non finished game and then been mad when they didn't ship me a copy before it finished.
I had preordered a few games back in the day that go pushed back months and no one made a fuss then, suddenly people are surprised that pre-ordering (ordering something before it's ready hence the pre) doesn't guarantee a date. That's why it is always an estimate.
People are crazy.
I must be crazy since I pre-ordered the 1st day it was released. They said they would ship it in September, then pushed it back to December, now January. Probably going to push it back another few months, because of that people are getting refunds.
Luckily we have rules which govern how you must conduct business. When you agree to accept Visa/Mastercard you are contractually obligated to follow these rules. You are not allowed to make your own up as you go along. Software is not unique, Mortal online is not unique and Star vault is not unique. SV did not follow the rules related to charging a customer and delivering a product, thus their contract with Visa/MC required that they return the money they unilaterally decided to keep as an interest free 6+ month loan. This is why we have these rules and contracts.. so that it's not up to someone's whim on whether they think it's a joke or not.
I'm not a benefactor that is donating to a cause... if I were I'd send my money to help the people in Haiti and not a video game company. No.. I am a consumer and as such there are universal expectations about the behavior of a company doing business. If SV doesn't follow the rules they get slapped down. If THEY don't like those rules perhaps THEY should have done research on their Visa/MC contracts before they signed them.
And what expectations did they not live up to? I don't think you understand that they are following all the rules. You agreed when you bought the game. YOU agreed when you accepted the terms and agreements. Visa and Mastercard will charge back ANYTHING unless it is contested. They are following the same exact rules all MMOs use when dealing with preorders. Whatabout cryptics LIFETIME memberships? Weeks after CO launched there were posts about those that wanted refunds. I wonder how those turned out? They spent 200 dollars on a lifetime membership BEFORE the game launched... roughly before OB started -- the same thing with STO. SV is releasing the game this month, they still are releasing a product, YOU took the terms on yourself to take the promotional items of early beta access when you bought the game in the first place and YOU used it.
YOU accepted the terms and agreements, YOU authorized them to charge the payment. They didn't defraud you as they were still providing you a product with an amended shipping date, they didn't reneg on their deal or their contract, they pushed the date back. account.mortalonline.com/public/pdf/refund_policy.pdf "During the nature of an Open Beta, Mortal Online will not be functioning up to the standards of the Gold Release of the game. This kind of Beta issues are not eligible for reimburersement."
Whats most likely lucky for a good deal of players right now, is that it would be more expensive to put 50 - 80 dollars in collections and contest those that are pulling back funds then just let it go. Not that I really care that much, but in the real world, when dealing with money, you should be held accountable for your actions..... obviously that doesn't mean you are.. but a stupid decision is a stupid decision.
Luckily we have rules which govern how you must conduct business. When you agree to accept Visa/Mastercard you are contractually obligated to follow these rules. You are not allowed to make your own up as you go along. Software is not unique, Mortal online is not unique and Star vault is not unique. SV did not follow the rules related to charging a customer and delivering a product, thus their contract with Visa/MC required that they return the money they unilaterally decided to keep as an interest free 6+ month loan. This is why we have these rules and contracts.. so that it's not up to someone's whim on whether they think it's a joke or not.
I'm not a benefactor that is donating to a cause... if I were I'd send my money to help the people in Haiti and not a video game company. No.. I am a consumer and as such there are universal expectations about the behavior of a company doing business. If SV doesn't follow the rules they get slapped down. If THEY don't like those rules perhaps THEY should have done research on their Visa/MC contracts before they signed them.
And what expectations did they not live up to? I don't think you understand that they are following all the rules. You agreed when you bought the game. YOU agreed when you accepted the terms and agreements. Visa and Mastercard will charge back ANYTHING unless it is contested. They are following the same exact rules all MMOs use when dealing with preorders. Whatabout cryptics LIFETIME memberships? Weeks after CO launched there were posts about those that wanted refunds. I wonder how those turned out? They spent 200 dollars on a lifetime membership BEFORE the game launched... roughly before OB started -- the same thing with STO. SV is releasing the game this month, they still are releasing a product, YOU took the terms on yourself to take the promotional items of early beta access when you bought the game in the first place and YOU used it.
YOU accepted the terms and agreements, YOU authorized them to charge the payment. They didn't defraud you as they were still providing you a product with an amended shipping date, they didn't reneg on their deal or their contract, they pushed the date back. account.mortalonline.com/public/pdf/refund_policy.pdf "During the nature of an Open Beta, Mortal Online will not be functioning up to the standards of the Gold Release of the game. This kind of Beta issues are not eligible for reimburersement."
Whats most likely lucky for a good deal of players right now, is that it would be more expensive to put 50 - 80 dollars in collections and contest those that are pulling back funds then just let it go. Not that I really care that much, but in the real world, when dealing with money, you should be held accountable for your actions..... obviously that doesn't mean you are.. but a stupid decision is a stupid decision.
Their refund policy is extremely vague and probably illegal. Using funds for an open ended loan, saying "we dont have to pay you back if we dont want to" and then pushing back when they were shipping the boxes and pushing back their launch months and months. All that added together can be used to justify a refund. Don't blame people for their actions when its Starvault that has caused all these problems. If they violate the terms of service with the credit card companies, people should be able to get a refund, thats the "real world"
Lachrymose is going to end up loosing his mod position on the MO forums for this
www.mortalonline.com/forums/30589-refund.html#post670639
"I can't speak for Star Vault, but from what I have seen on the forums, you likely won't be getting a refund through them. If you'd like to try to get a refund from them, email support@starvault.se asking for one, and you might have to wait a while to get it, as they don't have support staff. Honestly though, they probably won't even respond to it, since it doesn't qualify for a refund as stated in their September update (and in the refund policy, which has not changed to my knowledge).
If you don't recieve a response from them in a reasonable amount of time (whatever that may be), then go through your credit card company. At least then you can say that you gave SV a chance to process the refund themselves.
Then again, they are supposed to have shipped out some of the boxes already, so although I know others have received refunds through their CC companies prior to this, I'm not sure whether or not this would still be possible."
No.. you are 100% wrong. Please... I did NOT accept any terms and agreements when I ordered the game. Nope.. no popups.. nothing I clicked on.. nadda. Part of THEIR terms with Visa is that THEY will deliver the product within a certain amount of time. You CANNOT charge someone in July and not deliver a product 6 months later and not give the money back if asked. THOSE are the terms they agreed to and it is NOT superceded by some clicky on the left side of an order page that you don;t even have to read when placing your order...
The REALITY of the situation is that SV was wrong and they have paid the price. If THEY didn't want to be held to deliver a product within a certain timeframe after charging us.. THEY shouldn't have accepted Visa. They can't make their own rules up no matter how much they might like to.
The REALITY is that I got $75 back plus $5 in interest.. plus they had to pay a fee to my bank as a Recovery Charge since THEY didn;t follow the rules. I believe it is $100 but I am not sure.
Simple way of looking at it.. They have provided NO product. I have provided NO payment.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Pretty bad you had to capitalize all of those words just so he would understand. What you say is legitimate and I agree. No product (beta is not a product) so a refund is in order.
No.. you are 100% wrong. Please... I did NOT accept any terms and agreements when I ordered the game. Nope.. no popups.. nothing I clicked on.. nadda. Part of THEIR terms with Visa is that THEY will deliver the product within a certain amount of time. You CANNOT charge someone in July and not deliver a product 6 months later and not give the money back if asked. THOSE are the terms they agreed to and it is NOT superceded by some clicky on the left side of an order page that you don;t even have to read when placing your order...
The REALITY of the situation is that SV was wrong and they have paid the price. If THEY didn't want to be held to deliver a product within a certain timeframe after charging us.. THEY shouldn't have accepted Visa. They can't make their own rules up no matter how much they might like to.
The REALITY is that I got $75 back plus $5 in interest.. plus they had to pay a fee to my bank as a Recovery Charge since THEY didn;t follow the rules. I believe it is $100 but I am not sure.
Simple way of looking at it.. They have provided NO product. I have provided NO payment.
what product didnt they provide?
The game. We bought the game, its not officially out so they have not given us the actual game yet. We still have 2 weeks until launch. (also can be applied to the box)
The game that I ordered....
They SPECIFICALLY said they were not selling beta. I didn't buy beta. I bought a game. Actually my Receipt says: "DVD Box containing the game Mortal Online"
No DVD box received.. no game received. Over 6 months now.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
The game. We bought the game, its not officially out so they have not given us the actual game yet. We still have 2 weeks until launch. (also can be applied to the box)
i may be mistaken but when you buy something you get it right then. from what ive been reading everyone paid to pre-order the game with the option to participate in the beta testing of the game.
The game. We bought the game, its not officially out so they have not given us the actual game yet. We still have 2 weeks until launch. (also can be applied to the box)
i may be mistaken but when you buy something you get it right then. from what ive been reading everyone paid to pre-order the game with the option to participate in the beta testing of the game.
Again, we did not buy the beta, we bought the game. The game is not out yet so we should be able to get a refund. Also, the box was never shipped after 6 months, another reason why people wanted the refund. Some people are weary of purchasing products from unknown companies, thats why there are terms of service with Visa / Master Card for fraud protection. Some people can use that to get refunds as SV has not shipped the boxes they said they shipped and the game is constantly getting pushed back in every newsletter they release. They should have had their release set in stone at the very beginning, not push it back every month or every time they released a newsletter. That throws up red flags for an unknown company, even for MMO veterans.
We did not pay for the beta.. we paid for the game. huge difference. If they charged me $10 for the beta then I couldn;t get a refund for that once I used it.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
so the two of you were unhappy with the state of the game after being in the beta test so you wanted your money back?
We did not pay for the beta.. we paid for the game. huge difference. If they charged me $10 for the beta then I couldn;t get a refund for that once I used it.
I would have paid $5 to get into their beta from the beginning, as they would have been selling BETA ACCESS. We purchased the game, which gave us beta access as a perk. It was not the game.
Why shouldn't we get a refund for a product we do not actually own yet? The game is released in 2 weeks, until then we are in the beta, we do not own the game. (also lying about shipping the boxes has thrown many other people over as well)
Why shouldn't we get a refund for a product we do not actually own yet? The game is released in 2 weeks, until then we are in the beta, we do not own the game. (also lying about shipping the boxes has thrown many other people over as well)
so the both of you are pissed over not getting a box and want your money back?
Not even close my friend. I bought the game in July.. logged into beta.. spent 2 minutes stuck in "Sausage lake' which was litterally a lake of naked guys that couldnt move. Logged in maybe a total of 3 times since then.
My issue was that they SAID they were charging me for something in July that would be shipped in September. that didn;t seem unreasonable. Then Sept passed and nothing happened. Then people started claiming they were given tracking numbers.. which were fake. I still waited.. assuming I would give them until Dec.. In Dec they postposed AGAIN. I sent 5 messages to support and posted on their forums. They never.. even responded to me.
So here I am.. no product.. no response to my messages.. and out $75. So at THAT point I decide I have had enough and Email my Card Company. They wanted a copy of the receipt and the last day I would have accepted the product. I sent them copies of my messages that were never answered. They then contacted SV/GlobalConnect or "MALMO" as it showed on my charge who agreed that they had not sent any product. About 6-7 days after I contacted my card company my charge was reversed and all interest refunded.
EDIT TO ADD:
I didn;t pre-order the game to get free beta access. The one reason I pre-ordered was because one of the Developers said that pre-ordering was the only way to ensure you would be playing the game on launch day. I was in Darkfall when it went online with that crazy ordering scenario and 75% of the people got locked out. I was lucky to get in (was a fun 6 months) .. but I didn't want to get shutout from this game... Little did I know...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Why shouldn't we get a refund for a product we do not actually own yet? The game is released in 2 weeks, until then we are in the beta, we do not own the game. (also lying about shipping the boxes has thrown many other people over as well)
so the both of you are pissed over not getting a box and want your money back?
From what I have seen, SV has conducted themselves unprofessionally and the terrible management decisions they had, such as the 2 week vacation they took, I decided to move on and get my money back. What is wrong with that? Why would I not try to get a refund for it when its not even officially released yet? And why should I not try to get my money back if they lied about shipping the boxes?
Its impossible to defend the box issue anyway you spin it.
I am trying to make sure people actually know whats going on and not to spend money on this until after the release. I am trying to warn people not to buy it due to the fanboy hype and distortion of what is actually happening. I think its a public service to help people save money...
Well you know there are two sides to every coin, as much as you want to warn it seems some fans want to advertise. Of course on both sides you are within your own right to do so. It's obvious some people believe enough in the game that they will throw money at it in order to see it. It's obvious some people want to spend a lot of their time tearing down any notion of this being a decent game. I don't really look at either side as right or wrong, just simply people doing what they want with their time and/or money.
If only both sides could respect each others view, they're would be no problem. For starters why not drop teh fanboi and hater crap?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Yea, I am wrong for using the fanboy/hater thing. Thats my bad, will try to stop doing that. its a bad habbit due to posting on the MO forums and getting flamed constantly for criticizing their game gods =P