I think it is time for Starvault to get their act together and finally address the various problems. Maybe then, there is still hope.
But until then, I might see more scenes like this one:
Check these out, just played the game for 2 minutes and found massive problems...
Light sources coming from under the ground, my shadow was on the trees
People flying in the air:
Muultiple NPCs spawning inside each other (been there for months)
Horse stuck inside of a house
But remember, their release phase is still going on from what they told their stockholders a month or 2 ago, but all of these basic problems that have been there for months will be fixed in the next few weeks! Have "hope" for Starvault and the "potential" in this game!
Im still waiting for the Content Patch V2.0 and Lag/Sync Patch V2.0.
Whatever happened to the content from the last content patch?
No one knows, 2 weeks have gone by and no questions are asked.. if they are your called a troll and told to "GTFO CAREBEAR" because if your not hardcore enough to play with bugs you should go find another game....
Have I mentioned theres already a hack out to enable 3rd person avatar view?
No, I haven't heard of that one, but add it to a list of many. Stuffs bound to happen with everything clients side and ZERO prevention. You can't even report ones like that and the perma daylight. No one is the wiser. I'm more concerned about the working dupes honestly. Dupes can destroy even the best games.
No one knows, 2 weeks have gone by and no questions are asked.. if they are your called a troll and told to "GTFO CAREBEAR" because if your not hardcore enough to play with bugs you should go find another game....
That sounds vaguely familiar to a phrase I heard when DF launched...lol. It's frightening how similar the launches are and the statements that are being made about said launches.
I think any game has a chance if the game has the available support and it seems this game may have it. It may take a while, but they just might make a fairly polished game. Only time will tell.
Im still waiting for the Content Patch V2.0 and Lag/Sync Patch V2.0.
Whatever happened to the content from the last content patch?
No one knows, 2 weeks have gone by and no questions are asked.. if they are your called a troll and told to "GTFO CAREBEAR" because if your not hardcore enough to play with bugs you should go find another game....
Unfortunately many people who like the "hardcore" style of games such as PvP, Skill-Based, Sandbox style games think that by being this type of gamer you loose your voice to critique these types of games. I don't think it is asking too much to be an advocate of this style of game, and still get quality. No matter what the style of gameplay is, bugs and poor quality will always be unacceptable, carebear gamer or hardcore style advocate.
Why do people keep using the term polish to refer to MO. It's not in the polishing stage.. they are still building the systems. Polish is something that is done AFTER all the systems are in place. Polish is when you go around and fix that tree that's not quite on the ground or that spelling error in the NPC chat. MO is nowhere near the polish stage.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
That's what really concerns me. SV thinking the game was almost ready to go live in Nov. Here we are 4 months later and people are still saying the game needs a minimum of 6-12 months.
Darkfall went through this same problem back when it was first introduced. I still remember joining in the stick-poking of the "Once deceased body" that floated down the river that is these forums. Now Darkfall has resurrected as somewhat decent zombie. It has its flaws; sure, which begs the question. Why make a game that is almost exactly like Darkfall? Mortal Online is pretty much the same as Darkfall, with the exception that everything in Darkfall is done better.
The only thing you can't do in Darkfall is steal, but why bother stealing when you can just kill your opponent dead and take their stuff?
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
I concur. IIRC the doom and gloom surrounding Darkfall was much, much worse, as it stands now I would say Darkfall is probably more successful than anyone ever actually imagined it would be. Keep in mind DFO and MO are not made to draw the masses so it takes less subs to be a success.
DF is actually less successful than I figured it would be and I hate the game. I was expecting ~50k subs but they probably do not even have 20k.
MO will be fortunate to last 6 months after release.
Wow. A direct response instead of shifting the argument. (No, really, it's like cars produced in China) Unfortunately, its a very hard question to answer. As far as I know Aventurine (Darkfall) didn't have any more experience when they started and they seem to have achieved modest success despite a VERY rocky launch. (20,000 subs, $3 million/year gross revenue). I really don't know the level of experience at Icarus studios (Fallen Earth). The lead designer's experience seems to be mainly in pen and paper RPGs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Hammock) I don't know actual subscription numbers but it did seem to be pretty well received and was one of the top games on Steam for a while. Meanwhile, Notorious (Xsyon) has artists with prior experience designing video games (Tomorrow War) and a project leader with previous experience designing MMORPGs (Roma Victor), but have yet to convince me there is actually a game there despite a release date 34 days from now. The problem is ultimately one of scope (http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/3982/Legendary-Failures-of-Legend-Part-Two.html) From following the developers on the Mortal online forums, they seem to understand the need to limit the scope of their game. Well before they entered the closed Beta they were already discussing features that they would like to have but knew were not feasible to put in at launch (http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/288358-post6.html) If your ambition is to design a sandbox MMO, what smaller project do you start with? Even if it doesn't do well at launch, I think the development and creation of MO would be a good thing overall. Darkfall has demonstrated that a sandbox MMO with open PVP is viable despite a terrible launch and demonstrated that there is significant pent up demand for such a thing. The more evidence that there is a market for a sandbox MMO, the more likely that another company with better resources will try it instead of focusing on the next WOW-killer / WOW-clone. In terms of ambition, I think the problem is more one of time than one of scope. They almost certainly started selling discs too soon and seem to have advanced through the stages of Beta-testing to quickly. There is certainly some value in beta testing some of your systems early, but people's expectations are set by current trends. Currently the trend is to use the open beta as a showcase for the finished/nearly finished product. Going to beta early could be due to a different philosophy about beta testing or from poor organization, lack of skill, and inept management. There's only one person on this forum with any real insight on that matter (Hercules) and he has certainly weighed in with his opinion on that subject. However, he may be biased by a soured relationship with the company.
I agree that ultimately the problem is one of scope, later on you actually contradict yourself by saying it's more a problem of time, but to be honest, scope and time are pretty much the same issue here. Larger scope means more time spent developing, which means more money required to sustain that development cycle. Really, as you said, it boils down to scope vs available resources and ensuring they match.
In this case, MO completely overshot themselves and this is what has lead to their downfall. You ask what smaller project they could work on instead? Well my answer would be "anything except an epic sandbox MMO". They badly misjudged the scope of the project they were undertaking precisely due to lack of experience. They thought they could pull it off with their current resources when even just getting one small game under their belt could have demonstrated how difficult it really is and given them a chance to rethink the situation and adjust their scope to fit their resources. As it is, they planned the project without actually knowing what their resources were.
Even a UT3 mod would have allowed them to familiarise themselves with the engine, get a bit of experience in writing effective game code, and given them a better estimate of how long each part of the development cycle would take, and planned MO to suit their skillset without having to learn the hard way.
Anyway. I hope SV learn from this and don't throw in the towel. I don't like indie teams crashing and burning, I just wish they'd learn to walk before learning to fly! Hopefully they'll bounce back from this, and maybe MO will one day see a release.
I meant scope in the contect of the available resources (including time) Sorry if I was unclear. Hopefully they have more resources than some people think. We'll find out if some people are wrong about the time resource soon enough (slapshot). We won't find out about the skills and organization (Hercules) until they release the game or fold up shop. Even then, it may be a matter for some argument
Clearly, they pushed beta and preorders too early and that is taking a toll on the most important resource (the goodwill of your potential customers) Whether that will be fatal or not also remains to be seen.
Darkfall went through this same problem back when it was first introduced. I still remember joining in the stick-poking of the "Once deceased body" that floated down the river that is these forums. Now Darkfall has resurrected as somewhat decent zombie. It has its flaws; sure, which begs the question. Why make a game that is almost exactly like Darkfall? Mortal Online is pretty much the same as Darkfall, with the exception that everything in Darkfall is done better.
The only thing you can't do in Darkfall is steal, but why bother stealing when you can just kill your opponent dead and take their stuff?
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
I concur. IIRC the doom and gloom surrounding Darkfall was much, much worse, as it stands now I would say Darkfall is probably more successful than anyone ever actually imagined it would be. Keep in mind DFO and MO are not made to draw the masses so it takes less subs to be a success.
DF is actually less successful than I figured it would be and I hate the game. I was expecting ~50k subs but they probably do not even have 20k.
MO will be fortunate to last 6 months after release.
That's what really concerns me. SV thinking the game was almost ready to go live in Nov. Here we are 4 months later and people are still saying the game needs a minimum of 6-12 months.
yepa nd epic network code as a dysync issue deep down in there code and i believe they cant release until epic patches it
I thought i had posted it in the my response to Buniont's assertion that Darkfall's launch was smooth "outiside of ~2 days of de-sync issues which were quickly resolved". It was fairly long and ranty, so I suspect it was moderator deleted, even though I made an effort to not attack him, just the assertion.
Hanover confirmed: post deleted. Let's just say, if you go back to March and April in the MMORPG Darkfall forum, it does not fit with that description.
I canceled my pre-order and today I received my loot bag. I was 3 of 999 to order lol. Both the figurines I received were broken, the arms had been broken in two and the rest of the figurine is falling apart. So for all those who said reaper is great and they are quality, well I did NOT get quality. At least SV didn't pay reaper for quality. MO is already far down the hill of hope.
I canceled my pre-order and today I received my loot bag. I was 3 of 999 to order lol. Both the figurines I received were broken, the arms had been broken in two and the rest of the figurine is falling apart. So for all those who said reaper is great and they are quality, well I did NOT get quality. At least SV didn't pay reaper for quality. MO is already far down the hill of hope.
Did you get your money back from SV or whomever you used for payment? The condition of your items could easily be a result of SVs shipping. Based on the pictures I've seen the package is a joke.
I lost all hope for mortal online when I found out that xlordx from an ultima online free server hard been hired because the developers of mortal liked the free server so much. All faith gone from that moment on. So is there hope? No, there hasn't been any for over a year.
The intern doing emotes seems to be the most skilled person on the SV team.
I canceled my pre-order and today I received my loot bag. I was 3 of 999 to order lol. Both the figurines I received were broken, the arms had been broken in two and the rest of the figurine is falling apart. So for all those who said reaper is great and they are quality, well I did NOT get quality. At least SV didn't pay reaper for quality. MO is already far down the hill of hope.
Did you get your money back from SV or whomever you used for payment? The condition of your items could easily be a result of SVs shipping. Based on the pictures I've seen the package is a joke.
It is an absolute joke, and no I had never received my money. My bank said they could never get in touch so the issue could not be resolved. I should reissue a dispute.
I canceled my pre-order and today I received my loot bag. I was 3 of 999 to order lol. Both the figurines I received were broken, the arms had been broken in two and the rest of the figurine is falling apart. So for all those who said reaper is great and they are quality, well I did NOT get quality. At least SV didn't pay reaper for quality. MO is already far down the hill of hope.
Did you get your money back from SV or whomever you used for payment? The condition of your items could easily be a result of SVs shipping. Based on the pictures I've seen the package is a joke.
My bank said they could never get in touch so the issue could not be resolved
Comments
Check these out, just played the game for 2 minutes and found massive problems...
Light sources coming from under the ground, my shadow was on the trees
People flying in the air:
Muultiple NPCs spawning inside each other (been there for months)
Horse stuck inside of a house
But remember, their release phase is still going on from what they told their stockholders a month or 2 ago, but all of these basic problems that have been there for months will be fixed in the next few weeks! Have "hope" for Starvault and the "potential" in this game!
Im still waiting for the Content Patch V2.0 and Lag/Sync Patch V2.0.
Whatever happened to the content from the last content patch?
I win!!! LOL@U
No one knows, 2 weeks have gone by and no questions are asked.. if they are your called a troll and told to "GTFO CAREBEAR" because if your not hardcore enough to play with bugs you should go find another game....
Town light sources seem to not work after the patch
No, I haven't heard of that one, but add it to a list of many.
Stuffs bound to happen with everything clients side and ZERO prevention. You can't even report ones like that and the perma daylight. No one is the wiser. I'm more concerned about the working dupes honestly. Dupes can destroy even the best games.
I win!!! LOL@U
I can't even play the game without getting this every 5 minutes...
rlmccoy1987 the lightning does work in citys i dont know if its personal for you but for me they work.
but people try to play at morning, it doesnt lag and game feels very good!! i think lag is only thing making it unplayable
That sounds vaguely familiar to a phrase I heard when DF launched...lol. It's frightening how similar the launches are and the statements that are being made about said launches.
I think any game has a chance if the game has the available support and it seems this game may have it. It may take a while, but they just might make a fairly polished game. Only time will tell.
No one knows, 2 weeks have gone by and no questions are asked.. if they are your called a troll and told to "GTFO CAREBEAR" because if your not hardcore enough to play with bugs you should go find another game....
Unfortunately many people who like the "hardcore" style of games such as PvP, Skill-Based, Sandbox style games think that by being this type of gamer you loose your voice to critique these types of games. I don't think it is asking too much to be an advocate of this style of game, and still get quality. No matter what the style of gameplay is, bugs and poor quality will always be unacceptable, carebear gamer or hardcore style advocate.
Why do people keep using the term polish to refer to MO. It's not in the polishing stage.. they are still building the systems. Polish is something that is done AFTER all the systems are in place. Polish is when you go around and fix that tree that's not quite on the ground or that spelling error in the NPC chat. MO is nowhere near the polish stage.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Morning in what time zone?
MO's fine with 100 people online. (lag wise)
I win!!! LOL@U
Morning in what time zone?
MO's fine with 100 people online. (lag wise)
Just found this HanoverZ thought you might enjoy it! Remember these are from November 2009...
www.mortalonline.com/forums/26868-when-mo-going-launched-retail-mode.html#post596963
Morning in what time zone?
MO's fine with 100 people online. (lag wise)
Just found this HanoverZ thought you might enjoy it! Remember these are from November 2009...
www.mortalonline.com/forums/26868-when-mo-going-launched-retail-mode.html#post596963
That's what really concerns me. SV thinking the game was almost ready to go live in Nov. Here we are 4 months later and people are still saying the game needs a minimum of 6-12 months.
I win!!! LOL@U
I concur. IIRC the doom and gloom surrounding Darkfall was much, much worse, as it stands now I would say Darkfall is probably more successful than anyone ever actually imagined it would be. Keep in mind DFO and MO are not made to draw the masses so it takes less subs to be a success.
DF is actually less successful than I figured it would be and I hate the game. I was expecting ~50k subs but they probably do not even have 20k.
MO will be fortunate to last 6 months after release.
I agree that ultimately the problem is one of scope, later on you actually contradict yourself by saying it's more a problem of time, but to be honest, scope and time are pretty much the same issue here. Larger scope means more time spent developing, which means more money required to sustain that development cycle. Really, as you said, it boils down to scope vs available resources and ensuring they match.
In this case, MO completely overshot themselves and this is what has lead to their downfall. You ask what smaller project they could work on instead? Well my answer would be "anything except an epic sandbox MMO". They badly misjudged the scope of the project they were undertaking precisely due to lack of experience. They thought they could pull it off with their current resources when even just getting one small game under their belt could have demonstrated how difficult it really is and given them a chance to rethink the situation and adjust their scope to fit their resources. As it is, they planned the project without actually knowing what their resources were.
Even a UT3 mod would have allowed them to familiarise themselves with the engine, get a bit of experience in writing effective game code, and given them a better estimate of how long each part of the development cycle would take, and planned MO to suit their skillset without having to learn the hard way.
Anyway. I hope SV learn from this and don't throw in the towel. I don't like indie teams crashing and burning, I just wish they'd learn to walk before learning to fly! Hopefully they'll bounce back from this, and maybe MO will one day see a release.
NM
I win!!! LOL@U
@Neoptolemus:
I meant scope in the contect of the available resources (including time) Sorry if I was unclear. Hopefully they have more resources than some people think. We'll find out if some people are wrong about the time resource soon enough (slapshot). We won't find out about the skills and organization (Hercules) until they release the game or fold up shop. Even then, it may be a matter for some argument
Clearly, they pushed beta and preorders too early and that is taking a toll on the most important resource (the goodwill of your potential customers) Whether that will be fatal or not also remains to be seen.
@Hanover: Never mind what?
I concur. IIRC the doom and gloom surrounding Darkfall was much, much worse, as it stands now I would say Darkfall is probably more successful than anyone ever actually imagined it would be. Keep in mind DFO and MO are not made to draw the masses so it takes less subs to be a success.
DF is actually less successful than I figured it would be and I hate the game. I was expecting ~50k subs but they probably do not even have 20k.
MO will be fortunate to last 6 months after release.
Df i think has more than 20k subs
but less than 50k
Morning in what time zone?
MO's fine with 100 people online. (lag wise)
Just found this HanoverZ thought you might enjoy it! Remember these are from November 2009...
www.mortalonline.com/forums/26868-when-mo-going-launched-retail-mode.html#post596963
That's what really concerns me. SV thinking the game was almost ready to go live in Nov. Here we are 4 months later and people are still saying the game needs a minimum of 6-12 months.
yepa nd epic network code as a dysync issue deep down in there code and i believe they cant release until epic patches it
21,622 to be precise. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/259666/DarkFall-Character-Counts-for-both-Servers.html
I thought i had posted it in the my response to Buniont's assertion that Darkfall's launch was smooth "outiside of ~2 days of de-sync issues which were quickly resolved". It was fairly long and ranty, so I suspect it was moderator deleted, even though I made an effort to not attack him, just the assertion.
Hanover confirmed: post deleted. Let's just say, if you go back to March and April in the MMORPG Darkfall forum, it does not fit with that description.
I canceled my pre-order and today I received my loot bag. I was 3 of 999 to order lol. Both the figurines I received were broken, the arms had been broken in two and the rest of the figurine is falling apart. So for all those who said reaper is great and they are quality, well I did NOT get quality. At least SV didn't pay reaper for quality. MO is already far down the hill of hope.
Did you get your money back from SV or whomever you used for payment? The condition of your items could easily be a result of SVs shipping. Based on the pictures I've seen the package is a joke.
I win!!! LOL@U
The intern doing emotes seems to be the most skilled person on the SV team.
I win!!! LOL@U
Did you get your money back from SV or whomever you used for payment? The condition of your items could easily be a result of SVs shipping. Based on the pictures I've seen the package is a joke.
It is an absolute joke, and no I had never received my money. My bank said they could never get in touch so the issue could not be resolved. I should reissue a dispute.
Did you get your money back from SV or whomever you used for payment? The condition of your items could easily be a result of SVs shipping. Based on the pictures I've seen the package is a joke.
My bank said they could never get in touch so the issue could not be resolved
Then is should have defaulted in your favor.
I win!!! LOL@U