looks into mirrorball 2010 blizzard introduces "instanced world PvP™" Astranaar,Barrens,Splintree Post,Tarren Mill and more!! lft ,cross-realm,afklft,ontheflylft and more. feel like it was back then™ update!! world PvP™ is back!
the only way i could see myself playing this game again, would be to make all addons illegal.
lets see you LTP the game as it was intended.
it was a fun game before i was told i needed these addons to play.
"do you have raidhax?"
no, i don't use addons.
"What you don't use addons? you cant play with us then"
thats ok, i didn't want to play with people who need to cheat.
"we don't cheat!!" " omfggtfoylb. you don't know how to play this game, at the very least get the agro thingy to tell if your doing too much damage, so you don't pull agro from the tank."
no sorry i don't need some program to help me exploit the game.
"you will never get a group in this game again!!"
thats ok, ill go look for a game that doesn't let you cheat.
They need to come out wiht a server or servers for the classic vanilla wow before battlegrouds were put in the game and ruined pvp and put the old gm grind back in which means no resi and no welfare epics and no arenas which it what causes all the nerfs..
if you don't play anymore then just wait for CAT and if its not for you, again, then stop. i don't play. i haven't since november. i take breaks from MMOs. I'll hit it up again come CAT and enjoy it for a few months and then stop and go elsewhere, like with FE and DF right now. I'm cool with those until CAT.
Originally posted by SwampRob While I am pleased that they are offering more options, this new mechanic would certainly not bring me back. There are more hassles to grouping than just getting the group; various afks, loot ninjas, people playing at different paces, and ofc the moronic idea that only one person in a group gets loot off a boss. If I can't do the content SOLO, I'm not really interested. This includes ALL instances, raids, etc. The thing I really dislike about Wow is the bait and switch that you can solo til the end, and then you are required to group to improve your character further. Bleh.
First let me state that I am in agreement with you about more options, but I don't agree with your ends to that means.
What you are suggesting is just giving away rewards for the more challenging and difficult content at the price of spending time doing easy tasks. That is why I don't your solution is a solution at all. A better solution is to offer more difficult solo content and I do not mean tacking on timesinks. There really needs to be a break through in this area for that to be achieved though.
Furthermore I think you misrepresent the bait and switch of the game. There has ALWAYS been superior items in dungeons to what is offered to solo players at comparable levels. Almost every mmo on the market has this concept and it was in wow from the beginning. One cannot chose to ignore that for 80 levels and then claim bait and switch, since it has always existed. There is a finite amount of solo content just like there is a finite amount of group content. It is so easy to reach the end of the solo content, because it is just that. Easy.
For whatever reason, superior group rewards do not seem to be a problem until people run out of experience bars to fill up.
I respect the civility of this response; not all posters do this.
However, I do not agree that solo mode must equate to easy mode, although admittedly this is usually the case. Conversely, group mode does not have to nor is it always harder than solo. An argument could be made that if things go poorly in a fight when solo, you have no one to help you, heal you, pull agro off you, etc. I will grant though, that almost every MMO today is designed for the tougher bosses/content to be tackled by a group.
You are correct in that traditionally, MMO games give better rewards to group play. It is my contention that this is antiquated thinking and that MMOs should change. I do not believe I am speculating when I say that the majority of the time, the majority of the players in MMOs are soloing. Therefore, why must the best loot only be obtainable through grouping? To state it another way, why must the most challenging content only be for groups? I firmly believe that any designer who believes this is the only way it can be lacks imagination.
In any event, I will continue to enjoy MMOs in my own fashion and will continue to turn down all group quests or offerings to team up. Like everyone else, I get only one vote, and I will continue to vote with my wallet and not long support MMOs which refuse to give me the opportunity at equal rewards through solo play. FWIW, not every MMO gives the best loot to only groupers, merely the majority of them.
They slowed the leveling curve about 10-fold and added an appropriate amount of content. They made the game much less gear-dependent and much more skill-dependent. They made crafting actually useful. They made crafting much more fun. They didn't put so much emphasis on end-game raiding. They managed to balance classes properly. They wouldn't continuously buff this class, nerf the other, and vice versa when the next patch comes. They made instances more interesting and less cookie cutter. They introduced more interesting features rather than lame copies of what some other MMO already did better to start with. The vast majority of the terrible community left the game. They made characters more unique, cosmetically.
100% agree with you with number 10, that's the reason I don't play WoW anymore, because of these it meant finding friends was impossible, not only that but I've heard they also ruin ruin the game by gear and achievements. During my days of playing I always fell pray to stupid noobish pug groups, it wasn't fun and it ruined the game, basically the whole game is ruined because of elitists, stupid noobs and the frigging trollers. I don't think I ever want to come back to WoW, I like to talk to people while I level and if lucky level in a group but if people don't want be social or helpful then that just means you end up being a lone wolf forever when you level and that's not fun. =(
Shame the other MMORPG's are disliked by everyone, shame there isn't a really good game like it and is original rather than some cheap clone like RoM. =(
Originally posted by SwampRob I respect the civility of this response; not all posters do this. Thank you and likewise <<snip>> You are correct in that traditionally, MMO games give better rewards to group play. It is my contention that this is antiquated thinking and that MMOs should change. I do not believe I am speculating when I say that the majority of the time, the majority of the players in MMOs are soloing. Therefore, why must the best loot only be obtainable through grouping? To state it another way, why must the most challenging content only be for groups? I firmly believe that any designer who believes this is the only way it can be lacks imagination.
Right now I think we are at the apex of a swing from forced grouping to pure solo play. Forced grouping was a major problem of early mmos and pure solo is becoming a recipe for failure right now.
I don't think it is a case of developers lacking imagination as much as it is the genre is still young and they just have not figured out what works yet. Raiding is a proven mechanics that many have enjoyed for 10+ years and solo has also grown in popularity. Together they complement each other, but they also have the potential to destroy each other if the balance is to far in one direction.
If there was an easy solution the market would be filled with awesome games, but unfortunately it is a hard problem. Eventually someone will have that break through idea the bridges the gap.
Here is something to think about though. If all raid/group items were removed from the game and replaced with the rewards from solo content, would you find the game any better?
I recently unplugged after about 5 years, started right around the time BC came out.
I'd like to see if they could have a batch of servers for various stages of game pre-bc, pre lk etc.
When i started playing and you saw someone with a mount you knew they had put in a lot of time and effort to aquire it. As it stands now, the first 30 levels are no real challenge and the mounts are practially given to you at lvl 20.
I think what happened is they chose to make getting to end-game so much easier. Oppossed to making the playing of the game the actual fun part.
I'd say i played the last few years because of the people i had met and to chat and/or play with them.
I'm currently hoping another game comes out that grabs me like WoW did, hoping DCU is the one, champion online is 'almost' a lot of fun, the builds of your character are a bit much, if you go off the prefered path of the build your character is pretty weak. And maybe its my opinion of a superhero but they should be able to easily fight and beat at least 2 'thugs'.
They slowed the leveling curve about 10-fold and added an appropriate amount of content. They made the game much less gear-dependent and much more skill-dependent. They made crafting actually useful. They made crafting much more fun. They didn't put so much emphasis on end-game raiding. They managed to balance classes properly. They wouldn't continuously buff this class, nerf the other, and vice versa when the next patch comes. They made instances more interesting and less cookie cutter. They introduced more interesting features rather than lame copies of what some other MMO already did better to start with. The vast majority of the terrible community left the game. They made characters more unique, cosmetically.
100% agree with you with number 10, that's the reason I don't play WoW anymore, because of these it meant finding friends was impossible, not only that but I've heard they also ruin ruin the game by gear and achievements. During my days of playing I always fell pray to stupid noobish pug groups, it wasn't fun and it ruined the game, basically the whole game is ruined because of elitists, stupid noobs and the frigging trollers. I don't think I ever want to come back to WoW, I like to talk to people while I level and if lucky level in a group but if people don't want be social or helpful then that just means you end up being a lone wolf forever when you level and that's not fun. =(
Shame the other MMORPG's are disliked by everyone, shame there isn't a really good game like it and is original rather than some cheap clone like RoM. =(
Rudy,
Well said my friend. I was in WoW from beta - it was the first game I actually stood outside for at midnight to get. I remember the wonder of the NE realm and just how simple and fun the initial gameplay was. The Warcraft story in MMO form just after it was released was a blast. No nerfs, no focus on uber gear, just fun and exploration. I am also in agreement that #10 is an experience-killer. Barrens and GS chat was awful. I am an old school MMO player. I started with Asheron's Call all those years ago, and even played some EQ before it got easier, back when evil characters had XP penalty.
What I don't want to do is
1) knock Blizzard for WoW - it is an extremely impressive game. That would be like knocking the iPhone because it's awesome. But similarly, the control by Apple and the fanboys kill it for me, and that was ultimately why I switched phones. WoW is the same way. Too much focus on end game and a loss of enjoying the journey - that to me is what makes all the difference. If you haven't played DDO, that's one thing they got right. Sure, it's great to get to level 20, and it is ultimately every player's goal - but heck, enjoy the quests, the scenery, and the fun of upgrading your character on your way to max level.
2) Knock WoW players (well, except the ones that turned it into Monty Python's Flying Circus of Idiots) The players that are so boisterous and obnoxious in chat and in groups just ruin it for me. It's like "hey we conquered the game, it's no fun now, just grinding for epics" and people talk like they're at work. Seriously, I can't tell you how many times in BC instances the group was so dull and boring. I think the fun of the instance lost its shimmer because they knew they would have to run it 50 times in the next two weeks to get what they wanted. I like jumping in to an MMO where some understanding and skill is required to fully take advantage of all the game offers. WoW has become item-based more than skill-based, as was mentioned. When it first came out, the non-customizable stats were kind of a nice thing after so many MMOs required a bachelor's degree just to figure out the best way to build your character (which I did like to some extent, I must admit.) And WoW 's landscapes are unique to this day.
These may all be relatively small reasons that I don't play WoW anymore, but collectively, it's just not fun for me. People keep saying if you stick with it, it gets fun end game, but heck, it's a game - shouldn't it be fun now?
The trolling, attacks and retaliations are to stop please.
Lets get the thread back onto topic, which is asking people what would bring them back to WoW. If you never left or are currently playing WoW a simple "I never left" will suffice.
I don't think it is a case of developers lacking imagination as much as it is the genre is still young and they just have not figured out what works yet. Raiding is a proven mechanics that many have enjoyed for 10+ years and solo has also grown in popularity. Together they complement each other, but they also have the potential to destroy each other if the balance is to far in one direction. If there was an easy solution the market would be filled with awesome games, but unfortunately it is a hard problem. Eventually someone will have that break through idea the bridges the gap.
Here is something to think about though. If all raid/group items were removed from the game and replaced with the rewards from solo content, would you find the game any better?
I agree that the solution is not an easy or obvious one, especially when you consider that for solo play the content has to doable by various classes.
Also, I have no desire to see group/raid rewards removed from the game. It would be arrogant indeed to expect the game be designed only to my tastes. In fact, if such were done, it would likely result in less people playing the game, which in turn would mean less dollars in the coffers of developers, etc.
I am merely seeking alternatives to the same old type of endgame. I think it's particularly egregious when a game has a 10 part quest where the first 9 parts can be done solo and the last requires a group. I feel that by allowing players to the top level and then require them to team for advancement is very similar. If I feel like playing a single-person game, I do so. But there are many reasons to play MMOs other than grouping, and I am looking for one which rewards all playstyles equally. Of course, balances would have to be put in place to not make soloing superior time-wise, and I think that's fair. As long as it's possible to achieve the same loot in various ways.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The trolling, attacks and retaliations are to stop please. Lets get the thread back onto topic, which is asking people what would bring them back to WoW. If you never left or are currently playing WoW a simple "I never left" will suffice.
Thank you and have a fantastic day
Animuschaser
I like your new head gear. Errr....I mean....lights. Very cool. I need to tell you though....they might scare extremely stoned individuals when they happen upon them while surfing the site. Hypothetically speaking, I mean, you know....when they're not like expecting to see cop lights. Like...they might even like spill bong water in their keyboards, or...ya know...it's kinda...risky. I mean, ya know....I'm not sayin' I like...did that...or anything, but....you know...it could happen....
>_>
<_<
Edit:
Man do those faces like...look right? They don't seem right to me.... do they look shifty? They're supposed to look, ya know...shifty...is this thread sort of, I don't know....does it look smaller all of a sudden to anyone else? Didn't we used to have a button with like...emotes? Oh wait...HERE IT IS! <---wtf is he doing? eating chocolate cake? the emote choices are unsatisfactory.
wait....chocolate CAKE! omg....I'm so HUNGRY....
is posting complete nonsensical rubbish considered trolling? wow I hope not....wait...the parallels are almost too coincidental....and I don't even understand what I just said....
I don't think it is a case of developers lacking imagination as much as it is the genre is still young and they just have not figured out what works yet. Raiding is a proven mechanics that many have enjoyed for 10+ years and solo has also grown in popularity. Together they complement each other, but they also have the potential to destroy each other if the balance is to far in one direction. If there was an easy solution the market would be filled with awesome games, but unfortunately it is a hard problem. Eventually someone will have that break through idea the bridges the gap.
Here is something to think about though. If all raid/group items were removed from the game and replaced with the rewards from solo content, would you find the game any better?
I agree that the solution is not an easy or obvious one, especially when you consider that for solo play the content has to doable by various classes.
Also, I have no desire to see group/raid rewards removed from the game. It would be arrogant indeed to expect the game be designed only to my tastes. In fact, if such were done, it would likely result in less people playing the game, which in turn would mean less dollars in the coffers of developers, etc.
I am merely seeking alternatives to the same old type of endgame. I think it's particularly egregious when a game has a 10 part quest where the first 9 parts can be done solo and the last requires a group. I feel that by allowing players to the top level and then require them to team for advancement is very similar. If I feel like playing a single-person game, I do so. But there are many reasons to play MMOs other than grouping, and I am looking for one which rewards all playstyles equally. Of course, balances would have to be put in place to not make soloing superior time-wise, and I think that's fair. As long as it's possible to achieve the same loot in various ways.
i miss world raid style(it could be instanced ) but i sure would love to see a kind of raid like that with both facting able to go in there till say a cap of 1000 player in those pvpve raid instance
Originally posted by SwampRob I agree that the solution is not an easy or obvious one, especially when you consider that for solo play the content has to doable by various classes.
I think that is the biggest blockade to more open and challenging solo content in games.
Solo content is harder to design, because it has to take the lowest common denominator into account. It limits the mechanics that can be used, because it only takes 1 class to lack the proper ability to deal with the mechanic to present an impassable roadblock. This is the direct opposite of group content design.
Somehow, developers need to either get away from the notion that all classes can complete every quest, design a system to cater specifically to the class that is on attempting the task or something else.
None of which sound easy.
I still very much disagree with your theory of being forced to group at endgame. As I said earlier, group rewards are almost always superior to solo content from level 1 in mmos. Group based rewards are required to handle the much more difficult content of group based activities.
I understand that some people do not like to group in mmos (a very strange concept when you consider what an mmo is), but I don't think people should be rewarded for opting to not participate in the more difficult content of a game. That is very much like asking for pvp rewards without ever having to fight another player controlled avatar.
Originally posted by SwampRob I agree that the solution is not an easy or obvious one, especially when you consider that for solo play the content has to doable by various classes.
I think that is the biggest blockade to more open and challenging solo content in games.
Solo content is harder to design, because it has to take the lowest common denominator into account. It limits the mechanics that can be used, because it only takes 1 class to lack the proper ability to deal with the mechanic to present an impassable roadblock. This is the direct opposite of group content design.
Somehow, developers need to either get away from the notion that all classes can complete every quest, design a system to cater specifically to the class that is on attempting the task or something else.
None of which sound easy.
I still very much disagree with your theory of being forced to group at endgame. As I said earlier, group rewards are almost always superior to solo content from level 1 in mmos. Group based rewards are required to handle the much more difficult content of group based activities.
I understand that some people do not like to group in mmos (a very strange concept when you consider what an mmo is), but I don't think people should be rewarded for opting to not participate in the more difficult content of a game. That is very much like asking for pvp rewards without ever having to fight another player controlled avatar.
Originally posted by arctarus looking at this : eq2.wikia.com/wiki/Solo_Instances EQ2 have solo instances, so i dont understand why blizz cant implement it. Regarding why players who like to solo play mmo, i believe we have tons of post regarding it, beaten to death. The next mmo that's able to capture more players is 1 that's able to cater to all kinds of play style...
I have played in the solo instances of EQ2 and honestly that doesn't change anything. Solo play in the open world or in an instance is really just the same thing.
The flaw is in the design and mechanics of mmos that make solo gameplay almost trivial, especially when compared to group play. The content is scaled down to make sure that every possible class can complete the content and that it makes it very easy to complete.
Similarly in EQ2 displays why it is a bad idea to put the best rewards for most of the game as easily made player crafted gear and the effect it has making much of the pve content useless except for AA's and masters.
They balanced the classes, brought nerfs within industry norms instead of including them in every patch, and stopped changing the skill trees every 20 minutes.
Hehe this is exactly why I quit... hated having the rug pulled out from under me every other patch.
Comments
instanced =to world pvp ?that i got to see?
the only way i could see myself playing this game again, would be to make all addons illegal.
lets see you LTP the game as it was intended.
it was a fun game before i was told i needed these addons to play.
"do you have raidhax?"
no, i don't use addons.
"What you don't use addons? you cant play with us then"
thats ok, i didn't want to play with people who need to cheat.
"we don't cheat!!" " omfggtfoylb. you don't know how to play this game, at the very least get the agro thingy to tell if your doing too much damage, so you don't pull agro from the tank."
no sorry i don't need some program to help me exploit the game.
"you will never get a group in this game again!!"
thats ok, ill go look for a game that doesn't let you cheat.
They need to come out wiht a server or servers for the classic vanilla wow before battlegrouds were put in the game and ruined pvp and put the old gm grind back in which means no resi and no welfare epics and no arenas which it what causes all the nerfs..
I would give it ago if they got rid of battle grounds and we had world PVP like when it first came out!
if you don't play anymore then just wait for CAT and if its not for you, again, then stop. i don't play. i haven't since november. i take breaks from MMOs. I'll hit it up again come CAT and enjoy it for a few months and then stop and go elsewhere, like with FE and DF right now. I'm cool with those until CAT.
First let me state that I am in agreement with you about more options, but I don't agree with your ends to that means.
What you are suggesting is just giving away rewards for the more challenging and difficult content at the price of spending time doing easy tasks. That is why I don't your solution is a solution at all. A better solution is to offer more difficult solo content and I do not mean tacking on timesinks. There really needs to be a break through in this area for that to be achieved though.
Furthermore I think you misrepresent the bait and switch of the game. There has ALWAYS been superior items in dungeons to what is offered to solo players at comparable levels. Almost every mmo on the market has this concept and it was in wow from the beginning. One cannot chose to ignore that for 80 levels and then claim bait and switch, since it has always existed. There is a finite amount of solo content just like there is a finite amount of group content. It is so easy to reach the end of the solo content, because it is just that. Easy.
For whatever reason, superior group rewards do not seem to be a problem until people run out of experience bars to fill up.
I respect the civility of this response; not all posters do this.
However, I do not agree that solo mode must equate to easy mode, although admittedly this is usually the case. Conversely, group mode does not have to nor is it always harder than solo. An argument could be made that if things go poorly in a fight when solo, you have no one to help you, heal you, pull agro off you, etc. I will grant though, that almost every MMO today is designed for the tougher bosses/content to be tackled by a group.
You are correct in that traditionally, MMO games give better rewards to group play. It is my contention that this is antiquated thinking and that MMOs should change. I do not believe I am speculating when I say that the majority of the time, the majority of the players in MMOs are soloing. Therefore, why must the best loot only be obtainable through grouping? To state it another way, why must the most challenging content only be for groups? I firmly believe that any designer who believes this is the only way it can be lacks imagination.
In any event, I will continue to enjoy MMOs in my own fashion and will continue to turn down all group quests or offerings to team up. Like everyone else, I get only one vote, and I will continue to vote with my wallet and not long support MMOs which refuse to give me the opportunity at equal rewards through solo play. FWIW, not every MMO gives the best loot to only groupers, merely the majority of them.
100% agree with you with number 10, that's the reason I don't play WoW anymore, because of these it meant finding friends was impossible, not only that but I've heard they also ruin ruin the game by gear and achievements. During my days of playing I always fell pray to stupid noobish pug groups, it wasn't fun and it ruined the game, basically the whole game is ruined because of elitists, stupid noobs and the frigging trollers. I don't think I ever want to come back to WoW, I like to talk to people while I level and if lucky level in a group but if people don't want be social or helpful then that just means you end up being a lone wolf forever when you level and that's not fun. =(
Shame the other MMORPG's are disliked by everyone, shame there isn't a really good game like it and is original rather than some cheap clone like RoM. =(
Right now I think we are at the apex of a swing from forced grouping to pure solo play. Forced grouping was a major problem of early mmos and pure solo is becoming a recipe for failure right now.
I don't think it is a case of developers lacking imagination as much as it is the genre is still young and they just have not figured out what works yet. Raiding is a proven mechanics that many have enjoyed for 10+ years and solo has also grown in popularity. Together they complement each other, but they also have the potential to destroy each other if the balance is to far in one direction.
If there was an easy solution the market would be filled with awesome games, but unfortunately it is a hard problem. Eventually someone will have that break through idea the bridges the gap.
Here is something to think about though. If all raid/group items were removed from the game and replaced with the rewards from solo content, would you find the game any better?
I never left
i see you.
I recently unplugged after about 5 years, started right around the time BC came out.
I'd like to see if they could have a batch of servers for various stages of game pre-bc, pre lk etc.
When i started playing and you saw someone with a mount you knew they had put in a lot of time and effort to aquire it. As it stands now, the first 30 levels are no real challenge and the mounts are practially given to you at lvl 20.
I think what happened is they chose to make getting to end-game so much easier. Oppossed to making the playing of the game the actual fun part.
I'd say i played the last few years because of the people i had met and to chat and/or play with them.
I'm currently hoping another game comes out that grabs me like WoW did, hoping DCU is the one, champion online is 'almost' a lot of fun, the builds of your character are a bit much, if you go off the prefered path of the build your character is pretty weak. And maybe its my opinion of a superhero but they should be able to easily fight and beat at least 2 'thugs'.
Neither have the others ... mentally ...
or they wouldn't post.
Want a real mmorpg? Play WOW with experience turned off mode and be Pve_Pvp King at any level without a rat race.
Neither have the others ... mentally ...
or they wouldn't post.
You ever get tired of trolling?
The op has listed things that would get him to come back to WoW, Every other sane person without a WoW fanboi agenda has done the same thing.
I love how you see a thread like this and feel the need to challenge everyone.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
100% agree with you with number 10, that's the reason I don't play WoW anymore, because of these it meant finding friends was impossible, not only that but I've heard they also ruin ruin the game by gear and achievements. During my days of playing I always fell pray to stupid noobish pug groups, it wasn't fun and it ruined the game, basically the whole game is ruined because of elitists, stupid noobs and the frigging trollers. I don't think I ever want to come back to WoW, I like to talk to people while I level and if lucky level in a group but if people don't want be social or helpful then that just means you end up being a lone wolf forever when you level and that's not fun. =(
Shame the other MMORPG's are disliked by everyone, shame there isn't a really good game like it and is original rather than some cheap clone like RoM. =(
Rudy,
Well said my friend. I was in WoW from beta - it was the first game I actually stood outside for at midnight to get. I remember the wonder of the NE realm and just how simple and fun the initial gameplay was. The Warcraft story in MMO form just after it was released was a blast. No nerfs, no focus on uber gear, just fun and exploration. I am also in agreement that #10 is an experience-killer. Barrens and GS chat was awful. I am an old school MMO player. I started with Asheron's Call all those years ago, and even played some EQ before it got easier, back when evil characters had XP penalty.
What I don't want to do is
1) knock Blizzard for WoW - it is an extremely impressive game. That would be like knocking the iPhone because it's awesome. But similarly, the control by Apple and the fanboys kill it for me, and that was ultimately why I switched phones. WoW is the same way. Too much focus on end game and a loss of enjoying the journey - that to me is what makes all the difference. If you haven't played DDO, that's one thing they got right. Sure, it's great to get to level 20, and it is ultimately every player's goal - but heck, enjoy the quests, the scenery, and the fun of upgrading your character on your way to max level.
2) Knock WoW players (well, except the ones that turned it into Monty Python's Flying Circus of Idiots) The players that are so boisterous and obnoxious in chat and in groups just ruin it for me. It's like "hey we conquered the game, it's no fun now, just grinding for epics" and people talk like they're at work. Seriously, I can't tell you how many times in BC instances the group was so dull and boring. I think the fun of the instance lost its shimmer because they knew they would have to run it 50 times in the next two weeks to get what they wanted. I like jumping in to an MMO where some understanding and skill is required to fully take advantage of all the game offers. WoW has become item-based more than skill-based, as was mentioned. When it first came out, the non-customizable stats were kind of a nice thing after so many MMOs required a bachelor's degree just to figure out the best way to build your character (which I did like to some extent, I must admit.) And WoW 's landscapes are unique to this day.
These may all be relatively small reasons that I don't play WoW anymore, but collectively, it's just not fun for me. People keep saying if you stick with it, it gets fun end game, but heck, it's a game - shouldn't it be fun now?
insanex
The trolling, attacks and retaliations are to stop please.
Lets get the thread back onto topic, which is asking people what would bring them back to WoW. If you never left or are currently playing WoW a simple "I never left" will suffice.
Thank you and have a fantastic day
Animuschaser
Oh Noes Its The Forum Police
I agree that the solution is not an easy or obvious one, especially when you consider that for solo play the content has to doable by various classes.
Also, I have no desire to see group/raid rewards removed from the game. It would be arrogant indeed to expect the game be designed only to my tastes. In fact, if such were done, it would likely result in less people playing the game, which in turn would mean less dollars in the coffers of developers, etc.
I am merely seeking alternatives to the same old type of endgame. I think it's particularly egregious when a game has a 10 part quest where the first 9 parts can be done solo and the last requires a group. I feel that by allowing players to the top level and then require them to team for advancement is very similar. If I feel like playing a single-person game, I do so. But there are many reasons to play MMOs other than grouping, and I am looking for one which rewards all playstyles equally. Of course, balances would have to be put in place to not make soloing superior time-wise, and I think that's fair. As long as it's possible to achieve the same loot in various ways.
FFA PVP server would bring me back, with or w/o some form of looting.
Toss in some keeps or something that are worth fighting (a la DAOC) and I'm there for a while.
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I like your new head gear. Errr....I mean....lights. Very cool. I need to tell you though....they might scare extremely stoned individuals when they happen upon them while surfing the site. Hypothetically speaking, I mean, you know....when they're not like expecting to see cop lights. Like...they might even like spill bong water in their keyboards, or...ya know...it's kinda...risky. I mean, ya know....I'm not sayin' I like...did that...or anything, but....you know...it could happen....
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Edit:
Man do those faces like...look right? They don't seem right to me.... do they look shifty? They're supposed to look, ya know...shifty...is this thread sort of, I don't know....does it look smaller all of a sudden to anyone else? Didn't we used to have a button with like...emotes? Oh wait...HERE IT IS!
<---wtf is he doing? eating chocolate cake? the emote choices are unsatisfactory.
wait....chocolate CAKE! omg....I'm so HUNGRY....
is posting complete nonsensical rubbish considered trolling? wow I hope not....wait...the parallels are almost too coincidental....and I don't even understand what I just said....
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Implement PQ as an alternative to raid...
RIP Orc Choppa
I agree that the solution is not an easy or obvious one, especially when you consider that for solo play the content has to doable by various classes.
Also, I have no desire to see group/raid rewards removed from the game. It would be arrogant indeed to expect the game be designed only to my tastes. In fact, if such were done, it would likely result in less people playing the game, which in turn would mean less dollars in the coffers of developers, etc.
I am merely seeking alternatives to the same old type of endgame. I think it's particularly egregious when a game has a 10 part quest where the first 9 parts can be done solo and the last requires a group. I feel that by allowing players to the top level and then require them to team for advancement is very similar. If I feel like playing a single-person game, I do so. But there are many reasons to play MMOs other than grouping, and I am looking for one which rewards all playstyles equally. Of course, balances would have to be put in place to not make soloing superior time-wise, and I think that's fair. As long as it's possible to achieve the same loot in various ways.
i miss world raid style(it could be instanced ) but i sure would love to see a kind of raid like that with both facting able to go in there till say a cap of 1000 player in those pvpve raid instance
some dont like it but some do love those .
I think that is the biggest blockade to more open and challenging solo content in games.
Solo content is harder to design, because it has to take the lowest common denominator into account. It limits the mechanics that can be used, because it only takes 1 class to lack the proper ability to deal with the mechanic to present an impassable roadblock. This is the direct opposite of group content design.
Somehow, developers need to either get away from the notion that all classes can complete every quest, design a system to cater specifically to the class that is on attempting the task or something else.
None of which sound easy.
I still very much disagree with your theory of being forced to group at endgame. As I said earlier, group rewards are almost always superior to solo content from level 1 in mmos. Group based rewards are required to handle the much more difficult content of group based activities.
I understand that some people do not like to group in mmos (a very strange concept when you consider what an mmo is), but I don't think people should be rewarded for opting to not participate in the more difficult content of a game. That is very much like asking for pvp rewards without ever having to fight another player controlled avatar.
I think that is the biggest blockade to more open and challenging solo content in games.
Solo content is harder to design, because it has to take the lowest common denominator into account. It limits the mechanics that can be used, because it only takes 1 class to lack the proper ability to deal with the mechanic to present an impassable roadblock. This is the direct opposite of group content design.
Somehow, developers need to either get away from the notion that all classes can complete every quest, design a system to cater specifically to the class that is on attempting the task or something else.
None of which sound easy.
I still very much disagree with your theory of being forced to group at endgame. As I said earlier, group rewards are almost always superior to solo content from level 1 in mmos. Group based rewards are required to handle the much more difficult content of group based activities.
I understand that some people do not like to group in mmos (a very strange concept when you consider what an mmo is), but I don't think people should be rewarded for opting to not participate in the more difficult content of a game. That is very much like asking for pvp rewards without ever having to fight another player controlled avatar.
looking at this : eq2.wikia.com/wiki/Solo_Instances
EQ2 have solo instances, so i dont understand why blizz cant implement it.
Regarding why players who like to solo play mmo, i believe we have tons of post regarding it, beaten to death.
The next mmo that's able to capture more players is 1 that's able to cater to all kinds of play style...
RIP Orc Choppa
I have played in the solo instances of EQ2 and honestly that doesn't change anything. Solo play in the open world or in an instance is really just the same thing.
The flaw is in the design and mechanics of mmos that make solo gameplay almost trivial, especially when compared to group play. The content is scaled down to make sure that every possible class can complete the content and that it makes it very easy to complete.
Similarly in EQ2 displays why it is a bad idea to put the best rewards for most of the game as easily made player crafted gear and the effect it has making much of the pve content useless except for AA's and masters.
That would actually make me consider it, although I'm through with WoW (not because I hate it, just had enough).
Death Knights would have to be disabled as well though.
Anyway, not likely to happen.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Hehe this is exactly why I quit... hated having the rug pulled out from under me every other patch.