Blizzard has brought a whole new meaning to the word Scam. You people are quite foolish to keep allowing them to take advantage of you like this. But i guess if your happy then who am i to care.
"Make them pay"?? How in the world did you arrive at that wild eyed fallacy? NO ONE is being made/forced to pay for anything from the item shop. Yes, WoW makes Blizzard around a billion dollars a year(Asians have a pay model than the west does), simply by providing their subscribers(customers) with the service that they remain subscribed to. Isn't capitalism wonderful? ^^
As for your last... Thats the typical knee jerk reaction of the thoughtless. Getting our Dear Leaders involved in just about anything is a certain path to totally messing it up. Thanks, but we don't need any more of that around here.
[Mod Edit]
Anyway, regarding my post,,, please forgive me for the bad choice of words... By saying, "making them pay" I didn't mean blizzard literally held a gun everyones head threatening to commit bloody massacre's if their subscribers didn't purchase a ridiculous care bear celestial steed..... Obvously no one can make you buy something the person doesn't want..,,,,,
What I meant to say is, people addicted to WoW would feel the need to purchase that lovely steed simply because it's new, fun, and the only way one could get one is by coughing up 25 dollars.... So in a way, blizzard "KNOWS" and understands the game is an addiction and they are purposely creating these items to sell for "real life money buy me now" money because they know people are addicted enough and mindless enough to purchase the items...
No matter what you or anyone else says, it's wrong and unethical. I'll repeat what I stated earlier.. All virtual reality game items should be available in game and require either questing or raiding to acquire all the items... Our billed monthly subscription should include every item being obtainable within the game..
Those of you who are fine with blizzard or any subscription based MMORPG company charging people real life money
for in game items they created really need to stop and think about what your doing.. I guarantee if no one purchased the steed, Blizzard would have eventually seen this "idea" as a mistake that could possibly hurt their reputation and perhaps in time that same item would have changed and became a possible in game quest reward or a epic boss mob drop...
But no, those who spent their real life money to acquire this super neato god steed are only adding fuel to blizzard and other mmo game companies greed and this could possibly happen with new upcoming mmo's in the future..
A company who charges real life money for in game items they created should be charged and prosecuted as if they were drug dealers... Seriously..
Rallithon Oakthornn (Retired Heirophant of the 60th season)
Its sad to see that many people think its ok, to charge/spend real money for items in a subscription based mmo. I always liked sub based mmo games, because there was a level playing field and you actually had to play the game (and be good at it) to get the cool stuff. Back in vanilla wow, it actually meant something when you saw someone clad in epic armor riding a special mount.
Since vanilla wow, the whole game has been dumbed down and made easier for the benefit of the casual gamer. Gamers who don't want to immerse themselves into the game and put in "work", but still have the rewards that you get for achieving the hardest things in the game. I've seen how some people call farming for an item in a game "work". If you really think its boring, takes too much time out of your busy schedule to get a certain item, or learning to defeat a certain encounter... you're clearly looking in the wrong section of games. MMO games are about persistent worlds, developing your character, enjoying a long journey with lots of adventure and fun along the way. They shouldn't be about instant gratification, with or without real money.
I sincerely hope this will turn alot of people away from cataclysm, this way the new games that are in the pipes can hit it off good.
Blizzard has brought a whole new meaning to the word Scam. You people are quite foolish to keep allowing them to take advantage of you like this. But i guess if your happy then who am i to care.
I'd hardly term it a scam, since both sides of the transaction are happy with it. Nor do I see them taking advantage of anyone. No one is forced to purchase anything from the item shop. I totally agree with your last.
"Make them pay"?? How in the world did you arrive at that wild eyed fallacy? NO ONE is being made/forced to pay for anything from the item shop. Yes, WoW makes Blizzard around a billion dollars a year(Asians have a pay model than the west does), simply by providing their subscribers(customers) with the service that they remain subscribed to. Isn't capitalism wonderful? ^^
As for your last... Thats the typical knee jerk reaction of the thoughtless. Getting our Dear Leaders involved in just about anything is a certain path to totally messing it up. Thanks, but we don't need any more of that around here.
[Mod Edit]
Anyway, regarding my post,,, please forgive me for the bad choice of words... By saying, "making them pay" I didn't mean blizzard literally held a gun everyones head threatening to commit bloody massacre's if their subscribers didn't purchase a ridiculous care bear celestial steed..... Obvously no one can make you buy something the person doesn't want..,,,,,
What I meant to say is, people addicted to WoW would feel the need to purchase that lovely steed simply because it's new, fun, and the only way one could get one is by coughing up 25 dollars.... So in a way, blizzard "KNOWS" and understands the game is an addiction and they are purposely creating these items to sell for "real life money buy me now" money because they know people are addicted enough and mindless enough to purchase the items...
No matter what you or anyone else says, it's wrong and unethical. I'll repeat what I stated earlier.. All virtual reality game items should be available in game and require either questing or raiding to acquire all the items... Our billed monthly subscription should include every item being obtainable within the game..
Those of you who are fine with blizzard or any subscription based MMORPG company charging people real life money
for in game items they created really need to stop and think about what your doing.. I guarantee if no one purchased the steed, Blizzard would have eventually seen this "idea" as a mistake that could possibly hurt their reputation and perhaps in time that same item would have changed and became a possible in game quest reward or a epic boss mob drop...
But no, those who spent their real life money to acquire this super neato god steed are only adding fuel to blizzard and other mmo game companies greed and this could possibly happen with new upcoming mmo's in the future..
A company who charges real life money for in game items they created should be charged and prosecuted as if they were drug dealers... Seriously..
Sigh... Blizzard is simply providing a service. No one is forced to play WoW or to purchase anything from the item shop. The idea that people who play WoW are mindless addicts, at the mercy of the e-vile overlords at Blizzard, may be a comforting delusion for some, but it remains a delusion none the less. Simply because people make choices that you do not agree with in these terms, doesn't make those choices wrong. They remain simply choices that you disagree with. Blizzard selling items that they create out of thin air to its willing customers, is no worse than the fiat currency that the federal reserve creates out of thin air... In fact, the item shop does much less damage. ^^
Its sad to see that many people think its ok, to charge/spend real money for items in a subscription based mmo. I always liked sub based mmo games, because there was a level playing field and you actually had to play the game (and be good at it) to get the cool stuff. Back in vanilla wow, it actually meant something when you saw someone clad in epic armor riding a special mount.
Since vanilla wow, the whole game has been dumbed down and made easier for the benefit of the casual gamer. Gamers who don't want to immerse themselves into the game and put in "work", but still have the rewards that you get for achieving the hardest things in the game. I've seen how some people call farming for an item in a game "work". If you really think its boring, takes too much time out of your busy schedule to get a certain item, or learning to defeat a certain encounter... you're clearly looking in the wrong section of games. MMO games are about persistent worlds, developing your character, enjoying a long journey with lots of adventure and fun along the way. They shouldn't be about instant gratification, with or without real money.
I sincerely hope this will turn alot of people away from cataclysm, this way the new games that are in the pipes can hit it off good.
Gogo SWTOR & JGE!
I hate to point this out, but there are a LOT more casuals(with money) than there are raider types. Its only to be expected that once Blizzard looked at the demographics(they are obsessive about the data they collect) that they would adjust the game content to reach a larger section of their player base. The results(retention of millions and millions of players for more than 5 years) demonstrates that they correctly understood the changes they made.
I'm always amused by those who rant and rave about games not being "challenging" any more. Perhaps thats because the audience for "challenging" games has seriously declined over the last 10 plus years? I know I'm FAR from alone in not wanting anything to do with a game with corpse runs, gear and exp loss in their death penalty. Games are supposed to be a FUN pass time, not an exercise in seeing how sadistic the Dev's can get.
As for the new games, I suspect they will fare no better than the last crop of "WoW killers". The only threat at this point to WoW is Blizzard itself. It will be interesting to see if they can duplicate WoW's success in their next MMO. If they can, they are going to be around for a long, long time.
PEOPLE NEED TO STOP BUYING E-PETS AND SPEND MONEY AT REAL STORES TO SUPPORT REAL JOBS... AHHH!!!
People need to stop trying to make other peoples choices for them. Blizzard employs quite a number of people who have real jobs as a consequence.
People need to be wiser during times like this.
Instead of fattening Blizzard's wallet any further, this was a chance to show them that this is not the direction we want our western P2P MMORPGs to go.
It amazes me that you do not foresee the future repercussions that this latest move by Blizzard is going to cause.
Take your head out of the sand for a second and stop blindly defending your MMO so that you can see what's actually going on here.
This particular purchasable may not have bothered you, but what happens when one comes along that does? Better to fix the tiny leak in the dam now before the whole thing comes down, no?
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
People need to stop trying to make other peoples choices for them.
Yeah, this.
People can spend all day whining and moaning about other players buying this fluff steed, or dropping cash in Farmville, or buying characters on SOE's cash service, but in the end, those are personal choices made by others for their own reasons. You may not like it, and you may not agree with those choices, but honestly? Tough shit. It's not your choice to make for someone else.
Right now, I'm not playing any MMO. I took a step back from gaming to concentrate on finishing my degree, which happened back in December. These days, I'm trying to get into grad school, and I have other RL things going on. That said, if someone wants to drop $25 on this item, or spend $50 on Farmville cash, or buy a high-level, epic raid geared EQ or EQ2 toon so they can play with their friends and not have to grind out the lower levels by themselves, who cares? Their money, their life. The developers of these games offer a service, and some folks choose to take it.
No one is being forced to buy this steed by Blizzard, the same way no one forces you to buy anything else in a cash shop game. Buy it or don't, and accept that others will make a different decision than you.
Better to fix the tiny leak in the dam now before the whole thing comes down, no?
That genie has long since been released from the bottle. It's way, way too late to turn back now.
Either accept it, or don't, but this IS the way that games are going to go, especially from the larger developers. That ship sailed a long time ago, and they're not going to stop or change their minds.
PEOPLE NEED TO STOP BUYING E-PETS AND SPEND MONEY AT REAL STORES TO SUPPORT REAL JOBS... AHHH!!!
People need to stop trying to make other peoples choices for them. Blizzard employs quite a number of people who have real jobs as a consequence.
People need to be wiser during times like this.
Instead of fattening Blizzard's wallet any further, this was a chance to show them that this is not the direction we want our western P2P MMORPGs to go.
It amazes me that you do not foresee the future repercussions that this latest move by Blizzard is going to cause.
Take your head out of the sand for a second and stop blindly defending your MMO so that you can see what's actually going on here.
This particular purchasable may not have bothered you, but what happens when one comes along that does? Better to fix the tiny leak in the dam now before the whole thing comes down, no?
You presume to speak for the entire western gaming population? You speak for no one but yourself, as do I. I have no problem what so ever supporting games that I enjoy. Be they P2P or F2P, all that matters to me is that they are enjoyable. I'm always amazed and amused by those who proclaim that the the Time of Darkness(item shops...) approaches and that this spells the Doom of gaming... ^^
I totally understand the consequences of this action on Blizzards part. Its success means they will have more money to develop future games, and will also add more items. I personally have't purchased any of the item shop toys, because I have several good mounts that I'm quite happy with, and see no point in non combat pets. But thats *my* choice. Others obviously think differently. The suits at Blizzard are hardly going to kill the goose that lays their golden eggs. Given the absolute hysteria that resulted in the addition of two trival items, I seriously doubt they are going to take it any further, any time soon.
Its sad to see that many people think its ok, to charge/spend real money for items in a subscription based mmo. I always liked sub based mmo games, because there was a level playing field and you actually had to play the game (and be good at it) to get the cool stuff. Back in vanilla wow, it actually meant something when you saw someone clad in epic armor riding a special mount.
Since vanilla wow, the whole game has been dumbed down and made easier for the benefit of the casual gamer. Gamers who don't want to immerse themselves into the game and put in "work", but still have the rewards that you get for achieving the hardest things in the game. I've seen how some people call farming for an item in a game "work". If you really think its boring, takes too much time out of your busy schedule to get a certain item, or learning to defeat a certain encounter... you're clearly looking in the wrong section of games. MMO games are about persistent worlds, developing your character, enjoying a long journey with lots of adventure and fun along the way. They shouldn't be about instant gratification, with or without real money.
I sincerely hope this will turn alot of people away from cataclysm, this way the new games that are in the pipes can hit it off good.
Gogo SWTOR & JGE!
I hate to point this out, but there are a LOT more casuals(with money) than there are raider types. Its only to be expected that once Blizzard looked at the demographics(they are obsessive about the data they collect) that they would adjust the game content to reach a larger section of their player base. The results(retention of millions and millions of players for more than 5 years) demonstrates that they correctly understood the changes they made.
I'm always amused by those who rant and rave about games not being "challenging" any more. Perhaps thats because the audience for "challenging" games has seriously declined over the last 10 plus years? I know I'm FAR from alone in not wanting anything to do with a game with corpse runs, gear and exp loss in their death penalty. Games are supposed to be a FUN pass time, not an exercise in seeing how sadistic the Dev's can get.
As for the new games, I suspect they will fare no better than the last crop of "WoW killers". The only threat at this point to WoW is Blizzard itself. It will be interesting to see if they can duplicate WoW's success in their next MMO. If they can, they are going to be around for a long, long time.
These new games don't have to be wowkillers, just have a nice healthy community to support the game, and no item shops with real money.
Moving 80,000 units in 4 hours isn't impressive? Sheesh. The 10 million subs they have are not in North America, but combined from around the globe. Getting 80,000 people in North America to participate in microtransactions on a single item (which is entirely fluff and has absolutely no gameplay functionality) at a high cost is impressive in of itself, getting that amount of people to do so within four hours is even more impressive.
That's just my opinion, though.
And just to think 20 bucks could a got people a expansion pack with a flying mount....Now people are going to get bent over..Some people never learn...
Some people rob you at gun point..Others will rob you at "Ball Point Pen"
"Make them pay"?? How in the world did you arrive at that wild eyed fallacy? NO ONE is being made/forced to pay for anything from the item shop. Yes, WoW makes Blizzard around a billion dollars a year(Asians have a pay model than the west does), simply by providing their subscribers(customers) with the service that they remain subscribed to. Isn't capitalism wonderful? ^^
As for your last... Thats the typical knee jerk reaction of the thoughtless. Getting our Dear Leaders involved in just about anything is a certain path to totally messing it up. Thanks, but we don't need any more of that around here.
[Mod Edit]
Anyway, regarding my post,,, please forgive me for the bad choice of words... By saying, "making them pay" I didn't mean blizzard literally held a gun everyones head threatening to commit bloody massacre's if their subscribers didn't purchase a ridiculous care bear celestial steed..... Obvously no one can make you buy something the person doesn't want..,,,,,
What I meant to say is, people addicted to WoW would feel the need to purchase that lovely steed simply because it's new, fun, and the only way one could get one is by coughing up 25 dollars.... So in a way, blizzard "KNOWS" and understands the game is an addiction and they are purposely creating these items to sell for "real life money buy me now" money because they know people are addicted enough and mindless enough to purchase the items...
No matter what you or anyone else says, it's wrong and unethical. I'll repeat what I stated earlier.. All virtual reality game items should be available in game and require either questing or raiding to acquire all the items... Our billed monthly subscription should include every item being obtainable within the game..
Those of you who are fine with blizzard or any subscription based MMORPG company charging people real life money
for in game items they created really need to stop and think about what your doing.. I guarantee if no one purchased the steed, Blizzard would have eventually seen this "idea" as a mistake that could possibly hurt their reputation and perhaps in time that same item would have changed and became a possible in game quest reward or a epic boss mob drop...
But no, those who spent their real life money to acquire this super neato god steed are only adding fuel to blizzard and other mmo game companies greed and this could possibly happen with new upcoming mmo's in the future..
A company who charges real life money for in game items they created should be charged and prosecuted as if they were drug dealers... Seriously..
Sigh... Blizzard is simply providing a service. No one is forced to play WoW or to purchase anything from the item shop. The idea that people who play WoW are mindless addicts, at the mercy of the e-vile overlords at Blizzard, may be a comforting delusion for some, but it remains a delusion none the less. Simply because people make choices that you do not agree with in these terms, doesn't make those choices wrong. They remain simply choices that you disagree with. Blizzard selling items that they create out of thin air to its willing customers, is no worse than the fiat currency that the federal reserve creates out of thin air... In fact, the item shop does much less damage. ^^
You are really strongly in support of Blizzard squeezing more money from what you would have normally gotten with your sub fee. I know corporations love customers like you. As customers we are in control of how much we pay for services/products. When Blizzard started placing items in a shop to buy instead of putting them in the game for your sub fee, if the majority with have cancelled their account just for one month .. you would have seen that trend stop immediately. That shiny pricy horse then would have been placed in the game and the company would test other price gouging methods in the future.
They test the waters to see what they can get away with and I can't believe how many people wasted money on a digital horse. Congrulations you are speaking with your wallets "we want less for our money!". This isn't a casual versus hardcore argument. This hurts both parties. You speak with your money. If items are too hard to obtain via in games mean, quit the game and tell them why .. they would then start making items easier to obtain.
If you enjoy swiping your credit card for items by all means keeping shelling out the cash for what you would have gotten in the game in the past for your 15/month. Because this is what you are telling them. I will gaurantee you are about to see much more in the item shop soon that would have been in game. I voted already on how I felt about the item shop when it was introduced. I quit the game. Sometimes you have to do something out of principle.
Bottom Line ... you are not forced to play this or any other game.
Real bottom line is that even if you dp play no one is forcing you to buy fluff items with real money. I don't play anymore but of the people I know who do still play, not one has purchased anything outside the game ever. But that may have more to do with my agegroup (people have mortgages and kids, etc).
Moving 80,000 units in 4 hours isn't impressive? Sheesh. The 10 million subs they have are not in North America, but combined from around the globe. Getting 80,000 people in North America to participate in microtransactions on a single item (which is entirely fluff and has absolutely no gameplay functionality) at a high cost is impressive in of itself, getting that amount of people to do so within four hours is even more impressive.
That's just my opinion, though.
Add in a recession, hard working people scraping and diming to get by and this sounds even more impressive. 4hrs after notify for this amount is fast if you think about it to cause it would require everyone to be notified at once even if they were working, so how many of all their subs actually knew or had chance to buy on the first 4hrs. I bet if everyone knew and had chance to buy that day it would be a world record or something in sales in 4hrs time.
Consider people who can only afford to pay monthly to who could of bought it if they had better circumstances.
And when the item shops dominate all the MMOs what then ? Force us to quit?I think its time to either A. Raise sub prices and include all content and items and accquiring them in game thru normal means or B. All P2P that want to double dip and squueze every penny like a greedy old miser and become F2P. There is no real reason why not sub prices can't be raised and provide the means to support these titles.
And while I'm thinking about it when did everyone become a business and economic expert on these forums ? I remember a few years ago before WOW was a wet spot in Blizzard's pants that on game forums and older MMOs we talk about the game we loved and games and ideas on improving them and just discussing non important stuff now everyone is a business expert on their views that they think is how the industry works, I can never take these people seriously nor never will especially when they can't take open criticism and actually take in account the consequences that these steps towards cash shops in all MMOs regardless if they are P2P or F2P all I've been hearing so far is YAY Blizzard!!! Take my money !! Look at other MMOs out there that are P2P and have cash shops or TCG (gambling schemes) everyone started out with just fluff, just like you are all defending Blizzard are now, now these games went past the cosmetic and started offering XP Potions, Buffs, Crafting Schematics, Armor, and Weapons, they always say it will be just vanity items and they always lie so if it is their job to make money now and not create a quality game let them keep doing and let the suckers.. I mean players keep throwing money at it.
For the people that disagree and hate the idea people are buying these pixels and takes away from you obtaining it in game by just throwing money at it you know who they are when they pull the mount out and ride it around if it affects you so much blacklist people from PUGs and guilds, usually people that buy their way thru the game dont get a lot of sympathy, example if you know x player hacks, buys gold , or pays to powerlevel these people are shunned and excluded and are ignored by legit players this is no different. There are ways to deter this type of behavior use those measures.
Its pretty much over for this genre if this continues we went from worlds , excitement and adventure to console type online games with blatant cash grab exploits same thing with mainstream gaming, its a a scam plain and simple, think about it.
John Smedley started this subscription + item shop faggotry a few years back, a few of us pointed out where it was all going but most weren't interested in listening. It's called greed and is the nature of every human being, if they think they can get away with it then they'll do it 100%. When you can make millions in an hour or two on a crappy fluff mount imagine what you'll be making every day on XP potions and buffs! Do you think any one of these greedy SoBs is going to pass that up? Any game that has a subscription fee and item shop will just go the same way, the suits have seen how much the gold sellers make and want a slice of the action. SOE did it and CCP did it and now they're all trying to get their piece of the action, in the meantime the industry suffers from this plague of greed driven mass marketing suit bots trying to see how much they can squeeze from the subscriber.
It's not like Blizzard need the cash to pay the rent or anything, everyone who plays is paying a subscription (unless you play from China!). Their sub is paying developers to make content so why shouldn't they have access to it in game? Why must they pay extra even for "fluff" content they've already paid their subscription for? The answer is that common sense and common decency tells us they shouldn't but some greedy suits that want to buy that Porsche for his mistress in Las Vegas do!
Any game with sub + item shop I drop like a bad habit, this year is the year of the indipendent developer and hopefully it'll do something towards smashing this cycle of greed that is destroying what was once a great genre in gaming. Over the last few years it's been turned into nothing more than a cess pool of greedy upper management bottom feeders trying to rape gamer's bank accounts ... FACT!
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience"
Cool. That's a little over half of what people would pay for an entire full expansion to an MMO so... does the Horse come with new zones of content, new instances for pve, new craft content, etc?
No? It doesn't?
Lol. Whatever. My interest in Blizz's brand new MMO went -------------- that way ------------>
If more MMO's continue with this trend, I'll pick the ones that don't. Or get back into single player RPG's for an amount of time until some sanity returns.
Written elsewhere in this thread...
" It's a VERY bad sign for the MMO genre. Devs will be looking at those sales and realizing making dungeons and writing lore and fixing bugs doesn't pay as well. "
Cool. That's a little over half of what people would pay for an entire full expansion to an MMO so... does the Horse come with new zones of content, new instances for pve, new craft content, etc?
No? It doesn't?
Lol. Whatever. My interest in Blizz's brand new MMO went -------------- that way ------------>
If more MMO's continue with this trend, I'll pick the ones that don't. Or get back into single player RPG's for an amount of time until some sanity returns.
25 bucks for a single item....
Awesome is it necessary to have to enjoy the full experience of the game
What? It's not, oh no its the end of the world because they released an optional item I'll never have to buy.
QQ.....seriously
you don't have to buy it to feel like you have an advantage over the players, it doesn't impact the gameplay or cause a new revolution so its not a huge deal if they release items like this. Although I bought one just for the hell of it because I could and I wanted to. Do I regret buying it? Not really since it covers my mounts the rest of WoW'ing but its not going to cause a huge uproar and make it pay to minor cash shop to win.
Cool. That's a little over half of what people would pay for an entire full expansion to an MMO so... does the Horse come with new zones of content, new instances for pve, new craft content, etc?
No? It doesn't?
Lol. Whatever. My interest in Blizz's brand new MMO went -------------- that way ------------>
If more MMO's continue with this trend, I'll pick the ones that don't. Or get back into single player RPG's for an amount of time until some sanity returns.
Written elsewhere in this thread...
" It's a VERY bad sign for the MMO genre. Devs will be looking at those sales and realizing making dungeons and writing lore and fixing bugs doesn't pay as well. "
My sentiments exactly Tedly224, I'll wait for some new games to appear without cash shops. In the meanwhile, I'm playing on Neverwinter nights 2 persistent world servers. At least these servers are filled with people who want to play a game, not buy their way through it.
Comments
Blizzard has brought a whole new meaning to the word Scam. You people are quite foolish to keep allowing them to take advantage of you like this. But i guess if your happy then who am i to care.
Well, I wasn't talking about Facebook 'games'. Most of which are hardly games at all.
There are MANY flash games out there - fine ones like GemCraft, for example. Steam Birds. Imagicle is VERY creative and different. Roly-poly Cannon.
Armor Games is a very good hub for flash games. There is also BubbleBox.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
[Mod Edit]
Anyway, regarding my post,,, please forgive me for the bad choice of words... By saying, "making them pay" I didn't mean blizzard literally held a gun everyones head threatening to commit bloody massacre's if their subscribers didn't purchase a ridiculous care bear celestial steed..... Obvously no one can make you buy something the person doesn't want..,,,,,
What I meant to say is, people addicted to WoW would feel the need to purchase that lovely steed simply because it's new, fun, and the only way one could get one is by coughing up 25 dollars.... So in a way, blizzard "KNOWS" and understands the game is an addiction and they are purposely creating these items to sell for "real life money buy me now" money because they know people are addicted enough and mindless enough to purchase the items...
No matter what you or anyone else says, it's wrong and unethical. I'll repeat what I stated earlier.. All virtual reality game items should be available in game and require either questing or raiding to acquire all the items... Our billed monthly subscription should include every item being obtainable within the game..
Those of you who are fine with blizzard or any subscription based MMORPG company charging people real life money
for in game items they created really need to stop and think about what your doing.. I guarantee if no one purchased the steed, Blizzard would have eventually seen this "idea" as a mistake that could possibly hurt their reputation and perhaps in time that same item would have changed and became a possible in game quest reward or a epic boss mob drop...
But no, those who spent their real life money to acquire this super neato god steed are only adding fuel to blizzard and other mmo game companies greed and this could possibly happen with new upcoming mmo's in the future..
A company who charges real life money for in game items they created should be charged and prosecuted as if they were drug dealers... Seriously..
Rallithon Oakthornn
(Retired Heirophant of the 60th season)
Its sad to see that many people think its ok, to charge/spend real money for items in a subscription based mmo. I always liked sub based mmo games, because there was a level playing field and you actually had to play the game (and be good at it) to get the cool stuff. Back in vanilla wow, it actually meant something when you saw someone clad in epic armor riding a special mount.
Since vanilla wow, the whole game has been dumbed down and made easier for the benefit of the casual gamer. Gamers who don't want to immerse themselves into the game and put in "work", but still have the rewards that you get for achieving the hardest things in the game. I've seen how some people call farming for an item in a game "work". If you really think its boring, takes too much time out of your busy schedule to get a certain item, or learning to defeat a certain encounter... you're clearly looking in the wrong section of games. MMO games are about persistent worlds, developing your character, enjoying a long journey with lots of adventure and fun along the way. They shouldn't be about instant gratification, with or without real money.
I sincerely hope this will turn alot of people away from cataclysm, this way the new games that are in the pipes can hit it off good.
Gogo SWTOR & JGE!
I'd hardly term it a scam, since both sides of the transaction are happy with it. Nor do I see them taking advantage of anyone. No one is forced to purchase anything from the item shop. I totally agree with your last.
Sigh... Blizzard is simply providing a service. No one is forced to play WoW or to purchase anything from the item shop. The idea that people who play WoW are mindless addicts, at the mercy of the e-vile overlords at Blizzard, may be a comforting delusion for some, but it remains a delusion none the less. Simply because people make choices that you do not agree with in these terms, doesn't make those choices wrong. They remain simply choices that you disagree with. Blizzard selling items that they create out of thin air to its willing customers, is no worse than the fiat currency that the federal reserve creates out of thin air... In fact, the item shop does much less damage. ^^
PEOPLE NEED TO STOP BUYING E-PETS AND SPEND MONEY AT REAL STORES TO SUPPORT REAL JOBS... AHHH!!!
Snoop
I hate to point this out, but there are a LOT more casuals(with money) than there are raider types. Its only to be expected that once Blizzard looked at the demographics(they are obsessive about the data they collect) that they would adjust the game content to reach a larger section of their player base. The results(retention of millions and millions of players for more than 5 years) demonstrates that they correctly understood the changes they made.
I'm always amused by those who rant and rave about games not being "challenging" any more. Perhaps thats because the audience for "challenging" games has seriously declined over the last 10 plus years? I know I'm FAR from alone in not wanting anything to do with a game with corpse runs, gear and exp loss in their death penalty. Games are supposed to be a FUN pass time, not an exercise in seeing how sadistic the Dev's can get.
As for the new games, I suspect they will fare no better than the last crop of "WoW killers". The only threat at this point to WoW is Blizzard itself. It will be interesting to see if they can duplicate WoW's success in their next MMO. If they can, they are going to be around for a long, long time.
People need to stop trying to make other peoples choices for them. Blizzard employs quite a number of people who have real jobs as a consequence.
People need to be wiser during times like this.
Instead of fattening Blizzard's wallet any further, this was a chance to show them that this is not the direction we want our western P2P MMORPGs to go.
It amazes me that you do not foresee the future repercussions that this latest move by Blizzard is going to cause.
Take your head out of the sand for a second and stop blindly defending your MMO so that you can see what's actually going on here.
This particular purchasable may not have bothered you, but what happens when one comes along that does? Better to fix the tiny leak in the dam now before the whole thing comes down, no?
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Yeah, this.
People can spend all day whining and moaning about other players buying this fluff steed, or dropping cash in Farmville, or buying characters on SOE's cash service, but in the end, those are personal choices made by others for their own reasons. You may not like it, and you may not agree with those choices, but honestly? Tough shit. It's not your choice to make for someone else.
Right now, I'm not playing any MMO. I took a step back from gaming to concentrate on finishing my degree, which happened back in December. These days, I'm trying to get into grad school, and I have other RL things going on. That said, if someone wants to drop $25 on this item, or spend $50 on Farmville cash, or buy a high-level, epic raid geared EQ or EQ2 toon so they can play with their friends and not have to grind out the lower levels by themselves, who cares? Their money, their life. The developers of these games offer a service, and some folks choose to take it.
No one is being forced to buy this steed by Blizzard, the same way no one forces you to buy anything else in a cash shop game. Buy it or don't, and accept that others will make a different decision than you.
That genie has long since been released from the bottle. It's way, way too late to turn back now.
Either accept it, or don't, but this IS the way that games are going to go, especially from the larger developers. That ship sailed a long time ago, and they're not going to stop or change their minds.
You presume to speak for the entire western gaming population? You speak for no one but yourself, as do I. I have no problem what so ever supporting games that I enjoy. Be they P2P or F2P, all that matters to me is that they are enjoyable. I'm always amazed and amused by those who proclaim that the the Time of Darkness(item shops...) approaches and that this spells the Doom of gaming... ^^
I totally understand the consequences of this action on Blizzards part. Its success means they will have more money to develop future games, and will also add more items. I personally have't purchased any of the item shop toys, because I have several good mounts that I'm quite happy with, and see no point in non combat pets. But thats *my* choice. Others obviously think differently. The suits at Blizzard are hardly going to kill the goose that lays their golden eggs. Given the absolute hysteria that resulted in the addition of two trival items, I seriously doubt they are going to take it any further, any time soon.
These new games don't have to be wowkillers, just have a nice healthy community to support the game, and no item shops with real money.
And just to think 20 bucks could a got people a expansion pack with a flying mount....Now people are going to get bent over..Some people never learn...
Some people rob you at gun point..Others will rob you at "Ball Point Pen"
You are really strongly in support of Blizzard squeezing more money from what you would have normally gotten with your sub fee. I know corporations love customers like you. As customers we are in control of how much we pay for services/products. When Blizzard started placing items in a shop to buy instead of putting them in the game for your sub fee, if the majority with have cancelled their account just for one month .. you would have seen that trend stop immediately. That shiny pricy horse then would have been placed in the game and the company would test other price gouging methods in the future.
They test the waters to see what they can get away with and I can't believe how many people wasted money on a digital horse. Congrulations you are speaking with your wallets "we want less for our money!". This isn't a casual versus hardcore argument. This hurts both parties. You speak with your money. If items are too hard to obtain via in games mean, quit the game and tell them why .. they would then start making items easier to obtain.
If you enjoy swiping your credit card for items by all means keeping shelling out the cash for what you would have gotten in the game in the past for your 15/month. Because this is what you are telling them. I will gaurantee you are about to see much more in the item shop soon that would have been in game. I voted already on how I felt about the item shop when it was introduced. I quit the game. Sometimes you have to do something out of principle.
Bottom Line ... you are not forced to play this or any other game.
Real bottom line is that even if you dp play no one is forcing you to buy fluff items with real money. I don't play anymore but of the people I know who do still play, not one has purchased anything outside the game ever. But that may have more to do with my agegroup (people have mortgages and kids, etc).
Add in a recession, hard working people scraping and diming to get by and this sounds even more impressive. 4hrs after notify for this amount is fast if you think about it to cause it would require everyone to be notified at once even if they were working, so how many of all their subs actually knew or had chance to buy on the first 4hrs. I bet if everyone knew and had chance to buy that day it would be a world record or something in sales in 4hrs time.
Consider people who can only afford to pay monthly to who could of bought it if they had better circumstances.
And when the item shops dominate all the MMOs what then ? Force us to quit?I think its time to either A. Raise sub prices and include all content and items and accquiring them in game thru normal means or B. All P2P that want to double dip and squueze every penny like a greedy old miser and become F2P. There is no real reason why not sub prices can't be raised and provide the means to support these titles.
And while I'm thinking about it when did everyone become a business and economic expert on these forums ? I remember a few years ago before WOW was a wet spot in Blizzard's pants that on game forums and older MMOs we talk about the game we loved and games and ideas on improving them and just discussing non important stuff now everyone is a business expert on their views that they think is how the industry works, I can never take these people seriously nor never will especially when they can't take open criticism and actually take in account the consequences that these steps towards cash shops in all MMOs regardless if they are P2P or F2P all I've been hearing so far is YAY Blizzard!!! Take my money !! Look at other MMOs out there that are P2P and have cash shops or TCG (gambling schemes) everyone started out with just fluff, just like you are all defending Blizzard are now, now these games went past the cosmetic and started offering XP Potions, Buffs, Crafting Schematics, Armor, and Weapons, they always say it will be just vanity items and they always lie so if it is their job to make money now and not create a quality game let them keep doing and let the suckers.. I mean players keep throwing money at it.
For the people that disagree and hate the idea people are buying these pixels and takes away from you obtaining it in game by just throwing money at it you know who they are when they pull the mount out and ride it around if it affects you so much blacklist people from PUGs and guilds, usually people that buy their way thru the game dont get a lot of sympathy, example if you know x player hacks, buys gold , or pays to powerlevel these people are shunned and excluded and are ignored by legit players this is no different. There are ways to deter this type of behavior use those measures.
Its pretty much over for this genre if this continues we went from worlds , excitement and adventure to console type online games with blatant cash grab exploits same thing with mainstream gaming, its a a scam plain and simple, think about it.
John Smedley started this subscription + item shop faggotry a few years back, a few of us pointed out where it was all going but most weren't interested in listening. It's called greed and is the nature of every human being, if they think they can get away with it then they'll do it 100%. When you can make millions in an hour or two on a crappy fluff mount imagine what you'll be making every day on XP potions and buffs! Do you think any one of these greedy SoBs is going to pass that up? Any game that has a subscription fee and item shop will just go the same way, the suits have seen how much the gold sellers make and want a slice of the action. SOE did it and CCP did it and now they're all trying to get their piece of the action, in the meantime the industry suffers from this plague of greed driven mass marketing suit bots trying to see how much they can squeeze from the subscriber.
It's not like Blizzard need the cash to pay the rent or anything, everyone who plays is paying a subscription (unless you play from China!). Their sub is paying developers to make content so why shouldn't they have access to it in game? Why must they pay extra even for "fluff" content they've already paid their subscription for? The answer is that common sense and common decency tells us they shouldn't but some greedy suits that want to buy that Porsche for his mistress in Las Vegas do!
Any game with sub + item shop I drop like a bad habit, this year is the year of the indipendent developer and hopefully it'll do something towards smashing this cycle of greed that is destroying what was once a great genre in gaming. Over the last few years it's been turned into nothing more than a cess pool of greedy upper management bottom feeders trying to rape gamer's bank accounts ... FACT!
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience"
CS Lewis
25 bucks for a single item in an MMO.
Cool. That's a little over half of what people would pay for an entire full expansion to an MMO so... does the Horse come with new zones of content, new instances for pve, new craft content, etc?
No? It doesn't?
Lol. Whatever. My interest in Blizz's brand new MMO went -------------- that way ------------>
If more MMO's continue with this trend, I'll pick the ones that don't. Or get back into single player RPG's for an amount of time until some sanity returns.
Written elsewhere in this thread...
" It's a VERY bad sign for the MMO genre. Devs will be looking at those sales and realizing making dungeons and writing lore and fixing bugs doesn't pay as well. "
25 bucks for a single item....
Awesome is it necessary to have to enjoy the full experience of the game
What? It's not, oh no its the end of the world because they released an optional item I'll never have to buy.
QQ.....seriously
you don't have to buy it to feel like you have an advantage over the players, it doesn't impact the gameplay or cause a new revolution so its not a huge deal if they release items like this. Although I bought one just for the hell of it because I could and I wanted to. Do I regret buying it? Not really since it covers my mounts the rest of WoW'ing but its not going to cause a huge uproar and make it pay to minor cash shop to win.
My sentiments exactly Tedly224, I'll wait for some new games to appear without cash shops. In the meanwhile, I'm playing on Neverwinter nights 2 persistent world servers. At least these servers are filled with people who want to play a game, not buy their way through it.
I bet sometime next year Blizzard will offer max level toon for $40. Hell it might happen sooner than next year.