The same reason why some speak for a game when we have no idea what the game will actually play like. It's extremely difficult to have a true neutral position on a game before release. You're either buying the hype, exciting by what you are imaginging, doubting the hype, skeptical that a dozen good ideas will actually show up in the game, and etc., etc.
Exactly.
"What's sauce for the goose is good for the other." Well, something like that.
Most negative posts I have seen have given a reason for the concern. Most positive posts have been along the line of 'I have faith in [insert company name here]".
Very true. Albiet sadly, as I'm an optimist for this game, I have to be. Bioware games are the only ones I haven't thought hmm, this could've been better. Normally because I get sucked into a story and if theres 'any' comments I'd have against the gameplay, I forget. Could be a bad thing, but turns out the gameplay aint too bad either.
I honestly like what I see. I was concerned how they'd still deliver on the story, and yes I know most of you are sick of hearing about story all the time, but it was my main concern. Otherwise it's just another MMO, but for me, this could be my favourite MMO, time will tell, but for now, it's headed on a straight course to my rig at home.
Also helps I prefer this era of star wars over all else. Including the movies.
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
They did well in choosing the setting yes, it leaves them a lot of freedom to fill it up in their own way, with a dynamic timeperiod. From what I've seen it could become more epic than the universe at the time of the movies.
The graphics, I wasn't that enthusiastic about it. I'd preferred a more Mass Effect 2-style of graphics, but I understand that would be a hard thing to do for a MMO.
My biggest concern is that they'll take over too much elements of WoW, in order to appeal to as large an audience as possible. The graphics already seemed to go that way. Other companies made that mistake too, trying to copy things from WoW, and it didn't go well with those: in fact, I think it only contributed to a relatively stale last years when it comes to MMO's and innovation.
There are other ways to appeal to as large an audience as possible, I think games like GW2 are leading the way in that.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Cost over 150 million and the only thing that seems to be breaking ground is the voice acting for NPC's. I mean even the theme has been done before. Is it just a tragic waste of what could have been for that price tag or does this game actually have some substance beyond voice acting that would justify the cost?
Does anyone have any info to back up these claims of costs it is starting to look like a witch hunt on these forumns and I really don't understand why? Thses figures seem high , the theme is a fantastic IP and deserves for someone to have another go. SWG had too narrow an appeal.
So the IP deserves another chance!!!! yes ? And Bioware with it's track record in conjunction with L-Arts is a great combo.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
The same reason why some speak for a game when we have no idea what the game will actually play like. It's extremely difficult to have a true neutral position on a game before release. You're either buying the hype, exciting by what you are imaginging, doubting the hype, skeptical that a dozen good ideas will actually show up in the game, and etc., etc.
Exactly.
"What's sauce for the goose is good for the other." Well, something like that.
Most negative posts I have seen have given a reason for the concern. Most positive posts have been along the line of 'I have faith in [insert company name here]".
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
The same reason why some speak for a game when we have no idea what the game will actually play like. It's extremely difficult to have a true neutral position on a game before release. You're either buying the hype, exciting by what you are imaginging, doubting the hype, skeptical that a dozen good ideas will actually show up in the game, and etc., etc.
Exactly.
"What's sauce for the goose is good for the other." Well, something like that.
Most negative posts I have seen have given a reason for the concern. Most positive posts have been along the line of 'I have faith in [insert company name here]".
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
I think it is about expectations. GW games usually get leniency because its business model, the same way D&D(since it went f2p) and Runes of Magic doesn't get hammered that bad. Besides, the exposure of SWTOR has been more than GW2 more videos of actual gameplay has been released, so they are not in the same stage, at least in terms of hype. Moreover, SW IP brings more variety of things to the table that the classic sword and magic mmo, it is foreseeable to rise more opinions good and bad about the game.
I am not much of SW fan. I might have to get the game to play with my nephew but I don't get my expectations too high. I wish BW luck for the sake of SW fans and mmos in general.
Cost over 150 million and the only thing that seems to be breaking ground is the voice acting for NPC's. I mean even the theme has been done before. Is it just a tragic waste of what could have been for that price tag or does this game actually have some substance beyond voice acting that would justify the cost?
NIce opening line that may have had some substance to it and then you ask a basic question that infers you don't really have any idea of what they have and haven't included in the game. What is tragic is that you are posting on a SWTOR forumn and do not seem to be upto speed with where the game is at, I suggest you go read up on all the available content . Great stickies with links in this forumn. Read and ENjoy.
wow this thread has kept kicking.
The point of this thread was to learn if the game had more going for it than I was aware of. I was doing so by expressing that I felt the price tag given on this site seemed out of proprotion in regards to what the game would offer.. I don't need to know everything about the game in order to post on these sub forums. I don't need to dig up "all the available content". I read this thread and I enjoyed it now I suggest you stop trying to be a mod when you don't understand what are acceptable post and what aren't.
I'm actually pretty excited for the story element, personal interaction and all that jazz. Kind of like AOC, Man i loved that game, all the way to level 21....when tortage and the voice acting was over, i felt robbed and the game just seemed more of the same. Add in the abillity to actually change some outcomes for yourself? I'm pretty geeked for that.
The same reason why some speak for a game when we have no idea what the game will actually play like. It's extremely difficult to have a true neutral position on a game before release. You're either buying the hype, exciting by what you are imaginging, doubting the hype, skeptical that a dozen good ideas will actually show up in the game, and etc., etc.
Exactly.
"What's sauce for the goose is good for the other." Well, something like that.
Most negative posts I have seen have given a reason for the concern. Most positive posts have been along the line of 'I have faith in [insert company name here]".
Most negative posts I have seen have been along the lines of:
"This game has story so it is no MMORPG but a single player game."
"This game will be an instanced themepark."
"This game will suck because I think it will suck."
"This game will suck because it isn't SWG2, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Ultima Online, Everquest, FFXI,..."
"<insert doom prophet nr.1564867453>"
Most positive posts are busy reminding the negative posters on the information gathered on the game so far and that their points make no sense.
Be skeptical on what information is actually released, if you're just disputing for the sake of disputing, you're being a useless ass.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
GW2 only talked about dynamic events a little bit, about projectiles doing funny stuff and released hardly a couple of minutes worth of ingame footage.
GW2 does not have hordes of SWG mourners behind it.
Fully expect tons of haters to pop up when more information gets released on that game just the same.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
GW2 only talked about dynamic events a little bit, about projectiles doing funny stuff and released hardly a couple of minutes worth of ingame footage.
GW2 does not have hordes of SWG mourners behind it.
Fully expect tons of haters to pop up when more information gets released on that game just the same.
Think that's wishful thinking on your part, they have released quite a bit of information on the event system and the game as a whole. Yes more in game vids would be nice so i agree with you on that part.
There is a reason it's taken over swtor in the hype metre without it having the same fanatical hype as swtor, it's because people like what they are seeing and GW was a success which BioWare have yet to do in the mmorpg world, no matter how the fans like to gloss it over, this is BioWare first mmorpg even if they have people working it it from other mmorpg like War and SGW.
One failed in the end and the other was just a failure from the start.
Time will tell though but BioWare should understand that the mmorpg fanbase is unforgiving, you get no second chances, Vanguard and AOC showed that, both are okay games now but many are still unconvinced 3 years down the road.
GW does have 6 million copy sold, that's figures that BioWare and EA can only dream about.
At best I am watching this one in the wings, I refuse to let myself get sucked in to the hype and get let down. My only concerns are for those folks that walk in to this game with personal expectations and delusions of grandure. Yes I loved the original Trillogy. Yes, I have hopes that the game will not get evicerated by being squashed and forced in to a box that doesn't allow it to have it's own natural shape. But I can't expect great things until I see more about this game with the upcoming months. There is a mold for MMOs lately and it is real hard for most developers to stray too far away from it due to the money it can attrack. Something innovative is needed with this game, I just don't know if the force is with this one...
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
GW2 only talked about dynamic events a little bit, about projectiles doing funny stuff and released hardly a couple of minutes worth of ingame footage.
GW2 does not have hordes of SWG mourners behind it.
Fully expect tons of haters to pop up when more information gets released on that game just the same.
Think that's wishful thinking on your part, they have released quite a bit of information on the event system and the game as a whole. Yes more in game vids would be nice so i agree with you on that part.
There is a reason it's taken over swtor in the hype metre without it having the same fanatical hype as swtor, it's because people like what they are seeing and GW was a success which BioWare have yet to do in the mmorpg world, no matter how the fans like to gloss it over, this is BioWare first mmorpg even if they have people working it it from other mmorpg like War and SGW.
One failed in the end and the other was just a failure from the start.
Time will tell though but BioWare should understand that the mmorpg fanbase is unforgiving, you get no second chances, Vanguard and AOC showed that, both are okay games now but many are still unconvinced 3 years down the road.
GW does have 6 million copy sold, that's figures that BioWare and EA can only dream about.
GW1 that has no subscription and expansions you have to pay for to play? Thats like selling a single player game with DLC to 6 million people. BioWare doesn't need to dream about it, they've done it time and time again.
The reason GW2 took over SWTOR in the hype meter is because its been releasing information lately, nothing more. FFXIV will overtake GW2 when it gets closer to release. If you try and use the hype meter to determine the success of the game you'll realize quickly how your popular opinion falls flat. The hype meter means nothing on MMORPG.com.
They will both respectively have decent populations, the MMO world is big enough for both games, and then some. This theory that all MMORPGers need to stick to one game only and play it until it dies is ridiculous.
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
GW2 only talked about dynamic events a little bit, about projectiles doing funny stuff and released hardly a couple of minutes worth of ingame footage.
GW2 does not have hordes of SWG mourners behind it.
Fully expect tons of haters to pop up when more information gets released on that game just the same.
Doubt it GW2 already has more than it's fair share of haters, mostly people who assume it'll play like gw1 and a large amount of gw1 players skeptical bout the change in skill bar and likely skill system.
Despite this GW2 is just in a completely different boat to swtor. Swtor's players are hoping from something "awesome and different" and many players just don't feel swtor is doing anything of those things. People interested in gw2 are looking for something fresh and innovative. As long as A-net continues to mention and bring those things to the table then they can do no wrong. Considering the entire game is designed to pretty much play as different and be as innovating as possible people are less likely to dissapointed.
The problem with swtor is no one really knows what exactly what this game will actually do apart from it being "great". But opinions vary so wildly about what "great" is that the second Bioware releases something not to their liking all hell breaks loose. People need something to justify their hype and the story is just not doing it for them so they complain.
Sadly a large part of this is Biowares own fault. They've set expectation so high and made their focus so wide that everyone expects anything and everything in this game. They haven't told us any of their goals for the industry apart from things people assumed they would bring anyway such as story. Any new goals they tell us now will be just met with dismay since everyones already made up their minds about what they want from this game a looong time ago.
A-net said from the get go that they want to change the industry and exactly how they want to change it. Spectator, esport style pvp, RTS style WvW, interactive and dynamic event system, unique and expansive personal stories. We roughly know whats going to be in the game what direction they're likely to take on certain parts of the game. Very defined specific goals were set out and are known by most players following this game. As long as A-net fulfill them and not deviate from those goals people generally don't have a reason to critisize.
With swtor we barely know about even a quarter of the game all the hype is in our imagination. We don't know exactly what they plan to do with pvp apart from they have it. We don't know what they want to do with grouping, how they plan to tackle it and solve ome apparant problems. We just know they have all the usual mmo stuff but no idea where they plan to take it. So people imaginations run wild imagining a totally different game than what bioware planned and are often met with a rude awakening.
If Bioware had clearly defined their plans for what exactly they want to do with specific sections of the game we probably wouldn't have as much whining as we do now as people would have come to terms with this fact a very long time ago. The hype has now gone out of control and will likely bite Bioware in the ass.
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
GW2 only talked about dynamic events a little bit, about projectiles doing funny stuff and released hardly a couple of minutes worth of ingame footage.
GW2 does not have hordes of SWG mourners behind it.
Fully expect tons of haters to pop up when more information gets released on that game just the same.
Doubt it GW2 already has more than it's fair share of haters, mostly people who assume it'll play like gw1 and a large amount of gw1 players skeptical bout the change in skill bar and likely skill system.
Despite this GW2 is just in a completely different boat to swtor. Swtor's players are hoping from something "awesome and different" and many players just don't feel swtor is doing anything of those things. People interested in gw2 are looking for something fresh and innovative. As long as A-net continues to mention and bring those things to the table then they can do no wrong. Considering the entire game is designed to pretty much play as different and be as innovating as possible people are less likely to dissapointed.
The problem with swtor is no one really knows what exactly what this game will actually do apart from it being "great". But opinions vary so wildly about what "great" is that the second Bioware releases something not to their liking all hell breaks loose. People need something to justify their hype and the story is just not doing it for them so they complain.
Sadly a large part of this is Biowares own fault. They've set expectation so high and made their focus so wide that everyone expects anything and everything in this game. They haven't told us any of their goals for the industry apart from things people assumed they would bring anyway such as story. Any new goals they tell us now will be just met with dismay since everyones already made up their minds about what they want from this game a looong time ago.
A-net said from the get go that they want to change the industry and exactly how they want to change it. Spectator, esport style pvp, RTS style WvW, interactive and dynamic event system, unique and expansive personal stories. We roughly know whats going to be in the game what direction they're likely to take on certain parts of the game. Very defined specific goals were set out and are known by most players following this game. As long as A-net fulfill them and not deviate from those goals people generally don't have a reason to critisize.
With swtor we barely know about even a quarter of the game all the hype is in our imagination. We don't know exactly what they plan to do with pvp apart from they have it. We don't know what they want to do with grouping, how they plan to tackle it and solve ome apparant problems. We just know they have all the usual mmo stuff but no idea where they plan to take it. So people imaginations run wild imagining a totally different game than what bioware planned and are often met with a rude awakening.
If Bioware had clearly defined their plans for what exactly they want to do with specific sections of the game we probably wouldn't have as much whining as we do now as people would have come to terms with this fact a very long time ago. The hype has now gone out of control and will likely bite Bioware in the ass.
Really nice analysis. Spot on.
I do agree that Bioware' marketing and communications strategy for this game is badly conceived and, as you suggest, is going to cause ructions later down the line. The funny thing is, I am pretty sure that Bioware's strategy is planned and someone is in charge of it - and yet they don't have a clue how it's going down or what they really need to do.
Cost over 150 million and the only thing that seems to be breaking ground is the voice acting for NPC's. I mean even the theme has been done before. Is it just a tragic waste of what could have been for that price tag or does this game actually have some substance beyond voice acting that would justify the cost?
NIce opening line that may have had some substance to it and then you ask a basic question that infers you don't really have any idea of what they have and haven't included in the game. What is tragic is that you are posting on a SWTOR forumn and do not seem to be upto speed with where the game is at, I suggest you go read up on all the available content . Great stickies with links in this forumn. Read and ENjoy.
wow this thread has kept kicking.
The point of this thread was to learn if the game had more going for it than I was aware of. I was doing so by expressing that I felt the price tag given on this site seemed out of proprotion in regards to what the game would offer.. I don't need to know everything about the game in order to post on these sub forums. I don't need to dig up "all the available content". I read this thread and I enjoyed it now I suggest you stop trying to be a mod when you don't understand what are acceptable post and what aren't.
Just wondered if you knew the source as I am interested where it came from , if you don't know just say so simple.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Cost over 150 million and the only thing that seems to be breaking ground is the voice acting for NPC's. I mean even the theme has been done before. Is it just a tragic waste of what could have been for that price tag or does this game actually have some substance beyond voice acting that would justify the cost?
NIce opening line that may have had some substance to it and then you ask a basic question that infers you don't really have any idea of what they have and haven't included in the game. What is tragic is that you are posting on a SWTOR forumn and do not seem to be upto speed with where the game is at, I suggest you go read up on all the available content . Great stickies with links in this forumn. Read and ENjoy.
wow this thread has kept kicking.
The point of this thread was to learn if the game had more going for it than I was aware of. I was doing so by expressing that I felt the price tag given on this site seemed out of proprotion in regards to what the game would offer.. I don't need to know everything about the game in order to post on these sub forums. I don't need to dig up "all the available content". I read this thread and I enjoyed it now I suggest you stop trying to be a mod when you don't understand what are acceptable post and what aren't.
Just wondered if you knew the source as I am interested where it came from , if you don't know just say so simple.
Oh so it's went from not knowing enough about this game to I may not know the source that interests/bothers you.
*sigh*
There was an article around the time I started this thread and I don't remember much more than that anymore. If you have a problem with that than please don't feel the need to tell me.
EDIT
I dug it up so I wouldn't have to keep defending myself in the event someone wanted to save face. Also, yes I am aware it is an educated guess and not an exact amount.
I dug it up so I wouldn't have to keep defending myself in the event someone wanted to save face. Also, yes I am aware it is an educated guess and not an exact amount.
Nah I think this is just a poor post full stop, but thanks for the link I will have a read, as I am interested on where and what eats up the old dollar bills.
edit after reading thread...
It is a fabricated figure as you said, as above dont presume that I care a jot about you this is not about you it's about the trash that is posted here. I just have 150 million reasons to doubt your posts now.
Strangely they could have spent 150 million but I don't see it, not when they licenced the engine , and already had most of the infrastructure in place to deliver this. As well as that the IP is already in place they have developed a lot here but again with KOTOR being in place this is an IP they know well they have not had to start anything from the ground up other than innovative systems which just need to be integrated into the Hero-Engine.
So no now you posted the link it is obvious that their was only one intention for posting this thread. So very interesting.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Oh so it's went from not knowing enough about this game to I may not know the source that interests/bothers you.
*sigh*
There was an article around the time I started this thread and I don't remember much more than that anymore. If you have a problem with that than please don't feel the need to tell me.
EDIT
I dug it up so I wouldn't have to keep defending myself in the event someone wanted to save face. Also, yes I am aware it is an educated guess and not an exact amount.
Nah I think this is just a poor post full stop, but thanks for the link I will have a read, as I am interested on where and what eats up the old dollar bills.
edit after reading thread...
It is a fabricated figure as you said, as above dont presume that I care a jot about you this is not about you it's about the trash that is posted here. I just have 150 million reasons to doubt your posts now.
Strangely they could have spent 150 million but I don't see it, not when they licenced the engine , and already had most of the infrastructure in place to deliver this. As well as that the IP is already in place they have developed a lot here but again with KOTOR being in place this is an IP they know well they have not had to start anything from the ground up other than innovative systems which just need to be integrated into the Hero-Engine.
So no now you posted the link it is obvious that their was only one intention for posting this thread. So very interesting.
Sorry I stopped visiting this sites forums and didn't realize someone had replied to me until now.
It doesn't matter if you think it's a poor post for whatever changing reasons they may be. If that is not knowing enough about the game in a public forum for you or for possibly not knowing the source as you latter claimed or now for having some hidden agenda or "only one intention for posting this thread. So very interesting" lol
If you had read the thread it would have been clear that my intention was to find out if this game had anything going for it that stands out when considering how expensive it is. Like it or not I don't care but there is big money being spent even if it doesn't match the estimate MMORPG.com gave in that article and I felt that it was dissapointing a game with so much hype and fully funded could offer so little that was exceptional. I hoped to find out more and that I was wrong but I've concluded that I wasn't.
As for the quality of my post I don't care if you have 150 million reasons to doubt them, by the sounds of your post you conjure that much if it's not what you want to hear anyway. Again I suggest you just stop worrying about others post and take a closer look at your own. Thank you.
Cost over 150 million and the only thing that seems to be breaking ground is the voice acting for NPC's. I mean even the theme has been done before. Is it just a tragic waste of what could have been for that price tag or does this game actually have some substance beyond voice acting that would justify the cost?
"Seems to be" "tragic Waste"
So no substance to this post , Fabricated budget and what appears to be assumptions by the OP. Well done for wasting all our time thanks!!!
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Cost over 150 million and the only thing that seems to be breaking ground is the voice acting for NPC's. I mean even the theme has been done before. Is it just a tragic waste of what could have been for that price tag or does this game actually have some substance beyond voice acting that would justify the cost?
Before judging budget expenditure, go and make the exact same MMO and come back and tell us how much it cost.
I believe WoW cost $80 million to make, whilst I believe VG and AOC cost $40 million each.
Now, consider that the size of SWTORs landmass appears to be about 50% bigger than the total landmass in WOW including the expansions. Which means more work on gameworld design. And consider the complete voice acting for all possible dialogue snippets for all characters (plus choices in voice style which may possibly be an option). Which is far much more than AOC had. Then there's the class quest systems, the world quest systems. Then of course, there's the licencing payments of the IP and a host of other drains on the overall budget.
After factoring in all that, you start to realise where all the money went.
Comments
Very true. Albiet sadly, as I'm an optimist for this game, I have to be. Bioware games are the only ones I haven't thought hmm, this could've been better. Normally because I get sucked into a story and if theres 'any' comments I'd have against the gameplay, I forget. Could be a bad thing, but turns out the gameplay aint too bad either.
I honestly like what I see. I was concerned how they'd still deliver on the story, and yes I know most of you are sick of hearing about story all the time, but it was my main concern. Otherwise it's just another MMO, but for me, this could be my favourite MMO, time will tell, but for now, it's headed on a straight course to my rig at home.
Also helps I prefer this era of star wars over all else. Including the movies.
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
They did well in choosing the setting yes, it leaves them a lot of freedom to fill it up in their own way, with a dynamic timeperiod. From what I've seen it could become more epic than the universe at the time of the movies.
The graphics, I wasn't that enthusiastic about it. I'd preferred a more Mass Effect 2-style of graphics, but I understand that would be a hard thing to do for a MMO.
My biggest concern is that they'll take over too much elements of WoW, in order to appeal to as large an audience as possible. The graphics already seemed to go that way. Other companies made that mistake too, trying to copy things from WoW, and it didn't go well with those: in fact, I think it only contributed to a relatively stale last years when it comes to MMO's and innovation.
There are other ways to appeal to as large an audience as possible, I think games like GW2 are leading the way in that.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Does anyone have any info to back up these claims of costs it is starting to look like a witch hunt on these forumns and I really don't understand why? Thses figures seem high , the theme is a fantastic IP and deserves for someone to have another go. SWG had too narrow an appeal.
So the IP deserves another chance!!!! yes ? And Bioware with it's track record in conjunction with L-Arts is a great combo.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
TOR is under constant flaming because it deserves it. Look Guild Wars 2 forums. No hate or flaming there and the game was revealed pretty much the same time SW:TOR was. It all depends on the developers. SW:TOR fans are pissed by the state of the game while GW 2 are not.
Now wheres the pickle...
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
I think it is about expectations. GW games usually get leniency because its business model, the same way D&D(since it went f2p) and Runes of Magic doesn't get hammered that bad. Besides, the exposure of SWTOR has been more than GW2 more videos of actual gameplay has been released, so they are not in the same stage, at least in terms of hype. Moreover, SW IP brings more variety of things to the table that the classic sword and magic mmo, it is foreseeable to rise more opinions good and bad about the game.
I am not much of SW fan. I might have to get the game to play with my nephew but I don't get my expectations too high. I wish BW luck for the sake of SW fans and mmos in general.
wow this thread has kept kicking.
The point of this thread was to learn if the game had more going for it than I was aware of. I was doing so by expressing that I felt the price tag given on this site seemed out of proprotion in regards to what the game would offer.. I don't need to know everything about the game in order to post on these sub forums. I don't need to dig up "all the available content". I read this thread and I enjoyed it now I suggest you stop trying to be a mod when you don't understand what are acceptable post and what aren't.
I'm actually pretty excited for the story element, personal interaction and all that jazz. Kind of like AOC, Man i loved that game, all the way to level 21....when tortage and the voice acting was over, i felt robbed and the game just seemed more of the same. Add in the abillity to actually change some outcomes for yourself? I'm pretty geeked for that.
Most negative posts I have seen have been along the lines of:
"This game has story so it is no MMORPG but a single player game."
"This game will be an instanced themepark."
"This game will suck because I think it will suck."
"This game will suck because it isn't SWG2, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Ultima Online, Everquest, FFXI,..."
"<insert doom prophet nr.1564867453>"
Most positive posts are busy reminding the negative posters on the information gathered on the game so far and that their points make no sense.
Be skeptical on what information is actually released, if you're just disputing for the sake of disputing, you're being a useless ass.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
GW2 only talked about dynamic events a little bit, about projectiles doing funny stuff and released hardly a couple of minutes worth of ingame footage.
GW2 does not have hordes of SWG mourners behind it.
Fully expect tons of haters to pop up when more information gets released on that game just the same.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Think that's wishful thinking on your part, they have released quite a bit of information on the event system and the game as a whole. Yes more in game vids would be nice so i agree with you on that part.
There is a reason it's taken over swtor in the hype metre without it having the same fanatical hype as swtor, it's because people like what they are seeing and GW was a success which BioWare have yet to do in the mmorpg world, no matter how the fans like to gloss it over, this is BioWare first mmorpg even if they have people working it it from other mmorpg like War and SGW.
One failed in the end and the other was just a failure from the start.
Time will tell though but BioWare should understand that the mmorpg fanbase is unforgiving, you get no second chances, Vanguard and AOC showed that, both are okay games now but many are still unconvinced 3 years down the road.
GW does have 6 million copy sold, that's figures that BioWare and EA can only dream about.
Furious Fighters
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/13trindx.htm
At best I am watching this one in the wings, I refuse to let myself get sucked in to the hype and get let down. My only concerns are for those folks that walk in to this game with personal expectations and delusions of grandure. Yes I loved the original Trillogy. Yes, I have hopes that the game will not get evicerated by being squashed and forced in to a box that doesn't allow it to have it's own natural shape. But I can't expect great things until I see more about this game with the upcoming months. There is a mold for MMOs lately and it is real hard for most developers to stray too far away from it due to the money it can attrack. Something innovative is needed with this game, I just don't know if the force is with this one...
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~V
Cost over 150 million and ... all I got was this t-shirt?
I think we need to wait until they give us more info on whats in the game before we start deciding the 150 mil was all pissed away on voice actors.
"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "
GW1 that has no subscription and expansions you have to pay for to play? Thats like selling a single player game with DLC to 6 million people. BioWare doesn't need to dream about it, they've done it time and time again.
The reason GW2 took over SWTOR in the hype meter is because its been releasing information lately, nothing more. FFXIV will overtake GW2 when it gets closer to release. If you try and use the hype meter to determine the success of the game you'll realize quickly how your popular opinion falls flat. The hype meter means nothing on MMORPG.com.
They will both respectively have decent populations, the MMO world is big enough for both games, and then some. This theory that all MMORPGers need to stick to one game only and play it until it dies is ridiculous.
Doubt it GW2 already has more than it's fair share of haters, mostly people who assume it'll play like gw1 and a large amount of gw1 players skeptical bout the change in skill bar and likely skill system.
Despite this GW2 is just in a completely different boat to swtor. Swtor's players are hoping from something "awesome and different" and many players just don't feel swtor is doing anything of those things. People interested in gw2 are looking for something fresh and innovative. As long as A-net continues to mention and bring those things to the table then they can do no wrong. Considering the entire game is designed to pretty much play as different and be as innovating as possible people are less likely to dissapointed.
The problem with swtor is no one really knows what exactly what this game will actually do apart from it being "great". But opinions vary so wildly about what "great" is that the second Bioware releases something not to their liking all hell breaks loose. People need something to justify their hype and the story is just not doing it for them so they complain.
Sadly a large part of this is Biowares own fault. They've set expectation so high and made their focus so wide that everyone expects anything and everything in this game. They haven't told us any of their goals for the industry apart from things people assumed they would bring anyway such as story. Any new goals they tell us now will be just met with dismay since everyones already made up their minds about what they want from this game a looong time ago.
A-net said from the get go that they want to change the industry and exactly how they want to change it. Spectator, esport style pvp, RTS style WvW, interactive and dynamic event system, unique and expansive personal stories. We roughly know whats going to be in the game what direction they're likely to take on certain parts of the game. Very defined specific goals were set out and are known by most players following this game. As long as A-net fulfill them and not deviate from those goals people generally don't have a reason to critisize.
With swtor we barely know about even a quarter of the game all the hype is in our imagination. We don't know exactly what they plan to do with pvp apart from they have it. We don't know what they want to do with grouping, how they plan to tackle it and solve ome apparant problems. We just know they have all the usual mmo stuff but no idea where they plan to take it. So people imaginations run wild imagining a totally different game than what bioware planned and are often met with a rude awakening.
If Bioware had clearly defined their plans for what exactly they want to do with specific sections of the game we probably wouldn't have as much whining as we do now as people would have come to terms with this fact a very long time ago. The hype has now gone out of control and will likely bite Bioware in the ass.
Really nice analysis. Spot on.
I do agree that Bioware' marketing and communications strategy for this game is badly conceived and, as you suggest, is going to cause ructions later down the line. The funny thing is, I am pretty sure that Bioware's strategy is planned and someone is in charge of it - and yet they don't have a clue how it's going down or what they really need to do.
Just wondered if you knew the source as I am interested where it came from , if you don't know just say so simple.
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Oh so it's went from not knowing enough about this game to I may not know the source that interests/bothers you.
*sigh*
There was an article around the time I started this thread and I don't remember much more than that anymore. If you have a problem with that than please don't feel the need to tell me.
EDIT
I dug it up so I wouldn't have to keep defending myself in the event someone wanted to save face. Also, yes I am aware it is an educated guess and not an exact amount.
http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/feature/4115/Scott-Jennings-Great-Expectations-SWTOR.html
Nah I think this is just a poor post full stop, but thanks for the link I will have a read, as I am interested on where and what eats up the old dollar bills.
edit after reading thread...
It is a fabricated figure as you said, as above dont presume that I care a jot about you this is not about you it's about the trash that is posted here. I just have 150 million reasons to doubt your posts now.
Strangely they could have spent 150 million but I don't see it, not when they licenced the engine , and already had most of the infrastructure in place to deliver this. As well as that the IP is already in place they have developed a lot here but again with KOTOR being in place this is an IP they know well they have not had to start anything from the ground up other than innovative systems which just need to be integrated into the Hero-Engine.
So no now you posted the link it is obvious that their was only one intention for posting this thread. So very interesting.
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Sorry I stopped visiting this sites forums and didn't realize someone had replied to me until now.
It doesn't matter if you think it's a poor post for whatever changing reasons they may be. If that is not knowing enough about the game in a public forum for you or for possibly not knowing the source as you latter claimed or now for having some hidden agenda or "only one intention for posting this thread. So very interesting" lol
If you had read the thread it would have been clear that my intention was to find out if this game had anything going for it that stands out when considering how expensive it is. Like it or not I don't care but there is big money being spent even if it doesn't match the estimate MMORPG.com gave in that article and I felt that it was dissapointing a game with so much hype and fully funded could offer so little that was exceptional. I hoped to find out more and that I was wrong but I've concluded that I wasn't.
As for the quality of my post I don't care if you have 150 million reasons to doubt them, by the sounds of your post you conjure that much if it's not what you want to hear anyway. Again I suggest you just stop worrying about others post and take a closer look at your own. Thank you.
"Seems to be" "tragic Waste"
So no substance to this post , Fabricated budget and what appears to be assumptions by the OP. Well done for wasting all our time thanks!!!
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Before judging budget expenditure, go and make the exact same MMO and come back and tell us how much it cost.
I believe WoW cost $80 million to make, whilst I believe VG and AOC cost $40 million each.
Now, consider that the size of SWTORs landmass appears to be about 50% bigger than the total landmass in WOW including the expansions. Which means more work on gameworld design. And consider the complete voice acting for all possible dialogue snippets for all characters (plus choices in voice style which may possibly be an option). Which is far much more than AOC had. Then there's the class quest systems, the world quest systems. Then of course, there's the licencing payments of the IP and a host of other drains on the overall budget.
After factoring in all that, you start to realise where all the money went.
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