see , wow was cartoony but it felt right. it's hard to explain but the swtor models are really just disgusting looking. im glad im not the only one who feels that way and yah the lightsabers , if i play the game, i'll definately roll non human and non jedi.
A lot of people have complained about the huge shoulders, tiny waists and uniform heighs of the toons. The fanbois say 'Oh this is only Alpha, it will change before launch' but they don't have any evidence for that. Far more likely, the graphics are preset and will remain constant because A/. They tie in with the look of the awful 'Clone Wars' cartoons B/. They are easy to programme and will reduce the latency of the game in operation C/. They can be easily translated into those saleable action figures for which George Lucas has a hard on.
No.. the FANS (stop bashing them by calling them names please) say that you need to stop freaking out over the little stuff when its still in alpha stage. You did happen to notice that they changed the size of the lightsabers right? Its entirely possible that they will do the same to the pc's. So chill and stop trying to scare everyone please.
1/. Have they changed the size of the lightsabers? It does not seem so to me. Perhaps I am wrong.
2/. As I said, Bioware has no reason at all to change the toon design and animation, and every reason to keep them exactly as they are.
3/. I used - and will continue to use - the term 'fanboi' because it's a harmless term to describe anyone who is so overeager to support a game, that they attack anyone and anything who issues the slightest criticism of it. These people are different from 'fans' who also support a game but are able to let other people have their opinions, even if contrary to theirs, without going crazy.
Does that sound reasonable to you? You guys are doing the exact same thing but with a game. You are seeing the partially completed game and taking it as though this is the way its going to be from start to finish for the whole thing.
Why would that be a good thing?
Pretty much. Alpha this, alpha that, but at the core it's not going to change.
A game can look good for an alpha, or bad for an alpha. Just because it's in an alpha doesn't mean they can get away with just about anything.
Except that you don't know the core of the game, you know the graphics, some planets, and a combat video.
Except that you don't know the core of the game, you know the graphics, some planets, and a combat video.
That's exactly what we do know.. whatever tricks there is to the features we don't know, but we know and have seen the basics. Those won't be changing or if they will, get ready for some massive delays.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
3/. I used - and will continue to use - the term 'fanboi' because it's a harmless term to describe anyone who is so overeager to support a game, that they attack anyone and anything who issues the slightest criticism of it. These people are different from 'fans' who also support a game but are able to let other people have their opinions, even if contrary to theirs, without going crazy.
It's not a harmless term by the rules of this site, BTW.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
see , wow was cartoony but it felt right. it's hard to explain but the swtor models are really just disgusting looking. im glad im not the only one who feels that way and yah the lightsabers , if i play the game, i'll definately roll non human and non jedi.
A lot of people have complained about the huge shoulders, tiny waists and uniform heighs of the toons. The fanbois say 'Oh this is only Alpha, it will change before launch' but they don't have any evidence for that. Far more likely, the graphics are preset and will remain constant because A/. They tie in with the look of the awful 'Clone Wars' cartoons B/. They are easy to programme and will reduce the latency of the game in operation C/. They can be easily translated into those saleable action figures for which George Lucas has a hard on.
No.. the FANS (stop bashing them by calling them names please) say that you need to stop freaking out over the little stuff when its still in alpha stage. You did happen to notice that they changed the size of the lightsabers right? Its entirely possible that they will do the same to the pc's. So chill and stop trying to scare everyone please.
1/. Have they changed the size of the lightsabers, it does not seem so to me. Perhaps I am wrong.
2/;. As I said, Bioware has no reason at all to change the toon design and animation, and ever reason to keep them exactly as they are.
3/. I used - and will continue to use - the term 'fanboi' because it's a harmless term to describe anyone who is so overeager to support a game, that they attack anyone and anything who issues the slightest criticism of it. These people are different from 'fans' who also support a game but are able to let other people have their opinions, even if contrary to theirs, without going crazy.
1. Have you not been paying attention to the threads on here? Everyone is talking about how the lightsabers have changed.
2. No, you haven't.
3. No, its not a "harmless term to describe someone overeager to support the game", its a term to degrade someone who likes something into someone who doesn't matter or is unhealthily obsessed. So its insulting. Just because someone likes something doesn't turn them into a freak.
wikipedia.com
fanboy: A fanboy is a person considered to belong to one or more fandoms to a point of obsession.
Go look up the movie "Fanboys" and you'll see why its such an insult.
You, as a person, may think its funny. But to those of us who just like the universe its set in but don't go wandering around dressed as a Jedi as though its daily wear, its an insult.
How is it not relevant given the topic of the article and one of the points of the debate being static combat? From this article we see that clearly the trooper is not static nor are the enemies. This clearly contradicts the talking point of static combat.
How is it not relevant given the topic of the article and one of the points of the debate being static combat? From this article we see that clearly the trooper is not static nor are the enemies. This clearly contradicts the talking point of static combat.
Eh, not a point in my debate at least. If you meant to link that article to someone else, I apologize.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Think the overall look and especially the animation are nothing what I have seen before in MMORPG's. will also say the same about GW2.
Don't even put swtor animation up agaist GW2, GW2 make swtor animation look old and dated.
As for not seeing the same type of animations in a mmorpg before,perhaps you need to actually take a look at other si-fi mmorpg that have come out recently.
Not sure why you made the link to Global Agenda, mis-link perhpas? (I hope), cause already played Tabula Rasa which looked like it except from some jetpack combat, didn't see anything new here and yes watch the clip a few times to see if I might have missed something but sorry didn't see anything new to the genre, totally different then what SWtOR seems to be doing which again is something apart from GW2 is not seen before and most definitly not seeing it in Global Agenda.
And me saying that about GW2 doesn't mean I put them in the same boat, just that my opinion on things different then most MMORPG in both of them as for animation as I aint talking about the graphics but pure about characters are handled and Glabal Agenda doesn't even come close to any of those 2
EDIT: Downloaded/installed the trail of Global Agenda, looked like abit of fun tho felt pretty dated for just a online game, didn't get any MMORPG fibe from the game, also felt bored pretty quick with the lack of options, and yes I am aware of the trail limitations, but the overall feel was very boring. I love Sci Fi, but didn't like GA at all. Still not sure why you thought GA could even come close to SWtOR or GW2, both games I was not looking forward to, but am beginning to see those are allot better then many MMO's out there and outcoming soon.
3/. I used - and will continue to use - the term 'fanboi' because it's a harmless term to describe anyone who is so overeager to support a game, that they attack anyone and anything who issues the slightest criticism of it. These people are different from 'fans' who also support a game but are able to let other people have their opinions, even if contrary to theirs, without going crazy.
It's not a harmless term by the rules of this site, BTW.
How can GW 2 , FF14 look so good models, and swtor look pretty average and even bad? Its Bioware they should have what it takes to make animations and char models look as awsome as GW2.
They are doing Blizzard's thing - low specs to suit more PC owners.
The difference is that Star Wars was live action movies, while Warcraft was already an IP featuring toony graphics.
So will it be weird for you to watch the live action Warcraft movie when it comes out?
1/. Have they changed the size of the lightsabers, it does not seem so to me. Perhaps I am wrong.
2/;. As I said, Bioware has no reason at all to change the toon design and animation, and ever reason to keep them exactly as they are.
3/. I used - and will continue to use - the term 'fanboi' because it's a harmless term to describe anyone who is so overeager to support a game, that they attack anyone and anything who issues the slightest criticism of it. These people are different from 'fans' who also support a game but are able to let other people have their opinions, even if contrary to theirs, without going crazy.
1. Have you not been paying attention to the threads on here? Everyone is talking about how the lightsabers have changed.
Everyone? No, that isn't true.
2. No, you haven't.
Actually, I did. I gave three specific reasons as to why Bioware will not change the poor, clunky PC stylisations, and I even numbered them. It seems you must have missed those
3. No, its not a "harmless term to describe someone overeager to support the game", its a term to degrade someone who likes something into someone who doesn't matter or is unhealthily obsessed. So its insulting. Just because someone likes something doesn't turn them into a freak.
wikipedia.com
fanboy: A fanboy is a person considered to belong to one or more fandoms to a point of obsession.
Go look up the movie "Fanboys" and you'll see why its such an insult.
Just because you feel bad when someone calls you a fanboi, does not mean it's an insult. And no, you don't get to choose your definition of the word either. The fact that you get your information from a B-movie makes your argument a little ridiculous. No, a 'fanboi' is a nasty, dishonest and borderline neurotic who supports a game to such an extent that they attack, defame and bitch about anyone who expresses an opinion different to their own.
Am I calling you a 'fanboi'? Of course not. You are one of the most reasonable, logical and friendly people on the forum.
You, as a person, may think its funny. But to those of us who just like the universe its set in but don't go wandering around dressed as a Jedi as though its daily wear, its an insult.
It is funny. It's also true. As long as I don't breach any forum rules, I'll continue to do it as long as I like.
No, I'm not. People have been banned here for less.
Well, well, well. And to thank that one of mmorpg.com's own featured columnists, was it Jaime Skelton?, just wrote a column called 'The Fanboi and The Troll'. I hope they don't get banned.
Or perhaps it's just that posters get banned if they call specific people 'a fanboi' - and not if they refer generally to 'fanbois'.
Originally posted by Bannne Originally posted by Reklaw Was excited the first time when I heard of STtOR. Over time when more info was given I became less and less excited. Now after seeing:Star Wars: The Old Republic Videos: Combat Dev Diary (6:11) I have some excited back. Think the overall look and especially the animation are nothing what I have seen before in MMORPG's. will also say the same about GW2.
Don't even put swtor animation up agaist GW2, GW2 make swtor animation look old and dated.
Well, well, well. And to thank that one of mmorpg.com's own featured columnists, was it Jaime Skelton?, just wrote a column called 'The Fanboi and The Troll'. I hope they don't get banned.
You are new here. The staff are not held to the same standard as us plain old posters.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
They rave in interviews how they captured great action feeling, when all i see is your character being static doing wack-a-mole with few animated effects. (even though the effect might be flame thrower, or jetpack hover. Its still your character being on the spot, executing some skill over and over again)
^^ This. This is exactly what I was worried about when I saw the first video and it appears it has not gotten any better. All through combat video, the toon is almost exclusively standing in one place inviting everyone and their mother to shoot them/slash them. And while the Bounty Hunters flamethrower and the Siths force lightning looked nice, dont think that is going to play out too well. If there is any real pvp in this game, I think it will be amusing to watch those two classes powerup their attacks ala Dragonball Z while every enemy in the area beats the piss out of them while they stand there. It almost seems like the armor and saber deflects are so prominent simply so they dont have to have moving, fluid combat.
And in the video they go on and on about how unique it is and the light saber fighting has so many animations. I think I saw 5 animations repeated over and over. Maybe the kid in charge that they showed in that video and the other Watchers should stop messing with Green Latern and get to work on combat. It shouldn't need repeating, but this is suppoed to be a mmo/mmorpg, not an online single player game.
one thing overly dissapointing about this game so far is the look and feel from the gameplay. Im not into over realism but the character models seem to have no attraction to me at all.
the latest combat videos just makes me want to vomit.
so , just out of curiosity i am wondering what everyone else thinks of the graphics swtor/biowar is gonna put out. Personally, im teetering on not buying based on the character models alone, i mean , to me, they are just extremely ugly and the lightsabers literally look like a raver's glow stick...just not impressed so far. i just expected more from bioware's art department.
the landscapes look amazing, but the characters imo look horribly rendered and even more horribly designed.
curious on other's thoughts.
i never really understand ppls hang ups on if a game is pretty and dainty and all that silly stuff.You could end up with Aoc that looked great at release and played like crap would that make you happier? I will take game play any day of the week over graphics I am playing a game not watching a fricking movie.If I wanna see graphics to go ooo and ahh at I will go turnonthe hdtv and pop in a blue ray and watch it.
They rave in interviews how they captured great action feeling, when all i see is your character being static doing wack-a-mole with few animated effects. (even though the effect might be flame thrower, or jetpack hover. Its still your character being on the spot, executing some skill over and over again)
^^ This. This is exactly what I was worried about when I saw the first video and it appears it has not gotten any better. All through combat video, the toon is almost exclusively standing in one place inviting everyone and their mother to shoot them/slash them. And while the Bounty Hunters flamethrower and the Siths force lightning looked nice, dont think that is going to play out too well. If there is any real pvp in this game, I think it will be amusing to watch those two classes powerup their attacks ala Dragonball Z while every enemy in the area beats the piss out of them while they stand there. It almost seems like the armor and saber deflects are so prominent simply so they dont have to have moving, fluid combat.
And in the video they go on and on about how unique it is and the light saber fighting has so many animations. I think I saw 5 animations repeated over and over. Maybe the kid in charge that they showed in that video and the other Watchers should stop messing with Green Latern and get to work on combat. It shouldn't need repeating, but this is suppoed to be a mmo/mmorpg, not an online single player game.
I agree with this. Despite what the developers keep telling us in their press releases and con interviews, the combat actually looks rather old-fashioned. Toons stand in a line and only move if they are trying to close or open distance.
By comparison, Global Agenda's combat seemed incredibly fluid. positional and varied - really next generation stuff. How it compares with combat in other forthcoming MMOs, I don't know.
I get so tired of flamers and trollers that dig in over a game they've NEVER seen. They make assumptions and form overarching opinions based on a single, in production, pre beta, video. People who try to throw premature opinions out as facts are starting to really irritate me. Its like, get a clue, wait until you play the game before you start thrashing out at it. If you don't it only makes you look like a jack*ss. There was no need to take a simple, premature opinion and turn it into a flame war. This community is becoming increasingly hostile for no good reason and it's driving a lot of sensible and good natured readers away. People who want to see real information and mature discussions.
And why exactly do we have to assume it is going to be much better at release? Some of us honestly don't like what we see at this stage and by saying it we don't flame, troll or trashing out at it but simply state our own opinion. The way how you put it you can as well be considered just another fanboy defending the game for whatever reason so lets all start fanboy vs troll war here..... No thanks.
Game looks way below my expectations considering it is developed by BioWare and I am not gonna lie and say otherwise. That is until I see a video I like....
one thing overly dissapointing about this game so far is the look and feel from the gameplay. Im not into over realism but the character models seem to have no attraction to me at all.
the latest combat videos just makes me want to vomit.
so , just out of curiosity i am wondering what everyone else thinks of the graphics swtor/biowar is gonna put out. Personally, im teetering on not buying based on the character models alone, i mean , to me, they are just extremely ugly and the lightsabers literally look like a raver's glow stick...just not impressed so far. i just expected more from bioware's art department.
the landscapes look amazing, but the characters imo look horribly rendered and even more horribly designed.
curious on other's thoughts.
i never really understand ppls hang ups on if a game is pretty and dainty and all that silly stuff.You could end up with Aoc that looked great at release and played like crap would that make you happier? I will take game play any day of the week over graphics I am playing a game not watching a fricking movie.If I wanna see graphics to go ooo and ahh at I will go turnonthe hdtv and pop in a blue ray and watch it.
Because we want to see both gameplay and graphics to be on a high level. Trust me cartoony stylized graphics already turned off a number of people regardless of how the gameplay will turn out. Every single element of the game matters in how playable TOR will be and some people just can't get into it with a feeling of playing a cartoon character.
Regarding nice graphics and AoC example I defently agree with you. It can be misleading since graphics don't matter if gameplay sucks (which is why I never ever pre-purchase or buy games at release). But to say that graphics should be overlooked and that gameplay is what actually matters is just taking the case to an opposite extreme. In the end it all matters, something a bit more and something a bit less depending on personal tastes but every single element if done poorly can be a turn off.
When they first started releasing screenshots I felt the environments were amazing. Simply beautiful, I felt they captured the mood of the scenery very well.
Now that's been said, I have disliked the artwork for the item models (lightsabers) and players since then as well. I feel they are growing on me a little, but still would have liked to see something a bit better.
Comments
1/. Have they changed the size of the lightsabers? It does not seem so to me. Perhaps I am wrong.
2/. As I said, Bioware has no reason at all to change the toon design and animation, and every reason to keep them exactly as they are.
3/. I used - and will continue to use - the term 'fanboi' because it's a harmless term to describe anyone who is so overeager to support a game, that they attack anyone and anything who issues the slightest criticism of it. These people are different from 'fans' who also support a game but are able to let other people have their opinions, even if contrary to theirs, without going crazy.
Except that you don't know the core of the game, you know the graphics, some planets, and a combat video.
That's exactly what we do know.. whatever tricks there is to the features we don't know, but we know and have seen the basics. Those won't be changing or if they will, get ready for some massive delays.
http://darthhater.com/2010/03/15/gdc-trooper-hands-on-tor-game-play-impressions/page/2
I reiterate my troll more statement
It's not a harmless term by the rules of this site, BTW.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I meant all of them tricks. We know some, but I doubt we know everything. Not like it's relevant though.
1. Have you not been paying attention to the threads on here? Everyone is talking about how the lightsabers have changed.
2. No, you haven't.
3. No, its not a "harmless term to describe someone overeager to support the game", its a term to degrade someone who likes something into someone who doesn't matter or is unhealthily obsessed. So its insulting. Just because someone likes something doesn't turn them into a freak.
wikipedia.com
fanboy: A fanboy is a person considered to belong to one or more fandoms to a point of obsession.
Go look up the movie "Fanboys" and you'll see why its such an insult.
You, as a person, may think its funny. But to those of us who just like the universe its set in but don't go wandering around dressed as a Jedi as though its daily wear, its an insult.
How is it not relevant given the topic of the article and one of the points of the debate being static combat? From this article we see that clearly the trooper is not static nor are the enemies. This clearly contradicts the talking point of static combat.
Eh, not a point in my debate at least. If you meant to link that article to someone else, I apologize.
Not sure why you made the link to Global Agenda, mis-link perhpas? (I hope), cause already played Tabula Rasa which looked like it except from some jetpack combat, didn't see anything new here and yes watch the clip a few times to see if I might have missed something but sorry didn't see anything new to the genre, totally different then what SWtOR seems to be doing which again is something apart from GW2 is not seen before and most definitly not seeing it in Global Agenda.
And me saying that about GW2 doesn't mean I put them in the same boat, just that my opinion on things different then most MMORPG in both of them as for animation as I aint talking about the graphics but pure about characters are handled and Glabal Agenda doesn't even come close to any of those 2
EDIT: Downloaded/installed the trail of Global Agenda, looked like abit of fun tho felt pretty dated for just a online game, didn't get any MMORPG fibe from the game, also felt bored pretty quick with the lack of options, and yes I am aware of the trail limitations, but the overall feel was very boring. I love Sci Fi, but didn't like GA at all. Still not sure why you thought GA could even come close to SWtOR or GW2, both games I was not looking forward to, but am beginning to see those are allot better then many MMO's out there and outcoming soon.
What? You're having me on, surely?
So will it be weird for you to watch the live action Warcraft movie when it comes out?
Yes. I very much doubt that real actors in makeup will capture the style at all. How much of it will be CGI?
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
No, I'm not. People have been banned here for less.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Well, well, well. And to thank that one of mmorpg.com's own featured columnists, was it Jaime Skelton?, just wrote a column called 'The Fanboi and The Troll'. I hope they don't get banned.
Or perhaps it's just that posters get banned if they call specific people 'a fanboi' - and not if they refer generally to 'fanbois'.
As for not seeing the same type of animations in a mmorpg before,perhaps you need to actually take a look at other si-fi mmorpg that have come out recently.
Example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_JUSiLE8uQ&feature=related
GW2s graphics look pretty bland.
Like they're trying to imitate AoC but failing miserably.
Alltern8 Blog | Star Wars Space Combat and The Old Republic | Cryptic Studios - A Pre Post-Mortem | Klingon Preview, STO's Monster Play
You are new here. The staff are not held to the same standard as us plain old posters.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
^^ This. This is exactly what I was worried about when I saw the first video and it appears it has not gotten any better. All through combat video, the toon is almost exclusively standing in one place inviting everyone and their mother to shoot them/slash them. And while the Bounty Hunters flamethrower and the Siths force lightning looked nice, dont think that is going to play out too well. If there is any real pvp in this game, I think it will be amusing to watch those two classes powerup their attacks ala Dragonball Z while every enemy in the area beats the piss out of them while they stand there. It almost seems like the armor and saber deflects are so prominent simply so they dont have to have moving, fluid combat.
And in the video they go on and on about how unique it is and the light saber fighting has so many animations. I think I saw 5 animations repeated over and over. Maybe the kid in charge that they showed in that video and the other Watchers should stop messing with Green Latern and get to work on combat. It shouldn't need repeating, but this is suppoed to be a mmo/mmorpg, not an online single player game.
i never really understand ppls hang ups on if a game is pretty and dainty and all that silly stuff.You could end up with Aoc that looked great at release and played like crap would that make you happier? I will take game play any day of the week over graphics I am playing a game not watching a fricking movie.If I wanna see graphics to go ooo and ahh at I will go turnonthe hdtv and pop in a blue ray and watch it.
I agree with this. Despite what the developers keep telling us in their press releases and con interviews, the combat actually looks rather old-fashioned. Toons stand in a line and only move if they are trying to close or open distance.
By comparison, Global Agenda's combat seemed incredibly fluid. positional and varied - really next generation stuff. How it compares with combat in other forthcoming MMOs, I don't know.
And why exactly do we have to assume it is going to be much better at release? Some of us honestly don't like what we see at this stage and by saying it we don't flame, troll or trashing out at it but simply state our own opinion. The way how you put it you can as well be considered just another fanboy defending the game for whatever reason so lets all start fanboy vs troll war here..... No thanks.
Game looks way below my expectations considering it is developed by BioWare and I am not gonna lie and say otherwise. That is until I see a video I like....
Because we want to see both gameplay and graphics to be on a high level. Trust me cartoony stylized graphics already turned off a number of people regardless of how the gameplay will turn out. Every single element of the game matters in how playable TOR will be and some people just can't get into it with a feeling of playing a cartoon character.
Regarding nice graphics and AoC example I defently agree with you. It can be misleading since graphics don't matter if gameplay sucks (which is why I never ever pre-purchase or buy games at release). But to say that graphics should be overlooked and that gameplay is what actually matters is just taking the case to an opposite extreme. In the end it all matters, something a bit more and something a bit less depending on personal tastes but every single element if done poorly can be a turn off.
Like that cartoony nasty game World of Warcraft. Yup, people just hate that cartoony look and won't have anything to do with it.
Game play is all. If the game is bad, who cares what it looks like.
When they first started releasing screenshots I felt the environments were amazing. Simply beautiful, I felt they captured the mood of the scenery very well.
Now that's been said, I have disliked the artwork for the item models (lightsabers) and players since then as well. I feel they are growing on me a little, but still would have liked to see something a bit better.
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