sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
Ulduar 10 can definitely be done with all blues, the hard modes, definitely not.
Obviously you must use one of the other addons for "Gear Score". The widely accepted website and derived addons on my server is from www.wow-heroes.com, not that GearScore addon. The numbers tend to end up being quite different... just to get the facts straight.
WTH are you on about, ofc its the addon that is the whole point of gear score, gear score is the Addon whatever website you are talking about came after that was implemented, the addon is what makes it good cause a RL can just check everyones gear score and experience on the spot, not some website that would be ridiculous LOL. Who in their right mind is going to browse a website and input the name of the character before making a PUG for everyone the addon is just very convenient target the person get the GS.
I dont think you fully understand how the GS system works, I advise you to do little more research as the Addon is what people use in game all the time to create PUGs on 90% of the servers.
Would you stop trying to brow-beat me into a pointless argument and just have civil discourse? I am not sure why this is bothering you so much. Different servers use different methods for determining gear score, big deal. For the record, the algorithm used by wow-heores to determine gear score (and wow-heroes website and accompanying addon(s) that use the same algorithm) were established in early summer of 2008. The GearScore addon was not created until some time in mid January of 2009. Who really cares though since it's basically the same thing, it just uses different methods to get to the same basic information... Anyhow, pointless debate really, since Gear Score is a nearly useless statistic.
------------------------- "Searchers after horror haunt strange, far places..." ~ H.P.Lovecraft, "From Beyond"
sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
You asked for a link and you got one. Heres a more recent one. ICC in all blues.
sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
You asked for a link and you got one. Heres a more recent one. ICC in all blues.
Sorry but thats the exception and not the rule. New raiders going into that place with all blues will get curb stomped.
I remember playing WoW with alts back in TBC and since we already knew what the hell to do we were able to clear content in lesser gear.
It's a fact that that content is not designed to be done as an entry raid in blues.
I have been told that Blizzard actually allowed and designed a gear score concept into WoW and now will be apart of its core design. That didn’t really surprise me at all.
Completely false.
You are probably thinking about the April Fools Day joke where Blizzard mocked Gearscore.
Blizzard agrees that the player base is abusing the Gearscore mod but there is nothing they can do about it. They could ban Gearscore but people would find other ways to discriminate.
Also, you make it sound like people discriminating others based on simple things is exclusive to WoW. Sorry, but again, you are completely wrong.
Actuallty a form 'gearscore' is used by Blizzard for the Random dungeon finder. Blizzard has some minimum levels of gear that you have to have before you can even chooses or randomly be placed in the ICC 5man heroics. You also can't choose the higher raids in 'Looking for Raid' if you don't have the gear. And its fairly high, much higher than the true minimum. The Greedy Globlin ICC in blues project easily cleared the ICC-5 heroics, as well as ToC, most of Ulduar and is progressing in ICC, in blue gear, blue enchants, 'blue' gems.
And that with a skilled team that can work well together, you can take far harder mobs with lesser gear than normal.
But yeah, I can see how in PUGs you don't know how good or skilled someone is, and then is gearscore the fastest and least riskiest way to form up your team.
That's what guilds and friends are for, to form up teams that let you join for the player you are and skill you have.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Sorry but thats the exception and not the rule. New raiders going into that place with all blues will get curb stomped.
I remember playing WoW with alts back in TBC and since we already knew what the hell to do we were able to clear content in lesser gear.
It's a fact that that content is not designed to be done as an entry raid in blues.
I agree new raiders will have problems if they tried this in all blues, but it does not change the fact that gear is not as important as some make it out to be. If you read their articles, these guys wipe a lot themselves, while learning each fight.
The people who are shouting in global for GS and ach checks don't want to wipe. They want to stroll into each dungeon knowing they will clear it on the first try and not have to teach a bunch of newbies how to raid.
... and last night there was someone spamming for Gruul's lair , minimum 5500 gs. That's what irritates people. Because of some schmuck that obviously has no idea what it takes to run the dungeon. The problem is they tried to take the analyzing of gear out of it and make it quicker for the raid leader to decide on who has sufficient gear to run the content. But the same raid leaders who had no idea on how to analyze a player's gear still have no idea what you can actually run the dungeon with.
With the expansion they get rid of most of the stats so people don't have to think anymore either. Hell, go on elitistjerks.com, make some macros, and you probably only need to hit 3 buttons and never think at all ..... Maybe gear score is a good idea, since most people can't play worth a shit ... at least with an insanely high gear score you can be assured they don't totaly suck.
sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
You asked for a link and you got one. Heres a more recent one. ICC in all blues.
Sorry but thats the exception and not the rule. New raiders going into that place with all blues will get curb stomped.
I remember playing WoW with alts back in TBC and since we already knew what the hell to do we were able to clear content in lesser gear.
It's a fact that that content is not designed to be done as an entry raid in blues.
Simply a demonstration that skill and knowledge *will* make up for lower stat gear in *some* fights.
sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
You asked for a link and you got one. Heres a more recent one. ICC in all blues.
Sorry but thats the exception and not the rule. New raiders going into that place with all blues will get curb stomped.
I remember playing WoW with alts back in TBC and since we already knew what the hell to do we were able to clear content in lesser gear.
It's a fact that that content is not designed to be done as an entry raid in blues.
Simply a demonstration that skill and knowledge *will* make up for lower stat gear in *some* fights.
With enough practice a player could do some pretty amazing things when it comes to raid progression. with that said the dungeon wasn't designed to be cleared that way.
And that with a skilled team that can work well together, you can take far harder mobs with lesser gear than normal.
But yeah, I can see how in PUGs you don't know how good or skilled someone is, and then is gearscore the fastest and least riskiest way to form up your team.
That's what guilds and friends are for, to form up teams that let you join for the player you are and skill you have.
Sad thing is, for WoW hard modes, you need the skill AND the gear. Lich King heroic won't go down with a 5k GS raid team, no matter how well you play. The DPS and healing will simply not be there.
Obviously you must use one of the other addons for "Gear Score". The widely accepted website and derived addons on my server is from www.wow-heroes.com, not that GearScore addon. The numbers tend to end up being quite different... just to get the facts straight.
WTH are you on about, ofc its the addon that is the whole point of gear score, gear score is the Addon whatever website you are talking about came after that was implemented, the addon is what makes it good cause a RL can just check everyones gear score and experience on the spot, not some website that would be ridiculous LOL. Who in their right mind is going to browse a website and input the name of the character before making a PUG for everyone the addon is just very convenient target the person get the GS.
I dont think you fully understand how the GS system works, I advise you to do little more research as the Addon is what people use in game all the time to create PUGs on 90% of the servers.
Actually WoW-Heroes was there first and it is the prefered method on my server becaue it had gear and achievement displays in addition to just a number long before GS added those features. Raid leaders found that so usefull that the addon never caught on on my server.
Obviously you must use one of the other addons for "Gear Score". The widely accepted website and derived addons on my server is from www.wow-heroes.com, not that GearScore addon. The numbers tend to end up being quite different... just to get the facts straight.
WTH are you on about, ofc its the addon that is the whole point of gear score, gear score is the Addon whatever website you are talking about came after that was implemented, the addon is what makes it good cause a RL can just check everyones gear score and experience on the spot, not some website that would be ridiculous LOL. Who in their right mind is going to browse a website and input the name of the character before making a PUG for everyone the addon is just very convenient target the person get the GS.
I dont think you fully understand how the GS system works, I advise you to do little more research as the Addon is what people use in game all the time to create PUGs on 90% of the servers.
Actually WoW-Heroes was there first and it is the prefered method on my server becaue it had gear and achievement displays in addition to just a number long before GS added those features. Raid leaders found that so usefull that the addon never caught on on my server.
Let's not get carried away here. The generic norm is to use the GearScore addon.
I agree it is a bad mechanic. But I also agree that it is a mechanic instituted largely by the players that can be found in almost any MMO in one form or another. It's basically a form of exclusion. Players have been blocking other players since UO in one way or another. I don't think it's completely intentional either. Players want the best chance to win, and that often means excluding players that do not meet certain standards.
The only saving grace to such a mechanic is that there are players out there who do not feel this way. There are many players and guilds that do not have stringent requirements to join or participate. You may not be able to take on the hardest, more cutting edge content, but you shouldn't let that stop you from finding some nice players to play with and have a good time.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
Yes, it is a figure. But it says something about you as a player: how much effort you have put into your character. U can get like 5k NOT raiding. And also DPS meters and stuff finds out the raids weakest link. And the highest GS u can get in the game right now is 6860. So if you get like 5k, you'd have a better chance at getting into raids, than you would at 3200.
And if you still think 3200 is good enough for ICC(f.ex.), imagine everyone at 3200.. You would fail.. Or at least it'd be hard for everyone completing the raid. I don't say GS is everything, but it makes stuff easier. Like denying your place in the raid due to the low GS. And taking someone else with higher GS, they would probably do higher DPS than you(I said probably).
Also, if everyone in the raid have lower gs than you, and the difference is high, they are boosting you..
Gearscore is another nail in the coffin of the community. My paladin had tanked ICC10man yet I got denied VOA because they didn't like my GS. The community is horrid in the game and the looking for dungeon addition while making dungeon runs easier has totally destroyed what feeble community was left.
Yes, it is a figure. But it says something about you as a player: how much effort you have put into your character. U can get like 5k NOT raiding. And also DPS meters and stuff finds out the raids weakest link. And the highest GS u can get in the game right now is 6860. So if you get like 5k, you'd have a better chance at getting into raids, than you would at 3200.
And if you still think 3200 is good enough for ICC(f.ex.), imagine everyone at 3200.. You would fail.. Or at least it'd be hard for everyone completing the raid. I don't say GS is everything, but it makes stuff easier. Like denying your place in the raid due to the low GS. And taking someone else with higher GS, they would probably do higher DPS than you(I said probably).
Also, if everyone in the raid have lower gs than you, and the difference is high, they are boosting you..
GS and damage meters become an obsession for some. But thats true about just about any human activity. Humans tribal nature applies more in the area of exclusion, than inclusion, which fact lies at the root of some of our most basic and major problems. That it carries over into games is hardly any surprise.
Gearscore is another nail in the coffin of the community. My paladin had tanked ICC10man yet I got denied VOA because they didn't like my GS. The community is horrid in the game and the looking for dungeon addition while making dungeon runs easier has totally destroyed what feeble community was left.
What community? the same community which refused to team up or make any effort to run groups for low level dungeons? please..there was no community to speak of. I spend days looking for teams for classic dunegons and never got a single person interested in forming a group. thanks to the dungeon tool i can enjoy the game i pay for instead of just skipping it because so called community is too lazy to forum groups.
The only community that exists in WOW is in guilds, thats how it has always been.
Gearscore is another nail in the coffin of the community. My paladin had tanked ICC10man yet I got denied VOA because they didn't like my GS. The community is horrid in the game and the looking for dungeon addition while making dungeon runs easier has totally destroyed what feeble community was left.
What coomunity? the same community which refused to team up or make any effort to run groups for low level dungeons? please..there was no community to speak of. I spend days looking for teams for classic dunegons and never got a single person interested in forming a group. thanks to the dungeon tool i can enjoy the game i pay for instead of just skipping it because so called community is too lazy to forum groups.
The only community that exists in WOW is in guilds, thats how it has always been.
Not in my experience. I have always been able to get groups for my low level toons. Well that was true up until WotLK came out. Since its release things in my opinion have nosedived fast.
Gearscore is another nail in the coffin of the community. My paladin had tanked ICC10man yet I got denied VOA because they didn't like my GS. The community is horrid in the game and the looking for dungeon addition while making dungeon runs easier has totally destroyed what feeble community was left.
What coomunity? the same community which refused to team up or make any effort to run groups for low level dungeons? please..there was no community to speak of. I spend days looking for teams for classic dunegons and never got a single person interested in forming a group. thanks to the dungeon tool i can enjoy the game i pay for instead of just skipping it because so called community is too lazy to forum groups.
The only community that exists in WOW is in guilds, thats how it has always been.
Not in my experience. I have always been able to get groups for my low level toons. Well that was true up until WotLK came out. Since its release things in my opinion have nosedived fast.
Did you ever realise that addition of dungeon tool was fault of the players itself? if groups were so readily avilable and players were not forced to skip content do you think Blizzard would implement such a tool? fact is that people want to experince all of the content and lets be fair, there is no fun in standing at one place and spamming 'lfg' for hours. There was a huge demand for such a tool and Blizzard only gave what players wanted.
Nothing wrong with giving players a chance to experince all of the content. isn't that what we pay a monthly sub for? whats the better option? making all low level content soloable like Turbine did with LOTR or add a dungeon finder tool?
Yes, it is a figure. But it says something about you as a player: how much effort you have put into your character. U can get like 5k NOT raiding. And also DPS meters and stuff finds out the raids weakest link. And the highest GS u can get in the game right now is 6860. So if you get like 5k, you'd have a better chance at getting into raids, than you would at 3200.
And if you still think 3200 is good enough for ICC(f.ex.), imagine everyone at 3200.. You would fail.. Or at least it'd be hard for everyone completing the raid. I don't say GS is everything, but it makes stuff easier. Like denying your place in the raid due to the low GS. And taking someone else with higher GS, they would probably do higher DPS than you(I said probably).
Also, if everyone in the raid have lower gs than you, and the difference is high, they are boosting you..
GS and damage meters become an obsession for some. But thats true about just about any human activity. Humans tribal nature applies more in the area of exclusion, than inclusion, which fact lies at the root of some of our most basic and major problems. That it carries over into games is hardly any surprise.
Well, obsessed because they want to improve in the game. I like having DMG meters and GearScore addons, to see how I'm doing, how much dps I do compared to others, and if I'm not in the top I have done something wrong. Same with tanking, I want to have ~50% damage taken in a 5man instance. And to be able to do that gear comes into account. I can't outdps a 6k GS rouge when I have 4500 GS myself.. So I won't aim higher on the dps list than the rogue.. That's just an example on how I use the mechanic ofc.
Did you ever realise that addition of dungeon tool was fault of the players itself? if groups were so readily avilable and players were not forced to skip content do you think Blizzard would implement such a tool? fact is that people want to experince all of the content and lets be fair, there is no fun in standing at one place and spamming 'lfg' for hours. There was a huge demand for such a tool and Blizzard only gave what players wanted.
Nothing wrong with giving players a chance to experince all of the content. isn't that what we pay a monthly sub for? whats the better option? making all low level content soloable like Turbine did with LOTR or add a dungeon finder tool?
Fault of the players? Or players are being 'forced' (meaning, not deciding, which means there is no fault to be found) to skip content? You're contradicting yourself.
The fault is squarely on Blizzard. Players, in this game, any game, react directly to the mechanics that compose the game. If there is a poor response to an implemented mechanic, review the CAUSE, not the EFFECT.
How, why, and when, did low-level content become obsolete? Did it become nigh impossible to find a group for? Well, Blizzard did this wonderful little thing called 'speed up the path to level cap' back in BC whereby
- All world mobs were now all non-elite
- All quests gave 1/3 more xp
- All mobs had 1/3 less hp
- All mobs had 1/3 less attack.
This made solo'ing, questing in particular, HIGHLY more beneficial than any sort of grouping. Because Blizzard was making a patch solution to another problem in their game: top-heavy population at level cap, with the 'game' 'starting' at level cap.
The demand for such a tool was a demand created by poor mechanic implementation on behalf of Blizzard themselves. Blizzard didn't 'give players what they wanted' so much as they 'fixed a by-product of poor implimentation'... and the core problem remains untouched.
Launching patch solutions to quel effects has proven to be unfruitful. The devs can keep trying to put lipstick on the pig...
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc. We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be. So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away. - MMO_Doubter
I am against the use of add-ons. Gear Score is a third party add on.
Add ons are not made by Blizzard and can harm the game experience. That's why I was against Gear score and the DPS meters available on the web.
However ... although I didn't install it I never had a single whisper about my gear in joining PUG's.
The reason is simple: I always had a good understanding of what my present gear could handle or not - content wise -.
As an experiment I installed both "recount" and "GS" a few weeks ago. It just confirmed what I knew already: without raiding ICC in the last 3 months (and having only one piece of ICC 10), my GS stood at 5314.
And I don't even have all the gear available from non ICC raiding.
So GS is a rather useless tool for experienced players as they know the gear of the classes they play.
I do keep it installed though as together with "recount dps" it shows your "personal performance" now in fights, because you can have a ratio of DPS to GS.
As a matter of fact - for personal use - it lets you measure your performance in PVE fights, it even has a positive influence of your play performance (since you quantify your dps according to your gear). You can deduce which rotations and abilities perform better. But most of the time it just sits there unused.
Note: GS doesn't distinguish between PvP and PvE gear, which makes it questionable to quantify other PVE players on the fly.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
Comments
WoW's only progression at endgame is gear so obviously judging someone by their gear is going to happen.
This is why I don't play gear grind mmos anymore.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
sorry.. going to call BS on that whole post.. ONE.. there is nothing but "say so" believe us we did it.. Which can't be confirmed or disproved.. Secondly there are some encounters that can be tailored or won with alot of luck and know how.. more luck then anything else.. and 3rdly.. That was the final boss.. they they go thru the entire dungeonw wearing blues? I bet not.. I would bet they cleared most of Ulduar wearing epics and hand picked a certain fight.. But like I said "combat" log proves nothing as to who is wearing what.. LOL
But it makes for a good story and I'm sure like most press, fans will be eating it up.. yum yum.. Can I have seconds?
Ulduar 10 can definitely be done with all blues, the hard modes, definitely not.
Would you stop trying to brow-beat me into a pointless argument and just have civil discourse? I am not sure why this is bothering you so much. Different servers use different methods for determining gear score, big deal. For the record, the algorithm used by wow-heores to determine gear score (and wow-heroes website and accompanying addon(s) that use the same algorithm) were established in early summer of 2008. The GearScore addon was not created until some time in mid January of 2009. Who really cares though since it's basically the same thing, it just uses different methods to get to the same basic information... Anyhow, pointless debate really, since Gear Score is a nearly useless statistic.
-------------------------
"Searchers after horror haunt strange, far places..." ~ H.P.Lovecraft, "From Beyond"
Member Since March 2004
You asked for a link and you got one. Heres a more recent one. ICC in all blues.
Sorry but thats the exception and not the rule. New raiders going into that place with all blues will get curb stomped.
I remember playing WoW with alts back in TBC and since we already knew what the hell to do we were able to clear content in lesser gear.
It's a fact that that content is not designed to be done as an entry raid in blues.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
Actuallty a form 'gearscore' is used by Blizzard for the Random dungeon finder. Blizzard has some minimum levels of gear that you have to have before you can even chooses or randomly be placed in the ICC 5man heroics. You also can't choose the higher raids in 'Looking for Raid' if you don't have the gear. And its fairly high, much higher than the true minimum. The Greedy Globlin ICC in blues project easily cleared the ICC-5 heroics, as well as ToC, most of Ulduar and is progressing in ICC, in blue gear, blue enchants, 'blue' gems.
I think he was trying to say that skill > gear.
And that with a skilled team that can work well together, you can take far harder mobs with lesser gear than normal.
But yeah, I can see how in PUGs you don't know how good or skilled someone is, and then is gearscore the fastest and least riskiest way to form up your team.
That's what guilds and friends are for, to form up teams that let you join for the player you are and skill you have.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I agree new raiders will have problems if they tried this in all blues, but it does not change the fact that gear is not as important as some make it out to be. If you read their articles, these guys wipe a lot themselves, while learning each fight.
The people who are shouting in global for GS and ach checks don't want to wipe. They want to stroll into each dungeon knowing they will clear it on the first try and not have to teach a bunch of newbies how to raid.
... and last night there was someone spamming for Gruul's lair , minimum 5500 gs. That's what irritates people. Because of some schmuck that obviously has no idea what it takes to run the dungeon. The problem is they tried to take the analyzing of gear out of it and make it quicker for the raid leader to decide on who has sufficient gear to run the content. But the same raid leaders who had no idea on how to analyze a player's gear still have no idea what you can actually run the dungeon with.
With the expansion they get rid of most of the stats so people don't have to think anymore either. Hell, go on elitistjerks.com, make some macros, and you probably only need to hit 3 buttons and never think at all ..... Maybe gear score is a good idea, since most people can't play worth a shit ... at least with an insanely high gear score you can be assured they don't totaly suck.
Simply a demonstration that skill and knowledge *will* make up for lower stat gear in *some* fights.
With enough practice a player could do some pretty amazing things when it comes to raid progression. with that said the dungeon wasn't designed to be cleared that way.
Thats not a bad thing though.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
Sad thing is, for WoW hard modes, you need the skill AND the gear. Lich King heroic won't go down with a 5k GS raid team, no matter how well you play. The DPS and healing will simply not be there.
Actually WoW-Heroes was there first and it is the prefered method on my server becaue it had gear and achievement displays in addition to just a number long before GS added those features. Raid leaders found that so usefull that the addon never caught on on my server.
Let's not get carried away here. The generic norm is to use the GearScore addon.
I agree it is a bad mechanic. But I also agree that it is a mechanic instituted largely by the players that can be found in almost any MMO in one form or another. It's basically a form of exclusion. Players have been blocking other players since UO in one way or another. I don't think it's completely intentional either. Players want the best chance to win, and that often means excluding players that do not meet certain standards.
The only saving grace to such a mechanic is that there are players out there who do not feel this way. There are many players and guilds that do not have stringent requirements to join or participate. You may not be able to take on the hardest, more cutting edge content, but you shouldn't let that stop you from finding some nice players to play with and have a good time.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
Yes, it is a figure. But it says something about you as a player: how much effort you have put into your character. U can get like 5k NOT raiding. And also DPS meters and stuff finds out the raids weakest link. And the highest GS u can get in the game right now is 6860. So if you get like 5k, you'd have a better chance at getting into raids, than you would at 3200.
And if you still think 3200 is good enough for ICC(f.ex.), imagine everyone at 3200.. You would fail.. Or at least it'd be hard for everyone completing the raid. I don't say GS is everything, but it makes stuff easier. Like denying your place in the raid due to the low GS. And taking someone else with higher GS, they would probably do higher DPS than you(I said probably).
Also, if everyone in the raid have lower gs than you, and the difference is high, they are boosting you..
Gearscore is another nail in the coffin of the community. My paladin had tanked ICC10man yet I got denied VOA because they didn't like my GS. The community is horrid in the game and the looking for dungeon addition while making dungeon runs easier has totally destroyed what feeble community was left.
GS and damage meters become an obsession for some. But thats true about just about any human activity. Humans tribal nature applies more in the area of exclusion, than inclusion, which fact lies at the root of some of our most basic and major problems. That it carries over into games is hardly any surprise.
What community? the same community which refused to team up or make any effort to run groups for low level dungeons? please..there was no community to speak of. I spend days looking for teams for classic dunegons and never got a single person interested in forming a group. thanks to the dungeon tool i can enjoy the game i pay for instead of just skipping it because so called community is too lazy to forum groups.
The only community that exists in WOW is in guilds, thats how it has always been.
Not in my experience. I have always been able to get groups for my low level toons. Well that was true up until WotLK came out. Since its release things in my opinion have nosedived fast.
Did you ever realise that addition of dungeon tool was fault of the players itself? if groups were so readily avilable and players were not forced to skip content do you think Blizzard would implement such a tool? fact is that people want to experince all of the content and lets be fair, there is no fun in standing at one place and spamming 'lfg' for hours. There was a huge demand for such a tool and Blizzard only gave what players wanted.
Nothing wrong with giving players a chance to experince all of the content. isn't that what we pay a monthly sub for? whats the better option? making all low level content soloable like Turbine did with LOTR or add a dungeon finder tool?
Originally posted by Wraithone
Well, obsessed because they want to improve in the game. I like having DMG meters and GearScore addons, to see how I'm doing, how much dps I do compared to others, and if I'm not in the top I have done something wrong. Same with tanking, I want to have ~50% damage taken in a 5man instance. And to be able to do that gear comes into account. I can't outdps a 6k GS rouge when I have 4500 GS myself.. So I won't aim higher on the dps list than the rogue.. That's just an example on how I use the mechanic ofc.
Fault of the players? Or players are being 'forced' (meaning, not deciding, which means there is no fault to be found) to skip content? You're contradicting yourself.
The fault is squarely on Blizzard. Players, in this game, any game, react directly to the mechanics that compose the game. If there is a poor response to an implemented mechanic, review the CAUSE, not the EFFECT.
How, why, and when, did low-level content become obsolete? Did it become nigh impossible to find a group for? Well, Blizzard did this wonderful little thing called 'speed up the path to level cap' back in BC whereby
- All world mobs were now all non-elite
- All quests gave 1/3 more xp
- All mobs had 1/3 less hp
- All mobs had 1/3 less attack.
This made solo'ing, questing in particular, HIGHLY more beneficial than any sort of grouping. Because Blizzard was making a patch solution to another problem in their game: top-heavy population at level cap, with the 'game' 'starting' at level cap.
The demand for such a tool was a demand created by poor mechanic implementation on behalf of Blizzard themselves. Blizzard didn't 'give players what they wanted' so much as they 'fixed a by-product of poor implimentation'... and the core problem remains untouched.
Launching patch solutions to quel effects has proven to be unfruitful. The devs can keep trying to put lipstick on the pig...
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc.
We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be.
So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away.
- MMO_Doubter
I am against the use of add-ons. Gear Score is a third party add on.
Add ons are not made by Blizzard and can harm the game experience. That's why I was against Gear score and the DPS meters available on the web.
However ... although I didn't install it I never had a single whisper about my gear in joining PUG's.
The reason is simple: I always had a good understanding of what my present gear could handle or not - content wise -.
As an experiment I installed both "recount" and "GS" a few weeks ago. It just confirmed what I knew already: without raiding ICC in the last 3 months (and having only one piece of ICC 10), my GS stood at 5314.
And I don't even have all the gear available from non ICC raiding.
So GS is a rather useless tool for experienced players as they know the gear of the classes they play.
I do keep it installed though as together with "recount dps" it shows your "personal performance" now in fights, because you can have a ratio of DPS to GS.
As a matter of fact - for personal use - it lets you measure your performance in PVE fights, it even has a positive influence of your play performance (since you quantify your dps according to your gear). You can deduce which rotations and abilities perform better. But most of the time it just sits there unused.
Note: GS doesn't distinguish between PvP and PvE gear, which makes it questionable to quantify other PVE players on the fly.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk