I have roll my eyes at the "It's game breaking. I'm not going to play" people.
But so don't I at the people that have to argue against something as simple and harmless as jumping..
This is Final Fantasy I.
Maybe a little change is a good thing?
MIght even be therapeutic. Try it. You might be surprised.
Okay.. look at the image above.
Image a JUMP command just below the RUN.
Now imagine taking your cloudy-icon-cursor-thingy and tapping over to JUMP (Note: You might wan't to keep hitting the DOWN cursor. I'm not sure the cursor could go to right or left back then).
Imagine your pointy hat Wizard Avatar jiggling a little bit on the screen!
..and LICH's turn.
See? Was that so painful? Change can be a good thing.
..just like cursors that can go right and left, or even wrap back to the first item when you are at the bottom of a list.
EDIT: I see now that the "cloudy-icon-thing" is actually a mickey-mouse-stylized hand.. and shadow.
We need to start thinking of MMO's as we do music or literature or the movies. There is not one MMO or one game that will be universally satisfactory to everyone's taste. MMO's don't come in one genre just as books or music doesn't come in one genre. Change and innovation is a good thing in the MMO industry just as it is in literature and music, but every MMO doesn't need to push the envelope or be cutting edge to be "good" or fun. It just needs to be good. The same is true for music. The same is true for books or for movies. Music evolves. MMO's evolve. Storytelling evolves. And in doing so, it doesn't make obsolete or not enjoyable everything that's been done before.
Oh I'm sure you know better than them. We all do, always. Developers always mess things up, we players have to just tolerate it. If we were given enough money and manpower, we'd create a perfect MMO from the scratch. Poor developers just don't get it.
Was this purposely direected at no one in particular because no one in particular made the claims that you're satirizing with thinly-veiled contempt and pretension?
Was this purposely direected at no one in particular because no one in particular made the claims that you're satirizing with thinly-veiled contempt and pretension?
I found your comment funny, that's all. "At least they think they know better than us", haha
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Was this purposely direected at no one in particular because no one in particular made the claims that you're satirizing with thinly-veiled contempt and pretension?
I found your comment funny, that's all. "At least they think they know better than us", haha
Then you must have missed the part in one of my previous posts where I clearly said, " I realize that developers often know best about their games... more often than not. I also realize that if a gaming company catered to every whim of their player base the games would be completely terrible."
You're vocal, no doubt, although It might behoove you to read and at least attempt to understand the opinions of those that you are so quick to refute. Otherwise you look uninformed and selectively active in the conversation. I've read a lot of your posts on these boards. I agree with a lot of your ideas and enjoy many of the posts. Sadly however, a sizable portion of them only serve to convey your sanctimoniousness and grandiose delusions.
Then you must have missed the part in one of my previous posts where I clearly said, " I realize that developers often know best about their games... more often than not. I also realize that if a gaming company catered to every whim of their player base the games would be completely terrible."
You're vocal, no doubt, although It might behoove you to read and at least attempt to understand the opinions of those that you are so quick to refute. Otherwise you look uninformed and selectively active in the conversation. I've read a lot of your posts on these boards. I agree with a lot of your ideas and enjoy many of the posts. Sadly however, a sizable portion of them only serve to convey your sanctimoniousness and grandiose delusions.
I sure did. I took your post for what it was, don't blame me for that. Thanks for pointing that quote out nonetheless.
No need for such hostility really, lol.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Hiromichi Tanaka laughing as he answers this question:
The main reason is because we don't think its important to have the functions in the game, we don't need to have the functions in the game. So even if you jump around and nothing is gonna happen anyway{....last part is garbled cause the guy is laughing....post what else is said if you can understand it!}
Yay, another chapter closed in all the whining why there isn't a jump feature, and that many of us FFXI vets already tried to explain, "because there is no damned reason or need to jump from the way its designed"
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
What can I say, I like to jump.. I hate invisible walls in open worlds, and I saw them in some of the E3 videos. Same as in XI, 2 inch tall rock, gotta go around.. That was the reason I could never go back to XI after trying some newer games. The controls and the closed feeling of the open world. As petty as it is, it may be a show stopper for me. I know for a fact that it will eventually drive me crazy, just like it did each time I tried to come back to XI.
Oh and to the guy who screamed about people never jumping in combat situations.. Ever heard of Martial Arts? Watch a black belt fight, then tell me there's no jumping in combat..
"If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford
Both sides have played the card now, what could come out of this standoff?!
I'm voting for realism rearing up and slapping both sides.
If no jumping is a deal-breaker for you then this isn't your game.
If you don't care about jumping then this 'may' be your game.
If you prefer no jumping then this is probably your game.
If you want to debate the general benefits of jumping vs. no jumping I believe the general forum is a better place for that conversation. Like it or not, it appears the developers sided with the 'no jumping' camp, making the conversation moot in this forum.
If you want to debate the general benefits of jumping vs. no jumping I believe the general forum is a better place for that conversation. Like it or not, it appears the developers sided with the 'no jumping' camp, making the conversation moot in this forum.
I'd say let them speak about it for all they want. If the greatest debates concerning this game circle around Jumping, (lack of) Character Customization and sloppy controls, then that's cool. Could be worse.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Hiromichi Tanaka laughing as he answers this question:
The main reason is because we don't think its important to have the functions in the game, we don't need to have the functions in the game. So even if you jump around and nothing is gonna happen anyway{....last part is garbled cause the guy is laughing....post what else is said if you can understand it!}
Yay, another chapter closed in all the whining why there isn't a jump feature, and that many of us FFXI vets already tried to explain, "because there is no damned reason or need to jump from the way its designed"
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
I go hiking and cave diving and camping all the time. The highest I can jump WITHOUT carrying anything is about one or two feet. How high do you think you can jump wearing armor carrying a sword, and having a back pack full of loot?
Hiromichi Tanaka laughing as he answers this question:
The main reason is because we don't think its important to have the functions in the game, we don't need to have the functions in the game. So even if you jump around and nothing is gonna happen anyway{....last part is garbled cause the guy is laughing....post what else is said if you can understand it!}
Yay, another chapter closed in all the whining why there isn't a jump feature, and that many of us FFXI vets already tried to explain, "because there is no damned reason or need to jump from the way its designed"
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
I go hiking and cave diving and camping all the time. The highest I can jump WITHOUT carrying anything is about one or two feet. How high do you think you can jump wearing armor carrying a sword, and having a back pack full of loot?
Try not at all.
Realisim.
Well, high ehough to clear a 2 inch tall rock..
And you should definitely be able to hop off a 1 or 2 foot ledge to the solid ground below, rather than be forced to follow some zig-zag path 20 feet to the left, then 20 feet to the right, just to traverse a hill or something..
For me it's a double issue, because the way they implemented no jumping involves invisible walls, which in turn force you to take specific paths through parts of an open world.
"If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford
Hiromichi Tanaka laughing as he answers this question:
The main reason is because we don't think its important to have the functions in the game, we don't need to have the functions in the game. So even if you jump around and nothing is gonna happen anyway{....last part is garbled cause the guy is laughing....post what else is said if you can understand it!}
Yay, another chapter closed in all the whining why there isn't a jump feature, and that many of us FFXI vets already tried to explain, "because there is no damned reason or need to jump from the way its designed"
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
I go hiking and cave diving and camping all the time. The highest I can jump WITHOUT carrying anything is about one or two feet. How high do you think you can jump wearing armor carrying a sword, and having a back pack full of loot?
Try not at all.
Realisim.
Well, high ehough to clear a 2 inch tall rock..
And you should definitely be able to hop off a 1 or 2 foot ledge to the solid ground below, rather than be forced to follow some zig-zag path 20 feet to the left, then 20 feet to the right, just to traverse a hill or something..
For me it's a double issue, because the way they implemented no jumping involves invisible walls, which in turn force you to take specific paths through parts of an open world.
They show them in beta / apha footage climing up inclines that look bigger than 2 inches of rock.
Edit: They also show them "falling" off a steep decline. If you watch the alpha / beta footage on ffxivcore perhaps your fears will be washed away.
In one of the videos it even show them in a cave going over very rocky terrain and even going down into a ravine that looks like they can't get out of it because of how far down they go, they had to teleport out when they completed the quest.
XI allowed you to drop down as long as the fall was "realistic" as in you wouldn't hurt yourself doing so. You see this in the beta but some tweaks need be made, from my limited Alpha testing experience. Sometimes you can't fall off a two feet ledge, sometimes you can, so these are things that will be ironed out during the Beta.
I assume the area is perfect for testing purposes due to great height differences, which is why SE chose to conduct the testing in that area specifically. There's lots of movement glitches that testers can notice during gameplay there.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
XI allowed you to drop down as long as the fall was "realistic" as in you wouldn't hurt yourself doing so. You see this in the beta but some tweaks need be made, from my limited Alpha testing experience. Sometimes you can't fall off a two feet ledge, sometimes you can, so these are things that will be ironed out during the Beta.
I assume the area is perfect for testing purposes due to great height differences, which is why SE chose to conduct the testing in that area specifically. There's lots of movement glitches that testers can notice during gameplay there.
Agreed, like Quicksand Caves, thats what the recent beta video of killin the large crabs reminded me of.
They design their areas with the lack of jumping in mind, making it so you can get places they intend be it up hill or down.
Hiromichi Tanaka laughing as he answers this question:
The main reason is because we don't think its important to have the functions in the game, we don't need to have the functions in the game. So even if you jump around and nothing is gonna happen anyway{....last part is garbled cause the guy is laughing....post what else is said if you can understand it!}
Yay, another chapter closed in all the whining why there isn't a jump feature, and that many of us FFXI vets already tried to explain, "because there is no damned reason or need to jump from the way its designed"
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
I go hiking and cave diving and camping all the time. The highest I can jump WITHOUT carrying anything is about one or two feet. How high do you think you can jump wearing armor carrying a sword, and having a back pack full of loot?
Try not at all.
Realisim.
Well, high ehough to clear a 2 inch tall rock..
And you should definitely be able to hop off a 1 or 2 foot ledge to the solid ground below, rather than be forced to follow some zig-zag path 20 feet to the left, then 20 feet to the right, just to traverse a hill or something..
For me it's a double issue, because the way they implemented no jumping involves invisible walls, which in turn force you to take specific paths through parts of an open world.
They show them in beta / apha footage climing up inclines that look bigger than 2 inches of rock.
Edit: They also show them "falling" off a steep decline. If you watch the alpha / beta footage on ffxivcore perhaps your fears will be washed away.
In one of the videos it even show them in a cave going over very rocky terrain and even going down into a ravine that looks like they can't get out of it because of how far down they go, they had to teleport out when they completed the quest.
I'll have to watch them again, cause I got the impression of some very directed movement in some areas..
Like Hyanmen said though, if this is the biggest gripe for the game sofar, that's awesome!
Unfortunately, for me, it is one of those kinda pet peave things, that will eventaully get under my skin.. >.<
"If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford
Honestly now that I think about it, jumping wouldn't be what they would implement to 'fix' it.
I'd say climbing sounds more likely, if they ever choose to do something about it. Or raising your leg to step over something (I always do this at work- I don't actually "jump" when I come across a tall object, lol).
And when you fall down a ledge, you wouldn't "jump" down the ledge either, since that would only make the impact worse. You'd most likely take a sitting pose and fall down instead.
Not to mention when you actually jump forward irl, how high do you actually get? With normal jump, maybe 20cm? That's not quite helpful.. while not moving you can get higher, but that would be pointless.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Honestly now that I think about it, jumping wouldn't be what they would implement to 'fix' it.
I'd say climbing sounds more likely, if they ever choose to do something about it. Or raising your leg to step over something (I always do this at work- I don't actually "jump" when I come across a tall object, lol).
And when you fall down a ledge, you wouldn't "jump" down the ledge either, since that would only make the impact worse. You'd most likely take a sitting pose and fall down instead.
Not to mention when you actually jump forward irl, how high do you actually get? With normal jump, maybe 20cm? That's not quite helpful.. while not moving you can get higher, but that would be pointless.
I agree those animations would make more sense for most activities. The highest I generally jump on a semi-regular basis is to the second step of a flight of stairs because im in a hurry. Also yeah if im falling off a ledge im shortening the drop as much as possible. Though I guess some of this would change if being say chased by a monster, but really even then unless there is something faster than me but can't jump as high as me i don't really see the point of jumping for that either. Speed has to do with power and so does jumping. If a wolf(something faster and able to jump higher than most of us) lets say is chasing you jumping isn't going to help you get away. Climbing a tree could though.
Also, yeah, the wearing armor argument holds pretty well for jumping. I'm by no means Adrian Peterson or Lebron James when it comes to athletic ability, but I'm no fat slob either. I can have about a 30 inch vertical, but I know if I am carrying say 275 lbs, it is about 0-6 inches tops. That is unawkward weight as well.
Needless to say I'm fine with no jumping. I don't see how it could be a game breaker either way, but there are a lot of these arguments around these forums going on I don't get.
Hiromichi Tanaka laughing as he answers this question:
The main reason is because we don't think its important to have the functions in the game, we don't need to have the functions in the game. So even if you jump around and nothing is gonna happen anyway{....last part is garbled cause the guy is laughing....post what else is said if you can understand it!}
Yay, another chapter closed in all the whining why there isn't a jump feature, and that many of us FFXI vets already tried to explain, "because there is no damned reason or need to jump from the way its designed"
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
I go hiking and cave diving and camping all the time. The highest I can jump WITHOUT carrying anything is about one or two feet. How high do you think you can jump wearing armor carrying a sword, and having a back pack full of loot?
Try not at all.
Realisim.
I have been hiking and camping quit a bit actually, even before I was in the marines so I understand being able to jump with or without a pack and gear on. Historically also during the middle ages, a common misconception was that armor was heavy because there is a story about one knight who could jump his own height in a full suit of armor. Is it easy? of course not, but we don't live on jupiter where gravity doesn't allow for jumping in the least.
That's the only application where it would indeed make sense to jump. It really helps more when you are faced with horizontal obstacles, not so much for vertical ones.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
I have a question. Is this game even built around a true Z-axis? If it's not then jumping is pointless and there are many other things that come with a game with true Z-axis than typical jumping.
The game doesnt need a jump feature becouse the server can't handle the jumps, that means the server doesnt have a Y axis it only works with w and z axis. wich means even if teh scenery is 3D, the calculations are only 2D like in a map. Thats smart, the server makes the calculations faster with only 2 axis instead of 3.
If they only had a completely flat world that would be the case, if it has hills and valley's they still need a y axis location.
Comments
I have roll my eyes at the "It's game breaking. I'm not going to play" people.
But so don't I at the people that have to argue against something as simple and harmless as jumping..
This is Final Fantasy I.
Maybe a little change is a good thing?
MIght even be therapeutic. Try it. You might be surprised.
Okay.. look at the image above.
Image a JUMP command just below the RUN.
Now imagine taking your cloudy-icon-cursor-thingy and tapping over to JUMP (Note: You might wan't to keep hitting the DOWN cursor. I'm not sure the cursor could go to right or left back then).
Imagine your pointy hat Wizard Avatar jiggling a little bit on the screen!
..and LICH's turn.
See? Was that so painful? Change can be a good thing.
..just like cursors that can go right and left, or even wrap back to the first item when you are at the bottom of a list.
EDIT: I see now that the "cloudy-icon-thing" is actually a mickey-mouse-stylized hand.. and shadow.
Was this purposely direected at no one in particular because no one in particular made the claims that you're satirizing with thinly-veiled contempt and pretension?
I found your comment funny, that's all. "At least they think they know better than us", haha
Then you must have missed the part in one of my previous posts where I clearly said, " I realize that developers often know best about their games... more often than not. I also realize that if a gaming company catered to every whim of their player base the games would be completely terrible."
You're vocal, no doubt, although It might behoove you to read and at least attempt to understand the opinions of those that you are so quick to refute. Otherwise you look uninformed and selectively active in the conversation. I've read a lot of your posts on these boards. I agree with a lot of your ideas and enjoy many of the posts. Sadly however, a sizable portion of them only serve to convey your sanctimoniousness and grandiose delusions.
I sure did. I took your post for what it was, don't blame me for that. Thanks for pointing that quote out nonetheless.
No need for such hostility really, lol.
The reason jumping is wanted I think for those like myself is the little known thing called realism. Immersion also has an influence on the topic because in what reality is the gravity so strong that you can't jump? I look at it as lazy design work by the devs by not adding something so simple as being able to jump, whether it has a benefit or not. Just gives me one more reason why I won't be playing yet another asian grindfest mmo.
Oh snap, realism was said!
Both sides have played the card now, what could come out of this standoff?!
What can I say, I like to jump.. I hate invisible walls in open worlds, and I saw them in some of the E3 videos. Same as in XI, 2 inch tall rock, gotta go around.. That was the reason I could never go back to XI after trying some newer games. The controls and the closed feeling of the open world. As petty as it is, it may be a show stopper for me. I know for a fact that it will eventually drive me crazy, just like it did each time I tried to come back to XI.
Oh and to the guy who screamed about people never jumping in combat situations.. Ever heard of Martial Arts? Watch a black belt fight, then tell me there's no jumping in combat..
"If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford
I'm voting for realism rearing up and slapping both sides.
If no jumping is a deal-breaker for you then this isn't your game.
If you don't care about jumping then this 'may' be your game.
If you prefer no jumping then this is probably your game.
If you want to debate the general benefits of jumping vs. no jumping I believe the general forum is a better place for that conversation. Like it or not, it appears the developers sided with the 'no jumping' camp, making the conversation moot in this forum.
I'd say let them speak about it for all they want. If the greatest debates concerning this game circle around Jumping, (lack of) Character Customization and sloppy controls, then that's cool. Could be worse.
I go hiking and cave diving and camping all the time. The highest I can jump WITHOUT carrying anything is about one or two feet. How high do you think you can jump wearing armor carrying a sword, and having a back pack full of loot?
Try not at all.
Realisim.
Well, high ehough to clear a 2 inch tall rock..
And you should definitely be able to hop off a 1 or 2 foot ledge to the solid ground below, rather than be forced to follow some zig-zag path 20 feet to the left, then 20 feet to the right, just to traverse a hill or something..
For me it's a double issue, because the way they implemented no jumping involves invisible walls, which in turn force you to take specific paths through parts of an open world.
"If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford
They show them in beta / apha footage climing up inclines that look bigger than 2 inches of rock.
Edit: They also show them "falling" off a steep decline. If you watch the alpha / beta footage on ffxivcore perhaps your fears will be washed away.
In one of the videos it even show them in a cave going over very rocky terrain and even going down into a ravine that looks like they can't get out of it because of how far down they go, they had to teleport out when they completed the quest.
XI allowed you to drop down as long as the fall was "realistic" as in you wouldn't hurt yourself doing so. You see this in the beta but some tweaks need be made, from my limited Alpha testing experience. Sometimes you can't fall off a two feet ledge, sometimes you can, so these are things that will be ironed out during the Beta.
I assume the area is perfect for testing purposes due to great height differences, which is why SE chose to conduct the testing in that area specifically. There's lots of movement glitches that testers can notice during gameplay there.
Agreed, like Quicksand Caves, thats what the recent beta video of killin the large crabs reminded me of.
They design their areas with the lack of jumping in mind, making it so you can get places they intend be it up hill or down.
I'll have to watch them again, cause I got the impression of some very directed movement in some areas..
Like Hyanmen said though, if this is the biggest gripe for the game sofar, that's awesome!
Unfortunately, for me, it is one of those kinda pet peave things, that will eventaully get under my skin.. >.<
"If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said a faster horse." - Henry Ford
Honestly now that I think about it, jumping wouldn't be what they would implement to 'fix' it.
I'd say climbing sounds more likely, if they ever choose to do something about it. Or raising your leg to step over something (I always do this at work- I don't actually "jump" when I come across a tall object, lol).
And when you fall down a ledge, you wouldn't "jump" down the ledge either, since that would only make the impact worse. You'd most likely take a sitting pose and fall down instead.
Not to mention when you actually jump forward irl, how high do you actually get? With normal jump, maybe 20cm? That's not quite helpful.. while not moving you can get higher, but that would be pointless.
lol
I agree those animations would make more sense for most activities. The highest I generally jump on a semi-regular basis is to the second step of a flight of stairs because im in a hurry. Also yeah if im falling off a ledge im shortening the drop as much as possible. Though I guess some of this would change if being say chased by a monster, but really even then unless there is something faster than me but can't jump as high as me i don't really see the point of jumping for that either. Speed has to do with power and so does jumping. If a wolf(something faster and able to jump higher than most of us) lets say is chasing you jumping isn't going to help you get away. Climbing a tree could though.
Also, yeah, the wearing armor argument holds pretty well for jumping. I'm by no means Adrian Peterson or Lebron James when it comes to athletic ability, but I'm no fat slob either. I can have about a 30 inch vertical, but I know if I am carrying say 275 lbs, it is about 0-6 inches tops. That is unawkward weight as well.
Needless to say I'm fine with no jumping. I don't see how it could be a game breaker either way, but there are a lot of these arguments around these forums going on I don't get.
I have been hiking and camping quit a bit actually, even before I was in the marines so I understand being able to jump with or without a pack and gear on. Historically also during the middle ages, a common misconception was that armor was heavy because there is a story about one knight who could jump his own height in a full suit of armor. Is it easy? of course not, but we don't live on jupiter where gravity doesn't allow for jumping in the least.
Did you know that Eorzea is actually in Jupiter?
Do you not need to jump to try to cross a precipice?
That's the only application where it would indeed make sense to jump. It really helps more when you are faced with horizontal obstacles, not so much for vertical ones.
I have a question. Is this game even built around a true Z-axis? If it's not then jumping is pointless and there are many other things that come with a game with true Z-axis than typical jumping.
If they only had a completely flat world that would be the case, if it has hills and valley's they still need a y axis location.