Technically this is a good thing for players that have higher level toons. The new players will have to spend cash to get access to many of the lvl 20+ quests, but if you had hit lvl 50+ and own the expansions, you get all the content in those expansions for free. Really, this is a good deal because ALL players get access to the new classes as well, something that was introduced in MoM. So everyone gets some content and game improvements from each of the expansions, but Turbine is drawing the line with quests - you have to pay. Makes sense to me, and of course it makes business sense too.
Okay, here's the breakdown of the points for SoA quest costs, if you buy all of them.
There are 9 quest packs in all. Trollshaws, Forochel, Lone-lands, Misty Mountains, North Downs, Angmar, Endewaith, Eregion, and Evendim.
The total cost of all the quest packs is 5,610 TP as of about 5 minutes ago.
Right now you can buy 6,900 points for $49.99. So you can buy all the quest packs for $49.99 and you end up with an extra 1,290 points to spend on other things. The bonus points for the $49.99 packs is only a limited time thing. The normal amount of points that will buy you is 3,800. So right now, for about 3 months sub time you can get all the SoA quests 18-50, and even some for level 65.
insanex
That's cool, but since Monster Play, unlimited CS, unlimited gold, 5+ character slots are only available for subscribing and lifetime players, I still decided to sub for another 6 monhts. Mind you, I still have my founder's option of 9,99 a month.
Each to their own - for me, a price of 1 single junk food meal is worth playing Lotro a month. I could even lose some weight
Edit: I have to add, I already own Moria, Mirkwood, and have 8 toons, 5 of them between 35 and 60
I know I should have had the lifetimer option (still available btw for 299/199 USD) a long ago, but heck, that's life.
DB
I was under the impression that the gold and char slot cap was purchasable...
Okay, here's the breakdown of the points for SoA quest costs, if you buy all of them.
There are 9 quest packs in all. Trollshaws, Forochel, Lone-lands, Misty Mountains, North Downs, Angmar, Endewaith, Eregion, and Evendim.
The total cost of all the quest packs is 5,610 TP as of about 5 minutes ago.
Right now you can buy 6,900 points for $49.99. So you can buy all the quest packs for $49.99 and you end up with an extra 1,290 points to spend on other things. The bonus points for the $49.99 packs is only a limited time thing. The normal amount of points that will buy you is 3,800. So right now, for about 3 months sub time you can get all the SoA quests 18-50, and even some for level 65.
insanex
That's cool, but since Monster Play, unlimited CS, unlimited gold, 5+ character slots are only available for subscribing and lifetime players, I still decided to sub for another 6 monhts. Mind you, I still have my founder's option of 9,99 a month.
Each to their own - for me, a price of 1 single junk food meal is worth playing Lotro a month. I could even lose some weight
Edit: I have to add, I already own Moria, Mirkwood, and have 8 toons, 5 of them between 35 and 60
I know I should have had the lifetimer option (still available btw for 299/199 USD) a long ago, but heck, that's life.
DB
I was under the impression that the gold and char slot cap was purchasable...
Let me get this straight, you heard the term "Free to Play" and you took it to literally mean the you would be able to log in, play the game, and all of its content, without ever having to pay one red cent?
If you log in, play the game, even if its only to level 20, and haven't payed any money, guess what you've just done?
Wait for it.....
Wait....
You've played for free!!
Now, please go away, and let those of us who understand that Turbine is running a buisness, not a charity, discuss the game.
Let me get this straight, you heard the term "Free to Play" and you took it to literally mean the you would be able to log in, play the game, and all of its content, without ever having to pay one red cent?
If you log in, play the game, even if its only to level 20, and haven't payed any money, guess what you've just done?
Wait for it.....
Wait....
You've played for free!!
Now, please go away, and let those of us who understand that Turbine is running a buisness, not a charity, discuss the game.
you dodn't play the game, you played parts of the game.
Let me get this straight, you heard the term "Free to Play" and you took it to literally mean the you would be able to log in, play the game, and all of its content, without ever having to pay one red cent?
If you log in, play the game, even if its only to level 20, and haven't payed any money, guess what you've just done?
Wait for it.....
Wait....
You've played for free!!
Now, please go away, and let those of us who understand that Turbine is running a buisness, not a charity, discuss the game.
you dodn't play the game, you played parts of the game.
I like the idea, I can play until I decide I'm bored or it's worth the investment of some real cash, without having to buy it and spend money then be disapointed. I've played most of the day on LOTR it's not too bad but I don't think I'd get my credit card out just yet. Why complain about it? Nothing is free in this world, real or virtual.
So you thought that everything that before cost $15/month to access would now be given to you free?
There is alot of information how the buisness model works so it shouldnt come as a surprise.
SInce you already have MoM/SoM you can play thoose areas without paying monthly. The SoA contetn you have not payed for before so if you want to level alts you either becoma VIP or buy some quests packs with Tp (or grind for them)
It's funny how people get upset when they are given something because they think they shold get even more..
If I am paying 15 a month, I want it alll. I just cancelled everything. It is BS.
I get everything in other games with a full subscription, why not this one. What makes this game so special to ask for more? NOTHING....bye bye turbine........... KMA
hey if they advertise the game as F2p then the game should be F2p not the parts that take a week to play.
because after a week you log in your F2p game and find it no longer F2P. And it's still advertised as F2P.
isn't that...lying?
So, by your analogy, if I am driving with my car all around the landscape, but don't enter pay to use highways, then I am not driving at all? Cause this is exactly what you're saying (hence the facepalm).
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.
hey if they advertise the game as F2p then the game should be F2p not the parts that take a week to play.
because after a week you log in your F2p game and find it no longer F2P. And it's still advertised as F2P.
isn't that...lying?
Okay, once more...
I challenge you to show me one single solitary peice of information put forth by Turbine wherein they stated that you would get unlimited, unrestricted access to the game for free. Go ahead, I'll wait.
When the sites come back up, have a gander at my link (assuming it's not broken) there you will see a detailed breakdown of exactly what Turbine if offering.
You're claiming you were lied to, when the reality is you never understood what you were being told in the first place. Stop blaming Turbine for your failure to fully understand something, it's not like they didn't explain it (see link).
So you thought that everything that before cost $15/month to access would now be given to you free?
There is alot of information how the buisness model works so it shouldnt come as a surprise.
SInce you already have MoM/SoM you can play thoose areas without paying monthly. The SoA contetn you have not payed for before so if you want to level alts you either becoma VIP or buy some quests packs with Tp (or grind for them)
It's funny how people get upset when they are given something because they think they shold get even more..
If I am paying 15 a month, I want it alll. I just cancelled everything. It is BS.
I get everything in other games with a full subscription, why not this one. What makes this game so special to ask for more? NOTHING....bye bye turbine........... KMA
What is the confusion? You can log into game for free. You get free trial. The rest will cost you.
Quests will cost you. Fine - GW did it, DDO did it. Except both did it much better, because the quests were truly optional, you could chose to buy some and skip some. LOTRO sells quests by level bands and there are no real choices - it is pay for a given pack or grind for ten levels.
Also - and this is my gripe - character development will cost you too. Want slot more "talents" than in free trial - pay. Pay per character per slot. Want a mount? Pay. Other F2Ps sell mounts, LOTRO sells both mounts and the actual ability to ride mounts. Again, per character basis. Want to post just one single auction? Pay. Per character. No account wide unlocks as in DDO. No in game means to unlock say bag space as in DDO.
Yes, you can get turbine points as free player. 5 cents at a time. Most of it is for grinding mobs and you have to stay at one spot. Want more points? Grind more. In DDO you get points for completing actual creative quests, the more difficult one the more gain, here it is for boring mindless grind.
This is not DDO, this is hardly F2P. It is nice trial and a fine sub game. But not F2P. It is not free and shop does not give you any real options.
Edit: And yes, it is EQ but without SOE expertise or Blizzard polish - and less free with more lag and less customer support and worse combat mechanics than RoM or Allods.
I don't agree with the OP really as this topic screams drama, but what isn't clear to me is how many Turbine Points - if any - are being given to former subscribers who played "X" months ago.
If someone had subscribed for two years early in the game's release, I do think they should be rewarded with the applicable amount of Turbine Points (whatever that is). This way they have points to "re-purchase" quest packs/perks that they would have essentially paid for over time already.
This is a tough balance though, as at some point the past subscribers will run out of points and be forced to reinvest into the game to play. Given that they once paid a monthly fee for the same access, I don't see that ad-hoc purchasing being a problem. IF they want to go through content quickly and that might add up to more than $15/month; why not just re-subscribe again?
So if you didn't wish to pay the sub before, you couldn't play the game.
If you wished to play the game before, you paid a sub. And you paid for MoM/SoM. And you still paid a sub. And when you stopped paying for that sub, you couldn't play.
Now you can play the game (some of it at least), for free. Could you do that before?
Am I missing something? Am I a Ruhtard all of a sudden? This makes me shake my head just like when I heard about someone tripping over a speed bump and sueing. And then winning the case. But them only awarding $800,000 because it was 20% her fault.....
You don't have to pay one single cent only invest huge amount of time if you want it all free.
You can complete deeds shit loads of deeds to earn Tpoints to buy quest packs or whatever you want to buy, so yeah its all free if you really want to undertake the huge grinding.
Why do you care so much for the subscribers? For them changed a little (except the horrible lag those days). Now they can log in if they do not sub but if they want to play like humans they re-sub just like before. And subbing is the bargain choice.
The title concerns another topic - that this is hardly F2P game no matter how you cut it, this is just crippled P2P. Other F2Ps have some aspects free and some purchased, in LOTRO the only free thing is two day trial and a place at the tail of login queue. It may be better model than free EQ2 but not better enough to make a difference.
Originally posted by Torgrim You don't have to pay one single cent only invest huge amount of time if you want it all free.
You can complete deeds shit loads of deeds to earn Tpoints to buy quest packs or whatever you want to buy, so yeah its all free if you really want to undertake the huge grinding.
The thing is, the Deeds reward you with other things than T-points so you would want to complete them anyway.
I am curious how this will turn out. F2P model is 'new' and it is exciting to watch all the changes that will come in the future.
Let me get this straight, you heard the term "Free to Play" and you took it to literally mean the you would be able to log in, play the game, and all of its content, without ever having to pay one red cent?
If you log in, play the game, even if its only to level 20, and haven't payed any money, guess what you've just done?
Wait for it.....
Wait....
You've played for free!!
Now, please go away, and let those of us who understand that Turbine is running a buisness, not a charity, discuss the game.
you dodn't play the game, you played parts of the game.
so the game isn't free to play, parts of it are.
So if I kicked you in the privates, I haven't actually kicked YOU? That is comforting to know. If a birthday party host asks you if you liked cake, you would complain upon receiving only a slice? Just as metaphores, of course...
The game IS free to play. You CAN play the game for free. Even if you extend the meaning of "game" to encompass the game in its entirety, you can STILL play the game for free. Surely, if you wish to extend the meaning of "game" to "the entire game", it is a legitimate move to extend the meaning of "free" to "free, as long as you put some effort in to grind the points"? You either allow for a broad semantic perspective, in which case "game" means "entire game" and "free" means "ultimately free", or you do not, in which case "play the game for free" just relates to the activity of playing the game and "free" means "you don't have to pay anything or put in any considerable effort", and then I could STILL argue that any considerable effort spent on a leisure activity counts as "free", because it does not cost you any money at all. Any other interpretation of the phrase "play the game for free" is a case of applying double standards.
On a sidenote, as far as the technicalities of the word "play" are concerned (which is part of the issue here), there exists no telic reading of that verb. This means there is no 'goal' reading whereupon the activity is concluded because it has been completed. Compare the verb "to exit", which is completed and therefore concluded the moment it is executed fully; once one exits a building, one is no longer in the process of exiting the building. Once one plays a game, however, one is still in the process of playing it after one has played the game, unless one stops playing. Conversely, one cannot 'stop' exiting a building. This is important, because this means the phrase "play for free" does nowhere imply that, in order to play, one needs to be able to play the entire game, as there is no sense of 'goal', completion, or conclusion inherent to the verb "to play".
Bottom line: feel free to argue semantics, but at least have some idea of what semantics are.
It is as if everyone is Juliust Caesar and Turbine are the Republic Senate. Turbine tradegically and merciless stabbed each player in the back killing them dead.
Think of it this way everyone, when you go to a Cost-Co or Sam's Club or any other similar place. They have a free sample of a new brand of cookies, you try one, you love it. Now you only get one cookie one "Free" cookie. Same concept here, they let you play the game for free, but they let you play it as LOOOONG as you want.
THE COOKIES
Pros: Free sample cookie - One Cookie
Cons: You only get one cookie.
THE LORD OF THE RINGS ONLINE
Pros: You get to play Lord of the Rings Online to level 20, possible level 50 (as long as you want)
Cons: Content is locked and thus getting to certian levels may be difficult.
Let me get this straight, you heard the term "Free to Play" and you took it to literally mean the you would be able to log in, play the game, and all of its content, without ever having to pay one red cent?
If you log in, play the game, even if its only to level 20, and haven't payed any money, guess what you've just done?
Wait for it.....
Wait....
You've played for free!!
Now, please go away, and let those of us who understand that Turbine is running a buisness, not a charity, discuss the game.
you dodn't play the game, you played parts of the game.
so the game isn't free to play, parts of it are.
So if I kicked you in the privates, I haven't actually kicked YOU? That is comforting to know. If a birthday party host asks you if you liked cake, you would complain upon receiving only a slice? Just as metaphores, of course...
The game IS free to play. You CAN play the game for free. Even if you extend the meaning of "game" to encompass the game in its entirety, you can STILL play the game for free. Surely, if you wish to extend the meaning of "game" to "the entire game", it is a legitimate move to extend the meaning of "free" to "free, as long as you put some effort in to grind the points"? You either allow for a broad semantic perspective, in which case "game" means "entire game" and "free" means "ultimately free", or you do not, in which case "play the game for free" just relates to the activity of playing the game and "free" means "you don't have to pay anything or put in any considerable effort", and then I could STILL argue that any considerable effort spent on a leisure activity counts as "free", because it does not cost you any money at all. Any other interpretation of the phrase "play the game for free" is a case of applying double standards.
On a sidenote, as far as the technicalities of the word "play" are concerned (which is part of the issue here), there exists no telic reading of that verb. This means there is no 'goal' reading whereupon the activity is concluded because it has been completed. Compare the verb "to exit", which is completed and therefore concluded the moment it is executed fully; once one exits a building, one is no longer in the process of exiting the building. Once one plays a game, however, one is still in the process of playing it after one has played the game, unless one stops playing. Conversely, one cannot 'stop' exiting a building. This is important, because this means the phrase "play for free" does nowhere imply that, in order to play, one needs to be able to play the entire game, as there is no sense of 'goal', completion, or conclusion inherent to the verb "to play".
Bottom line: feel free to argue semantics, but at least have some idea of what semantics are.
Priceless thank you, kind sir!
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.
Comments
Technically this is a good thing for players that have higher level toons. The new players will have to spend cash to get access to many of the lvl 20+ quests, but if you had hit lvl 50+ and own the expansions, you get all the content in those expansions for free. Really, this is a good deal because ALL players get access to the new classes as well, something that was introduced in MoM. So everyone gets some content and game improvements from each of the expansions, but Turbine is drawing the line with quests - you have to pay. Makes sense to me, and of course it makes business sense too.
insanex
I was under the impression that the gold and char slot cap was purchasable...
insanex
They are.
Let me get this straight, you heard the term "Free to Play" and you took it to literally mean the you would be able to log in, play the game, and all of its content, without ever having to pay one red cent?
If you log in, play the game, even if its only to level 20, and haven't payed any money, guess what you've just done?
Wait for it.....
Wait....
You've played for free!!
Now, please go away, and let those of us who understand that Turbine is running a buisness, not a charity, discuss the game.
*Facepalm*
....Really?
Wow.
Read it again, you'll get there.
They have to make their money of course.
I like the idea, I can play until I decide I'm bored or it's worth the investment of some real cash, without having to buy it and spend money then be disapointed. I've played most of the day on LOTR it's not too bad but I don't think I'd get my credit card out just yet. Why complain about it? Nothing is free in this world, real or virtual.
If I am paying 15 a month, I want it alll. I just cancelled everything. It is BS.
I get everything in other games with a full subscription, why not this one. What makes this game so special to ask for more? NOTHING....bye bye turbine........... KMA
So, by your analogy, if I am driving with my car all around the landscape, but don't enter pay to use highways, then I am not driving at all? Cause this is exactly what you're saying
(hence the facepalm).
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.
Okay, once more...
I challenge you to show me one single solitary peice of information put forth by Turbine wherein they stated that you would get unlimited, unrestricted access to the game for free. Go ahead, I'll wait.
http://www.lotro.com/betasignup/vipchart.html
When the sites come back up, have a gander at my link (assuming it's not broken) there you will see a detailed breakdown of exactly what Turbine if offering.
You're claiming you were lied to, when the reality is you never understood what you were being told in the first place. Stop blaming Turbine for your failure to fully understand something, it's not like they didn't explain it (see link).
Having an opinion is not wrong.
Stating that opinion for others, is not wrong.
Continuing to try to defend that opinion, when it has been shown that it is incorrect?
Well...
Am I missing something in this thread?
--Can you play level 1-50 for free? Yes
--Can you get ALL of the quest packs for free? Yes
--Can you get Mines of Moria for free and get to level 60 for free? Yes
--Can you get Mirkwood and get to level 65 for free? Yes
--Can you get stuff from the LOTRO Store for free? Yes
--Can you get rested XP and Monster Play for free? No, that is currently the ONLY things you cannot get for free.
What's the point of this thread again....?
You do get it all if you are a VIP memebr...
March on! - Lets Invade Pekopon
who cares just be glad you have another world to play EQ in.
Evil will always triumph because good is dumb....
What is the confusion? You can log into game for free. You get free trial. The rest will cost you.
Quests will cost you. Fine - GW did it, DDO did it. Except both did it much better, because the quests were truly optional, you could chose to buy some and skip some. LOTRO sells quests by level bands and there are no real choices - it is pay for a given pack or grind for ten levels.
Also - and this is my gripe - character development will cost you too. Want slot more "talents" than in free trial - pay. Pay per character per slot. Want a mount? Pay. Other F2Ps sell mounts, LOTRO sells both mounts and the actual ability to ride mounts. Again, per character basis. Want to post just one single auction? Pay. Per character. No account wide unlocks as in DDO. No in game means to unlock say bag space as in DDO.
Yes, you can get turbine points as free player. 5 cents at a time. Most of it is for grinding mobs and you have to stay at one spot. Want more points? Grind more. In DDO you get points for completing actual creative quests, the more difficult one the more gain, here it is for boring mindless grind.
This is not DDO, this is hardly F2P. It is nice trial and a fine sub game. But not F2P. It is not free and shop does not give you any real options.
Edit: And yes, it is EQ but without SOE expertise or Blizzard polish - and less free with more lag and less customer support and worse combat mechanics than RoM or Allods.
I don't agree with the OP really as this topic screams drama, but what isn't clear to me is how many Turbine Points - if any - are being given to former subscribers who played "X" months ago.
If someone had subscribed for two years early in the game's release, I do think they should be rewarded with the applicable amount of Turbine Points (whatever that is). This way they have points to "re-purchase" quest packs/perks that they would have essentially paid for over time already.
This is a tough balance though, as at some point the past subscribers will run out of points and be forced to reinvest into the game to play. Given that they once paid a monthly fee for the same access, I don't see that ad-hoc purchasing being a problem. IF they want to go through content quickly and that might add up to more than $15/month; why not just re-subscribe again?
So if you didn't wish to pay the sub before, you couldn't play the game.
If you wished to play the game before, you paid a sub. And you paid for MoM/SoM. And you still paid a sub. And when you stopped paying for that sub, you couldn't play.
Now you can play the game (some of it at least), for free. Could you do that before?
Am I missing something? Am I a Ruhtard all of a sudden? This makes me shake my head just like when I heard about someone tripping over a speed bump and sueing. And then winning the case. But them only awarding $800,000 because it was 20% her fault.....
No, he won't. His later comments only prove that. Some people are just limited in their comprehension ability.
QFT - I gave up after his first response. Completely clueless.
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.
You don't have to pay one single cent only invest huge amount of time if you want it all free.
You can complete deeds shit loads of deeds to earn Tpoints to buy quest packs or whatever you want to buy, so yeah its all free if you really want to undertake the huge grinding.
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
Why do you care so much for the subscribers? For them changed a little (except the horrible lag those days). Now they can log in if they do not sub but if they want to play like humans they re-sub just like before. And subbing is the bargain choice.
The title concerns another topic - that this is hardly F2P game no matter how you cut it, this is just crippled P2P. Other F2Ps have some aspects free and some purchased, in LOTRO the only free thing is two day trial and a place at the tail of login queue. It may be better model than free EQ2 but not better enough to make a difference.
The thing is, the Deeds reward you with other things than T-points so you would want to complete them anyway.
I am curious how this will turn out. F2P model is 'new' and it is exciting to watch all the changes that will come in the future.
So if I kicked you in the privates, I haven't actually kicked YOU? That is comforting to know. If a birthday party host asks you if you liked cake, you would complain upon receiving only a slice? Just as metaphores, of course...
The game IS free to play. You CAN play the game for free. Even if you extend the meaning of "game" to encompass the game in its entirety, you can STILL play the game for free. Surely, if you wish to extend the meaning of "game" to "the entire game", it is a legitimate move to extend the meaning of "free" to "free, as long as you put some effort in to grind the points"? You either allow for a broad semantic perspective, in which case "game" means "entire game" and "free" means "ultimately free", or you do not, in which case "play the game for free" just relates to the activity of playing the game and "free" means "you don't have to pay anything or put in any considerable effort", and then I could STILL argue that any considerable effort spent on a leisure activity counts as "free", because it does not cost you any money at all. Any other interpretation of the phrase "play the game for free" is a case of applying double standards.
On a sidenote, as far as the technicalities of the word "play" are concerned (which is part of the issue here), there exists no telic reading of that verb. This means there is no 'goal' reading whereupon the activity is concluded because it has been completed. Compare the verb "to exit", which is completed and therefore concluded the moment it is executed fully; once one exits a building, one is no longer in the process of exiting the building. Once one plays a game, however, one is still in the process of playing it after one has played the game, unless one stops playing. Conversely, one cannot 'stop' exiting a building. This is important, because this means the phrase "play for free" does nowhere imply that, in order to play, one needs to be able to play the entire game, as there is no sense of 'goal', completion, or conclusion inherent to the verb "to play".
Bottom line: feel free to argue semantics, but at least have some idea of what semantics are.
It is as if everyone is Juliust Caesar and Turbine are the Republic Senate. Turbine tradegically and merciless stabbed each player in the back killing them dead.
Think of it this way everyone, when you go to a Cost-Co or Sam's Club or any other similar place. They have a free sample of a new brand of cookies, you try one, you love it. Now you only get one cookie one "Free" cookie. Same concept here, they let you play the game for free, but they let you play it as LOOOONG as you want.
THE COOKIES
Pros: Free sample cookie - One Cookie
Cons: You only get one cookie.
THE LORD OF THE RINGS ONLINE
Pros: You get to play Lord of the Rings Online to level 20, possible level 50 (as long as you want)
Cons: Content is locked and thus getting to certian levels may be difficult.
Get it now?
Priceless
thank you, kind sir! 
DB
Denial makes one look a lot dumber than he/she actually is.