"The game was just out of beta and 40 of my guild started playing. I was one of my group’s “Planet Side” testers/players, having beta tested it. We are 200 strong spread out now over 8-10 different games.
I would tune in the SWG channel on TS and listen, it was amazing to here the accounts of things across the galaxy as seen through the eyes of noobs. Everyone was a noob. I had to be a part of this.
I got the game and away I went. There were people everywhere. Cantinas were jammed, star ports as well. People running across Dath, no speeders yet. Fighting rancors and nightsisters. Squills and Tuskin Raiders were things to avoid on our home planet. The Corellian plains ands the swamps of Talus, filled with big cats and their babies was a great place for the CH, but a dangerous one as well.
The crafting was amazing as well, folks dedicated themselves to mining, harvesting or buying the best resources, looting or buying skill tapes, and the items they made were top shelf. We knew who they were and we haggled for the best price. Weapons, armor, BE clothing, foods, drinks, etc…
The fighting classes would hire out to protect crafters as they tended their harvesters, or just paid us to bring home the best meat or bone, when ever it would be located that month at various places across the galaxy.
The player cites became sophisticated and well thought out. We would hunt in groups to fund the treasury. Recruit top crafters to place their vendors so traffic in town would increase.
Entertainers formed troupes that would travel around and perform at events for hire. Towns would have celebrations, music, fireworks, dancing. The socialization was at its peak.
Bases became focal points for the GCW, defending and attacking, when one went “hot” hundreds of players would be on hand. Theed was a kill zone as was the Bestine-Anchorhead corridor.
Jedi were rare and as the game progressed, more found their way to the Force. But through perma-death, saber TEF and eventually visibility and the BH, showing off with a LS was a bad thing. Removing the BH gank squad made us Jedi more brazen and may have been the first sign of the down hill slide. Jedi should have remained in the shadows.
I remember traveling across many planets and stopping off in a camps on a regular basis. Players just out and about were never hard to stumble across. The Master Ranger camp was a sight to see. If they had a dancer, it was a chance to heal up a bit and move on. Before leaving you could often barter for a new pet or some food or drink. Few new I was a Jedi, it was much safer that way. Regular clothes, carrying a rifle or carbine, with my LS in the tool bar just in case I was not as careful as I thought I was.
Back to a big city, get your speeder, armor and weapon repaired. It was always nice to find a smuggler and get those new items sliced. Stop by the local cantina and enjoy some music and get a mind buff, hit a star port and have a doctor buff you up. Then back out to the open spaces, never far from action.
Player run night clubs sprang up, rented juke boxes, exotic dancers, beauty pageants and just a place to hang out, waiting for the next assault on the enemy or hunting party. At one pageant, with about two hundred in attendance, a beautiful young Jedi was competing, when a BH attacked, the fight spilled out into the street and raged on for 20 minutes before she managed to escape. I cannot imagine a more “Star Warsy” scene then a fight breaking out in a Star Wars bar.
You didn’t have to run around to find PvP, it would always find you if you were not alert. NPC’s could unmask you as well, and many times you would have to fight your way out of town. For a Jedi, that meant visibility for sure. Time o be extra careful. But if laying low was your thing for the moment, there were 100 places to go and things to do. Tend to your factors, restock, shop, socialize, hunt, the Vette, Theme Parks, The Warren, Black Sun Bunker, etc… The server forums served as After Action Reports that made the slow times at work more enjoyable.
New players would seek help, and many did help. Taking them under their wing, showing them the ropes, forging bonds, weaken by the tears of this dying game, and friend’s lists evaporated as gamers left for greener pastures.
You really carved out your own existence, the greatest Star Wars saga ever told, yours… and if you ran the course and wanted a change, you could start over, 31 more times if it suited you.
Many of us have moved on, others stay and pray that the greatness of this game will return. Still others, like me, pay for a month here and there just to check in and see for ourselves.
For me, there is a soothing, surreal feeling when I hear the opening music. I stand above my home on Tatooine, in Storm’s End, a town we forged from the sands in a place called The Valley of the Wind. I watch the twin suns set over the mountains and remember what the game was like. It truly breaks my heart to think of the friends lost and the good times we had, gone forever, like the sands in a storm. I wait a bit longer, check my empty friend’s list and log off.
Yes, we were adventurers, explorers and soldiers, and it was the best of times."
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
Not only is SW:TOR made by a different company, it is also set in a different time frame and there is no reason whatsover why it should adopt SWG gameplay, that only ever attracted a niche audience.
I am a SWG vet and am amazed that people really liked that game even in hindsight. When there weren't Combat Medics throwing their poisons through walls of "safe houses", it were Creature Handlers engaging in an epic battle with imba creatures that filled the screen, so you couldn't see anything. If it wasn't that, it were players desperately trying to grind jedi while the whole player economy went poof because your local weapon smith became sword master this week and the armor smith was out exploiting some creatures on yavin in the attempt to grind chef, his 23rd profession. How there was the consistent image that anyone who was really, desperately, trying to become jedi was a 9 year old and those who actually made it were already known exploiters. How the developers kept all the iconic star wars items gimped and spent their time introducing fish-tanks (!) and purple mandalorian armors and other things of similar use to the game, to keep the powerful "Barbie doll-house" player base happy that became stronger and stronger and more influental. How the developers then decided to merge the jedi folks with the GCW crowds by integrating jedi into the GCW framework — merging communities who were like cats and dogs all the time (because GCW players / PVP maintained that rebels and imperials should be at war and that this war is not about sorcerers and wizards running around, who suppose to be almost extinct). Some argued with SW canon, others simply that they want blasterfire, troopers and walkers stomping over the battlefields.
The whole idea with Jedi as alpha profession. The idea that each broken profession must be revamped 9 times a year without fixing anything just shoveling crap one side to the other. The ridiculous themeparks where the Emperor and Darth Vader would hang out in a sunny mason and their throne rooms that looked like a garage.
I was with the game for along time, due to my guild and because I somehow thought that it could only get better, that they would manage to set their priorities straight and so on. At that time, there was no WOW to compare, so the quality bar was already low.
I hoped the NGE would fix it. It didn't, but what made matters worse: a genuinely crappy, broken beyond repair game was glorified and people would go on and on how great it was. It wasn't. If you are into the barbie doll-house thingy, collecting images to put on the wall, decorate houses and such, I am sure there are other more polished games out there.
Jedi and the Hologrind.. yeah.. those things should never have been in the game, it spoiled it, no mistake, Jedi should never have been a playable character.. and introducing the hologrind just sent the game to hell, it ceased to become about Starwars, and became instead, stargrind.. and to try and fix that situation they introduced levels with the CU.. epic fail.. and when that didnt work, they created the NGE, and the result is the current version of SWG and a lesson in how not to run an MMO.. but few will admit that the games problems didnt start with the CU.. but with the introduction of Jedi themselves.. if the game had been allowed to evolve naturally, much as Eve did, then perhaps it would be in a much better place today.. as for the complaints about lack of content in SWG.. perhaps that just highlighted lack of creativity.. on the part of the players.. Eve doesnt have that problem, but for those without sufficient imagination, then storybook games with limited choices are the best thing, me, i could never be satisfied with something so shallow.
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
For those people who never played SWG before the CU or NGE, you guys will never understand what made SWG one the BEST mmos ever. People complain about SWTOR not being Galaxies enough, and I understand those feelings. In SWG you had the opportunity to be and do whatever you wanted; explore, craft, pvp, space combat, role play, be a shop keeper, be a bio engineer and create new species whatever. There were 33 professions in total, 33! All with their own cool pros and cons...which some will debate as a good thing or bad thing, but you know what, who cares we had the opportunity to decide for ourselves. We could travel anywhere in the known galaxy we wanted to, and if you were a jedi you needed to stay alert the entire time for BHs which no other game has ever been able to capture that concept as well as SWG. I cannot tell you how many times my guild and I PVPd across an entire planet, blowing up IMP bases and then responding to our home planet because the imps were hitting ours. 100% the ability to do whatever you want, whenever you want... freedom, in a game... who thought it possible.
As far as story in SWTOR, that can only get you so far and I for one am sick of hearing about the GREAT stories to be had. If you ask me, and many other SWG vets from beta or release, we made our own stories which provided me with memories that will last forever... Think about it, when is the last time you remembered fondly the "go get me 15 bear pelts" or the "were rading this dungeon for the upteenth time"... No one does, because it feels like a job... Does this sound familiar "I have to log in tonight to get my level so i can raid, or I have to get this piece of gear so they will let me go on a raid"... Never once did I ever think of SWG as a job, it was fun almost every second I played the game.
I think back now, and no other game brings back the fond memories like SWG does. Sitting here as I write this, I can't help but hear the SW log in music and think how truly epic that experience was... My guild mates from the SWG days still tell old stories and laugh.
In closing, the SWTOR fans will inevitably say "this isnt SWG" and I understand that. However allow me to say, and I would like to think most SWG vets would agree, we would be much much better off if SWTOR had more of SWG in it, and less of WoW.
I played it from launch and honestly I did think it was an awesome game and I couldn't see how anything could be better than it, it was also though my first mmo and truth be told after playing a vast majority of the premium mmo's released since then I would not accept SWG even in the state it launched in.
My patience for a lack of control of ones own software and programs is just one I can't be bothered with after playing console games with great stability for so long.
I think some of the experiences I had in SWG were some of the best I've ever had in an mmo but I'm not too certain that that is really a good thing, I'm certain a recovering addict remembers how good that first hit was too and that is often how I look at SWG and SOE and the treatment we he players got from that company on this game.
With hindsight I can't view SWG as anything more than an average game even for what it did do and the NGE rates about the same as a themepark mmo. I'm glad for everyone who enjoyed it, misses it and wishes it was still here but please realize your experiences don't equate to making that a great game ever.
Some of the best "bike rides" I ever went on as a kid was when I had the old rummage sale special or the traget brand huffy, of course I loved my redlines and diamondbacks more but I certainly never forgot the outside things that made those experiences special and we shouldn't either.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
It was and will never be a goal for Bioware to create a sequel or in any way a game like SWG. SWG stands on its own in no relation to SWTOR exept it plays in the SW Universe. So get the f**k off SWG vets. Your cry for a sequel to SWG is better be directed to SOE or what not....
Since SWTOR was announced, Bioware has told us it will be an MMO focused on Story and not on freedom or any other f**ckin troll aspect your throwing in a discussion wether to be or not to be like SWG.
TWO DIFFERENT GAMES! Whats not to understand there?
ps: for the record, i did play swg since the relase for about 3 months, wether pre cu/nge or after when i tested a trial back then, not my game! so i went on finding something tthat fits, why cant you instead of all the hate/troll/cry postin? jesus, find something to do!
Playing: Global Agenda / Vindictus ----------------- Excited for: Guild Wars 2 / TERA / SWTOR ----------------- Have Played: Ultima Online, World of Warcraft, Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online, Vanguard, CoH/CoV, EverQuest 1+2, Tabula Rasa, DDO, The Chronical of Spellborn, Warhammer Online, Age of Conan, Champions Online, Aion, FLYFF, ArchLord, Metin 2, DAoC, APB, CC, Darkfall and many many more ----------------- Favorite MMO: Ultima Online
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
You have no idea what I have done. Yes I have played pre cu SWG. I don't know what all the fuss is about over it honestly. Just because you liked it, does not mean everyone did. Those missions were all boring. Some people don't give a damn about accomplishments really, if the means to get the accomplishment is a snooze fest.
Kindergarten games? I don't know what you consider a kindergarten game, but I guess children that have no job do have alot more time on their hands. Where as I don't have alot of time on my hands.
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
I recall the themeparks and I also recall they were never quite as engaging as an instance in WOW if they even worked correctly which they sometimes didn't, gaining ranks could in my opinion be considered somewhat alternate content but it was really just the act of running those random generic terminal jobs or pvp (I think if I remember right) but I don't know if it was truly any different than the other mission terminals and I hardly remember the bounty hunter missions but what I remember of them is I never got the feeling of doing anything any different than the mission terminal missions and the only difference I really remember is sometimes your target was actually in the city and not in the middle of a desert for no reason.
The content was light to be generous with an assessment of the game.
In regards to the op's post there is nothing wrong with someone wanting to be Uncle Owen, but where I see a problem is when people try to find problems with another game simply because it's not going to give you the ability to be Uncle Owen. It irks me to hear so many people profess to be Star Wars fans but also so quick to turn away from something Star Wars because it isn't being done the way they want it to be done.
I would think there is nothing wrong with saying "this game isn't going to be SWG so I know I won't play it for longer than it takes to complete the story" but most detractors follow the same plan and attempt to tear the game down with very little good reason.
I often hear the "on rails" argument made and that equally applies to the games people often consider sandboxes including SWG, while folks purport to have so much freedom what you don't have the freedom to do is play in a game world with compelling questing options that made you feel like your actions were important to a galaxy on the whole and not just your imaginary family (like Uncle Owen) you had very few if any short term goals they were almost all attached to grinds that lasted for months only to have it taken away in the blink of an eye. When it was all said and done again I could never think back on the awesome chain of quests on Tat that ended with a group assault on Jabas palace.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
I recall the themeparks and I also recall they were never quite as engaging as an instance in WOW if they even worked correctly which they sometimes didn't, gaining ranks could in my opinion be considered somewhat alternate content but it was really just the act of running those random generic terminal jobs or pvp (I think if I remember right) but I don't know if it was truly any different than the other mission terminals and I hardly remember the bounty hunter missions but what I remember of them is I never got the feeling of doing anything any different than the mission terminal missions and the only difference I really remember is sometimes your target was actually in the city and not in the middle of a desert for no reason.
The content was light to be generous with an assessment of the game.
Gaining ranks and mission terminals is not my idea of REAL content. That is just computer generated content, and it is the same thing over and over again. When I first started swg , I was dropped off in eisly. No money, no idea what i was supposed to do. Tried to talk to all the npcs and none of them had a quest. I went to the mission terminals and they didn't even work properly. If they did I would have had to walk an absurd amount of time to get there since I had no transportation.
I also noticed how people would stand around and have to BEG other players to learn a few skills.
Don't try to pull rank on me, and tell me I didn't play the game when it came out. I tried it for a lil bit and decided it was not my thing. I only got bored and resubbed the game when they started having the heroic encounters added to the game.
I also played and enjoyed SWG to an extent way back when. But we still had to farm baz nitches quests with groups of people far enough away to make a lot of gold. We still had to grind or do dungeons for loot and items to be used in crafting, or for the +skill thingys.
The game allowed for a lot of RPing. And a lot of people did that, cool, fine! I did too.
There is nothing stopping you or anyone else from playing Uncle Owen in SWG right now. Or even an emu. This game is going to be a themepark, and not a sandbox themepark like SWG was.
I know that is hard to accept, but I think one day all these SWG vets you are referring to can make it through the day without TOR allowing them to be Uncle Owen...again.
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
Running theme parks were ok, but they weren't all that long. My favorite being the Jabba themepark, but again it was short. I recall the longest one being Emperor's retreat, seeing both Vader and the Emperor made my day. But again it didn't last to long.
Gaining Ranks was just a grind, that isn't really 'content' it's just something to do on the side. But even then, what if you were nuetral? That's one thing off the list for those players.
BH missions, this was content? Alright, you can take a player bounty or an NPC bounty. The NPC bounty being far less fun and rewarding. It was repeatative, find guy, kill him, collect reward, repeat. Player Bounties is still player created content, without the players who kill other players (this also requires PVP) you can't take these missions. If you play the gamen now, there are plenty of player bounties thanks to Restuss.
And what did you mean by 'kindergarten games'? Are you saying a complete game with loads of content is for children? Does an adult need to be bored to consider himself an adult? That's some screwed up logic right there.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I don't know about that since i can't predict the future. At this point in time the game is left feeling empty and lifeless. Of course on launch day and the months following afterward there are plenty of fond memories to be had. That's when everyone was running around trying to learn the game and having a good time. Now adays this does not happen.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
Said as if either or both of you had access to all the data as to why people left the game . . .
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
I recall the themeparks and I also recall they were never quite as engaging as an instance in WOW if they even worked correctly which they sometimes didn't, gaining ranks could in my opinion be considered somewhat alternate content but it was really just the act of running those random generic terminal jobs or pvp (I think if I remember right) but I don't know if it was truly any different than the other mission terminals and I hardly remember the bounty hunter missions but what I remember of them is I never got the feeling of doing anything any different than the mission terminal missions and the only difference I really remember is sometimes your target was actually in the city and not in the middle of a desert for no reason.
The content was light to be generous with an assessment of the game.
Gaining ranks and mission terminals is not my idea of REAL content. That is just computer generated content, and it is the same thing over and over again. When I first started swg , I was dropped off in eisly. No money, no idea what i was supposed to do. Tried to talk to all the npcs and none of them had a quest. I went to the mission terminals and they didn't even work properly. If they did I would have had to walk an absurd amount of time to get there since I had no transportation.
I also noticed how people would stand around and have to BEG other players to learn a few skills.
Don't try to pull rank on me, and tell me I didn't play the game when it came out. I tried it for a lil bit and decided it was not my thing. I only got bored and resubbed the game when they started having the heroic encounters added to the game.
Man switch to decalf or something I'm not trying to pull rank as a matter of fact I agreed with you......
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
Said as if either or both of you had access to all the data as to why people left the game . . .
Millions of people bought the game and only 200k of those people actually stayed enough to enjoy it, until SOE and LA combat upgrade which pissed off the remaining people.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
Said as if either or both of you had access to all the data as to why people left the game . . .
I don't think any data is necessary, the facts were, people were leaving the game and SOE thought they had to do something to stop it, not just once, but twice. I loved SWG. I would still be playing had they not changed it. Thats not to say other people would still be too, though.
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
I recall the themeparks and I also recall they were never quite as engaging as an instance in WOW if they even worked correctly which they sometimes didn't, gaining ranks could in my opinion be considered somewhat alternate content but it was really just the act of running those random generic terminal jobs or pvp (I think if I remember right) but I don't know if it was truly any different than the other mission terminals and I hardly remember the bounty hunter missions but what I remember of them is I never got the feeling of doing anything any different than the mission terminal missions and the only difference I really remember is sometimes your target was actually in the city and not in the middle of a desert for no reason.
The content was light to be generous with an assessment of the game.
Gaining ranks and mission terminals is not my idea of REAL content. That is just computer generated content, and it is the same thing over and over again. When I first started swg , I was dropped off in eisly. No money, no idea what i was supposed to do. Tried to talk to all the npcs and none of them had a quest. I went to the mission terminals and they didn't even work properly. If they did I would have had to walk an absurd amount of time to get there since I had no transportation.
I also noticed how people would stand around and have to BEG other players to learn a few skills.
Don't try to pull rank on me, and tell me I didn't play the game when it came out. I tried it for a lil bit and decided it was not my thing. I only got bored and resubbed the game when they started having the heroic encounters added to the game.
Man switch to decalf or something I'm not trying to pull rank as a matter of fact I agreed with you......
Yea, I wasn't talking about you, though. I was referring to the guy that keeps "sungodra'ing" me in every post like he knows me.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
Said as if either or both of you had access to all the data as to why people left the game . . .
Of coarse we don't. But I was a player, including many, many of my friends. None of them left because of the CU or the NGE, they left because of the lack of polish and the lack of content. I'm speaking from a personal experience and the words of the people I played with, both known in person and those I've met in the game.
Does it really take data to figure out what could have caused people to leave? Get real.
Can this really be YET ANOTHER thread by an SWG whiner? Seriously? Can it really be? How many is this now? 10,000!?!?
My head is about to explode. You people really need to find something else to do with your time other than pathetically attempting to change this game into SWG 2. It wil NEVER happen. Give up now. Your mission is hopeless! ALL IS LOST! THE END IS NIGH!! Go on a walk. Go out to the bars. Do something else with your lives! LIFE IS SHORT.
For God's sake... PLEASE stop this useless crap. I'm really really getting tired of it.
YOU WILL NOT SUCCEED AT CHANGING THIS GAME. Period. Enough said. Cry a tear, write a sonnet about it if you must, but MOVE ON.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
Said as if either or both of you had access to all the data as to why people left the game . . .
not ALL the data.
but i did receive guild and private messeges in-game from many friends. and i had access to several forums.
SOE doesnt even have numbers as to why people leave. and the feedback was readily available to those who were part of that game.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
well isnt that SOE's fault?
Or the hologrind for that matter?
i dont fail to understand. i was there.
It is, but I know exactly what you were talking about. CU (not being to bad) or the NGE. What you fail to understand, is the game was a complete mess, it was no where near polished and you had little to do to keep you entertained, it was The Sims Online with a mediocre combat system.
I'm sure you believe if the CU or the NGE never happened the game would be doing grand. If not, sorry for assuming.
Comments
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Jedi and the Hologrind.. yeah.. those things should never have been in the game, it spoiled it, no mistake, Jedi should never have been a playable character.. and introducing the hologrind just sent the game to hell, it ceased to become about Starwars, and became instead, stargrind.. and to try and fix that situation they introduced levels with the CU.. epic fail.. and when that didnt work, they created the NGE, and the result is the current version of SWG and a lesson in how not to run an MMO.. but few will admit that the games problems didnt start with the CU.. but with the introduction of Jedi themselves.. if the game had been allowed to evolve naturally, much as Eve did, then perhaps it would be in a much better place today.. as for the complaints about lack of content in SWG.. perhaps that just highlighted lack of creativity.. on the part of the players.. Eve doesnt have that problem, but for those without sufficient imagination, then storybook games with limited choices are the best thing, me, i could never be satisfied with something so shallow.
Again Sungod, allow me to repeat. You must have never, ever played the game in the first 2 years because you have zero clue as to the amount of content. Running theme parks, gaining ranks, BH missions... there was content all over the place... you just had to explore to find it... it wasn't handed to you like some of the kindergarten games.
I played it from launch and honestly I did think it was an awesome game and I couldn't see how anything could be better than it, it was also though my first mmo and truth be told after playing a vast majority of the premium mmo's released since then I would not accept SWG even in the state it launched in.
My patience for a lack of control of ones own software and programs is just one I can't be bothered with after playing console games with great stability for so long.
I think some of the experiences I had in SWG were some of the best I've ever had in an mmo but I'm not too certain that that is really a good thing, I'm certain a recovering addict remembers how good that first hit was too and that is often how I look at SWG and SOE and the treatment we he players got from that company on this game.
With hindsight I can't view SWG as anything more than an average game even for what it did do and the NGE rates about the same as a themepark mmo. I'm glad for everyone who enjoyed it, misses it and wishes it was still here but please realize your experiences don't equate to making that a great game ever.
Some of the best "bike rides" I ever went on as a kid was when I had the old rummage sale special or the traget brand huffy, of course I loved my redlines and diamondbacks more but I certainly never forgot the outside things that made those experiences special and we shouldn't either.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
first of all:
Bioware != Verant Interactive/SOE
second:
SWTOR != SWG
SWTOR != SWG 2
It was and will never be a goal for Bioware to create a sequel or in any way a game like SWG. SWG stands on its own in no relation to SWTOR exept it plays in the SW Universe. So get the f**k off SWG vets. Your cry for a sequel to SWG is better be directed to SOE or what not....
Since SWTOR was announced, Bioware has told us it will be an MMO focused on Story and not on freedom or any other f**ckin troll aspect your throwing in a discussion wether to be or not to be like SWG.
TWO DIFFERENT GAMES! Whats not to understand there?
ps: for the record, i did play swg since the relase for about 3 months, wether pre cu/nge or after when i tested a trial back then, not my game! so i went on finding something tthat fits, why cant you instead of all the hate/troll/cry postin? jesus, find something to do!
Playing: Global Agenda / Vindictus
-----------------
Excited for: Guild Wars 2 / TERA / SWTOR
-----------------
Have Played: Ultima Online, World of Warcraft, Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online, Vanguard, CoH/CoV, EverQuest 1+2, Tabula Rasa, DDO, The Chronical of Spellborn, Warhammer Online, Age of Conan, Champions Online, Aion, FLYFF, ArchLord, Metin 2, DAoC, APB, CC, Darkfall and many many more
-----------------
Favorite MMO: Ultima Online
You have no idea what I have done. Yes I have played pre cu SWG. I don't know what all the fuss is about over it honestly. Just because you liked it, does not mean everyone did. Those missions were all boring. Some people don't give a damn about accomplishments really, if the means to get the accomplishment is a snooze fest.
Kindergarten games? I don't know what you consider a kindergarten game, but I guess children that have no job do have alot more time on their hands. Where as I don't have alot of time on my hands.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
I recall the themeparks and I also recall they were never quite as engaging as an instance in WOW if they even worked correctly which they sometimes didn't, gaining ranks could in my opinion be considered somewhat alternate content but it was really just the act of running those random generic terminal jobs or pvp (I think if I remember right) but I don't know if it was truly any different than the other mission terminals and I hardly remember the bounty hunter missions but what I remember of them is I never got the feeling of doing anything any different than the mission terminal missions and the only difference I really remember is sometimes your target was actually in the city and not in the middle of a desert for no reason.
The content was light to be generous with an assessment of the game.
In regards to the op's post there is nothing wrong with someone wanting to be Uncle Owen, but where I see a problem is when people try to find problems with another game simply because it's not going to give you the ability to be Uncle Owen. It irks me to hear so many people profess to be Star Wars fans but also so quick to turn away from something Star Wars because it isn't being done the way they want it to be done.
I would think there is nothing wrong with saying "this game isn't going to be SWG so I know I won't play it for longer than it takes to complete the story" but most detractors follow the same plan and attempt to tear the game down with very little good reason.
I often hear the "on rails" argument made and that equally applies to the games people often consider sandboxes including SWG, while folks purport to have so much freedom what you don't have the freedom to do is play in a game world with compelling questing options that made you feel like your actions were important to a galaxy on the whole and not just your imaginary family (like Uncle Owen) you had very few if any short term goals they were almost all attached to grinds that lasted for months only to have it taken away in the blink of an eye. When it was all said and done again I could never think back on the awesome chain of quests on Tat that ended with a group assault on Jabas palace.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Gaining ranks and mission terminals is not my idea of REAL content. That is just computer generated content, and it is the same thing over and over again. When I first started swg , I was dropped off in eisly. No money, no idea what i was supposed to do. Tried to talk to all the npcs and none of them had a quest. I went to the mission terminals and they didn't even work properly. If they did I would have had to walk an absurd amount of time to get there since I had no transportation.
I also noticed how people would stand around and have to BEG other players to learn a few skills.
Don't try to pull rank on me, and tell me I didn't play the game when it came out. I tried it for a lil bit and decided it was not my thing. I only got bored and resubbed the game when they started having the heroic encounters added to the game.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Rose colored goggles are ftw right?
I also played and enjoyed SWG to an extent way back when. But we still had to farm baz nitches quests with groups of people far enough away to make a lot of gold. We still had to grind or do dungeons for loot and items to be used in crafting, or for the +skill thingys.
The game allowed for a lot of RPing. And a lot of people did that, cool, fine! I did too.
There is nothing stopping you or anyone else from playing Uncle Owen in SWG right now. Or even an emu. This game is going to be a themepark, and not a sandbox themepark like SWG was.
I know that is hard to accept, but I think one day all these SWG vets you are referring to can make it through the day without TOR allowing them to be Uncle Owen...again.
Running theme parks were ok, but they weren't all that long. My favorite being the Jabba themepark, but again it was short. I recall the longest one being Emperor's retreat, seeing both Vader and the Emperor made my day. But again it didn't last to long.
Gaining Ranks was just a grind, that isn't really 'content' it's just something to do on the side. But even then, what if you were nuetral? That's one thing off the list for those players.
BH missions, this was content? Alright, you can take a player bounty or an NPC bounty. The NPC bounty being far less fun and rewarding. It was repeatative, find guy, kill him, collect reward, repeat. Player Bounties is still player created content, without the players who kill other players (this also requires PVP) you can't take these missions. If you play the gamen now, there are plenty of player bounties thanks to Restuss.
And what did you mean by 'kindergarten games'? Are you saying a complete game with loads of content is for children? Does an adult need to be bored to consider himself an adult? That's some screwed up logic right there.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
Not true, it could be the same game it was in pre-cu and the game would still be hemorrhaging subscriptions. You're insisting everybody would have stayed if no changes were made, what you fail to understand plenty were leaving because no changes were being made.
I don't know about that since i can't predict the future. At this point in time the game is left feeling empty and lifeless. Of course on launch day and the months following afterward there are plenty of fond memories to be had. That's when everyone was running around trying to learn the game and having a good time. Now adays this does not happen.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Said as if either or both of you had access to all the data as to why people left the game . . .
Gaming since Avalon Hill was making board games.
Played SWG, EVE, Fallen Earth, LOTRO, Rift, Vanguard, WoW, SWTOR, TSW, Tera
Tried Aoc, Aion, EQII, RoM, Vindictus, Darkfail, DDO, GW, PotBS
Screw it.
I don't care about innovation I care about fun.
Man switch to decalf or something I'm not trying to pull rank as a matter of fact I agreed with you......
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Millions of people bought the game and only 200k of those people actually stayed enough to enjoy it, until SOE and LA combat upgrade which pissed off the remaining people.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
I don't think any data is necessary, the facts were, people were leaving the game and SOE thought they had to do something to stop it, not just once, but twice. I loved SWG. I would still be playing had they not changed it. Thats not to say other people would still be too, though.
Yea, I wasn't talking about you, though. I was referring to the guy that keeps "sungodra'ing" me in every post like he knows me.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
well isnt that SOE's fault?
Or the hologrind for that matter?
i dont fail to understand. i was there.
Of coarse we don't. But I was a player, including many, many of my friends. None of them left because of the CU or the NGE, they left because of the lack of polish and the lack of content. I'm speaking from a personal experience and the words of the people I played with, both known in person and those I've met in the game.
Does it really take data to figure out what could have caused people to leave? Get real.
Oh. My. God.
Can this really be YET ANOTHER thread by an SWG whiner? Seriously? Can it really be? How many is this now? 10,000!?!?
My head is about to explode. You people really need to find something else to do with your time other than pathetically attempting to change this game into SWG 2. It wil NEVER happen. Give up now. Your mission is hopeless! ALL IS LOST! THE END IS NIGH!! Go on a walk. Go out to the bars. Do something else with your lives! LIFE IS SHORT.
For God's sake... PLEASE stop this useless crap. I'm really really getting tired of it.
YOU WILL NOT SUCCEED AT CHANGING THIS GAME. Period. Enough said. Cry a tear, write a sonnet about it if you must, but MOVE ON.
not ALL the data.
but i did receive guild and private messeges in-game from many friends. and i had access to several forums.
SOE doesnt even have numbers as to why people leave. and the feedback was readily available to those who were part of that game.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
It is, but I know exactly what you were talking about. CU (not being to bad) or the NGE. What you fail to understand, is the game was a complete mess, it was no where near polished and you had little to do to keep you entertained, it was The Sims Online with a mediocre combat system.
I'm sure you believe if the CU or the NGE never happened the game would be doing grand. If not, sorry for assuming.