I would like to clarify one thing... in no way am I bashing Bioware, they are a great game company. KOTOR was a great game, period. The point I was trying to make, is the more ideas they borrow from SWG and the less they take from WoW the better off this game will be.
Well, I submit that the more they take from KOTOR (which you admit to be a great game) and the less they take from SWG, the better off this game will be.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
you as the poster above assume that i was referring exclusively about the NGE.
Lots of other games dont play like SWG did either, so should they all be made the same way too? The company that happens to be making this particular starwars game doesnt make sandbox games like that. Thats just not what they do. They make games that have heavy story telling and play like interactive movies. Its pointless saying that Bioware shouldnt make games that they are good at and instead should make sandbox games that they are totally unfamiliar with.
Besides why does it matter? Starwars games get churned out all the time. Once you are bored with one, just hop onto another one. Once you have played them all, wait a few years for the next batch to get rolled off the assembly line.
Yes, yes we can... the game that some loved is dead and gone... all I would like to ask is that Bioware not make a WoW SW clone of a game... Use SWG as inspiration to make SWTOR a GREAT game, not just a 7 or 8 out of 10...
1. People are assuming that the SWG Vets think SWG was flawless. The reality is that they don't. Yes, SWG had a lot of bug and balance issues, and could have used a bit more content then it had. What the SWG vets want back is the core concept and ideals that SWG presented, which was a free-form open world sandbox MMO that allowed you to immerse yourself into and participate with the Star Wars universe. Despite the bugs and balance issues, SWG was still great game for what it was aiming for, a dimond in the rough if you will.
2. The people trying to bash SWG are claiming that SWG was an inherently flawed game, which is what lead to it's demise. The reality is that there was nothing wrong with the core concept of the game. It was the mismanagement and lack of motivation on SOE's end with regards to being on the ball with fixing bugs, balance issues, and constantly producing content (story arcs), which caused SWG to fail.
In other words... there was, and is, nothing wrong with the concept of a Star Wars MMO using a sandbox MMO methodology. It was the follow up execution by SOE post release which caused the game's subscriberbase to slip, and then finally topple when SOE forced a core overhauled nobody asked for.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
you as the poster above assume that i was referring exclusively about the NGE.
So the problems, NGE and SOE. It's not clear what you meant by it being run by SOE, my guess is that SOE changed your game. Was you saying this during the pre-cu phase? Doubt it.
Originally posted by BadgerSmaker
Originally posted by Cruoris
does anyone want to list off some actual buzz kills for this game? i get that it was EVEN BETTER before the "fall", but its sounding more and more like the sandbox ive searching for all my life.
There is a Free Trial, if you like broken, wow-wannabe sandbox games then SWG has a lot ot offer you.
Broken, WoW-wannabe. Broken indeed, like it always was. WoW wannabe, NGE bashing again. Why not actually inform the poster? Let him know what is broken, or should I say, what has ALWAYS been broken and inform him about how the NGE works?
For those people who never played SWG before the CU or NGE, you guys will never understand what made SWG one the BEST mmos ever.
Stopped reading there. I don't know why people keep spewing this crap. SWG was one the of the worst MMOs ever and was failing right out of the gate. Legions of beta players warned not to release it but the devs didn't care and immediatley it started bleeding initial subscribers like crazy and in the end the CU and NGE were thrown in as a last ditch effort to safe this abortion of a game.
When I was 8 years old I wanted to be Luke Skywalker and Han Solo. I understand you wanted to be uncle owen's burned corpse in the sand but I believe not many people shared that dream.
Who would you chose to be, Uncle Owen or Luke Skywalker?
Well that's easy, Uncle Owen. The reason is Luke Skywalker's story is already written, and the devs must follow a very narrow path of content, which if you are a fan you already know. On the other hand, if you are Uncle Owen....you are free to create your own story.
When I think of the differences between precu SWG and some of the other mmo's, I think of the housing as a for instance. In SWG, you can build your house pretty much anywhere, except too close to towns or poi's. You can face your house, north, south, east or west...to watch the setting sun, or to get a nice view of the valley or prairie or the lake. inside your house, you can decorate it however you want.
In this other mmo I played, all the houses are set down for you, the views predetermined. And all the furniture and decorations go on 'hooks' so you are limited to where you can put items. Big difference there...one system gives you freedom, the other gives you a narrowly defined experience.
That is why mmo's today suck. They offer you a predefined, narrow experience. No open worlds, just corridors and instances and zones. No uniqueness to crafting. Just input a + b=c. You want interesting crafting, SWG had it. Ryzom had it. Everything else sucks in terms of depth and uniqueness.
I say all this, but I will still play TOR ofcourse, but not because I was a SWG fan. I'll play it for what it is, and I expect it to be a good time.
1. People are assuming that the SWG Vets think SWG was flawless. The reality is that they don't. Yes, SWG had a lot of bug and balance issues, and could have used a bit more content then it had. What the SWG vets want back is the core concept and ideals that SWG presented, which was a free-form open world sandbox MMO that allowed you to immerse yourself into and participate with the Star Wars universe. Despite the bugs and balance issues, SWG was still great game for what it was aiming for, a dimond in the rough if you will.
2. The people trying to bash SWG are claiming that SWG was an inherently flawed game, which is what lead to it's demise. The reality is that there was nothing wrong with the core concept of the game. It was the mismanagement and lack of motivation on SOE's end with regards to being on the ball with fixing bugs, balance issues, and constantly producing content (story arcs), which caused SWG to fail.
In other words... there was, and is, nothing wrong with the concept of a Star Wars MMO using a sandbox MMO methodology. It was the follow up execution by SOE post release which caused the game's subscriberbase to slip, and then finally topple when SOE forced a core overhauled nobody asked for.
I don't think many people are assuming every vet thinks it was flawless. Being a pre-cu player, it was very clear the game was broken. The game was just poorly executed. Then SOE tried to out WoW, WoW. Which is impossible.
The problem is, whenever SWG is brought up, all that is talked about is pre-cu, people rarely talk about the other major problems that were driving people away. But it's nice to see some reconition as to what all was wrong with galaxies and not just one change. SWG was fine for what it was before the CU, if they would have put more focus on polish and content or adding more tools for player created content it would still be doing fine today.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
you as the poster above assume that i was referring exclusively about the NGE.
So the problems, NGE and SOE. It's not clear what you meant by it being run by SOE, my guess is that SOE changed your game. Was you saying this during the pre-cu phase? Doubt it.
Originally posted by BadgerSmaker
Originally posted by Cruoris
does anyone want to list off some actual buzz kills for this game? i get that it was EVEN BETTER before the "fall", but its sounding more and more like the sandbox ive searching for all my life.
There is a Free Trial, if you like broken, wow-wannabe sandbox games then SWG has a lot ot offer you.
Broken, WoW-wannabe. Broken indeed, like it always was. WoW wannabe, NGE bashing again. Why not actually inform the poster? Let him know what is broken, or should I say, what has ALWAYS been broken and inform him about how the NGE works?
For those people who never played SWG before the CU or NGE, you guys will never understand what made SWG one the BEST mmos ever.
Stopped reading there. I don't know why people keep spewing this crap. SWG was one the of the worst MMOs ever and was failing right out of the gate. Legions of beta players warned not to release it but the devs didn't care and immediatley it started bleeding initial subscribers like crazy and in the end the CU and NGE were thrown in as a last ditch effort to safe this abortion of a game.
When I was 8 years old I wanted to be Luke Skywalker and Han Solo. I understand you wanted to be uncle owen's burned corpse in the sand but I believe not many people shared that dream.
Then evidently you never played after release, because plenty of people were perfectly happy being their own version of Uncle Owen... Myself, I was a BH/Pistoleer so your assumption that I wanted to be Owen is completely wrong. I started this thread to simply give a voice to those people who enjoyed the social classes and aspects of SWG, much like my old SWG guildies who would like to see this portion of the game included in SWTOR.
I understand some gamers want all pew pew with zero social skills, however some gamers prefer both.
Who would you chose to be, Uncle Owen or Luke Skywalker?
Well that's easy, Uncle Owen. The reason is Luke Skywalker's story is already written, and the devs must follow a very narrow path of content, which if you are a fan you already know. On the other hand, if you are Uncle Owen....you are free to create your own story.
Umm... no. Uncle Owen's story is also written. He was murdered by storm troopers. He never got to be a hero or go on any adventures. He just died face down in the sand like the loser he was.
For those people who never played SWG before the CU or NGE, you guys will never understand what made SWG one the BEST mmos ever. People complain about SWTOR not being Galaxies enough, and I understand those feelings. In SWG you had the opportunity to be and do whatever you wanted; explore, craft, pvp, space combat, role play, be a shop keeper, be a bio engineer and create new species whatever. There were 33 professions in total, 33! All with their own cool pros and cons...which some will debate as a good thing or bad thing, but you know what, who cares we had the opportunity to decide for ourselves. We could travel anywhere in the known galaxy we wanted to, and if you were a jedi you needed to stay alert the entire time for BHs which no other game has ever been able to capture that concept as well as SWG. I cannot tell you how many times my guild and I PVPd across an entire planet, blowing up IMP bases and then responding to our home planet because the imps were hitting ours. 100% the ability to do whatever you want, whenever you want... freedom, in a game... who thought it possible.
As far as story in SWTOR, that can only get you so far and I for one am sick of hearing about the GREAT stories to be had. If you ask me, and many other SWG vets from beta or release, we made our own stories which provided me with memories that will last forever... Think about it, when is the last time you remembered fondly the "go get me 15 bear pelts" or the "were rading this dungeon for the upteenth time"... No one does, because it feels like a job... Does this sound familiar "I have to log in tonight to get my level so i can raid, or I have to get this piece of gear so they will let me go on a raid"... Never once did I ever think of SWG as a job, it was fun almost every second I played the game.
I think back now, and no other game brings back the fond memories like SWG does. Sitting here as I write this, I can't help but hear the SW log in music and think how truly epic that experience was... My guild mates from the SWG days still tell old stories and laugh.
In closing, the SWTOR fans will inevitably say "this isnt SWG" and I understand that. However allow me to say, and I would like to think most SWG vets would agree, we would be much much better off if SWTOR had more of SWG in it, and less of WoW.
I have to agree that on release, bugs aside, SWG was the most fun I ever had in an MMO. The freedom was the key. And for me too, the best memories.
Who would you chose to be, Uncle Owen or Luke Skywalker?
Well that's easy, Uncle Owen. The reason is Luke Skywalker's story is already written, and the devs must follow a very narrow path of content, which if you are a fan you already know. On the other hand, if you are Uncle Owen....you are free to create your own story.
Umm... no. Uncle Owen's story is also written. He was murdered by storm troopers. He never got to be a hero or go on any adventures. He just died face down in the sand like the loser he was.
If you like SWG so much , go play the game, it is there for you.
TOTAL FAIL. You just don't get it. After the CU/NGEs of SWG, there is no SWG that we knew to go back to. 33 professions down to 9. Let that sink in. 33 profession down to 9. Jedi that you worked your ass off for 12 to 18 months to get... now, one of 9 starter professions.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
Who would you chose to be, Uncle Owen or Luke Skywalker?
Well that's easy, Uncle Owen. The reason is Luke Skywalker's story is already written, and the devs must follow a very narrow path of content, which if you are a fan you already know. On the other hand, if you are Uncle Owen....you are free to create your own story.
When I think of the differences between precu SWG and some of the other mmo's, I think of the housing as a for instance. In SWG, you can build your house pretty much anywhere, except too close to towns or poi's. You can face your house, north, south, east or west...to watch the setting sun, or to get a nice view of the valley or prairie or the lake. inside your house, you can decorate it however you want.
In this other mmo I played, all the houses are set down for you, the views predetermined. And all the furniture and decorations go on 'hooks' so you are limited to where you can put items. Big difference there...one system gives you freedom, the other gives you a narrowly defined experience.
That is why mmo's today suck. They offer you a predefined, narrow experience. No open worlds, just corridors and instances and zones. No uniqueness to crafting. Just input a + b=c. You want interesting crafting, SWG had it. Ryzom had it. Everything else sucks in terms of depth and uniqueness.
I say all this, but I will still play TOR ofcourse, but not because I was a SWG fan. I'll play it for what it is, and I expect it to be a good time.
How about neither one? how about I make my own character? Why would I want to be Owen or Skywalker?
When I make my characters , I make them so I can make a name for myself, not to be uncle owen or luke skywalker.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
you as the poster above assume that i was referring exclusively about the NGE.
So the problems, NGE and SOE. It's not clear what you meant by it being run by SOE, my guess is that SOE changed your game. Was you saying this during the pre-cu phase? Doubt it.
Originally posted by BadgerSmaker
Originally posted by Cruoris
does anyone want to list off some actual buzz kills for this game? i get that it was EVEN BETTER before the "fall", but its sounding more and more like the sandbox ive searching for all my life.
There is a Free Trial, if you like broken, wow-wannabe sandbox games then SWG has a lot ot offer you.
Broken, WoW-wannabe. Broken indeed, like it always was. WoW wannabe, NGE bashing again. Why not actually inform the poster? Let him know what is broken, or should I say, what has ALWAYS been broken and inform him about how the NGE works?
Where are you talking about all the other problems?
you just picked up on a few of my posts.
yes the NGE was the final major blow.
i've posted, lived and researched extensively about the other problems.
you are just not searching the right forums perhaps. my sig might give you a clue.
So you just feel you should claim the NGE was the only problem here. I'm not going to run around lookin for previous posts on another site if you can't properly answer questions on this one. Instead of being vague why don't you try to detail the reasons you quit. This is as ridiculous as people coming to this forum saying something untrue about TOR, where we demand the information to support it, get nothing and then are asked to prove what we say.
Anyways, I'm done talking about this. Getting old always finding myself/others talking about a dead game in the wrong forums.
then let them go play Star Sims Ultima Wars Online. (also known as the non-star warsy SWG)
It would be nice however they (SOE) made it more like the game you're waiting on (TOR) so people actually don't have SWG to go back to. If it were only that simple (just go back to SWG) most people would have done that. As it is, the NGE SWG is somewhere between the original SWG and TOR.
OP, TOR is made for those who want to be told a story, not for those who want to make their own story. It's the difference between buying a coloring book and buying a sketchbook.
This is what blows my mind... people think SWG was devoid of any kind of story or plot... It was far from it, you had the opportunity to take part in many of the SW stories, some did and some did not... but again, you had the choice it was not force fed to us...
This.
When a game is story-driven (everything planned out for you) then everyone has the same story. But with SWG, the stories were made by the people, NOT the developers and THAT is what's missing.
Mos Eiseley canina
Ranger camps
Player-developed cities
PvP city battles
Players selling wares in the streets
The list goes on and on. It's too bad the MMO community has been dumbed down over the years to accept being forced into where the developers want them to go and how to think. Sad really.
And people can do the exact same thing in TOR, except for the player developed cities.
Like the one guy said, SWG was just the same thing as Ultima Online reskinned. They were lazy and didn't want to add alot of time or content into the game so they have this idea of. "Hey let the player do it" throw them in eisly and let them do it all. Give them some player houses and abunch of empty land and let them think we put some effort into this game.
SWG developement is easy mode. That is all there is to it. It is easy for a dev team to make that kind of game, and requires hardly any work , as oppose to a game like TOR.
The assumption in SWG was that you already knew the Star Wars lore and thus, the plot...
If you like SWG so much , go play the game, it is there for you.
TOTAL FAIL. You just don't get it. After the CU/NGEs of SWG, there is no SWG that we knew to go back to. 33 professions down to 9. Let that sink in. 33 profession down to 9. Jedi that you worked your ass off for 12 to 18 months to get... now, one of 9 starter professions.
Shannia, what you wrote is a perfect description of how outraged SWG players felt. The gamers who didn't experience it, will never understand. Allow me to paint a picture for those who didn't experience it... You play WoW (most of you do anyways) You worked your a$$ off to get to level 80 and get 25 man ICC quality gear... Then Blizz comes out and says btw we are killing off half of the classes, making you re-roll and making everyone level 80. Oh and btw some of the gear you worked your a$$ off to get, will no longer work with your class...eventhough it did before.
There ya go, for those who didn't experience it... it would be just like that... and yes you would be livid.
That is a problem. When you get a game where players are the only form of real content, what happens to a game when all or most of the players are gone? You are left with an empty and boring world.
When all the players up and left swg , that is what we were left with.
except that no-one would have left had they not been driven out by SOE.
I have to disagree with this point, those who've read my posts may be able to attest to my story of leaving SWG, I left right before the CU and when I did leave it was during the time where we were all aware changes were coming but only the few hardcore knew exactly what changes those would be. I left because in truth after a year and the bug fixes never came and the luster started to dull on some of those friendships the game was not all it seemed when we first began.
Correct me if I'm wrong but The Matrix Online and the Final Fantasy mmo dropped around that time? Because I recall over one hundred members of a three guild coalition leaving for one of those two games before the CU or NGE.
you as the poster above assume that i was referring exclusively about the NGE.
So the problems, NGE and SOE. It's not clear what you meant by it being run by SOE, my guess is that SOE changed your game. Was you saying this during the pre-cu phase? Doubt it.
Originally posted by BadgerSmaker
Originally posted by Cruoris
does anyone want to list off some actual buzz kills for this game? i get that it was EVEN BETTER before the "fall", but its sounding more and more like the sandbox ive searching for all my life.
There is a Free Trial, if you like broken, wow-wannabe sandbox games then SWG has a lot ot offer you.
Broken, WoW-wannabe. Broken indeed, like it always was. WoW wannabe, NGE bashing again. Why not actually inform the poster? Let him know what is broken, or should I say, what has ALWAYS been broken and inform him about how the NGE works?
Where are you talking about all the other problems?
you just picked up on a few of my posts.
yes the NGE was the final major blow.
i've posted, lived and researched extensively about the other problems.
you are just not searching the right forums perhaps. my sig might give you a clue.
So you just feel you should claim the NGE was the only problem here. I'm not going to run around lookin for previous posts on another site if you can't properly answer questions on this one. Instead of being vague why don't you try to detail the reasons you quit. This is as ridiculous as people coming to this forum saying something untrue about TOR, where we demand the information the support it, get nothing and then are asked to prove what we say.
Anyways, I'm done talking about this. Getting kidna old always finding myself talking about a dead game in the wrong forums.
I quite because of the NGE.
but i know the problem came from way back, and the changes negatively affected my game experience since, as well as that of other people.
If you like SWG so much , go play the game, it is there for you.
TOTAL FAIL. You just don't get it. After the CU/NGEs of SWG, there is no SWG that we knew to go back to. 33 professions down to 9. Let that sink in. 33 profession down to 9. Jedi that you worked your ass off for 12 to 18 months to get... now, one of 9 starter professions.
No you have failed.. i'm not gonna out and out say it on this site for obvious reasons. But SWG is THERE for you. Gah read between the lines please, so I don't have to spell these things out for people.
If you like SWG so much , go play the game, it is there for you.
TOTAL FAIL. You just don't get it. After the CU/NGEs of SWG, there is no SWG that we knew to go back to. 33 professions down to 9. Let that sink in. 33 profession down to 9. Jedi that you worked your ass off for 12 to 18 months to get... now, one of 9 starter professions.
Shannia, what you wrote is a perfect description of how outraged SWG players felt. The gamers who didn't experience it, will never understand. Allow me to paint a picture for those who didn't experience it... You play WoW (most of you do anyways) You worked your a$$ off to get to level 80 and get 25 man ICC quality gear... Then Blizz comes out and says btw we are killing off half of the classes, making you re-roll and making everyone level 80. Oh and btw some of the gear you worked your a$$ off to get, will no longer work with your class...eventhough it did before.
There ya go, for those who didn't experience it... it would be just like that... and yes you would be livid.
The game is there for you. Learn to do a search or some research and you will find what you are looking for. People are all well aware that the game was changed and people are pissed off. Didn't stop some SWG fans from having it their way.
but i know the problem came from way back, and the changes negatively affected my game experience since, as well as that of other people.
i posted a link earlier you must have missed it.
here you go:
1. SWG wont launch until its ready - SOE repeatedly told us this game wont launch until its ready to go. This early on was to include space, JTL wasnt ever supposed to be an expansion. Lets also not forget key components not included at launch like player cities, vehicles, and jedi. As a">A Complete History of SOE's Lies
Amazing how you have to be put into a situation of doubt to provide information as to what was and still is wrong with the game. Wouldn't that have been far more informative then making smartass remarks about the NGE being a WoW wanna be and the fact that SoE is still running it?
Anyways, as I said, done talking about this, this forum is about SWTOR, not SWG.
but i know the problem came from way back, and the changes negatively affected my game experience since, as well as that of other people.
i posted a link earlier you must have missed it.
here you go:
1. SWG wont launch until its ready - SOE repeatedly told us this game wont launch until its ready to go. This early on was to include space, JTL wasnt ever supposed to be an expansion. Lets also not forget key components not included at launch like player cities, vehicles, and jedi. As a">A Complete History of SOE's Lies
Amazing how you have to be put into a situation of doubt to provide information as to what was and still is wrong with the game. Wouldn't that have been far more informative then making smartass remarks about the NGE being a WoW wanna be and the fact that SoE is still running it?
i dont know what you mean mate.
go back a few pages.
i posted a link on the history of soe's lies. you missed it. not my fault.
and the nge was produced precisely to resemble wow. even if SOE denies it.
Comments
What we need is closure. Can we get some closure?
TRUST THE COMPUTER! THE COMPUTER IS YOUR FRIEND!
Stay Alert! Trust No One! Keep Your Laser Handy!
Yellow Clearance Black Box Blues!
Well, I submit that the more they take from KOTOR (which you admit to be a great game) and the less they take from SWG, the better off this game will be.
you as the poster above assume that i was referring exclusively about the NGE.
but SOE IS to blame one way or the other.
Lots of other games dont play like SWG did either, so should they all be made the same way too? The company that happens to be making this particular starwars game doesnt make sandbox games like that. Thats just not what they do. They make games that have heavy story telling and play like interactive movies. Its pointless saying that Bioware shouldnt make games that they are good at and instead should make sandbox games that they are totally unfamiliar with.
Besides why does it matter? Starwars games get churned out all the time. Once you are bored with one, just hop onto another one. Once you have played them all, wait a few years for the next batch to get rolled off the assembly line.
Yes, yes we can... the game that some loved is dead and gone... all I would like to ask is that Bioware not make a WoW SW clone of a game... Use SWG as inspiration to make SWTOR a GREAT game, not just a 7 or 8 out of 10...
There's two big misconceptions here.
1. People are assuming that the SWG Vets think SWG was flawless. The reality is that they don't. Yes, SWG had a lot of bug and balance issues, and could have used a bit more content then it had. What the SWG vets want back is the core concept and ideals that SWG presented, which was a free-form open world sandbox MMO that allowed you to immerse yourself into and participate with the Star Wars universe. Despite the bugs and balance issues, SWG was still great game for what it was aiming for, a dimond in the rough if you will.
2. The people trying to bash SWG are claiming that SWG was an inherently flawed game, which is what lead to it's demise. The reality is that there was nothing wrong with the core concept of the game. It was the mismanagement and lack of motivation on SOE's end with regards to being on the ball with fixing bugs, balance issues, and constantly producing content (story arcs), which caused SWG to fail.
In other words... there was, and is, nothing wrong with the concept of a Star Wars MMO using a sandbox MMO methodology. It was the follow up execution by SOE post release which caused the game's subscriberbase to slip, and then finally topple when SOE forced a core overhauled nobody asked for.
Looking at your previous posts doesn't really talk about the the problems Jax brought up.
No:
1. turning the nge f2p won't make it a decent game.
2. its still run by soe.
So the problems, NGE and SOE. It's not clear what you meant by it being run by SOE, my guess is that SOE changed your game. Was you saying this during the pre-cu phase? Doubt it.
fixed.
Broken, WoW-wannabe. Broken indeed, like it always was. WoW wannabe, NGE bashing again. Why not actually inform the poster? Let him know what is broken, or should I say, what has ALWAYS been broken and inform him about how the NGE works?
SOE's way to conduct business:
1. Drive customers away by changing the games they like in the hope that they'll be back after they've vented their frustrations.
2. Drive customers away by banning them from the forums (or game?) when they post private communications.
3. Drive potential customers away by enacting controversial rules which will be made public on other forums.
1. NGE
2. Forum
3.Forum
Where are you talking about all the other problems?
Stopped reading there. I don't know why people keep spewing this crap. SWG was one the of the worst MMOs ever and was failing right out of the gate. Legions of beta players warned not to release it but the devs didn't care and immediatley it started bleeding initial subscribers like crazy and in the end the CU and NGE were thrown in as a last ditch effort to safe this abortion of a game.
When I was 8 years old I wanted to be Luke Skywalker and Han Solo. I understand you wanted to be uncle owen's burned corpse in the sand but I believe not many people shared that dream.
Who would you chose to be, Uncle Owen or Luke Skywalker?
Well that's easy, Uncle Owen. The reason is Luke Skywalker's story is already written, and the devs must follow a very narrow path of content, which if you are a fan you already know. On the other hand, if you are Uncle Owen....you are free to create your own story.
When I think of the differences between precu SWG and some of the other mmo's, I think of the housing as a for instance. In SWG, you can build your house pretty much anywhere, except too close to towns or poi's. You can face your house, north, south, east or west...to watch the setting sun, or to get a nice view of the valley or prairie or the lake. inside your house, you can decorate it however you want.
In this other mmo I played, all the houses are set down for you, the views predetermined. And all the furniture and decorations go on 'hooks' so you are limited to where you can put items. Big difference there...one system gives you freedom, the other gives you a narrowly defined experience.
That is why mmo's today suck. They offer you a predefined, narrow experience. No open worlds, just corridors and instances and zones. No uniqueness to crafting. Just input a + b=c. You want interesting crafting, SWG had it. Ryzom had it. Everything else sucks in terms of depth and uniqueness.
I say all this, but I will still play TOR ofcourse, but not because I was a SWG fan. I'll play it for what it is, and I expect it to be a good time.
I don't think many people are assuming every vet thinks it was flawless. Being a pre-cu player, it was very clear the game was broken. The game was just poorly executed. Then SOE tried to out WoW, WoW. Which is impossible.
The problem is, whenever SWG is brought up, all that is talked about is pre-cu, people rarely talk about the other major problems that were driving people away. But it's nice to see some reconition as to what all was wrong with galaxies and not just one change. SWG was fine for what it was before the CU, if they would have put more focus on polish and content or adding more tools for player created content it would still be doing fine today.
you just picked up on a few of my posts.
yes the NGE was the final major blow.
i've posted, lived and researched extensively about the other problems.
you are just not searching the right forums perhaps. my sig might give you a clue.
]
edit: oh that and i used to go by a different name on these forums since 06.
Then evidently you never played after release, because plenty of people were perfectly happy being their own version of Uncle Owen... Myself, I was a BH/Pistoleer so your assumption that I wanted to be Owen is completely wrong. I started this thread to simply give a voice to those people who enjoyed the social classes and aspects of SWG, much like my old SWG guildies who would like to see this portion of the game included in SWTOR.
I understand some gamers want all pew pew with zero social skills, however some gamers prefer both.
Umm... no. Uncle Owen's story is also written. He was murdered by storm troopers. He never got to be a hero or go on any adventures. He just died face down in the sand like the loser he was.
Burn baby burn I say!
I have to agree that on release, bugs aside, SWG was the most fun I ever had in an MMO. The freedom was the key. And for me too, the best memories.
All srsnesssss aside... this made me laugh.
TOTAL FAIL. You just don't get it. After the CU/NGEs of SWG, there is no SWG that we knew to go back to. 33 professions down to 9. Let that sink in. 33 profession down to 9. Jedi that you worked your ass off for 12 to 18 months to get... now, one of 9 starter professions.
Fear not fanbois, we are not trolls, let's take off your tin foil hat and learn what VAPORWARE is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware
"Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product."
How about neither one? how about I make my own character? Why would I want to be Owen or Skywalker?
When I make my characters , I make them so I can make a name for myself, not to be uncle owen or luke skywalker.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
So you just feel you should claim the NGE was the only problem here. I'm not going to run around lookin for previous posts on another site if you can't properly answer questions on this one. Instead of being vague why don't you try to detail the reasons you quit. This is as ridiculous as people coming to this forum saying something untrue about TOR, where we demand the information to support it, get nothing and then are asked to prove what we say.
Anyways, I'm done talking about this. Getting old always finding myself/others talking about a dead game in the wrong forums.
The assumption in SWG was that you already knew the Star Wars lore and thus, the plot...
Shannia, what you wrote is a perfect description of how outraged SWG players felt. The gamers who didn't experience it, will never understand. Allow me to paint a picture for those who didn't experience it... You play WoW (most of you do anyways) You worked your a$$ off to get to level 80 and get 25 man ICC quality gear... Then Blizz comes out and says btw we are killing off half of the classes, making you re-roll and making everyone level 80. Oh and btw some of the gear you worked your a$$ off to get, will no longer work with your class...eventhough it did before.
There ya go, for those who didn't experience it... it would be just like that... and yes you would be livid.
I quite because of the NGE.
but i know the problem came from way back, and the changes negatively affected my game experience since, as well as that of other people.
[Mod Edit]
No you have failed.. i'm not gonna out and out say it on this site for obvious reasons. But SWG is THERE for you. Gah read between the lines please, so I don't have to spell these things out for people.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
The game is there for you. Learn to do a search or some research and you will find what you are looking for. People are all well aware that the game was changed and people are pissed off. Didn't stop some SWG fans from having it their way.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Amazing how you have to be put into a situation of doubt to provide information as to what was and still is wrong with the game. Wouldn't that have been far more informative then making smartass remarks about the NGE being a WoW wanna be and the fact that SoE is still running it?
Anyways, as I said, done talking about this, this forum is about SWTOR, not SWG.
i dont know what you mean mate.
go back a few pages.
i posted a link on the history of soe's lies. you missed it. not my fault.
and the nge was produced precisely to resemble wow. even if SOE denies it.