I guess it comes down to expectations really, I haven't been paying much attention to either Rift or GW2.
Rift has only just come onto my radar in the last few weeks, from the little I've seen and heard I'm quite interested, I'm not expecting anything drastically different from current MMO's, but it would be nice to find a replacement game for EQ2, thats how I found out about it actually, from a lot of unhappy EQ2 players who seemed to hold this game up as some sort of saviour for those who like EQ2 but are sick of SOE and their rip off Station Cash store.
As for GW2, I'm not sure what the crack is with that game, everytime I seem to read a thread on here it feels like people are just jumping in basically saying 'game x' isn't going to be as good as GW2. For me this is very puzzling as I personally found GW1 to be amongst the worst MMO's I've played, I wouldn't even call it an MMO given the way the game worked and the fact that you only actually played with your group outside of the towns. For that reason alone I've hardly read anything about the game, and if it has the same system in place (I.E. not really an MMO) then I won't be touching GW2.
Back to Rift though, I hope it isn't a 'clone' of WoW, if it is just a case of the game sticking with tried and tested things then thats fine by me, as long as it is polished at launch, has plenty of content, fun to play and isn't highly instanced then I'll be happy.
I agree, GW1 was a complete let down and a waste of money for me. Arena has alot to prove in my eye's before I even consider buying GW2.
You guys havent read a line about GW2 have you??
The game is NOT GW1 2.0
It's like the first thing you learn about GW2 that it will NOT be instanced as GW1...it is open as any other "true" MMORPG out there...just watch some videos, Im very surprised you havent, it is a game with NDA that has probably the most gameplay vids out there...thx to gamescons and so on...
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
A developer announce new feature or some other sort of information about upcoming game and people fill in the blank spots with their imagination. That is how hype and disappointment is created.
Yeah I feel the same way. Rift just looks like another "Stripped down WoW + 1" game. It takes a stripped down version of the WoW formula, adds 1 or 2 features (rifts) and then proceeds to release and fail.
You can see this phenomenon with several other games:
AoC (stripped down WoW + combo based combat)
WAR (stripped down WoW + more PvP)
Aion (stripped down WoW + flying)
All of these games fail for a reason. WoW is great at what it does, a stripped down WoW + 1 game is never go to be preferable to the real deal. Just like the OP said we need innovation or something different. More of the same is just a waste.
Well, going by that.. ANY MMO release is going to be a stripped down WoW. Aion is so freaking different from WoW in so many ways that to call it a stripped down version is absurd.
Just to show another example. i think AOC copied WOW too? But no oh wait.. it looks different because the bars not only go vertical like WOW but they also go horizontal .. i guess they both are same otherwise right?
I haven't even played BETA and i already know more about soul system than those who claim to have played beta.
Just to show another example. i think AOC copied WOW too? But no oh wait.. it looks different because the bars not only go vertical like WOW but they also go horizontal .. i guess they both are same otherwise right?
Quoting a game that failed isn't really helping your argument.
The fact that they said that they can't guarantee any balance and people should figure out on their own which builds are OP?
Yeah, great improvements there..
And you played BETA..wow, such a waste. I wish i had the key. Does WOW offer you 7 sub classes/soul for each calling? that is total of 28 souls. Can you change builds in WOW on the fly? you can in RIFT once you are out of combat. In WOW you are stuck between three different type of skill tress.....not sub classes. Every sub class in RIFT is a complete class in its own, is it the same in WOW? nope.
Originally posted by donkeys
Originally posted by Chilliesauce
Just to show another example. i think AOC copied WOW too? But no oh wait.. it looks different because the bars not only go vertical like WOW but they also go horizontal .. i guess they both are same otherwise right?
Quoting a game that failed isn't really helping your argument.
It helps make a point that visual simialrity doesn't mean same functionality.
Rift took WoWs skill tree system and greatly improved on it. Of coarse you cant see this in this lame pic you posted but nice try.
How did they "greatly improve on it"?
The fact that they said that they can't guarantee any balance and people should figure out on their own which builds are OP?
Yeah, great improvements there..
I m not even a big fan of Rift, and this pic is a piss poor description of how Rifts soul system actually is. Theres alot more to it then WOWs, thats a fact.
I wish comments could be more objective, there are far too many screaming RIFT= Fail because GW" is leet, I have yet to see the success of 1 game negatively impact upon the success of another, games stand or fall on their own merits.
Rift is a standard MMORPG with some added bells & whistles & a LOT of polish, what other game did exactly that, yes WoW did. That's as far as a "WoW clone" Rift gets, it's borrowed from the genre rather than any specific title, just like WoW did, problem is there is a huge audience for whom WoW was their first true MMO & it has blinded them to the wider spectrum.
If there is something game devs should borrow from WoW it is exactly the things that Trion has adopted within Rift, high production values, variety of things to do, lots & lots of polish.
The thing is that the audience for "something truly new & innovative that hasn't been done before" is incredibly bloody small, just look at the niche games out there that offer a slice of that in their titles, add up that whole segment of the industry & it will still be a drop in WoW's bucket, it's just not good business to create something that would be so divergent & revolutionary, as much as the vocal minority would love to see it it would be a niche title, it would be too strange & unrecognisable to gain any kind of serious success it would be for a extremely select & elite audience that could not support it financially.
So truth is any game that aims to be successful is inevitably going to have to have familiarity, inevitably going to have a seen it all before flavour to it, it will be an evolution of a 1 system at a time kind, WAR's PQ system is one such evolutionary element that has given rise to Rifts & GW2s dynamic events, there will be others but the single thing you need to ask with any game, be it a clone, derivative, mmo standard or new revolution is.......
I wish comments could be more objective, there are far too many screaming RIFT= Fail because GW" is leet, I have yet to see the success of 1 game negatively impact upon the success of another, games stand or fall on their own merits.
Rift is a standard MMORPG with some added bells & whistles & a LOT of polish, what other game did exactly that, yes WoW did. That's as far as a "WoW clone" Rift gets, it's borrowed from the genre rather than any specific title, just like WoW did, problem is there is a huge audience for whom WoW was their first true MMO & it has blinded them to the wider spectrum.
* Here I stopped reading. Seriously, Polish? a LOT? Maybe youve been in another Beta... *
Name me a game in beta that was more polished then?
A lot were, I could make a list with thousands of games but what would be the point?
I have a state of the art PC and at max setting the game still runs at sub 30 FPS, while the game doesn't look much better than WoW does. I'm not the only one reporting these performance issues.
So truth is any game that aims to be successful is inevitably going to have to have familiarity, inevitably going to have a seen it all before flavour to it, it will be an evolution of a 1 system at a time kind, WAR's PQ system is one such evolutionary element that has given rise to Rifts & GW2s dynamic events, there will be others but the single thing you need to ask with any game, be it a clone, derivative, mmo standard or new revolution is.......
I couldn't care less if Rift borrowed everything from other MMOs. My biggest concern was the fast and easy leveling curve and 'accessibility' which was the most important reason I left WoW for good and give a finger to other Blizzard games.
It's only stupidity to copy the bad aspects of successful games, or not to acknowledge why they were successful in the first place. Also, I'd call it stupidity to target the same group of players as the giant of all MMOs. Do they really think any of those kids will leave their beloved WoW for some unknown 'Rift' that doesn't even have murlocs.
I was not in beta but everything I've read this far about Rift looks exactly like WoW:Cata. Easy and fast journey to endgame, shallow gameplay, and one gimmick (rifts) that could very well be a seasonal event in any MMO.
This genre needs games that are not neccessarily innovative, but they are well made and target different kind of players.
Name me a game in beta that was more polished then?
Fun is subjective if you don't find it fun look elsewhere, not every game can appeal to everyone after all.
Correction..CLOSED BETA. Give an example of MMO which was this polished in CLOSED beta.
Only one I can think of is Lotro, at least imo. I had no prob's in the slightest running this in closed Beta. Rift does run very well on my med. ranged system though.
Now hear we go. A lot of people that were on the RIFT bandwagon are now jumping off because of a false built up expectation. The same thing will happen with GW2 and it's dynamic events. Are they really any different than RIFTS events, i don't think so.
Quoted for this.
The best bame is always the one we havent experienced yet, GW2 will be no different.
It has PQs, it has chore quests (it just dosent call them that).
Anyhow, wont add more, because it's said below.
You're still going to be running around in the same old fantasy setting doing the same stuff that the first GW had plus zerging into a event that will only affect the playing world for a short time.
With saying this, does that mean GW2 will feel the same as RIFT, who knows since no one has been able to play it. I guess time will tell if GW2 will be more of the same or be some what better than RIFT.
Even though RIFT feels like other games, the biggest problem it has is that it didn't set itself apart from the others. So the game feels no better or worse, just has a been there done that type of vibe.
Lol, what sort of mmo do you people want? A game where your avatar is just dropped into a forest with only a loin cloth and a tooth -pick then left to get on with it? Oh-wait!
Lol, what sort of mmo do you people want? A game where your avatar is just dropped into a forest with only a loin cloth and a tooth -pick then left to get on with it? Oh-wait!
Comments
What Zippsn said ... he pretty much nailed it
You guys havent read a line about GW2 have you??
The game is NOT GW1 2.0
It's like the first thing you learn about GW2 that it will NOT be instanced as GW1...it is open as any other "true" MMORPG out there...just watch some videos, Im very surprised you havent, it is a game with NDA that has probably the most gameplay vids out there...thx to gamescons and so on...
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
It isn't surprising at all.
A developer announce new feature or some other sort of information about upcoming game and people fill in the blank spots with their imagination. That is how hype and disappointment is created.
People are stupid.
That is all.
Have fun playing your "next-generation" MMO.
Collector's editions are scams.
Only because they look similar in design doesn't mean they function similar too. Just shows you know absolutely nothing about soul system.
Rift took WoWs skill tree system and greatly improved on it. Of coarse you cant see this in this lame pic you posted but nice try.
The Brave Do Not Fear The Grave
Just get along with it it's been discussed all over the place:
Yup, Rift is a WoW with a twist(rift, soul system)
end of discussion
And you failed to see that before...
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
Well, going by that.. ANY MMO release is going to be a stripped down WoW. Aion is so freaking different from WoW in so many ways that to call it a stripped down version is absurd.
How did they "greatly improve on it"?
The fact that they said that they can't guarantee any balance and people should figure out on their own which builds are OP?
Yeah, great improvements there..
Collector's editions are scams.
Just to show another example. i think AOC copied WOW too? But no oh wait.. it looks different because the bars not only go vertical like WOW but they also go horizontal .. i guess they both are same otherwise right?
I haven't even played BETA and i already know more about soul system than those who claim to have played beta.
Quoting a game that failed isn't really helping your argument.
Collector's editions are scams.
And you played BETA..wow, such a waste. I wish i had the key. Does WOW offer you 7 sub classes/soul for each calling? that is total of 28 souls. Can you change builds in WOW on the fly? you can in RIFT once you are out of combat. In WOW you are stuck between three different type of skill tress.....not sub classes. Every sub class in RIFT is a complete class in its own, is it the same in WOW? nope.
It helps make a point that visual simialrity doesn't mean same functionality.
I m not even a big fan of Rift, and this pic is a piss poor description of how Rifts soul system actually is. Theres alot more to it then WOWs, thats a fact.
I wish comments could be more objective, there are far too many screaming RIFT= Fail because GW" is leet, I have yet to see the success of 1 game negatively impact upon the success of another, games stand or fall on their own merits.
Rift is a standard MMORPG with some added bells & whistles & a LOT of polish, what other game did exactly that, yes WoW did. That's as far as a "WoW clone" Rift gets, it's borrowed from the genre rather than any specific title, just like WoW did, problem is there is a huge audience for whom WoW was their first true MMO & it has blinded them to the wider spectrum.
If there is something game devs should borrow from WoW it is exactly the things that Trion has adopted within Rift, high production values, variety of things to do, lots & lots of polish.
The thing is that the audience for "something truly new & innovative that hasn't been done before" is incredibly bloody small, just look at the niche games out there that offer a slice of that in their titles, add up that whole segment of the industry & it will still be a drop in WoW's bucket, it's just not good business to create something that would be so divergent & revolutionary, as much as the vocal minority would love to see it it would be a niche title, it would be too strange & unrecognisable to gain any kind of serious success it would be for a extremely select & elite audience that could not support it financially.
So truth is any game that aims to be successful is inevitably going to have to have familiarity, inevitably going to have a seen it all before flavour to it, it will be an evolution of a 1 system at a time kind, WAR's PQ system is one such evolutionary element that has given rise to Rifts & GW2s dynamic events, there will be others but the single thing you need to ask with any game, be it a clone, derivative, mmo standard or new revolution is.......
is it fun?
Name me a game in beta that was more polished then?
Fun is subjective if you don't find it fun look elsewhere, not every game can appeal to everyone after all.
Correction..CLOSED BETA. Give an example of MMO which was this polished in CLOSED beta.
A lot were, I could make a list with thousands of games but what would be the point?
I have a state of the art PC and at max setting the game still runs at sub 30 FPS, while the game doesn't look much better than WoW does. I'm not the only one reporting these performance issues.
How is that polished.
Collector's editions are scams.
The answer is NO
WoW is much more fun than this
I couldn't care less if Rift borrowed everything from other MMOs. My biggest concern was the fast and easy leveling curve and 'accessibility' which was the most important reason I left WoW for good and give a finger to other Blizzard games.
It's only stupidity to copy the bad aspects of successful games, or not to acknowledge why they were successful in the first place. Also, I'd call it stupidity to target the same group of players as the giant of all MMOs. Do they really think any of those kids will leave their beloved WoW for some unknown 'Rift' that doesn't even have murlocs.
I was not in beta but everything I've read this far about Rift looks exactly like WoW:Cata. Easy and fast journey to endgame, shallow gameplay, and one gimmick (rifts) that could very well be a seasonal event in any MMO.
This genre needs games that are not neccessarily innovative, but they are well made and target different kind of players.
Only one I can think of is Lotro, at least imo. I had no prob's in the slightest running this in closed Beta. Rift does run very well on my med. ranged system though.
Lol, what sort of mmo do you people want? A game where your avatar is just dropped into a forest with only a loin cloth and a tooth -pick then left to get on with it? Oh-wait!
Sounds good to me this far.
You guys have been sucked in by Trions extremely cleverly creative use of words.
Their closed beta isnt realy a closed beta, it's an open beta. The closed beta happened with their Alpha testers, and is still happening.
I would like to see Rift do ok and grow, I am not anti Trion, but lets be honest.