GM corruption?

Kost · May 2011

Originally posted by kakasaki
Really Anubisan? There is a fine line between a healthy amount of skepticism and willful blindness. Not sure if you have crossed it yet but, darn if you aren't close...

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

The chat log along with the video does make quite a convincing case. I really hope that SV takes the bull by the horns and addresses the problem directly.. maybe even in a HoC setting since the last few were cancelled. If they just bury their heads and delete the threads it will only make matters worse.

Things I would like to know:

1. How did the "permabanned" guy get access to the game again? He didn't even make it a secret since he posted an "I'm back" thread on the official forums.

2. Did a GM transfer the items/gold to him as the video seems to show?

3. If not, how did this new character get all those books and gold?

3.A If it was duped.. please let us know

3.B If it was traded to him from another player. Please explain how it was possible for a non-GM to trade this to a "yellow-flagged" account that is supposed to have trading restrictions.

3.C If it was traded to him, have you tracked down who traded it and also used the logs to discover where they got all the gold and books?

4. The video clearly shows " Unknown" as the source of the trade which is what shows when a GM is involved. If no GM was involved did this person hack the GM commands as has been done in the past?

5. Gradius (a GM) is seen sending him a whisper in game. Is it possible for a non-GM to make a character with the name of GMs? Wouldn't those be restricted?

6. If it was a "test-server" as some have claimed, how is it possible that someone "permabanned" for hacking would have access to such a server and free interaction with the GM team? This seems extraordinarily unlikely.

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by Anubisan
My point is there is not a single MMO in existence that provides the entire game on a CD/DVD. You ALWAYS have to download the majority of the game client before you can play it. So, by your argument here every MMO company are thieves because none of them provide the entire game in disk form.

No, the difference here is that they sent out BETA discs.. and acknowledged itw as a problem but promised they would send the real discs when the game launched. It's now been a year since the game launched... but no discs. They also promised to freely ship ALL PRELAUNCH UPDATES on DVD. Heck.. they are STILL promoting that in their store:

Boxed Version

EUR 35.96

(incl. VAT EUR 0.00)

Embossed Metal Box
All pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD
Digital Download
Free future digital updates and expansions
Includes one month's game time
Includes shipping fee

THAT is the difference. But let's not get bogged down with the old DVD argument as it's really tangental to this thread. There are plenty of previous discussions about it. Let's stay focused on the specific allegation of GM's giving players large quantities of free gold/items in game. Discuss the DVD issue in an existing thread like this one: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/312573/Company-will-not-send-out-the-Release-DVDs-10-months-after-launch-because-they-dont-want-to-disappoint-customers.html

bezado · May 2011

I do not like Mortal, one worst games I played in long while, but this video is fake man. It was either test server or a free server emulator and like most have commented on a GM in that game doesn't show GM_(name) it will show Anonymous and that underscore GM_ is for the IRC channels not how it shows in game, the person who made that video either is trolling or wanted to get back at the games GM or whatever cause he was found either guilty of something and banned or didn't get what he wanted from a GM. It's fake.

ShortyBible · May 2011

Originally posted by ShortyBible

Originally posted by Anubisan

Originally posted by ShortyBible
This is no argument Sir. I am simply stating the facts. At release MO was over 10 gigs, I refused to download 10 gigs when I paid for the client on media. Of course I expected to download updates, patches expansions etc: The fact is that I spent $75.00 over 2 years ago, and have nothing to show for it.

When a company takes my money and does not fulfill my order that makes them thieves.

So I am not surprise about any shady things I read that might be happenning within the game.

PS. If you I had spent $40.00 for the download version you would have had a point. But i spent $75.00 for the client on media for various reasons.

My point is there is not a single MMO in existence that provides the entire game on a CD/DVD. You ALWAYS have to download the majority of the game client before you can play it. So, by your argument here every MMO company are thieves because none of them provide the entire game in disk form.

Please reread my last post. I will give this one more shot. I paid for a working client on media. I have yet to receive it after almost 2 years. What I recevied from SV was a useless CD with a promise to receive a working client on media at a future date after the game was released. Let me repeat what you seem to have ignored reading. I don't expect the entire game on media, I do expect to download patches, updates, expansions etc;. If SV arn't thieves and they kept my $75.00 USD, could you please tell me what I received of value for that $75.00.

As for being off topic , I think I am well on topic, because I am discussing the corruption that exist in SV to include it's employees.

ShortyBible · May 2011

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by Anubisan

My point is there is not a single MMO in existence that provides the entire game on a CD/DVD. You ALWAYS have to download the majority of the game client before you can play it. So, by your argument here every MMO company are thieves because none of them provide the entire game in disk form.

No, the difference here is that they sent out BETA discs.. and acknowledged itw as a problem but promised they would send the real discs when the game launched. It's now been a year since the game launched... but no discs. They also promised to freely ship ALL PRELAUNCH UPDATES on DVD. Heck.. they are STILL promoting that in their store:

Boxed Version

EUR 35.96

(incl. VAT EUR 0.00)

Embossed Metal Box

All pre-launch updates freely shipped on DVD

Digital Download

Free future digital updates and expansions

Includes one month's game time

Includes shipping fee

THAT is the difference. But let's not get bogged down with the old DVD argument as it's really tangental to this thread. There are plenty of previous discussions about it. Let's stay focused on the specific allegation of GM's giving players large quantities of free gold/items in game

Thank you for clarrfying the issue. I am still upset that I spent $75.00 USD and have yet to receive anything of value for it.

Renoaku · May 2011

Star Vault (SV) Obviously can't be trusted I mean The GM Corruption with them has occur almost in more than one way, and it seems that the GM's in this game are no better than the ones in the old T4C game which all their games servers died out the popular ones anyways.

SV helped a guild siege illegally in the past, Claimed using a hammer to destory a wall was illegal bug, but instead gave a guild an advantage over another, and now this giving items away illegally.

I know how GM's have commands and what they can do in games summoning items, and to me this is exactly what it looks like, while it could be fake, or just another user giving it away how did they get the name called unknown to trade it to him unless he was using a hack and a dual monitor I do not think that this would be possible to fake, but rather GM's illegally helping guilds to make wars and make their game popular or something.

If you want to play a PVP game like Mortal Online, then you are better off just buying Dark Fall, as this game has improved, and is a lot better than Mortal Online any day. It also doesn't have all the GM Corruption like Mortal has.

I mean Eve Online itself had GM Corruption in the past but those GM's were caught too and the items were removed.

Links:

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3924592#3924592

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/361/view/forums/thread/298106/GM-interferes-with-player-siege.html

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/361/view/forums/thread/298204/Were-worried-about-GM-conduct-What-about-the-CEO-himself-.html

So if SV has nothing to hide then why would the GM say this and if they are not doing anything like GM Corruption can they explian this?

[12:43] <[Ely]Arwen> discord stop ignoring your player base we want explanation/statement from starvault

[12:43] <[Ely]Arwen> henrik must answer

[12:43] agree 100%[12:43] <@[GM]Discord>; and say what

[12:44] <@[GM]Discord>; your answer is your not going to get one

[12:44] <@[GM]Discord>; so I suggest you move on

DLangley · May 2011

Please avoid instigating arguments and personal attacks guys. Thanks!

Anubisan · May 2011

Look, I admit that it is possible there is some GM corruption going on here. I am only saying that there is not enough information to say that conclusively at this point. All we have is some guy in a youtube video claiming that that is what is going on. The fact that there are also people bitching about it in IRC does not prove anything other than that a bunch of people are worried that something fishy did go down. Again, I'm not saying that it didn't happen... only that I'm not going to jump to conclusions about it with the information at hand. Still, the player who was involved in all of this is an individual who has been perma-banned at least once by SV in the past and keeps re-purchasing the game and coming back. Someone like this would have plenty of reason to smear SV's image, so this entire story becomes even less plausible to me.

The GM responded in IRC similarly to how I would expect a GM to respond to false accusations of corruption. They have no way of proving anything to the playerbase, so there is no point in trying to come out and give a public statement. If they were to provide logs or video footage of what they believe really happened, people would claim that these are fakes and would not believe them anyway. So what is a GM staff supposed to do in a case like this? Personally, I think they should do nothing. Even acknowledging the issue turns it into a huge deal for a lot of people even though it may be nothing.

Finally, I just have to say that I really hope there is no corruption going on here. I am really enjoying the game and it is the only MMO that I have found since Ultima Online which provides a lot of the features I am looking for. If the GMs are actually corrupt, then this isn't going to be the game for me either. I just hope that isn't the case and I want to give them the benefit of the doubt.

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by Anubisan
Still, the player who was involved in all of this is an individual who has been perma-banned at least once by SV in the past and keeps re-purchasing the game and coming back. Someone like this would have plenty of reason to smear SV's image, so this entire story becomes even less plausible to me.

See.. I can agree in principle, BUT why was his account not deleted? He was "permabanned" but his account was reactivated. Just look on the official forums. He posted a thread saying "Russian is back!!!". This wasn't a new account.. it was an old one, just read his previous posts from months ago. He doesn't try to hide his identity. In post after post.. months ago.. he says that he is "Russian", the guy who supposedly was permabanned but still has access to his account...

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/search.php?searchid=2049487

Very.. VERY strange...

So, I really think my questions listed here: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/4249289 are quite pertinant...

deathshroud · May 2011

from what i can tell and have been told, russian was banned yet again for cheating. Which would explain the reasoning behind the video. Russian says that he argued with the gms to let him return to MO and they agreed considering a lack of evidence on his latest ban (1 of many previous bans) provided he did not return with the same name. Also the gms gave him books and gold to get to a similar level of progress to were his other account was. Some are aying that he recieved more than he should as a sort of bribe to not use his previous character name but no one except the gm and russian know if thats true.

However many people are claiming these videos are infact fake and easily edited or modified. The very fact that it is russian who is a notorious cheater puts alot of doubt on the authenticity of this video.

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by deathshroud
from what i can tell and have been told, russian was banned yet again for cheating. Which would explain the reasoning behind the video. Russian says that he argued with the gms to let him return to MO and they agreed considering a lack of evidence on his latest ban (1 of many previous bans) provided he did not return with the same name. Also the gms gave him books and gold to get to a similar level of progress to were his other account was. Some are aying that he recieved more than he should as a sort of bribe to not use his previous character name but no one except the gm and russian know if thats true.

However many people are claiming these videos are infact fake and easily edited or modified. The very fact that it is russian who is a notorious cheater puts alot of doubt on the authenticity of this video.

OK.. please... just PLEASE read what you wrote.

This guy was "permabanned"... multiple times. That in itself is a paradox.

As you say.. the video creator is a "notorious cheater". So WHY WAS HE LET BACK INTO THE GAME?!? He didn't hide his return. He was posting all over the forums about returning.. and made an "I'm back" thread as well! In his posts from months ago he clearly stated that he was "Russian".. yet was never banned. So again, WHY NOT?

I could understand if he made a new account with new info and tried to sneak back into the game. I really would. But that didn't happen here. He walked through the front door, calling out to anyone that would hear.

Guess what should happen to a known hacker who was permabanned who posts on the forums for MONTHS that he was coming back?!?!? Yeah... that's right.. his account should have been deleted. Apparently the policy is that if you are caught hacking we will ban that single account but you are welcome to continue playing the game under any other accounts. You don't even have to hide your identity.

funkmastaD · May 2011

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by deathshroud

from what i can tell and have been told, russian was banned yet again for cheating. Which would explain the reasoning behind the video. Russian says that he argued with the gms to let him return to MO and they agreed considering a lack of evidence on his latest ban (1 of many previous bans) provided he did not return with the same name. Also the gms gave him books and gold to get to a similar level of progress to were his other account was. Some are aying that he recieved more than he should as a sort of bribe to not use his previous character name but no one except the gm and russian know if thats true.
However many people are claiming these videos are infact fake and easily edited or modified. The very fact that it is russian who is a notorious cheater puts alot of doubt on the authenticity of this video.

OK.. please... just PLEASE read what you wrote.

This guy was "permabanned"... multiple times. That in itself is a paradox.

As you say.. the video creator is a "notorious cheater". So WHY WAS HE LET BACK INTO THE GAME?!? He didn't hide his return. He was posting all over the forums about returning.. and made an "I'm back" thread as well! In his posts from months ago he clearly stated that he was "Russian".. yet was never banned. So again, WHY NOT?

I could understand if he made a new account with new info and tried to sneak back into the game. I really would. But that didn't happen here. He walked through the front door, calling out to anyone that would hear.

Guess what should happen to a known hacker who was permabanned who posts on the forums for MONTHS that he was coming back?!?!? Yeah... that's right.. his account should have been deleted. Apparently the policy is that if you are caught hacking we will ban that single account but you are welcome to continue playing the game under any other accounts. You don't even have to hide your identity.

We don't know he was even ingame. He was banned for hacking the client, are we supposed to ignore this fact when watching that vid? It would explain the older client seen in the vid, anyway... Keep in mind, if you hack the client you don't need to connect to the server, you can just fake it client side. Why else would he wait a few months to release it, since he clearly isn't worried about being caught, why would he troll the forums for a month while sitting on his fraps ? but yeah, never thought I'd hear you complain that MOs forum mods were too lax :P

The above is just wild speculation ofc, but this thread is full of it, so I just wanna throw my hat in the ring.

Toferio · May 2011

Originally posted by deathshroud
However many people are claiming these videos are infact fake and easily edited or modified. The very fact that it is russian who is a notorious cheater puts alot of doubt on the authenticity of this video.

Those claims have as much credibility as me saying Henrik is Michael Jacksons unknown son. There are no proof then the video is fake, except for some fans claiming so. Could the naysayers please point at what point in the video there are any signs of modification? No? Thought so.

kakasaki · May 2011

Originally posted by Anubisan
Look, I admit that it is possible there is some GM corruption going on here. I am only saying that there is not enough information to say that conclusively at this point. All we have is some guy in a youtube video claiming that that is what is going on. The fact that there are also people bitching about it in IRC does not prove anything other than that a bunch of people are worried that something fishy did go down. Again, I'm not saying that it didn't happen... only that I'm not going to jump to conclusions about it with the information at hand. Still, the player who was involved in all of this is an individual who has been perma-banned at least once by SV in the past and keeps re-purchasing the game and coming back. Someone like this would have plenty of reason to smear SV's image, so this entire story becomes even less plausible to me.

The GM responded in IRC similarly to how I would expect a GM to respond to false accusations of corruption. They have no way of proving anything to the playerbase, so there is no point in trying to come out and give a public statement. If they were to provide logs or video footage of what they believe really happened, people would claim that these are fakes and would not believe them anyway. So what is a GM staff supposed to do in a case like this? Personally, I think they should do nothing. Even acknowledging the issue turns it into a huge deal for a lot of people even though it may be nothing.

Finally, I just have to say that I really hope there is no corruption going on here. I am really enjoying the game and it is the only MMO that I have found since Ultima Online which provides a lot of the features I am looking for. If the GMs are actually corrupt, then this isn't going to be the game for me either. I just hope that isn't the case and I want to give them the benefit of the doubt.

Good reply man. And as for me, I was just poking fun, no harm ment. Many games have had issues with questionalble GMs (EvE anyone?) The true test of a company is how it handles the incident and what measures are put in place to prevent further questionable conduct.

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by funkmastaD

Originally posted by Slapshot1188

Originally posted by deathshroud
from what i can tell and have been told, russian was banned yet again for cheating. Which would explain the reasoning behind the video. Russian says that he argued with the gms to let him return to MO and they agreed considering a lack of evidence on his latest ban (1 of many previous bans) provided he did not return with the same name. Also the gms gave him books and gold to get to a similar level of progress to were his other account was. Some are aying that he recieved more than he should as a sort of bribe to not use his previous character name but no one except the gm and russian know if thats true.

However many people are claiming these videos are infact fake and easily edited or modified. The very fact that it is russian who is a notorious cheater puts alot of doubt on the authenticity of this video.

OK.. please... just PLEASE read what you wrote.

This guy was "permabanned"... multiple times.   That in itself is a paradox.

As you say.. the video creator is a "notorious cheater". So WHY WAS HE LET BACK INTO THE GAME?!? He didn't hide his return. He was posting all over the forums about returning.. and made an "I'm back" thread as well!    In his posts from months ago he clearly stated that he was "Russian".. yet was never banned.   So again, WHY NOT?

I could understand if he made a new account with new info and tried to sneak back into the game. I really would. But that didn't happen here. He walked through the front door, calling out to anyone that would hear.

Guess what should happen to a known hacker who was permabanned who posts on the forums for MONTHS that he was coming back?!?!? Yeah... that's right.. his account should have been deleted. Apparently the policy is that if you are caught hacking we will ban that single account but you are welcome to continue playing the game  under any other accounts. You don't even have to hide your identity.

We don't know he was even ingame. He was banned for hacking the client, are we supposed to ignore this fact when watching that vid? It would explain the older client seen in the vid, anyway... Keep in mind, if you hack the client you don't need to connect to the server, you can just fake it client side. Why else would he wait a few months to release it, since he clearly isn't worried about being caught, why would he troll the forums for a month while sitting on his fraps ? but yeah, never thought I'd hear you complain that MOs forum mods were too lax :P The above is just wild speculation ofc, but this thread is full of it, so I just wanna throw my hat in the ring.

Way to miss he point completely.

Everyone agrees that this guy was a known repeat hacker. Everyone agrees that he was "permabanned"

Why was he allowed over many months to keep his other account(s)? In plain site.. broadcasting who he was?

It doesn't appear that he was hiding anything.. it would appear that the powers that be at SV were comfortable with him... as long as it was on a new acct (or accts)

deathshroud · May 2011

im just writing exactly how it is, the fact he has been perma banned beofre or not does not change the facts as understood. Those are the facts as understood by the general mo public make of it as you will.

the gms lacked the real tools to tell if someone was cheating in early beta, quite often people were recieving bans on word of mouth alone or by 1 persons experience especially those who had recived bans previously. Thats why the devs werre giving those banned in beta another chance. Afterall beta had no real anti cheat system in it other than a gm seeing you cheat. I dont mind the fact that they let people back who were previously banned in beta. But the gms should of known exactly how someone like russian would react when presented with an oppertunity to discredit them like this. He is a cheater and a hacker. He does not respect the game or its player base otherwise he wouldnt be cheating. I just cant understand how nieve the gms could have been here.

Toferio · May 2011

New video is up, rather interesting insider insider info, and apparently Henrik had pretty good idea who Basshunter was for while, despite them playing surprised about his "reveal".

deathshroud · May 2011

everyone within the mo community already knew who basshunter was in MO, most didnt know he was also the guy making those arnie videos. But it would have been compeltely wrong had the gms announced "hey we got basshunter palying MO" without his concent.

The reveal was nice for the community and my thanks go out to the guy for making funny videos whilst we all had to wait though downtime. What was retarded was posting this video as an official video because the non-mo communtiy dont understand the ins and outs of his videos or that this isnt any sort of shameful promotional video.

Toferio · May 2011

Originally posted by deathshroud
that this isnt any sort of shameful promotional video.

Actually, it's exactly what it is, despite what SV may claim in public :P

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by deathshroud
im just writing exactly how it is, the fact he has been perma banned beofre or not does not change the facts as understood.

Have to disagree there. The fact that he broadcast he was back certainly indicates that he and SV had reached an accommodation of some sort regarding the removal of his permaban. Of course that doesn't fully prove his video, but it does add weight to the concept that they were accommodating his return...

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by deathshroud
What was retarded was posting this video as an official video because the non-mo communtiy dont understand the ins and outs of his videos or that this isnt any sort of shameful promotional video.

But they ARE in fact being spun as the exact type of promotional video you describe as "shameful" by the CEO himself:

* In May, published by Star Vault to Jonas 'Basshunter' Atlberg revealed that he is behind a film in which he invites friends and fans to play with him. The film is available in his network, including at Facebook where he reaches out to over 1.5 million fans.

That's what went out to the stock holders as part of the financial report for Q1... strange inclusion but it was there none the less...

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=sv&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aktietorget.se%2FNewsItem.aspx%3FID_News%3D58881%26Language%3D2&act=url

deathshroud · May 2011

well if thats the case then it was a dumb move by sv using it as a promotional tool. It should have remained what it was, just a video of a fan of mo goofing around during MO's downtime.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6E20TzLqq4

i have played with this guy on MO as an ally and an enemy so i konw for a fact he actually does paly mo.

Moreplex · May 2011

Originally posted by deathshroud
from what i can tell and have been told, russian was banned yet again for cheating. Which would explain the reasoning behind the video. Russian says that he argued with the gms to let him return to MO and they agreed considering a lack of evidence on his latest ban (1 of many previous bans) provided he did not return with the same name. Also the gms gave him books and gold to get to a similar level of progress to were his other account was. Some are aying that he recieved more than he should as a sort of bribe to not use his previous character name but no one except the gm and russian know if thats true.

However many people are claiming these videos are infact fake and easily edited or modified. The very fact that it is russian who is a notorious cheater puts alot of doubt on the authenticity of this video.

If the GMs gave him stuff to bring him up to speed or to bribe him, that is very very wrong. I have never heard of anything like that happening in a game before in my life. Especially for a person that is a known exploiter. What is SV thinking??!?!?!?!

Also like I said before especially with the new info on Basshunter, Henrik is using him as a spokesperson. It seems from readin about the game since Beta. Henrik throws a lot of favortism around for certian people and or guilds. That should never happen in a MMORPG. Everyone should be on the same level. No one should get privvy info or help and it seems Henrik does not follow that code. I see why the game is doing so bad.

Slapshot1188 · May 2011

Originally posted by Moreplex
If the GMs gave him stuff to bring him up to speed or to bribe him, that is very very wrong. I have never heard of anything like that happening in a game before in my life. Especially for a person that is a known exploiter. What is SV thinking??!?!?!?!

Exactly. That is what is so scary about this. They claimed to have permabanned him.. but he was around on another account for MONTHS (a year?1?) proclaiming that he was the same guy for all to see...

Here are some of the posts where he publicly states this:

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/62147-russian-back.html

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/60154-happy-birthday-henrik-post1120790.html#post1120790

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/59655-mortal-through-ages-post1117004.html#post1117004

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/59770-kranesh-post1114771.html#post1114771

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/59451-russian-looking-place-settle-down-post1110607.html#post1110607

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/58338-yo-yo-russian-here-post1096828.html#post1096828

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/58338-yo-yo-russian-here-post1096615.html#post1096615

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/54716-remembering-beta-combat-russian.html

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/54635-skill-based-game-ya-right-post1040090.html#post1040090

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/54103-los-banditos-teh-epic-post1033496.html#post1033496

http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/49205-russians-everyday-life-cave.html