Let us diverge our attention first from the word "free," and pay attention to the word "play."
Let's take an example. I download Atlantica Online. I PLAY it. I didn't pay anything to play it. Thus, it's free to play. You guys are adding other unecessary definition about free and about play. Take it as it is. Free to play. You can play it for free.
I keep hearing about Free to play games. You download them and you can play them, but are they really free? Mostly they have a cashshop where you buy what you need to enjoy the game, so you pay.. not free. Some like LOTRO's f2p have ways to earn points to get things in the "store" but they also sell those points for cash and make it tedious to actuall earn them in game. I suppose there are games that you can "play" for free, but be competitive? Get to level cap? Through all areas of the game? Without paying.. not really sure if that is true. Seems like a myth to me. Discussion? Because i do think this is the future of mmo's.
I'm currently playing Fallen Earth. It is F2P. I can get every skill level at the same time/rate as everyone else, craft every item, every mount, have tons of bank slots and weapons and be just as competitive as someone using the cs - all completely 100% free.
I have looked at the shop and there is nothing there that I need, and actually nothing I want. I'm wondering how gamersfirst is actually making any money.
Yes. Whats your point, everything I stated is true. I get every skill, can craft every item including mounts, cars and bikes, access all content, have all weapons and equipment completely free.
There is nothing in that shop I want. There are tons of bank slots allready so I don't need any more, I don't need/want either of the shop mounts or the dog, don't need/want the wardrobe slots or the app. The only thing I may want someday is a respec, but not yet. The only thing people who buy things have any advantage on is slightly quicker crafting, but since crafting is offline anyway what do I care. Oh and f2p can only craft 8 hours a day - are you kidding me, 8 hours is a fricken long time.
The game is f2p.
Venge
You asked how they make money...that is how they make money...duh.
Services, mounts, and style...
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
My point on that was that I don't think I am very different from most other people therefore if there is nothing there that I want, likely there is not a lot that other people would want so they won't be making hardly any money at all.
Venge
edit - I don't mind paying either, they are offering a decent game. If they ever offered a mount, or mount recipe that is as fast as the cars/motorcycles I would be all over that one.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
I keep hearing about Free to play games. You download them and you can play them, but are they really free? Mostly they have a cashshop where you buy what you need to enjoy the game, so you pay.. not free. Some like LOTRO's f2p have ways to earn points to get things in the "store" but they also sell those points for cash and make it tedious to actuall earn them in game. I suppose there are games that you can "play" for free, but be competitive? Get to level cap? Through all areas of the game? Without paying.. not really sure if that is true. Seems like a myth to me. Discussion? Because i do think this is the future of mmo's.
I'm currently playing Fallen Earth. It is F2P. I can get every skill level at the same time/rate as everyone else, craft every item, every mount, have tons of bank slots and weapons and be just as competitive as someone using the cs - all completely 100% free.
I have looked at the shop and there is nothing there that I need, and actually nothing I want. I'm wondering how gamersfirst is actually making any money.
Yes. Whats your point, everything I stated is true. I get every skill, can craft every item including mounts, cars and bikes, access all content, have all weapons and equipment completely free.
There is nothing in that shop I want. There are tons of bank slots allready so I don't need any more, I don't need/want either of the shop mounts or the dog, don't need/want the wardrobe slots or the app. The only thing I may want someday is a respec, but not yet. The only thing people who buy things have any advantage on is slightly quicker crafting, but since crafting is offline anyway what do I care. Oh and f2p can only craft 8 hours a day - are you kidding me, 8 hours is a fricken long time.
The game is f2p.
Venge
However small it is, by going F2P you are still compromising, and that's the price you end up paying even if it doesn't involve cash.
That you don't mind paying the small fare is irrelevant to the discussion, it's still not really free. (and not debating whether there really should be anything for free, that's not realistic)
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
No it is free, I can play every point of content in the game free. Every single point. There is not a single peice of content I need to pay for. None, zero zip.
Venge
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
This whole F2P isn't Free type topic is pretty well cooked and over done..
But for the sake of the arguement, it all depends on what you want from your mmo's. If it's PvP/being competitive, then no of course it's not going to be free.. there are other reasons people play games though (but that notion seems to be lost for a lot of people now).
That actually used to be the only real limitation when it came to F2P, you're just not going to be able to keep up with a cashshop player.
But sadly, now thanks to former P2P games gone F2P like DDO/LOTRO/DCUO/etc they are restricting content access too, and I have a feeling as time goes on even originally F2P games are also going to be made with that direction in mind, and my days of playing them casually for $0 will eventually come to an end..
Player: (looks at the car) Hey, this is only the FRAME of a car. Where's the tires, the engine, the freakin paint job!
Dev: I never said it was a running car. You want that?
Player: Of course!
Dev: Well, that's extra and it's it's gonna cost you.
That's pretty much how it goes. My experience with EQ2 extended was pretty much that. The list of what you couldn't do was longer than what you could do. Couldn't wear "master crafted" armor. Couldn't even equip larger bags or use all the slots. EVERYTHING you can get for free in the sub cost you.
Worst part? I subbed. Only to find out the races don't open up. You STILL have to puchase "race packs."
Free to play is not a myth. Let us diverge our attention first from the word "free," and pay attention to the word "play." Let's take an example. I download Atlantica Online. I PLAY it. I didn't pay anything to play it. Thus, it's free to play. You guys are adding other unecessary definition about free and about play. Take it as it is. Free to play. You can play it for free.
By this definition, if you walk into best buy and play a game on their system, then it is f2p.
What F2P actually means to consumers is that you get to play the game, the WHOLE game for free.
No thats just what it means to some consumers. I don't expect to be able to play the whole thing for free, I do expect to play a lot of it for free. That is f2p
Venge
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
No thats just what it means to some consumers. I don't expect to be able to play the whole thing for free, I do expect to play a lot of it for free. That is f2p
Venge
So you agree that it is a bad term then.
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
No thats just what it means to some consumers. I don't expect to be able to play the whole thing for free, I do expect to play a lot of it for free. That is f2p
Venge
So you agree that it is a bad term then.
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I think the term is just fine, however more specificity is always a good thing. I get to play for free, thats all it says, it's all I get.
Venge
edit - If I can get all of the content free I consider it f2p, if I have to pay something for content I consider it mostly f2p. I don't consider some fluff (if all fluff is cs that isa problem), potions content.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
No thats just what it means to some consumers. I don't expect to be able to play the whole thing for free, I do expect to play a lot of it for free. That is f2p
Venge
So you agree that it is a bad term then.
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I think the term is just fine, however more specificity is always a good thing. I get to play for free, thats all it says, it's all I get.
Venge
edit - If I can get all of the content free I consider it f2p, if I have to pay something for content I consider it mostly f2p. I don't consider some fluff (if all fluff is cs that isa problem), potions content.
Guessing that they've not updated that yet. Course, it only went "F2P" on what Oct 11th-12th? Updating their FAQ with any info on the game being "F2P" was probably easily overlooked...
Have to say that it is funny that they refer to the different levels as:
Commander (pays the most)
Wastelander (pays the middle)
Survivalist (pays the least)
Scavenger (pays nothing)
Scavenger - an organism that typically feeds on refuse or carrion, a garbage collector, a junk collector.
The Scavenger gets a single character, limited chips, 8 hours crafting/day, no supporter gift, 50 reward points, no global chat, no market discount, slower crafting speed (on top of a limited amount of time you can craft), slower salvaging speed, lower EXP, lower AP, and lower faction gain...
...but their insults of the free player aside, even though it is limited - grind increased - etc...
...it is a form of F2P. You're definitely playing...
Kind of like walking is a way to work, as others take public transportation or drive.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
No thats just what it means to some consumers. I don't expect to be able to play the whole thing for free, I do expect to play a lot of it for free. That is f2p
Venge
So you agree that it is a bad term then.
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I think the term is just fine, however more specificity is always a good thing. I get to play for free, thats all it says, it's all I get.
Venge
edit - If I can get all of the content free I consider it f2p, if I have to pay something for content I consider it mostly f2p. I don't consider some fluff (if all fluff is cs that isa problem), potions content.
Guessing that they've not updated that yet. Course, it only went "F2P" on what Oct 11th-12th? Updating their FAQ with any info on the game being "F2P" was probably easily overlooked...
Have to say that it is funny that they refer to the different levels as:
Commander (pays the most)
Wastelander (pays the middle)
Survivalist (pays the least)
Scavenger (pays nothing)
Scavenger - an organism that typically feeds on refuse or carrion, a garbage collector, a junk collector.
The Scavenger gets a single character, limited chips, 8 hours crafting/day, no supporter gift, 50 reward points, no global chat, no market discount, slower crafting speed (on top of a limited amount of time you can craft), slower salvaging speed, lower EXP, lower AP, and lower faction gain...
...but their insults of the free player aside, even though it is limited - grind increased - etc...
...it is a form of F2P. You're definitely playing...
Kind of like walking is a way to work, as others take public transportation or drive.
Except it isn't like that. I'm doing the f2p, haven't bought anything. I get so far unlimited chips, have 3 characters, 8 hours crafting, salvaging speed is the same, same faction gain, same xp, global chat. There is no difference between free and subsription except the subscribers get more than 8 hours crafting per day, and slightly faster crafting. whic his how I wonder if they are making any money at all.
This may be bad to say, but I'm thinking they gave away too much. I don't really want the game to close, but they have nothing I want to buy.
Venge
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
My objection to most F2P is their overall playing mechanics are heavily influenced by their payment model.
I agree on this. Design a blatantly obvious limitation into the game mechanics, then SELL the solution to the limitation. It creates a market for the solution (the free access to the game), the demand for the solution (the limitation) and the solution itself for the payment of cash.
I'm not one to completely discount Free to Play as a myth. It is possible to play and enjoy the game if one can accept the limitations, at least in some games.
One aspect that I do find a bit unusual is "Achiever" mentality in Free to Play. There's a blur between achiever and consumer when what you achieve was obtained via credit card. Sort of like these costumes of mine in GW. I don't consider having them as an achievement. Bought and paid for. But I'm okay with it. My purchase helped support the game, and there wasn't any sort of built in limitation I was avoiding. I just thought they looked cool.
Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now working in Network Security. I don't Forum PVP. If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident. When I don't understand, I ask. Such is not intended as criticism.
Personally I find that free to play can go either way. Sometimes you'll find free to play games like league of legends, where you can buy skins. I think you may be able to buy champions but they generally don't provide some distinct advantage and they can still be earned for free. Team fortress is another good example of free to play done right. You can find all of the items or buy them. Then some games just go post battlefield heroes beta, payments for any kind of advantage in addition to the visual stuff. If you're mad I didn't try to put more negative examples I'm sleepy and have a headache, give me a break.
My objection to most F2P is their overall playing mechanics are heavily influenced by their payment model.
I agree on this. Design a blatantly obvious limitation into the game mechanics, then SELL the solution to the limitation. It creates a market for the solution (the free access to the game), the demand for the solution (the limitation) and the solution itself for the payment of cash.
But... we've seen how this is really no different than the B2P nor P2P models. Both of them involve playing mechanics that are heavily influenced by the payment method.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Let us diverge our attention first from the word "free," and pay attention to the word "play."
Let's take an example. I download Atlantica Online. I PLAY it. I didn't pay anything to play it. Thus, it's free to play. You guys are adding other unecessary definition about free and about play. Take it as it is. Free to play. You can play it for free.
By this definition, if you walk into best buy and play a game on their system, then it is f2p.
What F2P actually means to consumers is that you get to play the game, the WHOLE game for free.
Ugh. Why do so many people in mmorpg.com like to use analogies? lol. Analogies are used to make a person understand your point. It's not always effective when used to simulate another situation since it will not be exactly the same.
Anyway, nobody officially dictated that F2P means playing the whole game for free. It's just what you want to believe in. If we just look at the statement as to what it is without adding anything else, free to play is being able to play the game for free. No more, no less. There's no added clause like "free to play everything" or whatever other clause you want to add.
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I think what would end the F2P debate is people realizing that most know exactly what the point of the model is. Most know exactly what they're getting, and most know nothing is truly free.
Basically people need to put an end to the overly righteous knight in shinning armor posting habits.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Basically people need to put an end to the overly righteous knight in shinning armor posting habits.
NEVAR! OPEN YOUR EYES, SHEEPLE! You are being LIED to! LIED, I SAY! But I, Donus Quixotus The Great, will Open your Eyes and explain to you how stupid you are believing the false advetrisement (even though nobody believes it, but that's not the point! The point is that I'm smart and you are stupid sheeple!)
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I think what would end the F2P debate is people realizing that most know exactly what the point of the model is. Most know exactly what they're getting, and most know nothing is truly free.
Basically people need to put an end to the overly righteous knight in shinning armor posting habits.
Actually, I think it is more a case of some us see a cow. We call it a cow. Some see the cow and call it a book. We ask them why they call it a book. They say because it is a book. We show them what a book is. We then point to the cow again, and we ask them what it is. They say it is a book. We bring them another book. This time we bring a book about farm animals. Inside this book, we show them a picture of a cow. The picture is clearly labeled. The label reads cow. We close the book, point to the cow, and ask them what it is. They say it is a book.
You see it as being overly righteous. We do not need to save the world. We do not need to teach the world that a cow is a cow and a book is a book. How is that our place?
We should stand back, and let those that call a cow a book - teach others that the cow is a book?
"All that is necessary for cows to be books is for those that know better to do nothing..."
{mod edit}
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Actually, I think it is more a case of some us see a cow. We call it a cow. Some see the cow and call it a book. We ask them why they call it a book. They say because it is a book. We show them what a book is. We then point to the cow again, and we ask them what it is. They say it is a book. We bring them another book. This time we bring a book about farm animals. Inside this book, we show them a picture of a cow. The picture is clearly labeled. The label reads cow. We close the book, point to the cow, and ask them what it is. They say it is a book.
You see it as being overly righteous. We do not need to save the world. We do not need to teach the world that a cow is a cow and a book is a book. How is that our place?
We should stand back, and let those that call a cow a book - teach others that the cow is a book?
"All that is necessary for cows to be books is for those that know better to do nothing..."
{mod edit}
{mod edit} Not sure why my statement about your comparison was erased. Again your comparison makes no logical sense.
It's quite simple really to describe what F2P is, it's a sampling of what an overall product offers, you can indulge in the free sample all you want, but to get the whole pie you either pay a sub as per normal, or buy a la carte. What is there more to say than that?
Do you stand next to a pie sampling in your local grocery store telling people to stay away that sample isn't free, if you want the whole pie you have to pay for it? Try it one day and see the reactions you get. I'm sure it will look a lot like this O,o
It's a matter of common sense, a service like this is not going to be totally free. That's why I feel it's a pointless debate, no one needs Captain Obvious to point it out to them.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
No it is free, I can play every point of content in the game free. Every single point. There is not a single peice of content I need to pay for. None, zero zip.
Venge
There's absolutely nothing in the cash shop (regardless whether you need it or not) that is only available it and not to players who chose not to play?
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
No it is free, I can play every point of content in the game free. Every single point. There is not a single peice of content I need to pay for. None, zero zip.
Venge
There's absolutely nothing in the cash shop (regardless whether you need it or not) that is only available it and not to players who chose not to play?
If so then the game is a rare exception.
Actually, many item malls make all of their goods tradeable. So therefore, in practice, you don't have to pay real money to access to any item mall item.
Sure, it will take you a longer time to access it, but you don't have to pay real money for it, which is what your question implied.
Comments
Free to play is not a myth.
Let us diverge our attention first from the word "free," and pay attention to the word "play."
Let's take an example. I download Atlantica Online. I PLAY it. I didn't pay anything to play it. Thus, it's free to play. You guys are adding other unecessary definition about free and about play. Take it as it is. Free to play. You can play it for free.
You asked how they make money...that is how they make money...duh.
Services, mounts, and style...
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
My point on that was that I don't think I am very different from most other people therefore if there is nothing there that I want, likely there is not a lot that other people would want so they won't be making hardly any money at all.
Venge
edit - I don't mind paying either, they are offering a decent game. If they ever offered a mount, or mount recipe that is as fast as the cars/motorcycles I would be all over that one.
However small it is, by going F2P you are still compromising, and that's the price you end up paying even if it doesn't involve cash.
That you don't mind paying the small fare is irrelevant to the discussion, it's still not really free. (and not debating whether there really should be anything for free, that's not realistic)
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
No it is free, I can play every point of content in the game free. Every single point. There is not a single peice of content I need to pay for. None, zero zip.
Venge
This whole F2P isn't Free type topic is pretty well cooked and over done..
But for the sake of the arguement, it all depends on what you want from your mmo's. If it's PvP/being competitive, then no of course it's not going to be free.. there are other reasons people play games though (but that notion seems to be lost for a lot of people now).
That actually used to be the only real limitation when it came to F2P, you're just not going to be able to keep up with a cashshop player.
But sadly, now thanks to former P2P games gone F2P like DDO/LOTRO/DCUO/etc they are restricting content access too, and I have a feeling as time goes on even originally F2P games are also going to be made with that direction in mind, and my days of playing them casually for $0 will eventually come to an end..
A better example would be:
Dev/car salesman: Hey, you want a free car?
Player/buyer: What's the catch?
Dev: No catch. It's yours.
Player: (looks at the car) Hey, this is only the FRAME of a car. Where's the tires, the engine, the freakin paint job!
Dev: I never said it was a running car. You want that?
Player: Of course!
Dev: Well, that's extra and it's it's gonna cost you.
That's pretty much how it goes. My experience with EQ2 extended was pretty much that. The list of what you couldn't do was longer than what you could do. Couldn't wear "master crafted" armor. Couldn't even equip larger bags or use all the slots. EVERYTHING you can get for free in the sub cost you.
Worst part? I subbed. Only to find out the races don't open up. You STILL have to puchase "race packs."
I unsubbed. Never looked back.
By this definition, if you walk into best buy and play a game on their system, then it is f2p. What F2P actually means to consumers is that you get to play the game, the WHOLE game for free.Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
No thats just what it means to some consumers. I don't expect to be able to play the whole thing for free, I do expect to play a lot of it for free. That is f2p
Venge
So you agree that it is a bad term then.
It should not be F2P....but it should be PALOIFF...
Honesty in adverstising (an oxymoron, I know) - would end most of the F2P debate.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
I think the term is just fine, however more specificity is always a good thing. I get to play for free, thats all it says, it's all I get.
Venge
edit - If I can get all of the content free I consider it f2p, if I have to pay something for content I consider it mostly f2p. I don't consider some fluff (if all fluff is cs that isa problem), potions content.
I'm still confused by the whole Fallen Earth thing. You go to the site and look at the FAQ: http://www.gamersfirst.com/fallenearth/?q=faqs
Guessing that they've not updated that yet. Course, it only went "F2P" on what Oct 11th-12th? Updating their FAQ with any info on the game being "F2P" was probably easily overlooked...
Ah, it is in the forums though: http://forums.gamersfirst.com/topic/223536-f2p-faq/
Which hints at limitations. Ah, because the game is not "F2P"... it is a Freemium game. There are three subscription options: http://www.gamersfirst.com/fallenearth/?q=premium-subscriptions
Ah, you can see the differences between the different levels - Premiums and Scavenger: http://www.gamersfirst.com/fallenearth/sites/www.gamersfirst.com.fallenearth/files/popup_matrix.png
Have to say that it is funny that they refer to the different levels as:
Commander (pays the most)
Wastelander (pays the middle)
Survivalist (pays the least)
Scavenger (pays nothing)
Scavenger - an organism that typically feeds on refuse or carrion, a garbage collector, a junk collector.
The Scavenger gets a single character, limited chips, 8 hours crafting/day, no supporter gift, 50 reward points, no global chat, no market discount, slower crafting speed (on top of a limited amount of time you can craft), slower salvaging speed, lower EXP, lower AP, and lower faction gain...
...but their insults of the free player aside, even though it is limited - grind increased - etc...
...it is a form of F2P. You're definitely playing...
Kind of like walking is a way to work, as others take public transportation or drive.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
Except it isn't like that. I'm doing the f2p, haven't bought anything. I get so far unlimited chips, have 3 characters, 8 hours crafting, salvaging speed is the same, same faction gain, same xp, global chat. There is no difference between free and subsription except the subscribers get more than 8 hours crafting per day, and slightly faster crafting. whic his how I wonder if they are making any money at all.
This may be bad to say, but I'm thinking they gave away too much. I don't really want the game to close, but they have nothing I want to buy.
Venge
I agree on this. Design a blatantly obvious limitation into the game mechanics, then SELL the solution to the limitation. It creates a market for the solution (the free access to the game), the demand for the solution (the limitation) and the solution itself for the payment of cash.
I'm not one to completely discount Free to Play as a myth. It is possible to play and enjoy the game if one can accept the limitations, at least in some games.
One aspect that I do find a bit unusual is "Achiever" mentality in Free to Play. There's a blur between achiever and consumer when what you achieve was obtained via credit card. Sort of like these costumes of mine in GW. I don't consider having them as an achievement. Bought and paid for. But I'm okay with it. My purchase helped support the game, and there wasn't any sort of built in limitation I was avoiding. I just thought they looked cool.
Personally I find that free to play can go either way. Sometimes you'll find free to play games like league of legends, where you can buy skins. I think you may be able to buy champions but they generally don't provide some distinct advantage and they can still be earned for free. Team fortress is another good example of free to play done right. You can find all of the items or buy them. Then some games just go post battlefield heroes beta, payments for any kind of advantage in addition to the visual stuff. If you're mad I didn't try to put more negative examples I'm sleepy and have a headache, give me a break.
But... we've seen how this is really no different than the B2P nor P2P models. Both of them involve playing mechanics that are heavily influenced by the payment method.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
Ugh. Why do so many people in mmorpg.com like to use analogies? lol. Analogies are used to make a person understand your point. It's not always effective when used to simulate another situation since it will not be exactly the same.
Anyway, nobody officially dictated that F2P means playing the whole game for free. It's just what you want to believe in. If we just look at the statement as to what it is without adding anything else, free to play is being able to play the game for free. No more, no less. There's no added clause like "free to play everything" or whatever other clause you want to add.
I think what would end the F2P debate is people realizing that most know exactly what the point of the model is. Most know exactly what they're getting, and most know nothing is truly free.
Basically people need to put an end to the overly righteous knight in shinning armor posting habits.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Nothing will end this debate as it is entirely pointless.
People make constructs based on their misconceptions and erroneous premises thus it is never ending circle of fallacy...
NEVAR! OPEN YOUR EYES, SHEEPLE! You are being LIED to! LIED, I SAY! But I, Donus Quixotus The Great, will Open your Eyes and explain to you how stupid you are believing the false advetrisement (even though nobody believes it, but that's not the point! The point is that I'm smart and you are stupid sheeple!)
PREPARE TO BE SAVED!!!
Actually, I think it is more a case of some us see a cow. We call it a cow. Some see the cow and call it a book. We ask them why they call it a book. They say because it is a book. We show them what a book is. We then point to the cow again, and we ask them what it is. They say it is a book. We bring them another book. This time we bring a book about farm animals. Inside this book, we show them a picture of a cow. The picture is clearly labeled. The label reads cow. We close the book, point to the cow, and ask them what it is. They say it is a book.
You see it as being overly righteous. We do not need to save the world. We do not need to teach the world that a cow is a cow and a book is a book. How is that our place?
We should stand back, and let those that call a cow a book - teach others that the cow is a book?
"All that is necessary for cows to be books is for those that know better to do nothing..."
{mod edit}
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
If I want to read from cow's sides, and call it a book, what's in it for you?
Just block me. Like I've blocked you. Win-win!
{mod edit} Not sure why my statement about your comparison was erased. Again your comparison makes no logical sense.
It's quite simple really to describe what F2P is, it's a sampling of what an overall product offers, you can indulge in the free sample all you want, but to get the whole pie you either pay a sub as per normal, or buy a la carte. What is there more to say than that?
Do you stand next to a pie sampling in your local grocery store telling people to stay away that sample isn't free, if you want the whole pie you have to pay for it? Try it one day and see the reactions you get. I'm sure it will look a lot like this O,o
It's a matter of common sense, a service like this is not going to be totally free. That's why I feel it's a pointless debate, no one needs Captain Obvious to point it out to them.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
There's absolutely nothing in the cash shop (regardless whether you need it or not) that is only available it and not to players who chose not to play?
If so then the game is a rare exception.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Actually, many item malls make all of their goods tradeable. So therefore, in practice, you don't have to pay real money to access to any item mall item.
Sure, it will take you a longer time to access it, but you don't have to pay real money for it, which is what your question implied.