I will log in the day it happens and play for a week. If I see a positive result in terms of player numbers SOE can have my sub again. If I don't...
I would love to start the game again with a new character on my old server and actually be able to meet new people and get good groups for the journey to 90.
I hate playing solo even more then I hate cash shops, but at least I can ignore cash shops in general in games that allow me to sub.
All this relies on SOE getting the word out though OFC... which is hardly their strong point historically. We shall see.
Problem is this line: "The F2P players will be under the same restrictions that currently exist on the Everquest II Extended server."
Yeah, no thanks. If I play a game converted to F2P, it will probably be L2. Lineage 2 is doing it right.... offer all the content for free and sell vanity / fluff items & exp potions in the shop. The restrictions in EQ2 F2P are insane... and they have a cash shop on top of it.
what about EQI? You would think a game that old would go f2p first.
Haha, that's a good point. You'd think that they would have only a skeleton crew running EQ1 but that thing still gets one expansion per year.
The EQ1 crowd is probably more comfortable with the subscription model so there would be no reason to change that for now.
"Does SoE not realize that people don't take free games seriously?" -goozmania
In your circle, and definitely on these forums, that is the case. However, for the majority of MMO gamers, the words 'serious' and 'games' often have nothing to do with each other. SOE probably realizes how most people want to pay for their online entertainment. After all, if they are the evil, greedy soulless corporation that people around here say they are, then logically they would shift to a business model that most people would prefer, thus maximizing their profits. Right?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Im thinking this also may signal the end of the station all access plan as well. Matrix is gone, SWG will soon be gone, EQ2 is going FTP and PotBS went FTP some time ago. What's left? Planetside and Vanguard? Oh, and EQ1. Hard to imagine many people sticking with it, even if its only 20 bucks. That's just not enough options anymore to make it worth it. I imagine that all access option wont be around too much longer... at least not until EQ Next and PS2 release, and those will likely be FTP models as well, if this article is any indication.
All Acess counts as Gold and gives you everything you had before... nothing has actually changed in reality for AA subbers. If it was value to you before chances are it still will be.
So.. is this basically saying the official servers are now going to be like EQ2X? if so I say screw you Sony, I already went to EQ2X and paid for my stuff just cus EQ2 official wasn't free, I don't wish to have to pay for the same stuff again just to go back to playing on the official servers, especially since I've already been playing races that aren't available for free on Antonia Bayle server. Shame they are charging for races and classes unlike games such as LOTRO, I was actually able to resume my character with no charges at all and at least what you might want to pay for you can earn tokens ingame to get them for nothing! Ok, so they have to make some money to keep the company going, but they're still ripping off us old players, what will we get out of all this? probably nothing, probably will have to pay to resume our characters, screw that.
EverQuest II feeling Lineage II F2P breath and fears competition..?
Odly enough, with the coming of L2 GoD, I decided to drop L2 and return to EQ2... Lets hope this new F2P will be worth it in the end. I do like the Dungeon Builder feature coming a lot already *grabs old AD&D DMG*
EQ2 and L2 have never been in competition, they are completely different games and different markets.
Saying that though, I do agree that L2's model is better and in all honety I was hoping to see something closer from SOE here.
Full access to content that exists in game right now and charge for anything new would have been cleverer on their part.
I was always baffled wit the segregation, now we know why, it was in development this entire time, feel sorry for those who moved over to the "experimental server" as SOE used to always say, i guess you did have warning.
This is going to be the best thing for that game. Might check it out.
Ok so would this mean that station pass people will get the expansions for free? Extended unlocks all expansions does it not? I am thinking I am running out of reasons to keep a station pass. lol.
I can only hope they change the model if they do go F2P fully. Right now, the subscription world is vastly better then the EQ2X in terms of value for your buck. I know they want money, but they really force subscribers to play such large amounts of cash extra, comparing alone to their very own game.
Fat chanse.
I am sured they saw the same hing as you and decided to charge more on all servers instead of just the EQ2X servers.
This used to be a great game but since the day they started the RMT shop in the P2P version (which was before EQ2X and I think it was the first RMT shop in a P2P game) the game started to go downhill fast.
SOE is far from the only greedy MMO company, but they are the worst. And this is comming from someone that played EQ2 5 years until I finally quit for good this spring.
EQ2 was just after EoF released one of the most fun MMOs out there, but it to me it just went downhill after that.
Well, splitting the community in to live and extended halves in the first place was monumentally stupid. This is a good move in that regard.
Also, I am glad to see that they are no longer treating gold subscribers like a second class of subscriber. but then it didn't really get better for the regular subscribers, all SOE did was just not give them less for the same price. Not exactly an impressive achievment.
However, I must stay that I am "impressed" that they some how found a way to pull off having an f2p cashshop + subscription to get full access + full priced expansions that add only game features and no actual content.
The game is fun and has a ton of features and content but playing it makes me feel co-dependant. "No, really I just... uh... fell down the stairs last night, that's the only reason my wallet is so bruised, really."
It doesn't go F2P, it just adds some more paying options and extends the cash shop.
Well, no one wins in this situation, maybe SOE at first, but when the new "omg EQ2 is free" thing will wash away, it will be back to what it was, plus worse community.
Problem is this line: "The F2P players will be under the same restrictions that currently exist on the Everquest II Extended server."
Yeah, no thanks. If I play a game converted to F2P, it will probably be L2. Lineage 2 is doing it right.... offer all the content for free and sell vanity / fluff items & exp potions in the shop. The restrictions in EQ2 F2P are insane... and they have a cash shop on top of it.
Yeah, but in L2 you're going to end up buying gold from 3rd party vendors or botting it yourself in order to keep yourself well geared.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I guess it is time to post this link to one of PA's best "extra credits" episodes.
SOE is exactly a premier example of a western company converting to F2P soley for the purpose of squeezing every last cent they can out of a market. That might sound like sensible capitalism but keep in mind that brand loyalty and customer satisfaction is a huge factor in a free market. I think they are burning their long term customer loyalty for near term quarterly returns. They are simply not getting it except for maybe the part where they got rid of the "power items" from the market place. but then again they didn't say that they wouldn't come back.
Ultimately I think L2 will end up being a more popular model. Lots of people questioned the marketing blurb "truly free". It become painfully clear what they were comparing themselves too when you consider SOE's definition of f2p.
I can only hope they change the model if they do go F2P fully. Right now, the subscription world is vastly better then the EQ2X in terms of value for your buck. I know they want money, but they really force subscribers to play such large amounts of cash extra, comparing alone to their very own game.
Fat chanse.
I am sured they saw the same hing as you and decided to charge more on all servers instead of just the EQ2X servers.
This used to be a great game but since the day they started the RMT shop in the P2P version (which was before EQ2X and I think it was the first RMT shop in a P2P game) the game started to go downhill fast.
SOE is far from the only greedy MMO company, but they are the worst. And this is comming from someone that played EQ2 5 years until I finally quit for good this spring.
EQ2 was just after EoF released one of the most fun MMOs out there, but it to me it just went downhill after that.
Totally. In addition to being greedy bastards, I heard they helped Osama blow up the twin towers as well
This move might actually be what makes me stop playing this game. I didn't like the EQ2X server community at all. Now there is a chance people like that will move over to any server? Great, so now I get to hear endless free players vs. paying players whines and hearing about how WoW is this, that and the other thing in global chat.
I also hope that all armor, weapons, and rare crafting materials are removed from the cash shop. Otherwise the economy will bomb.
Ok so would this mean that station pass people will get the expansions for free? Extended unlocks all expansions does it not? I am thinking I am running out of reasons to keep a station pass. lol.
no, the gold subscription which you get from having a station pass, only gives you access to content though sentinal's fate. Access to the continent of Velious can only be gotten by ALSO buying that expansion. Further, access to the new beastlord class and the other features of the upcoming expansion can only be had by buying Age of Discovery. To have the most complete access you need to both buy AoD AND get a subscription. So basically, what it has always costed only now your game includes a F2P cash shop and the socially inept antics of a largely F2P playerbase.
This move might actually be what makes me stop playing this game. I didn't like the EQ2X server community at all. Now there is a chance people like that will move over to any server? Great, so now I get to hear endless free players vs. paying players whines and hearing about how WoW is this, that and the other thing in global chat.
I also hope that all armor, weapons, and rare crafting materials are removed from the cash shop. Otherwise the economy will bomb.
"Power items" like the potions, self-rez scrolls, tradeskill items, master craft armor and the weapons have been removed. One of their few good moves. However they may reintroduce them back after getting player feed back. I read that to mean that they intend to bring them back but they want to be able to blame it on popular opinion and all the people who have been "begging" for it. Keep in mind that it will not take long for the f2p population to overwhelm the existing p2p vets. How do you think a lot of those folks will vote?
I also think this is going to be bad for the community. While I like the idea of the community growing again it would be better if it did so gradually and the new folks had time to be assimilated into the existing culture. Oh well.
Ok so would this mean that station pass people will get the expansions for free? Extended unlocks all expansions does it not? I am thinking I am running out of reasons to keep a station pass. lol.
no, the gold subscription which you get from having a station pass, only gives you access to content though sentinal's fate. Access to the continent of Velious can only be gotten by ALSO buying that expansion. Further, access to the new beastlord class and the other features of the upcoming expansion can only be had by buying Age of Discovery. To have the most complete access you need to both buy AoD AND get a subscription. So basically, what it has always costed only now your game includes a F2P cash shop and the socially inept antics of a largely F2P playerbase.
The only change for existing players is that they will have more people to group with (in theory) everything else is exactly the same as it was before.
My advice to people who have never played it before: Pay the $5 for the silver membership and dont listen to anyone else's views on their f2p model. You might be surprised to find that its nowhere near as restrictive as some would have you believe.
It *is* designed to get you hooked on the game so you sub, it is *not* designed to nickel and dime you to death (although if you want to play endgame content without a sub it may do that)
Keep in mind that it will not take long for the f2p population to overwhelm the existing p2p vets. How do you think a lot of those folks will vote?
They will vote against it most likely. Hardcore raiders are the types that want to pay for power, and eq2, while it has good raid content, is not centered around hardcore raiders. no one really used the potions and stuff on eq2x.
To have the most complete access you need to both buy AoD AND get a subscription. So basically, what it has always costed only now your game includes a F2P cash shop and the socially inept antics of a largely F2P playerbase.
It does NOT include a f2p cash shop (you fail at reading comprehension i suppose) and the eq2x and lotro player bases are really not that much different.
Its not like its going after the Perfect World or Runes of Magic demographic.
Jeezus, they're talking about "special offers" and "rebates"... Omg... they really lost it. Do they really think that a few bucks here or there is a major factor in whether I choose to spend my very valuable time on a game or not?
Wtf is this? Wal-mart?
Cripes. That's what you get when you have bean counters completely taking over a gaming company... Those people would really do better selling cheap chinese shirts or something rather than trying to make it in entertainment... and as a professional I would know. What they're doing is going against EVERYTHING in enterainment business.
To have the most complete access you need to both buy AoD AND get a subscription. So basically, what it has always costed only now your game includes a F2P cash shop and the socially inept antics of a largely F2P playerbase.
It does NOT include a f2p cash shop (you fail at reading comprehension i suppose) and the eq2x and lotro player bases are really not that much different.
Its not like its going after the Perfect World or Runes of Magic demographic.
It has had a cash shop that was and is largely based on other free to play games. This cash shop will also be the main source of revenue generation from the incoming free to play population. EQ2 has been a subscription game that also has a f2p style cash shop.
Please enlighten as to where my reading comprehension failed?
"Power items" like the potions, self-rez scrolls, tradeskill items, master craft armor and the weapons have been removed. One of their few good moves. However they may reintroduce them back after getting player feed back. I read that to mean that they intend to bring them back but they want to be able to blame it on popular opinion and all the people who have been "begging" for it. Keep in mind that it will not take long for the f2p population to overwhelm the existing p2p vets. How do you think a lot of those folks will vote?
I also think this is going to be bad for the community. While I like the idea of the community growing again it would be better if it did so gradually and the new folks had time to be assimilated into the existing culture. Oh well.
I meant that they would be permanently removed, but it has been a long day at work and commuting back home, so I left out "permanently". I think like you do, that those things will be added back. That is what makes me think that this game is going downhill, well that and the community might start sucking.
To be honest, I don't know how a lot of those folks would vote. Do people on Extended buy power items? I was there for several months at the start, so around that time people were not buying much of anything. They were trying to play as much as it was possible for free.
The thing that irritates me about this is that it isn't so much flexible options as it is allowing people onto formerly only pay-to-play servers that don't want to pay subs. I remember P2P players saying they didn't want F2P on their servers... period and that is why the Extended server was made. If I want to play my fae Conjuror, I still have to pay something. If I stop paying my sub, my fae Conjuror will be off limits, right? I still have to fork out money at some point, whether it is the rather steep "price of entry" to unlock the class and race pack, but then to have all of the bags, bank space, money, gear, spell levels, etc., I have to pay even more. It doesn't make sense for a player like me to ever get rid of the sub, so there is no additional level of flexibilty of payment options at all...
Comments
I am looking forward to this! Just a couple days ago i was about to re-sub to play but decided not to, now i can play all i want!
I will log in the day it happens and play for a week. If I see a positive result in terms of player numbers SOE can have my sub again. If I don't...
I would love to start the game again with a new character on my old server and actually be able to meet new people and get good groups for the journey to 90.
I hate playing solo even more then I hate cash shops, but at least I can ignore cash shops in general in games that allow me to sub.
All this relies on SOE getting the word out though OFC... which is hardly their strong point historically. We shall see.
Problem is this line: "The F2P players will be under the same restrictions that currently exist on the Everquest II Extended server."
Yeah, no thanks. If I play a game converted to F2P, it will probably be L2. Lineage 2 is doing it right.... offer all the content for free and sell vanity / fluff items & exp potions in the shop. The restrictions in EQ2 F2P are insane... and they have a cash shop on top of it.
The EQ1 crowd is probably more comfortable with the subscription model so there would be no reason to change that for now.
"Does SoE not realize that people don't take free games seriously?" -goozmania
In your circle, and definitely on these forums, that is the case. However, for the majority of MMO gamers, the words 'serious' and 'games' often have nothing to do with each other. SOE probably realizes how most people want to pay for their online entertainment. After all, if they are the evil, greedy soulless corporation that people around here say they are, then logically they would shift to a business model that most people would prefer, thus maximizing their profits. Right?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
All Acess counts as Gold and gives you everything you had before... nothing has actually changed in reality for AA subbers. If it was value to you before chances are it still will be.
So.. is this basically saying the official servers are now going to be like EQ2X? if so I say screw you Sony, I already went to EQ2X and paid for my stuff just cus EQ2 official wasn't free, I don't wish to have to pay for the same stuff again just to go back to playing on the official servers, especially since I've already been playing races that aren't available for free on Antonia Bayle server. Shame they are charging for races and classes unlike games such as LOTRO, I was actually able to resume my character with no charges at all and at least what you might want to pay for you can earn tokens ingame to get them for nothing! Ok, so they have to make some money to keep the company going, but they're still ripping off us old players, what will we get out of all this? probably nothing, probably will have to pay to resume our characters, screw that.
EQ2 and L2 have never been in competition, they are completely different games and different markets.
Saying that though, I do agree that L2's model is better and in all honety I was hoping to see something closer from SOE here.
Full access to content that exists in game right now and charge for anything new would have been cleverer on their part.
I was always baffled wit the segregation, now we know why, it was in development this entire time, feel sorry for those who moved over to the "experimental server" as SOE used to always say, i guess you did have warning.
This is going to be the best thing for that game. Might check it out.
Now that diablo 3 is coming out everything is lost for everyone.
Ok so would this mean that station pass people will get the expansions for free? Extended unlocks all expansions does it not? I am thinking I am running out of reasons to keep a station pass. lol.
Work hard Play Harder
Fat chanse.
I am sured they saw the same hing as you and decided to charge more on all servers instead of just the EQ2X servers.
This used to be a great game but since the day they started the RMT shop in the P2P version (which was before EQ2X and I think it was the first RMT shop in a P2P game) the game started to go downhill fast.
SOE is far from the only greedy MMO company, but they are the worst. And this is comming from someone that played EQ2 5 years until I finally quit for good this spring.
EQ2 was just after EoF released one of the most fun MMOs out there, but it to me it just went downhill after that.
Well, splitting the community in to live and extended halves in the first place was monumentally stupid. This is a good move in that regard.
Also, I am glad to see that they are no longer treating gold subscribers like a second class of subscriber. but then it didn't really get better for the regular subscribers, all SOE did was just not give them less for the same price. Not exactly an impressive achievment.
However, I must stay that I am "impressed" that they some how found a way to pull off having an f2p cashshop + subscription to get full access + full priced expansions that add only game features and no actual content.
The game is fun and has a ton of features and content but playing it makes me feel co-dependant. "No, really I just... uh... fell down the stairs last night, that's the only reason my wallet is so bruised, really."
All die, so die well.
It doesn't go F2P, it just adds some more paying options and extends the cash shop.
Well, no one wins in this situation, maybe SOE at first, but when the new "omg EQ2 is free" thing will wash away, it will be back to what it was, plus worse community.
Yeah, but in L2 you're going to end up buying gold from 3rd party vendors or botting it yourself in order to keep yourself well geared.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I guess it is time to post this link to one of PA's best "extra credits" episodes.
SOE is exactly a premier example of a western company converting to F2P soley for the purpose of squeezing every last cent they can out of a market. That might sound like sensible capitalism but keep in mind that brand loyalty and customer satisfaction is a huge factor in a free market. I think they are burning their long term customer loyalty for near term quarterly returns. They are simply not getting it except for maybe the part where they got rid of the "power items" from the market place. but then again they didn't say that they wouldn't come back.
Ultimately I think L2 will end up being a more popular model. Lots of people questioned the marketing blurb "truly free". It become painfully clear what they were comparing themselves too when you consider SOE's definition of f2p.
All die, so die well.
Totally. In addition to being greedy bastards, I heard they helped Osama blow up the twin towers as well
This move might actually be what makes me stop playing this game. I didn't like the EQ2X server community at all. Now there is a chance people like that will move over to any server? Great, so now I get to hear endless free players vs. paying players whines and hearing about how WoW is this, that and the other thing in global chat.
I also hope that all armor, weapons, and rare crafting materials are removed from the cash shop. Otherwise the economy will bomb.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
no, the gold subscription which you get from having a station pass, only gives you access to content though sentinal's fate. Access to the continent of Velious can only be gotten by ALSO buying that expansion. Further, access to the new beastlord class and the other features of the upcoming expansion can only be had by buying Age of Discovery. To have the most complete access you need to both buy AoD AND get a subscription. So basically, what it has always costed only now your game includes a F2P cash shop and the socially inept antics of a largely F2P playerbase.
All die, so die well.
"Power items" like the potions, self-rez scrolls, tradeskill items, master craft armor and the weapons have been removed. One of their few good moves. However they may reintroduce them back after getting player feed back. I read that to mean that they intend to bring them back but they want to be able to blame it on popular opinion and all the people who have been "begging" for it. Keep in mind that it will not take long for the f2p population to overwhelm the existing p2p vets. How do you think a lot of those folks will vote?
I also think this is going to be bad for the community. While I like the idea of the community growing again it would be better if it did so gradually and the new folks had time to be assimilated into the existing culture. Oh well.
All die, so die well.
The only change for existing players is that they will have more people to group with (in theory) everything else is exactly the same as it was before.
My advice to people who have never played it before: Pay the $5 for the silver membership and dont listen to anyone else's views on their f2p model. You might be surprised to find that its nowhere near as restrictive as some would have you believe.
It *is* designed to get you hooked on the game so you sub, it is *not* designed to nickel and dime you to death (although if you want to play endgame content without a sub it may do that)
They will vote against it most likely. Hardcore raiders are the types that want to pay for power, and eq2, while it has good raid content, is not centered around hardcore raiders. no one really used the potions and stuff on eq2x.
It does NOT include a f2p cash shop (you fail at reading comprehension i suppose) and the eq2x and lotro player bases are really not that much different.
Its not like its going after the Perfect World or Runes of Magic demographic.
Jeezus, they're talking about "special offers" and "rebates"... Omg... they really lost it. Do they really think that a few bucks here or there is a major factor in whether I choose to spend my very valuable time on a game or not?
Wtf is this? Wal-mart?
Cripes. That's what you get when you have bean counters completely taking over a gaming company... Those people would really do better selling cheap chinese shirts or something rather than trying to make it in entertainment... and as a professional I would know. What they're doing is going against EVERYTHING in enterainment business.
It has had a cash shop that was and is largely based on other free to play games. This cash shop will also be the main source of revenue generation from the incoming free to play population. EQ2 has been a subscription game that also has a f2p style cash shop.
Please enlighten as to where my reading comprehension failed?
All die, so die well.
I meant that they would be permanently removed, but it has been a long day at work and commuting back home, so I left out "permanently". I think like you do, that those things will be added back. That is what makes me think that this game is going downhill, well that and the community might start sucking.
To be honest, I don't know how a lot of those folks would vote. Do people on Extended buy power items? I was there for several months at the start, so around that time people were not buying much of anything. They were trying to play as much as it was possible for free.
The thing that irritates me about this is that it isn't so much flexible options as it is allowing people onto formerly only pay-to-play servers that don't want to pay subs. I remember P2P players saying they didn't want F2P on their servers... period and that is why the Extended server was made. If I want to play my fae Conjuror, I still have to pay something. If I stop paying my sub, my fae Conjuror will be off limits, right? I still have to fork out money at some point, whether it is the rather steep "price of entry" to unlock the class and race pack, but then to have all of the bags, bank space, money, gear, spell levels, etc., I have to pay even more. It doesn't make sense for a player like me to ever get rid of the sub, so there is no additional level of flexibilty of payment options at all...
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.