Not sure on exact numbers but don't the 90% (non-raiders) fund the 10% (raiders)?
According to a poll a few years ago on this site I think, 60% considered raiding important for end game content.
As a raider for over 5 years, and a hardcore raider (#1 progression guild on 18th pve ranked server) I can agree with those numbers. But then again raiding used to be more accessable. With the addition of one player can wipe the raid mechanics added to most fights, the skill bar was raised for all raiders.
A real dick move, because most raiders were not 'hard core' they enjoyed doing it with friends, even those friends that may have been so-so players.
they are not prevented from raiding, they just struggle on hard mode - which at the end of the day is just the same content but without the normal mode nerfing. RE points above, the raiders subscriptions pay for their own content, in fact the 'raiders' get less content for their money in comparison to casuals.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
they are not prevented from raiding, they just struggle on hard mode - which at the end of the day is just the same content but without the normal mode nerfing. RE points above, the raiders subscriptions pay for their own content, in fact the 'raiders' get less content for their money in comparison to casuals.
Normal mode is harder than it used to be not just hard mode.
Well it's hard to explain i guess. But yeah there were lots of comical relief moments and such but usually these were moments (even the most avid RP'ers don't rp 24/7 ) . But the thing is i don't know but in my opinion the pandaren just don't fit at all and them being a playable race is just the final nail in the coffin.
Bingo.
For all the talking, about a matter of taste no-less, this is all that really needs to be said.
No contrived hatred of real-life China or their adorable lil' pandas.
Just a calm, coherent statement of opinion.
So goblins aren't comical 100% of the time? How about trolls? They are pretty funny, as are gnomes...
Blizzard has always made races both comical and threatening in all of their Warcraft history. Remember the two-headed ogres in WC2 where, if you gave them orders the heads would start arguing with each other? The only thing with the pandas is that they might not be threatening enough, but who knows, perhaps they will be. It depends on how Blizzard designs them.
I am also surprised that people here can say that they refuse to engage in an expac that offers Asian themes because it is only designed for the Asian market. I guess these people have not played GW:Factions, the Asian themed areas of EQ2, or AoC, etc. To keep up with this theme, they wouldn't have played GW:Nightfall because it is clearly intended for an African audience right? And no desert areas because they are too Arabian...
Since at least the release of Oriental Adventures in first edition D&D, Asian themes have been around in fantasy games...
I see no problem in Blizzard releasing something to please both Westerners and Asians. After all, the gaming community is international and if they do a good job with it, then that is great. I just hope the talent changes and the streamlining of classes don't let the game down is all.
The problem is that the expansion is bad and wrong on many levels.
a) World of Warcraft was basically a replay of the original story in Warcraft. It was used up by WotLK. And what would have been the sensible thing to do? Advance the story using the craft of writing more story, this was visible in Cataclysm, though cataclysm failed in mechanics. Is building MoP about a single idea that originated as a joke in WC3, story? Barely, and if they had to do it, which they didn't, they could have had much more story and complexity. Pandas, OK, and another race they have been at war with, and a third party antagonist for a faction neutral antagonist. So much more to build on. But no, just pandas.
b) It is deviating from formula, it's like they have no idea whatsover what was in the product they had been selling for years that was successful. One race for both factions, formula change, gutted talent system, formula change, no big baddie in an expansion, formula change. This burger tastes funny. Oh shit we forgot the secret sauce.
c) It is monolithic, built on one narrow theme, and the theme that dominates is china, chinese artwork, really bad 'chinese' music, and almost everything in the new content is named in chinese, fire elementals called Huo, chinese for fire. Monkeys, are Hozu, chinese for monkey, water elementals, Shu, shui being water in, yep chinese.
MoP is not very creative in story, what it brings to the game are changes from proven formula, and it is very one dimensional.
Now it does not matter if the race is pandas or the theme is china, just those faults above make it bad.
The prblem is that the expansion is bad and wrong on many levels.
a) World of Warcraft was basically a replay of the original story in Warcraft. It was used up by WotLK. And waht would have been the sensible thing to do? Advance the story using the craft of writing more story, this was visible in Cataclysm, though cataclysm failed in mechanics. Is building MoP about a single idea that originated as a joke in WC3, story? Barely, and if they had to do it, which they didn't, they could have had much more story and complexity. Pandas, OK, and another race they have been at war with, and a third party antagonist for a faction neutral antagonist. So much more to build on. But no, just pandas.
But if they did a third party antagonist for a faction neutral antagonist, how is it any different to the expansions before it. Below you are complaining about MoP deviating from formula, yet here you are asking for it, a bit of contradiction.
b) It is deviating from formula, it's like they have no idea whatsover what was in the product they had been selling for years that was successful. One race for both factions, formula change, gutted talent system, formula change, no big baddie in an expansion, formula change. This burger tastes funny. Oh shit we forgot the secret sauce.
They have stated they want to make expansions more frequent, thus they can milk the players even more. So players will obviously have to put up with the lesser amount of quality put into each expansion pack. Blizzard lost its WoW secret sauce long before MoP
c) it is monolithic, built one narrow theme, and the theme that dominates is china, chinese artwork, really bad 'chinese' music, and almost everything in the new content is named in chinese, fire elementals called Huo, chinese for fire. Monkeys, are Hozu, chinese for monkey, water elementals, Shu, shui being water in, yep chinese.
Um, isn't that the same as every single expansion? They all focus on western fantasy,
MoP is not very creative in story, what it brings to the game are changes from proven formula, and it is very one dimenstional.
Blizzard was never known for its creativity, but rather polish from the proven forumla, which is exactly what you just said. Why not do something they are good at. Creativity is pointless if it wasn't to improve the quality of the game.
Now it does not matter if the race is pandas or the theme is china, just those faults above make it bad.
At least we can come into agreement into the end
Textbook happy ending.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW? As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Yeah.. 10%. Let's see. Cosndiering the price point in OP is right and it's infact 6 cents / hour it would take 8 hours a day of playtime to reach subscription price as in US. Plenty of people there play for way more than 8 hours a day on average. Another thing is, the fact that Chineese servers are not operated by Blizzard but a Chineese company so Blizzard doesn't pay for those servers. Next thing is the fact that there is way more people there playing the game than in NA/EU regions.
It would much more closer to accurate to say NA makes about 25-30% EU makes about 15-20% and rest is Asian market.
Should be no surprise that you're incorrect. I say that because you did zero research to back up your claims, and clearly you didn't think it out. NetEase makes the majority of the money that WoW generates in China. The pay Blizzard a fee. To simplify - its kind of like how a frachise works. Someone buys the rights to operate under a brand, and then pays the franchisor a fee. NetEase paid big bucks to operate in China, and they probably pay a nominal percentage of revenue.
Faction neutral in the sense that the previous main antagonists are not friendly to a faction, some may have started out as one factioin, but did not end up that way by the time they were antagonists and the final bosses of expansions.
Yeah.. 10%. Let's see. Cosndiering the price point in OP is right and it's infact 6 cents / hour it would take 8 hours a day of playtime to reach subscription price as in US. Plenty of people there play for way more than 8 hours a day on average. Another thing is, the fact that Chineese servers are not operated by Blizzard but a Chineese company so Blizzard doesn't pay for those servers. Next thing is the fact that there is way more people there playing the game than in NA/EU regions.
It would much more closer to accurate to say NA makes about 25-30% EU makes about 15-20% and rest is Asian market.
Should be no surprise that you're incorrect. I say that because you did zero research to back up your claims, and clearly you didn't think it out. NetEase makes the majority of the money that WoW generates in China. The pay Blizzard a fee. To simplify - its kind of like how a frachise works. Someone buys the rights to operate under a brand, and then pays the franchisor a fee. NetEase paid big bucks to operate in China, and they probably pay a nominal percentage of revenue.
That is correct, chinese pay 6 cents an hour to NetEase, and blizzard gets a slice of the profits.
b) It is deviating from formula, it's like they have no idea whatsover what was in the product they had been selling for years that was successful. One race for both factions, formula change, gutted talent system, formula change, no big baddie in an expansion, formula change. This burger tastes funny. Oh shit we forgot the secret sauce.
They have stated they want to make expansions more frequent, thus they can milk the players even more. So players will obviously have to put up with the lesser amount of quality put into each expansion pack. Blizzard lost its WoW secret sauce long before MoP
I don't see why they always have to keep up with the "formula" to be honest. And I disagree that it is a foregone conclusion that Blizzard has lost its mojo, so to speak. I don't see how such broad sweeping statements can be made about a newly announced expac. Why not just wait and see what they come up with? I am concerned about the talent system changes, but there are issues with the old ones, so they should do something.
c) it is monolithic, built one narrow theme, and the theme that dominates is china, chinese artwork, really bad 'chinese' music, and almost everything in the new content is named in chinese, fire elementals called Huo, chinese for fire. Monkeys, are Hozu, chinese for monkey, water elementals, Shu, shui being water in, yep chinese.
Um, isn't that the same as every single expansion? They all focus on western fantasy,
What is wrong with them focusing on Chinese themes? I think it could add a lot to the game if it is done well.
Again, I don't see why it is such a big deal that they are adding in Oriental themes. Would you be reacting this way if they added in African themes instead? Or South American?
We don't know how the expac will pan out since it is early days yet. But perhaps we could all be pleasantly surprised, or terribly horrified. We just don't know.
As another poster stated just above me, most people offended isn't actually the RPer population, they know the history of the game and pandarians was actually part of it.
If you look on the youtube trailer for MoP, huge amount of complains are actually spawn from random hate to downright racism, so I was wrong on some parts, they aren't just insecure, some of them are simply racist. There is nothing wrong to have an asian influence on the art style. In a believeable world, it is simple to understand if there is a western cultural race, there is a probably chance to have a eastern cultural race.
Well off course there are always going to be people with dodgy reasons to hate something. But let's not also forget that some people might simply not like the asian style without necessarily being china haters (i know some blatantly make it clear they also hate china but not all).
I think that for every "weird" reason to hate MoP there is someone with a valid reason.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt. Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
So goblins aren't comical 100% of the time? How about trolls? They are pretty funny, as are gnomes...
I didn't like goblins as a playable race but i wasn't Horde, so that was a non issue for me. And i hated melee gnomes. And yes they may have been funny but panda's aren't even funny if you ask me, they just don't fit at all. Trolls while having certain funny lines still looked somewhat threatening and trolls have always been an established "race" of the western fantasy theme. Do however keep in mind this is strictly an opinion. Some people think one race looks more ridiculous than an other others would disagree, well i think the pandaren gave a whole new meaning to " What in the name of the lich king?!" in WoW (as a playable race)
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt. Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
I think main problem with pandas is it's not any fantasy race.
Before any races but human were pure fantasy (Hope nobody met goblin, troll or orc in real life=D). panda looks way too close to circus bear to me & don't appeal to me to pick it up for represent myself.
Asian theme was popular few year ago, but it over now now too, beside I don't mind it at all, more to be real life animal like in WoW
and most: as this short x-pack again and I guess are nothing much to play and discover for price of new attractive game...
try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises. Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2
Comments
According to a poll a few years ago on this site I think, 60% considered raiding important for end game content.
As a raider for over 5 years, and a hardcore raider (#1 progression guild on 18th pve ranked server) I can agree with those numbers. But then again raiding used to be more accessable. With the addition of one player can wipe the raid mechanics added to most fights, the skill bar was raised for all raiders.
A real dick move, because most raiders were not 'hard core' they enjoyed doing it with friends, even those friends that may have been so-so players.
they are not prevented from raiding, they just struggle on hard mode - which at the end of the day is just the same content but without the normal mode nerfing. RE points above, the raiders subscriptions pay for their own content, in fact the 'raiders' get less content for their money in comparison to casuals.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Normal mode is harder than it used to be not just hard mode.
So goblins aren't comical 100% of the time? How about trolls? They are pretty funny, as are gnomes...
Blizzard has always made races both comical and threatening in all of their Warcraft history. Remember the two-headed ogres in WC2 where, if you gave them orders the heads would start arguing with each other? The only thing with the pandas is that they might not be threatening enough, but who knows, perhaps they will be. It depends on how Blizzard designs them.
I am also surprised that people here can say that they refuse to engage in an expac that offers Asian themes because it is only designed for the Asian market. I guess these people have not played GW:Factions, the Asian themed areas of EQ2, or AoC, etc. To keep up with this theme, they wouldn't have played GW:Nightfall because it is clearly intended for an African audience right? And no desert areas because they are too Arabian...
Since at least the release of Oriental Adventures in first edition D&D, Asian themes have been around in fantasy games...
I see no problem in Blizzard releasing something to please both Westerners and Asians. After all, the gaming community is international and if they do a good job with it, then that is great. I just hope the talent changes and the streamlining of classes don't let the game down is all.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
The problem is that the expansion is bad and wrong on many levels.
a) World of Warcraft was basically a replay of the original story in Warcraft. It was used up by WotLK. And what would have been the sensible thing to do? Advance the story using the craft of writing more story, this was visible in Cataclysm, though cataclysm failed in mechanics. Is building MoP about a single idea that originated as a joke in WC3, story? Barely, and if they had to do it, which they didn't, they could have had much more story and complexity. Pandas, OK, and another race they have been at war with, and a third party antagonist for a faction neutral antagonist. So much more to build on. But no, just pandas.
b) It is deviating from formula, it's like they have no idea whatsover what was in the product they had been selling for years that was successful. One race for both factions, formula change, gutted talent system, formula change, no big baddie in an expansion, formula change. This burger tastes funny. Oh shit we forgot the secret sauce.
c) It is monolithic, built on one narrow theme, and the theme that dominates is china, chinese artwork, really bad 'chinese' music, and almost everything in the new content is named in chinese, fire elementals called Huo, chinese for fire. Monkeys, are Hozu, chinese for monkey, water elementals, Shu, shui being water in, yep chinese.
MoP is not very creative in story, what it brings to the game are changes from proven formula, and it is very one dimensional.
Now it does not matter if the race is pandas or the theme is china, just those faults above make it bad.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Should be no surprise that you're incorrect. I say that because you did zero research to back up your claims, and clearly you didn't think it out. NetEase makes the majority of the money that WoW generates in China. The pay Blizzard a fee. To simplify - its kind of like how a frachise works. Someone buys the rights to operate under a brand, and then pays the franchisor a fee. NetEase paid big bucks to operate in China, and they probably pay a nominal percentage of revenue.
Faction neutral in the sense that the previous main antagonists are not friendly to a faction, some may have started out as one factioin, but did not end up that way by the time they were antagonists and the final bosses of expansions.
That is correct, chinese pay 6 cents an hour to NetEase, and blizzard gets a slice of the profits.
MoP is not an expansion aimed towards the asian market.
It is an expansion with an asian theme.
MANY mmos have had asian themed content updates, because it has been a genre staple since Dungeons and Dragons.
Did they come out with the D&D Asian Adventures campaign to get more asians to play the game?
No! They created the expansion to give all those a new choice of roles to play, and environments to play in.
To think that an asian themed expansion has to be aimed at asian players is borderline racist.
Again, I don't see why it is such a big deal that they are adding in Oriental themes. Would you be reacting this way if they added in African themes instead? Or South American?
We don't know how the expac will pan out since it is early days yet. But perhaps we could all be pleasantly surprised, or terribly horrified. We just don't know.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
I think main problem with pandas is it's not any fantasy race.
Before any races but human were pure fantasy (Hope nobody met goblin, troll or orc in real life=D).
panda looks way too close to circus bear to me & don't appeal to me to pick it up for represent myself.
Asian theme was popular few year ago, but it over now now too, beside I don't mind it at all, more to be real life animal like in WoW
and most: as this short x-pack again and I guess are nothing much to play and discover for price of new attractive game...
try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises.
Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2