I dont know why FPS guys keep playing MMOS, just to trolling i guess. Im a MMO veteran, and today was my 1st swtor beta, without a single doubt tor will be the best MMO in the market, the game is just amazing and the PvP is a blast. i didnt even notice than i was actually grinding, and the combat is fast, fun and dynamic, the game is even better playing with friends. BW did a great job with this game, and the hype will be even bigger after this weekend
I don't know about you but I play all types of games. I like to be entertained and games is where I find that entertainment. There have been FPS's that i liked and some that I hated, same goes for side scrollers, SP's, and mmo's.
On Topic:
I expected something better from BW, I guess its true that the best developers at BW left a long time ago.
You didn't realize it when DA2 came out?
I'll still likely play SWTOR though. Many games these days give me about 20 hours for 60 bucks. I figure SWTOR will at least give me 100 so money well spent so long as I have a bit of fun.
Does the game have its problems? Ya sure, but they're buried by all the things it gets right.
Currently on my laptop, which I bought with gaming in mind, I can max it out. Oddly enough no matter what setting I put it on, the frame rate does not change. I'm fine with the 20-50 frames I do get though, so whatever.
But ya, this game is pretty damn fun actually.
And trying to compare a single player game to an MMO is unfair really.
Well OP you deserve yoru opinion like everyone else,but when you say your a demanding player waiting for 1990's gaming in D3,i question that.
The game is lacking for depth no question ,they could have done more in every aspect.However there is a lot of different areas to explore and each class does have a few cool ideas.My takes is it is worth 23- maybe 4 months entertainement but will lack the depth of a true MMO.
THe game does lack combat variance,it seems like almost every single mob is in groups of 3,they really were lazy in alot of it's design.
Personally i think the game has some value,not overwhelming but i find it at least playble,i couldn't handle 15 minutes of Skyrim or many other games out there.Example Rift, was a lot like Skyrim for me,i struggled to stay in the game for more than 15 minutes.i have played SWTOR for 2 hour stints at a time ,which is long for me.
They pretty much lied abotu the dialogue however,i don't find much difference at all in dialogue other than +50 or +50 pts in good/evil [rare occasions] and i called that dialogue months before this game even came out,i knew exactly what they were going to do. However i didn't play this game for it's dialogue, iknew not to buy into games gimmicks,they never pan out as the dev say they will.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I find it amusing that some people think that they can discover all the game has to offer before they leave the starting planet. You know....the tutorial.
Originally posted by Wharg0ul I find it amusing that some people think that they can discover all the game has to offer before they leave the starting planet. You know....the tutorial.
I somehow doubt an on rails theme park with heavy voice over for it's quest(s) hubs and story line is going to deviate much from what is presented at the start.
I find it amusing that some people think that they can discover all the game has to offer before they leave the starting planet. You know....the tutorial.
I somehow doubt an on rails theme park with heavy voice over for it's quest(s) hubs and story line is going to deviate much from what is presented at the start.
yeah...'cause no game EVER opens up and gains any depth after the first few training missions, right??
I don't see how you could have been "waiting on this game for 2 years", when it was only a couple of weeks ago that you posted on this forum that these MMO games are boring, and that you were waiting on Skyrim and Diablo 3. You keep jumping into MMORPG threads to promote Diablo 3. If you dislike MMORPG's so much, avoid them. If Diablo 3 is what you want to play so badly, wait for it.
I'm not sure why you expected a MMORPG to play like a shooter. Most people that are looking to play this will be expecting typical MMORPG type game play. Comparing an MMORPG to a FPS (or even TPS) game is like comparing apples to oranges. They are nothing alike.
My system is nowhere as good as yours, and I play with no lag, other than the occasional lag spike. And, no matter how good your system is, network lag could always be a factor. Besides, you will always have more lag in beta due to all the additional tracking software they have running.
I'm going to have to disagree with you on the cover system. it is fun and it works very well. Smuggler and Imperial Agent are two of my favorite classes.
What? I see people say that while still being gw2 fanboys as well. Likely he/she is not happy with current gen of MMO and was looking forward to a non MMO to take their time till new MMO come out like gw2,AA, and even swtor. You are trolling
Saying what? You quoted my whole post.? Trolling? No. You must not understand the meaning. I was just stating what the OP was doing. He tries to make it sound like he was a big fan of the game until trying it, but in a post, in the SWTOR forums in a thread about new beta invites going out, he said that with Skyrim and Diablo 3 coming out he didn't have time for these boring MMO's. That was two weeks before they even tried the game, so it is a clear indicator that they had already made up their mind that this game would be a "boring MMO". That shows a lack of objectivity, don't you think? It is not trolling to point out that the OP said this was a boring MMO, two weeks before setting foot in the game.
In a thread that asks if people will choose Guild Wars 2 or SWTOR, and the OP Posts to say they will be playing Diablo 3. If you look through their previous posts, most of them reference Diablo 3 in threads that are about other games. In this thread he compared SWTOR gameplay negatively against action games, rather than other MMORPG's.
The OP likes action games and thinks MMO's are boring. I'm fine with them liking Diablo 3, but they keep posting about it in MMORPG forums rather than a Diablo 3 forum. When a person has such huge biases before even getting into a game, you have to take anything they say with a grain of salt. Pointing out those biases is not trolling.
I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system.
I agree with you. My system runs it fine on ultra and it is outdated.
Did it ever dawn on you that fine to you might be 35 FPS?
I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system.
Also, I thought the game looked fine on ultra and the animations were good. The cover system doesn take you out of the action at all, just press f and you roll into cover, imo it feels more actiony then just standing around shooting.
No mate my system is very well i play battlefield 3 with 80-120 fps.
If u think the cover system is good then good for u enjoy the game im used to play more action games.
About the movement animation it seems u havent played good animation games yet.Try some saints row 3 and see what good animation looks like.
Condescending much? OK, I'm out of this thread.
No the guy just knows his hardware and expects developers to perform at certain levels to earn his money. Settle for whatever you like, Dont judge people for having higher standards than you.
I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system.
Also, I thought the game looked fine on ultra and the animations were good. The cover system doesn take you out of the action at all, just press f and you roll into cover, imo it feels more actiony then just standing around shooting.
No mate my system is very well i play battlefield 3 with 80-120 fps.
I call shenanigans then...
There are too many people posting in this thread that know little to nothing about PC hardware Im done here.
Felt I had to post because I disagree completely with the OP. Ive been in beta a long time now and the animations are great. As for performance, I have an i5 2500k, (2) GTX460' in SLI and the game FPS average for me is 50+, often above 100FPS. If your system is running that low FPS, you have something wrong going on with your system.
Hi all im 27 years old and i play games since 1997 i was waiting for this game 2 f years and to tell the truth im very dissapointed.
My system rig 980x watercooled 580 sli latest drivers 12 gigs of ram alienware optx 2310 monitor ssd drive
One word for those who are willing to buy the game "try it before u buy it.It may save u some money especially if u have preordered the collectors just like me.
The only reason i tried the beta was to see if those150 euro really worth it.
I played 2 characters a smuggler and a bounty hunter
What i didnt like about the game:
Character movement animations are awful
graphics are not very good even on ultra
Gameplay is not fun u shoot with guns but it doesnt play like 3rd person shooter it plays like meh...it's not fun
Smugglers cover system is not fun and it doesnt work well.Furthermore it looks out of action.
it didnt give me the feeling that i was advancing in lvls
Performance of the game is very very very poor even on my system i had 35 fps outdoors.Indoors was better but im not playing the game only for indoors.They may improve that but i dont think there will be much of improvement.
////////////////////////////////////////
The only thing they managed to do right is the dialogs but im not playing a game only for dialogs but for it's gameplay.
I conclussion the gameplay of the game was not fun and it didnt gave me the feeling so as to want to play more.It seemed that there were a lot of things missing.
Now ill have to cancel my collectors preorder cause 150 euro for this game doesnt worth it nor my 15 per month.
Back to saints row 3 and waiting for diablo 3
Ps Try the game for your self if u get the chance.You may like it.For me im a very demanding player and if i see some things missing i just abandon it from the beggining.Some things may change but i think i gave them a lot of time to bring it on.This game should have been released by march.Now it releases december and it still looks like crap.
Peace
Did you have any idea what you were getting into? This game is clearly not for you. MMOs all share alot of the "issues" you did not like, not sure why you expected any different. The game runs at 60-80 fps on my computer on max settings and sometimes higher and you have a way better system. You may have a system that is overheating (issue with Alienwares anyways iirc) or you just are not taking care of it.
You have just blown my mind in all honesty. I am quite simply, amazed, you were not aware of these things. How do you have so many posts on an MMO site? It seems like you have never played any before..
You also can't compare running a single player / small scale multiplayer game(yes I know 64 players is more then most, but it is still no where near what an mmo requires) to an MMO. The games you generally play (not MMOs) are built around having a small number of people on your screen, not a few dozen or more. They make look better, but the player's client does not have much interaction with the server compared to an MMO.
In MMOs the environment is not static like in an FPS,ect...even if some part of that environment is randomized it is all loaded before you even get to that part of the game. This is where MMO fps would be affected, your client doesn't know whats going on a few hundred yards out from your character so it has to animate on the fly. This, combined with thousands of people using several sets of servers to do various things can all have an impact on your FPS in an MMO.
I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system.
Also, I thought the game looked fine on ultra and the animations were good. The cover system doesn take you out of the action at all, just press f and you roll into cover, imo it feels more actiony then just standing around shooting.
No mate my system is very well i play battlefield 3 with 80-120 fps.
If u think the cover system is good then good for u enjoy the game im used to play more action games.
About the movement animation it seems u havent played good animation games yet.Try some saints row 3 and see what good animation looks like.
Condescending much? OK, I'm out of this thread.
No the guy just knows his hardware and expects developers to perform at certain levels to earn his money. Settle for whatever you like, Dont judge people for having higher standards than you.
No one else is having problems with framerates. Doesnt matter what our "standards" are. On a GTX260 my game ran at 60+ fps, which past that you can't see much difference. Stop trying to defend the troll.
Originally posted by marinrider I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system. Also, I thought the game looked fine on ultra and the animations were good. The cover system doesn take you out of the action at all, just press f and you roll into cover, imo it feels more actiony then just standing around shooting.
No mate my system is very well i play battlefield 3 with 80-120 fps. If u think the cover system is good then good for u enjoy the game im used to play more action games. About the movement animation it seems u havent played good animation games yet.Try some saints row 3 and see what good animation looks like.
Condescending much? OK, I'm out of this thread.
No the guy just knows his hardware and expects developers to perform at certain levels to earn his money. Settle for whatever you like, Dont judge people for having higher standards than you.
Not judging the OP but most people who "know their hardware" don't buy Alienware. Nor do they use 12 gigs of ram.
well if its not for you, then its not for you, but be understood that this is a stress test beta weekend. Your not supposed to have good quality... but i would expect the performance to get better from one weekend to the next.
I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system.
Also, I thought the game looked fine on ultra and the animations were good. The cover system doesn take you out of the action at all, just press f and you roll into cover, imo it feels more actiony then just standing around shooting.
No mate my system is very well i play battlefield 3 with 80-120 fps.
If u think the cover system is good then good for u enjoy the game im used to play more action games.
About the movement animation it seems u havent played good animation games yet.Try some saints row 3 and see what good animation looks like.
Condescending much? OK, I'm out of this thread.
No the guy just knows his hardware and expects developers to perform at certain levels to earn his money. Settle for whatever you like, Dont judge people for having higher standards than you.
Not judging the OP but most people who "know their hardware" don't buy Alienware. Nor do they use 12 gigs of ram.
Yep, sounds like he doesn't know the least about hardware and is simply reading off the front of his custom built system. Alienware computers don't last long and are a huge waste of money. You could build a system just as good or better for 1/3 of the price in some cases. 12 gigs if ram isn't bad to get right now since ram prices are really cheap, but you are right it does not really matter past 8 gigs unless you are handling a ton of applications.
I find it amusing that some people think that they can discover all the game has to offer before they leave the starting planet. You know....the tutorial.
I somehow doubt an on rails theme park with heavy voice over for it's quest(s) hubs and story line is going to deviate much from what is presented at the start.
yeah...'cause no game EVER opens up and gains any depth after the first few training missions, right??
Well it didnt for me. I have an invite to get back in now but have ignored it. Im enjoying another mmorpg too much to mess with Swtor atm.
I got to level 15 or 16 with my Sith Sorcerer. Not much changed on Dromund Kass. Linear paths. Same kind of story stuff. I didnt heavily dislike Korriban myself, but I never noticed much changing with it. That was three days of solid play though. Sure I guess things might change, but I doubt it. It makes no sense for suddenly the game to totally open up at level 30 for example.
Dromand Kass felt exactly like Korriban for the most part, and I got a good solid sense of the game. Its not bad for what it is, and there's entertainment value there, but I have a feeling once the novelty wears off, even some of the more die hard fans will migrate to something else.
In my opinion there are better mmorpgs to play that are years old. Games with better graphics, animations, and even story. It might not be voice acted but the stories can still be even more excellent if a player isnt bothered by reading.
I consider Swtor to be a decent mmorpg. Nothing more. Its not bad to me. But its nothing I would consider great either.
I felt the opposite if what you did. Also, my system is not nearly as good as yours and I ran it fine on ultra with no lag. Maybe something is up with your system.
Also, I thought the game looked fine on ultra and the animations were good. The cover system doesn take you out of the action at all, just press f and you roll into cover, imo it feels more actiony then just standing around shooting.
No mate my system is very well i play battlefield 3 with 80-120 fps.
If u think the cover system is good then good for u enjoy the game im used to play more action games.
About the movement animation it seems u havent played good animation games yet.Try some saints row 3 and see what good animation looks like.
Condescending much? OK, I'm out of this thread.
No the guy just knows his hardware and expects developers to perform at certain levels to earn his money. Settle for whatever you like, Dont judge people for having higher standards than you.
Not judging the OP but most people who "know their hardware" don't buy Alienware. Nor do they use 12 gigs of ram.
12 gigs if ram isn't bad to get right now since ram prices are really cheap, but you are right it does not really matter past 8 gigs unless you are handling a ton of applications.
I think the point was that he's running triple channel ram with a 2500k when he should be using dual channel
His gtx 580's in Sli should be destroying the game, my 2500k and a single old gtx460 hasn't dropped below 40fps yet and that's with AA enabled via the .ini file.
users/username/AppData/Local/SWTOR/betatest/settings and open the client_settings.ini
I find it amusing that some people think that they can discover all the game has to offer before they leave the starting planet. You know....the tutorial.
I somehow doubt an on rails theme park with heavy voice over for it's quest(s) hubs and story line is going to deviate much from what is presented at the start.
yeah...'cause no game EVER opens up and gains any depth after the first few training missions, right??
Well it didnt for me. I have an invite to get back in now but have ignored it. Im enjoying another mmorpg too much to mess with Swtor atm.
I got to level 15 or 16 with my Sith Sorcerer. Not much changed on Dromund Kass. Linear paths. Same kind of story stuff. I didnt heavily dislike Korriban myself, but I never noticed much changing with it. That was three days of solid play though. Sure I guess things might change, but I doubt it. It makes no sense for suddenly the game to totally open up at level 30 for example.
Dromand Kass felt exactly like Korriban for the most part, and I got a good solid sense of the game. Its not bad for what it is, and there's entertainment value there, but I have a feeling once the novelty wears off, even some of the more die hard fans will migrate to something else.
In my opinion there are better mmorpgs to play that are years old. Games with better graphics, animations, and even story. It might not be voice acted but the stories can still be even more excellent if a player isnt bothered by reading.
I consider Swtor to be a decent mmorpg. Nothing more. Its not bad to me. But its nothing I would consider great either.
Actually, the game opens up progressively the further you go. As I have said...by the time you get to Alderaan, it's almost too big.
Think of it this way...you don't get sprint until 14, because you don't need it till then, and you don't get a vehicle till 25 for the same reason. Ditto with the faster vehicles later on.
IMO, this is intentional...Bioware probably didn't want people bitching that it took too long to get anywhere at lower levels.
I think the "review" is valid, I mean he says he likes FPSers and disliked how it didn't feel like a 3rd person shooter, but something was lacking in his opinion. I guess he expected the combat to be quite differant than nearly any MMORPG, and well although fast paced, its not.
"You may like it.For me im a very demanding player and if i see some things missing i just abandon it from the beggining"
Also says that, so I wouldn't be too harsh on the OP.
Comments
I had average expectations and it exceeded em.
Best way to be tbh, I don't think it'll kill WoW tbh, but it'll compete better than those before it.
You didn't realize it when DA2 came out?
I'll still likely play SWTOR though. Many games these days give me about 20 hours for 60 bucks. I figure SWTOR will at least give me 100 so money well spent so long as I have a bit of fun.
Does the game have its problems? Ya sure, but they're buried by all the things it gets right.
Currently on my laptop, which I bought with gaming in mind, I can max it out. Oddly enough no matter what setting I put it on, the frame rate does not change. I'm fine with the 20-50 frames I do get though, so whatever.
But ya, this game is pretty damn fun actually.
And trying to compare a single player game to an MMO is unfair really.
Well OP you deserve yoru opinion like everyone else,but when you say your a demanding player waiting for 1990's gaming in D3,i question that.
The game is lacking for depth no question ,they could have done more in every aspect.However there is a lot of different areas to explore and each class does have a few cool ideas.My takes is it is worth 23- maybe 4 months entertainement but will lack the depth of a true MMO.
THe game does lack combat variance,it seems like almost every single mob is in groups of 3,they really were lazy in alot of it's design.
Personally i think the game has some value,not overwhelming but i find it at least playble,i couldn't handle 15 minutes of Skyrim or many other games out there.Example Rift, was a lot like Skyrim for me,i struggled to stay in the game for more than 15 minutes.i have played SWTOR for 2 hour stints at a time ,which is long for me.
They pretty much lied abotu the dialogue however,i don't find much difference at all in dialogue other than +50 or +50 pts in good/evil [rare occasions] and i called that dialogue months before this game even came out,i knew exactly what they were going to do. However i didn't play this game for it's dialogue, iknew not to buy into games gimmicks,they never pan out as the dev say they will.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I find it amusing that some people think that they can discover all the game has to offer before they leave the starting planet. You know....the tutorial.
I somehow doubt an on rails theme park with heavy voice over for it's quest(s) hubs and story line is going to deviate much from what is presented at the start.
yeah...'cause no game EVER opens up and gains any depth after the first few training missions, right??
Ha ha ha ha ha! Love it
Saying what? You quoted my whole post.? Trolling? No. You must not understand the meaning. I was just stating what the OP was doing. He tries to make it sound like he was a big fan of the game until trying it, but in a post, in the SWTOR forums in a thread about new beta invites going out, he said that with Skyrim and Diablo 3 coming out he didn't have time for these boring MMO's. That was two weeks before they even tried the game, so it is a clear indicator that they had already made up their mind that this game would be a "boring MMO". That shows a lack of objectivity, don't you think? It is not trolling to point out that the OP said this was a boring MMO, two weeks before setting foot in the game.
In a thread that asks if people will choose Guild Wars 2 or SWTOR, and the OP Posts to say they will be playing Diablo 3. If you look through their previous posts, most of them reference Diablo 3 in threads that are about other games. In this thread he compared SWTOR gameplay negatively against action games, rather than other MMORPG's.
The OP likes action games and thinks MMO's are boring. I'm fine with them liking Diablo 3, but they keep posting about it in MMORPG forums rather than a Diablo 3 forum. When a person has such huge biases before even getting into a game, you have to take anything they say with a grain of salt. Pointing out those biases is not trolling.
"TO MICHAEL!"
Did it ever dawn on you that fine to you might be 35 FPS?
Diablo3? Saints row? Not sure if you're playing the right genre bud.
No the guy just knows his hardware and expects developers to perform at certain levels to earn his money. Settle for whatever you like, Dont judge people for having higher standards than you.
There are too many people posting in this thread that know little to nothing about PC hardware Im done here.
Felt I had to post because I disagree completely with the OP. Ive been in beta a long time now and the animations are great. As for performance, I have an i5 2500k, (2) GTX460' in SLI and the game FPS average for me is 50+, often above 100FPS. If your system is running that low FPS, you have something wrong going on with your system.
Did you have any idea what you were getting into? This game is clearly not for you. MMOs all share alot of the "issues" you did not like, not sure why you expected any different. The game runs at 60-80 fps on my computer on max settings and sometimes higher and you have a way better system. You may have a system that is overheating (issue with Alienwares anyways iirc) or you just are not taking care of it.
You have just blown my mind in all honesty. I am quite simply, amazed, you were not aware of these things. How do you have so many posts on an MMO site? It seems like you have never played any before..
You also can't compare running a single player / small scale multiplayer game(yes I know 64 players is more then most, but it is still no where near what an mmo requires) to an MMO. The games you generally play (not MMOs) are built around having a small number of people on your screen, not a few dozen or more. They make look better, but the player's client does not have much interaction with the server compared to an MMO.
In MMOs the environment is not static like in an FPS,ect...even if some part of that environment is randomized it is all loaded before you even get to that part of the game. This is where MMO fps would be affected, your client doesn't know whats going on a few hundred yards out from your character so it has to animate on the fly. This, combined with thousands of people using several sets of servers to do various things can all have an impact on your FPS in an MMO.
No one else is having problems with framerates. Doesnt matter what our "standards" are. On a GTX260 my game ran at 60+ fps, which past that you can't see much difference. Stop trying to defend the troll.
Not judging the OP but most people who "know their hardware" don't buy Alienware. Nor do they use 12 gigs of ram.
"TO MICHAEL!"
well if its not for you, then its not for you, but be understood that this is a stress test beta weekend. Your not supposed to have good quality... but i would expect the performance to get better from one weekend to the next.
Yep, sounds like he doesn't know the least about hardware and is simply reading off the front of his custom built system. Alienware computers don't last long and are a huge waste of money. You could build a system just as good or better for 1/3 of the price in some cases. 12 gigs if ram isn't bad to get right now since ram prices are really cheap, but you are right it does not really matter past 8 gigs unless you are handling a ton of applications.
Well it didnt for me. I have an invite to get back in now but have ignored it. Im enjoying another mmorpg too much to mess with Swtor atm.
I got to level 15 or 16 with my Sith Sorcerer. Not much changed on Dromund Kass. Linear paths. Same kind of story stuff. I didnt heavily dislike Korriban myself, but I never noticed much changing with it. That was three days of solid play though. Sure I guess things might change, but I doubt it. It makes no sense for suddenly the game to totally open up at level 30 for example.
Dromand Kass felt exactly like Korriban for the most part, and I got a good solid sense of the game. Its not bad for what it is, and there's entertainment value there, but I have a feeling once the novelty wears off, even some of the more die hard fans will migrate to something else.
In my opinion there are better mmorpgs to play that are years old. Games with better graphics, animations, and even story. It might not be voice acted but the stories can still be even more excellent if a player isnt bothered by reading.
I consider Swtor to be a decent mmorpg. Nothing more. Its not bad to me. But its nothing I would consider great either.
Ah, crap....you beat me to it
I think the point was that he's running triple channel ram with a 2500k when he should be using dual channel
His gtx 580's in Sli should be destroying the game, my 2500k and a single old gtx460 hasn't dropped below 40fps yet and that's with AA enabled via the .ini file.
users/username/AppData/Local/SWTOR/betatest/settings and open the client_settings.ini
Add this line in:
AntiAliasingLevel = 4
Actually, the game opens up progressively the further you go. As I have said...by the time you get to Alderaan, it's almost too big.
Think of it this way...you don't get sprint until 14, because you don't need it till then, and you don't get a vehicle till 25 for the same reason. Ditto with the faster vehicles later on.
IMO, this is intentional...Bioware probably didn't want people bitching that it took too long to get anywhere at lower levels.
I think the "review" is valid, I mean he says he likes FPSers and disliked how it didn't feel like a 3rd person shooter, but something was lacking in his opinion. I guess he expected the combat to be quite differant than nearly any MMORPG, and well although fast paced, its not.
"You may like it.For me im a very demanding player and if i see some things missing i just abandon it from the beggining"
Also says that, so I wouldn't be too harsh on the OP.